The Ministry of Magic's Dirty DARK Secret - Harry Potter Theory
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- Опубліковано 25 вер 2024
- Welcome to Harry Potter Theory. Today we’re discussing the VEIL. Deep within the heart of the Ministry of Magic lies a chilling enigma that has confounded wizards and witches for centuries - the Veil - a haunting manifestation nestled within the Death Chamber of the Department of Mysteries.
Its ethereal presence has long been regarded as a mystical and enigmatic artifact. But when faced with such an imposing structure, it’s hard not to ask questions like.. What IS it? Who created it? And how does the Veil connect to the wizarding world's understanding of life, death, and the beyond?
Furthermore, what if the Veil is not exactly what it seems? What if, hidden within its folds, lies a dark truth about the Ministry's sordid past?
Today we’re going to peel back the layers of secrecy that have long surrounded the Veil, and reveal a number of shocking revelations. For instance, what if I told you that the Ministry of Magic may have once employed the Veil for unimaginable, nefarious purposes? Prepare to question everything you thought you knew as we navigate the twisted corridors of the Ministry, uncovering a truth so haunting that it shaped the very foundations upon which this magical institution was built. Can you handle the truth that lies beyond the Veil?
Let’s dive in.
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What makes you think that the MoM does not STILL use the Veil for executions? After all, had Voldie been captured alive, no prison would have held him, and, so, sending him through The Veil could have been the only way to end his reign of terror.
You're right! It could definitely still be used
Idk man. Not sure id even wanna risk voldi.not really "DYING" and just being thrown in an ancient death world dude came back as a wisp. And you wanna throw him in a wisp world. Hard pass for me
Perfect punishment for Voltimart and Umbridge😂
I think it was used before the discovery of Azkaban.
@@Tropicsmoker22he can't come back through the veil so the main voldemort with the most information and context would have been forever locked away and I doubt he trusted anyone with his memories other than maybe nagini that said if he was thrown in alongside nagini being killed even if any of him ever came back and hadn't been destroyed it would have been a much weaker voldemort
I think instant painless death is much more humane than Azkaban. Like Herminone said "killed or worse, expelled"
Certainly if what you get expelled for lands you in Azkaban. Hagrid didnt though just the formal wand snap. Hermione was a goody two shoes for a period of the philosophers stone so getting expelled was horrible for her
1. Given where the Ministry of Magic is located, they would have had to do something to hide the Veil from Muggles. Building there might have been the combining of 2 efforts.
2. Is Azkaban more humane? During the Dementors era and for a life sentence, no. However, it was more "reversible". Marvolo Gaunt was released after serving his term. Hagrid was also released. Anyone eventually found innocent through more evidence could be released although they'd be traumatized. I think the Veil would be a more humane option than the Dementor's Kiss.
Good news, you don't immediately face death upon being found guilty, you can get freedom of it's proven you are Innocent, something a corpse and a dead person in the Vail can't get.
Strangely there is an ironic twist to the dementors. Sirius proves that Azkaban does not work well on the innocent.
If someone spends a year or two there and doesn't lose their minds they must be holding onto something powerful but unhappy, like the knowledge you've been falsely imprisoned.
The veil may have had another benefit for those in power. If going through the veil meant that the person had gone "on" and could not make the choice to remain, then those in power didn't have to risk being haunted by those executed.
Good one That was never mentioned in the fantastic beasts when they tried to execute Newt and tina .
The three worst fates from Harry Potter:
3. Avada Kedavra
2. Dementor's Kiss
1. Being Expelled
If it was an execution chamber it would have been a very humane way of putting someone to death. Remember what Sirius said to Harry in the forbidden forest, "It's easier than falling asleep". No blood and gore, and if the condemned didn't know what was about to happen there wouldn't even be the fear of death.
Sirius receiving a death matching the sentence they may have given him before dementors is kind of sickening.
Tbf, this theory about the death chamber only makes the tragedy of Sirius more powerful. He only did good, but was treated and died as a criminal. Maybe all marauders suffered their respective faiths for what they did in their teenage ages - privileged bullies who seemed to have the world at their feet.
Not really, due to going back in time to create an alternate timeline his death was actually inevitable just not by the ministry and guilty. You can’t stop a death from happening, it just happens at a different time in a different way.
It could serve as a place of study. Court rooms are not the only spaces designed the way the Veil room is. Lecture halls are another such place. What if the Veil room was a place of study?
Small correction about real-life history: hanging was NOT about snapping the neck. It was meant as an inhumane method of execution with beheading being the noble alternative...
Only rather recently (and mostly the USA and Britain), trapdoors were used to snap the neck, but for the most part of history hanging was done from trees or beams with no mechanical devices. Some, like the Austrians, didn't even bother to hoist up the victim but tied him up and let him stand for as long as he pleases... (or rather until the legs give in and he'll suffocate himself in the process, which was a very drawn out affair...). I'd like to mention two more aspects that are often overlooked:
1) There was the superstition that the soul would leave the body through the mouth and nostrils, but when hanged, it would have to leave through the other end... Thus, it was meant as a humiliation!
2) The more obvious way it was a humiliation was the fact that hanging was usually performed until the body decomposed to the point that it fell off the noose! Moreover, proper burials were denied for the most part. At times, retrieval of the body was punishable by death!
PS: there were other variants as well, the Greeks loved to hang people upside down, which would cause the blood to flow to the head before the noose tightened. The more famous version of course is curcifiction, which was also a form of hanging, both in terms that people died from suffocation, but also that the bodies were left to rot. In case, you don't know how people suffocate from it: when someone hangs unsupported (be it that the legs can no longer resist, or were smashed), then the weight of the legs would stretch out the torso, which would fatigue the lungs, resulting in a very slow form of strangulation.
Inhumane methods for inhumane people.
Awesome as always thanks ❤ you always come up with interesting content appreciate your hard work!
I suffer from psychosis. My whole life has been dwelling on dreams and forgetting to live.
I’m so sorry for you:(
@@Zoe397 no need to be. I found God and my mind is much more at peace, my medication helps too lol
@@sleepyhyrule6894 phew I’m so happy your okay
Surprised that they didn't have it covered to prevent accidents.
Department is reckless. Why else would they love potions or not take Harry seriously. Even though they knew the truth.😅
What would have happened if Voldemort went through the Veil before all the Horcruxes were destroyed?
I’m assuming something comparable to what happened when he tried to kill a baby Harry.
@@nocturne311 But could that ghost (for lack of a better term) version of Voldemort be able to come back through the veil and wait for new body like when he attacked Harry as a baby or would that version of him be stuck while his soul has still on this plain? If so I think that would be worse than death
@@stuffingtonjfluffypantsiiiIf I had to guess, I would think the latter, which is what I was going to say originally. I just didn’t want to sound presumptuous. That would indeed literally be a fate worse than death, agreed.
@stuffingtonjfluffypantsiii No. I when a Horcrux is made, it splits the soul in parts, meaning that the part of his soul that went through the Veil would have been destroyed or more moved on. Voldermort would have had to regenerate his physical self another way.
id assume the opposite of you guys ... i doubt Voldemort could went through the veil, no matter how hard trying
I think that whatever institution/magical collective preceed the MoM was built around the veil, and it is there chambers that became the department of mysteries and the other lowest rooms like the wizengamot court (which was likely the meeting/debating chamber like in the houses of parliament). So when the MoM was formed it was literally and also figuratively built on top of its predecessor and all of the building above this is MoM era. I think the Veils creation dates back to the earliest periods of magical history.
The theory of containment sounds exactly like something the SCP Foundation would do. However unlike the SCP Foundation, witches and wizards only need to obliviate someone. No amnestics needed. I’ll bet the SCP Foundation would love to be able to use memory charms just from a convenience standpoint. As it’s easier and faster to obliviate someone than strap them down and administer amnestics via hypodermic needle.
Love how many people still are connected to Harry Potter
Me I love it
I think the story could be better but the worldbuilding and characters are good in HP. What i really missed from HP was more wand-use. So far as i can tell Harry barely knows any spells after 6 years of magic school
Despite what JK became, the worldbuilding and the school story stuff was well done.
@@shinystarmiestudios4179what did Jk become lol?
@@DaVultureTTG a radical feminist with questionable proclamations and a very negative and unjustly generalizing view on trans people. quick to attack others
Amazing as always. Thank you, your hard work doesn’t go unnoticed xx
My guess would be that the Veil was created by one of the Peverell brothers.
Namely the one with the stone of resurrection ( wich he allso created himself ).
so if it connects to the after life is the resurection stone actually a part of it
I think the Veil and Resurrection Stone were both created by Cadmus Peverell. I doubt he got it right the first time... so the Veil could be a failed attempt at creating something like the Resurrection Stone.
This has been my assumption as well, so I agree with your theory
I think this is probably what JK had in mind. I doubt it’s an accident that she described it as she did. I’d say this goes beyond theory but not quite canon since it’s not 100% confirmed. But I’d say it’s definitely thannon.
Really weird coincidence
Was re listening to the Stephen fry audiobooks and finished order today just a few hours after you posted this
And i always thought it must be used for executions
Legilimency!
7:37 CAPTAIN JACK SPARROW!!!! AYYYY SAVY
What I could add as a further theory of the veils origin is that British witches and wizards found it in Ireland during the British colonization. Since that is what the area outside of Dublin during this of time was called the veil. Then they moved it to London, and built the ministry around it.
At the very least I'd have a plaque in place near everything with known info and warnings (if applicable) to avoid any accidents. In fact, rope or gate those kinds of things off. Way too many movies and TV shows used the top secret/need-to-know-basis/above-paygrade excuse to withhold information from people whos lives or wellbeing is at stake and in by doing so caused more harm than good. This is why I never saw the _Harry Potter_ Ministry of Magic as a 'good' bunch. It's a façade at best. In fact some of the members get their jollies off at killing people as seen in _Fantastic Beasts_ (2016) which involved Tina about to get killed ... by some magic goo or whatever.
In that kind of universe, I wouldn't be a criminal but sure would cause the Ministry a bunch of grief just for fun. They all have their heads up each others' rear ends as demonstrated in many scenes. Their "trace" on minors doesn't even work unless the scene needs it to. Remember after the Quidditch game when Death Eaters came through to wreck the camp? Barty Jr cast the Dark Mark into the sky, ran off when Harry's friends came around, then various ministry workers popped up ready to cause harm AND accused KIDS of casting the mark. I dunno, maybe Fudge's crippling incompetence rubbed off on everyone working under him.
Tina had been sentenced to death. It doesn't really matter the means, she was sentenced. It's no different than the death sentence in other countries.
The trace only detected magic near the minor. If there were adults around then they can't tell who did it and who didn't. This is explained. Really, it was only a deterrent for muggle borns. Magical parents were meant to keep their kids in check themselves.
The kids got accused because it was Harry's wand that cast it and they could show the last spell used. If someone fires a gun then runs off, handing you it in the process, the police are going to think it was you at first until the area is secured.
Thank you for another great video. Mischief managed!
kinda like in Fantastic Beasts there's an execution chamber 🤷
1672 C.E.? And studied; like a teaching hospital watching surgeries, high above - maybe both, using convicted criminals to study the veil
Thank you for continuing to post these videos! Always enjoy them.
I absolutely love Harry Potter Fanfiction and some of the subjects discussed on this channel lead me to believe that the creator/narrator is also a fan of fanfiction 😊
This is really close to one of the plot lines of my home brew DnD campaign I have written. Nice!❤
I think it makes sense wizards would have used public executions at the same time muggles did. I'm not sure about the part on building the MoM around the Veil though, there are so many ancient and powerful relics in the Department of Mysteries, why would the veil and the Death Chamber be more important and different than other artifacts? 🤔
That's just cruel.😶😡
Love your videos man❤
So JK rowling has gone on record saying she got huge inspiration from the bible. The "veil" in hebrew mysticism is a gateway for the living to actually step into "the next place" and be able to commune with spirits who have passed on this is a common belief in "Kabbalah" if you were unjust and unrighteous if you didnt have the favor of God you'd have your soul sucked out for eternity.
A Very Good Video 👌🏻👍🏻
Btw, what if you throw a dementor into the Veil?
It is probably created with the similar purpose of that pool with chair room in the Breast movie in MACUSA.
Great use of Monty Python's Holy Grail!!!!
If the MoM was built around it, the artifact would've been of Celtic/Druidic or Roman origin. Such a powerful artifact in the hands of the druids would most certainly require the cover of a sacred grove of trees. Were it of Roman origin, I'd expect it to have a more militaristic purpose and anything so powerful should certainly need to remain in Rome itself, not the hinterlands of the empire. All this to say, I think they brought it to England perhaps from the classical world like Elgin did with the marble relief that bears his name.
Possibly also muggles were executed there too. It was the witch trials and just after so maybe muggles were taken to be executed as a form of revenge for them doing it to the witches.
If the gateway (veil) was built a couple thousand years ago that would place it smack bang in the middle of the Golden era of Roman occupation. The rectangular room could also be Roman construction if that is indeed when the veil was created. I'm inclined to believe it is far older and was discovered by the Romans who in turn built the chamber and the chambers around it. And if this is the case it would not have been a place of horrors. It would have been a temple. Only the most trusted of the order that tended it would be allowed to enter the sanctum. This would have been seen as a gateway to the gods and only the most worthy would be allowed to pass through. With the fall of the Roman empire it would be abandoned to be rediscovered years later. Even then, the use would only be for the most worthy because it lacks the kind of spectacle people had become accustomed to. People wanted to see hangings, beheadings, they wanted the condemn drawn and quartered and the parts would go on tour throughout the kingdom. We don't get any of that with the veil. Someone goes through, it's quick, it's clean, nothing to tidy up, and no spectacle.
If the magic world wouldn't be so medieval with the instruments and tools they use, they could have send probes or cameras to the other side to see what's there or what happens. It's stunning to me that the mere concept of science doesn't exist in that world. They don't question or test anything besides spells, potions and maybe wands. They live like 5000 years ago but with magic. They still believe so much in Divination and Fortune Telling that they teach it at the school and even so, there are too many wizards that doesn't believe in that crap. They only study their magic animals and ignore all the rest that live on this planet like they don't exist at all and would never encounter one. It's incoherent that Victor Krum transformed his head into a shark during the Three Wizards Cup but they never even mention about having a biology class where they are been taught all the non-magical ones or what are cells, how they body works, etc. Every city in the world has been made by muggles, they live in those cities and when you look where the wizards live, their houses and buildings in general looks like they were made by a kid with no sense of architecture or engineering, the buildings are still standing because of magic, ironically. Muggles are a WAY MORE advance society than wizards. They went to the moon, they study the universe, they created Hadron Colliders to study particles, they have weapons capable of destroy an entire city and killing millions of people and wizards has this veil that no one knows who made it, where did it came from and how it works besides the obvious thing. Muggle-borns wizards are kinda being downgraded to ignorance by being inserted into the magic world. Yet wizards see the muggles as weirdos with odd lives that nothing they do makes sense, while it's the other way around. They are like cavemen that lived all their lives so much in a box that once they see what's out there, they ended up amazed even not knowing and many of the things they use were made by muggles... LIKE FREAKIN TRAINS LIKE THE HOGWARTS EXPRESS, BROOMS, ETC. If it were up to wizards to create a transportation method they would just take a rock and make it fly. They are the primitive ones, not muggles.
The Veil was used to execute muggles, who were highly religious, to "capture their soul".
I thought this might be the case the first time I read the book oh so long ago. It just made sense to me. Makes even more sense now that I know I'm not the only one that thought it.
Given the presence of dementors at Azkaban, no, I believe it is less humane because it is a form of cruel long term torture that is beyond breaking a persons mind as it also permanently affects their soul given enough time and exposure. Even if you aren't killed necessarily, this is not as reversible and merciful as people seem to think.
This creator loves that stock photo of the pitchfork and the fiery background. Finds its way into every vid 😂
In order is the intention then I think the Ministry being build around it is a good shout. As for morality, Azkaban is certainly a deserved punishment for some.. like Patricia Rakepick. But some went for minor stuff. Like being an unregistered animagius is worse than being a murderer🤔
A method of execution. Like the pool in Macusa.
Could it be possible that so many people/witches and wizards were killed under that archway leaving a Hotspot of magical energy and thinning the veil between life and death?
Great work ❤
They could've used to rip away the soul of the wizards hands, like oruchimaru with death
Best vid yet
I think you are right. It makes a lot of sense. ❤
Interesting...very interesting.
That monstrosity killed my love Sirius Black 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭🖤🖤🖤🖤🖤🖤🖤
I wonder if the veil and Azkaban are connected. If the souls sent to the veil are transformed into dementors, then eventually, the ministry would have too many dementors to deal with. Instead, they send prisoners to Azkaban to stay in the same place as the previously 'executed' criminals.
Definitely, it is a very plausible theory. I wonder why it isn't more widespread. I only think that it wasn't for public executions. The people present were perhaps the judges, officials and perhaps some sort of elected witnesses. After all, public executions could have been practiced elsewhere, and that was a small hall for thousands of people who usually saw such things in the real world. In addition to such use, however, it could have served some more mystical purposes: if we take times far beyond the scope of the Ministry, the artefact could have been used to transcend mortal flesh, to be purified (the body disappears). On a darker note, it could have been a place of human sacrifice to some ancient gods (some monsters may be dwellling on the other side of the Veil).
I believe most witches and wizards are just re-used like you know there spirt and magic is put into the next witch or wizard that has blood that could be magical and has a similar soul and that when Sirus went through the vale all chance of that happening diminished and that was why it was such a artefact I also belive ariannas spirt may have been give to hermione because I believe that for some people it takes longer for there souls to cross over
The biggest problem I have with the theory that the Ministry was built around the arch is that the Ministry is located miles below London. How did the arch get down there? Was London a canyon originally? Just because an arch is crumbly and looks like it could fall down at any minute doesn't mean it wasn't built in 1707 when the Ministry was formed. England is dotted with old and crumbly castles from the medieval and renaissance period as many of us who have played Hogwarts Legacy can attest to.
Miles below? Really?
@@untitled6391 It's actually 10 stories below
It's fairly common for cities/towns to be built over the remains of older cities/towns. If I remember right, Seattle is an example, as is NYC. Dirt and stuff accumulates or is purposely put over them so that new can be built.
@@nsmccoy224 Also wouldn't be surprised if an artefact as powerful as the veil was deliberately buried to try and keep it from being found again if attempts to destroy it failed.
It is many thousands, perhaps many tens of thousands of years old. People like to speculate about lost advanced civilisations, what if they just got it wrong and it was just extremely powerful magic at play? What if this veil was meant to function in a similar manner to the Stargate due to the complexities and limitations of apparition; but with the other end destroyed it's now a gateway to death as opposed to a gateway to say another country or continent?
We've got the vanishing cabinet that worked in a similar manner. Perhaps this was the OG version of that sort of magic but people now fundamentally misunderstand it much like how a lot of locations and artefacts get labelled as "religious" if we can't determine its purpose.
What if the veil was a naturally occuring thing, like a concentration of magic that was so high that it latched itself onto something like the archway and then created the gateway. I just don't think any witch or wizard, or any group of them would be able to have created this. Frankly, its just as much of a stain on the natural order as creating horcruxes is, you'd be bridging a path between life and death and while no that doesn't necessarily infer the intent, but I mean, I can't really see that being used for good. Point is, I don't think the veil was created, I think it was naturally occurring, found long ago, and was moved to the department later down the line. I do think they definitely experimented on it, but I very much don't believe anyone created it. I'm not saying its entirely impossible, just that its more likely for it to be natural than made by witches/wizards.
What does haggord mean
If Dobby and Dementors found Harry at the Dursleys then why couldn't the Death Eaters?
House elf magic is different than wizard magic so many of the natural magical laws and applied spells don't apply to them - example, house elves can disapparate in Hogwarts but wizards cant.
And the dementors didn't find Harry at the Dursleys, they found him in a walkway a few blocks away from the Dursley's, where Harry wasn't protected by his mother's love.
If Dementors were sent to get Harry by waiting in the area of the Dursleys then why weren't Death Eaters?
@@erickinahan3970 Because the Dementors were sent by Delores Umbrage who wasn't a Death Eater. But, technically, V could've sent Death Eaters to get Harry from the Dursley neighborhood at any time but didn't. I've wondered that part myself.
mcousa has a similar item in its basement
I only started looking at this stuff because I’m enjoying the game so? Books or movies?
keep it safe... _for them_
I'd pick that Vail any day over Azkaban and the Dementors. lol
Its an arena were the would train aurors threw a troll in there or somethin smaller an they would have to manovuer it in the veil or touch it
👍
We know American wizards execute but Britian never did we never hear of that .
can you handle the re - Veilations
The Veil seems like a thing that should have been destroyed long ago.
Or, in the very least, experimented with. Maybe a way could be found to go through and return. It could become a sort of Orpheus Gate,.so that you could venture into the Underworld and bring people back. It could be used to defeat Death once and for all. The greatest thing a wizard could accomplish.
🦁🦁🦁🦁🦁 THE LION WAS HERE 🦁🦁🦁🦁🦁 No. 690
😊🎉🎇🦁
could very well be an execution chamber, after all we see one exactly in the Americas that almost killed Newt and Tina
So what it's a movie not realistic life it's fantasy
👍👍👍
Hi Harry Potter fan here can I be pinned
Everyone here is???
📌
❤❤❤❤
@@untitled6391 I know I was just saying so it doesn’t just say can I be pinned
@@jakemcfarland164 you must be a child
So who's cares great movie though
First ;)
You aren't even first
Last, fir now😅😊😂