😮Dr C. I went thru division of a business and marriage simultaneously. As clients approached me saying "I've heard his side . Now what's yours?" My response was, "I apologize you heard that dirty laundry. Although we have a friendly business relationship I'm sure you didn't want to hear that anymore than I want to hear yours." " However, I was thinking about you and knowing you have had a few changes in your life I would like to suggest a change to update your..." whatever an honest need was. The ones who were relieved remained my clients. The ones disappointed and pushed back with wanting the poop scoop I encouraged to consider a list I offered to other agents I respected who offered solid companies. Saying, I understand you may have reservations continuing with me as your advisor It was the best knee jerk reaction I stumbled on in my exit from that narcissist husband/business partner. It was a hard stressful full year but I am here to say life after divorcing a narcissist. I loved today's podcast regarding not defending or explaining separating and getting confronted. It is easier when business clients than family and friends. I get that.
They do not apologize, ever, not ever. Ego is their badge of honor to themselves always. I’m 51 years into this personality type and learned only 4 years ago what it is.
When a relationship with a narcissist ends, you will not get any of these statements of closure; I'm sorry it didn't work out, thank you for the time of your life that you shared with me, or even good bye.
Interesting about the nurse. My mother was a nurse and a major narcissist. I was placed in foster care because I was medically neglected, also beaten by my father. Emotionally abused by both. My sister was a teacher. Totally into power and control. Both were/are obsessively clean.
It’s strange you mention that your mom was a nurse and obsessive about cleanliness, you just described my late Sister in law, it never occurred to me that narcissism could be part of that obsessive behaviour. 🤔
I shouted at my mother because I was so hurt and outraged by her cruel words and unjust accusations. Later, I apologised for my poor reaction and bought her flowers. She took them without a word, showing how justified she felt. She never said sorry for anything, but broke up families. She played the pitiable victim.
A lot of nurse narcissists have performative empathy. They are only nice and sweet to their patients but treat their coworkers and family like dog 💩. As a highly empathetic nurse, I have had to deal with many of them. They were horrible individuals.
My father said that to me. He did some terrible things to me. It's sad seeing my parents' horrible genes live on in my nephews. In a way I'm glad I've not had children and added to it.
It depends on the relationship, on who said that to who and in the dynamics at play. In my case, I could say that to my maternal unit if she ever dared to ask me to apologize. I was a child when she abused me, I know I have nothing to apologize to her for, and it’s factually true.
I am in so much pain from this woman. I really did love her. But the more time that passes since the discard, I see more and more how she just used me and manipulated me.
Remember this post. Reflect back on it in a month, 2 months, etc. You will be amazed at how far you'll have come! And ...should the n-ex come 'a knockin' in the meantime, reflect on all the bad times, not the occasional good ones! Be well, be blessed 🧡🫂
Greatly appreciate you. I have listened to you for years. I heard another psychologist that got me thinking is narcissism learned or genetic. He made a good point that 80 % of the population have been traumatized at some point. Yet 7 to 8%of the population are narcissists. He feels that it is more genetic than learned. I kind of agree
There's a field of science called epigenetics - environmental stressors, emotional, physical, psychological, etc. can turn on and off genes. We all carry genes that are not active, but can become active under duress or other circumstances. I always wonder how much is learned from example - the child emulating the parent. So much brain development takes place before age three. Small children have big ears!
❤Thank you Dr. Carter for doing Good work and being a voice of wisdom and empathy- a significant factor in my growth these past few years. With prayer, introspection and therapy, it’s been a long journey but I’m grateful, peaceful and productive. God Bless you
I told a 85 year-old man I knew that I'm a veteran. He was being nice to me and now he's being a jerk. Interesting how people's attitude can change on one piece of personal information. I notice he seems angry all the time. Someone told me his daughter is not talking to him. Now I know why. I'm really getting sick of running into old, immature men.
I don’t think they even need to make accusations. If you ask them something, they may simply explain, while making you feel guilty for asking such a question.
Regarding the nurse: I have always found them very bossy, like teachers. I've always been surprised when I've encountered one who is caring when I've been in hospital. Truly surprised, because my mother was a nurse and medically neglected me.
My mom wasn't the narcissistic parent but she did have fleas. I learned to hate apologizing from her because whenever one of us kids said we were sorry, instead of accepting the apology, she would say, "Well you SHOULD be sorry." So we learned to never apologize. When I was married, my ex understood that apologies were hard for me and why, so he knew that when I did apologize it was because I was absolutely devastated. He appeared to apologize, but now I realize that none of them were actual apologies. He actually told my oldest daughter years later that he only apologized to shut me up. And when I think about his apologies I realize that they were actually nopologies. They were very general, such as I'm sorry we fought, or they would be low key blaming me.
What if the boss is badly bullying you in private? And gets their cronies to verbally abuse you? I retired as soon as I could. Already in my 70's. I'm not sure why it happened but I think the boss was jealous of my skills and also had a mean streak. Easy to get away with elder abuse.
I have a so called friend im staying with who bits my head off all the time. She may be wrong at times and very hurtful. She will never admit she is wrong ,never apologize. She over talks me, interrupts and speaks so loudly that my voice is not heard. So when i stop talking she wonders why. Full of advice even though I don't ask for it. I can hardly stand to be around her anymore. She is just so mean spirited and tries to make me look stupid every chance she gets. I just keep saying to myself "I reject this negative energy and send it back from where it came, with love and light".
Re: Nurse narcissist - Most nurses are very caring & empathetic, but there are exceptions in any professions. I am a nurse and worked with many narcissistic nurses. They use their patients as source- just like anybody else in their path. They are very self serving & usually passive aggressive to their patients & co-workers. They lie to make themselves look better than the average care provider when the real truth is the same as dealing with any narcissist. It's a sad reality that is not often addressed.
I think there is a line between enabling and being supportive. I find myself hesitating to assist my inlaws who find excuses for their destructive behaviors.
So sad 😔 only a 6 year old can ignore a 6 year old! The husband is a child in a mature body, and I think this probably shows itself in other aspects of life too.
Thank-you, Dr. Carter. I have a question. Can you explain why a narcissist doesn't remember their behaviors when they are in their "demon state?" I'm using rhe term "demon" in reference to your Angel/Demon on podcast.
Dr. C, would you address the dynamic in which a naricissist takes something good (for example, Thanksgiving) and makes it very unpleasant (for example, bullying someone at the Thanksgiving table and harassing them the rest of the evening), and then gaslights the other person with something along the lines of "You are such a terrbile person to not spend Thanksgiving with the family. Don't you value Thanksgiving?!" I see that this kind of dynamic has actually caused some victims to believe that they themselves don't like Thanksgiving, since they find it unpleasant. That is, they place the negativity on Thanksgiving itself, rather than on the person. "I don't like Thanksgiving." Rather than, "I don't like that bully." This seems so weird to me and I think it perhaps has to be a dynamic that started with someone as the scapegoat child.
Is it ok to say that "i don't want to be responsible for another child because i don't think i can be able to manage the stress? " Does it makes me evil or Narcissistic? I wouldn't mind to help find her a temporary home, but just thinking about having another child in my life makes me feel really overwhelmed. To be honest. in my relationship, im the one who is not a kid person, i only have one boy, and i love him dearly. but I was not the one who wanted to pursue parenthood. My husband had to push me so hard to ger pregnant and have a child with him, because he said he loves kids. But then i realised what he really loves is the validation children can give it to him. And the image of a prefect dad.
Sorry to say this but I still believe NPD begins by 3 & without learning empathy by 5 (or school age) narcissists are set on a future course… if no true conscience is developed by age 7 then preadolescence is as far as they will go! Adolescence is tricky to negotiate for anyone, but without emotional maturity or behavioral guard rails in place, then there’s no possibility that an adult will fully emerge from the spoiled chrysalis of narcissism
Dr. C thank you for your podcasts. I have learned so much. Question: How does one manage the fallout from a covert narcassist after discard when she is part of a network of friends.? I thought we were very good friends until she started passive aggressive discard behavior and became very friendly with one of the other members of the group. I have a wonderful group of friends and we are all mostly involved in the same Church groups. I have decided to minimize contact with narcissist- be cordial, kind, but not buddy buddy. It has co e to my attention that she has spread neg gossip about me; when she perceives that I am getting friendly with another she pulls out the charm and uses her charasmic traits to “love bomb” them or gifts them . How do I address this action to the new friend or should I just Ig or and hope the new friend will not take her seriously. She is well liked and is very cleaver with her actions/ manipulations. Thank you
My heart breaks for the little girl who’s being cared for by relatives where the husband ignores her. He is more concerned with how her presence makes him appear to others, than that she needs love and acceptance. I hope she learns that Jesus loves her and her parents’ lives don’t affect her worth. I was a child like that too. My stepfather found out, when I was 7, that I’d been conceived in adultery. After that, he referred to me as “nothing but a bastard” and he also called me a “slut, tart and floozy”. Thankfully, society has largely let such judgement go. I like what Rick Warren says: “There are no illegitimate children; only illegitimate parents”.
My advice is to take things slowly to allow yourself time to process your feelings. I also agree with the first comment about not getting into another relationship within the first year. For me, I am not anywhere near ready after 17 months and this could be because I was married for 40+ years before ending the relationship, because I came from severe childhood abuse and because of the level of abuse I received from my ex-husband the last several months before I made him leave. I would take your time, have a safe net of safe people and if you are comfortable, a therapist who understands this type of abuse can be very helpful. My therapist has been a lifeline for me.
I liked "The Menu" w/Ralph Finnes (recent). Why? Such a unique story line, lots of character development. For a more vintage movie, IMO, you can't beat the original b/w "What Ever Happened To Baby Jane?" Davis/Crawford. Why? The acting is superlative and it introduced the world to Victor Buono
If i see a my granchild continually being emotionaly abused and two times it was severe is it wrong to tell his parents to stop it. I see narasistic behavior in the mother and it is vindictive and revengefull. She is abusive to me and others but when i see it used on my grandson i get upset.
That's a difficult one. One thing you can do is spend as much time as you can with him and be the affirming safe secure base. My grandmothers especially my father's mother gave me more of that than my mother, it makes a difference.
My mother wasn't nurturing either. She busied herself with work cooking, cleaning. She would a mile at me sometimes, when I was doing or looking how she liked but there was never that close warm connection. To the outside it would look good, a mother with a neat dressed well behaved kid smiling but it all felt false. I feel fierce in my love for my cats (didn't have kids because I didn't want for them how I feel and I couldn't provide what they would need, it seemed selfish to do so), knowing what they need, their moods and calls. With my mother it was me trying to attune to her. It was pure luck if she was happy with me or not. Now I can't stand her hugging me, it feels so fake.
It's so good to be in this community. It has helped me keep my own sanity. 🙏🏼❤
Suffice to say every move they make, every breath they take IS a manipulative move! Stay Healthy!!
"I am watching you."
From song by The Police
@rosieE121 You got it, that's the reference!😊
And for it’s for me me me :( zero shame this DR says
@@rosieE121lol
Always a pleasure to see you Dr. Carter and share your videos. I've learned so much from you over the years. Thank You!
Same here!! Much gratitude fornDr. C.!! Love from SW VA!!
😮Dr C. I went thru division of a business and marriage simultaneously. As clients approached me saying "I've heard his side . Now what's yours?" My response was, "I apologize you heard that dirty laundry. Although we have a friendly business relationship I'm sure you didn't want to hear that anymore than I want to hear yours." " However, I was thinking about you and knowing you have had a few changes in your life I would like to suggest a change to update your..." whatever an honest need was. The ones who were relieved remained my clients. The ones disappointed and pushed back with wanting the poop scoop I encouraged to consider a list I offered to other agents I respected who offered solid companies. Saying, I understand you may have reservations continuing with me as your advisor It was the best knee jerk reaction I stumbled on in my exit from that narcissist husband/business partner. It was a hard stressful full year but I am here to say life after divorcing a narcissist. I loved today's podcast regarding not defending or explaining separating and getting confronted. It is easier when business clients than family and friends. I get that.
Thank you so much for giving us this wonderful channel! And I’m glad I live in a country that allows me the freedom to listen to it! 💙Hi to Gus!
Thanks so much.
😭YOU ARE MY ANGEL, DR. C.
They do not apologize, ever, not ever. Ego is their badge of honor to themselves always. I’m 51 years into this personality type and learned only 4 years ago what it is.
'Narcissistic Injury', thank you for the term. Me? I think I'll choose to live the rest of my life defined by the truth you had to stifle.
When a relationship with a narcissist ends, you will not get any of these statements of closure; I'm sorry it didn't work out, thank you for the time of your life that you shared with me, or even good bye.
Priceless Dr Carter!
"My response is nevermind! ", time to find the path to our own wellbeing. Not business as usual! Time for peace of mind.
Happy Wednesday Dr. Carter and Team Healthy! 😊
Thanks Michelle
From Sweden, listens to everything you say!
Thank you for reminder of love regarding election.
Interesting about the nurse. My mother was a nurse and a major narcissist.
I was placed in foster care because I was medically neglected, also beaten by my father. Emotionally abused by both.
My sister was a teacher. Totally into power and control.
Both were/are obsessively clean.
Yup
It’s strange you mention that your mom was a nurse and obsessive about cleanliness, you just described my late Sister in law, it never occurred to me that narcissism could be part of that obsessive behaviour. 🤔
Some people actually judge others by their cleanliness.
You are a real encourager
You’re the best, ultimate respect which has helped me greatly.
I shouted at my mother because I was so hurt and outraged by her cruel words and unjust accusations. Later, I apologised for my poor reaction and bought her flowers. She took them without a word, showing how justified she felt. She never said sorry for anything, but broke up families. She played the pitiable victim.
A lot of nurse narcissists have performative empathy. They are only nice and sweet to their patients but treat their coworkers and family like dog 💩. As a highly empathetic nurse, I have had to deal with many of them. They were horrible individuals.
My youngest sister on steroids 🤦♀️ years ago I discovered that nursing attracts the most controlling females 🤷♀️ my mother was also a CNA
@ I’ve seen some really unbelievable behavior in 23 years. So much that I am going back to school to get out of healthcare for good.
How about "I would apologize, but since it is 100% your fault, I have nothing to apologize for."
My father said that to me. He did some terrible things to me. It's sad seeing my parents' horrible genes live on in my nephews.
In a way I'm glad I've not had children and added to it.
It depends on the relationship, on who said that to who and in the dynamics at play.
In my case, I could say that to my maternal unit if she ever dared to ask me to apologize. I was a child when she abused me, I know I have nothing to apologize to her for, and it’s factually true.
@@snowbear1877exactly 😉
Thank you, Dr. C! I always learn and feel less alone when I listen to the Team Healthy videos by you.
If they do admit fault they expect adoration for it.
Constant Adoration! or you're in trouble again, ends with you're the whole problem...!😢
I am in so much pain from this woman. I really did love her. But the more time that passes since the discard, I see more and more how she just used me and manipulated me.
Sadly that’s the trend as we recover
Remember this post. Reflect back on it in a month, 2 months, etc. You will be amazed at how far you'll have come! And ...should the n-ex come 'a knockin' in the meantime, reflect on all the bad times, not the occasional good ones! Be well, be blessed 🧡🫂
Hang in there.
I'm right there with you, and this pain feels like torture 💔 for what THEY have done... 🙏🏼
Greatly appreciate you. I have listened to you for years. I heard another psychologist that got me thinking is narcissism learned or genetic. He made a good point that 80 % of the population have been traumatized at some point. Yet 7 to 8%of the population are narcissists. He feels that it is more genetic than learned. I kind of agree
Actually his figures are way to low! It’s a combo of nature or temperament with nurture or environment 🤦♀️
There's a field of science called epigenetics - environmental stressors, emotional, physical, psychological, etc. can turn on and off genes. We all carry genes that are not active, but can become active under duress or other circumstances. I always wonder how much is learned from example - the child emulating the parent. So much brain development takes place before age three. Small children have big ears!
@@badomajiyes. Bruce Lipton 👍
I quit apologizing cause when I would whether really my fault or not, he would say “no you’re not “
Can’t win so don’t try just go gray rock then no contact plz
Thank you dr Les❤ 🙏
You're most welcome
@@SurvivingNarcissismThank you 🙂
To say "I'm sorry" means they have to change
Exactly.
Meanwhile they complain and complain that you won't change. I guess that would be projection.
Exactly ! And that will not happen
Hi everyone from Argentina!!
Glad to be there with you in Argentina!!
@@SurvivingNarcissism Thank you a lot!!
I always love seeing you and the videos Dear Dr. C.
God bless you from Cynthia Ann on TEAM HEALTHY
from JANESVILLE, WI
Thanks, Cynthia.
@ Please give Gus a big hug from me
❤Thank you Dr. Carter for doing Good work and being a voice of wisdom and empathy- a significant factor in my growth these past few years. With prayer, introspection and therapy, it’s been a long journey but I’m grateful, peaceful and productive. God Bless you
Thank you for your invaluable advice and support dr Carter ❤ God bless you😊
I told a 85 year-old man I knew that I'm a veteran. He was being nice to me and now he's being a jerk. Interesting how people's attitude can change on one piece of personal information. I notice he seems angry all the time. Someone told me his daughter is not talking to him. Now I know why. I'm really getting sick of running into old, immature men.
Bit late to the party. Hey Team Healthy! ❤️🇬🇧
I don’t think they even need to make accusations. If you ask them something, they may simply explain, while making you feel guilty for asking such a question.
Regarding the nurse: I have always found them very bossy, like teachers. I've always been surprised when I've encountered one who is caring when I've been in hospital. Truly surprised, because my mother was a nurse and medically neglected me.
My mom wasn't the narcissistic parent but she did have fleas. I learned to hate apologizing from her because whenever one of us kids said we were sorry, instead of accepting the apology, she would say, "Well you SHOULD be sorry." So we learned to never apologize.
When I was married, my ex understood that apologies were hard for me and why, so he knew that when I did apologize it was because I was absolutely devastated. He appeared to apologize, but now I realize that none of them were actual apologies. He actually told my oldest daughter years later that he only apologized to shut me up. And when I think about his apologies I realize that they were actually nopologies. They were very general, such as I'm sorry we fought, or they would be low key blaming me.
Thank-you, Dr. Carter.
What if the boss is badly bullying you in private?
And gets their cronies to verbally abuse you? I retired as soon as I could. Already in my 70's. I'm not sure why it happened but I think the boss was jealous of my skills and also had a mean streak. Easy to get away with elder abuse.
How many times must we apologize, plead and cry before we realize we are not the insane monsters we are reacting as.
I have a so called friend im staying with who bits my head off all the time. She may be wrong at times and very hurtful. She will never admit she is wrong ,never apologize. She over talks me, interrupts and speaks so loudly that my voice is not heard. So when i stop talking she wonders why. Full of advice even though I don't ask for it. I can hardly stand to be around her anymore. She is just so mean spirited and tries to make me look stupid every chance she gets. I just keep saying to myself "I reject this negative energy and send it back from where it came, with love and light".
Re: Nurse narcissist -
Most nurses are very caring & empathetic, but there are exceptions in any professions.
I am a nurse and worked with many narcissistic nurses. They use their patients as source- just like anybody else in their path. They are very self serving & usually passive aggressive to their patients & co-workers. They lie to make themselves look better than the average care provider when the real truth is the same as dealing with any narcissist. It's a sad reality that is not often addressed.
I like the sound of Jackie too Dr C 👍🏽
I think there is a line between enabling and being supportive. I find myself hesitating to assist my inlaws who find excuses for their destructive behaviors.
Thank you Dr. C. Love your videos.
You are quite welcome
What am I going to do with that person in the mirror? ❤
Love her 💔❤️🩹♥️
So sad 😔 only a 6 year old can ignore a 6 year old! The husband is a child in a mature body, and I think this probably shows itself in other aspects of life too.
My hero what is my dad , a good man
Thank-you, Dr. Carter. I have a question. Can you explain why a narcissist doesn't remember their behaviors when they are in their "demon state?" I'm using rhe term "demon" in reference to your Angel/Demon on podcast.
Dr. C, would you address the dynamic in which a naricissist takes something good (for example, Thanksgiving) and makes it very unpleasant (for example, bullying someone at the Thanksgiving table and harassing them the rest of the evening), and then gaslights the other person with something along the lines of "You are such a terrbile person to not spend Thanksgiving with the family. Don't you value Thanksgiving?!" I see that this kind of dynamic has actually caused some victims to believe that they themselves don't like Thanksgiving, since they find it unpleasant. That is, they place the negativity on Thanksgiving itself, rather than on the person. "I don't like Thanksgiving." Rather than, "I don't like that bully." This seems so weird to me and I think it perhaps has to be a dynamic that started with someone as the scapegoat child.
Is it ok to say that "i don't want to be responsible for another child because i don't think i can be able to manage the stress? " Does it makes me evil or Narcissistic? I wouldn't mind to help find her a temporary home, but just thinking about having another child in my life makes me feel really overwhelmed. To be honest. in my relationship, im the one who is not a kid person, i only have one boy, and i love him dearly. but I was not the one who wanted to pursue parenthood. My husband had to push me so hard to ger pregnant and have a child with him, because he said he loves kids. But then i realised what he really loves is the validation children can give it to him. And the image of a prefect dad.
Sorry to say this but I still believe NPD begins by 3 & without learning empathy by 5 (or school age) narcissists are set on a future course… if no true conscience is developed by age 7 then preadolescence is as far as they will go! Adolescence is tricky to negotiate for anyone, but without emotional maturity or behavioral guard rails in place, then there’s no possibility that an adult will fully emerge from the spoiled chrysalis of narcissism
Yes, there is so much yet undefined in Narcissistic personality styles. This is an interesting point of view.
Dr. C thank you for your podcasts. I have learned so much. Question: How does one manage the fallout from a covert narcassist after discard when she is part of a network of friends.? I thought we were very good friends until she started passive aggressive discard behavior and became very friendly with one of the other members of the group. I have a wonderful group of friends and we are all mostly involved in the same Church groups. I have decided to minimize contact with narcissist- be cordial, kind, but not buddy buddy. It has co e to my attention that she has spread neg gossip about me; when she perceives that I am getting friendly with another she pulls out the charm and uses her charasmic traits to “love bomb” them or gifts them . How do I address this action to the new friend or should I just Ig or and hope the new friend will not take her seriously. She is well liked and is very cleaver with her actions/ manipulations. Thank you
I hope that little 6 year old girl is okay ✌
the husband❤! uncle of Six year olds Auntie❤
My heart breaks for the little girl who’s being cared for by relatives where the husband ignores her. He is more concerned with how her presence makes him appear to others, than that she needs love and acceptance. I hope she learns that Jesus loves her and her parents’ lives don’t affect her worth. I was a child like that too. My stepfather found out, when I was 7, that I’d been conceived in adultery. After that, he referred to me as “nothing but a bastard” and he also called me a “slut, tart and floozy”. Thankfully, society has largely let such judgement go. I like what Rick Warren says: “There are no illegitimate children; only illegitimate parents”.
Your mom married a mean man.
🫂
I am on my way out of a narcistic abusive relationship.
I know its gonna be hard. Your advice?
Take one full year of no dating & no addiction to break that trauma bond 💔❤️🩹♥️ I am over a year out & it just gets better ☮️
@@caroleminke6116I'd say 5 years at least.
@@caroleminke6116 congradulations!
My advice is to take things slowly to allow yourself time to process your feelings. I also agree with the first comment about not getting into another relationship within the first year. For me, I am not anywhere near ready after 17 months and this could be because I was married for 40+ years before ending the relationship, because I came from severe childhood abuse and because of the level of abuse I received from my ex-husband the last several months before I made him leave. I would take your time, have a safe net of safe people and if you are comfortable, a therapist who understands this type of abuse can be very helpful. My therapist has been a lifeline for me.
Chat conversation, extended : horror movie to recommend (and why, hopefully)
We can do Christmas movies in a week or two....
I liked "The Menu" w/Ralph Finnes (recent).
Why? Such a unique story line, lots of character development.
For a more vintage movie, IMO, you can't beat the original b/w "What Ever Happened To Baby Jane?" Davis/Crawford.
Why? The acting is superlative and it introduced the world to Victor Buono
Let me add anything on MeTV's Svengoolie show Saturday nights!
@ Lol. I’m there Saturday nights, too.
@ The Ghost & Mr. Chicken is about the closest I’ll get to horror.
👋
Was my dad I should say 🙄
I like Jacky. ❤
If i see a my granchild continually being emotionaly abused and two times it was severe is it wrong to tell his parents to stop it. I see narasistic behavior in the mother and it is vindictive and revengefull. She is abusive to me and others but when i see it used on my grandson i get upset.
That's a difficult one. One thing you can do is spend as much time as you can with him and be the affirming safe secure base. My grandmothers especially my father's mother gave me more of that than my mother, it makes a difference.
@@bereal6590 From my experience, I second your opinion. Two of my grandparents made a tremendous difference in my life.
My mother wasn't nurturing either. She busied herself with work cooking, cleaning. She would a mile at me sometimes, when I was doing or looking how she liked but there was never that close warm connection. To the outside it would look good, a mother with a neat dressed well behaved kid smiling but it all felt false. I feel fierce in my love for my cats (didn't have kids because I didn't want for them how I feel and I couldn't provide what they would need, it seemed selfish to do so), knowing what they need, their moods and calls. With my mother it was me trying to attune to her. It was pure luck if she was happy with me or not. Now I can't stand her hugging me, it feels so fake.