Gods of the Whoniverse | New to Who? | Doctor Who
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- Опубліковано 18 чер 2024
- The God of Death has arrived - and he isn't the first! Tyrell/@theoriesbyt introduces the Whoniverse's Pantheon...
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Nah... My guy didn't mention "Mara the God of Beasts" The disrespect is real, lol!
Yes they did Harriet mentioned," there is The Mara the god of beasts."
@@MeidasWhovianAdvocate they are talking about in the video
I don't remember her. Who was she?
@@oskarm646 Mara was the villain in the Kinda and Snakedance episodes
Didn't even mention Hecuba, the Toymakers sister, Aka the Queen/Goddess of Time
Even the "how long do X live?" thing from Rogue was a callback to Pyramids of Mars
The Mara, Fenric and Omega: "Are we a joke to you, official Doctor Who youtube channel?"
Although they were never called gods, I think the Eternals might count as well.
Omega doesn't count imo, he was a timelord.
@@Icelandic_Sand Wasn't he pretty much a god in the antimatter universe, though?
We need more stuff with fenric he’s a great villain and the elder gods aswell we just need to see more off
Fenric is even more powerful than the characters they listed. I wonder why they try to not mention Fenric.
The bit about how The Beast survived before time began could have to do with something from a SJA episode when Luke postulated that another universe existed before the current one where Magic and beings like The Beast existed and were able to do immense and impossible things in relation to the current universe’s standards and laws.
Thats what the Time Lords had claimed to gave dispelled in the dark times, thats why Rassilon had no problems with destroying this universe and go forth into a newer one as beings of pure energy
That's a common piece of Doctor Who lore that is referenced a ton, like in that Shakespeare episode with Ten. The Timelords (or rather, Rassilon in particular) were the ones who established causality and physics as laws of the universe using the Eye of Harmony. Everything that didn't fit their paradigm was banished.
Expanded media covers this a lot, the pre-universe monsters are called the Great Old Ones, and this covers the Nestine too who create Autons as servants. The Great Intelligence is one too. As is Fenric.
According to the carnival queen it was actually this universe in its infancy
There was a universe before the Doctor Who universe, and also the universe itself was like this before the rise of the Time Lords, in the 'Dark Times'.
I am gonna be honest; I knew everything this video said already i just enjoy hearing Tyrell say it. 😅
Us too! ❤❤
🥺 this warmed my heart thank you Jeremy! 🙌🏿😭
@@theoriesbyt Of course man! You were the main reason I watched the official Podcast. ♥♥
So excited to see the Trickster on here!
I SO hoping he returns either next episode or next season
One could argue that Time from Flux is a god. It even had disciples/heralds in Swarm and Azure who believed in their "faith" of death and chaos.
Time is a dimension in of itself, it would be impossible to even conceptualise Time as a god imo
@@william...1 Bro doesn't know about the Menti Celesti.
@@najawin8348 extended media ain’t canon I’m not going down this road
I think calling Time a god is an understatement.
@@william...1 Actually, the *_only_* things referred to as canon by the BBC are extended media - namely, the Adventure Games and Infinity. The show itself isn't canon!
I would like to see The Beast make a return someday. He was a terrifying enemy.
Also, I got the sense that the Pantheon that the Toymaster and Maestro were part of were actual gods, beings from outside time and space able to change reality. Sutekh as shown in Pyramid of Mars was long lived and godlike, but still a mortal being of flesh and bone born on a planet in the universe. How did he end up as part of the Pantheon, let alone "the mother and father and other of them all?" Did dying in the time corridor cause their spirit to undergo a shift and put them outside reality, where they became a true god? Or was the one we saw in Pyramid of Mars merely an avatar of the real Sutekh, who existed beyond time and space?
I hope we get that answered in Empire of Death.
It’s my theory that the Beast and Sutekh are one and the same. They have the same voice, both are gods of death, both have been interpreted as some form of god of the underworld in different religions and Carla Sunday even interpreted Sutekh as the Beast or Devil during the time window scene.
Maybe Sutekh was trapped in the corridor of eternity and ended up outside the universe, in nowhere (where wild blue yonder took place)? He could have created The Toymaker and other guys from Pantheon there out of no-things there just for his own amusement, and later on they left him and started travel on their own? So Sutekh was really born in the Universe, but ended up creating the Pantheon outside of it?
@@alexanderpronyakin8532 that's what I think might have happened, but we won't know until Friday/Saturday.
No offence but we really don't "need" these questions answered via some clunky dialogue in what should be a dramatic season finale.
"Quick, let's stop the episode to explain why Sutekh is now a slightly different bad guy than the one from 50 years ago that half the people watching never knew existed until last week!"
@@Sparx632 you are correct because in the Tom Baker series his names weren't just set and Sethafon but 'Satan' as well if translated from Hebrew means "The one opposed" and I don't just mean to GOD I mean all life! So 🫲😨🫱
I think sutekh jumped on the tardis in wild blue yonder thats when she starting groaning
It’s to see why the Toymaker was afraid of Sutekh. He’s a dangerous being.
How I wish they brought Trixter back for at least one episode of DW. He gave me so many nightmares when I was a child
I don't know how I missed that hint from the Toy maker. Interesting to see how early it was hinted at I wonder if there are more hints through out the 60th specials?
The Tardis starts making that weird noise in Wild Blue Yonder, so that's another hint
@@NankitaBR yeah i noticed that thought it was a toymaker related thing tho
The Meep mentioned that they would tell "The Boss" about the Doctor. Whether or not they were referring to Sutekh remains to be seen.
The Meeps Boss, The Toymakers Legion, The Golden Tooth that trapped the doctor and whoever the person who picked it up was, the mavity and salt issue
I suspect the first line of the specials and indeed this RTD era is key to everything that’s happened since. “Once Upon a Time”
Maybe Sutekh was trapped in the corridor of eternity and ended up outside the universe, in nowhere (where wild blue yonder took place)? He could have created The Toymaker and other guys from Pantheon there out of no-things there just for his own amusement, and later on they left him and started travel on their own? So Sutekh was really born in the Universe, but ended up creating the Pantheon outside of it?
I don't think Sutekh ACTUALLY created the Pantheon. Yes, his harbinger hyped him up, but other gods - Toymaker and Maestro - spoke about "The one Who Waits" as someone who they simply don't want to deal with. Toymaker accidentally found Sutekh and was like "Nope, I'm out". I get the feeling that Sutekh became the main figure of the Pantheon simply because of his power.
doubt he created the toymaker, the toymaker is part of the guardians of time, like white and black but represents play he always existed
@@danielkiran8174Tbf Sutekh is described as “Mother and Father and Other” which you could take as claiming Sutekh created some of the Gods but may have a different relationship to others
The Black Guardian scares the hell out of me as a kid!
At this point, if we don't see all the gods Harriet mentioned except for the toymaker and maestro because we already saw them
i mean we've already seen most of the ones she listed tho
we've seen maestro and the toy master, we've seen the trickster and the mara too. The 3 gods i don't remember which name she said but it's theorized they were actualkly the 3 godsof ragnarok we've seen before so if it's true we've seen them too
so yeah we've seen like half of them i guess (if some of the others aren't ones we've seen without knowing it )
@tunderdiamant8651 I mean in this era I'd be surprised if we don't see the mara or the trickster at some point
@@naruto199797 Guess it depends if they want to keep focusing on the gods thing for the next season or not
@@tunderdiamant8651 The theatre that Ncuti and Varada Sethu are running past has "Harbinger" in lights above the entrance, so presumably we're getting at least one other God next season.
A few of the gods mentioned are from 13’s run.
I know people are confused with Sutekh originally being an Osiran, but here is my theory.
The pantheon of discord that the doctor names in the Sarah Jane Adventures and in The Devils Chord isn’t a established pantheon but a collection of gods that have come together due to their habit of causing chaos in the universe. Some exist outside the universe like the Toymaker and his legion. Some mess with the universe and its inhabitants like Zelin in ‘Can you hear me’.
With Sutekh, it could be that he is the god of death amongst the Osirans but since killing all of his kind and being trapped, has become the head of this pantheon. Or, if he wasn’t a god before, he has ascended to god-hood.
This means that the new season doesn’t retcon Sutekh, he simply became a part of this new pantheon.
Either Ruby is the daughter of Sutekh or someone who is probably the key to defeating Sutekh.
I think that Ruby is the daughter of Horus, the god of the sun who defeated Sutekh. Hence her name, Ruby Sun-Day.
Trickster is borderline Zamorak with time changing powers.
I've got a theory with a colleague, that the Doctor is actually another divine being. It was established he wasn't a normal Time-Lord somewhere in Capaldi's series I believe. Which could explain his more than pre-set amount of regenerations, while the Council convinced him it was by their mercy. And it could explain some other things as wel, living in multiple dimensions (Tennant) and the bi-regeneration for instance.
The Doctor is the Timeless Child, and all we know about their origin is that they were found abandoned or lost next to a rift in time and space, or something, which I can't remember for sure but I believe is the same one Gallifreyans later use to initiate children into Time Lords.
My theory is that the Doctor themself are not *exactly* a celestial/god, but rather, a physical form containing it - I think the Doctor's regeneration energy is an equivalent to Sutekh's black and red smoke, except the Doctor being a vessel for it rather than a direct transformation. The god of healing, or rejuvenation, or improvement, or something like that. The Celestial Healer?
Glad to see these still being uploaded, I love Doctor Who lore so much
I love doctor who so much and I am so ready for the next part of Legend of Ruby Sundae
You know... This is a second time in my life when being Polish kinda ruins being in a fandom for me. The first time was when I was watching the original Avatar series and I found out that Aang's predecessor's name was Roku even though he was called Roko in the Polish dub. The change was made because "Avatar Roku" would sound like "Avatar of the year" in Polish... And I still cannot unsee it.
And here I am, in the middle of a Doctor Who finale, witnessing the return of a terrifying god-like entity... Whose name sounds EXACTLY like a Polish word for "nipple".
Honestly I was hoping the villain of the season would be Hecuba, the toymaker's sister, it would be cool if she had merged with the Tardis somehow, since even their personalities match
I bloody love this show so much ❤❤! 60+ years of history, not afraid to show less successful effects from the past. This also shows everyone that Mythology used to be part of Doctor Who, and not just the final season.
THANKS for this!!!!!
"God's of Ragnaroke who exist to be entertained".
Reminds me of the Ducktales 2017 episode where Scrooge wrestled Jormungandr and Hel, to keep the world from ending.
This is a good explainable
I'm counting the hours for the next episode! I want more answers!
I’m glad this classes the Beast and Sutekh as two different characters.
They are not the same. Saying they’re the same is equivalent of saying the Cybermen and the Daleks are the same thing. They are not.
The queen of time sighing in the background
Interested to see what/who they include
1:14 "AAAHHH"
Maybe Sutekh was waiting at the end of time for the Tardis. In Utopia? Or hanging out with Me in Hell Bent?
The TARDIS started groaning in Wild Blue Yonder, so perhaps he latched on at the edge of the universe
more, moreee, MOREEE!
Even he hesitated when mentioning the Beatles as they look nothing like them
I think I'm totally lost
NOW!.😢
I’m praying they made Sutekh look like he did in the Pyramid of Mars story. It’ll be so disappointing if it’s just a creature with a voice. Even if they get someone to move around in the costume and dub over their lines with Gabriel Wolfs voice, I’m happy with that.
They made him look how he did in the comics.
sutekh is not a god he is one of the osirans and the reasons for his god like power is technology .non of those other gods are a match for sutekh.
Yeh I don't know why he's a god all of a sudden. Same with the mara, that's a deity that does not physically exist unless it is in the mind of someone.
He's considerably more powerful in expanded media than in The Pyramid of Mars. It's implied that when the Fourth Doctor encountered him, he was extremely weakened and in reality is capable of becoming an existential threat to life itself on a universal scale at his full power.
@@tmage23 I think daleks could stop sutekh as if they had set of the reality bomb sutekh would have ceased to exist I think ?
Are the Time Lords all that religious? All of the gods would be viewed as aliens from either this universe or from another one.
Tom Baker! I remembered!!
What about Daemos? And Deimos/Mandragora?
Fenric is gonna be so angry when told another god is trying to claim the title “god of gods”.
Aphrodite forbid for getting over it xxxx
I wanna see the black guardian again
The current shows really need to give a little bit more exposition when the Doctor has encountered these beings before. Especially since the show goes back so far and most don't know all the old shows.
I haven't watched their episodes yet, but is it explained why the Black and White Guardians have birds on their heads? Is it a divine fashion statement?
It is not explained. personally I think only a being witht he power of a guardian could pull off that look and not get laughed at.
if it's any help, Doctor Who Magazine defined 'Face the Raven' as what the Black guardian says when taking a photo.
I sure hope in the “Whoniverse” there is room for older doctors to get more screen time (8th and 14th)
"with the help of the beatles the Doctor AND Ruby?" Lol. No. The Doctor did ABSOLUTELY nothing
Of all the gods I seen in doctor who series, who is the most evilest god of all gods.
When I first saw the Guardian of Darkness and the Guardian of Light decades ago, I thought, "Who are these chicken people?" ;-P
Oh, Mary Tamm was gorgeous (and my first Doctor Who crush)...
5:20, I don't think they almos reference.... or did He?
Can’t believe you made me keep this secret for 2 months 😭
Sutech looks like Splinter the Rat from TMNT. With a dog collar on. What is an "actual god?"
Here what about "Dark places on the inside?"
I think regarding what or who might be possibly really returning other than Sutekh could be central to Mars and the name Flood as we know there also the Ice Warriors and that entries being made of a living fluidity water and these aren't the only lifeforms exiting there. Mrs Flood is named as someone who is a possible figure in the future if she were an old foe who is part of this course but what is she doing is a mystery. Maybe Flood is a clue or a miss direction from the real figure from the darkness of the Terror Of The Dark as in Black Hole the return of a time lord the first time lord Omega but with the Time Wars he may have been regenerated and has been living amongst humans for 60 years and is wearing a face that is hiding floods of secrets, so why don't the Doctor know of this. Omega used a shield of detection. Remember the other name for Omega to the time lords was He Who Waits not Sutekh but Omega. Mrs Flood aka Omega regenerated she has waited but did Sutekh know of Mrs Flood or Omega?
Don't forget The Shada, Time, Cronus, House, The Boneless, The No Things...
the one who waits its amy isnt it
Nah it's sutekh, but yes both her and Rory waited a long time 😂, not as much as sutekh but still
What about Azal from The Daemons?
He’s got a bird on his head he’s clearly evil 😂
Hoping for no Deus Ex Machina resolution to Sutekh
Hope so, too, but RTD sadly has a bad track record with resolving finals
Technically he _is_ a Deus Ex Machina.
You’re watching the wrong show
Basically all it seems that all the Doctor is to give up and runaway with Ruby and some of the UNIT members who he can save. Sutekh is a very powerful god. Yet like every being Sutekh has his weaknesses. Pride is one of Sutekh's weaknesses. Unfortunately, he had enough time to figure out not to let his pride to blind him. One of Sutekh's weaknesses is another God. For the time, it will not be very easy for the Doctor to find any god who is more powerful than Sutekh. Oddly one God was trick by the Toymaker, so as he claims. The Toymaker will rather avoid Sutekh.
How the Doctor find a powerful God who can defeat Sutekh. He must find the right god in a short amount of time. There are the Olympians, but I don't know that the Doctor had encounter one of the Olympians. If the Doctor encounter any of the Olympians, he may ran into Hercules. Since the Doctor has less time, he needs to trick Sutekh to release the TARDIS. The vast written library and the digital library contain sufficient data to help the Doctor find one candidate.
The Doctor knows of a few candidates who are likely powerful enough to defeat Sutekh. Yet he needs to check the two libraries to find the candidate who can defeat Sutekh. Oddly there are some libraries which can help the Doctor. One of which is the Library which maintains the soul of River Song. Because of the Dark Enemy who haunt the Great Library, the Doctor will have to use it as a last resort. Still the 15th Doctor can still run into River Song before her death. Being an Archeologist, River can help the Doctor to find the One who can defeat Sutekh.
I thought Suteckh was trapped on Mars, not earth?
❤❤
How many maestros are there?
Huh neat
I thought Sutekh was trapped on Mars....
No, the artefact holding Sutekh prisoner was on Mars.
He was!
@@darrengamer8189 No, he wasn’t.
Sutekh was trapped in a pyramid on Earth, and the Eye of Horus (which was keeping Sutekh a prisoner) was in a pyramid on Mars.
Correction: Kinda both. The "cell" is in Egypt. The "lock" is controlled from Mars. The "door" to the cell was in Britain.
But then he was thrust in a time corridor where his desth was a forgone conclusion but Tine is fluid and the accelerated event hadnt happened yet
Mary Tamm ❤❤❤❤
I thought sutekh was an extraterrestrial called an osiran, not a transcendental.
i think alot of people are forgetting about wild blue yonder, the doctor cast a superstition at the ends of the universe and let way to the supernatural existing, alot of reality was rewritten and since that episode were in a new altered timeline, first shown right after with the goblins... a simple explanation could be sutekhs essence was changed from this, but maybe not who knows :)
Sutekh was imprisoned on Mars, not on earth.
His capture device was on Mars, but he himself was entrapped in Saqqara, Egypt (before the Doctor offset his time corridor)
Of course the most powerful God of them all is the Doctor.
A god missing from this video is known for the contests he has played with are friendly time lord one of the elder gods Fenric who needs way more recognition someone who challenged the other elder gods and made the Doctor a pawn in one of his games to try and enter are reality so pls can he can he come back
What about Abaddon?
The Tenth Doctor fought Sutekh after he escaped the Void using his son Anubis!
Who wants to bet that the devil will return as well I'm hoping because I want to see is overgrown ass do something don't get me wrong he was excellent in the 2 episode's but I just want to see him do something with the magic that the people say the devil has and see him do some damage with that size of his because holy crappy he is huge
Didn't Thanos already do all this in End Game?
The last of the Time Lords VS the last of the Osirans
Wait, wasn't Pyramids of Mars called that because Sutekh was imprisoned ON Mars?
The Eye of Horus was on Mars, he was on Earth. A plot point in PoM is when the Eye is destroyed he is still trapped on Earth for another few minutes due to the time it takes light/radio signals to travel from Mars to Earth
The Beast isn't just merely the Devil. It is the creature that is considered the evil one in all religions. The being that influenced the image of every devil in every faith. Thus it is referred to by all the names for all devils.
What about the Mara, the Gods of Ragnarok?
you forgot about aha/(toymaker) the aeon of elation. yaoshi - the aeon of abundance. qlipoth - the aeon of preservance. xipe - the aeon of harmony. lan - hunt. nanook - destruction. IX - nihility. nous - erudition. akivili - trailblaze. tayzzyronth - propagation. ena - order. fuli - remebrance. HooH - equilibrium. idrila - the beauty. long - permanence. mythos - enigmata. oroboros - voracity. terminus - finality.
What about Sutekh bring an “Osiran”? Is that conveniently retconned?
No. The Osirans are considered gods.
If the Gods and Osirans are linked is it possible Horus who originally imprisoned Sutekh actually the White Guardian? I was thinking about this earlier in the day and then this video came out.
5:21 Red vs Blue reference?
I was going Red vs Green, like how pvp games color code players. (in MMORPGS, RvB for shooters)
THAT IS NOT THE LAST TIME THE DOCTOR SAW SUTEKH!
it wasn't televised though
8:03 the first mention of the Pantheon? Even if Russell hasn’t decided on a team up between gods yet.
RIP Doctor Who
Cope.
LOVE JINX MONSOON ❤❤❤
one of the worst villians in Doctor Who
@@gunmasterx1164 according to .. u?
@@JsWg510 according to everyone who's complaining about Doctor Who being too woke right now and according to the episode reviews.
@@JsWg510 he also told the fans to fuck off
interesting that sutekh isnt actually...a god
Osirans are gods.
What if Doctor is a God too
I honestly really like Doctor Who in the modern era, but I really can't watch the classic episodes without completely cringing about the "cheap" CGI from back then. I get that it probably was good enough for the time and if this was part of your childhood you can easily ignore these things, but I just can't take it seriously if an all powerful god like being gets banned into the rainbow realm :D
It really wasn't good enough for the time. Jokes have always been made about the show's cheap FX - tinfoil monsters and the like. BBC budgets were miniscule compared to other sci-fi shows like Star Trek and they usually had very little money left when it came to the special effects.
As someone born in 2004 who got into the show with Eccleston and Tennant in my teens, I have no problem watching the classics. Troughton is my favorite doctor, I guess it's just a matter of opinion.
1993 here and only time I hated NuWho was when Chibnall tried running it into the ground.
Thanks to RTD, it only bounced off the ground. We got 2 days until the 2nd part.
Sutekh is not a god
You've forgotten many of the gods of the Whoniverse, like Akhaten and many others.
Coming from the official Dr Who channel, I'm a little disappointed..
0/10, didn't mention Sutekh's Faction Paradox appearances.
Lawrence Miles is the Sutekh of Virgin New Adventures
The special effects were stunning overall except sadly Sutekh. His head looked like a cross between a draught horse (especially the mouth and nostrils) and a massive canine (even down to having a collar). You can actually see the fabric material used in the costume even down to the stitching. CGI good but they should probably have also applied it more to the actual revelation of Sutekh. I hope the mask makes a return. All that money and I an old school DW fan could easily detect the handmade parts of Sutekh's appearance. If you don't believe me stop this video at 8:56 and look around the left eye (on screen) or Sutekh’s actual right eye - it is very easy to notice the material (on a 55+ screen). Enlarge the image and you can see the actual thread on a large screen. The possessed humans though were very shocking and convincing and what an ending. Wow.
Second
And here I thought you were fifteenth. ;)
19 secs ago first! 🥇
who is this guy on the camera man
Tyrell aka @theoriesbyt :)
I am _really_ not a huge fan of mixing god-level threats to the [insert impressive spacial geographical feature here] into one group. Let the Toymaker and Maestro be their own thing, the Black and White Guardians of Time, the Beast in _The Satan Pit,_ the Mara, the Eternals, the Gods of Ragnarok, Light, Fenric, the Daemons, the Master of the Land of Fiction, and Sutekh (an Osiran) should all be their own things without matching wordplay Harbingers. To do otherwise makes them feel like a low-rent comic book supervillain team with their H. Arbingers being their club business cards. And why is Sutekh suddenly into word games and peer groups anyhow? He has his own motif. The universe and all of time and space is a big place after all. There should be literally infinite variety
EXCEPT... when asked about the cool Egyptian part... Cultural appropriation! WHY would they even say THAT?! Its rooted in THAT culture of MYSTERY! I am BEYOND pissed off they would even SAY this! I ruines the show and dragges it down.
First of all, I can’t stand this woke crap anymore. Secondly, all the things they were hinting at, I wanted it to be John Simms master, so Sutekh is quite disappointing
Just rename the show to Dr Who gives a f###
If you don't like the show then don't watch it lol