This will push the industry in the right direction. Looking forward to what specialized has coming with the Gen 4 levo, Ive seen Brose has an updated motor coming with more power and no belt.
Pretty sure that this will end up being a flop! The fact that they have chosen to sell these bikes in places like Fahrrad XXl in Germany doesn’t bode well for their future.
Overpowered e-bikes for many isnt the future. More natural, intuitive, connected e-bikes are what most purist mountain bikers want. Bikes that make you feel like you’re Nino Shurter every ride. Not like your on a motorcycle. Get a proper moto if you wanna rip the trails to shreds
Mid 2025 - 2026 is where we will see a massive reaction from other brands and even pinion. 2024 models come down in price to make way for 2025 versions, and we all get a great deal lol this is definitely a game changer, and the basic build is a good price. Shame its not been offered with an enduro/ dh frame or 180 /190 front and rear. It's good to see this on the market. Hopefully,other brands are concerned, and the consumer gets the best tech and deals going forward.
From what I hear it’s virtually impossible to get this bike so far. They probably want to show off their flagship bike first and even that is incredibly hard to get to test right now.
I have the privateer e161 ebike. Its a heavy, brute of a beast, long travel and totally planted i dont care much for powerful motors etc i just want to get to the top and bomb it down. I think a longer travel version would be a lot of peoples dream bike
If this platform had more travel, I'd be all over this. This is already a better bike / deal than my Levo SL Gen2 S-Works... for nearly $4k less. I want a frame-only option of this platform with more travel.
Hey man i plan to buy my first emtb with specialized 2025 line Should i stay with new SL comp with genie or better full power turbo levo comp carbon If you will have time to look please recommend me
@@Slayer2ez Hey. First, congrats. I think you'd be stoked with either bike. I have the S-Works SL personally. I think it depends on what you ride, fitness levels, what your friends have, etc. For me, I wanted a bike that felt as close to a non electric trail bike as possible. The SL was that for me. Its just under 40lbs. I also find the range and power to be more than I need for 90% of what I ride. And on the other 10%, I've used the range extender (that S-Works comes with) and always had more juice at the end of a long day.
@@AnthonyMcCulley TY for reply! I still think which to buy. Yes that what i expect with SL one, i m not wealthy to buy SL s-works but i probably can buy SL comp 2025 with genie, e switcher, fox x and fox rhythm and maven bronze brakes it,s 19,1 kg total. if you will have time check if that good model and worth to buy. I plan to get SL comp. You don't recommend turbo comp carbon full power one btw?
@@AnthonyMcCulley Also a question about SL, is that comfort to ride with eco/10% on different surface or little uphill? because when i tried to do that on tero it feels pretty boring, even eco was not so comfort and off motor is crazy dead. If SL feel way better on eco and below it's probably great choice for me And what about components and value of models of 2025 line, which levo is best built money for quality for long use you think? Is SL comp with new genie and e switcher with fox x and sox rhythm and Maven Bronze looks a very good deal for 8000$? Or should i better buy turbo levo 2025 and save ~2000$ and stay with allot on Marzocchi Bomber
Thank you for pointing out the fundamental fact that this bike is trail geometry. I think other reviewers have gotten their hands on it, and throw out terms such as enduro or all mountain, but these other reviewers aren't familiar with the geo changes that have affected what modern MTB categories actually are. Yes, this bike has generic, middle of the road trail geometry. Which is not a bad thing, modern trail bikes shred. I hope they execute the details well, and I hope they develop a partnership with Santa Cruz or. Pivot or ibis!
Many of us already have all the components, wheels, colors, ETC. Basically every thing i love is on the bike i own currently. I don't need a full setup/ nor do i want a bunch of parts i don't want/need. PLEASE HAVE THE FRAME ONLY OPTION. I wont spend the money on stuff i have to sell for much less than i paid for it.
I hired the cheapest trek fuel exe. Which is currently on sale for less than €5000 It had way less torque and a much smaller battery, but it was absolutely perfect for trails where I ride. It lasted about 2.5hours in turbo mode with 80% of the riding being up hill.
The DJI package sounds great. Hopefully someone will be able to put a bike together for under £5k in the future. £6.5k maybe competitive to other brands but still too pricey for me.
Until the next brand or V2 version is released with a 1500nm motor with a 1000wh battery with double the density/half the weight. Try to think of these motor defined bikes as appliances and it’ll make more sense.
No it hasn't, there are plenty of motors which have equivalent power torque, they are just not well know. Sachs RS, Polini, Askoll...ecc You have to look outside the main brands on the market.
Good to see a more balanced (not paid) review. How does it compare to ride against the new Orbea Rise LT? I’ve been waiting since May for my Rise to arrive, and thinking of switching to the Amflow as Orbea cannot say when the Rise will arrive
We’ve actually got a full review on the Rise coming very soon. Have a read of my first ride review on MBR.co.uk for more detailed impressions on the ride, handing, and suspension. 👍
The big names were just sitting back too much. We actually don´t need 120Nm of torque, but a full power bike, lightweight, nice screen and software options, very simple but an impresive look...awsome job Amflow and DJI! But a fact: I would like it more with 90Nm max. With this much power, even the local e-bikers, will call you a motorbiker.
Amflow was just intro bike dji is selling the motor on different brand. Hopefully we will see Santa Cruz DJI motor version. Full motor Super lite version
@@finroddd would do me nicely, i do know a friend whos friend works at a bike shop thats going to be dealing these bikes and has said thee orders are insane for them
they should have done a real entry level bike aswell - aluminum frame, entry/midrange components (most of us dont ride rampage or audi 9) for sub 5k, maybe even sub 4k. a new brand which noone has experience with (we all know what dji is like, but their new brand producing a frame which they havnt done before.....) shouldnt expect me to gamble 6k+ on them
I've just confirmed my order and paid deposit for the New Amflow PL. Been watching carefully all the reviews and information. Can't wait, due before Christmas, hopefully it's as good as the hype. Zipp moto carbon wheelset, .Xx AXS T type transmission and AXS reverb dropper with Ultimate code stealth brakes ready and waiting to fit 👍👌😁
The authors of the video MIGHt be interested in a bit of history of the Sachs /BMZ motor . its a german made motor that was originally designed for heavy cargo bikes hence the high torque that can be accessed at low RPMs which is useful in moving loaded cargo bikes from a standstill . the designer was looking for ways to dissipate the heat that is usually associated with high torque e bike motors and part of the solution was to use a metal casing that would draw off a substantial amount of heat. the so called extra weight was considered a non issue because a cargo bike is already super heavy so one more kilo added to the bike was negligible . well he was successful with this design and NOX cycles agreed to use the motor in their E MTB . i've had one for about five years and the slow-ish pedaling up hills without overheating is quite remarkable .
I think the motor and battery are game changers, but sounds like the frame might not be the best suspension design. Look forward to solid state batteries with this motor in a better frame design, and maybe an integrated gearbox?
WAs hoping for a decent conversation about what this bike actually rides like (I get that the motor and battery dominates much of this bike's highlights). You both seem to be adament it fits squarely into the "Trail" category. Is it more like a Stumpy EVO or Ibis Ripmo or Transition Sentinal that is more all-mountain and maybe a half step away from Enduro if built up burly OR is it more like a middle of the road trail bike like a Santa Cruz Hightower/Trek Fuel Ex/Merida One-Forty? Do you think you could Enduro this up a bit with say a coil shock + HBO, some burlier tyres and maybe a 170mm Fox 38 instead of a 36?
Take away 6.5kg for the motor and battery and you’re at 14kg, which is pretty light for a modern trail bike, let alone Enduro bike. So fundamentally the frame is light , like the new Stumpjumper 15. We’d resist the temptation to try and turn it into an Enduro bike, because it’s not that bike. We’ll talk more about this in the written first ride review, which I plan to get done in the next week to ten days. 👍
@MBRmagazine thanks for the wee comparison. Looking forward to the in depth review. As always, appreciate the nuance you two bring to MTB video journalism when the majority of UA-cam reviewers over sensationalise/have such hackneyed generic "reviews".
Is this an Amazing system inside the wrong frame? Are they going to license the tech for other manufacturers? And if so is an OG bike designer going to make the bike you really want?
I think I heard that Amflow have exclusive rights for 2025, then we'll see it on other bike brands. Would be sick if Amflow had an aluminium enduro version
@@mycyclingdisorder I thought Brose was supp to be a good quality motor now for '23 on? No? I keep hearing it is the quietest one out there. My wife's Ride1Up bike has a brose motor...not the same as the Levo motors, but you literally cannot hear it at all unless you are on a steep hill. Are the Brose motors on the Levo not as quiet or solid still? I was actually considering between a Levo and a Canyon Strive:On, (none available currently in the U.S), for my 1st eMTB next year and hearing the noise from the Bosch was a bit of a turnoff. So now you have me starting over.
How long’s a piece of string, right? A multitude of factors at play, but in filming this video I did 27km and 620m climbing and used 49% battery (800wh). That was in auto mode with about ten activations of boost mode. I’m 78.kg and trail conditions were wet.
How does it behave when you stop in a middle of a climb and want to restart again compared to other motors that gives smooth control right at the begining of the stroke ?
The initial response wasn’t as good as the latest Bosch CX, but I didn’t get enough time to play about with the settings in the app. I think it’s possible to change the sensitivity and start up response.
how is the sizing compared to other bikes? the specs on the website indicate it has a short reach and upright seat angle, means if I am a large on a Canyon (for example) i would probably need an XL on the amfow?
Why in hell did they make the shock mount trunnion with all the space avaible in front of it? Make the shock shorter with trunnion and then add a yoke mount to extent it, ridiculous... This bike is going to be a shock killer.
In case you noticed Bike brands don’t give a shit about you. Or any consumer for that matter. Just give them your money and shut the fuck up is exactly what they want. It’s like the world is full of a bunch of fucking idiotic sheep.
thanks Danny and Alan for getting soaking wet on our behalf! So is there any reason why this motor wouldn't suit a more burly enduro bike, and are you aware (and allowed to tell us!) of any more bikes that are coming soon with it?
Ha! It's the least we could do! To your first question, there's absolutely no reason why it wouldn't suit a burlier enduro bike. In fact we think it would be a better fit. To the second question, we have no idea what Amflow has planned, but it would make sense to offer another model aimed at the e-enduro market.
@@ytuberizationI understand it's peak but In the review he's saying eco is like trail so trail is like turbo which on a levo or Bosch is well over 250w. If you can run an 800wh battery down in 2 hrs then that's over 400w consumed continuously or avg
Question: was your bike limited to the American speed limit (20 mph) our European (25 km/h)? With so much power the Europeans like me will be frustrated I think (7-8 km/h difference)
Could it be too powerful, and then damage the cassette, chain, derailleur. Also with a so powerful motor will it run the battery down very quickly?. Also it is not really cycling anymore
This is a great step forward. But I think everybody should hold on to their wallets a minute while the rest of the industry catches up. It might be one of those things where you go out and buy this bike, and you realize you should have waited.
If your riding trails like in the vid, consider I paid 2300 for a hard tail Aventon Rambles also with 105 nm of power, 800watt all day batt and only 4 pounds more, for a 1500 usd you can convert to tubless, and fox 38 front forks.. 😂😂😂
@@dallasdrew2390 if only it was that simple. No one will touch getting batterie’s from Oz to NZ unless you pay a small fortune, just not feasible. Plus with no support in NZ when things go wrong we will have to send it back to Oz. We cannot even get Cayon eeb’s in NZ as well as many other brands. There are some cons to living in paradise 😁
"It's just over 20 kilos it's not going to feel super solid...' kenevo SL is 19 kilos feels super solid. DH bikes are 17 kilos and feel super solid. I think the consensus on this bike is that the motor is awesome but the bike does not ride that good. And that is the most important thing. . ..
@MBRmagazine yep fair call. But I guess my point is it's not really such a break through as people think. Like if those weights you just suggested are correct then to have that system in an enduro bike would be 23 or 24 kg bike a d that already exists now so not a break through at all IMO
@@MBRmagazine How? Yeah, the tech is cool but everything around it is the same old 'stuff'. And the pricing is stale too. DJI could figure out how to bring the costs down. They are giving GoPro headaches with their new Action 5 action cam. Their drones are dominating in that space and I've heard they might get into mirrorless cameras.
What I’m saying is, they’re coming in with a fresh prospective. If there was profit in coming in at a lower price point, there’s nothing to stop them. They could wipe the floor with everyone.
This would be a perfect Enduro project😊. It's has the "God be praised" NOT to steep seat tube angle that destroy this "normal cycling position" that most everyone whants to have😂. Put a 170mm-180mm fox factory fork and 160mm- 170mm rear coil fox factory at the rear, than you have the Ultimate Emtb for now...... I always buy Trail bikes (Now I am now on my 5'th Rebuilt Emtb) that I rebuilt to Enduro just because this damage seat tube angle that seems to be in every high power Emtb today. Se at the POLE Bikes with 81° seat tube angle, how they ended🤔
@@MBRmagazine The reason It's just because of that😅. A EXTREM full power Trail Emtb, like this Amflow bike, is like driving a 500cc two stroke motocross wiht bad suspension😉
Great bike, albeit a one trick pony. With the battey not removeable, I can't take it on tour and swap out the batteries. Also, with the bend in the cross bar there's nowhere to carry a sceond battery for distance touring. So, until Amflow sort out those little incidences, it's a one trick pony.
I was eyeballing this bike until I saw the price. These prices are getting out of hand. My wife actually asked me "why don't you just get a motorcycle?" 😂
The spec actually excels in comparison to other brands, even at their end of 2024 season sale prices. This one's gonna be tidy. If demand is as high as it looks, there will probably be no discounts on it either, perhaps an early adopter accessories pack thrown in. Maybe start looking at that motorcycle...
Guess how long a chain and sprocket last with that power !, it's like Mark Cavendish sprinting for every ride at 1000W, it will eat chains for breakfast 😮
It's got the Sram XX Eagle Transmission drivetrain & chain on it, (not a single review mentions that which I thought was a big deal...why the blackout on talking about component specs?). Isn't that drivetrain supp to be bulletproof and work better under harder loads instead of exploding? Shifting under 20NM full load on a hill would certainly be a good test of that claim.
@CD9 yes i saw that . Two things in that regard- 1- the sachs can run at full power indefinitely , DJi openly admits that their 30 second cut off is to avoid overheating . Also the sachs can deliver its power at a much lower RPM which means the DJi would require more energy due to increased pedal rate resulting in not being able to maintain the 25 top speed limit on a steep hill . 2- but what i find even more interesting is the paid ads or reviews as they are called , are making claims based on specs with little to no real world long term testing by riders and the use of negative hyperbole claiming superiority with statements like 'more powerful by a wide margin ' . or nothing even comes close . that's irresponsible and simply untrue .
Just to make it clear that this was not paid for or partnered with Amflow or dji in any way. With regards to the Sachs motor you mention, I think it’s worth pointing out that the DJI motor is also 1kg lighter than the Sachs.
an extra 2.2lbs on a full power e bike is a non issue for the majority of riders that don't do kamakazi downhills with aerial acrobatics . weight weenies are like audiophiles that pay more attention to their gear than just enjoying the music/ride . as to the claimed non affiliation with Amflow/DJi , they DO expect a certain degree of hyperbole on the part of the reviewer . i do find it strange that almost every ad for their company ( because that's what it is regardless of being paid or not ) says that the DJi is WAAY more powerful than all other bikes available . this is simply not true . i've already mentioned the details of that so ,,,,
People can make their own mind up whether weight is an important part of the equation or not - we’re just pointing it out. Yes, there have been equally powerful motors in the past, like the Sachs and TQ you mention, but equally technology has moved on and this affects the way that power is delivered. This is not a review, it’s just a collection of first impressions. The review is coming later. Equating some positive impressions with an advert is bizarre. Glad you’re happy with your bike and motor. At the end of the day, that’s the important thing.
I can hill climb anything with my stroked big bore YZ250 (325), pretty powerful bike with 14/48t gearing idk I have no issue with keeping the front wheel tracking. Am I losing something here? Is this bike more powerful than a 325cc mx running race gas!? 😅😂
I m a bit confused... You don t ride biked with pedals as I hunderstand??? I didn t see the pedals when you weighted it 😉😉. It s a fake trick used by mtb companies
@@MBRmagazine if I follow your logic then why you didn t remove the saddle, handle bar, gris etc... Theses are bikers favorite also😉. The fact to take off the pedals is a mtb industrie trick (constructor and journalist) to minimise the weight. Honesty is always the good way to go 😉😉
@@MBRmagazine Come on, don t try to bring the conversation somewhere else... You have to give the right informations to your viewers, it s just an honesty fact. More over you said 100% stock and you didn t tell that it was without pedals... So the information is not correct, it s not 100% stock as it s not including the pedals... Remove other parts then if I follow your logic : heyy my mtb weights 1kg dude 100% stock
Every bike weight on every media site and manufacturer is without pedals. Otherwise everyone has to use the same pedals and make a note of which pedals the bike was weighed with. There are bigger problems in the world to worry about.
No one is discussing whether this is legal to ride in the UK as it has over 250w whatts of power so is not classified as an EPAC (electrically assisted pedal cycles) and will therefore be classified as a moped or motorcycle and so should be licensed and taxed and should not be riden on cycle tracks??
I think it's a common misunderstanding, the mentioned 250w are the average output during a 30min period, the 850w here are the peak power, that the motor can push out for a short time. The motor was mainly produced for the EU market so it surely complies to the laws, I guess the UK has the same regulations for ebikes like the EU, doesn't it?
Because the bike is doing most of the work for him so he doesn't need the angle or the leverage. When you run up a hill you lean forward...when someone is carrying you, you can lay back.
Just passed by to say to all the DJI Fanbois that their dream motor still uses derailleur, and that the TQ HP120S is still the power king, so suck it up!
I hope all the other motor manufacturers take note and start increasing their power and making the price point more competitive.
This will push the industry in the right direction. Looking forward to what specialized has coming with the Gen 4 levo, Ive seen Brose has an updated motor coming with more power and no belt.
Pretty sure that this will end up being a flop! The fact that they have chosen to sell these bikes in places like Fahrrad XXl in Germany doesn’t bode well for their future.
If my Kenevo SL could make a kid with this bike, assuming the right genes get propagated I'd be like: Take my money right now.
Overpowered e-bikes for many isnt the future. More natural, intuitive, connected e-bikes are what most purist mountain bikers want. Bikes that make you feel like you’re Nino Shurter every ride. Not like your on a motorcycle. Get a proper moto if you wanna rip the trails to shreds
The extra control offered by the hall sensor on the rear wheel and power control seems a big part of the innovation.
11:06 “The motor does the torque-ing” my favorite quote of the day.
Waiting for the 170+… THEN it’ll be right! 😀👍🏼
Mid 2025 - 2026 is where we will see a massive reaction from other brands and even pinion. 2024 models come down in price to make way for 2025 versions, and we all get a great deal lol this is definitely a game changer, and the basic build is a good price. Shame its not been offered with an enduro/ dh frame or 180 /190 front and rear. It's good to see this on the market. Hopefully,other brands are concerned, and the consumer gets the best tech and deals going forward.
Very nice interview/discussion, touching the important issues!
Thanks!
I would like to see a longer travel version with burlier suspensions for enduro-freeride
So would we!
Filming on my local trails, well done!
Be good to see a test on the lower spec bike as i haven't seen anybody cover it yet.
Yes, agreed. We did ask for one to test, so need to check which one is heading our way.
From what I hear it’s virtually impossible to get this bike so far. They probably want to show off their flagship bike first and even that is incredibly hard to get to test right now.
Finally getting good tech on mountain bikes. Let’s hope reliability is good and to see this motor and battery on other bikes!
Will wait for the warranty and etc for UK original buyer motor replacement etc.
5 years for the frame, 2 years for the motor
I have the privateer e161 ebike. Its a heavy, brute of a beast, long travel and totally planted i dont care much for powerful motors etc i just want to get to the top and bomb it down. I think a longer travel version would be a lot of peoples dream bike
It would be interesting to do a range test vs Orbea Rise in RS+ mode to understand which of the two bikes is more efficient
I'm on the waiting list for the PL Pro... can't bloody wait ❤
If this platform had more travel, I'd be all over this. This is already a better bike / deal than my Levo SL Gen2 S-Works... for nearly $4k less. I want a frame-only option of this platform with more travel.
Hey man i plan to buy my first emtb with specialized 2025 line
Should i stay with new SL comp with genie or better full power turbo levo comp carbon
If you will have time to look please recommend me
@@Slayer2ez Hey. First, congrats. I think you'd be stoked with either bike. I have the S-Works SL personally. I think it depends on what you ride, fitness levels, what your friends have, etc.
For me, I wanted a bike that felt as close to a non electric trail bike as possible. The SL was that for me. Its just under 40lbs. I also find the range and power to be more than I need for 90% of what I ride. And on the other 10%, I've used the range extender (that S-Works comes with) and always had more juice at the end of a long day.
@@AnthonyMcCulley TY for reply! I still think which to buy. Yes that what i expect with SL one, i m not wealthy to buy SL s-works but i probably can buy SL comp 2025 with genie, e switcher, fox x and fox rhythm and maven bronze brakes it,s 19,1 kg total. if you will have time check if that good model and worth to buy. I plan to get SL comp. You don't recommend turbo comp carbon full power one btw?
@@AnthonyMcCulley Also a question about SL, is that comfort to ride with eco/10% on different surface or little uphill? because when i tried to do that on tero it feels pretty boring, even eco was not so comfort and off motor is crazy dead. If SL feel way better on eco and below it's probably great choice for me
And what about components and value of models of 2025 line, which levo is best built money for quality for long use you think? Is SL comp with new genie and e switcher with fox x and sox rhythm and Maven Bronze looks a very good deal for 8000$? Or should i better buy turbo levo 2025 and save ~2000$ and stay with allot on Marzocchi Bomber
Thank you for pointing out the fundamental fact that this bike is trail geometry. I think other reviewers have gotten their hands on it, and throw out terms such as enduro or all mountain, but these other reviewers aren't familiar with the geo changes that have affected what modern MTB categories actually are.
Yes, this bike has generic, middle of the road trail geometry. Which is not a bad thing, modern trail bikes shred. I hope they execute the details well, and I hope they develop a partnership with Santa Cruz or. Pivot or ibis!
Many of us already have all the components, wheels, colors, ETC. Basically every thing i love is on the bike i own currently. I don't need a full setup/ nor do i want a bunch of parts i don't want/need. PLEASE HAVE THE FRAME ONLY OPTION. I wont spend the money on stuff i have to sell for much less than i paid for it.
I think there are a lot of people on a similar boat to you, but unfortunately for most brands it’s just not worth doing a frame only option.
I hired the cheapest trek fuel exe. Which is currently on sale for less than €5000 It had way less torque and a much smaller battery, but it was absolutely perfect for trails where I ride. It lasted about 2.5hours in turbo mode with 80% of the riding being up hill.
Interesting, thanks. Although I am scraping my head about how you got home - maybe you’re texting before doing the descending? 😅
Range test at different power modes would be interesting
Could it be too powerful, and then damage the cassette, chain, derailleur
I good dose of healthy competition coming to market 👍 Any idea on availability, for North America?
Sorry, no. We'll ask the question though.
With that amount of power, I wonder how long the drive train will last?
I thought MGUs will be the next big thing. But probably Amflow will be.
The DJI package sounds great. Hopefully someone will be able to put a bike together for under £5k in the future. £6.5k maybe competitive to other brands but still too pricey for me.
I run my rear type backwards to utilize the square leading edge at 14-16psi, not worried about rolling resistance.
It’s literally left every other other brand in the dust
Until the next brand or V2 version is released with a 1500nm motor with a 1000wh battery with double the density/half the weight. Try to think of these motor defined bikes as appliances and it’ll make more sense.
No it hasn't, there are plenty of motors which have equivalent power torque, they are just not well know. Sachs RS, Polini, Askoll...ecc You have to look outside the main brands on the market.
@@alexbiketester…yes, but everyone knows the brand DJI… There are a lot of drone brands, but who knows it?
@@alexbiketester Is not just power & torque... All considering it really left everyone in the dust, hard to admit, but true.
@@dit4963 It hasnt, try a Sachs or ASKOLL.
Good to see a more balanced (not paid) review. How does it compare to ride against the new Orbea Rise LT? I’ve been waiting since May for my Rise to arrive, and thinking of switching to the Amflow as Orbea cannot say when the Rise will arrive
We’ve actually got a full review on the Rise coming very soon. Have a read of my first ride review on MBR.co.uk for more detailed impressions on the ride, handing, and suspension. 👍
We’ll probably never see this come to the US.
The big names were just sitting back too much. We actually don´t need 120Nm of torque, but a full power bike, lightweight, nice screen and software options, very simple but an impresive look...awsome job Amflow and DJI! But a fact: I would like it more with 90Nm max. With this much power, even the local e-bikers, will call you a motorbiker.
You can always tune the power down
I think at £6k the lower spec bike will sell like hot cakes
yeah - actually the lower spec is very decent.
Amflow was just intro bike dji is selling the motor on different brand. Hopefully we will see Santa Cruz DJI motor version. Full motor Super lite version
@@finrodddi like the silver one more than the gold and black version thats looks like a cannondale moterra neo 1 sl
@@megane230f1 the silver one probably will need bigger shock but not immediately
@@finroddd would do me nicely, i do know a friend whos friend works at a bike shop thats going to be dealing these bikes and has said thee orders are insane for them
Next level!!
Be interesting to see how chains deal with the torque. Be a bummer to snap the chain half way up a climb.
they should have done a real entry level bike aswell - aluminum frame, entry/midrange components (most of us dont ride rampage or audi 9) for sub 5k, maybe even sub 4k. a new brand which noone has experience with (we all know what dji is like, but their new brand producing a frame which they havnt done before.....) shouldnt expect me to gamble 6k+ on them
Canyon Torque mullet 💥💯
Hopefully pinion can make as good of a motor or just use this combined with the gearbox
I've just confirmed my order and paid deposit for the New Amflow PL. Been watching carefully all the reviews and information. Can't wait, due before Christmas, hopefully it's as good as the hype. Zipp moto carbon wheelset, .Xx AXS T type transmission and AXS reverb dropper with Ultimate code stealth brakes ready and waiting to fit 👍👌😁
Hope you enjoy it, and you don’t get too bored waiting for your mates to catch up! 😂
Haha, reckon they'll be tired of the big grin every time they do 😁 Can't wait 👍
The authors of the video MIGHt be interested in a bit of history of the Sachs /BMZ motor .
its a german made motor that was originally designed for heavy cargo bikes hence the high torque that can be accessed at low RPMs which is useful in moving loaded cargo bikes from a standstill .
the designer was looking for ways to dissipate the heat that is usually associated with high torque e bike motors and part of the solution was to use a metal casing that would draw off a substantial amount of heat. the so called extra weight was considered a non issue because a cargo bike is already super heavy so one more kilo added to the bike was negligible . well he was successful with this design and NOX cycles agreed to use the motor in their E MTB . i've had one for about five years and the slow-ish pedaling up hills without overheating is quite remarkable .
I want this bike. I have a commuter all decked out, and I want to get this and leave it bone stock.
I think the motor and battery are game changers, but sounds like the frame might not be the best suspension design. Look forward to solid state batteries with this motor in a better frame design, and maybe an integrated gearbox?
Suspension is actually good. The tune is spot on and the bike is supple, active, and poppy. 👍
WAs hoping for a decent conversation about what this bike actually rides like (I get that the motor and battery dominates much of this bike's highlights).
You both seem to be adament it fits squarely into the "Trail" category. Is it more like a Stumpy EVO or Ibis Ripmo or Transition Sentinal that is more all-mountain and maybe a half step away from Enduro if built up burly OR is it more like a middle of the road trail bike like a Santa Cruz Hightower/Trek Fuel Ex/Merida One-Forty?
Do you think you could Enduro this up a bit with say a coil shock + HBO, some burlier tyres and maybe a 170mm Fox 38 instead of a 36?
Take away 6.5kg for the motor and battery and you’re at 14kg, which is pretty light for a modern trail bike, let alone Enduro bike. So fundamentally the frame is light , like the new Stumpjumper 15. We’d resist the temptation to try and turn it into an Enduro bike, because it’s not that bike. We’ll talk more about this in the written first ride review, which I plan to get done in the next week to ten days. 👍
@MBRmagazine thanks for the wee comparison. Looking forward to the in depth review. As always, appreciate the nuance you two bring to MTB video journalism when the majority of UA-cam reviewers over sensationalise/have such hackneyed generic "reviews".
Thanks! Appreciate the kind words and support.
Imagine when they implement anti slip in the back for wet conditions.
Is this an Amazing system inside the wrong frame? Are they going to license the tech for other manufacturers? And if so is an OG bike designer going to make the bike you really want?
Maybe they should buy Pole?
I think I heard that Amflow have exclusive rights for 2025, then we'll see it on other bike brands. Would be sick if Amflow had an aluminium enduro version
We wouldn't be surprised to see a queue of brands knocking on DJI's door now this has come out.
The Spesh levo is done. Whether full power or SL, both are toast🥲
Brose. The weak link.
Specialized. The most Overpriced
@@mycyclingdisorder I thought Brose was supp to be a good quality motor now for '23 on? No?
I keep hearing it is the quietest one out there. My wife's Ride1Up bike has a brose motor...not the same as the Levo motors, but you literally cannot hear it at all unless you are on a steep hill. Are the Brose motors on the Levo not as quiet or solid still? I was actually considering between a Levo and a Canyon Strive:On, (none available currently in the U.S), for my 1st eMTB next year and hearing the noise from the Bosch was a bit of a turnoff. So now you have me starting over.
what can you say about battery consumption? If you're using up all that torque, what would that net you in ride time?
How long’s a piece of string, right? A multitude of factors at play, but in filming this video I did 27km and 620m climbing and used 49% battery (800wh). That was in auto mode with about ten activations of boost mode. I’m 78.kg and trail conditions were wet.
Impressive!
Do you know when they’ll be available in the USA?
Not at the moment, but I’m guessing that’s a goal.
not now，but you can also buy it
How does it behave when you stop in a middle of a climb and want to restart again compared to other motors that gives smooth control right at the begining of the stroke ?
The initial response wasn’t as good as the latest Bosch CX, but I didn’t get enough time to play about with the settings in the app. I think it’s possible to change the sensitivity and start up response.
how is the sizing compared to other bikes? the specs on the website indicate it has a short reach and upright seat angle, means if I am a large on a Canyon (for example) i would probably need an XL on the amfow?
Have a read of the first ride review on MBR.co.uk - it’s got loads more info on the sizing and handling. 👍
Yeah same as always. Add 2 kilo to the weight to get the real weight. But 21,5kg pretty good.
Why in hell did they make the shock mount trunnion with all the space avaible in front of it? Make the shock shorter with trunnion and then add a yoke mount to extent it, ridiculous... This bike is going to be a shock killer.
In case you noticed Bike brands don’t give a shit about you. Or any consumer for that matter. Just give them your money and shut the fuck up is exactly what they want. It’s like the world is full of a bunch of fucking idiotic sheep.
Lol
Yes absolutely, can’t understand why they did this. Well than hopefully there wiil room enough for a TTX22M shock
Yes, my biggest concern about this bike is how the shock will hold up.
There’s an accessory mount in front of the shock.
thanks Danny and Alan for getting soaking wet on our behalf! So is there any reason why this motor wouldn't suit a more burly enduro bike, and are you aware (and allowed to tell us!) of any more bikes that are coming soon with it?
Ha! It's the least we could do! To your first question, there's absolutely no reason why it wouldn't suit a burlier enduro bike. In fact we think it would be a better fit. To the second question, we have no idea what Amflow has planned, but it would make sense to offer another model aimed at the e-enduro market.
Should make a AWD version.
If the battery is built into the frame, will storing the bike in a cold garage damage the battery over time ?
Depends on the temperature. If it’s negative Celsius, probably best to bring it inside somewhere warm.
I hope other motor companies learn something from DJI: You don't have to have a loud motor to have power.
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How do you think it would alter the feel if you upgraded to a 170mm fox 38?
Personally, I think that’s trying to turn this bike into something it’s not.
How tall are you? How did you find the size in the L?
Wish I can afford one 😂
All the big oems are shiting themselves when they are charging what they are!
Out of interest how is it UK legal when they are supposed to be a maximum of 250w continuous power?
It is legal in UK and EU. The 850/1000 Watt are peak power, not constant.
@@ytuberizationI understand it's peak but
In the review he's saying eco is like trail so trail is like turbo which on a levo or Bosch is well over 250w. If you can run an 800wh battery down in 2 hrs then that's over 400w consumed continuously or avg
I guess it is speed limited. even in boost mode?
Depending on where you are in the world, yes.
The Amflow pulled away but how if both restricted to 15mph?…. Did you manage to derestrict?
Both bikes had the 15.5mph limiter.
Hopefully you can unlock it to 32km/h ! 25 is ridiculous 😢
Yes 15moh is way too slow. I have Turbo Levo with Levociraptor and makes such a huge different to the size of the smile on your face!
The old guy has the resting position the worm's in man in black have
Question: was your bike limited to the American speed limit (20 mph) our European (25 km/h)? With so much power the Europeans like me will be frustrated I think (7-8 km/h difference)
Limited to 25km/h 👍
Could it be too powerful, and then damage the cassette, chain, derailleur.
Also with a so powerful motor will it run the battery down very quickly?.
Also it is not really cycling anymore
Certainly it remains to be seen how modern drivetrains will cope on this bike.
Exactly, Lightweight vs power never equals durability. Component manufacturers struggle enough building light stuff to last on 85nm and 750w 😂
This is a great step forward. But I think everybody should hold on to their wallets a minute while the rest of the industry catches up. It might be one of those things where you go out and buy this bike, and you realize you should have waited.
I want this bike so bad, but I can’t afford it. 😢
The old hairy one is so informative 👍🏽
😂
The rest of the manufacturers are s******* their pants.
Engine yes, bike probably not.
They'll probably sell the motors, electronics and battery to other brands
Looks like your dropper post died as it’s sunk for almost all the video.
Try climbing steep trails with it dropped. You’ll be surprised.
If your riding trails like in the vid, consider I paid 2300 for a hard tail Aventon Rambles also with 105 nm of power, 800watt all day batt and only 4 pounds more, for a 1500 usd you can convert to tubless, and fox 38 front forks.. 😂😂😂
Hopefully brands will decrease the price of their bikes.
My Orbea rise might be at risk……..
But is it restricted to 15 mph???
Depends where you are in the world. UK and Europe is 25kph. US is 20mph.
Another vid ruined by rubbish muzak. What's wrong with the crunch of tyre on track? Unwatchable.
We’ll try and let the noise of the bike take centre stage in future if the quality is good enough 👍
Gutted Amflow are not bringing their bikes to New Zealand!
Just order one from Australia online and get it sent accross the ditch.
@@dallasdrew2390 if only it was that simple. No one will touch getting batterie’s from Oz to NZ unless you pay a small fortune, just not feasible. Plus with no support in NZ when things go wrong we will have to send it back to Oz. We cannot even get Cayon eeb’s in NZ as well as many other brands. There are some cons to living in paradise 😁
"It's just over 20 kilos it's not going to feel super solid...' kenevo SL is 19 kilos feels super solid. DH bikes are 17 kilos and feel super solid. I think the consensus on this bike is that the motor is awesome but the bike does not ride that good. And that is the most important thing. . ..
Yes but your Kenevo motor and battery weighs 3.7kg give or take, and the DJI is 6.5kg. That’s a lot of weight available to bulk up the chassis.
@MBRmagazine yep fair call. But I guess my point is it's not really such a break through as people think. Like if those weights you just suggested are correct then to have that system in an enduro bike would be 23 or 24 kg bike a d that already exists now so not a break through at all IMO
Yes that’s spot on. Slight weight saving on the motor, and latest battery cells, but the main systems will have that soon enough.
We wonder why the bike industry is in trouble. $8K+ Yikes
Hardly legacy bike industry though. This is a completely new ball game for DJi
@@MBRmagazine How? Yeah, the tech is cool but everything around it is the same old 'stuff'. And the pricing is stale too. DJI could figure out how to bring the costs down. They are giving GoPro headaches with their new Action 5 action cam. Their drones are dominating in that space and I've heard they might get into mirrorless cameras.
What I’m saying is, they’re coming in with a fresh prospective. If there was profit in coming in at a lower price point, there’s nothing to stop them. They could wipe the floor with everyone.
@@MBRmagazine Let's hope they really shake up the industry.
This would be a perfect Enduro project😊.
It's has the "God be praised" NOT to steep seat tube angle that destroy this "normal cycling position" that most everyone whants to have😂.
Put a 170mm-180mm fox factory fork and 160mm- 170mm rear coil fox factory at the rear, than you have the Ultimate Emtb for now......
I always buy Trail bikes (Now I am now on my 5'th Rebuilt Emtb) that I rebuilt to Enduro just because this damage seat tube angle that seems to be in every high power Emtb today.
Se at the POLE Bikes with 81° seat tube angle, how they ended🤔
I’m not sure ‘enduroing’ the Amflow is the best move. It’s basically a 14kg trail bike with a ludicrously powerful motor.
@@MBRmagazine
The reason It's just because of that😅.
A EXTREM full power Trail Emtb, like this Amflow bike, is like driving a 500cc two stroke motocross wiht bad suspension😉
Great bike, albeit a one trick pony. With the battey not removeable, I can't take it on tour and swap out the batteries. Also, with the bend in the cross bar there's nowhere to carry a sceond battery for distance touring. So, until Amflow sort out those little incidences, it's a one trick pony.
I was eyeballing this bike until I saw the price. These prices are getting out of hand. My wife actually asked me "why don't you just get a motorcycle?" 😂
This bike is thousands less than other bikes of this calibre.
You're preaching on the wrong video
The spec actually excels in comparison to other brands, even at their end of 2024 season sale prices. This one's gonna be tidy. If demand is as high as it looks, there will probably be no discounts on it either, perhaps an early adopter accessories pack thrown in. Maybe start looking at that motorcycle...
Guess how long a chain and sprocket last with that power !, it's like Mark Cavendish sprinting for every ride at 1000W, it will eat chains for breakfast 😮
make it singlespeed! Problem solved! 😂
It's got the Sram XX Eagle Transmission drivetrain & chain on it, (not a single review mentions that which I thought was a big deal...why the blackout on talking about component specs?). Isn't that drivetrain supp to be bulletproof and work better under harder loads instead of exploding? Shifting under 20NM full load on a hill would certainly be a good test of that claim.
launch date 2035?
Available next month apparently
Thank you it’s been so elusive to get an ETA
"Way more power than anything else " ??
i think not .
Sachs/BMZ 112 Nm
TQ 120 NM
Rocky mountain about 108 NM
Gmbn tested it on an uphill section and it was over 20% faster than the Rocky and with crap tyres
@CD9 yes i saw that . Two things in that regard-
1- the sachs can run at full power indefinitely , DJi openly admits that their 30 second cut off is to avoid overheating . Also the sachs can deliver its power at a much lower RPM which means the DJi would require more energy due to increased pedal rate resulting in not being able to maintain the 25 top speed limit on a steep hill .
2- but what i find even more interesting is the paid ads or reviews as they are called , are making claims based on specs with little to no real world long term testing by riders and the use of negative hyperbole claiming superiority with statements like 'more powerful by a wide margin ' . or nothing even comes close . that's irresponsible and simply untrue .
Just to make it clear that this was not paid for or partnered with Amflow or dji in any way. With regards to the Sachs motor you mention, I think it’s worth pointing out that the DJI motor is also 1kg lighter than the Sachs.
an extra 2.2lbs on a full power e bike is a non issue for the majority of riders that don't do kamakazi downhills with aerial acrobatics . weight weenies are like audiophiles that pay more attention to their gear than just enjoying the music/ride .
as to the claimed non affiliation with Amflow/DJi , they DO expect a certain degree of hyperbole on the part of the reviewer . i do find it strange that almost every ad for their company ( because that's what it is regardless of being paid or not ) says that the DJi is WAAY more powerful than all other bikes available . this is simply not true . i've already mentioned the details of that so ,,,,
People can make their own mind up whether weight is an important part of the equation or not - we’re just pointing it out. Yes, there have been equally powerful motors in the past, like the Sachs and TQ you mention, but equally technology has moved on and this affects the way that power is delivered. This is not a review, it’s just a collection of first impressions. The review is coming later. Equating some positive impressions with an advert is bizarre. Glad you’re happy with your bike and motor. At the end of the day, that’s the important thing.
No wonder you need an e-bike. That saddle is waaaaaaay to low.
Putting the saddle down for steep climbs lets you maximise traction while minimising front wheel lift.
@@MBRmagazine Sure, but not that low. There is no way you can get power through your legs with the saddle slammed that low.
Pinion better
I can hill climb anything with my stroked big bore YZ250 (325), pretty powerful bike with 14/48t gearing idk I have no issue with keeping the front wheel tracking. Am I losing something here? Is this bike more powerful than a 325cc mx running race gas!? 😅😂
One word; traction.
My cube has 85nm and if I’ve got grip I can climb the hill, I’ve never once wanted more power, this is ridiculous and pointless.
You can tell that the guys at Amflow don’t know shit about bike design simply by the fact that they made this thing a trunnion!
I m a bit confused... You don t ride biked with pedals as I hunderstand??? I didn t see the pedals when you weighted it 😉😉.
It s a fake trick used by mtb companies
Just add the weight of your favourite pedals? 🤷♂️
@@MBRmagazine if I follow your logic then why you didn t remove the saddle, handle bar, gris etc... Theses are bikers favorite also😉.
The fact to take off the pedals is a mtb industrie trick (constructor and journalist) to minimise the weight. Honesty is always the good way to go 😉😉
Oh no, you’ve uncovered our evil conspiracy to trick the world! And we would have got away with it if it wasn’t for you meddling kids! 😤
@@MBRmagazine Come on, don t try to bring the conversation somewhere else... You have to give the right informations to your viewers, it s just an honesty fact. More over you said 100% stock and you didn t tell that it was without pedals... So the information is not correct, it s not 100% stock as it s not including the pedals...
Remove other parts then if I follow your logic : heyy my mtb weights 1kg dude 100% stock
Every bike weight on every media site and manufacturer is without pedals. Otherwise everyone has to use the same pedals and make a note of which pedals the bike was weighed with. There are bigger problems in the world to worry about.
No one is discussing whether this is legal to ride in the UK as it has over 250w whatts of power so is not classified as an EPAC (electrically assisted pedal cycles) and will therefore be classified as a moped or motorcycle and so should be licensed and taxed and should not be riden on cycle tracks??
I think it's a common misunderstanding, the mentioned 250w are the average output during a 30min period, the 850w here are the peak power, that the motor can push out for a short time. The motor was mainly produced for the EU market so it surely complies to the laws, I guess the UK has the same regulations for ebikes like the EU, doesn't it?
We asked the CEO of Bosch about this recently. Will get his response written up and on the site soon.
Why the heck is that rider pedaling uphill with the dropper post all the way down? That makes zero sense to me unless the dropper was broken? 🤔
It’s the best way to maintain traction and keep the front wheel from lifting.
Because he is a better rider than you 😂
It makes perfect sense.
Because the bike is doing most of the work for him so he doesn't need the angle or the leverage. When you run up a hill you lean forward...when someone is carrying you, you can lay back.
£9k...no, I'll buy a car. Completely overpriced.
You have a valid point about the price, but not sure buying a car will help you go mountain biking!
you can try the basic one，its cheaper
Dreadful load “music”. Stopped watching
Agreed. I want to be able to listen for creaks, squeaks, cable rattle, motor back lash, motor noise, etc, but the music drowned everything out.
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Just passed by to say to all the DJI Fanbois that their dream motor still uses derailleur, and that the TQ HP120S is still the power king, so suck it up!
Can someone show Danny how to not dress like a dork?
Ha! We don’t have a wardrobe department! 😂
It would be great if it actually was a bike that one can buy...lots of bla,bla about this unicorn bike.. dosen't matter if can't buy
Deliveries to dealers next month they’re saying.
好想買 可惜我這邊沒有販售
Like using a jet ski for surfing. Fun for 20 minutes but ultimately soulless.
How tall are you? How did you find the size in the L?