The tool I showed at the end of the video is called Migaku! So far it's been super useful for me to learn Japanese as I can easily find single N+1 sentences in the anime that I watch and instantly batch create Anki cards only with things I can actually learn from! The guys also reached out to me and have a special offer for you if you USE THIS LINK: migaku.io/free-month/Juls. You'll get a free 14-day trial and if you like it, you can pay and get the second month FOR FREE!
Hey man, love your videos. I myself am studying in Japan and unfortunately went with ISI, the largest language school here, which is an "immersion style school" - so they will not talk to us in English, even if we dont understand something. So your videos really help to fill the gaps with understanding what they are trying to teach us. One suggestion I have - Could you maybe make a playlist for your Japanese study videos in order - because im just jumping around trying to find certain things but it would really help to just watch them easily in the correct order for the upcoming final tests;) Not just for me but also your other viewers :)
In order to immerse yourself in a language, you need to understand the language. I feel like this concept is completely lost on everybody. Edit: cheers for the heart man.
I think the best damnation of the "immersion only" method was that if (incomprehensible) immersion is such an effective method of learning a language, weebs who have spent decades watching thousands of hours of anime with Japanese audio tracks would be fluent in the language. Instead, they are lucky to know 5 words. (and usually use them incorrectly.) I'm 40, always wanted to learn Japanese, and am finally taking the time to do it. I'm halfway through Genki book 1, so I have a long road ahead to get more content to be comprehensible, but the fact that I can actually read and know a handful of kanji is miles ahead of where I've been all my life. Y'know... knowing 5 words, and only being able to pick Japanese writing out of a lineup compared to Chinese and Korean.
Kinda. The thing with weebs is that the input is NOT technically incomprehensible to them since they use native language subtitles. My friend who has been watching anime for more than 10 years but has never sat down to actually learn Japanese can still barely communicate with Japanese people using broken Japanese. He's joined my gaming sessions with my JP friends and can convey what he wants (granted most of the time broken and taking a long time). . It's lucky you're only halfway through the Genki book since Genki does a lot more harm to your Japanese than it actually helps! Most of the time learners who use textbooks get stuck with questions that don't actually exist like "what is は vs が". If you ever find yourself asking this question, it's a sign that you've been mislead by Genki and should immediately stop and change your approach before you take even more damage. . For reference, I recommend an approach based on getting comprehensible input on a daily basis. Specifically an approach that can teach you words that are most commonly used in the language (as opposed to an arbitrarily created JLPT list). This approach can be found in Anki: ua-cam.com/video/DcY2Svs3h8M/v-deo.html . Furthermore, to see exactly how much damage Genki has done to you, I recommend watching either my video on は vs が, or look up any of my teach, "Cure Dolly"'s videos. ua-cam.com/video/TMi0ehYC7fE/v-deo.html
@@JouzuJuls Genki is not the only resource I'm using, of course. I've been bouncing between japanese learning games and apps, Kanji Study being a favorite, and I do know that there's plenty of warning against Genki out there... but also when it comes to learning Japanese from textbooks, Genki is just about the best one you can get. I've already come across some weird genki-isms, yes. 😅 verbs make so much more sense learning about the godan and ichidan types and the differences, and the rules, rather than "Aight kids, y'all got them thar U verbs and them RU verbs. Also this one ends in RU but it's U. Just memorize it. Also, them thar verbs don't fit in either, we just call them irregular. Memorize it all!"
NGL with the quality of these videos I thought jouzu was such a bigger UA-camr these past few weeks of watching his videos. Why is he not as popular or more popular than these vtubers! I've gained so much valued information from this guy than I have ever from any other youtuber!! And he puts it in a fun way D: what is going on! I'm pointing anyone wanting to learn Japanese here!
Whaching a thing with subtitle absolutely does work. It's been a point of pride for me how I acquired english without putting effort, just by watching movies. But learning japanese made me appreciate how much I actually got out of my school education with english. You absorb next to nothing until you get some basics, because you don't know what anything is, so you're brain just ignores the whole thing as noise, as oppose to mapping and reinforcing
Oh my God! I could not like this video more!! I'm so upset that I wasted the past couple years listening to a bunch of incomprehensible input and wondered why I wasn't getting much better. I completely agree with you!
Glad to hear that I was able to voice your experience for the past couple years! I know it must be frustrating to realize that you could've saved a lot of time and I can relate to that too (I also butchered my Anki for like 1.5 years ua-cam.com/video/t3g6X1RMUyg/v-deo.html) . But hey! There's no time like the present! Don't regret what happened in the past, let's make every step from here on out count! 😁
also you can absolutely use parts of a language you haven't yet acquired. it'll take longer and won't be automatic because you'll be mentally translating or recalling a conjugation table or something, but you can still use it. intentional learning is a stepping stone to acquiring. it's not completely necessary, but it does make your life easier. if you were actually trying to be as "efficient" as possible, you would still spend a fraction of your time learning using traditional materials like grammar books and vocabulary sheets because that's going to make your input more comprehensible. to comprehend the input you don't have to acquire the language. you can still be mentally translating. the thing that matters is you can understand it.
Well for me there was nobody making this particular video for reference so the advice back 3 years ago was "Don't use native subs because that leads to a 0% increase in language ability." . Approx 3-5 months in I jumped into the wolves and watched a new anime with no subs. (It was GGO, the SAO spinoff, 3/10 do not recommend). . Honestly I understood what was going on just fine but the show just kinda sucked so I don't even remember it. . When I actually realized what I said at 7:46 was when I watched my second anime without subs, Amagi Brilliant Park- which I've already watched before in the past. And I realized how having prior knowledge seriously boosts and bolsters comprehension. . To summarize, you can do it whenever you want. You shouldn't stop watching anime/stop whatever you enjoy doing just because you need subs. Keep doing it anyway- and once YOU feel comfortable with giving it a shot, try rewatching something and taking off the subs!
I actually like using Japanese subtitles because in many cases my understanding of the kanji is better than my understanding of what is being said. Doing this helps me connect the two concepts, i.e., Kanji with the pronounciation, but also the word with the meaning as given by the kanji. Like, I don't understand the sentence when I hear it, but when I see the kanji, it suddenly clicks. So I think whether you benefit from Japanese subtitles highly depends on your reading proficiency.
I would like to point out just one thing that you said. Besides that I enjoyed your video and agree with you for sure! But on your last point though, you said that rewatching the same content twice ( first with NL subs, then again without any or TL subs ) would boost the comprehensibility rates higher but wouldnt that just gear your brain towards relying on the NL subs? Automatically translating in your head without any actual conscious/subconscious acquisition going on. In regards to anime specifically, it's infamous for having not so accurate or I should say rough translations. Which then in turn can lead to other negative things? Wouldn't rewatching content without any subs at all or just TL subs paired with occasional word/phrase lookups lead to the same comprehensibility results? This is just my thoughts on it and I would love to hear yours appreciate it!
Hello! Thanks for your well thought out comment! It means a lot when my videos get people thinking! . You bring up a good point and here are my 3 points as response: . 1. I know I said "rewatch twice" but what I meant was "rewatch once" or "watch twice". Upon first viewing, if one is not confident in their ability to understand the thing without NL subs, use NL subs. Once the thing has been understood, then rewatching with TL or no subs will greatly increase comprehension. . 2. Dependency on NL subs will not be built because NL subs are forgotten instantly after watching- what's left is a general idea of what's going on. Very rarely will you rewatch a show and recall EXACTLY what the NL subs for a particular line is, but you WILL remember the scenarios and plot points as a general idea much clearer. . 3. Roughly translated subs don't really matter because, even if you used really accurately translated subs that get everything down to the minute nuances, you'd simply become reliant on the subs. The goal is not to have the subs accurately tell you everything and try to remember the subs; the goal is to let the subs help you understand the story, then use the story to help acquire the language. . Hope this clears things up!
Thanks For the thorough response as well! Definitely makes more sense, I’m just on the fence with this since my core idea of language learning / acquisition aligns with MattvsJapan, refold, etc. And they stress the idea of never having any NL subs at all, but I actually tried doing this for a bit but I felt like my brain automatically translated what was just said from my memory of the NL subs. At least for me, rewatching things in general helps me grasp the story much better and makes it much clearer. Also prior to that I usually look up a summary of a episode if possible. In general though, I believe mixing these two methods is the best way to go ( Rewatching things, mixing NL subs then with none or vice versa )
Also! I wanted to take this chance to ask you about your thoughts on passive immersion. More specifically passive immersion taken from previously watched content. I do this quite often and I do believe it helps a bunch since it’s something I actively watched before therefore I’m really just getting more input via subconscious acquisition and filling in the blanks I missed when I first watched it. But I wanted to hear your thoughts as well, once again Thanks and keep up the great work with the channel!
@@mittsu03 Whatever works for you works for you! I'd only advise thinking a bit more critically about Matt's advice specifically because he has a tendency to come up with things that are not scientifically proven and play it off as a fact (and of course now that he's got a whole scam business going on- trustworthiness just goes way down). . A lot of stuff Matt says (especially in older videos) does hold up to criticism, like his reasoning for why he thinks RTK is a good resource. . But he also came up with the idea that Outputting is damaging- which is an idea that Krashen never said and did not outright agree with. In fact Krashen said something along the lines of "we cannot claim this unless there is more scientific studies". . I'm also pretty sure that Matt is the person who cited that Spanish research paper at 6:54, which can be easily disproven just with Weebs.
@mittsu05 On passive immersion, I am not aware of any scientific studies into the effectiveness of passive immersion, so I can only say from my own experience. . I passive immerse a lot, in fact I'm doing so as of writing this comment. (See my infamous "12 hour" immersion schedule: ua-cam.com/video/JFKYC1pUC9I/v-deo.html) . In my experience, passive immersion specifically in stuff that I've watched before APPEARS TO BE a lot more useful than passive immersing in stuff I've never seen before. . When it comes to stuff I've never seen before, there's a chance that I don't pay enough attention that a lot of words just fly by- then when I do take a glance, I have absolutely no clue what's going on because I'm detached from the context. As a result, what should've been an interesting video is now just "??? what's going on". . Obviously this sort of confusion would not occur on something you've seen before and understand. And so when your brain picks up on something here- it tends to be something you comprehend quite well and IMO it does help with acquisition. . Again, just my thoughts on it. No vigourous scientific testing and peer reviews!
#5 is really interesting because like you I believed this for a long time. However, that isn't going to stop me from watching anime with subtitles ( because my Japanese good enough to fully understand it yet ) anyways and I didn't want to miss any important plot points. After doing this for a couple months, I realized #5 is totally wrong. While you may get nothing out of ONLY watching anime with subtitles, if you are doing it while learning AT THE SAME TIME you can actually pick up a lot of vocabulary and it's good listening practice. Also, to enhance the effect, each time subtitles pop up, I will make a habit of adding a half second delay before I read them, giving my mind an chance to try and understand the Japanese it heard first. If my mind doesn't get it, I look at the subtitle. If it does, I just skip that subtitle. It's like training wheels on a bike, like a "back up" in case you didn't get the content in the main language, and over time I need those training wheels less and less.
Yes, that's the important part. The focus of this video wasn't "look for N+1 content otherwise it's worth nothing", it's "look for comprehensible input". . Naturally, things that you completely lose yourself in and forget that you're even trying to learn a language because it's so engaging, those MUST be comprehensible (otherwise you'd be struggling anyway). THAT's the best type of content.
Not that hard to find sir, 1 Google search brought me to the source I used. Please refer to page 10. www.sdkrashen.com/content/books/principles_and_practice.pdf
@@JouzuJuls went to page 10, didn't find anything on "deliberate acquisition", the distinction you have in the video between subconscious & deliberate acquisition. Also did a quoted search in the whole document. I could have missed something though, could you give a quote.
@@6Uncles AH, I see what you mean, sorry, I misread. My point wasn't very clear- I meant to emphasize the distinction between conscious acquisition (which doesn't exist) and conscious learning. The reason I had to draw this distinction is because a lot of people think there is such thing as "conscious acquisition" or that their studying is "conscious acquisition". The reason I said that he divided acquisition into 2 different parts is because Krashen continuously uses the term "unconscious acquisition" in the paper linked above just to clarify that acquisition is, in fact, unconscious. (As he lays out on page 10, "Language acquisition is a subconscious process".) What I meant by "he divided it in 2" was that one is real and the other isn't. My wording in the video should've been "Krashen expressly stated that language acquisition is subconscious, so "conscious acquisition" doesn't exist- however, this does not mean "conscious learning" does not exist." Hope this clarifies what I meant! Apologies for the confusion!
That depends on how much you know. If it's literally little to no Japanese, don't bother with immersion yet. Nothing makes sense -> 0 comprehensible input -> 100% waste of time. . Start by building up basic vocab and grammar through whatever methods you want. Ah, also Hiragana and Katakana should be done first thing. That shouldn't take more than like 2-3 days tbh. . Then, personally I use Anki's optimized core 2K deck to learn basic vocab & grammar as it gives me example sentences (comprehensivle input) to learn naturally from. . For grammar, I recommend Cure Dolly's guides. I also have a few grammar guides on my channel for what I believe are the three most important things to know that the textbooks don't teach you. . The entire time you're acrively learning these things, make sure you also supplement it with Japanese things you can eventually immerse in. (Japanese YT channels, anime, etc. And you can watch all these with Eng subs. The point is to just have something ready so when you're ready to turn off the subs, you don't have to look for anything)
@@courtneytaylor1841 Long video but it documents everything I did in my very first year of learning Japanese, including how long I spent not immersing: ua-cam.com/video/Jp92ZHyR_rw/v-deo.html
I really enjoy your videos! I can say from experience that number 5 is incorrect. I learned all of my English from watching English television with Hebrew subtitles... I think in general, people in Israel speak much better English on average than many other countries, and I think it's largely because television shows are subtitled and not dubbed.
learning things through study is also good, because it lets you know more of what you read or watch. reading or watching things isn’t helpful if you don’t understand it. a mix of both is best 😊
As i always say, Grammar is a great tool for introduction to different aspects of a language. But still isn't 100% a necessity. And definitely shouldn't be treated how it's treated in somewhere for example, south asia. (Throughout the school life, if it's a local board system, you'll always be taught grammar. Not the language. Yes, just grammar, memorize rules strictly, tests to see if you memorize them but not use of the language whatsoever.) So, it shouldn't be a strictly used material. As it alone can not teach you a language. You need immersion because that gets you familiar with the real spoken language, which results in building understanding of the language (how we do for our native for example) It's the most effective way as you stated. But most people around me is just what i call "grammar-nerds" they say grammar is everything. They're always only studying grammar. While you could learn a language to an understandable amount just by immersing media(i did in the past) you can't to that with grammar only (example is the educational system here cuz last year, when i was an 11th grader, i took the terminal exam. I didn't study English books for months but got 70/100 (80+ is A+ here) just due to my knowledge mainly acquired by immersing media for years. While others got mostly below 40 and many got below 10 and etc. they were the ones who memorized grammar rules for a grand exam and then later forgot them due to no desire to actually understanding in the language just like they'd do in their native) Bottom line is, To upgrade the progress, i think one should make a balance. Use grammar in the beginning if they want and all those stuff but ultimately, get familiar with the language via gettin used to its usage. You can learn a language without grammar, but you can't learn a language without immersion. Mixing both(grammar and such stuff in the beginning) can definitely help you progress faster.
"Native Language subtitles have zero effect for learning anything" Then how it is that I learned the word 攻撃 before even started studying japanese by simply watching Yugioh with an english sub?
Can't you use easier words .so basically we have to learn the basics such as sentence structure, important phrase and expression,tense and vocabulary.Then use it different context
It needs to be interesting too. There’s a lot of comprehensible input UA-cam channels for Korean and I really appreciate their efforts but the content explaining Korean culture or history is something I can only watch once in a while. To watch it daily it needs to be more entertaining than educational and that’s a bit more tricky to do.
I want to learn English from scratch again :) I happen to know Ajatt method, but I don't know if it is effective. Immersion without knowing is something weird. If it's not effective, it's a waste of time (1 or 2 years of immersion).
Not sure what you mean. If you immerse and understand everything, then everything is comprehensible. If nothing is comprehensible, nothing is understandable. If you understand something, then that thing is comprehensible. Simple as that.
The tool I showed at the end of the video is called Migaku! So far it's been super useful for me to learn Japanese as I can easily find single N+1 sentences in the anime that I watch and instantly batch create Anki cards only with things I can actually learn from! The guys also reached out to me and have a special offer for you if you USE THIS LINK: migaku.io/free-month/Juls. You'll get a free 14-day trial and if you like it, you can pay and get the second month FOR FREE!
Hey man, love your videos. I myself am studying in Japan and unfortunately went with ISI, the largest language school here, which is an "immersion style school" - so they will not talk to us in English, even if we dont understand something. So your videos really help to fill the gaps with understanding what they are trying to teach us.
One suggestion I have - Could you maybe make a playlist for your Japanese study videos in order - because im just jumping around trying to find certain things but it would really help to just watch them easily in the correct order for the upcoming final tests;) Not just for me but also your other viewers :)
The man added clips from the last episode of Love Is War, which came out only 2 days before the release of his video. Respect!
Damn right I did LMAO! Thanks for watching and picking these things up!
In order to immerse yourself in a language, you need to understand the language. I feel like this concept is completely lost on everybody.
Edit: cheers for the heart man.
I think the best damnation of the "immersion only" method was that if (incomprehensible) immersion is such an effective method of learning a language, weebs who have spent decades watching thousands of hours of anime with Japanese audio tracks would be fluent in the language. Instead, they are lucky to know 5 words. (and usually use them incorrectly.)
I'm 40, always wanted to learn Japanese, and am finally taking the time to do it. I'm halfway through Genki book 1, so I have a long road ahead to get more content to be comprehensible, but the fact that I can actually read and know a handful of kanji is miles ahead of where I've been all my life. Y'know... knowing 5 words, and only being able to pick Japanese writing out of a lineup compared to Chinese and Korean.
Kinda. The thing with weebs is that the input is NOT technically incomprehensible to them since they use native language subtitles. My friend who has been watching anime for more than 10 years but has never sat down to actually learn Japanese can still barely communicate with Japanese people using broken Japanese. He's joined my gaming sessions with my JP friends and can convey what he wants (granted most of the time broken and taking a long time).
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It's lucky you're only halfway through the Genki book since Genki does a lot more harm to your Japanese than it actually helps! Most of the time learners who use textbooks get stuck with questions that don't actually exist like "what is は vs が". If you ever find yourself asking this question, it's a sign that you've been mislead by Genki and should immediately stop and change your approach before you take even more damage.
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For reference, I recommend an approach based on getting comprehensible input on a daily basis. Specifically an approach that can teach you words that are most commonly used in the language (as opposed to an arbitrarily created JLPT list). This approach can be found in Anki: ua-cam.com/video/DcY2Svs3h8M/v-deo.html
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Furthermore, to see exactly how much damage Genki has done to you, I recommend watching either my video on は vs が, or look up any of my teach, "Cure Dolly"'s videos. ua-cam.com/video/TMi0ehYC7fE/v-deo.html
@@JouzuJuls Genki is not the only resource I'm using, of course. I've been bouncing between japanese learning games and apps, Kanji Study being a favorite, and I do know that there's plenty of warning against Genki out there... but also when it comes to learning Japanese from textbooks, Genki is just about the best one you can get.
I've already come across some weird genki-isms, yes. 😅 verbs make so much more sense learning about the godan and ichidan types and the differences, and the rules, rather than "Aight kids, y'all got them thar U verbs and them RU verbs. Also this one ends in RU but it's U. Just memorize it. Also, them thar verbs don't fit in either, we just call them irregular. Memorize it all!"
NGL with the quality of these videos I thought jouzu was such a bigger UA-camr these past few weeks of watching his videos. Why is he not as popular or more popular than these vtubers! I've gained so much valued information from this guy than I have ever from any other youtuber!! And he puts it in a fun way D: what is going on! I'm pointing anyone wanting to learn Japanese here!
Thank you very much for watching the video and leaving this kind and encouraging comment!
Whaching a thing with subtitle absolutely does work. It's been a point of pride for me how I acquired english without putting effort, just by watching movies. But learning japanese made me appreciate how much I actually got out of my school education with english. You absorb next to nothing until you get some basics, because you don't know what anything is, so you're brain just ignores the whole thing as noise, as oppose to mapping and reinforcing
Oh my God! I could not like this video more!! I'm so upset that I wasted the past couple years listening to a bunch of incomprehensible input and wondered why I wasn't getting much better. I completely agree with you!
Glad to hear that I was able to voice your experience for the past couple years! I know it must be frustrating to realize that you could've saved a lot of time and I can relate to that too (I also butchered my Anki for like 1.5 years ua-cam.com/video/t3g6X1RMUyg/v-deo.html)
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But hey! There's no time like the present! Don't regret what happened in the past, let's make every step from here on out count! 😁
@@JouzuJuls Such a positive way to look at it! Agreed. 頑張ります!
also you can absolutely use parts of a language you haven't yet acquired. it'll take longer and won't be automatic because you'll be mentally translating or recalling a conjugation table or something, but you can still use it. intentional learning is a stepping stone to acquiring. it's not completely necessary, but it does make your life easier. if you were actually trying to be as "efficient" as possible, you would still spend a fraction of your time learning using traditional materials like grammar books and vocabulary sheets because that's going to make your input more comprehensible. to comprehend the input you don't have to acquire the language. you can still be mentally translating. the thing that matters is you can understand it.
7:46 did you do that in your own journey? how did things go? also what is the right level to start doing this in your opinion?
Well for me there was nobody making this particular video for reference so the advice back 3 years ago was "Don't use native subs because that leads to a 0% increase in language ability."
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Approx 3-5 months in I jumped into the wolves and watched a new anime with no subs. (It was GGO, the SAO spinoff, 3/10 do not recommend).
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Honestly I understood what was going on just fine but the show just kinda sucked so I don't even remember it.
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When I actually realized what I said at 7:46 was when I watched my second anime without subs, Amagi Brilliant Park- which I've already watched before in the past. And I realized how having prior knowledge seriously boosts and bolsters comprehension.
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To summarize, you can do it whenever you want. You shouldn't stop watching anime/stop whatever you enjoy doing just because you need subs. Keep doing it anyway- and once YOU feel comfortable with giving it a shot, try rewatching something and taking off the subs!
Your editing cracks me up...
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed the video! Hopefully I can keep making videos with this quality every month from now!
I actually like using Japanese subtitles because in many cases my understanding of the kanji is better than my understanding of what is being said. Doing this helps me connect the two concepts, i.e., Kanji with the pronounciation, but also the word with the meaning as given by the kanji. Like, I don't understand the sentence when I hear it, but when I see the kanji, it suddenly clicks. So I think whether you benefit from Japanese subtitles highly depends on your reading proficiency.
I would like to point out just one thing that you said. Besides that I enjoyed your video and agree with you for sure! But on your last point though, you said that rewatching the same content twice ( first with NL subs, then again without any or TL subs ) would boost the comprehensibility rates higher but wouldnt that just gear your brain towards relying on the NL subs? Automatically translating in your head without any actual conscious/subconscious acquisition going on. In regards to anime specifically, it's infamous for having not so accurate or I should say rough translations. Which then in turn can lead to other negative things? Wouldn't rewatching content without any subs at all or just TL subs paired with occasional word/phrase lookups lead to the same comprehensibility results? This is just my thoughts on it and I would love to hear yours appreciate it!
Hello! Thanks for your well thought out comment! It means a lot when my videos get people thinking!
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You bring up a good point and here are my 3 points as response:
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1. I know I said "rewatch twice" but what I meant was "rewatch once" or "watch twice". Upon first viewing, if one is not confident in their ability to understand the thing without NL subs, use NL subs. Once the thing has been understood, then rewatching with TL or no subs will greatly increase comprehension.
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2. Dependency on NL subs will not be built because NL subs are forgotten instantly after watching- what's left is a general idea of what's going on. Very rarely will you rewatch a show and recall EXACTLY what the NL subs for a particular line is, but you WILL remember the scenarios and plot points as a general idea much clearer.
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3. Roughly translated subs don't really matter because, even if you used really accurately translated subs that get everything down to the minute nuances, you'd simply become reliant on the subs. The goal is not to have the subs accurately tell you everything and try to remember the subs; the goal is to let the subs help you understand the story, then use the story to help acquire the language.
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Hope this clears things up!
Thanks For the thorough response as well! Definitely makes more sense, I’m just on the fence with this since my core idea of language learning / acquisition aligns with MattvsJapan, refold, etc. And they stress the idea of never having any NL subs at all, but I actually tried doing this for a bit but I felt like my brain automatically translated what was just said from my memory of the NL subs. At least for me, rewatching things in general helps me grasp the story much better and makes it much clearer. Also prior to that I usually look up a summary of a episode if possible. In general though, I believe mixing these two methods is the best way to go ( Rewatching things, mixing NL subs then with none or vice versa )
Also! I wanted to take this chance to ask you about your thoughts on passive immersion. More specifically passive immersion taken from previously watched content. I do this quite often and I do believe it helps a bunch since it’s something I actively watched before therefore I’m really just getting more input via subconscious acquisition and filling in the blanks I missed when I first watched it. But I wanted to hear your thoughts as well, once again Thanks and keep up the great work with the channel!
@@mittsu03 Whatever works for you works for you! I'd only advise thinking a bit more critically about Matt's advice specifically because he has a tendency to come up with things that are not scientifically proven and play it off as a fact (and of course now that he's got a whole scam business going on- trustworthiness just goes way down).
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A lot of stuff Matt says (especially in older videos) does hold up to criticism, like his reasoning for why he thinks RTK is a good resource.
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But he also came up with the idea that Outputting is damaging- which is an idea that Krashen never said and did not outright agree with. In fact Krashen said something along the lines of "we cannot claim this unless there is more scientific studies".
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I'm also pretty sure that Matt is the person who cited that Spanish research paper at 6:54, which can be easily disproven just with Weebs.
@mittsu05 On passive immersion, I am not aware of any scientific studies into the effectiveness of passive immersion, so I can only say from my own experience.
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I passive immerse a lot, in fact I'm doing so as of writing this comment. (See my infamous "12 hour" immersion schedule: ua-cam.com/video/JFKYC1pUC9I/v-deo.html)
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In my experience, passive immersion specifically in stuff that I've watched before APPEARS TO BE a lot more useful than passive immersing in stuff I've never seen before.
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When it comes to stuff I've never seen before, there's a chance that I don't pay enough attention that a lot of words just fly by- then when I do take a glance, I have absolutely no clue what's going on because I'm detached from the context. As a result, what should've been an interesting video is now just "??? what's going on".
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Obviously this sort of confusion would not occur on something you've seen before and understand. And so when your brain picks up on something here- it tends to be something you comprehend quite well and IMO it does help with acquisition.
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Again, just my thoughts on it. No vigourous scientific testing and peer reviews!
#5 is really interesting because like you I believed this for a long time. However, that isn't going to stop me from watching anime with subtitles ( because my Japanese good enough to fully understand it yet ) anyways and I didn't want to miss any important plot points. After doing this for a couple months, I realized #5 is totally wrong.
While you may get nothing out of ONLY watching anime with subtitles, if you are doing it while learning AT THE SAME TIME you can actually pick up a lot of vocabulary and it's good listening practice. Also, to enhance the effect, each time subtitles pop up, I will make a habit of adding a half second delay before I read them, giving my mind an chance to try and understand the Japanese it heard first.
If my mind doesn't get it, I look at the subtitle. If it does, I just skip that subtitle. It's like training wheels on a bike, like a "back up" in case you didn't get the content in the main language, and over time I need those training wheels less and less.
I think its okay to watch content that isn't N+1 if it really peaks your interest. Its hard to find N+1 content
Yes, that's the important part. The focus of this video wasn't "look for N+1 content otherwise it's worth nothing", it's "look for comprehensible input".
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Naturally, things that you completely lose yourself in and forget that you're even trying to learn a language because it's so engaging, those MUST be comprehensible (otherwise you'd be struggling anyway). THAT's the best type of content.
When you are MINING sentences for Anki, Ideally make those N+1 for efficiency. But Immersion and sentence mining are 2 different things.
please provide a reference for "deliberate acquisition" stated at 1:30. Hard to find anything on this
Not that hard to find sir, 1 Google search brought me to the source I used. Please refer to page 10.
www.sdkrashen.com/content/books/principles_and_practice.pdf
@@JouzuJuls went to page 10, didn't find anything on "deliberate acquisition", the distinction you have in the video between subconscious & deliberate acquisition. Also did a quoted search in the whole document.
I could have missed something though, could you give a quote.
@@6Uncles AH, I see what you mean, sorry, I misread.
My point wasn't very clear- I meant to emphasize the distinction between conscious acquisition (which doesn't exist) and conscious learning.
The reason I had to draw this distinction is because a lot of people think there is such thing as "conscious acquisition" or that their studying is "conscious acquisition".
The reason I said that he divided acquisition into 2 different parts is because Krashen continuously uses the term "unconscious acquisition" in the paper linked above just to clarify that acquisition is, in fact, unconscious. (As he lays out on page 10, "Language acquisition is a subconscious process".)
What I meant by "he divided it in 2" was that one is real and the other isn't.
My wording in the video should've been
"Krashen expressly stated that language acquisition is subconscious, so "conscious acquisition" doesn't exist- however, this does not mean "conscious learning" does not exist."
Hope this clarifies what I meant! Apologies for the confusion!
Thank bro! Your video really helps me learning English better.
bro what do you recommend beginners do to find comprehensible input for immersion while they know little to no japanese?
That depends on how much you know. If it's literally little to no Japanese, don't bother with immersion yet. Nothing makes sense -> 0 comprehensible input -> 100% waste of time.
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Start by building up basic vocab and grammar through whatever methods you want. Ah, also Hiragana and Katakana should be done first thing. That shouldn't take more than like 2-3 days tbh.
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Then, personally I use Anki's optimized core 2K deck to learn basic vocab & grammar as it gives me example sentences (comprehensivle input) to learn naturally from.
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For grammar, I recommend Cure Dolly's guides. I also have a few grammar guides on my channel for what I believe are the three most important things to know that the textbooks don't teach you.
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The entire time you're acrively learning these things, make sure you also supplement it with Japanese things you can eventually immerse in. (Japanese YT channels, anime, etc. And you can watch all these with Eng subs. The point is to just have something ready so when you're ready to turn off the subs, you don't have to look for anything)
@@JouzuJuls How long did you spend learning before you decided to immerse?
@@courtneytaylor1841 Long video but it documents everything I did in my very first year of learning Japanese, including how long I spent not immersing: ua-cam.com/video/Jp92ZHyR_rw/v-deo.html
I really enjoy your videos! I can say from experience that number 5 is incorrect. I learned all of my English from watching English television with Hebrew subtitles... I think in general, people in Israel speak much better English on average than many other countries, and I think it's largely because television shows are subtitled and not dubbed.
My level of English is just A2. I don't really understand what you said. Can you write down some words to sum up?
learning things through study is also good, because it lets you know more of what you read or watch. reading or watching things isn’t helpful if you don’t understand it. a mix of both is best 😊
Judging from what you just wrote, you seem higher than A2.
As i always say,
Grammar is a great tool for introduction to different aspects of a language.
But still isn't 100% a necessity.
And definitely shouldn't be treated how it's treated in somewhere for example, south asia.
(Throughout the school life, if it's a local board system, you'll always be taught grammar. Not the language. Yes, just grammar, memorize rules strictly, tests to see if you memorize them but not use of the language whatsoever.)
So, it shouldn't be a strictly used material.
As it alone can not teach you a language. You need immersion because that gets you familiar with the real spoken language, which results in building understanding of the language (how we do for our native for example)
It's the most effective way as you stated.
But most people around me is just what i call "grammar-nerds" they say grammar is everything. They're always only studying grammar.
While you could learn a language to an understandable amount just by immersing media(i did in the past) you can't to that with grammar only (example is the educational system here cuz last year, when i was an 11th grader, i took the terminal exam. I didn't study English books for months but got 70/100 (80+ is A+ here) just due to my knowledge mainly acquired by immersing media for years. While others got mostly below 40 and many got below 10 and etc. they were the ones who memorized grammar rules for a grand exam and then later forgot them due to no desire to actually understanding in the language just like they'd do in their native)
Bottom line is,
To upgrade the progress, i think one should make a balance. Use grammar in the beginning if they want and all those stuff but ultimately, get familiar with the language via gettin used to its usage.
You can learn a language without grammar, but you can't learn a language without immersion.
Mixing both(grammar and such stuff in the beginning) can definitely help you progress faster.
Great video. Now I have something to link people do when they are spouting bs that they don't understand about immersion
Thank you very much! Yes, too many people just say "immerse more" and cite Krashen for things he never said!
"Native Language subtitles have zero effect for learning anything"
Then how it is that I learned the word 攻撃 before even started studying japanese by simply watching Yugioh with an english sub?
Can't you use easier words .so basically we have to learn the basics such as sentence structure, important phrase and expression,tense and vocabulary.Then use it different context
It needs to be interesting too. There’s a lot of comprehensible input UA-cam channels for Korean and I really appreciate their efforts but the content explaining Korean culture or history is something I can only watch once in a while. To watch it daily it needs to be more entertaining than educational and that’s a bit more tricky to do.
I want to learn English from scratch again :) I happen to know Ajatt method, but I don't know if it is effective. Immersion without knowing is something weird. If it's not effective, it's a waste of time (1 or 2 years of immersion).
I'm reading graded readers (stage 4). I don't know where to go after stage 6. And when I can read and listen to authentic things.
Almost everyone misapplies Krashen... it's really tiresome at this point
Great video, you deserve more subs
Thank you very much!
me personnaly i've learn english withouth any compresensive imput. just immersing and i can understand it all
Not sure what you mean. If you immerse and understand everything, then everything is comprehensible. If nothing is comprehensible, nothing is understandable. If you understand something, then that thing is comprehensible. Simple as that.
@@JouzuJuls everything is comprehensible now 💯
Primero que nada me da mucha pena que mis compañeros de trabajo se hayan equivocado. Lo haremos mejor
Bruh A ga SUS da is hilarious.
Honestly, telling people to not watch anime with English subs is actively harmful. I know that firsthand.
Aがඞだ.