Non-Book Reader Review | The Wheel of Time S2 Episodes 6-7 *spoilers*
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- Опубліковано 24 сер 2024
- Perrin (and Caitlin) learn about Ji'e'toh, Mat and Ishamael do shrooms, and Aludra regrets hiding her secret stash of fireworks in the foregate. What does a non-book reader think of episodes 6 & 7 of season 2?
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An Egwene stan. We can work with this 😊
Egwene threatening Renna and redoing her braid was superb.
The trippy tea was not my favourite for Mat- would have preferred him seeing his flickers or something.
Ji is Honour and Toh is obligation.
Mo has big toh to Lan. Insurmountable Toh.
Really hoping the Siuan plot is some Daes Dae Mar’ing.
Oh my god I’d love a Verin/Moiraine relationship.
Lanfears trip to the Foregate is iconic. Come on losers we’re going destroying.
See, now why couldn't I remember to explain Ji'e'toh that simply 😅
Verin and Moiraine, the shop we didn't know we needed 🤣
Rand: Mum, I think there might be drugs at this party 😳
Lanfear: Don't move, I'm coming to get you!
I’d perhaps reassure her that ji’e’toh isn’t meant to make complete sense after a single conversation, or five conversations. Like most foreign cultures, it only starts to make intuitive sense once you’ve been immersed in it.
Or... super hard pop quiz after each episode?
C'mon, in episode 7, Mat had the best line so far in the series, asking Ishy, "Is this a sex thing or murder thing?" I think I scared my wife a bit with how much that line made me laugh.
With how often that question has been asked this season, it makes me wonder how common getting kidnapped for sex is in Randland
"Either way, let's get it over with quickly."
Poor Mat! 😂
😅 she's not impressed this season.
@@ElliotEdits maybe he’ll win her over next episode. Miracles happen!😜
He's got the one liners going, at least.
I've read the whole series and I have the same opinion about Mat.
It's quite nifty of the scriptwriters in this season to connect episodes. Like Nynaeve feels guilty for what happened to Ryma in Ep6, so in Ep7, she lets Elayne take the lead.
'Don't encourage her' got me giggling
But Min never mentioned meeting Rand, so when she said his name he immediately knew. Makes total sense.
I suppose total betrayal is the next logical step to jump to 😅
@@ElliotEdits maybe not in regular life, but when you’re a ta’ve’ren intertwined with the Dragon Reborn it’s probably a pretty safe assumption
Under those circumstances, probably safe to stay skeptical of friends
The Mat gag (or is it) is hilarious.
Once I got the clip of the tear cascading down his cheek, I knew I'd be using it a lot 😂
@@ElliotEdits Brilliant!
Poor Mat!!😢Egwene... man, I do NOT like her in the books, but the show made me love her too! I can totally relate there, Caitlin!
Siuan, really, wanting to cage Rand & use as a weapon is that any different from what the Seanchan do with Egwene?
Lanfear though, is defo the top dog of ladies at the moment.🙃 Although Rema get's an honorary mention. What a lady.
Show Egwene > book Egwene 🤣
It was a nice parallel with Siuan and the Seanchan.
Lanfear is queen 👑
I actually thought that the way the handled Mat was good. I would have liked the Flickers but this seemed like a unique way to handle it. It was one of my favorite scenes of the season.
I did like the trippy nature of the scene, but would have liked to see some flickers. Could have been a nice parallel to Nynaeve's journey through the arches.
Good reaction, but with mat a book favourite it is hard to see people not liking mat at all. I think the 'cut' section will still be there by the way.
I hope so! Fingers crossed the mirror is just foreshadowing
Direct translations
Ji = Honor
e = and
Toh = Obligation
Thank you! My explanation was a bit long-winded 😅
First season made Mat my favorite character even before reading the books. Now I'm reading book 5 and Mat is still my favorite, but if I hadn't read the books and had just watched season 2 I wouldn't even remembered Mat existed, which is quite sad.
But I get why they are struggling a bit. Mat doesn't do a lot during EOTW and TGH. I think that skipping to his plot during TDR would work and be more fun but then what would he do next season?
That's really interesting to hear. You make a good point about series 3 🤔 wonder if he will end up going to the Three-fold Land. Hoping for a showdown with Fain in episode 8
Poor Mat, he is mine and probably the vast majority of book fans favourite character ;)
Looks like his character is about to get a whole lot better after episode 8
Mat’s luck will change soon!
That tea definitely had some of the milk from Barthanes' special cow in it
I’m really loving most of this show. But cmon what is with tv and movie writers knocking ppl out all the time by getting slammed against a wall. 😂 it’s not the worst thing ever but it’s pretty lame.
I... 100% agree with this! Next we'll see Mat or Perrin stealing a Seanchan's armour to sneak into the palace
Barthanes makes the best sandwiches! 😂
Dude really decided to join the Dark One just to keep a magic cow alive for its butter
Mat’s “luck” will change in the next episode!!!
🤣 very well said
thank god some one that says ai-dom like they do in the audio books
Oh god, how else is it pronounced 😳😅
You 2 look like Mat and Elayne!
That's our next con cosplay sorted!
Not gonna lie... the villainous ladies this season are a smoke show.
No smoke without fire 🤣
Rand am I even on the show
Pretty sure I saw him in the Amerlyn throne room somewhere 🤔
@@ElliotEdits no they don't mention him
Obligatory comment
Obligatory thanks
28 years Wheel Of Time reader here. Having watched several non-book reader reviews I've picked up there's "meh" to outright hostility towards Mat. That's quite shocking for a character who is arguably top of the Wheel Of Time popularity charts and for good reason. Granted he doesn't go supernova in the shining stakes until books 4 and 5, but I'm not sure TV Matt will be able to recover from very bad first impressions.
The last thing I am is a bookcloak but it does seem the tables have turned on CIS men both in the world of the TV show and the writer's room. Shocking. These are two top quality episodes but Mat's portrayal is being a dampener for me. Robert Jordan's Wheel Of Time originally written with an audience of teenage boys and post-teen men as its audience, it's been reimagined for post-teen women instead. Fascinating.
I think Mat's character will recover too. I think Dónal Finn is shows signs of being able to play a more playful Mat.
Personally I always thought of the girls as far more effectual than the boys, especially towards the beginning. Rahvin would have had Rand without Nynaeve.
@@ElliotEdits I certainly agree that Nynaeve is badass, but for example Mat's moment on the Tower grounds didn't happen in the TV show. Instead Nynaeve got to have a bit of that strong moment he didn't have. And another strong moment of "seeing" the future which should have been fun and showed him as clever instead made him come across as a drug-talking idiot. 😞 I did find the bit where he held himself and scream funny though. 🤷♀
Rafe sits at the darkfiend table. An Amazon showrunner whispers into his ear, "Do we stay to the source material?" Rafe responds then laughs madly, "No, give them the Jake Skywalker Wheel of Time until until they break from despair and embrace the dark."
spoilers, Tower trains them to tie off weaves, aka wards. Tower trains them on shields, so Moraine would know if she were stilled vs shielded. But you know, Rafe could care less.
Show us training happening to Rand so it builds up to him fighting the other blademaster? No, remember Rafe must give them Jake Al'Thor not Rand Al'Thor.
Show an accurate meeting with Rand and Siuan ala Fal Dara? No, have him put down like the weakling he is and have him cry out to Lanfear for help too.
Flicker flicker flicker...NO. Red doorway, No. An An'greal? No. Give them Jake Cauthon sipping tea.
The dragon can be a women? No, now according to Verrin as she uses the male pronoun, the dragon was always a male, so much for the s1 mystery box for the NPCs. Another fail to the consistency of tv hate letter cannon.
Moraine aka the Gandalf of the series now teams up with Sauron's underling who she just murdered 2 eps before. Make it make sense.
I did enjoy reading this comment. I can't deny you make some good points. Though I think Rafe's motivations are less Darkfriend related, and more to do with making a show that will make it to the end.
The tea thing is worrying me though 😅
@@ElliotEditsagreed. The problem with adapting a book series with like 1400 named characters and almost as many storylines, when in the books it all took place over something like 3 years (14 books!. The series is going to take at least 10 years to make 8 seasons, so we HAVE to make changes there, and since different characters and storylines speak to so many different people in different ways, no matter who is adapting it no one is going to fully agree. It’s hard. That said I did enjoy this comment and do agree with some points. It feels like they nerf all the male characters or make them flawed in more ways than their counterparts while buffing the women in huge ways. But, and this may just be me, I kinda think the books were pretty progressive to begin with in more effective and nuanced ways and didn’t quite need the buffing/nerfing. I kinda hate watched season 1, but overall season 2 is a step up and I’m excited for what’s to come. Sorry super long comment.
@@rawrbeez6625 14 books was enough source material. We did not need entire multi ep plot lines on non book characters like Stephan or the Lan/Alanna plot line in s2 which does not happen in books. And some of the changes weakened characters.
Lan is the one who kills the Myrddraal and not the shielded Moraine. Lan also trains Rand. Show is better than tell right? Rafe just tells us that Logain or something trains Rand so the final fight with the blademaster is going to make Rand look like a Mary Sue.
The White Tower trained people on tieing off weaves and on shielding so Moraine would have known she was not stilled. I think this is either in the positive, that the showrunners are not very much into the books like a super fan would be or possible worst they want to tell their own story and not Jordans.
In Books, it was super hard to shield Rand. No single living non forsaken channeler could do it. Yet here its done casually by Suian. In books when she met Rand, she was loosely controlling fear of him as he is Tav'ern and blazed like the sun to her. Here it is contempt. Just hate letter to source changes. And Moraine again, kills Lanfear (who is sleeping with Rand who in books never once does) and to team up with her, ugh. That is not an in character move on her part.
@@jonahdav9589 yeah you’re bringing up every specific points without actually addressing the crux of the issue. Let’s make this easier: what characters and storylines would you cut, mix or remix to fill only 8 hours of screen time? No matter what you choose, I posit that you would be correct (no right answer) and STILL roughly 80% of book readers would HATE the choices you made.
@@rawrbeez6625 I'd cut Rafe and the showrunners, reboot the series with the book 1 prologue that made the entire thing work. A younger Lord of the Rings cast in the innocent Two Rivers Aka Shire and stay true to the source material. I'd use crowdfunding and have actual book fans help pick the cast and scenes instead of this hate letter to source material Rafe has sloppily written.
Loved Episode 6 as it related to Egwene’s travails as Damane.
That’s how you do adaptations!
Pity the rest of it was… I have many words I want to use, but I’ll stick with just two.
Not Good.
And again, although nonsensical in isolation, the most powerfully realised moment in Episode 7 is Egwene’s confrontation with Renna.
Never mind the unintentional comedy of Renna walking out in a huff after being threatened with Death, when even by the TV Show Only Standards (and I use the word standards loosely) there is no way but through imbecilic scripting convenience where a sul’dam would leave such a threat unpunished.
But, the line is delivered so powerfully, I still got chills in the moment… never mind my guffaws when Renna just walked out of the cell.
Unfortunately Rand has been rendered irredeemable by some terrible scripting. Never mind the ludicrously self satisfied subversion of what Logain said to him about his Power in Episode 6, fancy having your nominal ‘Hero’ suborning genocide for the sake of nothing more than his own escape.
I’ve seen heaps of encouragement to watch this show with as lazy a critical eye as possible polluting the ether, but Episode 7 was the camel that ate the straw, when it comes to blowing up all pretence of continuity or intelligent storytelling. I mean, when they can’t even consolidate some of their own best work for more than a few Episodes and are reduced to ludicrous inconsistencies on the Age of the Main Characters for this Episode, the mechanics of the main magic system, or even the plotting within the Episode itself (Verin & Alana were a great help in keeping anyone from getting to the Waygate, following Rand & Moiraine weren’t they?)
This TV Show was never a worthwhile adaptation, but throughout Season 2 it had become watchable Television in its own right.
Episode 7 destroyed that, utterly.
Not even the prospect of the grave being no bar to its call can genuinely excite for the upcoming finale, given viewers are being asked to root for a Moral Pygmy, content at being an accessory to the murder of thousands of innocents without even having assumed any World Spanning responsibility yet, never mind just how heinous his exchange is, merely on the face of it.
Mat & Perrin are just wasted factotums, in the service of terrible storytelling and whatever heroics they conjure next week will require a suspension bridge of disbelief, so as to span the Aryth Ocean back to Seandar. And perhaps that is where this show’s ambitions lie… trying to make their viewers goldfish, in order for them to derive any tangible satisfaction from a hopefully spectacular Series Finale.
The one redeeming possibility remains Egwene and the likelihood Nynaeve & Elayne will attempt to save her. Maybe Min will put her wine bottle down long enough to contribute a Viewing that doesn’t stink of red herring. How will she get to Falme to contribute? Stupidity will find a way, I’m sure.
Look up Charles Barkley saying ‘Terrrrrible’ on UA-cam and not even he can encompass how actually terrible Episode 7 of this TV Show was, and as a result how awful if made most of the rest of Season 2 look in retrospect.
I must admit, I feel like Mat and Perin have been afterthoughts this season.
Also, researching episode 6 for footage did make me realise how little impact everything else had compared to Egwene and Renna. I mean a sandwich!!!!
A few cracks have begun to show towards the end of season 2, but I'm hoping the finale will build a solid foundation for series 3.
@gearomkologenas5458 "suspension bridge of disbelief, so as to span the Aryth Ocean back to Seandar." ....a barrel of two rivers Tabac should be delivered to your house for that line to sum up this series.
on Rafe and the showruners, each ep I want to hear, "I have won against Lewis Therin" for this nightmare to end.
"till shade is gone, till water is gone, into the shadow with teeth bared, screaming defiance on the last day, to spit in their eyes at the last moment' !
Clearly this show their will be 4 to 7 Woman that will have much greater importance in the story, Robert Jordan is from the 60s and 70s but had a great relationship with woman,
They want to show how the Woman of this world are critical in power roles 😂❤❤❤😮😮
What I'm hearing is more screen time for Nynaeve 🤣
(I totally agree)
Poor Matt, Matt has nothing to do yet changing actors, the show runners are trying to gage what the audience wants and what they can do to make the show their own R Judkins wants to be ooo so famous!!!!❤❤❤😂😂
I do think the show should focus less on making Mat a tortured soul and fast forward to the fun, lucky, glory-avoiding Mat we all want to see! And importantly, one that doesn't leave his friend crying
well post mortem when this is canceled next year. The actual fans of the books wanted the Peter Jackson treatment not the Jake Skywalker sucking sea cow tits throwing away the lightsaber to die of a headache.
Absolutely right but they do want to take us on a roller coaster, ride, get us hooked!!🤩@@ElliotEdits
@@paulkalaj3500 I think Caitlin and I are hooked!
Robert Jordan was in the military and really understood power and the human condition, Their going to allow the actors to compete with eachother on performance should get even better. 4 sure .