@@SwedeProof a good pun is always my pleasure my dear friend. Also side note you guys make amazing wood splitters very handy for Aussie long Easter holidays camping.
@sir pinpoint : Yeah, but my comment was saying that Rufus Tranquilus did nothing to Octavian or Antony to warrant them killing him, not that Rufus was a good or innocent man in general. Most people abhor the notion of slavery now, but back in Roman society, as you know, people owing and/or abusing slaves was as common breathing. Thus, Rufus profiting off slave labor wouldn't have been seen as uncommon or amoral among most back.
During the time of Sulla's proscriptions, a man went and saw his name on one of the lists. He cried out, 'My villa has killed me!' He knew he hadn't done or said anything that would get him in trouble with Sulla. Unfortunately, Sulla needed money for the treasury and the man happened to own some valuable lands. In peaceful times it's wonderful to be rich. In times of revolution or civil war it can be the cause of your death.
Maybe if he had premptively made a large sizeable donation to Sulla and retired to some far flung corner with a modest retirement lumpsum then he could have kept his life.
Sulla is misunderstood a lot. By all accounts Marius was the bloodlusting Monster Sulla is often described but Marius did not publish any lists. Sulla as clean and precise like with everything else published every name and most were part of Marius crimes in some way. Sulla was very important for Rome to get back to Stability and control of the empire
@@listrahtes I see Sulla and Marius as two sides of the same coin. I don't see either one as the 'good' or 'bad' one. They were both exceptional generals who were quite willing to murder their political enemies when it suited them. Honestly, if Marius had been younger and won the war I could see him doing roughly the same things Sulla did, just on behalf of the Populare. Though maybe he would have kept having himself elected Consul rather than Dictator.
@@nelsonchereta816 Pretty much this. Thucydides talks at length about how revolution and political strife gripped the Greek polities during the Peloponnesian War, and he mentions how cities would frequently switch from Athenian allied democracies to Spartan allied oligarchies and then back to democracies. Cities often changing their allegiances and political structures multiple times. And each time the political order in a city state flipped, it would be followed by purges, proscriptions, and mass bloodshed. The democrats would come in, and violently purge their city of the oligarchists. The oligarchists, vengeful would conspire, overthrow the democracy, and then commence a violent purge of the democrats. And on and on and on this would go. Rome during the late Republic was much the same. Marius came into power, violently purged the Optimates, only to be overthrown by Sulla, who came in and violently purged the Populares, only to be overthrown by Marius, who violently purged the Optimates, only to be overthrown again by Sulla, who violently purged the Populares. Political violence and terror was not unique to any one political party in Rome. Rather it was a very common arsenal in the toolbox of political ploys that each party used to get the leg up. And frankly, this is a story we see repeated time and time again throughout history. In the Islamic Caliphate, the Umayyads used terror to solidify their rule against the Alids, only to themselves become the victims of terror perpetrated by the Abbasids. In China, the various Court Factions of the Imperial Court such as the eunuchs, generals and royal family frequently took turns employing terror against one another to cement their control over the Court. The Wars of Religion saw Catholics and Protestants frequently purge and massacre one another to establish dominance. The French Revolution is probably one of the most well known examples with Jacobin-led Revolutionary Terror and Bourbon-led Counter-Revolutionary Terror being employed.
Best part of this scene: how casually Atia explains why she wants Tranquillus dead, as if it were a small annoyance to be taken care of. Polly Walker really stole just about every scene she was in during the show's run.
Yeah, she is great. The scene seems to illustrate what a trivial regard the Roman upper class had for the lives of others. It is almost like they weren’t people, but rather pieces on a chess board to them, and/or an inch they needed to scratch. There were probably a lot of people on that list who deserved to be killed, but also some who didn’t. Casualties of politics and the ambitions on men.
In real life this incident played out differently. There were some men they all agreed should be killed but each member of the triumvirate had to make a concession to be proscribed. Antony had to give up his uncle. Octavian had to give up Cicero. Getting octavian to give up Cicero was the hardest part of the meeting but he did so to appease lepidus and antony.
Octavius argued long and hard for Cicero's life. After he was sole ruler of Rome, he looked after Cicero's son and even made him consul; in that role Cicero the younger gained some revenge for his father's murder, by proclaiming the defeat of Mark Antony in the senate after the battle of Actium.
So basically HBO does Octavius dirty by making him be the one to propose killing Cicero while Antony is left to agree, when in real life it was the other way around.
@@Taiko-THC349 givers happy takers happy... its not hard to satisfy a spoiled rich girl if you got the money. Especially the ones that dont need to use their brain to survive tends to be the easiest to manipulate
I love the little moments that Octavian has after he first hands over the list. You can see he is steeling himself for the hard, cruel road ahead. The Octavian of later episodes would have no hesitation, but this is his Start of Darkness
He did not said that like a villain, more like sociopat he is. Brief pause to suggest remorse which he felt, then back on trail to climb on that last step of the zikkurat.
@@jantekjantek it's been suggested that Octavian/Augustus was an aspie (aspergers) and that seems to have been how the series played him. Aspies are often intelligent, single-minded and without squeamishness, but for reasons that support their goals. Sociopaths (and psychopaths) do bad things on impulse, often because they don't have a sense of 'why no'..
@@davebox588 Thats possible, heard that. Its funny tho how some slight deviations lead someone who follows textbooks to say you have a disorder. I really liked how the actor portrayed Octavian, the series hits some serious bullseyes with whole "rome" aspect. edit: my point about aspergers was that diagnose someone 2000 years after his deaths with aspergers according to modern "social behavior" can not be conclusive. You can't know it, it will forever be hypothesis.
@@jantekjantek yes, of course we can't know. That's why I said "it's been suggested". The comment was that he was a sociopath. That doesn't seem likely for the creator of the Pax Romana, though possible for plenty of other emperors, particularly Caligula. But of course the modern study of history is multi-disciplinary and pulls together information from study whose relevance wouldn't have occured to us even twenty years ago. Psychiatry is maybe one of them?
@@jantekjantek I agree it was obvious he doesnt want to do it but if his plans were leak to brutus then chances are he and Anthony might lose the battle.
Antony's armor has a medal with the picture of Alexander III, the great, dressed in his favorite Hercules lion cap. He was one of the last people to see his tomb when Cleopatra took him there to boast about her ancestral line. I think that it was Octavian who moved the tomb into an unknown place.
@@user-sc5iv2rp2t The Ptolemys were not descended from Alexander. All of Alexander's offspring and relatives were murdered during the Wars of the Diadochi. At most, he had a few cousins, one of which was notably Phyrrus of Epirus.
When Octavian entered Alexandria he asked to see the tomb of Alexander the great when he opened Alexander the great sarcophagus octavian laid on Alexander’s head the crown of flowers but accidentally broke the corpse’s nose in the process. When Octavian was asked if he wanted to see the mausoleum of the Ptolemies He replied “I came to see a king not a row of corpses.” I don’t think Octavian would have moved the sarcophagus for fear of angering the Alexandrians. As of today it has yet to be discovered
This show was so good, not since "I Claudius ' back in the 70's had there been such a great TV show about Rome. Unfortunately, I don't expect to get another 30 years to wait for the next. Vivamus, Moriendum Est
only thing bothers me in this series is Lepidus. They portrayed him as a fucking idiot. like a pawn. he was just as influenced as Mark Antony in real life if not more
@@stephencronin1080 yeah I know show was abruptly cancelled and all but they had time to portray him as an idiot so I think they had enough time to portray him as he was. Or at least something close to. Cleopatra also had little screen time but they nailed the character.
@@davidwalsh6608 If by retire quietly you mean have all of his legions defect to Octavian, who then stripped him of his powers except in name only, had his son killed, (who had been caught up in an assassination plot on Octavian) was essentially put into house arrest until he died save for when Octavian needed him in person at the Senate.
Aww nice reference but you're a bit late. "Tribune Aquila" died in Mutina, the very battle in which Octavian "defeated" Antony, just a few weeks before this scene.
Ahmage Bishoor cool looking armor and melee weapons* granted you can still hit someone with a bat or something, but I’d prefer to just shoot them. (In self defense of course)
@@ahmagebishoor7675 I mean the Ancient Greeks used layers of linen stitched together to make a tough padded armour (Linothorax; Greek, Loricae Linteae; Latin) which is actually surprisingly effective at stopping arrows and having them bounce off, unlike leather armour which would embed them in it and probably allow them to push through to the skin beneath before stopping. Hollywood always thinks leather armour looks cool, thus all battles whether ancient or fantasy would use them. It's not that much of a stretch that today's bulletproof vests use methods that the Ancients would find remarkably similar to their times.
If you're not willing to carry out the necessary means, then you never sufficiently desired the ends in the first place. Very Nitzechien. (I think I spelled his name right. Someone correct me if I didn't. Thnx. )
Octavian sending his best subordinates out with a 'special' mission-his genius general Agrippa with specific details to be given to Vorenus and Pullo in dealing with Cicero shows Octavian does NOT want this special assassination potentially botched. Seemed he wanted to at least give Cicero a somewhat noble death at the hands of experts and not simply getting hacked to death by street urchins.
Irl thats basically what octavian said during this meeting. Each man was forced to give up someone they cared about to appease the other two. Antony was made to give up his uncle. Octavian fought for Cicero but eventually he gave in to pressure from antony and lepidus in order to preserve the triumvirate
Lepidus "... General Antony, tell them!" Antony "Do you feel like in charge?" Lepidus "Well ... Im lending a bit of weight to your course ... I have friends in the senate ..." Antony "And that gives you power over me?" Lepidus "........................ Im off to Africa then, see ya around folks" Octavian " I think not ... I like Africa ..." Lepidus " Alright then ... do you know why im not very well known in the 21st century?" Octavian " .... No ..." Lepidus " 'cause this is my historical exit, farewell fellas"
Imperator caesar augustus divi filius, primus inter pares, princeps civitatis, princeps senatus, princeps, pater patriae en mi opiníon el además claudio, trajano y marco aurelio son sin lugar a dudas los mejores gobernantes de roma no por nada a trajano le dieron el título de optimus princeps.
@@Xeper-I-Set Atia is the mother of Augustus. So yes, she's a real historical figure. What we see in the show is what is known as a Fictional Version of a Historical Figure. And I wasn't trying to make an argument, I was merely pointing out a fact; Historically, Atia never saw her son become the First Emperor of Rome.
@@Xeper-I-Set Well if you want to be vindictive and take it as an argument, go right ahead. You can't read tone in text! You have no idea what I meant, so people can just make up your own meaning. I was only saying that Atia was Dead by this time.. Its also known as a "fun fact." Shame on me for not clarifying for trolls... 🙄
What the heck is this Atia doing there in the first place? Romans, macho as they were did not want women in the millitairy command tent ( it became the downfall of Marcus Antonius at Actium with Cleopatra bossing around) and Atia in all accounts is mentioned to have avoided political life as much as possible, not only for herself but also for her son Gaius Octavius. After the death of her husband Gaius Octavious she married the Epicurean and fence sitter Lucius Marcius Philippus. There was however a matrone mingling frequent in politics and that was the wife of Marcus Antonius himself, the granddaughter of Gaius Gracchus, named Fulvia and mother of Octavian's first wife Claudia.
@@MikeFromPA That is an unbelievably simple and stupid analysis. Augustus and Julius Caesar were both populists who were trying to make better the lives of the Roman citizens. They were despised by the ruling classes and the rich and loved by the armies and common people. This sounds like exactly like what us Nationalists want. Global elites killing our ways of life for personal profit is exactly what these two would have fought against. Thinking that being "progressive" means the same thing throughout all of history is retarded. Our idea of being "progressive" today is sick and twisted.
Augustus became the richest man in history because of this. Fun fact: the roman empire under augustus was the ideological foundation for Italian fascism. Named such for the bundle of sticks (fasci) the Roman consul would wield to signify they were in power that day. So you're saying a fascist dictator should kill any and all political rivals and confiscate their wealth for the state and use that to lower taxes and give the people the equivalent to 3yrs wages in order to buy their love. You consolidate power and become ultimate ruler over your new nation. The people have zero say in their governance but let's be honest by that point it was so corrupt they didn't have power anyway
The leather noises are giving me life.
devildog1982z So edgy. 🙄
One could say it gives you pleather 🤣🤣🤣
So you say you are making leather noises of your own! 😆
@@TheMelbournelad Hilarious! Abso-fuckin'-lutely hilarious!
🤣🤣🤣
@@SwedeProof a good pun is always my pleasure my dear friend. Also side note you guys make amazing wood splitters very handy for Aussie long Easter holidays camping.
*Woe unto Rufus Tranquilus then*
You're the man now Dog : LOL ! Poor guy did nothing to deserve death.
@sir pinpoint : Yeah, but my comment was saying that Rufus Tranquilus did nothing to Octavian or Antony to warrant them killing him, not that Rufus was a good or innocent man in general. Most people abhor the notion of slavery now, but back in Roman society, as you know, people owing and/or abusing slaves was as common breathing. Thus, Rufus profiting off slave labor wouldn't have been seen as uncommon or amoral among most back.
Top comment, and rightfully so.
@@willthisdoreviews3376 😂
During the time of Sulla's proscriptions, a man went and saw his name on one of the lists. He cried out, 'My villa has killed me!' He knew he hadn't done or said anything that would get him in trouble with Sulla. Unfortunately, Sulla needed money for the treasury and the man happened to own some valuable lands. In peaceful times it's wonderful to be rich. In times of revolution or civil war it can be the cause of your death.
Maybe if he had premptively made a large sizeable donation to Sulla and retired to some far flung corner with a modest retirement lumpsum then he could have kept his life.
given enough time and enough inequality, the rich always get eaten
Sulla is misunderstood a lot. By all accounts Marius was the bloodlusting Monster Sulla is often described but Marius did not publish any lists. Sulla as clean and precise like with everything else published every name and most were part of Marius crimes in some way. Sulla was very important for Rome to get back to Stability and control of the empire
@@listrahtes I see Sulla and Marius as two sides of the same coin. I don't see either one as the 'good' or 'bad' one. They were both exceptional generals who were quite willing to murder their political enemies when it suited them. Honestly, if Marius had been younger and won the war I could see him doing roughly the same things Sulla did, just on behalf of the Populare. Though maybe he would have kept having himself elected Consul rather than Dictator.
@@nelsonchereta816 Pretty much this.
Thucydides talks at length about how revolution and political strife gripped the Greek polities during the Peloponnesian War, and he mentions how cities would frequently switch from Athenian allied democracies to Spartan allied oligarchies and then back to democracies. Cities often changing their allegiances and political structures multiple times. And each time the political order in a city state flipped, it would be followed by purges, proscriptions, and mass bloodshed. The democrats would come in, and violently purge their city of the oligarchists. The oligarchists, vengeful would conspire, overthrow the democracy, and then commence a violent purge of the democrats. And on and on and on this would go.
Rome during the late Republic was much the same. Marius came into power, violently purged the Optimates, only to be overthrown by Sulla, who came in and violently purged the Populares, only to be overthrown by Marius, who violently purged the Optimates, only to be overthrown again by Sulla, who violently purged the Populares. Political violence and terror was not unique to any one political party in Rome. Rather it was a very common arsenal in the toolbox of political ploys that each party used to get the leg up.
And frankly, this is a story we see repeated time and time again throughout history. In the Islamic Caliphate, the Umayyads used terror to solidify their rule against the Alids, only to themselves become the victims of terror perpetrated by the Abbasids. In China, the various Court Factions of the Imperial Court such as the eunuchs, generals and royal family frequently took turns employing terror against one another to cement their control over the Court. The Wars of Religion saw Catholics and Protestants frequently purge and massacre one another to establish dominance. The French Revolution is probably one of the most well known examples with Jacobin-led Revolutionary Terror and Bourbon-led Counter-Revolutionary Terror being employed.
lepidus: general antony tell them!
antony: cicero must die first :D
It's to be noted that Augustus argued with Anthony over Cicero's execution for a number of days before he relented.
@@Reach1335 True that
"There are one or two names I'd like to add myself" :')
Also Lepidus' brother was on the list as was Anthony's uncle, everyone had someone they wanted spared on the lists but had to relent.
@@Reach1335 gawd damn sucks to be roman
"woe unto rufus tranquillus then"------ cracks me up each time
Best part of this scene: how casually Atia explains why she wants Tranquillus dead, as if it were a small annoyance to be taken care of. Polly Walker really stole just about every scene she was in during the show's run.
Yeah, she is great. The scene seems to illustrate what a trivial regard the Roman upper class had for the lives of others. It is almost like they weren’t people, but rather pieces on a chess board to them, and/or an inch they needed to scratch. There were probably a lot of people on that list who deserved to be killed, but also some who didn’t. Casualties of politics and the ambitions on men.
Pity the show didn't run for a third season. I really wanted to see her play the same games with Livia only to be completely outclassed.
Cutthroat politics.
she didn't 'steal' this scene at al..
Yep. Especially when she was naked.
In real life this incident played out differently. There were some men they all agreed should be killed but each member of the triumvirate had to make a concession to be proscribed. Antony had to give up his uncle. Octavian had to give up Cicero. Getting octavian to give up Cicero was the hardest part of the meeting but he did so to appease lepidus and antony.
So basically HBO/BBC did Lepidus dirty again.
@@wikipediaintellectual7088 And Rufus Tranquillus.
Octavius argued long and hard for Cicero's life. After he was sole ruler of Rome, he looked after Cicero's son and even made him consul; in that role Cicero the younger gained some revenge for his father's murder, by proclaiming the defeat of Mark Antony in the senate after the battle of Actium.
So basically HBO does Octavius dirty by making him be the one to propose killing Cicero while Antony is left to agree, when in real life it was the other way around.
Cicero's quip about Octavian, raise him, praise and erase him didn't help
2:02 Posca helping to kill the father of his future wife.
Well.....he would have known she was due a large inheritance....
@Kaiser und König Kriegspieler ye, only in our imagination sadly... :(
She got over it. Shiny trinkets helped
And he later married her and f--ked her.. knowing all that.
@@Taiko-THC349 givers happy takers happy... its not hard to satisfy a spoiled rich girl if you got the money. Especially the ones that dont need to use their brain to survive tends to be the easiest to manipulate
I love the little moments that Octavian has after he first hands over the list. You can see he is steeling himself for the hard, cruel road ahead. The Octavian of later episodes would have no hesitation, but this is his Start of Darkness
In real life, Octavian commited atrocities with his troops on fallen armies and civilians alike - well before he achieved prominence.
The guy that plays Octavian was such a villain. "We should (Dramatic pause) Kill Them
He did not said that like a villain, more like sociopat he is. Brief pause to suggest remorse which he felt, then back on trail to climb on that last step of the zikkurat.
@@jantekjantek it's been suggested that Octavian/Augustus was an aspie (aspergers) and that seems to have been how the series played him. Aspies are often intelligent, single-minded and without squeamishness, but for reasons that support their goals. Sociopaths (and psychopaths) do bad things on impulse, often because they don't have a sense of 'why no'..
@@davebox588 Thats possible, heard that. Its funny tho how some slight deviations lead someone who follows textbooks to say you have a disorder.
I really liked how the actor portrayed Octavian, the series hits some serious bullseyes with whole "rome" aspect.
edit: my point about aspergers was that diagnose someone 2000 years after his deaths with aspergers according to modern "social behavior" can not be conclusive. You can't know it, it will forever be hypothesis.
@@jantekjantek yes, of course we can't know. That's why I said "it's been suggested". The comment was that he was a sociopath. That doesn't seem likely for the creator of the Pax Romana, though possible for plenty of other emperors, particularly Caligula.
But of course the modern study of history is multi-disciplinary and pulls together information from study whose relevance wouldn't have occured to us even twenty years ago. Psychiatry is maybe one of them?
@@jantekjantek I agree it was obvious he doesnt want to do it but if his plans were leak to brutus then chances are he and Anthony might lose the battle.
Antony's armor has a medal with the picture of Alexander III, the great, dressed in his favorite Hercules lion cap. He was one of the last people to see his tomb when Cleopatra took him there to boast about her ancestral line. I think that it was Octavian who moved the tomb into an unknown place.
Cool detail, thank you for sharing!
@Lord Cregan Stark I did not state anywhere that she was immediate descendant of Alexander III.
@Lord Cregan Stark Wasn't she descended from one of Alexanders general's though?
@@user-sc5iv2rp2t The Ptolemys were not descended from Alexander. All of Alexander's offspring and relatives were murdered during the Wars of the Diadochi. At most, he had a few cousins, one of which was notably Phyrrus of Epirus.
When Octavian entered Alexandria he asked to see the tomb of Alexander the great when he opened Alexander the great sarcophagus octavian laid on Alexander’s head the crown of flowers but accidentally broke the corpse’s nose in the process. When Octavian was asked if he wanted to see the mausoleum of the Ptolemies He replied “I came to see a king not a row of corpses.” I don’t think Octavian would have moved the sarcophagus for fear of angering the Alexandrians. As of today it has yet to be discovered
This show was so good, not since "I Claudius ' back in the 70's had there been such a great TV show about Rome. Unfortunately, I don't expect to get another 30 years to wait for the next. Vivamus, Moriendum Est
Octavian is convinced but his stoic hesistation is brilliant. He isn't happy but is necessary.
Esepeically Rufus Tranqulus
"Making use of strategic surprise is obvious."
only thing bothers me in this series is Lepidus. They portrayed him as a fucking idiot. like a pawn. he was just as influenced as Mark Antony in real life if not more
They didn't have the time do give everyone a fair shout
@@stephencronin1080 yeah I know show was abruptly cancelled and all but they had time to portray him as an idiot so I think they had enough time to portray him as he was. Or at least something close to. Cleopatra also had little screen time but they nailed the character.
He was smart enough to b with the winners and even smarter to retire quietly with his loot
@@davidwalsh6608 If by retire quietly you mean have all of his legions defect to Octavian, who then stripped him of his powers except in name only, had his son killed, (who had been caught up in an assassination plot on Octavian) was essentially put into house arrest until he died save for when Octavian needed him in person at the Senate.
Yeah also the Triumvirate was First Mark Anthony, lepidus and then Octavian he was clearly the Junior in These instances at the beginning
Love this scene - so well written and acted.
Rufus Tranquilus was my favorite character on the show I wish they had done more with him
"Woe onto Rufus Tranquilius then......."
Great show
great scene one of the best
What happened to Biggus Dikkus... he should be on the list too...
He supported Caesar.
But no woman we cant kill his wife Incontinentia Buttocks .
He has a wife y'know...
Wait till Biggus Dikkus hears about this!
And don’t forget his wife incontinentia Buttocks
The first order of business in any civil war is settling scores... and there are always a lot of scores to settle,
They were going hard with the proscriptions.
0:42 only if tribune Aquila allows it
I understood that reference!
Aww nice reference but you're a bit late. "Tribune Aquila" died in Mutina, the very battle in which Octavian "defeated" Antony, just a few weeks before this scene.
@@zamzamazawarma928 Wait, how do You know that?
@@kapitan19969838 It's history.
@@zamzamazawarma928 but how
Только вчера досмотрел, удивительно здесь так давно это выложили ... Aver Rome
this is comedic gold
As far as I recall it wasn't Marc-Anthony that wanted Cicero's hands nailed on Senate's doors - that was an idea of his his wife at the time - Fulvia.
For the glory of General Lepidus. VIVAT LEPIDUS! VIVAT LEPIDUS!
Hail Lepidus
Poor Lepidus.
Wish they showed Cicero and Octavian friendship. The man called him father ffs.
2:03 fucking love the way he says that lol
Too bad the days of cool looking armor are long gone
We could bring it back if we wanted
Yeah because roman armor would stop a bullet or grenade.
Ahmage Bishoor cool looking armor and melee weapons* granted you can still hit someone with a bat or something, but I’d prefer to just shoot them. (In self defense of course)
@@theannouncer5538 with all these riots im happy i have guns.
@@ahmagebishoor7675 I mean the Ancient Greeks used layers of linen stitched together to make a tough padded armour (Linothorax; Greek, Loricae Linteae; Latin) which is actually surprisingly effective at stopping arrows and having them bounce off, unlike leather armour which would embed them in it and probably allow them to push through to the skin beneath before stopping. Hollywood always thinks leather armour looks cool, thus all battles whether ancient or fantasy would use them.
It's not that much of a stretch that today's bulletproof vests use methods that the Ancients would find remarkably similar to their times.
Leopardis was quite a decent man. At least he had a heart and more of a conscience than the others.
If you're not willing to carry out the necessary means, then you never sufficiently desired the ends in the first place. Very Nitzechien. (I think I spelled his name right. Someone correct me if I didn't. Thnx. )
It is. Also niccolo machiavelli, Michael Corleone, Sun Tzu and miyamoto musashi would have ben impressed
We should *pause* kill them..
Tribune Aquila: Fine.
I.. think I understood that reference...
@@kapitan19969838 The inside joke of all inside jokes ain't it
@@Afrimusican Absolutely, if we're talking about the same thing that is..
@@kapitan19969838 Well don't leave it hanging...what does "I think I understood that reference" mean then
@@Afrimusican I would tell You, but I better check if it's okay with Tribune Aquila first ^^
Poor old rufus
Proscriptions !!
The ones who fought Sulla must be rolling in their graves right now
Octavian sending his best subordinates out with a 'special' mission-his genius general Agrippa with specific details to be given to Vorenus and Pullo in dealing with Cicero shows Octavian does NOT want this special assassination potentially botched. Seemed he wanted to at least give Cicero a somewhat noble death at the hands of experts and not simply getting hacked to death by street urchins.
Ohh Mark Antony and his obsession with nailing things to the Senate doors
Noooo! My boy Cicero!
Cut out his tongue too for good measure.
Irl thats basically what octavian said during this meeting. Each man was forced to give up someone they cared about to appease the other two. Antony was made to give up his uncle. Octavian fought for Cicero but eventually he gave in to pressure from antony and lepidus in order to preserve the triumvirate
Woah unto thee, Rufus Tranquilus, for a barely knew you!
Ok, it’s settled ,I’m gonna subscribe to watch Roma, again! UA-cam AI, well played…..
what a mommy
The actor of Lepidus did not want to play the role originally. He however owed the screenwriter a tremendous debt.
Reminds me of the line from Goodfellas "and that's how easy it is to get whacked."
Manly james
Not a documentary .
Lepidus "... General Antony, tell them!"
Antony "Do you feel like in charge?"
Lepidus "Well ... Im lending a bit of weight to your course ... I have friends in the senate ..."
Antony "And that gives you power over me?"
Lepidus "........................ Im off to Africa then, see ya around folks"
Octavian " I think not ... I like Africa ..."
Lepidus " Alright then ... do you know why im not very well known in the 21st century?"
Octavian " .... No ..."
Lepidus " 'cause this is my historical exit, farewell fellas"
Why didn't others ask Agrippa how does he know about Octavia'a friend?
The Proscriptions. Nasty stuff
woe unto rufas tranquilo lol
What fabulous is it ?
Imperator caesar augustus divi filius, primus inter pares, princeps civitatis, princeps senatus, princeps, pater patriae en mi opiníon el además claudio, trajano y marco aurelio son sin lugar a dudas los mejores gobernantes de roma no por nada a trajano le dieron el título de optimus princeps.
Merely first citizen
Man the comment translate feature really butchers this.
What's Augustus writing on?
Wax
Paul Frantizek Nice. Thank you.
Bees wax to be exact.
Posca got a young wife too.
Atia died a year before Caesar. She shouldn't be in this scene.
The character in the show isn't an actual historical figure friendo
@@Xeper-I-Set Atia is the mother of Augustus. So yes, she's a real historical figure. What we see in the show is what is known as a Fictional Version of a Historical Figure. And I wasn't trying to make an argument, I was merely pointing out a fact; Historically, Atia never saw her son become the First Emperor of Rome.
@@pepperVenge How is ''she shouldn't be in this scene because the real life person she is loosely based on is already dead'' not an argument
@@Xeper-I-Set Well if you want to be vindictive and take it as an argument, go right ahead. You can't read tone in text! You have no idea what I meant, so people can just make up your own meaning. I was only saying that Atia was Dead by this time.. Its also known as a "fun fact." Shame on me for not clarifying for trolls... 🙄
@@pepperVenge ''Atia died a year before Ceasar'' is a fun fact. ''She shouldn't be in this scene'' is an opinion
Was there any explicit gay sex scene in Rome?
So Octavian may have become a successful ruler, but in the beginning, he was no better than Stalin.
You can not be a good or a bad ruler without first being a successful one.
Stalin was also successful ruler!
@@Askrom1 Indeed
The ends justified the means clearly
Dimitar Augustus was ruthless but he ushered in a Golden age for all Romans. The same cannot be said for Stalin.
What the heck is this Atia doing there in the first place?
Romans, macho as they were did not want women in the millitairy command tent ( it became the downfall of Marcus Antonius at Actium with Cleopatra bossing around) and Atia in all accounts is mentioned to have avoided political life as much as possible, not only for herself but also for her son Gaius Octavius. After the death of her husband Gaius Octavious she married the Epicurean and fence sitter Lucius Marcius Philippus.
There was however a matrone mingling frequent in politics and that was the wife of Marcus Antonius himself, the granddaughter of Gaius Gracchus, named Fulvia and mother of Octavian's first wife Claudia.
Posca is thinking about marriage….
so you can just kill a man and take his money?
Woe unto George Soros then.
Augustus and Julius Caesar were the progressives of their time. Funny to see right wingers thinking that they weren't.
@Donut Yes because homosexuality is such an immense benefit to the community...
@@mrtee3988 wow. Someone butthurt about gays existing. Y'know, I'm gonna kiss a dude for that
@@mrtee3988 "facts" are not your opinions.
@@MikeFromPA That is an unbelievably simple and stupid analysis. Augustus and Julius Caesar were both populists who were trying to make better the lives of the Roman citizens. They were despised by the ruling classes and the rich and loved by the armies and common people. This sounds like exactly like what us Nationalists want. Global elites killing our ways of life for personal profit is exactly what these two would have fought against.
Thinking that being "progressive" means the same thing throughout all of history is retarded. Our idea of being "progressive" today is sick and twisted.
We should take a cue from the Romans and proscribe the rich.
And enslave the lesser people while we are at it.
Augustus became the richest man in history because of this.
Fun fact: the roman empire under augustus was the ideological foundation for Italian fascism. Named such for the bundle of sticks (fasci) the Roman consul would wield to signify they were in power that day.
So you're saying a fascist dictator should kill any and all political rivals and confiscate their wealth for the state and use that to lower taxes and give the people the equivalent to 3yrs wages in order to buy their love. You consolidate power and become ultimate ruler over your new nation. The people have zero say in their governance but let's be honest by that point it was so corrupt they didn't have power anyway
But that would be wrong
Envy of the rich is never ending, it's an insidious moral failing.
Woe unto Trump then
Trump will make the list woe unto non-supporters.