Perfume, Pleasure, and Bankruptcy | How Roman Soldiers Managed Their Salaries and Expenses!
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- Опубліковано 27 кві 2024
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This video dives into a topic we are all very familiar wish: Salaries and what to do with them. It just so happens that in this regard, very little has changed from the time of the ancient Romans, who spent, saved, and invested just like we do today. The similarities of humans throughout history never ceases to amuse us! Just us in uncovering real documents and artifacts to reveal the lucrative life of average Roman soldiers previously lost to time!
If you want to see more videos like this, consider supporting us on Patreon, it helps a lot! / historiamilitum
Primary Sources
CIL 03, 2709. lupa.at/21433
CIL 03, 293. www.mqdq.it/public/ce/testo/c...
CIL 13, 1906.
P.Vindob. L. 135. papyri.info/ddbdp/sb;16;12609
PFay, 105.
RMR 68. PGenLat1.
Tab.Vindonissa 2.
Secondary Sources
Alston, R. “Roman military pay from Caesar to Diocletian” in Journal of Roman Studies, 84, 113-123.
Boren, H. C. Studies Relating to the Stipendium Militum in Historia: Zeitschrift für Alte Geschichte, Bd. 32, H. 4 (4th Qtr., 1983): 427-460
Brunt, P. A. “Pay and Superannuation in the Roman Army” in Papers of the British School at Rome, Vol. 18 (1950): 50-71.
De Nardis, M. “Pay and Income: Republic” in Le Bohec, Y (eds.) in Le Bohec, Y. (eds.), Encyclopedia of the Roman Army Vol. II, Wiley Blackwell: Oxford, 2015, 737-738.
Fink, R. O. Roman Military Records on Papyrus. Cleveland: American Philological Association. 1971.
Phang, S. E. Roman Military Service: Ideologies of Discipline in the Late Republic and Early Principate. Cambridge University Press: Cambridge. 2008.
Speidel, M. A. “Pay and Income: Principate” in Le Bohec, Y. (eds.), Encyclopedia of the Roman Army Vol. II, Wiley Blackwell:Oxford, 2015, 738-740.
Speidel, M. A. “Roman Army Pay Scales” in Journal of Roman Studies, 10/1992, 349-380.
Watson, G. R. “The Pay of the Roman Army: The Republic” in Historia: Zeitschrift für Alte Geschichte, Bd. 7, H. 1 (Jan., 1958): 113-120.
Roman understanding of salary (0:00)
Sponsor: MyHeritage (3:28)
Military Donations (4:46)
Receiving Salaries (5:58)
Salary Deductions (6:22)
Military Bank Accounts (7:31)
Expenses for Pleasure (9:57)
A REAL Bank statement! (12:22)
Retirement at Last.. (13:22)
Loaning to Friends (14:12) - Розваги
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The loot, don't forget looting as the longest tradition of human culture. Winning battles and pillaging settlements gave you a lot of wealth
Thats true. But how looting worked in the Roman world was so big of a topic that we decided to reserve a different video for it. Definitely will be covered!
@@HistoriaMilitum you know they sell off your dna to medical insurance companies?
When your life consist of kill or be killed you tend to spend money on the finer pleasures you can afford at the moment instead of some misplaced idea of noble spending.
Life is short, why not enjoy it when you can?
Can you imagine storing away your life for retirement only to have some Visgoth take it all away suddenly and without warning?
True, but as shown, the men who were frugal with their spending and lived benefitted big time.
@@huntclanhunt9697 oh definitely and plenty of them lived believing that they were chosen to survive and thrive which is why the legions could always fill their ranks.
Technically speaking armies don't lose large percentages of their soldiers over all big picture wise.
seen very well in other times of history such as the landsknechts
The economics and day-to-day logistics of the armies of history will never *not* be a fascinating topic. You *must* do more.
Vastly underrepresented avenue of discussion.
The Standard Bearer was probably the most well protected person in a legion. 😀
Indeed, I am sure everyone wanted to be on his good side !😁😁
Remembering previous Historia Militum video. When a standard was throw into enemy rank to 'encourage' the men to push to retrieve it. I wonder if they store the bank account on their standard for how much it motivate the men to retrive it.
And a target that is basically holding a sign that's saying "kill me" to the enemy.
There's a reason to expect protection 😅
But enemy had archers and javelin throwers and Standard Bearer had only small shield.
13:01 bro is named after the god of wine, pleasure and partying and he did not spend his money on wine, pleasure and partying. Amazing man indeed!
Soldiers recruited from the lower class suddenly getting a regular income for the first time and going nuts definitely still happens.
You pull up outside an Infantry barracks and all the lower enlisted are driving dodge chargers, cameros, and lifted trucks 😂
I was thinking the same thing, some things do never change
How could you leave out the beloved mustang with a 20% interest rate?
Dodge Charger is number one choice in the ghetto
Cheese at 28% APR
Those are all regular cars. What would you rather them drive?
How about loot? How did they account for, keep, value and sell their loot?
Loot is another super interesting aspect which was too long to cover in this video. We are planning to dedicate a full video to it :)
From what I can gather, campaigns were so expensive a legionary HAD to rely on loot to avoid debt and bankruptcy 😞 The Jewish revolt seems to be particularly expensive
In my younger days I was only interested in combat and strategy now it's stuff like this that interest me.
These are by far my favourite videos, I love seeing the nitty gritty of how they actually lived, trained and stuff.
I think it's because I can really picture myself in those times with these videos.
When a Roman 2000 years ago had better savings than you...
@@jonbaxter2254can you start to imagine their health. Roman or not. All the people of that time handled illness without pharmacuticals and vaccines. I know I'd die from diahrea 😔😔😔😔😔😔😔 I hate this world of gifts and curses
It’s really amazing how little has changed with how soldiers spent their money in ancient times. I’ve talked to people who have been in the military in modern times, the same kind of stuff is going on with spending and loaning money.
The Romans (West) were the first and for at least 1400 years the last, with funktional bookkeeping.
When a Soldier died, his officer would send the money to the next relative.
Ever Soldier had to write ( from somone else ) a last will, declaring how get the money.
It worked not allways, but the roman done everything to make it happen.
For a future topic, could you explore the family life of roman soliders? When in the military a big aspect of morale and stability was allowing constant contact with family and friends at home so I'd be interested to see how the romans approached this issue
Good idea, that would make a good video. We will look into it!
I liked this episode. There are directly parallels in the modern army, though the source and names are different. (i.e. a re-enlistment bonus rather than a imperial donative)
It’s always a good day when you upload another incredible video. Keep up the great work!
Thank you for the comment. We will try our best to make them more frequent! ;)
@@HistoriaMilitum No worries lol, these videos are very high quality because of the time and hard work put into them, I’m happy with any frequency 😊
Fun Fact: When you join the U.S. Army your half of your first 2 paychecks go to purchasing the clothing they issue you and things you need to buy for training anyways lol
Life of individuals is a really interesting and relatable topic. Like, what was like to be a legionnary on Gaul (daily days, economy, amusement, etc)...
Bro, that Stronghold 1 soundtrack in the background. So nostalgic 😮❤
Titus Cissonius was a true man of culture, he was one of the boys 👏
Absolutely interesting. Topics that bring us to the past, Roman bureaucracy is just like today's.
Yes, or they paved the way to how a society functions till this day
Love this channel for covering topics like this, also looking forward to Dacia Part 2!
I love learning about all this. please keep it coming :)
as always you did a great job with this video and I can't wait for the next one.
Thank you for your comment! :)
Love this! Thank you, please create more!
I appreciate your work on this subject, i wish you all the best!
I love how detailed you are with the contents and information of the videos. That's why I always keep my eye on your channel... Like yesterday, when a I saw another video, waiting for the next one (this one 😅)
Always Outstanding!
I love the way you approach these topics and the things you focus on. Keep up the good work! :)
Thank you tor your comment! We are working on much more like it.
@@HistoriaMilitum thanks for your contents :)
Honestly if I was Caesar I wouldn't have said a word either, walking over 20 miles a day and then putting 10 men in the same tent? I think I'd have just put the perfume directly into my nose.
I really enjoyed this thank you it was great to have real life examples.
Yeah this was great!! Keep it up!
Love these detailed videos
I love this channel. There's just so much interesting things there, well-documented, well-explained, and with a smooth voice on top of that.
Thanks you again for this video
Thank you for the kind comment. Nevertheless, we will always try to improve the quality with every video. Looking forward to seeing you in the next one! :)
@@HistoriaMilitum why did you guys change the thumbnail? was UA-cam flagging it as inappropriate or something like that?
@@agrippa2012 Not at all, just trying for something simpler and more catchy. What do you think about it? :)
@@HistoriaMilitum i prefer the previous one but im no thumbnail expert so what do i know? :)
Nevertheless, i hope this video gets a lot of views regardless of what thumbnail you use 👍
10:50 i love the Stronghold soundtrack in the background. already enjoyed the video and this made it even better.
Wow, I learned so much from this video. Excellently done.
The best type of content, is that of which explores the lives of ordinary people living ordinary lives.
I am glad to see your channel growing, you deserve to be as well respect as kings and generals. Excellent video
Thank you for the kind comment! Really glad you enjoyed.
Very interesting coverage of a topic not normally mentioned but very important.
Your vids are always of the highest quality man.
Im glad you think so. It takes quite some time to put them together!
It shows! Looking forward to your second Dacian War video. @@HistoriaMilitum
i absolutely love videos that talks about the more "mudane" aspects of life in ancient times.
Excellent Video. Thank you.
Very interesting. Its also interesting to see how long lifespans people had in this period, like that dude who bought those olive orchards at age 67.
Many people assume Romans and other ancients lived very short loves, but that is very much untrue! Its indeed a great ideas for a future video and I will make sure we make it. Thanks!
interesting topic, I never really thought of it prior to today
finally got around to watching this one, and i think this might be my favorite of your videos so far. Would love to see more like it!
Such s good video, well done
Thanks for the video
Fascinating.
YES PLEASE! More! More! MORE!
Very entertaining and informative video. Thank you for your time and effort. Thank you, sir.
Please do! I love the content!
I'm curious about what would happen if a spectacular defeat resulted in the Legion bank being looted by the enemy...
Could survivors claim some credit from the state?
I can't imagine full compensation would be simple matter...
Actually we don't know 😅. I imagine that the state paid deaf ears to such reclamations. Large defeats were not very common so to speak.
We know that for example sometimes generals with ambitions either seized the bank accounts or received large donations from the soldier in order to raise cash for the campaign. This a case with a revolt against Domitian in Germania. To prevent something like a limit of 225 denarii on the account was stablished but as you can see... this was often ignored 😂
@@JonEtxebeberriaRodriguez Yeah, about what I figure too.
But just something tells me survivors of some catastrophic defeat wouldn't walk away empty handed if they showed up and told their story... Just think how bad it would look
@@heofonfyr6000 You are right. But there unfortunately we are entering into the realm of the unknown. Sadly such things are never mentioned in the sources. We can only make educate guesses 😅. It's a shame because as a professional historian would love to find out what happened in such cases 😂
@@JonEtxebeberriaRodriguez well, if there's nothing in the archives we'll never know for sure.
Not just in Roman times; Military salaries for regular soldiers is probably the best source anytime in history.
Or do the mercennary way you get your pay regardless If they payer IS willing to pay
keep this videos coming
Fascinating stuff , on a historical site we had a discution on standard bearers fighting or not
the consensus was that a unit standard bearer was the focal point of a unit and the location of it's command , to regroup upon if the battle turned bad
so now it turn out the legionnaires would fight to protect their saving accountant too
duty and my money are a powerful alliance
Great video!!!
Soldier A: "those germania frau are kinda pretty"
Soldier B: "but they are not pure italian!"
Soldier A: "so what?"
"500 years later"
"We are the Holy Roman Empire".
Absolutely fascinating... Huzzah!! 😊
so interesting!
I would like to believe the Romans had to pay for their own weapons to make it a point not to leave it behind, incase of a route. I can imagine having to pay for my M4 on a few training events if I left it behind.
Dude these videos are amazing. Where do you even find all these specific stories about individual legionaries?? You had me hooked from beginning to end.
Thanks for your words. In most cases we go directly to the primary source material. Every piece of archaeological information has like a serial number that you can track and that every scholar must use when referring to the document. For example the document of Proculus has the reference code P.GenLat... which is the number it was given upon discovery and classification. So if we find a referrence to it in a book or somewhere we can check it. Documents like this are often stored in large databases or codex like compilations that scholars can consult. Same goes with inscriptions, you can go to the academic database and consult.
The only downside is 90% of the times the stuff is in latin or greek. It is assumed that only scholars will consult these stuff so they skip the translation part. Fortunately we know a bit of latin and roman epigraphic tradition so we can translate them if needed be 😊. I think it adds a bit uniqueness to the content and hopefully becomes a hallmark of the channel.
We will add the sources later for everyone to consult freely if they want 😊
@@JonEtxebeberriaRodriguez it’s definitely the part that stands out to me and I’m sure that sentiment stands for many! Looking forward to more content. It demonstrates a level of research that goes beyond expectation for most UA-cam vids!
Really interesting! Thanks!
I love Stronghold music in the background
I actually wouldn't mind seeing more videos on Roman fortifications..
Great vid
This video was fantastic. It gave me an even better appreciation for the value of a denarius.
Looking forward to the videos on corruption and plunder
Appreciate the Stronghold soundtrack guys!❤
As Henry Hill said in the movie Goodfellas "Fuck you, pay me".
You know, unless it's caesar, in which case they work on credit
I dig it, doing more like this would be good
excellent thank you very much
Notify me on the corruption video
"Something can't be very unique, unique means one of a kind"
Joshua Bartlett
I don't like being the Grammar Police but the misuse of words such as "unique" and "decimated" suggests an incomplete command of English. ("Decimated" didn't appear on this video but just as you can't be "somewhat unique" you can't be "completely decimated" any more than you can be "utterly halved".)
@@RichardDCook Well, you indeed cannot be "somewhat unique" (though it has been pointed out to me in another situation that "unique" does appareantly not equal "one of a kind" anymore in modern grammer, idk, I would argue that "decimated" has grown to equal "much reduced" as opposed to the original meaning of "divided by 10"
Right, language is always changing! There's a time when only a few uneducated people are using a word as having a new meaning, and a time when the vast majority of people are using the word that way. With "unique" and "decimated" we're in that grey middle ground where most people with an educated command of English use the words as having their original meanings but many, perhaps a majority, are using them as having new meanings. I wouldn't put the original meanings of those words in the "obsolete" bin just yet! (I myself couldn't use decimated, quartered, or halved in any other way than they obviously mean.)
Too funny! I spent my first two paychecks on a red suede coat. It was gorgeous. Sigh!
great video.
An original and well researched analysis of a topic I've always wanted to know about. It's incredible how inflation made the ranks more unequal over time. Also, compliments to the artist you have on the team.
super interesting
Very interesting!
I really loved seeing the example of the low interest rate for being a friend, contrary to the typical idea of "barbaric and brute antiquity" it shows that 2000 years ago friendship was exactly the same as it is today.
I often wonder if instead of lump sums they should add on a lifetime stipend that goes up with each year of service.
Turns out the average modern day PFC and Roman Legionnaire weren’t so different after all, what with horrible financial practices
I wonder how many Legionaires bought a horse and chariot with 15 percent interest at their first duty station.
Good video
I did a double take at 'stipendium', for a moment sounded like 'Stupendium' - which would be a pretty cool collab project
Strongold music :D
Very interesting
How ancient people were this organised and orderly blows my mind. They were centuries ahead of anybody else.
not just any ancient people, romans
They were mostly just like we are today, except they didn't have all the new technologies we have today, but our minds are still the same.
and yet allot could not write too. not sure about read part. and we even have parts in the world were not all can read or write
@@ramonruijgt4532 That's just education, but the mind still is there.
Please continue Legion Overviews! I wanna see XX valerian next!
Legionary got paid at 100 Denari silver a month. Auxiliary got paid 200 Denari silver a month. Centurians 250 to 500 Denari silver a month. An Aquila could easily received a pension of 2500 to 5000 Denari silver a month.
6:30 to 6:41
I think that's both normal and logical in practically every army and even in the current modern armies all over the world
Idk why the algorithm only hit me with this video now, was a great watch!
The unit of account in USA is the Dollar. In Imperial Roma, unit of account is sestertius or plural sestertii or called “HS” . A Denarii is a small silver coin worth 4 sestertii. You would list pay in sestertii, not denarii. So if I owe somebody $600, I would not say I owe them 🎉12x $50 “Grant” bills or 6 Benjis. DONATIVES for common soldiers would be 2 gold coins … Aurelii. That is 50 denarii or 200 HS. This bonus (Latin for “Good”) is 1/5 or a 20% bonus… and critical for a soldier ability to pay off debts. Failure to pay the yearly donative often led to rebelión. Also, every 5 years of an emperor reign, an extra 1 gold coin is added. So 10 years, a common solder gets 4 gold coins… 40% bonus!!!
When the Centurion sees his junior Legionary purchase a horse with 90% APR
The only thing that would make this better is if you tried to equate what a denarii is in todays money. I know we dont know excalty but a rough estimate would be cool to include. Otherwise well done, I enjoyed this video very much!
It is VERY rough, but you could get something like the US military pay rates (which are publicly available information), and see what a new soldier makes, a senior sergeant, etc, and compare that to a legionary, a centurion, etc. It would put you in the ballpark to get a denarii-to-dollar equivalence.
Titus Cissinius and Titus Pullo loved to party! Good troops, better drinkers
👍more please, esp on legino retirement, share ofspoils, disciplne, corruption. recruitment, training👏
good, somethings never change
Nice
Hah yeeeaaah music from Stronghold game
I do have an odd question, it is how much the resale value of equipment would be. Like if you bought a sword and then sold it a few weeks later or something. I have tried to find out that kind of thing in Ye Olde Days but I can never get a straight answer if I even get an answer at all.
I don’t think there is any information about equipment resale value. If there was, it would still probably be different for each period.. But its likely that after returning your gear after service, you were given part of your money back. We have a video coming up very soon about weapon and armour logistics, stay tuned!
@@HistoriaMilitum And I will be sure to watch it, I am just curious to see how marked down it would be for RPG purposes (I am a huge nerd lol)
Wow i didn't know that about standard bearers thats so cool
Why not try having a custom intro music just like Mark Felton. That would be great 🙂👍
Thoroughly enjoyed the subject of military pay and the detail you devoted to it.
I am a very big fan of Rome 2 Total War and could not help noticing the amazing skins on the soldiers from the game in the video. Would you mind sharing where those came from?
Good legionary skins are difficult to come by.
Well done and many thanks!
Thank you, glad you enjoyed! I believe the mod we used is just called “Named Roman Legions”.
Thank you for the reply!
I will check it out. 🫡
Good one but how's your progress on part 2 of the Dacian Wars documentary?
We are still working on the script. We are planning to release it in mid January after a couple other uploads. Sorry for the wait!
Oh Yea!