The Grudge: Joe Bugner vs Henry Cooper 1/2
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- Опубліковано 20 кві 2008
- 37 years of bitterness came to an end as two proud warriors settled their differences with a hug and a handshake. Henry Cooper and Joe Bugner have barely spoken since their infamous British heavyweight title fight at Wembley back in March 1971.
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Bugner didn’t deserve the hard time he got from the British press. He wasn’t responsible for the decision. He was a World class heavyweight in a great era.
Joe was very underrated, a great box5
I had the pleasure,of meeting Cooper.He literally walked into my bar in Tenerife.
A perfect gentleman.RIP
No one has a bad word to say about him. As straight up a man as you could meet. Cooper's tools used to pay him for appearances knowing the public would think he was something to do with the business. But it was just a co-incidence.
What did you expect him to do, fly, glide, what?
I always liked Joe Bugner. One of the best defensive boxers ever. The way he stayed in with Ron Lyle and took all that Lyle offered and lost on a split decision. His staying power was amazing.
Same here
And it was hardly his fault if Gibbs gave him the fight.
And if I am not mistaken Joe Bugner is the only man to take Ali the distance twice.
@@oleggorky906ken norton went the distance 3 times and alot of people thought he won all 3 too also joe frazier went the distance twice was pulled out in the 14th round of the third
@@miniramptricks1986 Yeah! I was wrong there. Hats off to you sir. I only realised when I was looking through a few of Ali’s old fights recently but I had forgotten where exactly I had posted this remark.
I stand corrected. Let’s say that Bugner is in good company then!
😆😆
How was Cooper so damned handsome and eloquent after 17 years of getting his face mashed up so badly?
loved Henry..grew to love Bugner. Shame he was never appreciated by most of us when he was in his prime ✌️🇬🇧👍
Yeah. He was always the enemy.
Bugner fought Ali,Frazier and Shavers to name a few,Respect bro x
Excellent watch. Well done sir for uploading. 2 warriors.
It happened to Larry Holmes across the pond. When Holmes beat Ali he had a mark against him. Same for Bugner unfortunately.
Totally different, Holmes beat the piss out of Ali, but Bugner didn't beat Cooper in most peoples minds.
@@RSR423other way around
@@davidprosser457 What was?
Young Bugner did really well against Ali especially early rounds. Respect Joe 🇬🇧🥊🇬🇧
I feel so sorry for Bugner.
Me too the British press had it in for him.
Me to I can't stand the British some Americans like it they think they're smarter because their accent I don't know but you know that guy Buckner you had a good record had a good boxing record
Great interview. They are two fighters who did well and still have all their marbles. 'Enry is still very popular here in the US.
Love these guys ...
Joe Bugner is brilliant. Keep on shining Joe.
R.I.P Henry Cooper
The Boxing News magazine that covered the fight had Joe Bugner winning narrowly.
The other journalists there were pretty split so the fight was much closer than people think, many of whom would've influenced by Harry Carpenter's comments at the end.
About 10 years ago Sky showed the whole fight with Harry Gibbs in the studio with Glenn Mccrory both give the verdict to Bugner by one round. Still have the fight on VHS
Radio had it a draw. So it wasn't a robbery.
Harry Gibbs ref'ed three Cooper fights. Copper lost them all!
SirPeter6464 . Coincidence probably . I’d like to know who the other two fights were against though . Maybe I saw them when I was a kid . Henry’s fights were always on Sportsnight in those days with Harry Carpenter commentating .
Yeah I too feel sorry for Joe Burner.
I recently saw Sir Henry Cooper, alongside Joe Calzaghe. Do a speech at the Plymouth Pavilion. And he was a truely fascinating ,funny and elequent man. A real legend.The audience where captivated by his stories about Ali and how he subsequently formed a friendship with him.
I know Cooper never won a World title and some say he was overated. But he fought at a time when the competition was fierce against legends like Ali, Johansen.
but his moaning constantly about losing to Bugner soured his legacy imhi , and the grief suffered by Joe for this is and was criminal setting up a narrative in British media that made joes life hell , and tbh Bugner was a better fighter he never ducked anyone . cooper would have lasted a few rounds against Frazier or Lyle , he even ducked Frazier
Cooper ever the modest Gentleman. An old school pro.
I watched this fight live ; it had the whole of the British public riveted . I think Henry Cooper just shaded it - put it this way , Cooper didn't deserve to lose the bout .
Two top top fella's and great fighters
Let's get this straight the fight was an extremely difficult one to judge don't envy Harry gibb, it went contrary to expectations everyone thought that the experienced Cooper would win the early rounds but the younger fitter bugner would get stronger in the latter rounds, truth is bugner was the better fighter up till the 9th round and the older Cooper really come good from the 10th to the 14th some people say that it was the 15th and last round that swayed gibbs mind in that case bugner won the fight because he surely won the 15th, The British public never forgave him!!!
As Bugner aged he seemed to turn into Bernard Cribbins.
ha ha ha deffo
With David Dickenson's tan.
Not the greatest boxer but excellent with the Wombles. He beat the shit out of Uncle Bulgaria.
Cribbins/Tony Mowbray
Met Aussie Joe During my time in the Australian Army boxing tournaments,,,presented trophies to our recruits at Kapooka ... and was an inspiration to our diggers ...... True Gentleman ,,,,,
"Aussie"Joe. Still makes me laugh. He wasn't an Aussie. Wasn't even British. He was Hungarian.
Joe Bugner seems a really nice guy.
Was the same age as Joe when he beat Henry. I actually taped the fight from the radio, on a reel to reel recorder. I disliked Joe, because Henry was my hero. These days, through retrospect, I can see that Joe was a very good fighter, who never got the respect he deserved. Just as a thought, looking at todays heavyweights, Henry would not have made the cruiser weight/Light heavy weight division. Respect to both of those ring warriors.
Bugner could’ve been a great he had the tools but maybe not the heart Henry Cooper was a real hard case but a great sportsman
It’s all subjective who won or lost in a fight as close as this one was . The fact is that if ten different top boxing judges were all to give their verdict on who actually won this fight then the chances are very high that they would be split . Some giving it to Bugner , others to Cooper . The fight was that close . It is so hard to tell who threw the most punches , who landed the most punches , whose carried the most weight and who was the most aggressive and who managed to slip more punches etc , etc . In some fights it is easy , in others that are close , it is almost impossible . I think the main reason that the public were incensed by the decision is that usually in a very close contest like this you give the verdict to the defending champion ( Cooper ) unless the opponent has clearly beaten him . After watching this fight over and over again all the way through it is difficult to say that Bugner clearly won .
Maybe he just shaved it but it isn’t clear , so should this be enough to take away the defending Champions belt . That is the difficult question . To be fair to the referee , I think he said that he judged it totally even , all square , going in to the last round and that there was ‘ No Way ‘ that Cooper won the last round . So what was he supposed to do in that situation ? I have often thought that instead of blaming the referee or the ring judges , when used , they should be looking at ways to actually judge and score the fight more fairly . I’m sure better ways could be found .
He won.
I think the reason why he got the decision was to give Britain another chance of winning the world heavyweight title as cooper was at the end of his career
Very British that the country never forgave Joe for being a winner. Enery was a God but every dog has his day and Joe was one of the best boxers I ever saw and he never got the respect he deserved.
Any chance of an upload??
two greats to rightttt
Big Joe: Legend 🥊
Excellant!
Joe Bugner could have been great but he failed to build on his strengths, Henry Cooper was a good boxer but one fight too far
Too light and barely a cruiser. People loved the man, but when he fought true world class he got beat. When they shouted names like Liston they ran a mile. Not even a prime Liston either. Bugner went in with Joe Frazier. No title either. Went all the way in a good fight. Cooper wouldn't have been allowed near him.
Cooper was a better boxer but the man was handicap by skin that would cut like butter. Bugner was not easy to watch he always looked like a man that going to deliver but never did People will say he went the distance with great fighters but he never once delivered a really great win
It seems very unfair the way Bugner was treated, as he said he did not make the final call on the result - the ref did, so why all the bad feeling from the crowd. Maybe it's only with the passing of time that we can sit back and view this fight more objectively, but certainly if Bugner had beaten anyone else that night then he would have been hailed a hero. Still two of the best heavy weights we've produced but don't they look small for that division compared to the guys today.
is the full fight on youtube? it appears the commentators in the video have it in for joe like they did when joe fought bruno..or like when lennox fought bruno, or like when tyson fury eventually gets his chance against the royals champ anthony joshua
Joe . The most aggravating boxer to watch.. You always felt there was so much more for him to offer but never did.
The ref did get it wrong Henry won that fight hands down 👊 👊 🥊
Bugner was a great boxer ...he took on enery and got the win but the crowd like kids wanted him out ..shameful..
Class
I think Henry won the fight- just. I also feel for Joe Bugner, he didn't make the decision at the end of the day, and he was given a hard time over it for years by the vicious media in Britain. He seems a complete gentleman and a good sportsman- and he was a fine boxer in his own right. He deserves more recognition and respect than he's received. He comes across like Henry always did, as a thoroughly decent bloke.
@stanssoapbox I met him once in London-75.He had a great sence of humour ,great one-liners ! I had the feeling he was a very sensitive man! I liked him.
He wasn't robbed or mugged by Angelo Dundee at all. It's an urban myth that Dundee exploited the slight tear in Clay's glove to get an extended break after round 5 (the round where Henry knocked Clay down) to give his man more time to recover. The live radio broadcast (the fight was only shown on TV in edited highlights the next evening) proves that the gap between round 5 and 6 was only 63 seconds - just 3 seconds more than normal. There wasn't a five minute gap like some have said.
It's 66 seconds to be accurate but the point stands . . . I love Henry but everytime he tells the story he adds a minute on
Not just 'convicts,' but 'ordinary convicts.'
Yep! It would be a different story now! To US trainers, Joe is considered one of the greats because he was continuously #5 in the greatest heavyweight division of all time. Brits see it differently as he looked like he wasn't trying most of the time. He had everything but that desire to be the very best! No matter how good your trainer is, if you don't have that you won't make it! You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink! Even the great Angelo Dundee ran in to this problem!
By the time Bugner was 37, he'd had several spells of inactivity. Cooper hadn't.
The guys who stopped Bruno were Tyson and huge sluggers like Lewis, Smith and Witherspoon. All incomparable to Cooper.
And let's face it, Cooper's chin was hardly granite either. Patterson sparked him. Johansson sparked him. Folley sparked him. Even Joe Bygraves sparked him. So Bruno several sizes bigger than Cooper, slightly better chin, likely hit harder, and with comparable skills has to be favored.
If only Joe could have had Henry's hammer he definitely would have been world champion
I doubt it with Frazier, Ali, Foreman and Holmes around.
Two proper men.
Lovely bloke Joe always up for a chat.
I was at that fight. Yes Joe Beat him well done.
Joe Bugner wot a fantastic personality gor boxing good on you sir
Why the hate against joe he did his best the referee raised his bloody hand up
Tough boxer who fought in brilliant era of heavyweights
@hainesarobert Not strictly true. He tended to fight more when he got hurt. Look at his fight with frazier.
It was a very close fight I just felt coopers punches were more hurtful. In coopers back yard and his last fight in such a close fight maybe ref should have called a draw.not often u see that a home fighter in his last fight at home in such a close fight who's the darling of the country and it goes the other way!
Wonder what happened to ref after??
He had some skills did bugner and Cooper was as brave as a lion and to think he wasn't even a heavyweight.
Gibbs was very honest
I always felt sorry for Joe. This was a man who took both ali and frazier the distance. The bottom line is that Henry was getting old and Joe was just too big for him? at nearly 40 years old Henry showed just how much heart he had. I was a toddler when they fought but I've seen the fight several times and although joe seems a little cautious at times I've always thought that if Henry had turned up the wick at any time joe could've answered him.
So accurate in my opinion.
Managers always seem to be THE REASON for fighters, not making it. Andy Smith was Bugner’s first manager and handled him up till the Ron Lyle fight. He was one of the most respected managers/trainers of that time. Angelo Dundee once told me that no manager could have done any better with Bugner. The reason! Joe didn’t want IT enough because he WANTED to be an actor and he only came out of retirement because he was broke. If, he had stuck with Smith, he wouldn’t be broke today!
Two of the best white hopes, Joe deserved better.
Malcolm Cartlidge why bring the race card into it?
@@solidcake3401 yeah, especially in boxing where we know what that (albeit slightly altered) phrase relates to.
RIP Our 'Enry.
Cooper lost lots of fights, didn't dare fight Liston, should have been disqualified v Erskine, the fight with Bugner was close and he's best remembered for knocking down a young Ali who soon stopped him. He was popular as he had the famous ' ammer and was always a trier, fighting through trouble with cuts, but he wasn't quite as great as some like to think.
sure would be nice to see this fight, to see who really should have won.
Best decision in his career going to America bugner was a excellent fighter
One is a gentleman, one overrated and sour. And for some reason the public assess them the wrong way round.
I agree with you entirely, Liquidindian911. If you watch carefully, you'll see that it was a, more or less, stray right cross that set Ali up, then Cooper caught him with two beautiful left hooks that had him reeling. I don't think he even saw the third one coming that dumped him on his arse. However, there's no getting away from the fact that Ali really was a class act and a fine and deserving champion.
MsG
true
I think there’s a bit of revisionism going on regarding Joe.
Sure enough at the time some people were on a bit of a downer with him for beating Cooper, a verdict incidentally which was no robbery it could have gone either way.
The fans problem with Joe was the fact he was a 6’4” Adonis with fantastic physical attributes and he frequently stunk the joint out with his passiveness.
His best performance was in a losing fight against Frazier but that was a rarity, if he showed that mettle and aggression in his other fights he would have done better and been more popular with the fans.
I mean he managed to get beat off Jack Bodell FFS.
Good luck Jo😎
yea brady im watching it, i also pissed myself laughing at the sabrina comment lol aussies have a great wit about them, i like also like the guy.
The ones sent to Australia were the English people that stole Soap…. The rest stayed behind,,, never to use Soap
Yeah, coopers twin also boxed as a heavyweight and went 16-14-1. He fought some top heavyweights like Brian London and Dick Richardson, he cut easy though so lost to most of them
I lived opposite Joe Bugner at the height of his fame. He drove a Rolls Royce with the number plate 1 ON U which my father had to explain to me! St Ives Cambridgeshire x
Apparently he lived in Wyton.
Could you tell me the road he lived on because I'd like to visit it some time?
@@ppuh6tfrz646 hi there. He had a large house built opposite to Hartford Marina. This position. Is between Houghton/Wyton and Huntingdon. The house is called Riverview, Google it. The neo georgian mansion has an avenue of yew trees lining the drive. Entrance is off the main Huntingdon rd. he didn’t live here too long as he soon ran out of money after a messy divorce. Prior to living here he lived in Needingworth Rd, St Ives which is where I lived as a child. His manager Andy Smith lived close by.
@@MrTrapper28 Wow. What can I say?
That is *much* appreciated. Thank you so much!!
Is it my imagination or do the trees at the front of Riverview look like punchbags?
I guess it's my imagination as Bugner would have moved out of the property sometime around 1978 and there would be no need to keep the trees that way.
I imagine that Bugner was living at Needingworth Road at the time of the Cooper fight as he wouldn't have been able to afford to have a house like Riverview built at that time.
Do you know whereabouts he lived on Needingworth Road?
I understand Bugner sacked Smith after the Ron Lyle fight, do you know if they ever patched things up?
*Thanks once again.*
@@ppuh6tfrz646 I think the house was built approx 1976 and he only lived here for a year or two. I don’t know the number of the house in needingworth rd (but I know the house) and I don’t know about patching up with Andy Smith. I moved from the area in 1980. I have a signed photo of JB somewhere in my attic. I met him many times.
@@MrTrapper28 Thanks Bob, that's much appreciated!! Incidentally, who do you think won the fight?
I scored it for Cooper.
The fight was a huge stitch up.
Mickey Duff, Astair and Co wanted the only independents left in British Boxing (Cooper and Wicks) out of the way and the ref was paid.
And people think Don King was the only one, far from it, VERY far from it.
Nobody rates Bugner higher than himself
Can tell Henry was still bitter
Joe Bugner you were 100 times better than cooper ever was... Top two best the country has eve produced..
If the decision was wrong it was the ref's fault, not Bugner's, the press shouldn't have done him over the way they did.
Actually, Bugner was in his 73rd pro fight against Bruno, much more than Cooper's career total of 56. I don't see how several years of inactivity at an advanced age could be of benefit to him.
Cooper was no Willie Pep either, also upright and there to be hit. Bruno was a big hitter too, and his KO losses were against hard-hitting super-heavies, not smallish cruisers. Cooper was out cold against the typical 200lb heavies of his era. Only Smith had Bruno down for the 10 count.
TUFF LADS !
Who, Brian London, Dick Richardson etc? Not quite murderers' row are they? Bugner did actually win the British/Euro titles from Cooper.
Bugner would never have pushed Frazier or Lyle so close had he only been fighting to survive. Even the first Ali fight was closer than the cards suggest. He also avoided no one, whereas Cooper admitted to steering clear of certain fighters.
I don't rate Bruno that highly either, just see him as a bigger version of Cooper - limited but overrated.
Don't know why anyone dislikes Joe for getting the decision over Henry it was down to the referee.Did he do enough on the night to take away the belts you decide. But Joe was a good boxer his record speaks for its self and in any other era he would have been World Champion.
the whole fight was filmed hasn't someone watched it closely yet and done a count???
To see who the real winner was
cooper by a small margin!!
It was a close fight but i went of Cooper after he Critized both Patterson and Liston in his book .Saying Liston was an aweful boxer .Then in an interview he said he turned down a fight with Liston and would not be in the same room as him never mind the ring .He also avoided George Chuvalo .George said he repeatly tryed to get in the ring with him but the Cooper camp refused .I believe him he became Canadian Champ in 1959 and i doudt he would hve turned down a fight with Cooper .He then critized Bugner from retired about tough fights with Ali and Lyle .Massively overated .He only hit Ali on the button in the first fight as he was clowning around .Could not touch him in the second fight .
He was not massively overrated every true boxing fan knew he was a good honest pro who had a great left hand punch that is all, when he went up in class he was found wanting. He was only famous because he decked Ali and he was great bloke very similar to Frank Bruno. The problem with Cooper he was too light he couldn't mix it in with the big guys so why fight Liston to get smashed in the 1st round. Had there'd been a Cruiserweight division he would of been a top contender maybe even a champion.
@@jahno7154 Well, he could easilly have boxed at light-heavyweight, which was a maximum of 190lb in those days. He often weighed less than that.
Cooper had a twin who fought light heavy. What more proof do you need?
Kids.. Kids... You're both right
Not in my opinion. Bugner beat Cooper clearly. He was never forgiven because he beat England's national treasure, who never stopped moaning about it.
As for who was better, Bugner was a grade above Cooper. Cooper was sparked by virtually every top quality opponent he faced.
scored this fight,years ago, 10/4/1 for cooper,what was harry Gibbs watching ?
British boxing was then scored on a 5 point per round system.
There a respected judges who had it close.
How come Cooper says he wanted to retire undefeated? Have I missed the obvious here?
think as a champion idk
Why do they say (and they say it in Part 2 of this video, also) that Bugner's win prevented Cooper from "retiring undefeated"? He had lots of losses prior to this one.
By chance, do they just mean Bugner prevented him from winning his FINAL fight?
He means undefeated as British, European and Commonwealth champion, not in his whole career.
There has been a lot of controversy over the result, and Cooper kept a grudge, while the public held it against Joe. But see Cooper v Erskine 3rd fight, 1st and 5th rounds: Cooper should have been disqualified twice over- he'd already lost to Erskine twice and that would have made it 3 defeats instead of win by savage knockout. Cooper had a good punch and had heart but he is generally overrated in Britain.
No, is he lefthanded aswell
Anyone else think Cooper comes over as bitter towards Bugner?
I don’t believe he also “followed” Bugners career after he himself retired.
The referee made the decision. If someone wants to be angry, be angry at the referee, not Joe Bugner.
Irrational.
I agree completely. Joe just turned up and did his job, same as Larry Holmes when he pasted Ali senseless.
The verdict was not Bugner's fault.
@LiquidIndian911 GOOD MAN!!!! at lassssst someone talking sence on youtube!!! :-) good fella
bugner the hugger
@REDnWHITEarmyFTM
As a 56-year-old thats NOT true M8!
You are right Henry was a True and lovely Gent but Bugner played the Panto, Villian and had a great sense of humour.
BOTH were great in different ways.
'Enry treated Joe very shabbily indeed.
henry cooper was very good would maybe had even gone further but it was his eyes prone to cuts that was the problem, joe bugner had the build could take a punch he proved that against frazier and went distance with ali, i always thought he never had the killer instinct. and i still think cooper won that fight but i think joe got it coz henry was at end of career, and lets give it to a younger man maybe.