The Future of Energy Storage - Professor Yet-Ming Chiang, MIT
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- Опубліковано 10 жов 2019
- What have been the key battery technology breakthroughs to get us to where we are now? What are some new opportunities for large-scale energy storage & what's MIT doing? What are some key lessons for startups to be successful in the battery industry?
Energy storage will play an increasingly important role in a decarbonized world. From electric vehicles to grid resiliency, batteries will impact the ultimate success of numerous industries that are critical to a low carbon society. Professor Yet-Ming Chiang, one of the world’s most prominent researchers in energy storage, will give a personal perspective on some of the challenges and opportunities for better and cheaper energy storage.
From a historical perspective, battery performance has improved steadily, but now the divergent needs for batteries in high energy density applications such as EVs (and, coming soon, electric aviation), and those for grid storage, which emphasizes ultra-low cost and earth-abundant materials, are becoming clear. He will give examples of emerging innovations that may address these different needs, including solid-state and other batteries that use alkali metal electrodes, and approaches that make use of the most widely available electroactive elements. The expectation is that the audience will come away with a realistic but exciting roadmap of possible areas of innovation for energy storage.
Finally, he will conclude with his personal experiences in building battery enterprises. Battery technologies are notoriously difficult to scale given high technology risk and high development costs. Yet-Ming will share some of the unique lessons learned at startups he has co-founded, including A123, 24M, and most recently Form Energy.
Prof. Chiang's research focuses on the design, synthesis, and characterization of advanced inorganic materials and related devices. Current topics include new cathode and anode materials for lithium ion batteries, phase transformations in electroactive materials, electrochemical device design, electrochemical-to-mechanical energy conversion, self-assembling colloids, and the stability and defect chemical properties of interfaces in inorganic materials. - Наука та технологія
We shud pump lithium and sulpher through a pipeline and charge it as it goes along. As far as pushing lithium into a ceramic, just ad the lithium while the ceramic is being formed. It would probably be simpler to shrink everything by 15% so we don't need so much energy. That would reduce the grocery bill and the energy use. Just a little more levity.
Did I miss the mention of that other MIT technology, Liquid Metal batteries?
Very impressive talk. Thks
Wonderful -- I am particularly interested in the storage solutions for evening out grid supply -vs demand.
The mention of cold fusion throws all his credibility into doubt.
Starts at 10:15
Cold fusion: the profesor said that one of the problem is to keep the hydrogen in pappadion. Could it improve the situation if strong megnetic fill will be on poth sids of pappadium as hydrogen is diamagnetic and will be repell from magnetic fill source keeping h2 molecyls in .
This is a human rights and survival issue for us all.
Dr. Chiang has excellent presentation with a wide spectrum of energy storage programs. Great insights!
When is Your next lecture?
I am interested in MIT's collaboration with the SAFIRE project. That is the future of energy production, going to need that next gen storage to compliment it~
Sorry to disappoint, but the SAFIRE project is pseudoscience. The only person that knew any plasma physics on the program left, and published a paper on it. If you're excited about real fusion, I'd look at Dennis Whyte, and tokamak energy. They have a real path to fusion power production. Or, look at NASA's lattice confinement fusion.
The speaker explains that a goal is to reduce the carbon dioxide. What isn't said is the price your competing with does not include the real cost of carbon dioxide's impact on climate change . The truth is we cannot afford the fossil fuels at any price. As this becomes more apparrent people who own or control the fossil fuel reserves will chase the price down so that their asset doesn't become stranded. It is this recognition that is required . It should be a competition between sustainable options. Great lecture by the way.
YOU ARE RIGHT!
40:27 energy storage
Thanks
Late 80s I was giving a lecture to the physics class (as part of my final year) on human powered flight. I tried the "get off the ground" joke and it crashed and burned then too! 🙂
1:24:22 That guy is the reason MIT and Harvard are BROKEN research institutions. He said "we didn't publish because we were disappointed by the result." That's the exact reason to publish. They wouldn't have done the experiment had there been a published experiment showing that it doesn't work ( and more importantly, how it didn't work, and with what methods).
You people are holding us back with this prestige bargaining. Only the people that get attractive results get paid... That's cherry picking data.
it is too much of a fight to be considered cutting edge unless you ARE those institutions. you can fight at small ones, but ultimately for grad school and phd they are paid like corporations and basically are the gatekeepers to professional employment at the top level. the problem is EVERYONE wants to use the latest tech, but no one has it because methods are original. these people are just lazy, thats it. they dont want to search through papers with useless information that could essentially be reddit stickied. and they dont want to fight the public. they already have the state to milk for money, and quite directly the taxpayers. the joke is always "i dont know the future, do you?". they just capitalize and take legal action in nasty ways such as the DMCA ya know? even media companies are capitalizing on.
You're talking about the cold fusion experiment, right? I think your timestamp is off and should be ua-cam.com/video/E76q-9q7ZDg/v-deo.html
I think the guy from the audience is talking about the experiments by Fleischmann, it fits the 31 years ago. His research wasn't published, he released it to the public like non-scientific news. This ultimately ended his scientific career. It's so difficult to publish about cold fusion because currently you can't prove it occurs. Good luck publishing a scientific experiment where you test something not predicted by science and fail to demonstrate it - that's like trying to start a combustion engine without fuel and concluding it didn't start.
I assume that if Google wanted to commercialize cold fusion they would do so in house and in secret. They would only publish results for PR and/or patent applications. So what's their motivation?
> As a favor? Bit far fetched but it wouldn't surprise me they would do a deal with MIT/DOE/whoever to fund this in order to do this research without the reputation risk of doing it yourself.
You discover definitive proof cold fusion can't exist. Google says you shouldn't publish your results, the study is ongoing and you should focus on something else. You try to convince them to start the publication and peer review process but they simply say no. Now what? There is no correct answer here: Google acts like a business and pursuit their initial goal, if you try to publish on your own your career is over and if you try to spread the word you can't be credited. There is a valid narrative to do nothing: at this point it's just a theory and the only things to gain is credit and/or save other people some time to spend on other problems, there's no legal way forward and your participation in the project might be beneficial in the end opposed to going rogue.
What I try to demonstrate here is the decision to publish or not is not straightforward. I'm not entirely sure what your position is (what do you mean by broken research institutes? What is prestige bargaining? What's wrong with investors targeting successful scientists?) but I feel like you're politically motivated - either because you dislike capitalism or you're a cold fusion believer. What''s your motivation?
I like That.
What is so funny is that everyone wants to play follow the leader in the same old b.s. that is THOUGHT. I used to hate it when I heard RETARDED PEOPLE saying THINK OUTSIDE of the box. ARE we all squared 2in
1:24:22. I like that bable version. What chapter was that again?
Any thoughts on lithium air?
James Tour says it has the potential to become the battery of the future.
This talk only mentions this in the first five minutes, and is more directed at the origins of life.
Organic chemistry is his field of expertise but I first heard of lithium air about five years ago.
Just asking?
Large scale application in cars/airplanes is still many years away. My guess would be 25 years before a mass produced car enters the market powered by Li-air. I think at that time Li-air will be only a gradual improvement, not disruptive. Kind of like OLED: nice, but not that significant. And that's if it happens at all.
@@gabepruijt9620 have you heard of the fluxliner.
As drawn by Mark Mccandlish?
This doco was done by
James Allen who was bumped of not long after putting it together.
Space craft ( interesting word)
According to this doco may go back thousands of years, but these seem to have been around pre ww2.
ua-cam.com/video/A02hFfRqigM/v-deo.html
ZP energy craft ufo anti gravity doco
James Allen
Coal Fusion? Isn't that something used in rings and necklaces? Good bass a status symbol, bonkers for energy production.
Great talk!
IMO Metal Ion based designs that attempt to achieve the energy spectrum of organic oxidation are putting a giant cart before a pony, so to speak.
A better way to design is from the ground up, which a number of groups are doing.
Tesla is not one of them...
There was no mention of capacitors as storage method?
Super fast. Negligible energy storage.
Battery tech is a really exciting topic to keep track of. Will be seeing massive progress there sooner than we think
In what chemistry? What scale of economy? Not in never Nederland I hope.
Can you say print basced CoSi?
When you get your shit together, and forget single phase conversion, and losses, maybe you will pull your head out of your woodstove 'ass'. And get real.
Wang bleeds Beaver. In other words he is a feminatzi stuffed colostomy bag.
43 years + following in otherspeoples footsteps, and still no breakthrough in relevant knowledge that he can share with the world.
We have more than enough elements which to work with. The problem is that no one has developed supper critical environmental conditions in which they can achieve anything like the fossilized materials discovered.
I say fucktards.
H2O 2 HHO 2 H2O.. Isothermal. Can be achieved with doped chemicals and sunlight.
Quit blowing smoke up everyone's ass.
How much you getting paid?
On the palladium thing, what about in a bath of ammonia?
Elaborate your thoughts.
It's a bit dampening my enthusiasm to see that even governments in Europe jump on hydrogen for energy storage as if there is nothing else. But if I need to give then an alternative for really large scale, I see that besides hydropower, there is nothing yet fully commercially available. However I read that with connected European grids and wind power even by night, there is no need for storing huge amounts of energy (??)
Have you all seen the movie “The Saint” with Elisabeth Shue and Val Kilmer.
I love that movie
@@rorythomson3439 pppppppppppppp
this channel is giving me hope for the mankind :)
Lab tested satisfactory.., then possibly 20 years ramping up bulk production at current rates of development, so the implication is that accelerating testing is first priority. So it's back to the Quantum Computational Hybridisation studies and development, almost the same Research as Quantum Chemistry, Feynman style? (Lots to do..)
So you take limestone and produce liquid fuels with the captured CO2. These will then emit the CO2 when burned... Am I missing something or is that not solving the problem?
Don't think you're missing anything. If you could make synthetic hydrocarbons at a competitive price you wouldn't bother with hydrogen. Cryo liquids are a nuisance, but especially hydrogen and helium. Live without them if you can.
@@sealpiercing8476 you're still adding more co2 to the environment. Carbon from limestone was trapped in calcium ages ago. It's another "fossil" fuel.
@@goncaloaguiar You're correct, I got it confused with CO2 gathered from combustion.
EXACTLY AND CO2 REMAINS THERE FOR 1000 YEARS!
@@sfmc3000 Realistically if you have the energy source (nuclear or maaaaybe solar) to actually synthesize hydrocarbon fuels at competitive price, that's the heavy lift, so removing it from the air at large scale would become realistic
Interesting talk.
I'm a little uneasy about bleeding beaver...
Please consider Hemp Bast hemicellulose graphene
Might be the world's Greenest answer has a Clear one Up on lithium
This is NOTHING but genocide. 193 thousand people died after taking the injection. And to top it off the government gives total amenity to the drug companies. Dane wigington said why would you have To store a vaccine at a cryogenic temperature. And he also said that someone stole one of the viles...put it under a microscop and THERE was life. Germ.....
RICIN MOTHERFUCKER get it right.
Why don't you refuel the liquid sulphur like a gasoline ?
Nothing about Liquid Metal batteries?! Sadoway with his company Ambri are also from MIT! Why isn't it even on his charts?
I thought he mentionned Liquid Metal Batteries and using rare earth materials which I thought was what Ambri does; so maybe he didn't want to be repetitive.
Dear sir greetings,
Story of India.
India is having 78000 petrol pumps outlets and are selling petrol and diesel and gas and each petrol pump has a 20000 litres of liquid per bunk and this is having 60 MW energy.
So India requirement is 5000000 MW of energy.
Please understand this ground realities.
230 million vehicles on Indian roads
1 million is 1000000
230000000 vehicles
If each vehicle gets minimum 5 kWh or 5 units charge then per hour India needs
23 00 00 000 vehicles X 5 kWh or units
1150000000 kWh or units per hour
1150000000 kWh or units per hour if each unit is sold for 10 rupees
11500000000 rupees revenue generated
100740000000000 rupees per year
This is the revenue generated per year
Sir these are genuine figures
On ground reality
If we convert this to hydrogen then please think about the ground realities
Please understand the importance and value of the flywheel technology and invention
I am the only person to work on Flywheel power generation technology and Flywheel power storage technologies
I am the only person to work on power Multipliction technologies
I am using hydraulic applications pneumatic applications batteries operated motors in-pipe cascading power generation technology etc for power storage and power generation and power Multipliction
I have sent to mukesh ji , like this I have sent to all important people in India
I am doing my marketing and advertising and branding
I am open to all people of the world
World First fuelless power generation technology developed by Indian scientist couple.
Absolutely free energy technologies
www.kammagearflywheelpowergeneration.com
Just 4 batteries and running a submersible pump, a welding machine or a lath machine or a industrial heater etc mechanical load and electrical load like halogen bulbs
ua-cam.com/video/Cut8Pv2nWBc/v-deo.html
ua-cam.com/video/e6pI0fevA-M/v-deo.html
ua-cam.com/video/cd-QWZBNLuo/v-deo.html
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ua-cam.com/video/rPRJofvOYoQ/v-deo.html
Federal government of India has accepted this technology and invention and incorporated Flywheel , compressed air and pump storage
Thanks
Dr Srinivas Bhasker chaganti
Chaganti Bala
8555045244
It is a Very good idea.I agree 100%
Compressed air has been a favorite of mine because of its versatility, I even thought way to make a small mechanical generator with a Gravity generated with a pneumatic piston reset...
A very low Tech Base in principle, but it may be a cheap fix until new Technologies can be implemented...
Also I'd like to see a comeback for Crystal Technology for small devices eliminating the need for batteries and the precious resources needed to make them...
Highview Power in the UK are one of the market leaders here. They look like they're a good outfit. Started building a 50MW storage plant last month following on from their 8MW demo plant.
Really limited scope with battery types and elements . Maybe competition for best battery ideas to collect more options. Rather than one myoptic scope .
Yes, as far as overview lectures go this one was not broad enough
How many windmills equals a fusion reactor?
I know one reactor meltdown is + to millions of worn out buried windmills! Fission is fine were they LFTR.
Approximately 2000
#Hemp
worked for A123systems. Where can I get the ppt ????
Lol
Well, 1 QUESTION. ARE YOU a PHYSICS TEACHER ?
I Am afraid to look at classified documents. I have My Calculations. It's funny. Someone that I met said. Why not get a patient on it. ARE YOU out of your FUCKING mind. Sorry. IT doesn't work THAT away. Oh , THAT WOULD NEVER HAPPEN.!!!.
Email ME
THE 1 THING THAT I DON'T UNDERSTAND. HOW IS IT THAT NO1 STUDIES PHYSICS. HOW THINGS WORK, HOW TO ADVANCE KNOLAGE. I MEAN. WHAT IS IT THAT IS BEING TOUT THESE DAYS. . I THOUGHT WE WERE SUPPOSED TO ADVANCE THE RACE! NOT KILL IT. THAT BRINGS ME TO SOMETHING ELSE. MAYBE WE ARE NOT SPOUSE TO FIGURE IT OUT. MAYBE WE SHOULD BE IN CHAOS. HOW IN THE FUCK DO YOU THINK THAT WE GOT HERE? MILLION DOLLAR QUESTION. SO WHAT! HOW WE CHOSE TO USE THIS INFORMATION IS UP TO USE. YOU.... WHY IS IT THAT WE OR US NEED TO DESTROY? ADVANCEMENT IS THE KEY. HOW DO YOU THINK THAT WE ADVANCE THIS FAR. IT'S NOT YOU AGAINST ME! AND REVERSE. I KNOW QUANTUM PHYSICS. I KNOW N-PHYSICS. HOW CAN WE HELP THIS PLANET.. WHO CARES WHO RULES THE WORLD. TEACH THE UP AND COMING MATHEMATICS AND PHYSICS. THEN WE WILL SEE A BETTER WORLD. THAT IS ALL THAT MATTERS. HOW DO YOU DO YOU THINK THAT THEY GOT HERE? BY DUMBING THE PEOPLE DOWN OR TO WORK TOGETHER. WOW. NO KIDDING.
Solar and batteries can RE-charge daily and provide extended power for the grid and disaster back-up at reduced power levels.
Tell that to Texas. Real world. People DIED!
THE GOVERNMENT IS HIDING SHIT FROM US. AND IT'S BEEN GOING ON FOR 150 YEARS.
THEY'RE ENERVY INDEPENDENT.
PISS- OFF PEON THEY SAY.
that's better than me
Solution! Midamerican Energy uses ground storage for Peaking NG turbines pumped by wind turbines over alot of NW Iowa. So much so that Iowa is nearly 90% wind power and recently replaced Iowas only Nuke. My workplace as materials auditor. ETR3, AS, EE, IGNuclear.
Has MIT heard of the danger of inbreeding?
What do u think about HYSR, Sun hydrogen? They are making H by photosynthesis, sun and water to make H, with zero operating cost
YOU DON'T HAVE A COMPUTER WITHIN YOUR VEHICLE THAT READS ALL FUNCTIONS.AM I RIGHT? WELL LET'S SEE HERE. SPOUSE I HAVE A CAR THAT RUNS ON HYDROGEN AND A GAS CARD, WHETHER IT BE EXXON MOBIL, GULF , ECT. NOW. I PULL UP TO THE PUMP TO FILL MY TANK. I CAN GUARANTEE YOU THAT THE COMPUTER COULD READ WHAT TYPE OF HYDROGEN IS GOING INTO THE VEHICLE. IF ANYONE WERE TO CREATE TTERE OWN HYDROGEN THE VEHICLE WOULD AOUTOMATICLY SHUT DOWN. AND ANYONE TRYING TO CREATE their HYDROGEN SO WOULD BE PROSECUTED. HERE IS A PLUS TAX FOR YOU. THE BYPRODUCT OF OF THE HYDROGEN WOULD BOND WITH THE CARBON WITHIN OUR ATMOSPHERE CREATING A FALL OUT OF SORTS. THE MONEY WOULD NEVER STOP ROLLING IN FOR THE GAS COMPANIES. EVERYONE WINS. FUNNY. YOU CAN squeeze 2 Neurons into a HYDROGEN ATOM and YOU CAN'T come up with a SOLUTION to GAS propelled automobiles. Right. As I said. No 1 including the GAS COMPANIES is at a loss!
Really simple situation to store enough energy for everything east of the Mississippi and half of Canada. Use Lake Erie and Lake Ontario for pumped hydro storage. Just 6 inches of water is one trillion gallons with a height difference of 300 feet.
A welcomed innovation applauds! What's the affordability and the accessibility to the ordinary person?
Shssshh peasant.
YOU mentioned ORDINARY PESANT. DID I SPELL THAT RIGHT
No mention of the Liquid Metal Battery by the MIT spinoff Ambri.
Professor Sadoway mentioned one time that the Lithium ion tribe has a somewhat antagonistic relationship with the molten salt tribe. I really hope it's nothing that petty.
they can't accept they were wrong, so won't talk about lmb by ambri. science is also corrupted by politics.
Why don't you boil it down to make it thicker and stronger by using nitrogen to solve your ability to make the hydrogen stay in it longer and stronger?
Renewable energy, industrial scale capacitors, cutting edge battery technology, and an infrastructure switch to hydrogen fuel. All of this is mostly already possible.
BULLCRAP $$$$$$$ sure you can dope up us mostly DOPES but try such idiotic logic on CHINA#1 building 2021 17 Reactors!
It's technically feasible, but it isn't cost-effective (yet.)
That's why we're still burning oil.
@ Devil's: That's why the establishment (big FF) promotes this and supresses molten salt nuclear.
The audio is terrible in this video.
GM recently announced probable battery halving of battery cost in 3 years! Also practically the grid has actually become its own storage with the increase of service area!
Sympathetic capacitance. Flash in the pan.
Molten salt nuclear. Safest. Cheapest. Scalable. Load following. Burns nuc waste. Etc.,...
(and use to manufacture HC's from CO2 and water, for military, jets and IC autos)
i am surprised why he did not talk about clean hydrogen/ Fuel Cells as part of a fuel in Aviation
this is not a talk about aviation, this is about energy storage for grid/electricty production.
Wouldn't be nice to have a computer that YOU could feed logical information INTO and GET a result. Now that is what I would call AI.
E-Fuel makes batteries obsolete. E-Fuel is a much simpler, easier and far more efficient way to store electrical energy.
I believe E-fuels will outcompete Batteries for part of the energy storage applications. "Battery electric propulsion can generally be considered
the preferred solution for short-distance and light vehicles because of their significantly higher energy efficiency", but "Batteries are
not suitable for modes of transport that require high amounts of energy to be stored onboard" as cited from the whitepaper: www.tno.nl/en/about-tno/news/2020/9/e-fuels-crucial-to-sustainable-heavy-transport/
@@132sander132 You have no idea of what E-Fuel is! What an idiotic statement.
@@rodkeh Now why'd you have to insult the man, you could've just disagreed like a normal person without being a twat
I don’t know if its right for me to say because of those laws. Or remain out of context . And look a Fake to everyone because of lack of knowledge, ability or skills.
Please Explain?
45:30 “The cost of lithium ion isn’t likely to get below 100 dollars a kWh”
Lol, less than a year later and Tesla is projecting production of a li-ion battery at close to 50 dollars a kWh. Maybe the good doctor isn’t very up to date on this science.
Maybe he meant pack level whereas Tesla pricing for the 4680 is for cell level, with no more pack nor modules. However, for stationary storage you need a cabinet, inverter, etc.
@@SraMYM The doctor wasn’t even talking about vehicles in particular. It was just general use storage, so even if Musk was talking about only battery costs (which it isn’t clear that he was) it is at least an apples to apples comparison.
"The long-term goal would be to try to get to a cost per kilowatt-hour of around 50 cents or 55 cents" - Elon Musk, 2020.
.
cleantechnica.com/2020/11/24/elon-musk-shares-battery-vehicle-updates-at-european-conference-1000-kilometer-range-vehicle-under-development/
Note he said "LONG TERM GOAL" not "WE HAVE TODAY"
(and yes he said cents but meant dollars)
@@nmarbletoe8210 The MIT professor implied it would never get below 100 dollars an hour due to necessary material and manufacturing cost. He was suggesting a different technology would be required to achieve significant cost reductions and was comparing the potential of alternatives.
Musk’s cost prediction have been one of his most accurate predictions, and he says they have a roadmap to achieve those cost savings with technology they already possess, only scale and manufacturing efficiency are necessary to produce at that cost.
@@NoNo-pz4lm That's true, you did say "projecting"!
.
Interesting debate in the battery and storage field here, one we all win in the long run!
A plane can't use batteries cuz it's too heavy. It needs to land too, and needs to dump the batteries like it dumps fuel not to break the landing gear.
Imagine how much faster the world could develop solid state batteries if it wasn't for intellectual property rights, patents and limitless capitalist greed in general...
Let's put solar panels on every home, business and covered parking rooftop and switch to electric vehicles making nearly everything we do solar powered while completely decentralizing our power supply and empowering everyone as power generation owners.
Solar power is CHEAPER and electric vehicles are soon to be CHEAPER to make and already are considerably CHEAPER to maintain and operate, especially if charged from your own solar power.
A 3-5 year ROI (return on investment) for a solar array that will generate power for decades is a no-brainer and the panels can even be made locally too.
#EndFossilFuels #SwitchToSolar #SwitchToElectric #GreenNewDeal
Go open source! You won't get anything but,'Let me pat myself on the back BULLSHIT from MIT album's, and their representations.
Get the white papers.
just put a wind turbine in a shape of a plane engine to recharge the batteries ,,, a dynamo ,
1:33:11 Home boy needs to brush up on his political science and remember that fresh water is much more valuable than fresh air; because it can be controlled with a pumped storage system.
apart from the difficult to hear sound quality, I am hearing enough uh uh uh uh uh uh uh uh uh uh
Oof this didn't age well
my socks?
Yes it did ?
Ease up on your use of "so" - not every sentence or thought needs to begin with it - gets annoying . With regard to the video's subject, battery efficiencies are critical, but equally important are design efficiencies - specifically motor torque/ chassis weight ratios in the automotive industries. More R&D needs done urgently in these areas - vehicle weights are way too high - SUV's don't need to be 3 tons. Lower weight = better motor/ battery performance - the two are directly linked.
real crap...
next time can you speak fluently. by not having many sudden stop.
15 minutes in, and I have heard ENOUGH of the same old,let me pat myself on the back BULLSHIT!
I have better things 2 do.
Uninspired by MIT.
Are you telling us that everybody on the Internet doesn't need to know where their bathrooms are?
The nerve! How can you imagine such a thing?
Actually, at 10:09 they accomplish a major Internet breakthrough: the guy (whew, at last!) says "OK. on to the main topic."
Big deal? Yes: he does NOT say "Without any further ado." This is a major internet breakthrough, comparable to the introduction of TCP/IP which replaced the !!!.!!.
(Yes, there is still some further ado, but he gets around to mentioning batteries at 12:43.)
Please learn to speak properly and stop ending every sentence with "OK"?
That sentence is grammatically incorrect in two ways.