Are Games Not Fun Anymore?
Вставка
- Опубліковано 21 бер 2024
- Coney reacts to Kameron's video, "How Streamers RUINED Gaming", and dissects the issue with multiplayer gaming between the casual and competitive audience base.
Watch the original video here:
• How Streamers RUINED G...
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#coney #gaming - Ігри
He started writing the essay and realized the other side was right
This dude was a agent of chaos.
From making some good points, to disregarding the actual topic, then his evil twin at the end.
and that's facts!
And that’s facts
I think the guy had a bunch of opinions that kinda related to each other and so tried to form an argument but the facts didn’t support each other and some even contradicted and in the end he just drew an awful conclusion
And that’s facts
@@RealNinjanate the way you make argumentative videos for teenagers is you just state all of your opinions as if they are facts. don't spend time supporting them, they might click off. the more things you say the better. insert the name of a few streamers every few minutes so they don't lose attention span and you have a hit
This guys accuracy is 100 percent we just dont know where he's aiming
I feel like he should of done what fighting game youtubers do and not actually say their opinion until the end and goes over the overall discussion of what all the arguments are. This would of got a low score if I was still a Judge for Junior debate teams. Needs better formatting. Taught me things like which comment I should put this reply under.
I think the line of logic is “streamers define and push meta > meta becomes so popular casuals can’t succeed > casuals adopt meta to succeed > SBMM filters good players to prevent stomps even with the meta > good players don’t succeed > no one’s having fun”. I don’t get it but that’s facts.
thank you for this amazing quote, it made my day
@@bigbrowski410 Thats along the lines of what I was getting from it: That the culture around games now in a post viral streamers and esports world is obsessed with this idealized fortune being at the top of metas; then developers create feedback loops catering to that 'be at the absolute top' climate, and ripple effects from that seeps into modes/systems that rob players everywhere on the spectrum of competitive investment from enjoying the game as much. That interpretation could be a little forced since it aligns close to my feelings, not an extremely airtight argument regardless. The thread of the whole video and the back and forth with this guy on "tryhards" was really fucking funny though. And thats facts
It is not that his bullet never misses. It is a bullet that never stops.
This is the most incomprehensible video watched on the Coney Stream
I have never seen a video essay 180 on its point completely at the 7 minute mark.
"By the end of this video, you'll have an answer"
BRO, I GOT *QUESTIONS*
NOT ANSWERS
I DON’T NEED FOOD, I NEED ANSWERS!
"Before fortnite was a cashgrab" Oh you sweet summer child
that line was REALLY funny to me. i've always loved fortnite and i do think it's a genuinely good game but the game has been trying its hardest to make money from its playerbase from day one. in season one of battle royale you had to level up to get the chance to buy cosmetics instead of the battle pass system which was CRAZY
I think this video summarizes what I believe the general mindset of this kind of person is, this weird thing of “I’m good at the game so I should win and not have to try”. I can’t help but think, brother, if you need to win to have fun you are a tryhard. That’s fine I’m tryharding a lot in the stuff I play, but when you complain about sweats that’s you.
This ^^^
It’s a lot about setting expectations of what people want out of gaming sessions. If winning is a predominant factor then it’s tryhard. If it’s having fun it’s casual. When you start mixing people with those expectations, that’s where it falls apart.
Worst case I know of is League. Not tryhards queuing up in normals, but people that play to boost their ego going into ranked. Start losing or having a losing lane, and FF at 15. Like imagine being in a pickup game of basketball and your team has a 0-10 scoring run. And someone on your team’s like “let’s give up and leave”. You’d call them dumb and immature, but that happens like every other game in League.
Losing constantly is just not fun. It’s just a fact that losing makes people feel bad
@@Cm0N. depends on the game and what you're hoping to get from it. I may be a bit strange since one of my favorite genres is roguelikes and losing is half the experience, but if your fun or ego is directly connected to winning, then yeah... losing constantly would suck but if the match making is good and the player base is healthy, you should just be shuffled down to people around your level.
Also, I think that if your world view is "losing constantly is just not fun" and you believe that you're better than the majority of the playerbase, you are just admitting that your fun hinges on making other people have less fun which is just kind of an asshole stance imo
@@Lee-fw5bd yeah the point of gaming is to make your opponents lose, even if it’s not online games that’s still the point, and you have to try to win as much as you can as the objective
A lot of videos like this written by younger writers feel all over the place. Like they're changing their mind as they do a little research/think about a different perspective.
A lot of it definitely screams forming an opinion then writing as they research rather then researching, forming an opinion, then writing.
I do think it's important that they're putting out content even if it's bad though. Doing is the only way to improve and hopefully this guy is able to see the critisism of his video and take it to heart.
Which would actually be a cool and neat way to format a video essay, but it seems like the video creator themselves somehow hasn't actually realized that they changed their mind halfway through and end up writing the video to have contradictory mission statements and conclusions.
This is what happens when you go into a topic with zero thought behind it. I am 100% sure he did not have a script when he made this and just turned on the camera and started talking.
The ‘I should win for putting in effort, but people shouldn’t beat me for putting in more effort than me’ argument
Lil bro stopped thinking at the clickbait idea
The one point that he made that confused me was when he said the end of casual gaming was with Fortnite and not CoD because I feel like everything he said bad Fortnite did, CoD did first with stuff like MLGs and Faze
him showing mw2 was so funny because call of duty has had sbmm since 2007
@@SuperTurboPOPtoday I learned I was 1 when cod got SBMM
This guy is better than all his friends in his group but gets cooked on ladder
Yeah but it’s because of streamers not because I’m bad
The basement warlord
That would make sense lmao
This is the dude thats too good to play with friends but not good enough to play in tournaments
Now THIS is Reacting
Edit: I should have expected this from the Lakers and Warriors stuff in the same room, dude is playing 5D chess
Probably had some Celtics and knicks stuff in the other room from the way his argument was bouncing around
21:00 this is how it feels when Grandpa starts talking about "I just don't agree with their lifestyle"
i have seen coney play games. he is so powerful,charismatic and he can beat 5 year olds at fortnite like no one else. he is also the only smash player with a family and has a child,his own not a stolen one
Yeah he had sex and had a kid and not have sex with kids. Based
@@SuperDrunkdragon🫡Finally a decent person as a UA-camr.
Mango.
i love these videos specifically for his conversations with chat. just actual genuine conversations almost
this is honestly what reaction videos should be, creating a dialogue and new content as a result
So I think his argument is that streaming and esports made games sweaty, which lead to games being not fun for casuals, which lead to skill based match making which now isn’t fun for skillful players. He thinks to fix it games should have the street fighter 6 control options which rewards skillful players for harder controls but also gives casual players the chance to have fun without needing to learn every single complicated command. For games like FPS he wants to bring lobbies back so that people can decide if they want to fight against skilled players.
Yeah his argument is fair but he just articulated it very poorly. I'm sure that if he spent more time on a script the video wouldn't feel as scattered
The modern controls argument is fundamentally flawed because it has a false premise. Someone new using modern controls and wanting to improve still needs to learn everything they would have had to learn with classic controls, they still have to learn theirbuttons and special moves, their purpose and usecases as well as a general idea of their frame data, how to play neutral and the structure and flow of offense and defense, the only gap that modern controls bridges is in execution which has never been the most difficult part of learning a fighting game, it just seemed that way on a surface level to casuals, which is why modern controls is such a successful and ingenius solution.
Bro wanted to cook but mixed up his recipe
Bro this ain't nothing new, there was "Best Redria Build!" and shit on PSO-World in 2001. I remember looking up FF6 stuff on Gamefaq in 1996. It's not that it's immediate sweat, it's the speed and access in which the world works now.
One of the biggest parts gaming magazine industry was built on the back of people wanting to optimize and play the meta, before the internet completely killed it by letting people make more and better strategy guides for free as a hobby.
Dude has a giant Kobe poster behind him and is complaining about people being too competitive in games
Mario Kart 8 should be the standard for online gaming tbh
just with better servers
I do think it's a good starting point but I would like a little more variety personally. I'd prefer a wider range in VR so people are more spread out throughout the track instead of gambling for a good item at the last 30 seconds. Also please put in some type of restriction to the tracks people can pick. Getting the same track 3 times within like 10 races is a little ridiculous.
LMAO when checker knights started playing when the guy went full two faced
1 way to shut this all down is think about Pokemon casuals vs comp. Think about how small comp is. That should tell you that no matter what example he brought up it is never the whole thing.
The competitive side's usually far less salty than the casual side funnily enough
@@grunkleg.3110smaller sample size tends to led towards that percentage wise.
Very surprised this became a vid
I'm surprised too but pleased 'cause this ended up being one of the funniest things I've seen in a while.
Bro in the original video is straight yapping, but Coney does provide a lot of good insight here so it makes sense
5:50 A few months back I found one of those guys in a Mario Kart lobby. Dude had max VR. He was live too, and he talked _so_ much shit. I managed to get a couple wins on him, and it felt incredible
i think the original point was right to a degree but worded wrong. instead of it being “streamers” it should be the internet. as a whole, the internet gave everyone and anyone access to optimization and guides to being better, so naturally with more resources people improved. that also started WAYYY before fortnite tho, and as a whole the sheer amount of people who had community and resources to improve meant growth of skill was inevitable.
It's not an issue of "competitive players are too sweaty" or "casual players need to get good", imo. It's about the *gap* between competitive players and casual players.
It's fun to feel like you're succeeding. Even if you don't end up winning the whole game, it still feels good to win interactions. What *doesn't* feel good is getting absolutely rolled and having zero chance to succeed, because at that point, you're getting stuffed out from even participating in the game (I assume that's what this guy was trying to articulate)
I do feel what he's saying tho. Like I join up with my friends playing something like overwatch and I tell them I'm bad, to which they respond "we're bad too" and then proceed to dominate. They're comparing their skill to like the 5-10% of players that are exceptional and stream, while I'm just saying I'm bad. I probably won't get a positive KD.
Felt that overwatch just ain't a fun game for me. My first experience with OW2 was just a guy getting mad in unranked. To which I pointed I'm a new player and I'm around the same skill level as you are when you've played for year. Overwatch is not a fun solo queue game. And I didn't have the time to climb the ranks with my friends back then so now I'm below their skill level.
I don't think streaming is responsible. i saw this back in halo 2 before streaming was well known at all. It's just the better you get, the more you understand mistakes, and thus the more you realize all the mistakes you constantly make.
It's also a consequence of skill based match making. You will frequently be put against players that are at least a bit better than you so you have a skewed view not realize those better players are like the best 1% in the game. Even if you realize it logically, it's hard to really internalize it when your experience is that you at least semi frequently get stomped by a better player.
I rewatched this video for fun and realized how much pain teachers went through reading all our shitty essays we tried to pump out to get a slightly decent grade after no proofreading
how did this make it to youtube
“Ninja vs Myth was the biggest topic in school”
How old are these video essayists now?
There are dudes right now who look like grown ass men with facial hair and everything who were in 6th grade at the start of the pandemic. The iPad babies are growing up and bringing their myopic perspectives with them
My big thing is that I'll play Fortnite or Fall Guys and never win and still have fun. The only people that complain about sweats are ironically sweats themselves. They're just upset that they're not winning as much.
I feel crazy seeing nobody ever bring up the point that if you really just want to play casually and don't care about winning, why are you complaining about losing too much? I thought your whole problem was that people care too much about winning.
Am glad they said Streamers and not streaming because I feel like streams have always had some sort of role when possible in the fighting game community. They be doing it pretty early in the era of streaming, mix in with in person events, example being Apex 2015 for Smash brothers Melee.
“You play to win the game.” -Herm Edwards
The essayist insists that people should play to have fun, and not to win, yet complains that he can't have fun because he's not winning. That entire video felt like the epitome of the little brother player whining about how the older sibling doesn't let them win for free.
Coney's videos are the best on the platform!
And that's facts!
0:07 Jiyuna really did say that
Weird tangent but kind of why I love playing commander magic and kind of don't enjoy playing 1v1 card games anymore. It's infinitely more fun to just play around than always seek the by infinitely optimizing to win.
When I think about the concept of competitive games separate from the actual experience of playing them, I 100% agree with the “sweats” that you gotta just get better to have more fun. But then I actually turn on the games and play them and suddenly I completely understand the “scrublords” perspective. There is something so spiritually devastating about getting your ass handed to you by someone who, because they’re faceless, feels like a monolithic and emotionless stumbling block.
The thing that helped me kinda move on from this (I do still get mad sometimes though) is thinking about it like “multiplayer Dark Souls.” In other words, changing your expectations around difficulty, and in general shifting your objectives from winning, to learning.
But streams still ruined gaming. And that’s facts.
Literally my experience with first playing TF2 in 2023: I was getting my ass handed to me constantly when I started out bc everyone already knew the game, even in Casual. I even started out mainly playing Heavy and Medic bc they didn’t require as much rigid precision or movement to be productive to the team. But the literal second I tried out Scout due to a friend recommending I try him, landing my first sneaky kill on an Engie camping us, and my friends popping off and winning the round due to the distraction? I instantly felt amazing and knew I wanted to keep getting better with Scout.
I would say certain AVGN episodes were the closest content to video essays I would watch, when I started watching youtube around 2010ish. They weren't the most in-depth analysis of the topic/focus. They were mostly just his own experiences and some fun facts. But, that's how I found out more about the NES/SNES eras of gaming, which was before my time. Then, I started to watch more well researched videos on specific topics, related to games/gaming. Topics related to either stuff before my time or before I really paid attention to the community and/or the behind-the-scenes stuff.
Most of the people I watched were older than me. NOW we've hit a point where these young guns are charging into this sphere with their own personal experiences. But now, they're being watched by older people that are like "Nah, that's not what it was like. In fact, BACK IN MY DAY-".
EDIT: Yo, that SFV Ryu mirror match was sneaky. People are going to think throwing Ryu's Hadoken was actually some sort of top tier meta. That actually kind of annoyed me.
EXTRA EDIT: Now he's praising SF6, but he's also kind of wrong!? I don't know how to feel anymore...
Let's go blade man pfp
@@lylelylecrocodile2538 I've been reppin' the Blade Man for years.
@@zanpakutoman4225 W robot master
I have been waiting for this video!
And that's FAX!
i have no idea what the fuck just happened
I think a lot of the issues the guy’s talking about mainly stem from casual and comp mixing together. It’s not inherently a bad thing if a game is marketed towards hardcore gamers. CSGO and CS2 haven’t exactly been noob friendly and that’s still going strong. The problem becomes when your casual audience and tryhard audience mix and throw everything off.
Examples of this is when you get tryhards that queue up in casual lobbies and act like the shit, dumpstering others that don’t care, talking trash and ruining the vibe of the entire gamemode. Overwatch 2 has this problem in spades where the only 2 playable gamemodes are Quick Play and Ranked. But everyone treats QP as just “Ranked Lite” and enough people take it so seriously the term “QP Warrior” has been made for them.
On the other side there’s the “for fun” gamers that start queuing up for ranked and not really taking the whole “I want to win” mentality corectly. Best example: League. If it’s competitive you play to win in ranked, why tf is there a forfeit button at 15 minutes? When games can hard swing within 2-3 errors? Azzapp is currently trying to change the whole mentality, but it makes the experience worse when it’s a mildly competitive setting and you have someone that gives up after a single mistake.
Coney’s just reading my mind in these vids, it’s so refreshing.
Bro there were people sweating and hacking back when I was 10 years old, this shit is not new.
I dislike skill based match making in casual modes too. Splatoon is already incredibly salty and sweaty in the ranked game modes, but your invisible "glicko" power carries over to Turf War. Turf War is supposed to be the casual mode of the game, but it feels like you'll never get a relaxed lobby unless you make a new account.
I think it’s so funny how much people LOVE the “oh you shoot at someone once and they build a whole hotel!” anecdote for Fortnite. I swear that is the only thing people have to say on the topic.
Tbf it is mad annoying
@@matthewbartlett3442 Sure, but maybe it’d be more convincing if the point was made in any other way ever.
@@CCuppy29people don't actually have opinions on this stuff they just see something on twitter and absorb that opinion without even thinking why.
16:16 what about the new players? What about the people that just actually like those skins for some reason?
knew this was going to be nonsense right at the beginning when he said "you have to be good or funny" and showed Kai Cenat as an example of someone "funny"
Biggest streamer in the world has to be doing something right about comedy
@@Cm0N.Not really. I dont think all the hate Kai gets is warranted, but he is not funny. He is the worst example of black humor imo.
Rizz has become a stain on the average lolipop's vocabulary, and its actually sad.
@@kyperactive > He is the worst example of black humor imo.
what do you mean by that
@@alexanderbateman5581 What do you think?
I literally gave you the example: How he ruined the word "Rizz".
@@kyperactive okay but like, what do you mean by "black humor" lmfao why that specifically
The guy in the video gives off the vibe that he's either a competitive player who's (for some reason) pissed off that there's so many other people playing at a competitive level. Or he's a streamer that is pissed off that there's so many other people streaming his game.
we act like its new but people pushed the Limit in pong, pac-man, and street fighter 2. the core of gaming is to always get best score possible.
Coney talking about playing Spy and getting mad at Pyro, #relatable fr except counterpoint:
Outplaying the Pyro and killing them before the afterburn kills you is EXTREMELY satisfying.
Not even about the video topic but I see tf2 discussion and the brainrot kicks in
From the casual gaming standpoint I see his argument on games always being a sweat-fest ruin the casual gaming experience. I've never been good at a game and I bet I speak for a lot of people when i say I don't want to have to grind a game for house just to stand a chance against casual lobbies to have fun
- Love the vids Coney
This video feels like when u learn one new thing ab a topic and since no one else know it u get to talk ab it like ur an expert
This is what happens when you try to write an essay without doing any actual research. Dude’s just going off his own opinions and vibes
That late game twist destroyed me
i’ve never played league so i don’t know how it exactly works, but if coney went back to his account and lost against a bunch of good players that he’s the same rank as, then wouldn’t he eventually fall in rank and match against people on his level? isn’t that the point of sbmm?
i think just in general, the “gaming is dying” crowd is people who have outgrown gaming or havent yet branched out beyond the most popular stuff.
This entire video felt like someone writing an essay the class period before it was due. He had to meet the word requirement, hit specific points, and have an argument. Instead he wrote the essay with a few points he could string together, realized the other side was right and just decided to play both sides to score points with everyone??? He was cooking, don't know what the recipe was and some substitutes were made but we got food at least.
To talk about the twitch streamer example he made early on in the video, I don’t think people try hard on purpose or something, at a certain point it just becomes natural.
Like- I remember a long time ago I created an infinite in a small fighting game, I practiced it cause I wanted to. I thought it was cool. At a certain point I just did it effortlessly. Of course, people would call me a tryhard and…. I mean, yeah, I get it, but I’m not really trying if that makes sense? It’s just how I play the game
This video was like a horoscope: purposefully vague so you can project your own thoughts on the argument.
I think the best way to describe this guy is that he’s a tryhard in denial, he wants to win and be good at games and thinks thats cool but also likes to think that hes a chill casual gamer who doesn’t need to tryhard. Thats how he is simultaneously being punished for being good at the game by skill based matchmaking and also having his casual experience ruined by sweats
This dude is very "born sometime between 2004-2007" coded
Absolutely
Blud switched sides like 7 times in that video
Watching this made me feel much older than I actually am... im not even 30 yet
I just wish more games would have a server browser so I don't need to be beholden to any kind of matchmaking.
I feel like the first handful of points this guy made were all either just wrong or highly debatable. I feel like he didn’t do much research and was just spitting off the dome 😂
“get gud” -the old wise man, 2007
I can only laugh in confusion, what the hell was he trying to say?
There's a world record for sitting
That alone should debunk his whole video
Everything and anything can be a competition and has been before youtube even existed
This hurt to watch just the pure psychic damage from that video was too powerful
Dude was born after 9/11 how many times he gonna say frick in one video loooooord
He was not satisfied with just "He had us in the first half".
These kinds of arguments have been around since people were on gamefaqs just with different games, terms, and tech. The kind of person who whines about "tryhards" or "sweats" or whatever are the people most obsessed with winning and with the most ego attached to the results of a game. Shitters are just like this and always have been.
This dude genuinely only plays the most mainstream games too
If I simply hold all the opinions I can always be right
this is what it must be like reading a student's synthesis essay
This video is like when you are writing a essay right and then you have to change your thesis because you realize something else while writing your papwr
He's spitting about TF2. Getting shot by a Sniper in TF2 made me mad at Sniper, not the dude controlling him. Things were simpler.
The sbmm argument is accurate. In some games you just get punished flr being good. The way it works is you'll fight good olayers and have worst teammates
I’m 100% the kind of UA-camr who doesn’t like streaming because I get uncomfortable mad. Like when I’m making UA-cam videos if I’m frustrated I could just cut it out, or scrap the video as a whole. If I’m streaming Smash and some shithead Ness starts using his one bar hotspot Internet to frame perfect teabag I am throwing something and I don’t want that to be on camera
What is up with the guardian music in the background 💀
This Kameron guy should play splatoon
I think this guy's feelings are valid and have some truth to them, but honestly it feels like 99% of their issues is less about what's changed on the outside and what has changed for them. They seem to be about my age, early 20s, and talking about "back when people weren't sweats"? People were absolutely sweats back then you just were 7 years old and didn't have the concept of that. Also, that younger age we had plenty to do on the internet but the gaming sphere hadn't evolved into the streaming/esports community that's easy to access and digest to people outside the community like it is now. This guy honestly just grew up and started seeing more about the competitive communities in the games they play, both because the internet growing made those communities more viewable and because they just got older, became exposed to different perspectives. The jumps in this video make me feel like they have this experience and haven't come to the realization that that's the case yet, so the narrative they're trying to build gets muddied and hard to follow since its just a jumble of emotions that everyone has about their pre-pubescence to adulthood growth.
This was a whole journey
I would HATE having to grade this guy
14:20 I think the solution is just to have your elo decay while you don't play the game.
When everyone’s super.. no one will be
Simple solution, make skill based matchmaking optional. Have a ranked and a casual mode, ranked puts you with players sharing your skill level, casual puts you with anyone. Makes both camps happy
I love my position in discourse like this cause I'm a TF2 kid *and* a fortnite kid.
I'm 20 at time of posting oh no.
Coney, you wanna play Helldivers 2 together?
This guy's video is so frustrating because he's ALMOST right. Multiplayer games have gone infinitely more competitive since the early 2010s and have lost the casual demographic. I'm 19, so I'm not gonna act like I'm some elder with memories of the good old days, but I still load up games like TF2, Half-Life and Garry's Mod because there's always stuff to do there. There's a tweet by David Sysmanski, creator of indie FPS DUSK, that went along the lines of "online multiplayer games peaked in the mid 2000s when you could join a server and find some random blocky custom map with a kid blasting techno music out of their microphone." Years ago I played some free Halo 3 clone on PC and, I've never played a Halo game in my life until then, but I had an absolute blast even when I was losing hard because it was just Fun. People used to go on dedicated servers for just screwing around, for hardcore play, to zone out on 24/7 servers. With games like Overwatch where you have automatic matchmaking, all of these people are in one server and are miserable. TF2 is still alive because you can either go on the official Valve servers and play by their rules, or go on a custom server with their own ruleset, and you can find your niche. My favorite servers are the casual custom map ones, where you'll just go through an infinite amount of maps you've never seen before and will never see again, reacting to it live with strangers or friends. I literally met my boyfriend through one of these servers. My favorite multiplayer game rn is Mario 64 Co-Op Deluxe, because there's a bunch of servers I can join and there's a million mods and gamemodes I can choose between. Even when I lose, it's whatever, because even if people are sweaty, the game is just plain FUN inherently. Honestly, while the implementation was bad, Smash 4 kind of had the right idea with the For Fun and For Glory system. If I was making a game like Overwatch or LoL, I'd have it split between Silly or Serious, and then official and custom servers for both.
Tl;dr: eSports, streamers and matchmaking didn't ruin games. Instead, developers trying to cater to ONLY that demographic and forgetting their casual userbase. Also let people mod your damn games.
Bro recorderd a yes and no the next day to be prepared
Just gonna leave a thought in here. I think the part with "take a shower" tweet or whatever meant something like "Oh, are you playing this game a lot of hours every day? Can't you just go and do something else, you loser and touch grass or whatever?" that's what I took it as. Compared to before it's like "Wow, he's so good! I wanna be friends with him!" and that's about it. Otherwise, I don't have much strong opinion to share here.
While eimmimg isn't meaningless, it's usually a smaller part of overall enjoyment than most people think.
Mario Party is a great example. Winning a game by making a few key decisions feels great. Winning because of a last turn Chance Time swapping stars is funny, but doesn't feel as fulfilling. If the later isn't possible, however, you lose most of the tension that Mario Party is notorious for.
Peak video game was prematchmaking tf2. You just pulled up the menu, found exactly what gamemode and map you wanted and it put you in that lobby. If it sucked, you left, and if it was good you could just vibe with the same people the whole day. You could vote to extend the map, or change it with minimal fuss, and 12v12 lobbies really allowed players to fight who they could reasonably match with their skill. Not to put a lot of value on the tf2 scoreboard, but it really did give a decent showing of skill / experience for the lobby. Those on the bottom usually could evenly match the bottom of the other team, and top players would evenly fight other top players in that single match. And because of the silly little hats, if someone was better than you, just remember what they looked like and avoid them, or gang up with your team.
nah, it didn't. I think esports did change gaming, but it didn't ruin it. gaming is at it's all time high, for it to be ruined would require it to be going downhill. Singleplayer gaming had no real change from esports, and if anythingh speedrunning (the most "competitive" you can really get with singleplayer games) has had a positive change on stuff due to it either fixing glitches or leading to devs having more fun with their games and leaving glitches and side paths open to exploration for speedrunning (I remember in iconoclasts specifically they fixed a glitch to make it not happen on accident but there was intentionally still a way to do it for speedrunning). For multiplayer games, you have skill based matchmaking now so you don't have to deal with the sweat, which would have killed gaming long term because it's not fun getting dominated like that. And the sweat can actively improve themselves together if they want to actually commit to esports. if they don't want to actually try and get better...sure maybe then those players are losing, But that is such a small percentage of the overall playerbase that...quite frankly....you don't matter?
It's like when I see competitive smashers complaining about things in smash...you guys are like a maximum of 1% game sales, you are entirely irrelevant to nintendo and stuff, which is also why idk why nintendo goes after you....but you're so small and reach such a small audience compared to the actual sales of the game that the realistic thing is....your opinion is from a vast vast minority that is in all reality somewhat catered to already.
I think people who are good at video games and are online more don't want to admit that the average gamer is not watching them, or anyone on youtube for gaming content. The average gamer is so casual that even the people you might call casual gamers are competitive to them.
To compare to smash again, there's the people who go to tourney's who are "the best of their friend group" but are actually garbage compared to even the bad people who participate in tourney usually. But those people are actually better than everyone that they actually know. Elite smash is top 5% of players, and they are GARBAGE. I was top 1% of GSP as kirby and I didn't grab, use tilts, shield, or do literally anything that made kirby good. I was better than 99% of the playerbase with that. Now realize how bad the average gamer is. And this applies to EVERY...SINGLE...GAME. Sure, maybe not nearly as much as games that are known for their competitive scenes, like overwatch or LoL.....but even their average players are not good.
You can even take that sentiment and put it in chess, average elo is like 900 or something...god awful. You are objectively above average at chess, but you're still so bad comparatively. You could nevver beat someone in the top 10% still.
So I think these people who complain about anything ruining gaming need to get a reality check, and realize that games objectively should not be made for them anymore...because the reality is that they are killing the gaming industry. If you want games made for only 10% of gamers then obviously you don't know how the world works.
Some people havent learned the grace in losing. Theres games i take seriously. (That bring out the worst in me *cough* valorant *cough*) and games i can sit down and have a good time. I like to win even in my casual games. If i want to have a chill time im not playing valorant lmfao. The competitive environment is what makes it fun unless i get stomped by a smurf. Fall guys is just fun and i could win more often if i put full effort in into it. Fortnite plenty of funny strats you can try (though randomness makes it unfun if you want exclusively want one strat)
You see I agree with Coney in every situation but Valorant. The skill floor is so damn high in that game coming from somebody whose first pc fps was that