Oh man this video is gold. I'm someone who is coming off the street picking up trad bows and starting fresh. There is soooooo much small detail going into getting these things to perform its crazy!
In all these years, I'd never heard of the reason for the nock position needing to be higher for longer draw lengths. Just thought you have a starting point and you adjust till you get proper arrow flight. Which does work, but it's nice to know the why. I myself seem to always have a knock height of 11/16" to 3/4" at my 29 inch draw. Thanks for all the information you share!
Hey Jeff. This is Brian Eberhart. I use to do some interior work for ya years back. my mom ( Krisilyn Patton) did some a well. Just found your UA-cam. Absolutely love it. Your the one one who gave me the advice to start shooting 3 under years ago at the car lot. You're definitely my go to for traditional shooting. I'm definitely a fan brother.
I'm primarily a compound bow shooter. I've been wanting to get a recurve, and after watching your review on sanlida, I took the bait and ordered a 68-inch noble from them via Amazon. Can't wait! I love your approach to archery. Thanks for the great videos👍
@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998 Well that bow showed up today. Putting the string on gave me anxiety, even with the provided stringer 😆. I've never strung a bow before. It was kinda like reloading for the first time. That first trigger pull, my face might have been just a bit further from the rifle than normal😏. Only took one fling of an arrow, though, and I'm digging it! Still love my V3X, but now it's going to have to share time with this Noble recurve. That recurve truly is a joy to shoot. You're a horrible influence, just horrible😉🤣, so thank you!
Jeff, you didn’t help me a little bit you helped me a lot! Just got back into 3-D just found your channel a few days ago and I wanna let you know that I really appreciate all your videos and this one in particular because I’m getting ready to purchase a 60 inch recurvethank you
i really want to get a long bow just for a light draw weight and shooting targets all day. like a 30lbs long bow and 1 thousand arrows thrown on the weekend. might sound insane to some but i want that bow i can shoot all day long while being super comfortable and easy to shoot. great for working on form and technique without wearing out the back haha. its also great for allowing others to shoot your bow with you and them being able to handle it and have fun too. its a great bow to have for the whole family or for shooting all day like i said earlier
Jeff, thank you for all you do for the trad community, it is much appreciated. I would love to hear your thoughts on tunning wood arrows. I have been coming to some conclusions (maybe that is too strong of a word) at least some theories of late and would love to hear your thoughts. Here is my current thinking. Wood arrows (also high GPI carbons) get their mass along the entire length of the arrow. Unless you want a very heavy arrow tip weights tip weights are usually lower. Also, I have found that heavier tip weights cause nock high issues. Which in my mind is due to wood not having the same dynamic recovery that carbon has. All this leads to an arrow that at hunting weight (500-600 grains) will have a low FOC. It would seem that PO cedar would be best as it is light allowing more tip weight and higher FOC’s. However, I have found tuning (nock high issues) with PO and heavy tips. It seems dynamic recovery plays a role here. Have you dealt with wood and have any thoughts on this?
Well I’ve definitely had some issues with PO Cedar shafts and some others as far as tuning and its really tough especially because even if you manage to get one shaft straight or as straight as possible it simply won’t stay that way just from weather changes and shooting alone and they’re very inconsistent in general compared to carbon because they’re natural wood and just somehow affected by humidity so it’s definitely tough but fun and relatively expensive lol so I’m just a really big fan of the carbon arrows for that reason and you can always go with slightly heavier gpi shafts and not so much point weight still achieving the total weight you want especially if you’re wanting around a 500 grain arrow setup 👍🏻
Just got a Galaxy Hybrid Long Bow from Lancaster Archery. Shot it I shot some Gold Tip Classics 400's full length total weight 614 grains. I draw 28.5" the bow is 45# and through the Garmin GPS I was surprised to see it's shooting 163fps. Now I need to tune it for sure. Pouring rain here today and tomorrow. Take care.
Please explain the Garmin GPS, which product are you using? I have a Caldwell chronograph but I see bad readings quite often and lighting is difficult to make it work well...
@@BriarJumper Briar sorry about that it was a Garmin Xero not a GPS. I have a Caldwell as well and it too gives me some headaches. I recently bought a Lab Radar and with the sensor for my rifle it works great. It's just large and chews through batteries like crazy. It's almost useless running it on batteries. Those small Garmin Xero units are pretty slick and for the price they might even be a deal.
Great job! I’m 73 and it’s taken me many years to come to the same conclusion as you stated in this video. I wish you could have had these videos 50 years ago. They would have saved me a lot of trouble!!
After researching on the internet, there seems to be a difference (maybe in Europe verses US?) in how a person's draw length is measured? I always measured at full draw from the string, bottom of the nock throat, to the pivot point over the deepest part of the bow handle. Some evidently measure from the nock throat to the front of the bow shelf. If I measure from the string to the pivot point, that gives me my draw length, then I add a least 2 or more inches to get the minimum total length of the arrow. Best to start longer in the case your spine is too weak so you can cut off a little at a time to match the heavier point weight and arrow spine to the bow and your draw length. It is magical when it all comes together. It seems to me it would be tough for the new archer to tune a bow with the arrow, if they have not established proper form and follow through with their shots.
Yes sir thanks so very much! Adjusting the brace height from the bottom has a greater effect on the string than the top for some reason and most likely it’s because there’s more string below the nock point than above it to twist or untwist on Flemish strings.
Hi Jeff - I’m a compound shooter switching over to recurve. I have a beginner Black Hunter #45lbs my draw length is 261/2”. I have been bare arrow shooting a 500 arrow. It’s been a struggle getting it to shoot straight- First shooting tail left - I added FOC 100gr. Insert and 125gr head. After several tries moving up to this weight. It’s better but a little to the right but if I back down FOC it shoots left again - it’s frustrating. What would be your suggestion to try.
@@goatfarmer8957 only if you’re left handed would that make sense to me but generally a 500 cut 28” with 200-250 will shoot good from a setup like that so it is very puzzling however all arrows behave differently even in the same spine that’s why I typically use Gold Tips because they are much easier for me to get a bare shaft good 👍🏻
Maybe a dumb question but is there a way to measure your draw without a bow? I shot compound bows for years back in high school, but have always wanted to get into trad archery. I just ordered a bow, but I was thinking of going into the local archery shop to make some upgrades once it gets here, it’s and ILF bow, just looking at where to start
Did you have to request from TTT strings to have both nock points adjustable? The one I ordered after watching your channel came with the top one snug, and the bottom one was adjustable. I found a video of them making them and they said the top one is supposed to stay secure. I'd prefer having them both adjustable and be able to nock my arrow between the two
@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998 I was trying to adjust it with a pair of pliers and it wouldn't budge. I'll try it again and see if I can get it loose
@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998 you are right. Took all I had to get it to budge, but I finally got it where I needed it! Thank you! Also, I watched your other videos on how to grip the bow, and it made a tremendous difference in my groups.
@@richardstheman1 he’s got a couple of guys helping him now and I’ve had some come in too tight but even those usually loosen up but you may have to let Trevor know and he’ll probably send you another one 👍🏻
I’m about to get into shooting recurve. I’m gonna start with the spyder xl from 3 rivers. I’m a 30 .5 “ draw and it’s a 64” bow. I’m gonna start out with 35 # limbs. What arrow should I start with to try and get tuned? Thank u
You should be fine with a 600 spine using fairly light point weight especially to get started shooting targets then you can go up to a 500 spine and add heavy inserts and points for hunting, you’ll probably need an Easton Legacy arrow because of your long draw length, they are longer than most which only come 31”
Jeff thanks for all the tips this channel is great! I’ve got a tuning issue going on myself I shoot a 64” long bow at 45 pounds at 28” and am trying to tune a hunting arrow was wandering what spine I should use for a 29.5” draw. I want a 500 plus grain arrow what do ya think?
I’m thinking a 400 spine cut 30.5-31” with 100 grain brass inserts that’ll easily get you there especially if you’re pulling around 48-49# at your draw 👍🏻
Thanks, is there anything wrong with using the small diameter black eagle instinct arrows for a longbow with a cut to center shelf. I heard somewhere that these help with the center shot on those kind of bows?
@@travisholcombe6982 no sir they shoot great just go with one size stiffer spine in them like a 400 because they tend weaker but shoot amazing out of longbows 👍🏻
I'm sorry to bother you brother. But as you said that split, 3 under is different. What if you string walk? I'm a 3 under shooter but I usually draw with my index finger 1/4" below my nock. This gives me a better visual of my arrow. Would I need 5/8 set nock point? And is that 5/8 from shelf height to bottom of top nocking point? And 1 more question. Would you happen to have any 2117 cutoffs laying around that you don't plan on using, I'm makings footers for some arrows that these work great on. I'll pay for them and shipping if you do. Thanks
Now, the way you explained this is not right. Because, when that arrow leaves the string, it will be the same height no matter the draw length. Once that string returns home, and the arrow leaves the string, it’s the same no matter draw length. Now maybe there is another reason for this, but your explanation is not correct.
On a compound that is true but not on a traditional bow, a low nock set will cause ramping and poor flight because the shelf is not dead center of the bow.
For checking arrow length by myself I put a hole in credit card, old one of course 😁 put it on tip of arrow and draw it back to shelf, and if finger sits in the way I check distance of finger with ruler draw card to finger and subtract distance of finger to back of shelf, and it's also a great technique if you have draw weight pull back scale, you draw it back to we're credit card hits finger, gives you accurate draw weight. Jeff you probably new this but if someone was wondering another great way on these variables, maybe this could help🙏
Jeff, i don't think you realize that your videos just don't help everyone of us with Archery, but they help us become closer to our creator. Please don't stop your videos they are truly inspiring in many ways. I think we all hunt to have silent times, to speak to Jesus and if we are blessed with a harvest, well we all know where it came from. Thank you and God Bless!
Years ago I stumbled on a few things that I noticed about shooting traditional bows. If you shoot with a deep hook you can shoot a heavier spined arrow than you can shooting in the first joint of your fingers. One other thing that I found if someone ask you how to shoot instinctive I would tell them start out with some form of gap shooting and after you shoot a lot of arrows you will forget the gap as it will be in your subconscious and you just don't think of it. I said a person can take a fork full of food and hit their mouth every time and they can't even see their mouth? It similar to instinctive shooting. People have told me I shoot fast? I never thought of it but my shot is made before I even pull the string back. I also can listen to a bow being shot and generally tell if it is tuned properly. You are speaking the truth. If a fellow follows your advice he will be on the right track.
Great tips & tutorials. Question: One of my longbows (a 58-inch AMO, 45 pounds reflex-deflex flatbow) is shooting all right but the velcro pad on the shelf is constantly eroding from the outside-initial part of the pad/shelf. So much, so that I changed it a couple of times and even ditched the velcro for a thicker leather shelf pad. Even the leather is getting marked and lightly eroded by the arrows. Why is this happening? Cheers. Thanks for sharing.
Jeff, I have just ordered my first ever ILF riser so this video will be so helpful for setting up my new recurve bow. Your videos are always so informative.
Wish you were around 40 years ago. lol. Thanks for a quality video with great information helping archers no matter how long they have been toxophilites.
I noticed you attach your LimbSaver solid limb broadband dampeners near the riser, and not close as possible to the strings without touching, as the manufacturer recommendeds. Is this the best spot for recurve limbs vs compound? Thanks ✝️
Hoping you can find time to respond, new to archery (recurve at least) I’m trying to find a good starter bow for practice and small game hunting, I’d use like 25-30 lb, anyway any recommendations would be appreciated, already watched a bunch of your videos, it’s been really helpful so I appreciate it
I've been knocking at zero/square, and my arrows seem to fly true. Should I change to a higher nock height and see if they preform better? I'm using floss to nock so perhaps adding twists will raise it as needed. Thanks for the insight and content Jeff! Congrats on a successful hunting season. Hope you had a happy holiday!
I’m using the Hoyt Flemish string that Lancaster has talk about quiet 16 strand and it just feels great. I actually learned a lot about spine weight in this video. The way you explained it just kind of clicked for me. I have 25# limbs and 45# limbs. I’m not ready to go up that weight or I’m not confident that I can. So as of now I’m just working with the 25#. I am finding that weight difficult to figure out arrow spine, most calculators are tuned for hunting and don’t give me clear, accurate numbers. So finding an arrow for such a low weight is hard. I’m using Easton vector 1000s feather fletch, they actually work well but unfortunately I’m afraid they’re too short for my long draw. I’m at close to 29” draw and they make pretty made “novice” arrows for only kids it seems. So I have to go custom. It’s difficult cause obviously I don’t want to injure myself or others, and I don’t want to injure my bow. What spine of arrow for an uncut arrow at 25# draw? As always god bless thank you for sharing your knowledge. It’s priceless truly.
Thank you - I have some Easton Legacy - I’ll try one of those before getting gold tip - just to see if it will change things. I’m guessing it’s the arrow but you start second guessing when you continue with issues lol I wanted to make sure I was in the right thought. Thanks for your videos - I’m always looking forward to new ones. Yes - it is very addictive!!!!!!
Hello, my name is Vince and I have that exact bow from Top Archery with 50lbs limbs. I shoot three fingers under and my brace on this bow is set at 8.5' and I draw just under 27" and this bow will shoot almost any 400-spine arrow with total of150grain tip with factory insert, to 250 grain tip and a factory insert like a Lasor beam. Surprisingly its quieter than my custom bows. It just crazy what performance you get for a $120. I can hit a small leaf at 15yds almost every time and a soda can at 25yrds.90% of the time . This bow will make an average shot into a great shot.
Hi Jeff. I ordered a Sanlida royal x8 recurve 45 lb. I strung it up and the brace height is 5 and 1/2 inches. Did they send the wrong string. String measurement is about 57 inches? Thanks Henry.
@@henrystamper they’re supposed to be 56” you can probably twist it up enough to get it to around 7.5” and you will have to keep twisting it up as it settles 👍🏻
I’m looking to get into traditional archery, hopefully to work my way into hunting and fishing someday. Planning on asking for a beginner’s bow for my birthday. Thank you so much for this video, and for being bold in your faith. ❤
Well with me it would be a bow between 43 and 45# fast enough to hunt with heavier arrows and still smooth enough to shoot a lot without fatigue and every bow is different, like bamboo core limbs draw smoother than maple core at the same poundage and that’s one reason I like ILF bows because I can run lighter limbs for super accurate 3D shooting and slightly heavier limbs for hunting but most importantly it’s the grip for me, it’s gotta fit me perfectly or I will never be satisfied lol, I’ve got several budget bows I’ve worked the grip to my liking and simply respray them with Krylon 1311 Matte and they’re as good as any custom bow out there and some I can just shoot well like they come but I like a slightly narrow grip personally and that’s what I like about Black Widow they’ve got so many grip options plus they’re amazing shooters!
Hey Jeff! I’ve just bought myself a liberty reflex/deflex. I’ve always shot Cedar arrows, but want to switch to carbon. Thanks to your videos. I believe I can set one up properly. What brand would you recommend? I generally only target practice to get ready for hunting season.
@@nileskerley7207 honestly I’d go with something like gold tip warriors or traditional from 3rivers already fletched if you know what spine you’re going to need for sure, if not grab a bare shaft test kit from them first and figure out exactly what spine you need with the point weight you want to run!
@@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998 awesome! I’ll be digging into my catalog shortly lol. Thanks so much for replying back! And thanks for All you do with your channel!
Hey Jeff I was wondering if you could help me out. I’m trying to order a set of custom strings from TTT for my Sanlida Hermit. I was looking on their website and I couldn’t find where it tells you the AMO. I have the 19” riser, website says it measures 60”. Do you happen to know the proper string length to order? Let me know if you can, thank you.
Yes sir Trevor knows exactly what size they need just let him know in the message it’s a Hermit and I do believe they’re 57 1/2” strings he knows for sure 👍🏻
Thanks a lot! You improve my understanding of my bow and how I have think about setting. Tomorow, I will take look on my basic setting. Best regards from France!
Thanks for all your help i have been watching all your videos. I got a bear grizzle 35# with a draw length of 27 1/4 " What do you think about a gold tip 500 traditional arrow with 150# point weight? Where did you buy you arrow lock from on your hunting bow?
when the arrow isnt large enough to take the energy from the bow, it leaves energy behind in the bow which makes all that noise and shock. its not only uncomfortable to shoot but its terrible for the bow. thats why shooting a bow with no arrow is such a terrible thing to do....all the energy goes from the string right back into the bow and breaks it. so, with the laws of energy and conservation of energy, you have to have an arrow sufficient in matter weight to take the energy from the string and keep it from going back into the bow riser. once you acheive that balance, you have a silent and powerful shot thats comfortable and no hand shock etc. a well tuned arrow to bow set up will be the difference between loving shooting and hating it haha and your bow will last so much longer if you get it right
Season is over here so I'm going to replace my string. Going to start at square one again as I'm not 💯 happy with flight. I find black eagle tend weak in general.
@@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998 I'm shooting BE vintage 400 cut to 29.5 . My draw is a fuzz over 28 " pulling 51 (on the Amazon scale) on my Hoyt buffalo. Anything more than 140 gr total up front and it shoots weak. I'm sure everyone from can be better, but I feel its good enough to test. Release is clean. Now my bow does have the x-short limbs and I didn't know if that plays into it.
@@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998 I'm finding that the 5mm legacy trad shafts act a little weaker than the standard carbon legacy shafts. Do you find that to be the case across the board? Smaller dia equals weaker spine?
Great video. I assume you are using the soft side of Velcro strip to quiet the bow? Not sure if you are into stump shooting and if you are it would be interesting to hear your thoughts on it…
@@markmullins7801 not much brother, that’s why I shoot carbon, but generally wood tends weak and are very inconsistent so it is extremely hard to bare shaft them just have to get decent flight and go with it.
We don’t at this time, we sold out the bow building shop in 2022 but I still work from home and am actually working on the new archery shop now hopefully up and going for the public again in late spring and yes sir I’ll have a full website and online ordering for pretty much everything as well as custom arrow builds 👍🏻
I have beaver balls & the limb backing just below the tips. I went a little bit outside the box & found something that's is so custom of a fit it's sick. There's a welding company accessory maker from Europe called Optrel. They make a sweatband that is black & they come in a pair. One pack of these will outfit 2 bows. All u do is take 1 out of the pair & make 2 cuts. The 2 cuts remove the center. Both ends fit your limb bolt area. U simply make a half moon cutout on both of these & they slide up the end of the limb & hold. When I unstring the bow they stay on the limb. Both sides, the top & bottom r covered & they come in black so u can hardly tell they r there. All year I shot 2 ILF recurve sets of limbs & I didn't see any wear. They r made to exact specs so all that is needed is that u cut an accurate half moon. I stealth stripped my ILF riser but I didn't want to add anything to the limbs that was intrusive. I plan to get years of use out of them. So glad u r talking about the ILF Bows. It's like more freedom to play with. Can't wait until 3 Rivers comes out with their new stuff. 😍
Just got my bow.40 pound black hunter .26 1\2 drew So will I be pulling 34 pounds an what arrow I have 400 &500 30 inch the 400 looks to fly best with125 tip.should I start cutting the 500 an try?
Well a 400 is definitely too stiff for anything under 48 pounds or so but having said that, most black hunters and I’ve got a couple are cut way past center which will allow them to shoot a stiffer arrow than normal but even a 500 is borderline unless it’s at least 30” especially with a 125 grain tip, the actual correct spine is a 600 for your poundage but sometimes and quite often they actually come in heavier than labeled so you’re probably good with 500’s and you really need to bare shaft test one to see exactly how much point weight you need for sure and if it’s a longbow not the recurve that’s definitely what I’d recommend for you 👍🏻
Greetings Jeff! Thanks for sharing all your knowledge! I purchased the Cairn bow, ordered your recommended arrows Dark Timber from Big Jim, 600 spine 225 on the front end and they fly great! Can't thank you enough. Great to get back into trad bow. Can't wait til hunting season. God bless
It’s a Bone-A-Fide target, they were at the Tennessee Classic a couple years back and I bought it there, they have adhesive backed target faces in realistic photo quality for them!
Love the content, man. Keep up the great work. I know it's a long shot, but I have a 10 year old one piece laminated long bow, and I need a new string. I was told not to get fats flight, I'm just unsure what sting I need. I love the bow and it shoots great I've just never had the need for a new string until recently. If anyone could help me out I would appreciate it. Thank yall.
Absolutely, what I would do is check the tips to see if they’re built up with phenolic or something really hard if so you can use fast flight Flemish twist and if they’re not you can go with B55 Dacron Flemish twist, if you contact TTT Strings on Facebook Trevor can help you with that no problem, you can send him a picture of the tips and the actual string length 👍🏻
You give an amazing amount of valuable information , thank you ... recently acquired an old Ben Pearson super jet 40# @ 63 " in great condition . No warps or twist , would you treat it the same and if you could do a video on an older all fiberglass bow it would be really great ! Thanks for sharing .
Oh man this video is gold. I'm someone who is coming off the street picking up trad bows and starting fresh. There is soooooo much small detail going into getting these things to perform its crazy!
In all these years, I'd never heard of the reason for the nock position needing to be higher for longer draw lengths. Just thought you have a starting point and you adjust till you get proper arrow flight. Which does work, but it's nice to know the why. I myself seem to always have a knock height of 11/16" to 3/4" at my 29 inch draw. Thanks for all the information you share!
Absolutely my friend and thank you for sharing that I really appreciate it 👍🏻
Hey Jeff. This is Brian Eberhart. I use to do some interior work for ya years back. my mom ( Krisilyn Patton) did some a well. Just found your UA-cam. Absolutely love it. Your the one one who gave me the advice to start shooting 3 under years ago at the car lot. You're definitely my go to for traditional shooting. I'm definitely a fan brother.
Absolutely buddy! I’m glad you’re still shooting after all this time I’ve got a lot of things coming up soon that will hopefully be helpful my friend!
@@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998 looking forward to it brother.
I'm primarily a compound bow shooter. I've been wanting to get a recurve, and after watching your review on sanlida, I took the bait and ordered a 68-inch noble from them via Amazon. Can't wait! I love your approach to archery. Thanks for the great videos👍
@@zen_of_I Cool deal brother! You’ll have some fun with it for sure!
@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998 Well that bow showed up today. Putting the string on gave me anxiety, even with the provided stringer 😆. I've never strung a bow before. It was kinda like reloading for the first time. That first trigger pull, my face might have been just a bit further from the rifle than normal😏. Only took one fling of an arrow, though, and I'm digging it! Still love my V3X, but now it's going to have to share time with this Noble recurve. That recurve truly is a joy to shoot. You're a horrible influence, just horrible😉🤣, so thank you!
@@zen_of_I 🤣😁👍🏻
Jeff, you didn’t help me a little bit you helped me a lot! Just got back into 3-D just found your channel a few days ago and I wanna let you know that I really appreciate all your videos and this one in particular because I’m getting ready to purchase a 60 inch recurvethank you
Jeffrey, your awesome man, just a plethora of information 👏
Thank you so much!
This video will be very useful for me..hopeful I’ll be ordering my Black widow PSA soon 😊
Great video Jeff, probably the best on explaining on how to set up !!! Thanks man!!!! 🙏
I really appreciate that! God Bless!
i really want to get a long bow just for a light draw weight and shooting targets all day. like a 30lbs long bow and 1 thousand arrows thrown on the weekend. might sound insane to some but i want that bow i can shoot all day long while being super comfortable and easy to shoot. great for working on form and technique without wearing out the back haha. its also great for allowing others to shoot your bow with you and them being able to handle it and have fun too. its a great bow to have for the whole family or for shooting all day like i said earlier
Two enthusiastic thumbs up!
Thanks so much!
Jeff, thank you for all you do for the trad community, it is much appreciated. I would love to hear your thoughts on tunning wood arrows. I have been coming to some conclusions (maybe that is too strong of a word) at least some theories of late and would love to hear your thoughts.
Here is my current thinking. Wood arrows (also high GPI carbons) get their mass along the entire length of the arrow. Unless you want a very heavy arrow tip weights tip weights are usually lower. Also, I have found that heavier tip weights cause nock high issues. Which in my mind is due to wood not having the same dynamic recovery that carbon has. All this leads to an arrow that at hunting weight (500-600 grains) will have a low FOC.
It would seem that PO cedar would be best as it is light allowing more tip weight and higher FOC’s. However, I have found tuning (nock high issues) with PO and heavy tips. It seems dynamic recovery plays a role here.
Have you dealt with wood and have any thoughts on this?
Well I’ve definitely had some issues with PO Cedar shafts and some others as far as tuning and its really tough especially because even if you manage to get one shaft straight or as straight as possible it simply won’t stay that way just from weather changes and shooting alone and they’re very inconsistent in general compared to carbon because they’re natural wood and just somehow affected by humidity so it’s definitely tough but fun and relatively expensive lol so I’m just a really big fan of the carbon arrows for that reason and you can always go with slightly heavier gpi shafts and not so much point weight still achieving the total weight you want especially if you’re wanting around a 500 grain arrow setup 👍🏻
Just got a Galaxy Hybrid Long Bow from Lancaster Archery. Shot it I shot some Gold Tip Classics 400's full length total weight 614 grains. I draw 28.5" the bow is 45# and through the Garmin GPS I was surprised to see it's shooting 163fps. Now I need to tune it for sure. Pouring rain here today and tomorrow. Take care.
Please explain the Garmin GPS, which product are you using? I have a Caldwell chronograph but I see bad readings quite often and lighting is difficult to make it work well...
@@BriarJumper Briar sorry about that it was a Garmin Xero not a GPS. I have a Caldwell as well and it too gives me some headaches. I recently bought a Lab Radar and with the sensor for my rifle it works great. It's just large and chews through batteries like crazy. It's almost useless running it on batteries. Those small Garmin Xero units are pretty slick and for the price they might even be a deal.
Great job! I’m 73 and it’s taken me many years to come to the same conclusion as you stated in this video. I wish you could have had these videos 50 years ago. They would have saved me a lot of trouble!!
Thank you sir!
Thanks Jeff!
After researching on the internet, there seems to be a difference (maybe in Europe verses US?) in how a person's draw length is measured? I always measured at full draw from the string, bottom of the nock throat, to the pivot point over the deepest part of the bow handle. Some evidently measure from the nock throat to the front of the bow shelf. If I measure from the string to the pivot point, that gives me my draw length, then I add a least 2 or more inches to get the minimum total length of the arrow. Best to start longer in the case your spine is too weak so you can cut off a little at a time to match the heavier point weight and arrow spine to the bow and your draw length. It is magical when it all comes together. It seems to me it would be tough for the new archer to tune a bow with the arrow, if they have not established proper form and follow through with their shots.
Thanks Jeff
You’re very welcome my friend!
This channel has helped me more than any other, i have one question: why adjust the string from the bottom limb?
Thanks again from Denmark!
Yes sir thanks so very much! Adjusting the brace height from the bottom has a greater effect on the string than the top for some reason and most likely it’s because there’s more string below the nock point than above it to twist or untwist on Flemish strings.
Thank you Jeff!
Hey Jeff do you always keep your bows strung?
I have a 45# in 54 inch @ 28” , does that mean I’ll need a 71/4 brace height and 11/16 nock set with a 500 gran @ 30” arrow ?
Jeff, you mention using velcro for limb silencing material. Why not use mole skin?
Hi Jeff - I’m a compound shooter switching over to recurve. I have a beginner Black Hunter #45lbs my draw length is 261/2”. I have been bare arrow shooting a 500 arrow. It’s been a struggle getting it to shoot straight- First shooting tail left - I added FOC 100gr. Insert and 125gr head. After several tries moving up to this weight. It’s better but a little to the right but if I back down FOC it shoots left again - it’s frustrating. What would be your suggestion to try.
@@goatfarmer8957 only if you’re left handed would that make sense to me but generally a 500 cut 28” with 200-250 will shoot good from a setup like that so it is very puzzling however all arrows behave differently even in the same spine that’s why I typically use Gold Tips because they are much easier for me to get a bare shaft good 👍🏻
Maybe a dumb question but is there a way to measure your draw without a bow? I shot compound bows for years back in high school, but have always wanted to get into trad archery. I just ordered a bow, but I was thinking of going into the local archery shop to make some upgrades once it gets here, it’s and ILF bow, just looking at where to start
Honestly not that I know of, you really need to draw one in an actual shooting position to get your true draw length.
Hi Jeff , a question, what is the Tiller by 3under ? Thank you for the answer
Did you have to request from TTT strings to have both nock points adjustable? The one I ordered after watching your channel came with the top one snug, and the bottom one was adjustable. I found a video of them making them and they said the top one is supposed to stay secure. I'd prefer having them both adjustable and be able to nock my arrow between the two
They’re both adjustable sometimes they just need a little more pressure to get them moving up or down the serving but definitely adjustable 👍🏻
@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998 I was trying to adjust it with a pair of pliers and it wouldn't budge. I'll try it again and see if I can get it loose
@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998 you are right. Took all I had to get it to budge, but I finally got it where I needed it! Thank you! Also, I watched your other videos on how to grip the bow, and it made a tremendous difference in my groups.
@@richardstheman1 he’s got a couple of guys helping him now and I’ve had some come in too tight but even those usually loosen up but you may have to let Trevor know and he’ll probably send you another one 👍🏻
Which gold tips do you go with?
@@worldtraveler8372 warriors are my pick!
I’m about to get into shooting recurve. I’m gonna start with the spyder xl from 3 rivers. I’m a 30 .5 “ draw and it’s a 64” bow. I’m gonna start out with 35 # limbs. What arrow should I start with to try and get tuned? Thank u
You should be fine with a 600 spine using fairly light point weight especially to get started shooting targets then you can go up to a 500 spine and add heavy inserts and points for hunting, you’ll probably need an Easton Legacy arrow because of your long draw length, they are longer than most which only come 31”
Thank you. I will try it out. Glad I found your videos!
Jeff thanks for all the tips this channel is great! I’ve got a tuning issue going on myself I shoot a 64” long bow at 45 pounds at 28” and am trying to tune a hunting arrow was wandering what spine I should use for a 29.5” draw. I want a 500 plus grain arrow what do ya think?
I’m thinking a 400 spine cut 30.5-31” with 100 grain brass inserts that’ll easily get you there especially if you’re pulling around 48-49# at your draw 👍🏻
Thanks, is there anything wrong with using the small diameter black eagle instinct arrows for a longbow with a cut to center shelf. I heard somewhere that these help with the center shot on those kind of bows?
@@travisholcombe6982 no sir they shoot great just go with one size stiffer spine in them like a 400 because they tend weaker but shoot amazing out of longbows 👍🏻
My arrows are cut to 27"too.
I'm sorry to bother you brother. But as you said that split, 3 under is different. What if you string walk? I'm a 3 under shooter but I usually draw with my index finger 1/4" below my nock. This gives me a better visual of my arrow. Would I need 5/8 set nock point? And is that 5/8 from shelf height to bottom of top nocking point?
And 1 more question. Would you happen to have any 2117 cutoffs laying around that you don't plan on using, I'm makings footers for some arrows that these work great on. I'll pay for them and shipping if you do. Thanks
D
I do not like the shooting ,wounding animals in sneaky way out of a tree stand
Now, the way you explained this is not right. Because, when that arrow leaves the string, it will be the same height no matter the draw length. Once that string returns home, and the arrow leaves the string, it’s the same no matter draw length. Now maybe there is another reason for this, but your explanation is not correct.
On a compound that is true but not on a traditional bow, a low nock set will cause ramping and poor flight because the shelf is not dead center of the bow.
For checking arrow length by myself I put a hole in credit card, old one of course 😁 put it on tip of arrow and draw it back to shelf, and if finger sits in the way I check distance of finger with ruler draw card to finger and subtract distance of finger to back of shelf, and it's also a great technique if you have draw weight pull back scale, you draw it back to we're credit card hits finger, gives you accurate draw weight. Jeff you probably new this but if someone was wondering another great way on these variables, maybe this could help🙏
Man that’s an interesting idea! 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Good idea!
.....or clip a clothes pin onto arrow.
same principle
Jeff, i don't think you realize that your videos just don't help everyone of us with Archery, but they help us become closer to our creator. Please don't stop your videos they are truly inspiring in many ways. I think we all hunt to have silent times, to speak to Jesus and if we are blessed with a harvest, well we all know where it came from. Thank you and God Bless!
Thank you brother I really appreciate that!
That last hunting bow is sweet ! The color and grain in it are very cool..
Lots of good tips. I appreciate it.
Good info Jeff, thanks for sharing.
Years ago I stumbled on a few things that I noticed about shooting traditional bows. If you shoot with a deep hook you can shoot a heavier spined arrow than you can shooting in the first joint of your fingers. One other thing that I found if someone ask you how to shoot instinctive I would tell them start out with some form of gap shooting and after you shoot a lot of arrows you will forget the gap as it will be in your subconscious and you just don't think of it. I said a person can take a fork full of food and hit their mouth every time and they can't even see their mouth? It similar to instinctive shooting. People have told me I shoot fast? I never thought of it but my shot is made before I even pull the string back. I also can listen to a bow being shot and generally tell if it is tuned properly. You are speaking the truth. If a fellow follows your advice he will be on the right track.
Great tips & tutorials. Question: One of my longbows (a 58-inch AMO, 45 pounds reflex-deflex flatbow) is shooting all right but the velcro pad on the shelf is constantly eroding from the outside-initial part of the pad/shelf. So much, so that I changed it a couple of times and even ditched the velcro for a thicker leather shelf pad. Even the leather is getting marked and lightly eroded by the arrows. Why is this happening? Cheers. Thanks for sharing.
Excellent video as always, thanks for sharing!
Thanks!
Jeff, I have just ordered my first ever ILF riser so this video will be so helpful for setting up my new recurve bow. Your videos are always so informative.
Wish you were around 40 years ago. lol. Thanks for a quality video with great information helping archers no matter how long they have been toxophilites.
Excellent information! Jeff, thanks for sharing!
Hey Jeff, what is the reason to adjust brace height fro. the bottom and not the top?
I noticed you attach your LimbSaver solid limb broadband dampeners near the riser, and not close as possible to the strings without touching, as the manufacturer recommendeds. Is this the best spot for recurve limbs vs compound? Thanks ✝️
Hoping you can find time to respond, new to archery (recurve at least) I’m trying to find a good starter bow for practice and small game hunting, I’d use like 25-30 lb, anyway any recommendations would be appreciated, already watched a bunch of your videos, it’s been really helpful so I appreciate it
Is the 5/8' upper knock knot rule true for compound bows and longbows as well as recurves?
I've been knocking at zero/square, and my arrows seem to fly true. Should I change to a higher nock height and see if they preform better? I'm using floss to nock so perhaps adding twists will raise it as needed. Thanks for the insight and content Jeff! Congrats on a successful hunting season. Hope you had a happy holiday!
Yes sir It is always a good idea to at least test one bare shaft just so you’ll have it leaving the bow as clean as possible 👍🏻
Excellent info - bow shoots like a dream now - thank you
Another option besides velcro, is stealth strips, they worked perfect on my ilf bow.
Yes they do work great!
I’m using the Hoyt Flemish string that Lancaster has talk about quiet 16 strand and it just feels great. I actually learned a lot about spine weight in this video. The way you explained it just kind of clicked for me. I have 25# limbs and 45# limbs. I’m not ready to go up that weight or I’m not confident that I can. So as of now I’m just working with the 25#.
I am finding that weight difficult to figure out arrow spine, most calculators are tuned for hunting and don’t give me clear, accurate numbers. So finding an arrow for such a low weight is hard. I’m using Easton vector 1000s feather fletch, they actually work well but unfortunately I’m afraid they’re too short for my long draw. I’m at close to 29” draw and they make pretty made “novice” arrows for only kids it seems. So I have to go custom. It’s difficult cause obviously I don’t want to injure myself or others, and I don’t want to injure my bow. What spine of arrow for an uncut arrow at 25# draw?
As always god bless thank you for sharing your knowledge. It’s priceless truly.
If you’re going to run a full length arrow with at least 150 grains on front you can probably even go with 700’s.
What brand is your hunting bow
Great info - thanks. Just subscribed
@@colinremmer2417 thanks brother! 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Thank you - I have some Easton Legacy - I’ll try one of those before getting gold tip - just to see if it will change things. I’m guessing it’s the arrow but you start second guessing when you continue with issues lol I wanted to make sure I was in the right thought. Thanks for your videos - I’m always looking forward to new ones. Yes - it is very addictive!!!!!!
@@goatfarmer8957 yes sir thank you!!!!
Hello, my name is Vince and I have that exact bow from Top Archery with 50lbs limbs.
I shoot three fingers under and my brace on this bow is set at 8.5' and I draw just under 27" and this bow will shoot almost any 400-spine arrow with total of150grain tip with factory insert, to 250 grain tip and a factory insert like a Lasor beam. Surprisingly its quieter than my custom bows. It just crazy what performance you get for a $120. I can hit a small leaf at 15yds almost every time and a soda can at 25yrds.90% of the time . This bow will make an average shot into a great shot.
I love mine! It’s awesome and really cheap lol
Hi Jeff. I ordered a Sanlida royal x8 recurve 45 lb. I strung it up and the brace height is 5 and 1/2 inches. Did they send the wrong string. String measurement is about 57 inches?
Thanks Henry.
@@henrystamper they’re supposed to be 56” you can probably twist it up enough to get it to around 7.5” and you will have to keep twisting it up as it settles 👍🏻
Just to be sure - are you going 5/8" from the shelf, or from the top of the nock squared and resting on the shelf? TY
@@stevefaculakiii55 resting the square on the shelf 👍🏻
I’m looking to get into traditional archery, hopefully to work my way into hunting and fishing someday.
Planning on asking for a beginner’s bow for my birthday.
Thank you so much for this video, and for being bold in your faith. ❤
What kind of tape you use for your handle bow
It’s Wilson comfort wrap from Walmart 👍🏻
Jeff, if you could only have 1 recurve bow to do everything, what poundage would you choose and why?
Well with me it would be a bow between 43 and 45# fast enough to hunt with heavier arrows and still smooth enough to shoot a lot without fatigue and every bow is different, like bamboo core limbs draw smoother than maple core at the same poundage and that’s one reason I like ILF bows because I can run lighter limbs for super accurate 3D shooting and slightly heavier limbs for hunting but most importantly it’s the grip for me, it’s gotta fit me perfectly or I will never be satisfied lol, I’ve got several budget bows I’ve worked the grip to my liking and simply respray them with Krylon 1311 Matte and they’re as good as any custom bow out there and some I can just shoot well like they come but I like a slightly narrow grip personally and that’s what I like about Black Widow they’ve got so many grip options plus they’re amazing shooters!
Great question !
Even better answer.@@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998
Hey Jeff! I’ve just bought myself a liberty reflex/deflex. I’ve always shot Cedar arrows, but want to switch to carbon. Thanks to your videos. I believe I can set one up properly. What brand would you recommend? I generally only target practice to get ready for hunting season.
@@nileskerley7207 honestly I’d go with something like gold tip warriors or traditional from 3rivers already fletched if you know what spine you’re going to need for sure, if not grab a bare shaft test kit from them first and figure out exactly what spine you need with the point weight you want to run!
@@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998 awesome! I’ll be digging into my catalog shortly lol. Thanks so much for replying back! And thanks for All you do with your channel!
Hey Jeff I was wondering if you could help me out. I’m trying to order a set of custom strings from TTT for my Sanlida Hermit. I was looking on their website and I couldn’t find where it tells you the AMO. I have the 19” riser, website says it measures 60”. Do you happen to know the proper string length to order? Let me know if you can, thank you.
Yes sir Trevor knows exactly what size they need just let him know in the message it’s a Hermit and I do believe they’re 57 1/2” strings he knows for sure 👍🏻
Thank you sir! Keep pumping out the awesome content. Good luck in the woods this year!
Thanks a lot! You improve my understanding of my bow and how I have think about setting. Tomorow, I will take look on my basic setting. Best regards from France!
Thanks for all your help i have been watching all your videos. I got a bear grizzle 35# with a draw length of 27 1/4 " What do you think about a gold tip 500 traditional arrow with 150# point weight? Where did you buy you arrow lock from on your hunting bow?
Great video Jeff 😊
Thanks!
when the arrow isnt large enough to take the energy from the bow, it leaves energy behind in the bow which makes all that noise and shock. its not only uncomfortable to shoot but its terrible for the bow. thats why shooting a bow with no arrow is such a terrible thing to do....all the energy goes from the string right back into the bow and breaks it. so, with the laws of energy and conservation of energy, you have to have an arrow sufficient in matter weight to take the energy from the string and keep it from going back into the bow riser. once you acheive that balance, you have a silent and powerful shot thats comfortable and no hand shock etc. a well tuned arrow to bow set up will be the difference between loving shooting and hating it haha and your bow will last so much longer if you get it right
Season is over here so I'm going to replace my string.
Going to start at square one again as I'm not 💯 happy with flight. I find black eagle tend weak in general.
Especially the Instinct arrows, they really do and probably because they’re so small diameter.
@@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998 I'm shooting BE vintage 400 cut to 29.5 . My draw is a fuzz over 28 " pulling 51 (on the Amazon scale) on my Hoyt buffalo. Anything more than 140 gr total up front and it shoots weak.
I'm sure everyone from can be better, but I feel its good enough to test. Release is clean.
Now my bow does have the x-short limbs and I didn't know if that plays into it.
@@instinctiveaddictionarcher8998 I'm finding that the 5mm legacy trad shafts act a little weaker than the standard carbon legacy shafts. Do you find that to be the case across the board? Smaller dia equals weaker spine?
@@caseyk6625 yes and it’s even worse with.166 micro arrows, that’s why my Air Strikes are 400’s and 340’s
Hey guys and gals, please don't you all run out now to get an 62" Black ILF Top archery bow. You will drive the price up !!LOL
i love that string and the matching yellow knocks. it looks awesome on that black TA bow! the black and yellow looks great together
Great video. I assume you are using the soft side of Velcro strip to quiet the bow? Not sure if you are into stump shooting and if you are it would be interesting to hear your thoughts on it…
Where can I find a list of traditional 3-D shoots in Alabama. Thanks for all you do for the traditional hunters. God bless
Thanks Jeff!
Yes sir 👍🏻
I just got into a recurve a month ago im pulling 27 inch draw im worried about getting good penetration on deer
Hey Jeff, im trying to bare shaft wood arrows and having a hard time. Any help on yhat?
@@markmullins7801 not much brother, that’s why I shoot carbon, but generally wood tends weak and are very inconsistent so it is extremely hard to bare shaft them just have to get decent flight and go with it.
Thank you. I guess carbon it is. Love your videos.
Do you have a shop, web page?
We don’t at this time, we sold out the bow building shop in 2022 but I still work from home and am actually working on the new archery shop now hopefully up and going for the public again in late spring and yes sir I’ll have a full website and online ordering for pretty much everything as well as custom arrow builds 👍🏻
I wish I had this video 10 years ago! Wonderful video.
I have beaver balls & the limb backing just below the tips. I went a little bit outside the box & found something that's is so custom of a fit it's sick. There's a welding company accessory maker from Europe called Optrel. They make a sweatband that is black & they come in a pair. One pack of these will outfit 2 bows. All u do is take 1 out of the pair & make 2 cuts. The 2 cuts remove the center. Both ends fit your limb bolt area. U simply make a half moon cutout on both of these & they slide up the end of the limb & hold. When I unstring the bow they stay on the limb. Both sides, the top & bottom r covered & they come in black so u can hardly tell they r there. All year I shot 2 ILF recurve sets of limbs & I didn't see any wear. They r made to exact specs so all that is needed is that u cut an accurate half moon. I stealth stripped my ILF riser but I didn't want to add anything to the limbs that was intrusive. I plan to get years of use out of them. So glad u r talking about the ILF Bows. It's like more freedom to play with. Can't wait until 3 Rivers comes out with their new stuff. 😍
Wow! That sounds like a good way there for sure! I really appreciate that!
Thank you very much for your valuable and keen insight and information.
@@karate357 yes sir thank you so much!
Thank you so much
Just got my bow.40 pound black hunter .26 1\2 drew So will I be pulling 34 pounds an what arrow I have 400 &500 30 inch the 400 looks to fly best with125 tip.should I start cutting the 500 an try?
Well a 400 is definitely too stiff for anything under 48 pounds or so but having said that, most black hunters and I’ve got a couple are cut way past center which will allow them to shoot a stiffer arrow than normal but even a 500 is borderline unless it’s at least 30” especially with a 125 grain tip, the actual correct spine is a 600 for your poundage but sometimes and quite often they actually come in heavier than labeled so you’re probably good with 500’s and you really need to bare shaft test one to see exactly how much point weight you need for sure and if it’s a longbow not the recurve that’s definitely what I’d recommend for you 👍🏻
Greetings Jeff! Thanks for sharing all your knowledge! I purchased the Cairn bow, ordered your recommended arrows Dark Timber from Big Jim, 600 spine 225 on the front end and they fly great! Can't thank you enough. Great to get back into trad bow. Can't wait til hunting season. God bless
Awesome brother that’s great! Now the fun begins 😁
Jeff, where did you get the big broadhead foam in your yard?
It’s a Bone-A-Fide target, they were at the Tennessee Classic a couple years back and I bought it there, they have adhesive backed target faces in realistic photo quality for them!
Love the content, man. Keep up the great work. I know it's a long shot, but I have a 10 year old one piece laminated long bow, and I need a new string. I was told not to get fats flight, I'm just unsure what sting I need. I love the bow and it shoots great I've just never had the need for a new string until recently. If anyone could help me out I would appreciate it. Thank yall.
Absolutely, what I would do is check the tips to see if they’re built up with phenolic or something really hard if so you can use fast flight Flemish twist and if they’re not you can go with B55 Dacron Flemish twist, if you contact TTT Strings on Facebook Trevor can help you with that no problem, you can send him a picture of the tips and the actual string length 👍🏻
Awesome, thank you sir
Good stuff...that was helpful.
Thanks!
Another great video! Keep up the good work. Love them out here in oregon.
Yes sir thanks from Alabama!
You give an amazing amount of valuable information , thank you ... recently acquired an old Ben Pearson super jet 40# @ 63 " in great condition . No warps or twist , would you treat it the same and if you could do a video on an older all fiberglass bow it would be really great ! Thanks for sharing .