A lot of people sadly are shortsighted just because Sauber is struggling right now. Short term issue. Audi is the long-term goal. Kinda wish they didn't sack Seidl, since he was instrumental in Porsche's return to Endurance dominance in the mid 10's.
Audi should be able to bring in better talent than Red Bull was able to at thr beginning. That isn't a guarantee of anything of course. It is F1 after all.
@@sigmablock i think seidl, more than anything could have also been one of the problems at sauber, remember he was also instrumental in making mclaren the slowest car at the start of 2022
Hülkenberg must be the most cursed driver on the grid he’s missed out on the Mercedes seat to Hamilton,Ferrari seat to Räikkönen,Red Bull seat to Perez,sacked by Renault despite being pivotal to getting them up the grid then Joins Sauber and they become the slowest team by a long distance.
@@Ruefus Move fast, break stuff. This season and next are a write off. They're putting as much resources into the next car and expanding facilities as possible. TBH they should just go over the cost cap, what is the FIA gonna do? Fine them? Woopty do, they have tons of money.
I think the biggest thing is that once Audi signed on the line, Sauber had no reason to invest any more than the bare minimum to keep the team going. They collected money from Stake/Kick, Alfa Romeo and whoever Zhou brings along, and it's FAR easier to just put it in your pocket than to invest in the team that you effectively don't own anymore. They won't get to reap the rewards in the long term, so why invest in the long term? Any other team has a driver that's constantly 30-40 seconds off the other would have sacked said driver by now. They have other drivers they could put in there. Pourchaire, for instance, even if it's a Colapinto-like drive. Or maybe Ferrari would pay them to put Schwartzman in the car for a few races. Either way, Audi created the situation by paying up front. There's no incentive for Sauber to improve. If Audi was forward thinking, they would have included a clause that for every place above 10th that you get in the constructors, it's an extra $25M or something silly like that. Give Sauber motivation to compete.
They also let their drivers handle things like calling your grandma or making an origami swan before letting the car go. Sauber actually has maybe the fastest pitstop crew in F1. I heard Bottas came to pit and filed his tax returns in less than 35 seconds and only lost 7 places! That is peak F1!
Poor Bottas... Was given a tractor, still ahead of his team mate constantly, and not being taken seriously by Sauber. Hulkenberg/Bottas line up would be fire!
Audi has mismanaged this project for a few years. Instead of integrating Sauber, they left it alone against what Seidl wanted. By the time it was too late, infighting started and forced Seidl out. Audi will need years to succeed as even with a good engine, the team has to invest a lot into aerodynamic and engineering prowess. That wheel nut issue at the start of this season was just embarrassing.
There are some parallels to Mercedes after they bought Brawn. Mercedes didn't initially realise what a year of under investment had done to set the team back, despite winning both titles in 2009. As a result, rather than the off the shelf race winner and title challenger, Mercedes had 2 winless seasons after purchasing Brawn, finishing 4th in the Constructors Championship both years and despite scoring a pole and a win in 2012 (two if you count Schumacher's fastest time in Q3 at Monaco before a 5 place grid drop from Spain was appiled), they slipped even lower to 5th in the Constructors Championship by the time they recruited Lewis Hamilton.
And that was inheriting a championship team. Audi are ingeriting the team that was and still is the worst car in the grid by some margin, never even close to sniffing points except a couple of weekends, despite bringing upgrades to the car constantly. They are not just last, they are last and dont know how to fix it
But Mercedes were inheriting a team that had a) just won b) billions poured into infrastructure by Honda c) the second greatest mind in putting together winning cars in the modern F1 era (1990+) and d) it only took them one season to realize their cheap budget wouldn’t cut it.
It took Red Bull 7 years to catch up to Merc (and that's WITH Adrian Newey), it took McLaren over a decade to win a race. So 2 years is literally nothing. Saubers best performances (in the WCC) were 2007 (2nd) and 2008 (3rd), so maybe expectations of immediate improvement are a bit unrealistic.
Why do these board members always need a timeline to be champion? It just seems so naive to say "we will win a championship by year XXXX".. Instead, just plan to do your best every year and see where it takes you. Timelines in F1 do not work.
because investors love timelines, or more like, they demand it. thats why all companies give out some form of timeline regardless of how bullshit sounding the timeline may be.
@@Lora_Beolab Yup, definitely mental illness to want to existing teams to not be greedy jerks and follow the rules they themselves put in place around an 11th team joining the grid.
@@leghumper83 Sauber is an engineering company (much like Haas). Just because the founder isn't in charge anymore doesn't mean they have to rebrand. Otherwise Ferrari woudn't be Ferrari anymore (same goes for porsche, peugeot, citroen, ford....)
If Audi thought they could win with Sauber before 2028, they were absolutely dreaming. Any F1 fan can see where Sauber is right now, even without all the inside info Audi has. Hopefully, Binotto’s experience can shake things up though as I would love to see another team fighting at the front of the grid!
A huge whiff. The big difference so far though is that it’s been a lack of investment, unlike Toyota, that’s been one of the main problems so far. It’s like they believed all they needed to do was make an engine and the chassis side didn’t require investment or a coherent management plan to become a winner.
Honestly the fact they are announcing this publicly is a great sign. Toyota never seemed to get the memo that they were shit until it was wayyyyyy too late.
Except the people that were anti Andretti. The anti Andretti people kept saying that Audi has a proven racing track record....F1 will be a breeze for them!
I can’t believe Audi is going to invest heavily in f1 considering the challenges the VW group is facing. But then again what do I know? Greetings from Denmark
I really hope they work some magic - Audi has always succeeded in everything they’ve entered and it would be painful for them to “chuck a Toyota” when they finally enter the biggest series of all.
@@mineralwater6736 it is true. Ask Toyota how difficult F1 was. Meanwhile Ferrari can go and win in WEC immediately while there’s all this talk about 3-5 year plans for winning in F1.
And Audi was given the "green light" to join F1 because they're a manufacturer, are good in motorsport, know what to do blah blah blah etc etc, but Andretti 🤷♂️🤦♂️ They are in many different racing categories etc, but it's NO to them. Now GM has taken their place and should be in F1 soon.
Because they didn't rock the boat, that was their only concern SauberAudi staying where they are makes no difference to FOM/Liberty, because it's maintaining the status quo
Unless you're based in the UK or Italy, where there is the depth of F1 engineering talent readily available, it's hard to be successful in formula 1. Simple
@@Ariespradana13 I dunno it is as if they are afraid of demand or something.. At least they got the A6 EV out.. Though not in series production quite yet (2025 model year)..
Volkswagen and Audi are both doomed as they are legacy petrol car companies with no viable EV strategy. Struggling companies which are facing inevitable bankruptcy ought not to be experimenting with pointless and expensive vanity projects.
You are onto something. The only current teams associated with car manufacturing brands (McLaren, Ferrari, Aston Martin, Mercedes) are low production car brands, while high production brands (Toyota, Honda team) have failed, and I think that correlates with this companies being too corporate to really dedicate fully to a F1 project, which is very costly and competitive. Audi is a low production brand, yes, but at the end of the day it is managed by the Volkswagen Group, who expect to see results in the short term like they do with their road cars. Of course, the mere fact of being a low production brand doesn’t necessarily translates into success either, but it seems to me like the trend is that this high production car companies usually have a hard time in F1 (one exception being Renault in the Alonso era, and look how quickly that went downhill and where they are now) because what works to sell cars massively doesn’t work to win races.
You also have to bear in mind that Audi is a subsidary to VW. And VW ist struggling quite big at the moment. Thinking about closing assembly plants in Germany for the first time in their history and also and quitting an agreement, protecting workers from layoffs. I think there is a chance, this project is going to get cancelled, before it even begins.
To be fair this video tells me Audi identified the problem and has started to work on it. I mean "THE RACE" said it themselves that bringing an F1 team to competitive levels is a years process and they quoted Red Bull and others, which is true. They will be fine in the end!
Audi have killed off their Dakar project, the stillborn LMDH car and their highly successful GT3 and TCR customer programmes for THIS. If they don't start winning by 2028, it will be a huge failure for them.
I think Binotto is on the right track, and the plan sounds good in theory. Sometimes its much easier to see all the problems from the outside, and it looks like there are a lot of basic ones that need to get aligned. In any case looking forward to seeing this team be less anonymous. If not, theres no reason for them to take up Andretti's seat.
Yeah, the Great Audi Master🅱️lan! Seriously though, I used to work for one of their suppliers. They are behind schedule, completely clueless about F1 and will suck just as bad as Toyota if not worse.
@@FoxvalleyproductionBuying Alpine was never an option for them. Just because many think they are now considering selling, doesn’t mean they were then. Besides, with all the crazy French business and labor laws, it would likely have been a very complicated purchase on top of everything else. Even if the latter isn’t true, the team simply wasn’t available at the time nor is it now.
Andretti Karma: They recjected Andretti entry for lack of potential to produce a competitive car. Audi will probably not be able to do that In fact it would be surprising, given that Renault - which had been that for decades as a full team or PU provider - also couldnt put a winning car on track.
I like an underdog and LOVED the Alfa Romeo liveried Sauber. But i dont like Audi (having done some work with them on road car(s)... horrible, arrogant bunch), so dont care for Sauber now. They are in their deserved position. I still will Williams to do well. I did work with them back in 2001 alongside some work for Jaguar. The difference in attitude and professionalism clearly showed why Williams were one of the top teams. I can't wait for them to be back where they belong...the top.
As a RedBull fan, i honestly believe in Audi's F1 project, i mean, it would take quite few year to build a good car, but if they make the right choices maybe they will have a chance in F1
I think Audi made the mistake of not making the final sale price determined by the number of points Sauber had in each of these last 2 seasons. It appears that Sauber have abandoned the team since the sale and has put in zero effort.
Lol, or bring down the standard of F1 development, tech and engineering and team managed to a level akin to a LMP1 programme, and Audi might have a chance.
It's interesting to me, as a Brazilian, how different international media, such as here, and the national media treat the Bortoleto-Audi rumors. Most reports I've seen say that Bottas is the favorite to get the seat, but the Brazilian ones are all adamant that Bortoleto is the favorite. Even linking it with a new broadcasting deal for the country. While I would love to see him in F1, it would be at least weird if Sauber/Audi choose him instead of Pouchaire or Maloney as they're academy drivers
There’s a pattern with teams who’ve been in top level sportscar racing, and done well, but find themselves unable to crack F1 as a team, or just an engine supplier. BMW, Peugeot, Toyota and now Audi. But when the opposite happens, success, like Ferrari winning Le Mans twice since joining the WEC and Alpine being more competitive in their first season with a Hypercar compared to some other teams who’ve been in the WEC for longer.
I mean, what did they expect? Its a catch 22. You bring in your own people, no experience, so chances of making waves are minimal. On the other hand, you retain most of the people from the outgoing team for their experience, which they haven't done anything but go backwards and your chances of making waves are also minimal.
Sauber/Audi squandered their start- up. They stopped development and upgrades on the current car allowing it to fall too far behind, then failed to sign Sainz. Sainz and Bottas would have made a great team. They just stopped trying and now it’s a big catch up game.
I’ve said it before, but Audi went in to F1 thinking it’s previous WEC programme and it’s experience in the top level of sportscar racing would suffice in preparing them for F1. They thought they could walk straight in and have a team that was well organised and a car that would be competitive. It seems they’re finding out that F1 is leagues ahead of the WEC, where technology, engineering, design and how a team is managed and run is on a different planet compared to running a LMP1 car.
Bothas not having a drive is so strange. Driven so well this year, he’s a team player, great marketing individual, cheap, consistent….. he kinda has it all….
So, one of them is handling day-to-day stuff whilst the other one is handling big picture stuff. That worked out so well for Jim and Michael. Where would the world be without the two popes?
Audi haven't even started and have already been messing things up royally. What exactly was the point of buying a team and waiting two years doing absolutely nothing with it until they get started as Audi? They should have bought 100% of the team and started full operations as soon as the ink was on the paper. They would have been much further along in getting the team to a better position by now. Another example of them just messing around wasting time is the driver situation. Just sign Bottas, he's the obvious choice. What I wouldn't give for an F1 series with no manufacturer teams, only independent racing teams.
Given how they were sleeping at the start, at least with Döllner and Binotto they sound like they are finally straightening things out and actually progress things at a reasonable pace. Might still flop but slightly more optimistic now.
Even if they would be 11th for 2-3 seasons (veeeeery likely no matter what), there is no real argument against letting them in. Except ofcourse - financial side for other teams. No need to hide that behind "legacy" or whatever crap they are trying to say.
Under the proposed structure if it goes wrong on track will it be Binotto’s fault or Wheatley’s and will the same person take all the credit for any success?
There's almost two years, till they come in. And during that time, we'll be dragged through speculations like this, perfect for clicks, and nothing more. "Well, Svend, don't click then!" Well, I won't.
Binotto summed it up nicely, the job of his life, every member from owner to mechanic, driver to marketer, everyone will give 110% and I wish them nothing but success. What a story it would be for Audi to turn it around and live the f1 dream. I’m a Hamilton fan so Ferrari it is but good luck Audi nonetheless 👍🏼
Everyone laughed whrn I commented on this channel that 3 years to be race winners was a ridiculous plan that would never happen. All the responses of "audi always wins whenever they join a series" and "you dont know what your talking about". Ive watched F1 for almost 4 decades now. In the 37 years, only Brawn GP was a team that found immediate success. And that was a freak occurance because if loop holes in the rules.
Duh. Yet, when it comes to Alpine, any move away from full manufacturer control is mocked as obviously being a foolish move. They’re letting their Flavio grudge compromise objectivity.
I don't get it. the same corporate guy that says "I will personally be more involved in f1 more intensely" also says "f1 project will be absolutely independent"
Volkswagen and Audi are both doomed as they are legacy petrol car companies with no viable EV strategy. Struggling companies which are facing inevitable bankruptcy ought not to be experimenting with pointless and expensive vanity projects.
Nico has to be questioning his choices - other than that sweet Audi-funded paycheck. I can't see how Audi will be able to keep their corporate hands out of the team.
oh boy - Seidl must have bruised delicate egos - Bottas was surprised to see them leave as well - the corporates definitely have ego issues and having smarter people in specialized roles
But guys, please correct me if I am wrong. Ferrari is not shsring their current data on the "possible" 2026 engine. But from what sauber/audi can take over, the Ferrari IP can lead to a good expertise to statt the audi 2026 engine development, right?
I cannot believe that James Key has not been fired yet. It did not take much time for Alpine to get rid of Harman and De Beer when their new F1 proved to be a total failure.
They'll get there eventually and are definitely a solid successor to Sauber. Now if only we could get other interested parties to buyout Alpine and Haas.
Who knew? It’s very little to do with Sauber and everything to do with how difficult it is for new teams joining F1, irrespective of who you are. Verprung Durch Technik apparently
Yes, and they went for the guy who threw away race wins and a championship by making dumb decisions. Unless it is a technical role, do not appoint Binotto.
Bottas deserves better than this vacillation. A Hulkenburg- Bottas driver lineup would allow much more focus upon other areas of team development, + valuable input from two highly experienced drivers. From a marketing standpoint, Nico and Valtteri are familiar names and faces, + that helps in building an identity and fanbase for the team. Just sign VB, + you can concentrate on other things.
Volkswagen and Audi are both doomed as they are legacy petrol car companies with no viable EV strategy. Struggling companies which are facing inevitable bankruptcy ought not to be experimenting with pointless and expensive vanity projects.
@sirgobbledygook I think that is a bit short-sighted. Granted he did a bad job at Audi, he did transform the McLaren team to a race winner from 2019 to 2021.
Just a reminder: Red Bull, Christian Horner and Adrian Newey needed 5 years to build a winning team from the ashes of Jaguar.
A lot of people sadly are shortsighted just because Sauber is struggling right now. Short term issue. Audi is the long-term goal.
Kinda wish they didn't sack Seidl, since he was instrumental in Porsche's return to Endurance dominance in the mid 10's.
Audi should be able to bring in better talent than Red Bull was able to at thr beginning. That isn't a guarantee of anything of course. It is F1 after all.
@@rkan2you think Audi should be able to do better than Adrian Newey? Gonna need to see your math there.
But Horner was able to improve the team operation in the 1st season using the car develop by Jaguar, Audi has been the opposite 😰
@@sigmablock i think seidl, more than anything could have also been one of the problems at sauber, remember he was also instrumental in making mclaren the slowest car at the start of 2022
Sainz definitely dodged a bullet.
😂 what are you even saying
He already hitted a bullet by joining Williams.
Thats not sure, 2026 is a new car and and Audi should be able to make a great car.
@@WernerRachtman same thing applies to Williams, nobody knows just yet
Well, Williams has 6 points
Hülkenberg must be the most cursed driver on the grid he’s missed out on the Mercedes seat to Hamilton,Ferrari seat to Räikkönen,Red Bull seat to Perez,sacked by Renault despite being pivotal to getting them up the grid then Joins Sauber and they become the slowest team by a long distance.
I had to agree!! The guy is so talented was touted to be atleast a multiple race winner but his f1 record gas gone for worst
Wait Ferrari?
At least he has experience and good low tier driver
I think all those teams will be happy with the decisions they made at the time
And I thought Alonso's luck was bad.
If Audi are really caught out by how bad Sauber are, well that’s on them. Pay attention
Sauber was demonstrably better before Audi took more control. That's on Audi.
@@RuefusSauber has been utter dogshit for over a decade now, what are you even waffling about?
@@Ruefus Move fast, break stuff. This season and next are a write off. They're putting as much resources into the next car and expanding facilities as possible. TBH they should just go over the cost cap, what is the FIA gonna do? Fine them? Woopty do, they have tons of money.
@@meikgeik they are playing the long game maximizing the wind tunnel time by being the slowest team
@@Ruefus haters gonna hate. Audi enters 2026 season you mo. ron
I think the biggest thing is that once Audi signed on the line, Sauber had no reason to invest any more than the bare minimum to keep the team going. They collected money from Stake/Kick, Alfa Romeo and whoever Zhou brings along, and it's FAR easier to just put it in your pocket than to invest in the team that you effectively don't own anymore. They won't get to reap the rewards in the long term, so why invest in the long term? Any other team has a driver that's constantly 30-40 seconds off the other would have sacked said driver by now. They have other drivers they could put in there. Pourchaire, for instance, even if it's a Colapinto-like drive. Or maybe Ferrari would pay them to put Schwartzman in the car for a few races. Either way, Audi created the situation by paying up front. There's no incentive for Sauber to improve. If Audi was forward thinking, they would have included a clause that for every place above 10th that you get in the constructors, it's an extra $25M or something silly like that. Give Sauber motivation to compete.
Also Sauber holding slowest average pitstop.
They must be also refuelling while pitstop.
They also let their drivers handle things like calling your grandma or making an origami swan before letting the car go. Sauber actually has maybe the fastest pitstop crew in F1. I heard Bottas came to pit and filed his tax returns in less than 35 seconds and only lost 7 places! That is peak F1!
I heard a rumour they changed wheel bearings every tyre change.
I heard they have a Costa Coffee and working bathroom in the Pitt Lane
still 8th in the pitstop standings, above Williams and Haas
Though they had quite fast pitstops recently, definitely faster than 3 sec pitstop Haas. That's for sure
Poor Bottas... Was given a tractor, still ahead of his team mate constantly, and not being taken seriously by Sauber. Hulkenberg/Bottas line up would be fire!
Bottas should have been taken on by Mercedes for next year - 10 time winner with them and countless podiums. Let Kimi grow up a bit.
@@freddiefreihofer7716 Bottas Russell would be a frosty pairing though
@@ryclemo4942 Good point. I forgot that Mercedes/Williams double wreck. George was furious.
Audi has mismanaged this project for a few years. Instead of integrating Sauber, they left it alone against what Seidl wanted. By the time it was too late, infighting started and forced Seidl out. Audi will need years to succeed as even with a good engine, the team has to invest a lot into aerodynamic and engineering prowess. That wheel nut issue at the start of this season was just embarrassing.
There are some parallels to Mercedes after they bought Brawn. Mercedes didn't initially realise what a year of under investment had done to set the team back, despite winning both titles in 2009. As a result, rather than the off the shelf race winner and title challenger, Mercedes had 2 winless seasons after purchasing Brawn, finishing 4th in the Constructors Championship both years and despite scoring a pole and a win in 2012 (two if you count Schumacher's fastest time in Q3 at Monaco before a 5 place grid drop from Spain was appiled), they slipped even lower to 5th in the Constructors Championship by the time they recruited Lewis Hamilton.
And that was inheriting a championship team.
Audi are ingeriting the team that was and still is the worst car in the grid by some margin, never even close to sniffing points except a couple of weekends, despite bringing upgrades to the car constantly. They are not just last, they are last and dont know how to fix it
But Mercedes were inheriting a team that had a) just won b) billions poured into infrastructure by Honda c) the second greatest mind in putting together winning cars in the modern F1 era (1990+) and d) it only took them one season to realize their cheap budget wouldn’t cut it.
@@The_ZeroLine Also Merc knew of the 2014 engine regulations ahead of everyone else.
@@Ale-nv2bo What? I thought Lewis designed and built their PU. 😉
It took Red Bull 7 years to catch up to Merc (and that's WITH Adrian Newey), it took McLaren over a decade to win a race. So 2 years is literally nothing. Saubers best performances (in the WCC) were 2007 (2nd) and 2008 (3rd), so maybe expectations of immediate improvement are a bit unrealistic.
Red bull had a better chassis, their deficit to merc was on the engine side
Why do these board members always need a timeline to be champion? It just seems so naive to say "we will win a championship by year XXXX"..
Instead, just plan to do your best every year and see where it takes you. Timelines in F1 do not work.
Yes - even when you're Successful. Kubika's 2008 title run aborted after his 1st win. Cuz BMW scheduled the title for 2009. 🤦♂
because investors love timelines, or more like, they demand it. thats why all companies give out some form of timeline regardless of how bullshit sounding the timeline may be.
Your routine reminder that Andretti is still not allowed on the grid despite this being the competition in the pinnacle of motorsport.
Right.
oh dear, once again Andretti glazers will keep on blindly glazing andretti and not recognize their mentaI iIIness...
@@Lora_Beolab Yup, definitely mental illness to want to existing teams to not be greedy jerks and follow the rules they themselves put in place around an 11th team joining the grid.
so Audi is essentially a German version of Renault with these 3-5 year plans to compete and the car company having turnover every 2-3 years
It seems like this looking at this today
Sauber - Mercedes (average, early start)
Sauber - BMW (1 win, several podiums, good)
Sauber - Audi . lets see
It won't be Sauber - Audi though mate. It's just Audi... Fyi
@@cornedenecker1636 my bad
Not really sure why it’s been named Sauber, other than “legacy” reasons since 2016 when Peter Sauber sold his share and was replaced as chairman.
@@LSchelvin71 haha all good man.
@@leghumper83 Sauber is an engineering company (much like Haas). Just because the founder isn't in charge anymore doesn't mean they have to rebrand. Otherwise Ferrari woudn't be Ferrari anymore (same goes for porsche, peugeot, citroen, ford....)
If Audi thought they could win with Sauber before 2028, they were absolutely dreaming. Any F1 fan can see where Sauber is right now, even without all the inside info Audi has. Hopefully, Binotto’s experience can shake things up though as I would love to see another team fighting at the front of the grid!
This has more than a wiff of Toyota F1 about it.
A huge whiff. The big difference so far though is that it’s been a lack of investment, unlike Toyota, that’s been one of the main problems so far. It’s like they believed all they needed to do was make an engine and the chassis side didn’t require investment or a coherent management plan to become a winner.
Yeah been thinking that for a while now. This could easily be Toyota all over again
They definately should go for Bottas, he has A LOT of experiance and hes an insanely good qualifyer
Mercedes should have gone with Bottas for next year.
@@freddiefreihofer7716 Bottas doesn't want just 1 year contract.
Audi's F1 problems are not worse than feared. They're pretty much what anyone who's watched F1 for more than a month expected.
VW should be more concerned about their very survival than spending money on F1.
Honestly the fact they are announcing this publicly is a great sign. Toyota never seemed to get the memo that they were shit until it was wayyyyyy too late.
@@bunsw2070 It's Audi's money.
I give'm like 4 years and they'll just bail on F1
Except the people that were anti Andretti. The anti Andretti people kept saying that Audi has a proven racing track record....F1 will be a breeze for them!
How can Audi VW close factories for cost saving, and start a f1 team that burns cash?
I can’t believe Audi is going to invest heavily in f1 considering the challenges the VW group is facing. But then again what do I know? Greetings from Denmark
I really hope they work some magic - Audi has always succeeded in everything they’ve entered and it would be painful for them to “chuck a Toyota” when they finally enter the biggest series of all.
F1 is different from anything else. Being successful in other series is pretty irrelevant
@@paperplane-db8qf not true.
@@mineralwater6736 it is true. Ask Toyota how difficult F1 was.
Meanwhile Ferrari can go and win in WEC immediately while there’s all this talk about 3-5 year plans for winning in F1.
@@paperplane-db8qf but Audi had success not only on WEC. Everything is different.
What is really important is that there is no Andretti.
👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼 100%
Good
Well said
And Audi was given the "green light" to join F1 because they're a manufacturer, are good in motorsport, know what to do blah blah blah etc etc, but Andretti 🤷♂️🤦♂️
They are in many different racing categories etc, but it's NO to them. Now GM has taken their place and should be in F1 soon.
I wonder if we’re gonna see Steiner more at races with Binotto being back 👀
Reminder that F1 kept using Audi as an example of how a team should enter the grid when it rejected andretti...
Because they didn't rock the boat, that was their only concern
SauberAudi staying where they are makes no difference to FOM/Liberty, because it's maintaining the status quo
I know indirectly an engineer currently working on Audi’s F1 engine, they are facing massive problems ATM, they are lacking both funding and knowhow
Unless you're based in the UK or Italy, where there is the depth of F1 engineering talent readily available, it's hard to be successful in formula 1. Simple
@@jules153 I am from Reggio Emilia
@@giannisupereroe2189 good to hear. Any engineers moving from there to Audi/Sauber?
@@jules153 Oh I don’t know about that, all I heard from him say is that they’re currently way, way behind in the engine development
@@jules153 didn't Honda disprove that?
They say Audi F1 won't be “Final product” untill 2027
Lets see if they get the Audi A8 EV out before that. :D Promised for this year and suddenly there is no dates anymore lol.
@@rkan2 really 😱
@@Ariespradana13 I dunno it is as if they are afraid of demand or something.. At least they got the A6 EV out.. Though not in series production quite yet (2025 model year)..
On the up-side, they can't do worse than Sauber is doing now ...
This is why commercial car manufactures are not the best option to run a F1 project
Volkswagen and Audi are both doomed as they are legacy petrol car companies with no viable EV strategy. Struggling companies which are facing inevitable bankruptcy ought not to be experimenting with pointless and expensive vanity projects.
You are onto something. The only current teams associated with car manufacturing brands (McLaren, Ferrari, Aston Martin, Mercedes) are low production car brands, while high production brands (Toyota, Honda team) have failed, and I think that correlates with this companies being too corporate to really dedicate fully to a F1 project, which is very costly and competitive.
Audi is a low production brand, yes, but at the end of the day it is managed by the Volkswagen Group, who expect to see results in the short term like they do with their road cars.
Of course, the mere fact of being a low production brand doesn’t necessarily translates into success either, but it seems to me like the trend is that this high production car companies usually have a hard time in F1 (one exception being Renault in the Alonso era, and look how quickly that went downhill and where they are now) because what works to sell cars massively doesn’t work to win races.
getting rid of andrea after he brought back mclaren from the mclaren honda nightmare is a huge mistake imo.
You also have to bear in mind that Audi is a subsidary to VW.
And VW ist struggling quite big at the moment. Thinking about closing assembly plants in Germany for the first time in their history
and also and quitting an agreement, protecting workers from layoffs.
I think there is a chance, this project is going to get cancelled, before it even begins.
To be fair this video tells me Audi identified the problem and has started to work on it. I mean "THE RACE" said it themselves that bringing an F1 team to competitive levels is a years process and they quoted Red Bull and others, which is true. They will be fine in the end!
Audi have killed off their Dakar project, the stillborn LMDH car and their highly successful GT3 and TCR customer programmes for THIS. If they don't start winning by 2028, it will be a huge failure for them.
Audi can learn from Aston Martin’s ongoing ‘El Plan’
I think Binotto is on the right track, and the plan sounds good in theory. Sometimes its much easier to see all the problems from the outside, and it looks like there are a lot of basic ones that need to get aligned. In any case looking forward to seeing this team be less anonymous. If not, theres no reason for them to take up Andretti's seat.
Yeah, the Great Audi Master🅱️lan! Seriously though, I used to work for one of their suppliers. They are behind schedule, completely clueless about F1 and will suck just as bad as Toyota if not worse.
Surely if Audi had know where Sauber would be 2 years later then they wouldn’t have bought the team. They would be in WEC and IMSA with an LMDH car
Or buy Alpine better option, maybe they don't know what they are doing.
F1 is still a very lucrative business, even when u r last.
Maybe they wouldnt have made such a fuzz of getting in and kept their objectives mild
It’s not where Sauber is two years later. It’s where Audi is two years later. They’ve been in control of the team. All this is on them.
@@FoxvalleyproductionBuying Alpine was never an option for them. Just because many think they are now considering selling, doesn’t mean they were then. Besides, with all the crazy French business and labor laws, it would likely have been a very complicated purchase on top of everything else. Even if the latter isn’t true, the team simply wasn’t available at the time nor is it now.
Andretti Karma: They recjected Andretti entry for lack of potential to produce a competitive car. Audi will probably not be able to do that In fact it would be surprising, given that Renault - which had been that for decades as a full team or PU provider - also couldnt put a winning car on track.
I like an underdog and LOVED the Alfa Romeo liveried Sauber. But i dont like Audi (having done some work with them on road car(s)... horrible, arrogant bunch), so dont care for Sauber now. They are in their deserved position. I still will Williams to do well. I did work with them back in 2001 alongside some work for Jaguar. The difference in attitude and professionalism clearly showed why Williams were one of the top teams. I can't wait for them to be back where they belong...the top.
Meanwhile FOM: We don't want Andretti because they wouldn't be a serious competitor.
What a joke
Andretti would be worse
@@Lora_Beolab Where’s your proof?
agree adretti is a JOKE. Now stop crying.
ikr, they turn a blind eye to a team that has shown in many years they can't be competitive and keep them on.
@@justinburley8659 I'll counter that, where's your proof that they wont be?
It's crazy that somehow the Sauber name is still in f1 after all these years 😅
6:29 that Alpine shot ☠️☠️☠️
Binotto spent all the budget on his haircut.
🤣 Took the wind tunnel money to buy James Key some sissors.
He went to silky smooth but couldn't find the zohan
Within 2 years, guarantee they will be talking about leaving
Sainz dodged a big one wow
So what exactly are the differences in job tasking and responsibilities between CEO, COO and Team Principal... sounds like a right cluster fü¢k.
There's a lot at Stake. 😅
😂😂😂😅 😢
7:39 - I love the green office just off the coast of Ireland
As a RedBull fan, i honestly believe in Audi's F1 project, i mean, it would take quite few year to build a good car, but if they make the right choices maybe they will have a chance in F1
I think Audi made the mistake of not making the final sale price determined by the number of points Sauber had in each of these last 2 seasons. It appears that Sauber have abandoned the team since the sale and has put in zero effort.
On a positive note, Sauber/Audi will get maximum development allowance in January.
How well they use it is the question.
All it takes is for the regulations to allow the use of AWD and Audi will sweep everyone away lol
Lol, or bring down the standard of F1 development, tech and engineering and team managed to a level akin to a LMP1 programme, and Audi might have a chance.
It's interesting to me, as a Brazilian, how different international media, such as here, and the national media treat the Bortoleto-Audi rumors.
Most reports I've seen say that Bottas is the favorite to get the seat, but the Brazilian ones are all adamant that Bortoleto is the favorite. Even linking it with a new broadcasting deal for the country.
While I would love to see him in F1, it would be at least weird if Sauber/Audi choose him instead of Pouchaire or Maloney as they're academy drivers
And yet Andretti would not add value to the sport
The Volkswagen Group is currently drowning under huge debts. How on earth is it justifying the funding of an F1 team?
Audi is beginning to look like the German Toyota F1 team
There’s a pattern with teams who’ve been in top level sportscar racing, and done well, but find themselves unable to crack F1 as a team, or just an engine supplier. BMW, Peugeot, Toyota and now Audi. But when the opposite happens, success, like Ferrari winning Le Mans twice since joining the WEC and Alpine being more competitive in their first season with a Hypercar compared to some other teams who’ve been in the WEC for longer.
Why would you spend money on 24/25 car when you can go full out on the 26 car???
I mean, what did they expect? Its a catch 22. You bring in your own people, no experience, so chances of making waves are minimal. On the other hand, you retain most of the people from the outgoing team for their experience, which they haven't done anything but go backwards and your chances of making waves are also minimal.
This isnt that deep - Underperform until the takeover and make the most part the additional Wind Tunnel time 🤷♂️
Sauber/Audi squandered their start- up. They stopped development and upgrades on the current car allowing it to fall too far behind, then failed to sign Sainz. Sainz and Bottas would have made a great team. They just stopped trying and now it’s a big catch up game.
I’ve said it before, but Audi went in to F1 thinking it’s previous WEC programme and it’s experience in the top level of sportscar racing would suffice in preparing them for F1. They thought they could walk straight in and have a team that was well organised and a car that would be competitive. It seems they’re finding out that F1 is leagues ahead of the WEC, where technology, engineering, design and how a team is managed and run is on a different planet compared to running a LMP1 car.
Andretti is laughing there ass off
DAMN, RIGHT?!...😏😉😎
@@X-Warrior.1119 yeah laughing behind penske & chip ganassi 💀
@@Ariespradana13 - Spare me your POLITICAL F1... Bullsh!t?
Meh. Completely new car concept and power unit for 2026 means virtually no point looking at current form
Bothas not having a drive is so strange. Driven so well this year, he’s a team player, great marketing individual, cheap, consistent….. he kinda has it all….
So, one of them is handling day-to-day stuff whilst the other one is handling big picture stuff.
That worked out so well for Jim and Michael. Where would the world be without the two popes?
Audi haven't even started and have already been messing things up royally. What exactly was the point of buying a team and waiting two years doing absolutely nothing with it until they get started as Audi? They should have bought 100% of the team and started full operations as soon as the ink was on the paper. They would have been much further along in getting the team to a better position by now. Another example of them just messing around wasting time is the driver situation. Just sign Bottas, he's the obvious choice.
What I wouldn't give for an F1 series with no manufacturer teams, only independent racing teams.
no Bortoleto
Didn’t this video fit in about half the time?
Given how they were sleeping at the start, at least with Döllner and Binotto they sound like they are finally straightening things out and actually progress things at a reasonable pace. Might still flop but slightly more optimistic now.
You’ve stuck with the sportscars LMDH/LMH bet that’s looking like a better option for them now 🤣
Let them try
I’m hoping they go back F1 is a waste of time
@@rowdyruffian7980 let them try something new
You have ton of cars in sportscar/gt racing
They had better be careful. If they arent competitive day one there is now a rule that they must be kicked out.
i'm sure they can score a point or two
That only applies to brand-new teams.
No new team based on fom must be top team from start
And lets not forget, they dropped all their sports car programs for this. A shambles before it's even started.
And we can’t let Andretti in…
Andretti won't be competitive too 😂
Oh shut up already. There should an 11th team. Stop talking about replacing someone
Nothing changes bro
@@jivewig who said anything about replacing someone? Don’t assume
Even if they would be 11th for 2-3 seasons (veeeeery likely no matter what), there is no real argument against letting them in. Except ofcourse - financial side for other teams. No need to hide that behind "legacy" or whatever crap they are trying to say.
How can it be embarrassing?
Andretti Cadillac V Series R F1 team..something complete
Under the proposed structure if it goes wrong on track will it be Binotto’s fault or Wheatley’s and will the same person take all the credit for any success?
Yet, andretti motorsport still arent able to get on the grid .. because?
Justice For Andretti!...
But we can’t have Andretti?
There's almost two years, till they come in. And during that time, we'll be dragged through speculations like this, perfect for clicks, and nothing more. "Well, Svend, don't click then!" Well, I won't.
Binotto summed it up nicely, the job of his life, every member from owner to mechanic, driver to marketer, everyone will give 110% and I wish them nothing but success. What a story it would be for Audi to turn it around and live the f1 dream.
I’m a Hamilton fan so Ferrari it is but good luck Audi nonetheless 👍🏼
I believe seidl could've fixed it but wasn't allowed to make the moves he wanted look at the work he did at mclaren thàt stella is now benefiting from
In the past 25 years, 4 teams have almost all the wins. It aligns perfectly with the team who have also spend the most money. Not a coincidence....
Everyone laughed whrn I commented on this channel that 3 years to be race winners was a ridiculous plan that would never happen. All the responses of "audi always wins whenever they join a series" and "you dont know what your talking about". Ive watched F1 for almost 4 decades now. In the 37 years, only Brawn GP was a team that found immediate success. And that was a freak occurance because if loop holes in the rules.
Duh. Yet, when it comes to Alpine, any move away from full manufacturer control is mocked as obviously being a foolish move. They’re letting their Flavio grudge compromise objectivity.
False equivalency. The two situations are completely different.
I don't get it. the same corporate guy that says "I will personally be more involved in f1 more intensely" also says "f1 project will be absolutely independent"
I wonder what the future is with VW groups dire financial position at the present time.
Volkswagen and Audi are both doomed as they are legacy petrol car companies with no viable EV strategy. Struggling companies which are facing inevitable bankruptcy ought not to be experimenting with pointless and expensive vanity projects.
Nico has to be questioning his choices - other than that sweet Audi-funded paycheck. I can't see how Audi will be able to keep their corporate hands out of the team.
oh boy - Seidl must have bruised delicate egos - Bottas was surprised to see them leave as well - the corporates definitely have ego issues and having smarter people in specialized roles
Imagine being the most consistent team for the wrong reason.
But guys, please correct me if I am wrong. Ferrari is not shsring their current data on the "possible" 2026 engine. But from what sauber/audi can take over, the Ferrari IP can lead to a good expertise to statt the audi 2026 engine development, right?
I cannot believe that James Key has not been fired yet. It did not take much time for Alpine to get rid of Harman and De Beer when their new F1 proved to be a total failure.
They'll get there eventually and are definitely a solid successor to Sauber. Now if only we could get other interested parties to buyout Alpine and Haas.
Audi should have stuck to the WEC entry
Just end this already disastrous F1 endeavor and return to the WEC...
Who knew? It’s very little to do with Sauber and everything to do with how difficult it is for new teams joining F1, irrespective of who you are.
Verprung Durch Technik apparently
Yes, and they went for the guy who threw away race wins and a championship by making dumb decisions. Unless it is a technical role, do not appoint Binotto.
Bottas deserves better than this vacillation. A Hulkenburg- Bottas driver lineup would allow much more focus upon other areas of team development, + valuable input from two highly experienced drivers. From a marketing standpoint, Nico and Valtteri are familiar names and faces, + that helps in building an identity and fanbase for the team. Just sign VB, + you can concentrate on other things.
The moment f1 teams mention a multi year...assume they have no clue..or they do not want to discuss any further... Be it target or contracts.
I love the tone of this video, it's like Scott knows he would do a better job. it's ridiculous, Journalists that need to learn how to be journalists.
How can they afford it when closing factories
Volkswagen and Audi are both doomed as they are legacy petrol car companies with no viable EV strategy. Struggling companies which are facing inevitable bankruptcy ought not to be experimenting with pointless and expensive vanity projects.
Honestly give it time, im sure audi will do well. I will check in again after 5 years
Andreas Siedl is the common factor for both McLaren and Sauber slump... Look what happened to mcl as soon as he left
Yup. Also James Key left at the same time and joined Sauber, he is still in Sauber as far as I know... lets see...
McLaren is falling apart, no one wants to be at McLaren. No one wants to be Oscars teammate either. Bottas is way better than a 22 year old.
@sirgobbledygook I think that is a bit short-sighted. Granted he did a bad job at Audi, he did transform the McLaren team to a race winner from 2019 to 2021.
@@Foxvalleyproductionok troll
You're high af