It’s crazy how much fear church leaders will put into their communities for asking questions and swaying from the status quo. How is anyone supposed to be welcomed with such exclusivity? The church I went to wasn’t progressive my any means (they weren’t over conservative either tho they just did their thing ya know, Canadian Catholics), my priest was one of the first people I came out to, I asked if being gay or hi was a sin during a confessional and he said as long as you do everything with honest genuine love, then it’s gods love. ❤️
Only church leaders who know they're wrong will not invite discussion. No church leader is God so we are all free to have it own thoughts that are valid, with evidence obviously.
That's a beautiful response. I'm glad that was your experience! Questions and uncertainty are like kryptonite to the average church structure... they are far too dangerous to entertain!
@@jtec99 My experience hasn't always played out in this manner. I've known countless church leaders who think they are absolutely correct shut down discussion and questions not because they doubt their certainty (although one could argue on a deeper level they may well) but because they have been taught questioning these things is sinful (often citing Adam and Eve being asked questions by Satan in the beginning). I'm glad however that this isn't common in your experience.
Try not to translate obedience with fear, unless you mean fear of the Lord which is _good_. (Proverbs 1:7; Proverbs 10:27; Job 28:28; Ephesians 5:21; etc.) I'm very open to all types of controversial questions, but I'm also honest and I strive to be walk in obedience with Jesus. (If we stumble into sin, we can confess it to God personally, yet we are warned not to sin willfully. 1 John 1:9; Hebrews 6:4-6; Hebrews 10:26) Your priest sadly lied to you. I was bi in my past, but we're told to deny ourselves to live for Jesus. To pick up our cross and follow Him. (Luke 9:23; Matt. 16:24) If not, we're not worthy of Him. (Matt. 10:37-38) He died for us. A gruesome death! (Isaiah 53:4-7; 1 Peter 2:21-25) The least we can do is live for Him in obedience. (John 14:15) He changes us, we cannot change ourselves. Hence why the Bible declares that we must be born again! (John 3:3-7) And that we are a new creature in Christ Jesus. (2 Corinthians 5:17) I hope you seek God on this. P.s. The Catholic church has many pagan practices so please stick to the Word of God, KJV preferably. Please genuinely repent or you will perish. I don't want that for you and neither does God. (Luke 13:3; 2 Peter 3:9) I hope the best for you and that you seek a close and personal relationship with the Lord Jesus Christ who is the Son of God and also known as the Word of God. (John 1:1; Revelation 19:13) P.p.s. This comment is just a response to your comment (the original comment) and not to the video.
This is wild. You have taken me on such a journey, this channel is actually changing my life. Thank you so much. Everything I am hearing is what I feel so deeply but have never been given permission to articulate
I was so confused by your video description for a split second...I was thinking, “wait, why does Brenda not know that SHE’S the epitome of Progressive Christianity?” LOL. Yeah, ditzy comes in black hair too! Hehe. Lotsa love and aloha from Hawai’i! 😁❤️🤙🏽🌈☀️ (just some symbols of Hawai’i)
i would love to see you have a conversation with someome outside your comfort zone, like people with differing views from yours but actually know their stuff. im not talking about your typical republican evangelical americans, im talking about a catholic/orthodox priest that is knowledgable, eloquent and respectful.
Have you tried churchclarity.com? It's a website that shows you where most churches stand on LGBTQ+ inclusive and women in ministry. You can even submit a church for them to check out. Also, now with corona, a lot of churches have online services so you don't need to physically be there to find a church you like! Hope you find a church/community that works for you!
Hey Sharon - this can be such a frustrating path. It really depends what you are looking for and where you are at on your specific journey. Some more Mainline church denominations can be more progressive, as well as UCC and some UMC. It really can be hit and miss though. Always worth Googling your hometown (or neighboring towns) and the term progressive church. You might still find that the progressive church isn't what you are looking for though depending what you have deconstructed and where you find yourself on your journey. I'm always here to chat if you need someone to talk to - feel free to DM me on instagram I'm just @phildrysdale
United Church of Christ. Not to be mistaken for Church of Christ, very different. Most are really open & u can find progressive daily devotionals on their website.
@@sharonkelly4870 Awesome! Isn't the Episcopal Church similar to the Roman Catholic Church, except for being more progressive on various social issues?
Christianity is not NECESSARILY all that 'spiritual,' dude... There are those who don't need to simply 'believe' anything and require sticking their fingers into the holes; although admittedly, often it is just into the holes in the standard Islamic narrative and so on. LOL ...Reality is reality, and that's all that needs to be 'accepted.' Reality is INCREDIBLY broad of an idea, and ambit of 'perspectives.'
@@jtec99 I'm actually Scottish but was married to an Irish lass for a while and live in England have also lived in many other places including America for 4 years so the accent isn't easy to place 😂
shit I nearly cried @39:00 because you are going to church to become free and find God and find New people, but you can end up having PTSD and going crazy and learning how to hurt Yourself
mind blown... i have only recently heard of this. i always called myself a more open pentecostal/ liberal. i feel exactly like this. im straight but i could never condemn anyone lgbtq and that treatment has always bothered me in all these old school minded religions. god bless u all. thank u for this. ill have to keep watching
@@iwasjustintrance I do have a Facebook but I tend to only check it a couple of times a week as Instagram is just a much healthier platform for me to interact with people. My account over there is fb.com/phildrysdaleministries
Please please do not let people inspire you... Let Jesus inspire you. Seek him for answers and the truth, you cannot put all of your trust in one or a group of people. The bible tells us that true wisdom comes from God, human wisdom is so deceitful... The human heart is so deceitful.. Seek and ask God, read his Word and the true way to follow God will be revealed to you. Jesus said that following him is not easy. It's hard to be different from the world and not accept the same things as the world, I can truly tell you that from my own experience, but the Lord himself told us it will not be easy.
I know you must be raising -or will raise your sweet little boy in a Progressive Christian faith with respect for other faiths (they aren’t harmful branches) and people who weren’t of a faith tradition. I was raised Episcopalian. I didn’t have a big point in life where things to be broken down-my faith grew slowly and continues to. I was raised with a loving God and not one of guilt and the baggage that comes with more Evangelical Christianity. I thank my parents for introducing me to that faith! (I was raised in an Episcopal Church as it was growing and changing as I was). I have been so blessed. As for my parents, they just wanted me to know that Christ loved me (and would welcome me and love no matter what ,as would they). I was just so blessed. You are going to do an amazing job-I can tell! Thank you for what you do (and giving Valentine something similar to what my parents gave me. (Or perhaps even a greater thing)! I could go on and on...bless you, mama-you are so lucky to have him, and he you!
I am a traditional and conservative Christian. Due to early trauma, I am one to speak out, for automy, and for justice. I am all for questioning, exploring, and defining things for yourself...those are all good things. My problem with progressive thinking is when you start to change the Bible and interpret it in a way that suits your own desires, perspectives, and agenda.
I think my questions to you would be; How should the Bible be interpreted? The problem with human interpretation is that everything is coloured by intrinsic biases and personal experiences - there is no such thing as a "pure" interpretation. Would you agree that there is Truth in many denominations? Or do you think there are only a few (or even only 1) that has things figured out? I ask because I share your concern of people warping scripture to fit their own agenda, however, I don't think that's a failing that is specific to one sect of Christianity.
Your videos have changed my views. I’ve been struggling with my Christianity for a long time. I grew up with a parent who would tell me I’m going to hell or God won’t save me when I missed one day of home church and it really turned me away from my faith. After watching Jo Luehmann and your videos, I was able to jump back into my faith with a light heart and my relationship with God has never been closer! It just makes me sad when people say progressive Christianity is a bad thing 😔
Well you can have a personal relationship with Jesus. Read the Word (preferably KJV) and pray to Him. Seek God diligently. Progressive Christianity does not line up with the Word of God and progressive Christianity is a false teaching. Progressive/Lukewarm Christianity will lead you down the broad path. Please be careful. Also, I'm sorry to hear that you went through such an experience in your personal life. We all grow with God at different speeds, but if we have faith and follow Him in obedience, we can become so much closer to Him! Closer than we can even imagine! Don't be deceived by false doctrines. Please seek Him in His Word and through prayer. Repent genuinely also! That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. Romans 10:9 KJV If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:9 KJV Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. John 3:5 KJV Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Acts 2:38 KJV And please do not commit/live in _willful_ sin! The Bible warns against it. (Hebrews 6:4-6; Hebrews 10:26) Jesus also warns those who are lukewarm Christians to repent. (Revelation 3:16) P.s. This comment is in response to your original comment and not on the video.
@@jesusismylordsavior6604 Why is Progressive Christianity false doctrine? I have stricter morals now then I did when I had a list of rules to follow that I didn't understand. Fundamentalism really screwed me up - it contributed to my crippling depression and suicida1 idealation. I am more connected to myself and the divine without being forced into a single methodology for faith. If something brings people to Christ, whether they're coming back and healing or they're hearing the message in a way that doesn't alienate them, does it have no worth? Is God not big enough, or invested in humanity enough, to draw those who are actively seeking to Himself? ("You will seek Me and you will find Me when you seek Me with all your heart." "Seek and ye shall find; knock and the door shall be opened upon you. For he who seeks finds; and for he who knocks the door shall be opened." ) Please take these questions in the heart in which I ask them; I honestly want to know what your reasoning is. God bless.
@@turtlette i really want to believe in Jesus and have a close relationship with him, but I gave up on my faith, because it felt like Christianity is against lgbt people and feminism which made me run away. I really want to be close with Jesus and have a deep connection with him. The amount of people I see on UA-cam calling me a lukewarm Christian, because I’m a feminist, and against homophobia is so sickening so this Chanel is like a safe heaven, but I still deal with anxiety of being lukewarm
"Progressive Christianity" is a broad way to hell simply put it. People are only unhappy living a simple, holy life because they still crave the flavor(Sin) of the world.
i think a good way to think about what the holy spirit is and how to listen to it is to think if whats its telling you to do is rooted in Gods word. because if you think that the spirit is telling you to lie to someone, then obviously thats the devil and not God. but if the spirit is just telling you how to love people and is telling you to talk to someone or pray for someone, then that is God talking to your heart. i felt this pull when i first became christian to not condemn but to love and affirm gay Christians. soon after i found this channel and i was taught by you and Gods word that what i was feeling was right and true and that i can be someone to stand up for the gay christian community like you do and help teach people to love and accept each other.
Jayce 1719, your right about the holy spirit definitely. It does not lie. So idk if you are trinitarian christian, but the Holy Spirit is God as well as the Father and Son are God. So you can't allow someone to tell you what God has already revealed about himself, way before they existed. What I'm saying is this: God told us to love everyone, but the first and great commandment before that, is to love the Lord God with all our heart, soul, and mind(Matthew 22:37-40). And He also says, if you love me, keep my commandments(John 14:15). Progressive christianity suggests that God or some views in the Bible are archaic, or his commandments are not useful nowadays. But the thing is, God is eternal, right, so He can't change, even before this channel, before you and I, before anyone was created, so His word has to stand, or He would no longer be God. I've been checking out this channel, as a 19 year old male, who has been saved for almost three years, and honestly my heart is grieved for the subscribers. I love you all, and telling you the truth from the Bible matters, because you deserve that choice to choose the truth or not, but this channel doesn't even give that chance to you...one last thing is that, God isn't calling you to be straight and just targeting homosexuals, God is calling us to live holy against all sin. That includes murder, fornication, adultery, theft, gossip, cursing, slander, covering, lying, homosexuality, wrath,all of them, and that's true justness(Ephesians 4:29, 1 Corinthians 6:8,19-20, Exodus 20:1-17). You wouldn't say that a murderer (which is a sin), or a cheater(adultery), is a Christian, when God told us through his word, that its wrong. And for God to be loving, he has to be Holy. And committing sin is not holy. May the Lord bless you truly🙏🏾🙏🏾💯✝️.
@@BC-zv5sk hi, even though I don't agree with everything you said, I can see exactly where you are coming from and I can tell that you are very passionate and clearly trying to just spread love, which I fully support. I was taught over the last year (yes I am a new christian), that all of God's word is true and is eternal, and that God the Father, God the Son, and the Holy Spirit are all one God. I believe that anyone with those core beliefs is a Christian, no matter if they have committed sin already in their life or not. I'm not exactly progressive because of those beliefs, but I also feel very progressive because I believe that God does not condemn homosexuality in the bible, and I'm very open to hearing about creation theories and God starting evolution theories. God didn't call us to have all the answers to everything all of a sudden, he just called us to love each other and him most of all. God Bless you too
@@Jayce-oe2hc I see what you're saying, for sure, and I agree to disagree lol, but Leviticus 18:22, Leviticus 20:13(not saying homesexuals will be put to physical death,but they do have to repent and turn from spiritual death.)If God is eternal, that means His word cannot change(if it did change, he would no longer be God, and we would no longer have a fufilling, perfect savior, because God would be a liar), and suggesting that Homosexuality in these scriptures from God's words, is not a sin, that would be like condoning progressive christianity. I can only get my basis from the Bible, and if I lived to you, I would be held accountable for it, I promise💯🙏🏾.
@@BC-zv5sk the way that i see it is that if you are going to use Leviticus as your reasoning for why being gay is still a sin punishable by spiritual death, then you better also be put to death if you have sex with a woman on her period 18:19, if you dont go to a priest if you get leprosy and go through a very specific ritual, chapters 13-14, if you dont do burn offerings and if you dont do them in a specific ritual 1-7, if you eat pigs or "unclean" animals 11, if you eat any blood 17:10-16, and many more laws that we do not condemn today. (all of these are from Leviticus in case you want to check them out). I hope you dont take any offence by this response, because i only mean to educate with it. Jesus is the new covenant, he is who set us free from all of those laws, and gave us only the laws to love each other and to love God above all. Jesus also never talked about being gay and never said that it was a sin. all we have to do is have faith in him and that he will return and bring us all with him to heaven.
@@Jayce-oe2hc Just to warn you, homosexuality is spoken against in the NT (Romans 1:17-32; 1 Corinthians 6:9) along with other sins. Marriage is always described between a man and a woman also. Never a man and a man nor a woman and woman. Only a man and woman can become one flesh through marriage. (Matthew 19:4-6) Please be careful and avoid spreading false doctrines or beliefs. We must obey Jesus (John 14:15; Luke 6:46; Revelation 3:16; Matthew 7:21-27) And lastly, _all_ of God's Word (scripture) is given by the inspiration of God! (2 Timothy 3:16; Hebrews 4:12) His Word is sharper than a two edged Sword and Jesus _is_ the Word of God. (John 1:1; John 1:14; Revelation 19:13) So please obey Jesus Christ; the Word of God. P.s. This is in response to your comments and not in response to the video.
I know the phrase "deconstruction" because my mentor has gone through it and is helping me on my journey through it, but I honestly thought he made up the phrase! It's really encouraging to know that there are so many other people going through this...and that they'll end up okay :)
@@keithrogers4170 But wait, there's more! My own dad told me that I am acting like a woman of bad character(prostitute) if I paint my nails. I had blue and white snowflakes painted at a birthday party. I was 12. Yay purity culture.
I don't think I'll be Christian any time soon based on the ideology and methodology that has been presented to me and that I think exists, however, I honestly like you having dialogue. I don't like Christians who basically call me bigot because I ask questions or tell me to shut up, whether you are Muslim, Christian, Hindu etc.. that's honestly about it.
Thank you for this! In recent weeks, I have learned that I am a free-thinking Progressive Christian, who simply wants to follow Jesus and spread his LOVE. It's so liberating to realize there is a world of like-minded people. It was a strange place for awhile, aligning more with left leaning views but loving Jesus with all my heart!
I love your earrings! My deconstruction is what brought me back to Catholicism and I thank God for those moments when I was an atheist and genuinely questioned everything I was taught. I believe that progressive Christianity & progressive Catholicism (Catholics are Christians, I’m just speaking from my church’s perspective) are fulfillments of Jesus’ call for us to love our neighbors as ourselves and to do community instead of charity. God bless ❤️
Progressive Christianity does not line up with the Word of God and progressive Christianity is a false teaching. Progressive/Lukewarm Christianity will lead you down the broad path. Please be careful. Don't be deceived by false doctrines. Please seek Him in His Word and through prayer. Repent genuinely also! (Also avoid man made denominations such as Catholicism which has false teachings and pagan practices.) That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. Romans 10:9 KJV If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:9 KJV Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. John 3:5 KJV Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Acts 2:38 KJV And please do not commit/live in _willful_ sin! The Bible warns against it. (Hebrews 6:4-6; Hebrews 10:26) Jesus also warns those who are lukewarm Christians to repent. (Revelation 3:16) P.s. This comment is in response to your original comment and not on the video.
I've never thought of it as "considering deconstruction." Interesting perspective implied in that phrase. For me it was unavoidable and even felt like a calling, but I never really considered it in the sense I would normally use that word. Staying put was not an option mentally, emotionally or spiritually.
I thought that too, I've found over the years very very few people if any choose to go on a journey of deconstruction... It's more like falling off a cliff after taking one too many a risky step towards the edge 😂 Like pulling at a thread (who can leave those) only to unravel the whole sweater.
@@PhilDrysdale For me, the very idea that some of the thinking I was doing was considered dangerous or no-go zones made it inevitable that I had to go there eventually. The sweater was super-glued, making it an uncomfortable sweater. The whole idea that certain things "opened me up to demonic possession" (even though not a single thought in my head was open to that) was ridiculous and superstitious. It could not be maintained.
@@MourningTalkShow Absolutely! "Listen up kids - I'm just gonna leave the room and I'm gonna leave this bag of gummies in the middle... now under no circumstances eat any until I get back." Prohibition only throws gas on the flames for 9/10 people.
Definitely not the person to reach out and try to teach hateful people why they're hateful. It's current year, if you haven't got it by now I don't know what to say to you.
Thank you for your comment. This is the first time of watching all of God is Grey’s videos that I paused to read the comments. Wow so much familiar hate... it’s tangible from those defending traditional divisive Christianity. Literally was feeling crazy anxiety when I would come across them and then I read your comment and the tension eased. I am definitely not the person to try to teach hateful people why they are hateful. I know why. I used to be one of the worst of them. But there was hope for me. So maybe there’s hope for them too. But that’s not my place.
Acts 17:30 Revelation 3:16 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 Psalm 44:21 Ephesians 4:29 James 2:18-19 Matthew 6:24 Matthew 7:21-23 John 14:6 May the Lord bless you all🙏🏾✝️💯
Brenda, I really love your channel and all the work you do. I love how eloquent and sensitive you are. All videos are so informative and I always get this feeling that Im not alone in my doubts and opinions on religion when I listen to you. I'm very thankful for you :) I wanted to ask you if you could do video on Todd White's/Bill Johnson's/all those "famous" pastors' and leaders' work?
I also think that progressive Christianity of course is not the right way, but neither is traditional Christianity. Progressive Christianity is just a way of reading the bible that has to exist, in order to find the actual truth (that only God knows, eventually). Much love
I commented on another UA-cam video about Christianity (not progressive Christianity, mind you), and I mentioned how I was in the process of deconstructing my faith, in hopes of being able to reconstruct it in a healthier, more truthful way. I received a comment back saying I was stupid and should just listen to church leaders. I immediately deleted my comment and now regret it. I know in my soul that this is what's right for me, whether I remain a Christian or not. I just don't know how to deal with the shame of being in this in between spot. I would love any feedback or advice.
I'd always be happy to chat with you over on instagram. I help people navigate this all the time @phildrysdale In short, there are no shortcuts, it's a day by day process. Follow your intuition, focus on finding a few safe amazing people you can share your journey with. You'll get there. It gets easier but it is hard for most people. You are far from alone on this journey!
So thankful that you made this video! I can relate hardcore. Deconstruction has been my life for the past 8 months and this really helped me gain a new perspective! 😊
So glad this helped you frame the journey you are on Jennifer! You are doing a really brave work and I'm proud of you walking a largely uncharted path! Always here if you need someone to chat to, just shoot me a DM on Insta :)
How is he literally European but he's very well emerssed in American politics? Sorry, random question, just found it kinda funny haha, I love this conversation by the way
Oh? I didn't realize American politics can offect European countries. I was more aware of stuff like trade and that kind of thing. But if you wouldn't mind explaining, may I ask? I'm not familiar with how that interaction works and I'd like to be.
I actually lived in America for 4 years and (pre-covid) spend a lot of my time travelling to America and working with people and communities deconstructing. About 70% of my audience are based in the USA. Really glad you liked the convo!
Oh! I didn't realize! That's really awesome, I didn't know there were like specific communities for deconstruction and stuff outside of God is Grey. Thank you so much for personally answering my question ☺️
@@anniepanie3318 there are so many - feel free to connect with me over on Instagram as I have a small community there and we talk about a lot of stuff day-in, day-out... I also always reply to DMs if you have any questions or just need to process the insanity that is deconstruction :) @phildrysdale
I'm deconstructing from Catholicism, definitely an atheist now and don't think that will change haha, but the way this guy describes how painful deconstructing is.. it's so affirming. It is hellish. Thank you ❤❤
Atheism is a beautiful place to arrive in your deconstruction and just as valid as any Christian persuasion! I'm glad you have found somewhere to land and I'm sorry it's been so painful for you. I'm always around to chat if you need someone to process with on Instagram - it's literally what I do for a living so never feel bad harassing me if you are having an existential crisis or something 😂
Do you believe the Bible is the word of God? If you do, you should realize that your path of Progressive Christianity is absurd, empty, and baseless. If you DON’T believe the Bible is the word of God, how do you know your particular brand of faith is correct, and where do you get your information about who Jesus is?
Its somehow absurd to admit that the people who wrote the bible were probably flawed, but searching for God and finding him through prayer, study and reflection can make you certain of his existence? You really wanna try and go down this path, because it either won't show you in good light, or it admits that your god isn't as powerful as you claim it to be.
while i agree with many of the points made in this video, i would just like to warn everyone here about the concept of “deconstruction” in general. from my knowledge, it’s a postmodernist ideological concept that strips meaning of truth and questions whether truth exists at all. it doesn’t align with christianity in the slightest. it’s fantastic to ask questions and read the Bible with a child’s mind, and it’s fine to explore various interpretations, but Christianity is also thousands of years old and its traditions do hold weight and importance.
This is not very accurate to be honest. Deconstruction is largely more of a Modern philosophy than Post-Modern. However it does continue into Post-Modern thought. I talk about this extensively elsewhere and everything I provide is free to watch or listen to so I won't go into it in depth but if you want to educate yourself on what deconstruction actually is you are welcome to check out some of the episodes on my show :) Deconstruction is very compatible with Christianity... it's actually it's foundation as Jesus actively deconstructed the Jewish faith to establish the Christian one in many ways.
I've been feeling quite lonely in my faith for the past year or so. I used to love going to church, but as my views on certain aspects of life changed, I find myself not enjoying the service as much anymore. The church I went to was better than most. Everyone is super kind. Women are treated equally and with respect. There's even a group called 'women on the frontline' where women from our and different churches go out together to talk about God's love. Overall I am thankful for the experiences that I've had there, I did get to know God in that place. But at the same time there are things (from the Bible) that I fundamentally disagree with, but the church sees them as absolute truth. I have ignored my own heart for so long, but I came to a point where I just couldn't anymore. It's been so confusing, because so many things out of the Bible don't align with my idea of God's unconditional love. I don't really kniw anyone who feels the same way I do. I miss going to Sunday celebration (as we called it in church). I miss God... I find myself being so confused about what I believe, that I'm closing myself off to him/her. I hope I can one day find a church where I can truly feel at home. In the meantime, I want to 'find' God again. It's funny, every time i think something like that, I feel like God is saying 'I'm right here, you silly goose. I'm not going anywhere, so why are you looking??'. That's something I keep forgetting unfortunately. God is not just out there, but also in here: *points to heart*. He always will be.
My only question for you all who clearly disagree with Jesus and Scripture, is why do you still seek to come in His name? For far too long Jesus has been misunderstood as some "religious" teacher who just had some really good ideas on how to live life. Do you all not understand that He said that He is the living God? That He is the only way? The only truth? The only life? He quoted directly from the Old Testament multiple times, because a lot of the Old Testament was written about Him as the coming Messiah. He is the true Creator who came in human flesh. Sin is sin and you can't change that because it is not your choice to make. You either submit to God or submit to sin. This is idolatry, coming up with your own version of God that you are comfortable with. 1 Timothy 4:1 - "Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of demons."
I have just started getting into Christianity let alone progressive I am very great full for finding your account as I see so many Christians who hate the LGBTQ community and have so much awful things to say and I am no expert but if almost fells like people can very much manipulate the Bible to make it sound like they want it to mean. As a closeted bisexual 13 year old those people have no idea how hurt it can make people and drive people away from Christianity if I weren’t as stable of a person I am it could have had such a impact on me but It it didn’t because I know god loves me and all the gays❤️🌈
I feel that people are purposely using language that causes a divide among the country... making it political, but if we could literally just change the language on the various movements, quit "demonizing" one another, we would find a whole lot more common ground. It is just so sad.
Ah but see, division along the people is what helps keeps the powerful in comfort. It's how our system is designed. To keep people from noticing that the ones harming them are the ones in ivory towers, not thier neighbors.
"Progressive Christianity" a fancy name that basically means I will as a "Progressive" only believe the things I want to believe in Gods Word the Bible and am free to omit whatever I dont want to believe or think will offend someone etc !!
this was such an answer to what my heart was craving! This video was so well timed in my life. I am going to have to watch it more the once to soak in all the knowledge and support. But I am struggling so much deconstructing my faith, its so lonely and overwhelming! But this gave me some foundation! THANK YOU!
We are all always deconstructing and reconstructing different beliefs and ideologies... so maybe in some context. However in my opinion I think most evangelical churches in the UK are yet to start doing any serious deconstruction of their faith. They simply aren't interested in asking the questions that lead to that because their conventional faith is working for them. I am of course speaking systemically as individuals are of course deconstructing and reconstructing in droves... very few that reconstruct will find a safe home in evangelical churches though.
@@PhilDrysdale That's my impression too.There are some nuanced changes...churches that once had openly proclaimed homosexuality a sin,now try to stay quiet about it,because its "sensitive" and "controversial". The Anglican church in Leeds that I used to attend-St Georges-went from a stringent and openly anti gay sex stance-including refusing to allow openly gay people to serve-to now a "big silence" where it's never discussed or mentioned at all in sermons. Even when they occasionally refer to the "no premarital sex" rule,LGBTs are never referenced. The new rector even used the word "diversity".The old rector was a vocal supporter of the 'Fellowship of Confessing Anglicans'
@@keithrogers4170 my wife and I were just talking about St George's yesterday. That appears to be the trend for sure... To be honest it's not a good one. Church Clarity have a lot on that... they are doing a lot to try and force churches to be clear on their stance. In many ways to be openly unaffirming is better than to pretend to be accepting and turn out to be unaffirming once you are already heavily involved in the community.
@@PhilDrysdale Unless it's an intermediate stage on the way to affirmation? Rev Jonathan Clark,the previous rector was very open and emphatic about St G's view of homosexuality. His successor,Lizzy Woolf,may be agnostic,but we just dont know because she has never mentioned it..
I know that there is a desire to be both Christian and not be told no, but that's not real. If God didn't have a standard (safety in that, not scariness), then He would be an inconsistent, unfaithful, and ultimately unmerciful God. This ideology doesn't explain the evil in this world. A God who ultimately judges wickedness is the only thing that can give a person hope, and forgiveness for the one who has been the offender. Also, why always about sex?
i really love this interview right now i would say i'm evangelical but i am still in this process of God undoing all the wrong teaching i have learnt but i don't think i'm ready to go down the path of destruction yet but i cause i like to question things but because my house church is evangelical i just get the surface answers and not really going any deeper to challenge what they believe and me as well there seems to be the what they hold the correct answer like i tried to ask the question is the bible really infallible basically they answered yes of course it is the leaders teach this stuff i'm like is this a generational thing cause i'm a millennial our generation we move forward progressively generally speaking but older gnerations seem stuck in what they believe the Irnony is they say i need to learn and if i am not right with my understanding of the scriptures than i need to change but when i say something and if they maybe wrong they wont change what they believe i am surely that isn't fair
My exact thoughts. This woman claims to read her bible every day but does NONE of what the Lord commands. Examine them by their fruits, that's the only way to tell who is a real follower of the Lord
I love how you call yourself a "Christian" using the Bible per say, and in the same breath, denying the veracity of the Bible! Sounds just like Satan quoting scripture to Jesus to appeal to His flesh, His ego, His pride! Yet Jesus thwarted him 3x and commanded him to get out of his face! I love Jesus, but, I'll live any way that feels good to me.....you don't even know Him
God did not send His Son to cendemn the world, but to save. But here is the condemnation: men love darkness rather than light, lest their deeds be exposed! The Bible teaches us to make no provision for the flesh. The Bible says that to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. The Bible says to flee from fornication. Really, what it comes down to, is choosing the spirit over the flesh! Jesus said, if any man will come after me, let him first deny himself, take up his cross, and follow Me! You're teaching grace as a license to sin, making provision for the flesh! You do that, because you do not love Jesus or care about His will more than your lusts! You're justifying your own sin! You're telling people sin is acceptable, yet Paul said to present our body as a living sacrifice, holy & acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service!
My understanding is that in Biblical Hebrew, the word levov means both heart and mind, and likewise the Aramaic that Jesus probably spoke does not have separate terms. Remember that English did not yet exist, so *nobody* in the world (never mind in Palestine) used that language! Incidentally, “the Lord” is a substitution for the Hebrew letters corresponding to YHWH (a name for God that in Jewish piety is not pronounced). Different versions of the Septuagint (the Bible of most early Christians) used in their translations of Deuteronomy different Greek words, some that corresponding to the English word heart and others that corresponding to mind/understanding (itself an example of lumping where English splits).
DISCLAIMER: Out of respect for my personal boundaries, please don't reply with a "call to repent" or Bible verse I just discovered your channel, God is Grey, and I really hope that you or Phil see this. I'm currently trying to figure things out and this video has given me a sense of peace and direction that I haven't felt in a while. Thank you! That is, until I read the scornful, hateful comments. I felt hurt reading it and the insulation that because of listening to a "heritic" and "false teacher" like you I was unsaved, going in the wrong direction, should be ashamed, a sinner, yadayadayada. But then I realized that is a sign of that slight religious PTSD that Phil mentioned. These people were trying to restrict God to a single interpretation of the Bible that just doesn't work practically when it comes to living a meaningful life full of good works and loving people. And breaking free of that mindset is so hard when people like those in the comments lambast you for it. I am a part of that 78% that still want s to return to Christ but I can't return to the evangelical flavor (which prevails where I am at) even when I try. I wish evangelical Christians the best. Most are good people who have done a lot of good with their faith. And I will try to redirect my ill will towards them into exercise or something. But I am done trying to incorporate so many harmful, impeding beliefs into a faith that is much more real and holy when I embrace the TRUTH that I intuitively know and guided towards. Thank you for all your work! I'm going to find that community and help find people that need the more REAL gospel based on truth, love, and REAL morality!
Hey, I hope at some point you will do a video that’s more about constructing a positive belief system, rather than deconstructing a negative one. Thanks. 💖💖💖
If you are interested I talk about this frequently over on my show. I get guests twice a week to talk about their journeys of faith deconstruction as well as reconstruction. I also have experts in the area come on. My chat with Mark Karris (045) or Keith Giles (041) might be something you find interesting especially.
Was Jesus really changing the bible and saying "let's do maybe love your neighbor, some weiedo said that God is very angry" I think Jesus came as truth and presented the truth that Was always there but we were not able to understand it.
YES he was!!...Gods words and attitude do change....from "hate your enemies,take an eye for an eye" to "love your enemies".....I cant honestly believe how many Christians can say with a straight face "God does not change".... .
As in other Semitic languages, Aramaic has a ‘root’ structure that for native speakers makes multiple dimensions of meaning simultaneously present. Churches in the Syriac tradition have an Aramaic version (the Peshitta) of the New Testament as well as the Old.
44:05 "the vast majority of people that stay in the church stay because of community. and that's true of people that are in church, period." i have to say, staying in church is what i believe has made me so incredibly lonely for most of my life. for people who happen to have personalities that the church already wants it's fine. but if you don't fit in and dare expect to still be accepted for who you are, God help you. 😕
Man, hearing him talk about the bible as a collection of journal entries from man wrestling with who God is, ive thought so for so long but so rarely do I EVER hear that perspective. but this conversation also made me realize just how parched and thirsty i am for a church where we could practice how to be more like Jesus in our lives and serve our community and be a light, but also study the bible in this way, as a discussion, as a struggled narrative, what can we learn from our historical ancestors? And it might be a place where I don't feel so alienated if my theology is a little tweaked here or my sexual ethics don't align with evangelical literalism. Truly that sounds like bliss and I'd love that kind of church.
There are some out there - hopefully you can find something in your local area, if not there are more and more thriving communities online looking to grow together in this way. Always here to help if I can as you figure things out :) Shoot me a DM on Insta anytime!
@@PhilDrysdale youre so kind thank you for making this your passion! I'm on a small island in the middle of the pacific (Maui) and i think ive explored most options. There was an LGBT affirming church i considered but they seem a little too new age for my taste. Like good for them I just dont know if thats for me. But i've followed you on insta and I'm gonna look into the deconstruction network website! should be interesting to see what i find
@@LipSyncLover Yeah, that new age thing appeals to a lot of people I think because it feels different from what they knew before. Nadia Bolz Weber talks about how she had to delve into goddess stuff just to heal from a few things, and then she went back to a more traditional understanding. There are always going to be errors and excesses when we don't consider how own biases, psychology, social influences, societal factors, and listen to scientists that will point out the excesses and misconceptions we have about what's going on. There's a strong sense of bitterness I get from the trauma people feel, so I get a little nervous when people get to create policies out of their own trauma when they have no actual science background. Social science isn't an exact science so people's egos can rule if other scientists don't talk to people about why they may perceive things a particular way. Emotional people need to talk to cerebral ones, and cerebral ones need to talk to more emotionally lead ones. We need to engage with ideas, and know the most popular ones are the ones that rise up, not the best ones.
@@lauraberg6272 I couldn't agree more. I think I'm just maybe a little bit lucky that I've never been one to dive headfirst. I always wade my way in so I avoid getting in over my head with something that maybe isn't best. Well, 90 percent of the time. But yeah, I agree
@@LipSyncLover Me either, I have Aspergers so I HAD to observe, learn and often the hard way, and am easily led if I don't actually have my critical thinking skills on because I'm lost in a sensory experience. You'd really be surprised how manipulative certain mystical experiences are to your brain. I had a time where I thought "If I don't get chills, God's not here." Linda Kay Klein talked about it in "Pure" that you begin to associate certain doctrines, ideas, and methods with a particular response in your body, which can make you associate that response with something good, and can reinforce all or nothing mentalities. Anyone in therapy will tell you those are never healthy for our brains. They make us too emotional and we're easily led. We don't have to be ALL IN. We need to be able to change with new information and even then, we need to have fun too. Fun is good for the brain chemicals.
Though I feel Christianity is a false religion, and a demon, which is guilty of many atrocities and blood shed, and crimes against humanity, It is still nice to see at least some one actually try to do something nice with the religion, but why is no one eles?
I'm far from an advocate for Christianity - especially as far as it is mostly portrayed in America. But there are many beautiful expressions within the Christian tradition along the way if we have eyes to see. Sure I think they can be built on and transcended... but in the words of Ken Wilber we would do well to transcend AND include rather than think we can merely transcend Christianity.
@@PhilDrysdale but the root problem is their Bible, as long as their Bible exist as a used holy book there is always going to be a problem, that book is outdated having slavery and human trafficking being admonished along with other evils our world can do without
@@newageandspritualistchurch7275 absolutely anyone who reads an ancient spiritual wisdom text as a static book of goals will always be pulling society backwards as opposed to moving it forwards. Most progressives however tend to look for the direction recorded in their scriptures... in that they seek to keep moving in that direction. Again, I'm not a progressive but I do think that model of Christianity is certainly a lot less rife with issues.
@MrCalidan69 (Due to technical problems it's at the moment not possible to answer directly under s.o.'s post.) Oh man, you again. All that we needed! You have no idea what you’re talking about! Have you even listened to this conversation? It seems not. Why don’t you mind your own business and get on people’s nerves? Do you really think only *_one_* person is interested in your spam? Do you believe this draws only *_one_* person into the kingdom of god? Or brings him/her nearer to Jesus? And - if you don’t like this channel why don’t you just stay away? Your behavior is self-contradictory.
I am deconstructing and learning a lot I think your channel will be a big help can you interview the channel Chasing Truth? He’s decontructing too and his channel is amazing he’s got a lot of interesting thoughts and opinions
Hei Brenda, can you maybe talk sometimes about the Labrants? They are christian youtuber and influencer. But I think the way of showing their children on the internet ist disgusting and they really sell their oldest daughter. I would like to hear your opinion on that.
I do want to play devils advocate for Mike Pence (ew those are words i thought id never say). I dont know his exact motives. see if you think youre going to jump on a woman or be overcome with lust for someone who isnt your wife just by being in a room with them....thats weird....and extreme....and fearful. I just watched a great video from Aba & Preach the other day though about men being afraid of women in the workplace and that's moreso because of legitimate fears of workplace gossip, rumors, and false accusations that HAVE ended people's careers and even marriages before, all because of a false accusation and they brought up a good example of a man this happened to who was proven beyond a reasonable doubt to be innocent (they have footage). It creates an unfair workplace environment for both sexes too. So, idk, if that's Pence's reasoning, i have sympathy. if its purity culture nonsense, not at all.
Yeah, I believe when we don't explain WHY a rule is in place it can be warped. This is why conversation is so important, and for the love of all things holy language is defined by the USER not the hearer. I get so mad when people say "they said this, so this means that." Not everyone uses the same word the same way, or applies meaning where it's not meant to be. Like when people accuse purity culture of being racist, as if there was INTENT there, is sick. You can highlight how maybe Tahitian women dancing using their hips is meant to express joy, not sexuality and someone can adjust their expectations in an interaction accordingly. European soliders, as you can imagine, had no idea how to handle what they perceived to be overwhelming come ons. They perceived the action a particular way and some acted extremely, because they were handed a script, and no one was there to say "um, please don't do that, that's unethical." Modernist lenses on ancient practices is what creates a lot of outrage. People were ignorant of in general, and just passing on what they knew. To subscribe INTENT to people drives me nuts. You can explain how something makes you feel, you just have to accept that intent is not always meant. People are usually not meaning to cause objective harm to you, unless there's something seriously wrong with them. Ignorance is often not intended.
@@lauraberg6272 you're going to have to stop saying all the things I tend to privately think its uncanny lol. But yeah, i can't stand assumed intent. Somewhere we lost the art of conversation and trying to ensure that we know what a person means by something they said, BEFORE we try to offer our counterpoints. Sometimes if people do this they might find they didnt actually disagree at all. I think modernist lenses and the accompanying biases tend to skew a lot of what is taught about our own history as a country, sadly. And furthermore it has been a problem when people try to look at the bible, for quite some time. For example, atheists just see the genocide part or the rape part and go "why the hell would anyone abide by this?" ....but i can also hardly blame them because we've had as the video points out this new mainstream view that the entirety of bible is indeed God's word, word for word, every letter. what can i say maybe there's just not as many brains out there willing to do this kind of analyzing. Some say there's just rampant stupidity but i actually kind of think its laziness. many modern brains are lazy, perhaps made worse by technology doing too much for us.
@@LipSyncLover Think of the reason a lot of people make youtube videos, or create platforms or make their LIVES about a particular label in order to make money. They are SELLING you and idea, or product, right? They will make their own case up, go after low hanging fruit(also called nut casing), appeal to popularity, and rely on their audience to be uneducated. It's not entirely the creator's fault sometimes, because an atheist like Jimmy Snow for instance, has genuine trauma, and PROJECTS his experience, (and even has admitted it at times but he does it a LOT) onto anything that he thinks links to it. He's also got a big ego bias. My mom often asks me "how are you having these conversations? Why are you questioning things?" Because without investigation, real investigation, we are easily manipulated. It's ok that you don't know something, but the question is, how badly do you want to find out? We just need to be kind to each other, or we'll never get through to each other if we don't.
I want to know where he got the statistic... that 2700 people leave church every day. It was a slow unraveling, but the day I drew the line in the sand was March 1st, 7 years ago. I’ll never forget that day.
When he was talking about how this is the biggest spiritual movement, it reminded me of the Great Awakenings of the past. I wonder if this is like a third Great Awakening??
To some degree. But in defense of most people, in the middle ages very few people had bibles to read in any way and just accepted whatever the church told them (which frequently was not particularly connected to the Bible but tradition)
Guess you want find out how to go to Heaven on this you tube channel so if you want to go to Heaven and are listening go to Romans 10; 9 and 10 ( the Bible ; Gods Word ) and do those two things GOD says to do to avoid hell and have your sins forgiven !! Pretty simple right question mark !!!
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“God is better than I first thought.” Love that
It’s crazy how much fear church leaders will put into their communities for asking questions and swaying from the status quo. How is anyone supposed to be welcomed with such exclusivity? The church I went to wasn’t progressive my any means (they weren’t over conservative either tho they just did their thing ya know, Canadian Catholics), my priest was one of the first people I came out to, I asked if being gay or hi was a sin during a confessional and he said as long as you do everything with honest genuine love, then it’s gods love. ❤️
Only church leaders who know they're wrong will not invite discussion. No church leader is God so we are all free to have it own thoughts that are valid, with evidence obviously.
That's a beautiful response. I'm glad that was your experience! Questions and uncertainty are like kryptonite to the average church structure... they are far too dangerous to entertain!
@@jtec99 My experience hasn't always played out in this manner. I've known countless church leaders who think they are absolutely correct shut down discussion and questions not because they doubt their certainty (although one could argue on a deeper level they may well) but because they have been taught questioning these things is sinful (often citing Adam and Eve being asked questions by Satan in the beginning). I'm glad however that this isn't common in your experience.
@@PhilDrysdale I admit I'm just interjecting my own opinion on they're motive.
Try not to translate obedience with fear, unless you mean fear of the Lord which is _good_. (Proverbs 1:7; Proverbs 10:27; Job 28:28; Ephesians 5:21; etc.) I'm very open to all types of controversial questions, but I'm also honest and I strive to be walk in obedience with Jesus. (If we stumble into sin, we can confess it to God personally, yet we are warned not to sin willfully. 1 John 1:9; Hebrews 6:4-6; Hebrews 10:26) Your priest sadly lied to you. I was bi in my past, but we're told to deny ourselves to live for Jesus. To pick up our cross and follow Him. (Luke 9:23; Matt. 16:24) If not, we're not worthy of Him. (Matt. 10:37-38) He died for us. A gruesome death! (Isaiah 53:4-7; 1 Peter 2:21-25) The least we can do is live for Him in obedience. (John 14:15) He changes us, we cannot change ourselves. Hence why the Bible declares that we must be born again! (John 3:3-7) And that we are a new creature in Christ Jesus. (2 Corinthians 5:17) I hope you seek God on this.
P.s. The Catholic church has many pagan practices so please stick to the Word of God, KJV preferably. Please genuinely repent or you will perish. I don't want that for you and neither does God. (Luke 13:3; 2 Peter 3:9) I hope the best for you and that you seek a close and personal relationship with the Lord Jesus Christ who is the Son of God and also known as the Word of God. (John 1:1; Revelation 19:13)
P.p.s. This comment is just a response to your comment (the original comment) and not to the video.
This is wild. You have taken me on such a journey, this channel is actually changing my life. Thank you so much. Everything I am hearing is what I feel so deeply but have never been given permission to articulate
Me too. Everything she says is everything I’ve always wanted to say but couldn’t articulate
"I never fit in that box" I know EXACTLY how that feels. 😞
To paraphrase the amazing Brene Brown - the beauty of never belonging anywhere is that in time you realize it means you belong everywhere.
I CANNOT RESONATE MORE!!!!!
That's what he said
I was so confused by your video description for a split second...I was thinking, “wait, why does Brenda not know that SHE’S the epitome of Progressive Christianity?” LOL. Yeah, ditzy comes in black hair too! Hehe.
Lotsa love and aloha from Hawai’i! 😁❤️🤙🏽🌈☀️ (just some symbols of Hawai’i)
@TheKingofLionsZ45 Are you ESL? ‘Cause I can give you a pass if you are...but if you’re American, then WTF kind of grammar is that?!?
i would love to see you have a conversation with someome outside your comfort zone, like people with differing views from yours but actually know their stuff. im not talking about your typical republican evangelical americans, im talking about a catholic/orthodox priest that is knowledgable, eloquent and respectful.
Fr. Josiah Trenham would make for a great discussion.
I am tired of leaving my church angry, but I have been to every church in my area and they are all the same. What churches are progressive?
Have you tried churchclarity.com? It's a website that shows you where most churches stand on LGBTQ+ inclusive and women in ministry. You can even submit a church for them to check out. Also, now with corona, a lot of churches have online services so you don't need to physically be there to find a church you like! Hope you find a church/community that works for you!
Hey Sharon - this can be such a frustrating path. It really depends what you are looking for and where you are at on your specific journey. Some more Mainline church denominations can be more progressive, as well as UCC and some UMC. It really can be hit and miss though. Always worth Googling your hometown (or neighboring towns) and the term progressive church. You might still find that the progressive church isn't what you are looking for though depending what you have deconstructed and where you find yourself on your journey. I'm always here to chat if you need someone to talk to - feel free to DM me on instagram I'm just @phildrysdale
United Church of Christ. Not to be mistaken for Church of Christ, very different. Most are really open & u can find progressive daily devotionals on their website.
I have found my place in the Episcopal Church after leaving the Evangelical church.
@@sharonkelly4870
Awesome! Isn't the Episcopal Church similar to the Roman Catholic Church, except for being more progressive on various social issues?
💖ly atheist not planning to become religious but ur POVs are intriguing❤
Christianity is not NECESSARILY all that 'spiritual,' dude... There are those who don't need to simply 'believe' anything and require sticking their fingers into the holes; although admittedly, often it is just into the holes in the standard Islamic narrative and so on. LOL ...Reality is reality, and that's all that needs to be 'accepted.' Reality is INCREDIBLY broad of an idea, and ambit of 'perspectives.'
@@interqward1 right....still an atheist
I could listen to this guy for hours. The accent reminds me of home.
Where is he from??
@@bazstrutt8247 sounds like ireland to me
J Rods I certainly thought British...
But was trying to be more precise
@@bazstrutt8247 you might be right though, there's many accents there. Thought I heard a slip of County Cork when he said Jesus a couple times.
@@jtec99 I'm actually Scottish but was married to an Irish lass for a while and live in England have also lived in many other places including America for 4 years so the accent isn't easy to place 😂
You discuss this topic in such a loving, educated, and mature way. God Bless you and yours
It was a great conversation - I really enjoyed it and I'm glad you did too :)
shit I nearly cried @39:00 because you are going to church to become free and find God and find New people, but you can end up having PTSD and going crazy and learning how to hurt Yourself
The pain is real 😂😢
Thank you for giving me the words of deconstruction and reconstruction in relation to my own experiences many years ago.
mind blown... i have only recently heard of this. i always called myself a more open pentecostal/ liberal. i feel exactly like this. im straight but i could never condemn anyone lgbtq and that treatment has always bothered me in all these old school minded religions. god bless u all. thank u for this. ill have to keep watching
I’ve never heard of Phil Drysdale before, but I loved hearing his perspective! Really great discussion! 💖
Thanks Melissa, glad you liked it!
The level of Knowledge on this video ins amazing. Thank you for bringing up such solid points of view!
So glad you enjoyed it Joyce!
Amazing discussion. Phil seems like really good guy that I'd love talk to - especially on the stages of psychological development.
Always happy to chat Justin - shoot me a DM on Insta sometime. Glad you liked the discussion!
@@PhilDrysdale oh my! You replied! I actually don't use Instagram. Do you use Facebook?
@@iwasjustintrance I do have a Facebook but I tend to only check it a couple of times a week as Instagram is just a much healthier platform for me to interact with people. My account over there is fb.com/phildrysdaleministries
I needed this so bad. Thank you.
Glad you liked it!
You’ve inspired me so much growing up as a Christian you get told you can’t support this you can’t support that but but you showed me
Please please do not let people inspire you... Let Jesus inspire you. Seek him for answers and the truth, you cannot put all of your trust in one or a group of people. The bible tells us that true wisdom comes from God, human wisdom is so deceitful... The human heart is so deceitful.. Seek and ask God, read his Word and the true way to follow God will be revealed to you. Jesus said that following him is not easy. It's hard to be different from the world and not accept the same things as the world, I can truly tell you that from my own experience, but the Lord himself told us it will not be easy.
I know you must be raising -or will raise your sweet little boy in a Progressive Christian faith with respect for other faiths (they aren’t harmful branches) and people who weren’t of a faith tradition. I was raised Episcopalian. I didn’t have a big point in life where things to be broken down-my faith grew slowly and continues to. I was raised with a loving God and not one of guilt and the baggage that comes with more Evangelical Christianity. I thank my parents for introducing me to that faith! (I was raised in an Episcopal Church as it was growing and changing as I was). I have been so blessed. As for my parents, they just wanted me to know that Christ loved me (and would welcome me and love no matter what ,as would they). I was just so blessed. You are going to do an amazing job-I can tell! Thank you for what you do (and giving Valentine something similar to what my parents gave me. (Or perhaps even a greater thing)! I could go on and on...bless you, mama-you are so lucky to have him, and he you!
Glad how lucky you are!!
I am a traditional and conservative Christian. Due to early trauma, I am one to speak out, for automy, and for justice. I am all for questioning, exploring, and defining things for yourself...those are all good things. My problem with progressive thinking is when you start to change the Bible and interpret it in a way that suits your own desires, perspectives, and agenda.
I think my questions to you would be;
How should the Bible be interpreted? The problem with human interpretation is that everything is coloured by intrinsic biases and personal experiences - there is no such thing as a "pure" interpretation.
Would you agree that there is Truth in many denominations? Or do you think there are only a few (or even only 1) that has things figured out?
I ask because I share your concern of people warping scripture to fit their own agenda, however, I don't think that's a failing that is specific to one sect of Christianity.
@@turtlette well said!
Another very interesting chat., So much I could comment about in a good way, I would not to know where to start. :)
Wow. This is my life to a tee right now. Still love God, but spiritually homeless.
Your videos have changed my views. I’ve been struggling with my Christianity for a long time. I grew up with a parent who would tell me I’m going to hell or God won’t save me when I missed one day of home church and it really turned me away from my faith. After watching Jo Luehmann and your videos, I was able to jump back into my faith with a light heart and my relationship with God has never been closer! It just makes me sad when people say progressive Christianity is a bad thing 😔
Well you can have a personal relationship with Jesus. Read the Word (preferably KJV) and pray to Him. Seek God diligently. Progressive Christianity does not line up with the Word of God and progressive Christianity is a false teaching. Progressive/Lukewarm Christianity will lead you down the broad path. Please be careful. Also, I'm sorry to hear that you went through such an experience in your personal life. We all grow with God at different speeds, but if we have faith and follow Him in obedience, we can become so much closer to Him! Closer than we can even imagine! Don't be deceived by false doctrines. Please seek Him in His Word and through prayer. Repent genuinely also!
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Romans 10:9 KJV
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1 John 1:9 KJV
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
John 3:5 KJV
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 2:38 KJV
And please do not commit/live in _willful_ sin! The Bible warns against it. (Hebrews 6:4-6; Hebrews 10:26) Jesus also warns those who are lukewarm Christians to repent. (Revelation 3:16)
P.s. This comment is in response to your original comment and not on the video.
@@jesusismylordsavior6604 Why is Progressive Christianity false doctrine? I have stricter morals now then I did when I had a list of rules to follow that I didn't understand. Fundamentalism really screwed me up - it contributed to my crippling depression and suicida1 idealation. I am more connected to myself and the divine without being forced into a single methodology for faith. If something brings people to Christ, whether they're coming back and healing or they're hearing the message in a way that doesn't alienate them, does it have no worth? Is God not big enough, or invested in humanity enough, to draw those who are actively seeking to Himself? ("You will seek Me and you will find Me when you seek Me with all your heart." "Seek and ye shall find; knock and the door shall be opened upon you. For he who seeks finds; and for he who knocks the door shall be opened." )
Please take these questions in the heart in which I ask them; I honestly want to know what your reasoning is.
God bless.
@@turtlette i really want to believe in Jesus and have a close relationship with him, but I gave up on my faith, because it felt like Christianity is against lgbt people and feminism which made me run away. I really want to be close with Jesus and have a deep connection with him. The amount of people I see on UA-cam calling me a lukewarm Christian, because I’m a feminist, and against homophobia is so sickening so this Chanel is like a safe heaven, but I still deal with anxiety of being lukewarm
Yes! So glad you had Phil on, I love his stuff!
Love you Isaac! Thanks man!
"Progressive Christianity" is a broad way to hell simply put it. People are only unhappy living a simple, holy life because they still crave the flavor(Sin) of the world.
i think a good way to think about what the holy spirit is and how to listen to it is to think if whats its telling you to do is rooted in Gods word. because if you think that the spirit is telling you to lie to someone, then obviously thats the devil and not God. but if the spirit is just telling you how to love people and is telling you to talk to someone or pray for someone, then that is God talking to your heart. i felt this pull when i first became christian to not condemn but to love and affirm gay Christians. soon after i found this channel and i was taught by you and Gods word that what i was feeling was right and true and that i can be someone to stand up for the gay christian community like you do and help teach people to love and accept each other.
Jayce 1719, your right about the holy spirit definitely. It does not lie. So idk if you are trinitarian christian, but the Holy Spirit is God as well as the Father and Son are God. So you can't allow someone to tell you what God has already revealed about himself, way before they existed. What I'm saying is this: God told us to love everyone, but the first and great commandment before that, is to love the Lord God with all our heart, soul, and mind(Matthew 22:37-40). And He also says, if you love me, keep my commandments(John 14:15). Progressive christianity suggests that God or some views in the Bible are archaic, or his commandments are not useful nowadays. But the thing is, God is eternal, right, so He can't change, even before this channel, before you and I, before anyone was created, so His word has to stand, or He would no longer be God. I've been checking out this channel, as a 19 year old male, who has been saved for almost three years, and honestly my heart is grieved for the subscribers. I love you all, and telling you the truth from the Bible matters, because you deserve that choice to choose the truth or not, but this channel doesn't even give that chance to you...one last thing is that, God isn't calling you to be straight and just targeting homosexuals, God is calling us to live holy against all sin. That includes murder, fornication, adultery, theft, gossip, cursing, slander, covering, lying, homosexuality, wrath,all of them, and that's true justness(Ephesians 4:29, 1 Corinthians 6:8,19-20, Exodus 20:1-17). You wouldn't say that a murderer (which is a sin), or a cheater(adultery), is a Christian, when God told us through his word, that its wrong. And for God to be loving, he has to be Holy. And committing sin is not holy. May the Lord bless you truly🙏🏾🙏🏾💯✝️.
@@BC-zv5sk hi, even though I don't agree with everything you said, I can see exactly where you are coming from and I can tell that you are very passionate and clearly trying to just spread love, which I fully support. I was taught over the last year (yes I am a new christian), that all of God's word is true and is eternal, and that God the Father, God the Son, and the Holy Spirit are all one God. I believe that anyone with those core beliefs is a Christian, no matter if they have committed sin already in their life or not. I'm not exactly progressive because of those beliefs, but I also feel very progressive because I believe that God does not condemn homosexuality in the bible, and I'm very open to hearing about creation theories and God starting evolution theories. God didn't call us to have all the answers to everything all of a sudden, he just called us to love each other and him most of all. God Bless you too
@@Jayce-oe2hc I see what you're saying, for sure, and I agree to disagree lol, but Leviticus 18:22, Leviticus 20:13(not saying homesexuals will be put to physical death,but they do have to repent and turn from spiritual death.)If God is eternal, that means His word cannot change(if it did change, he would no longer be God, and we would no longer have a fufilling, perfect savior, because God would be a liar), and suggesting that Homosexuality in these scriptures from God's words, is not a sin, that would be like condoning progressive christianity. I can only get my basis from the Bible, and if I lived to you, I would be held accountable for it, I promise💯🙏🏾.
@@BC-zv5sk the way that i see it is that if you are going to use Leviticus as your reasoning for why being gay is still a sin punishable by spiritual death, then you better also be put to death if you have sex with a woman on her period 18:19, if you dont go to a priest if you get leprosy and go through a very specific ritual, chapters 13-14, if you dont do burn offerings and if you dont do them in a specific ritual 1-7, if you eat pigs or "unclean" animals 11, if you eat any blood 17:10-16, and many more laws that we do not condemn today. (all of these are from Leviticus in case you want to check them out). I hope you dont take any offence by this response, because i only mean to educate with it. Jesus is the new covenant, he is who set us free from all of those laws, and gave us only the laws to love each other and to love God above all. Jesus also never talked about being gay and never said that it was a sin. all we have to do is have faith in him and that he will return and bring us all with him to heaven.
@@Jayce-oe2hc Just to warn you, homosexuality is spoken against in the NT (Romans 1:17-32; 1 Corinthians 6:9) along with other sins. Marriage is always described between a man and a woman also. Never a man and a man nor a woman and woman. Only a man and woman can become one flesh through marriage. (Matthew 19:4-6) Please be careful and avoid spreading false doctrines or beliefs. We must obey Jesus (John 14:15; Luke 6:46; Revelation 3:16; Matthew 7:21-27)
And lastly, _all_ of God's Word (scripture) is given by the inspiration of God! (2 Timothy 3:16; Hebrews 4:12) His Word is sharper than a two edged Sword and Jesus _is_ the Word of God. (John 1:1; John 1:14; Revelation 19:13) So please obey Jesus Christ; the Word of God.
P.s. This is in response to your comments and not in response to the video.
I know the phrase "deconstruction" because my mentor has gone through it and is helping me on my journey through it, but I honestly thought he made up the phrase! It's really encouraging to know that there are so many other people going through this...and that they'll end up okay :)
Oh my god I actually was taught that interlocking fingers while holding hands is dirty. I was 9.
That is a despicable way of brainwashing a young child.
@@keithrogers4170 But wait, there's more! My own dad told me that I am acting like a woman of bad character(prostitute) if I paint my nails. I had blue and white snowflakes painted at a birthday party. I was 12. Yay purity culture.
@@KvDenko Purity culture is evil ....a form of psychological abuse
I don't think I'll be Christian any time soon based on the ideology and methodology that has been presented to me and that I think exists, however, I honestly like you having dialogue. I don't like Christians who basically call me bigot because I ask questions or tell me to shut up, whether you are Muslim, Christian, Hindu etc.. that's honestly about it.
Thank you for this! In recent weeks, I have learned that I am a free-thinking Progressive Christian, who simply wants to follow Jesus and spread his LOVE. It's so liberating to realize there is a world of like-minded people. It was a strange place for awhile, aligning more with left leaning views but loving Jesus with all my heart!
I love your earrings! My deconstruction is what brought me back to Catholicism and I thank God for those moments when I was an atheist and genuinely questioned everything I was taught. I believe that progressive Christianity & progressive Catholicism (Catholics are Christians, I’m just speaking from my church’s perspective) are fulfillments of Jesus’ call for us to love our neighbors as ourselves and to do community instead of charity.
God bless ❤️
Depends what you mean by love.
Progressive Christianity does not line up with the Word of God and progressive Christianity is a false teaching. Progressive/Lukewarm Christianity will lead you down the broad path. Please be careful. Don't be deceived by false doctrines. Please seek Him in His Word and through prayer. Repent genuinely also! (Also avoid man made denominations such as Catholicism which has false teachings and pagan practices.)
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Romans 10:9 KJV
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1 John 1:9 KJV
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
John 3:5 KJV
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 2:38 KJV
And please do not commit/live in _willful_ sin! The Bible warns against it. (Hebrews 6:4-6; Hebrews 10:26) Jesus also warns those who are lukewarm Christians to repent. (Revelation 3:16)
P.s. This comment is in response to your original comment and not on the video.
I've never thought of it as "considering deconstruction." Interesting perspective implied in that phrase. For me it was unavoidable and even felt like a calling, but I never really considered it in the sense I would normally use that word. Staying put was not an option mentally, emotionally or spiritually.
I thought that too, I've found over the years very very few people if any choose to go on a journey of deconstruction... It's more like falling off a cliff after taking one too many a risky step towards the edge 😂 Like pulling at a thread (who can leave those) only to unravel the whole sweater.
@@PhilDrysdale "Here are some things to remember if you're considering falling off a cliff."
@@PhilDrysdale For me, the very idea that some of the thinking I was doing was considered dangerous or no-go zones made it inevitable that I had to go there eventually. The sweater was super-glued, making it an uncomfortable sweater. The whole idea that certain things "opened me up to demonic possession" (even though not a single thought in my head was open to that) was ridiculous and superstitious. It could not be maintained.
@@MourningTalkShow Absolutely! "Listen up kids - I'm just gonna leave the room and I'm gonna leave this bag of gummies in the middle... now under no circumstances eat any until I get back." Prohibition only throws gas on the flames for 9/10 people.
@@PhilDrysdale I feel like there is a bible story in Genesis about trees that covers this... :)
Definitely not the person to reach out and try to teach hateful people why they're hateful. It's current year, if you haven't got it by now I don't know what to say to you.
Thank you for your comment. This is the first time of watching all of God is Grey’s videos that I paused to read the comments. Wow so much familiar hate... it’s tangible from those defending traditional divisive Christianity. Literally was feeling crazy anxiety when I would come across them and then I read your comment and the tension eased. I am definitely not the person to try to teach hateful people why they are hateful. I know why. I used to be one of the worst of them. But there was hope for me. So maybe there’s hope for them too. But that’s not my place.
@@amberkeeler6175
This is the most positive response to one of my comments I've ever gotten. Glad it resonated with you so much Amber. 👍🏾
20 bucks say we get our "favorite" you tube commenters in the comment section here saying that "progressive christianity is false christianity!"
Acts 17:30
Revelation 3:16
1 Corinthians 6:9-10
Psalm 44:21
Ephesians 4:29
James 2:18-19
Matthew 6:24
Matthew 7:21-23
John 14:6
May the Lord bless you all🙏🏾✝️💯
😉.
Amen.
This is the kind of conversations I dream to have in real life with people. ♥
Brenda, I really love your channel and all the work you do. I love how eloquent and sensitive you are. All videos are so informative and I always get this feeling that Im not alone in my doubts and opinions on religion when I listen to you. I'm very thankful for you :) I wanted to ask you if you could do video on Todd White's/Bill Johnson's/all those "famous" pastors' and leaders' work?
I also think that progressive Christianity of course is not the right way, but neither is traditional Christianity. Progressive Christianity is just a way of reading the bible that has to exist, in order to find the actual truth (that only God knows, eventually). Much love
well what do you than i mean there is only two camps either evangelical or progressive
please collab with Georgia bridgers some time!!! she is a young bi christian woman who makes great videos about faith and sexuality!!!
Progressive Christianity isn't Christianity.
I commented on another UA-cam video about Christianity (not progressive Christianity, mind you), and I mentioned how I was in the process of deconstructing my faith, in hopes of being able to reconstruct it in a healthier, more truthful way. I received a comment back saying I was stupid and should just listen to church leaders. I immediately deleted my comment and now regret it. I know in my soul that this is what's right for me, whether I remain a Christian or not. I just don't know how to deal with the shame of being in this in between spot.
I would love any feedback or advice.
I'd always be happy to chat with you over on instagram. I help people navigate this all the time @phildrysdale
In short, there are no shortcuts, it's a day by day process. Follow your intuition, focus on finding a few safe amazing people you can share your journey with. You'll get there. It gets easier but it is hard for most people. You are far from alone on this journey!
So thankful that you made this video! I can relate hardcore. Deconstruction has been my life for the past 8 months and this really helped me gain a new perspective! 😊
So glad this helped you frame the journey you are on Jennifer! You are doing a really brave work and I'm proud of you walking a largely uncharted path! Always here if you need someone to chat to, just shoot me a DM on Insta :)
Please read your bible's and ask the lord to grant you discernment.
How is he literally European but he's very well emerssed in American politics? Sorry, random question, just found it kinda funny haha, I love this conversation by the way
People in european countries Look closely to what happens in the good ol' USA because it impacts us in direct and indirect ways..
Oh? I didn't realize American politics can offect European countries. I was more aware of stuff like trade and that kind of thing. But if you wouldn't mind explaining, may I ask? I'm not familiar with how that interaction works and I'd like to be.
I actually lived in America for 4 years and (pre-covid) spend a lot of my time travelling to America and working with people and communities deconstructing. About 70% of my audience are based in the USA. Really glad you liked the convo!
Oh! I didn't realize! That's really awesome, I didn't know there were like specific communities for deconstruction and stuff outside of God is Grey. Thank you so much for personally answering my question ☺️
@@anniepanie3318 there are so many - feel free to connect with me over on Instagram as I have a small community there and we talk about a lot of stuff day-in, day-out... I also always reply to DMs if you have any questions or just need to process the insanity that is deconstruction :) @phildrysdale
if I would have met you guys 15 years ago, I maybe wouldn't have lost my faith completely .... wonderful video :)
I'm deconstructing from Catholicism, definitely an atheist now and don't think that will change haha, but the way this guy describes how painful deconstructing is.. it's so affirming. It is hellish. Thank you ❤❤
Atheism is a beautiful place to arrive in your deconstruction and just as valid as any Christian persuasion! I'm glad you have found somewhere to land and I'm sorry it's been so painful for you. I'm always around to chat if you need someone to process with on Instagram - it's literally what I do for a living so never feel bad harassing me if you are having an existential crisis or something 😂
Do you believe the Bible is the word of God? If you do, you should realize that your path of Progressive Christianity is absurd, empty, and baseless. If you DON’T believe the Bible is the word of God, how do you know your particular brand of faith is correct, and where do you get your information about who Jesus is?
Its somehow absurd to admit that the people who wrote the bible were probably flawed, but searching for God and finding him through prayer, study and reflection can make you certain of his existence?
You really wanna try and go down this path, because it either won't show you in good light, or it admits that your god isn't as powerful as you claim it to be.
while i agree with many of the points made in this video, i would just like to warn everyone here about the concept of “deconstruction” in general. from my knowledge, it’s a postmodernist ideological concept that strips meaning of truth and questions whether truth exists at all. it doesn’t align with christianity in the slightest. it’s fantastic to ask questions and read the Bible with a child’s mind, and it’s fine to explore various interpretations, but Christianity is also thousands of years old and its traditions do hold weight and importance.
This is not very accurate to be honest. Deconstruction is largely more of a Modern philosophy than Post-Modern. However it does continue into Post-Modern thought. I talk about this extensively elsewhere and everything I provide is free to watch or listen to so I won't go into it in depth but if you want to educate yourself on what deconstruction actually is you are welcome to check out some of the episodes on my show :) Deconstruction is very compatible with Christianity... it's actually it's foundation as Jesus actively deconstructed the Jewish faith to establish the Christian one in many ways.
Love this channel and you, Brenda!
I've learned nothing here! The Bible says faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God! Rom 10:17
I've been feeling quite lonely in my faith for the past year or so. I used to love going to church, but as my views on certain aspects of life changed, I find myself not enjoying the service as much anymore. The church I went to was better than most. Everyone is super kind. Women are treated equally and with respect. There's even a group called 'women on the frontline' where women from our and different churches go out together to talk about God's love. Overall I am thankful for the experiences that I've had there, I did get to know God in that place. But at the same time there are things (from the Bible) that I fundamentally disagree with, but the church sees them as absolute truth. I have ignored my own heart for so long, but I came to a point where I just couldn't anymore. It's been so confusing, because so many things out of the Bible don't align with my idea of God's unconditional love. I don't really kniw anyone who feels the same way I do. I miss going to Sunday celebration (as we called it in church). I miss God... I find myself being so confused about what I believe, that I'm closing myself off to him/her. I hope I can one day find a church where I can truly feel at home. In the meantime, I want to 'find' God again. It's funny, every time i think something like that, I feel like God is saying 'I'm right here, you silly goose. I'm not going anywhere, so why are you looking??'. That's something I keep forgetting unfortunately. God is not just out there, but also in here: *points to heart*. He always will be.
Progressive Christianity is heretical Christianity.
In your opinion
No, it’s not Biblical
My only question for you all who clearly disagree with Jesus and Scripture, is why do you still seek to come in His name? For far too long Jesus has been misunderstood as some "religious" teacher who just had some really good ideas on how to live life. Do you all not understand that He said that He is the living God? That He is the only way? The only truth? The only life? He quoted directly from the Old Testament multiple times, because a lot of the Old Testament was written about Him as the coming Messiah. He is the true Creator who came in human flesh. Sin is sin and you can't change that because it is not your choice to make. You either submit to God or submit to sin. This is idolatry, coming up with your own version of God that you are comfortable with. 1 Timothy 4:1 - "Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of demons."
I have just started getting into Christianity let alone progressive I am very great full for finding your account as I see so many Christians who hate the LGBTQ community and have so much awful things to say and I am no expert but if almost fells like people can very much manipulate the Bible to make it sound like they want it to mean. As a closeted bisexual 13 year old those people have no idea how hurt it can make people and drive people away from Christianity if I weren’t as stable of a person I am it could have had such a impact on me but It it didn’t because I know god loves me and all the gays❤️🌈
I love ur videos
I feel that people are purposely using language that causes a divide among the country... making it political, but if we could literally just change the language on the various movements, quit "demonizing" one another, we would find a whole lot more common ground. It is just so sad.
Ah but see, division along the people is what helps keeps the powerful in comfort. It's how our system is designed. To keep people from noticing that the ones harming them are the ones in ivory towers, not thier neighbors.
God's opinion vs man's...awesome
"Progressive Christianity" a fancy name that basically means I will as a "Progressive" only believe the things I want to believe in Gods Word the Bible and am free to omit whatever I dont want to believe or think will offend someone etc !!
Thank you so much Phil and Brenda for such amazing content. You guys gave me so much ✨HOPE✨ listening to this.
Glad you enjoyed it Lynette! Thanks for the kind words :)
this was such an answer to what my heart was craving! This video was so well timed in my life. I am going to have to watch it more the once to soak in all the knowledge and support. But I am struggling so much deconstructing my faith, its so lonely and overwhelming! But this gave me some foundation! THANK YOU!
Phil Drysdale
Do you think there is major reconstruction going on in UK evangelical churches?...
We are all always deconstructing and reconstructing different beliefs and ideologies... so maybe in some context. However in my opinion I think most evangelical churches in the UK are yet to start doing any serious deconstruction of their faith. They simply aren't interested in asking the questions that lead to that because their conventional faith is working for them. I am of course speaking systemically as individuals are of course deconstructing and reconstructing in droves... very few that reconstruct will find a safe home in evangelical churches though.
@@PhilDrysdale I'm surprised its working for them and that more members arent disturbed by the teaching on eternal hell and sex....
@@PhilDrysdale That's my impression too.There are some nuanced changes...churches that once had openly proclaimed homosexuality a sin,now try to stay quiet about it,because its "sensitive" and "controversial".
The Anglican church in Leeds that I used to attend-St Georges-went from a stringent and openly anti gay sex stance-including refusing to allow openly gay people to serve-to now a "big silence" where it's never discussed or mentioned at all in sermons.
Even when they occasionally refer to the "no premarital sex" rule,LGBTs are never referenced.
The new rector even used the word "diversity".The old rector was a vocal supporter of the 'Fellowship of Confessing Anglicans'
@@keithrogers4170 my wife and I were just talking about St George's yesterday. That appears to be the trend for sure... To be honest it's not a good one. Church Clarity have a lot on that... they are doing a lot to try and force churches to be clear on their stance. In many ways to be openly unaffirming is better than to pretend to be accepting and turn out to be unaffirming once you are already heavily involved in the community.
@@PhilDrysdale Unless it's an intermediate stage on the way to affirmation?
Rev Jonathan Clark,the previous rector was very open and emphatic about St G's view of homosexuality.
His successor,Lizzy Woolf,may be agnostic,but we just dont know because she has never mentioned it..
I know that there is a desire to be both Christian and not be told no, but that's not real. If God didn't have a standard (safety in that, not scariness), then He would be an inconsistent, unfaithful, and ultimately unmerciful God. This ideology doesn't explain the evil in this world. A God who ultimately judges wickedness is the only thing that can give a person hope, and forgiveness for the one who has been the offender. Also, why always about sex?
i really love this interview right now i would say i'm evangelical but i am still in this process of God undoing all the wrong teaching i have learnt but i don't think i'm ready to go down the path of destruction yet but i cause i like to question things but because my house church is evangelical i just get the surface answers and not really going any deeper to challenge what they believe and me as well there seems to be the what they hold the correct answer like i tried to ask the question is the bible really infallible basically they answered yes of course it is the leaders teach this stuff i'm like is this a generational thing cause i'm a millennial our generation we move forward progressively generally speaking but older gnerations seem stuck in what they believe the Irnony is they say i need to learn and if i am not right with my understanding of the scriptures than i need to change but when i say something and if they maybe wrong they wont change what they believe i am surely that isn't fair
Obviously it's not Christian considering a certain word in the title of which no Christian would say
My exact thoughts. This woman claims to read her bible every day but does NONE of what the Lord commands. Examine them by their fruits, that's the only way to tell who is a real follower of the Lord
I love how you call yourself a "Christian" using the Bible per say, and in the same breath, denying the veracity of the Bible! Sounds just like Satan quoting scripture to Jesus to appeal to His flesh, His ego, His pride! Yet Jesus thwarted him 3x and commanded him to get out of his face! I love Jesus, but, I'll live any way that feels good to me.....you don't even know Him
I had a small exchange with him. He said Christianity isn't important. He doesn't even care if it's true or not.
@@LogosTheos Unfortunate
God did not send His Son to cendemn the world, but to save. But here is the condemnation: men love darkness rather than light, lest their deeds be exposed! The Bible teaches us to make no provision for the flesh. The Bible says that to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. The Bible says to flee from fornication. Really, what it comes down to, is choosing the spirit over the flesh! Jesus said, if any man will come after me, let him first deny himself, take up his cross, and follow Me! You're teaching grace as a license to sin, making provision for the flesh! You do that, because you do not love Jesus or care about His will more than your lusts! You're justifying your own sin! You're telling people sin is acceptable, yet Paul said to present our body as a living sacrifice, holy & acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service!
My understanding is that in Biblical Hebrew, the word levov means both heart and mind, and likewise the Aramaic that Jesus probably spoke does not have separate terms.
Remember that English did not yet exist, so *nobody* in the world (never mind in Palestine) used that language!
Incidentally, “the Lord” is a substitution for the Hebrew letters corresponding to YHWH (a name for God that in Jewish piety is not pronounced).
Different versions of the Septuagint (the Bible of most early Christians) used in their translations of Deuteronomy different Greek words, some that corresponding to the English word heart and others that corresponding to mind/understanding (itself an example of lumping where English splits).
DISCLAIMER: Out of respect for my personal boundaries, please don't reply with a "call to repent" or Bible verse
I just discovered your channel, God is Grey, and I really hope that you or Phil see this. I'm currently trying to figure things out and this video has given me a sense of peace and direction that I haven't felt in a while. Thank you!
That is, until I read the scornful, hateful comments. I felt hurt reading it and the insulation that because of listening to a "heritic" and "false teacher" like you I was unsaved, going in the wrong direction, should be ashamed, a sinner, yadayadayada. But then I realized that is a sign of that slight religious PTSD that Phil mentioned.
These people were trying to restrict God to a single interpretation of the Bible that just doesn't work practically when it comes to living a meaningful life full of good works and loving people. And breaking free of that mindset is so hard when people like those in the comments lambast you for it.
I am a part of that 78% that still want s to return to Christ but I can't return to the evangelical flavor (which prevails where I am at) even when I try.
I wish evangelical Christians the best. Most are good people who have done a lot of good with their faith. And I will try to redirect my ill will towards them into exercise or something. But I am done trying to incorporate so many harmful, impeding beliefs into a faith that is much more real and holy when I embrace the TRUTH that I intuitively know and guided towards. Thank you for all your work! I'm going to find that community and help find people that need the more REAL gospel based on truth, love, and REAL morality!
Hey, I hope at some point you will do a video that’s more about constructing a positive belief system, rather than deconstructing a negative one. Thanks. 💖💖💖
If you are interested I talk about this frequently over on my show. I get guests twice a week to talk about their journeys of faith deconstruction as well as reconstruction. I also have experts in the area come on. My chat with Mark Karris (045) or Keith Giles (041) might be something you find interesting especially.
Phil Drysdale ok great! I’ll check it out
Was Jesus really changing the bible and saying "let's do maybe love your neighbor, some weiedo said that God is very angry" I think Jesus came as truth and presented the truth that Was always there but we were not able to understand it.
I don't think the two are incompatible options :)
YES he was!!...Gods words and attitude do change....from "hate your enemies,take an eye for an eye" to "love your enemies".....I cant honestly believe how many Christians can say with a straight face "God does not change"....
.
As in other Semitic languages, Aramaic has a ‘root’ structure that for native speakers makes multiple dimensions of meaning simultaneously present.
Churches in the Syriac tradition have an Aramaic version (the Peshitta) of the New Testament as well as the Old.
44:05 "the vast majority of people that stay in the church stay because of community. and that's true of people that are in church, period."
i have to say, staying in church is what i believe has made me so incredibly lonely for most of my life. for people who happen to have personalities that the church already wants it's fine. but if you don't fit in and dare expect to still be accepted for who you are, God help you. 😕
Man, hearing him talk about the bible as a collection of journal entries from man wrestling with who God is, ive thought so for so long but so rarely do I EVER hear that perspective. but this conversation also made me realize just how parched and thirsty i am for a church where we could practice how to be more like Jesus in our lives and serve our community and be a light, but also study the bible in this way, as a discussion, as a struggled narrative, what can we learn from our historical ancestors? And it might be a place where I don't feel so alienated if my theology is a little tweaked here or my sexual ethics don't align with evangelical literalism. Truly that sounds like bliss and I'd love that kind of church.
There are some out there - hopefully you can find something in your local area, if not there are more and more thriving communities online looking to grow together in this way. Always here to help if I can as you figure things out :) Shoot me a DM on Insta anytime!
@@PhilDrysdale youre so kind thank you for making this your passion! I'm on a small island in the middle of the pacific (Maui) and i think ive explored most options. There was an LGBT affirming church i considered but they seem a little too new age for my taste. Like good for them I just dont know if thats for me. But i've followed you on insta and I'm gonna look into the deconstruction network website! should be interesting to see what i find
@@LipSyncLover Yeah, that new age thing appeals to a lot of people I think because it feels different from what they knew before. Nadia Bolz Weber talks about how she had to delve into goddess stuff just to heal from a few things, and then she went back to a more traditional understanding. There are always going to be errors and excesses when we don't consider how own biases, psychology, social influences, societal factors, and listen to scientists that will point out the excesses and misconceptions we have about what's going on. There's a strong sense of bitterness I get from the trauma people feel, so I get a little nervous when people get to create policies out of their own trauma when they have no actual science background. Social science isn't an exact science so people's egos can rule if other scientists don't talk to people about why they may perceive things a particular way. Emotional people need to talk to cerebral ones, and cerebral ones need to talk to more emotionally lead ones. We need to engage with ideas, and know the most popular ones are the ones that rise up, not the best ones.
@@lauraberg6272 I couldn't agree more. I think I'm just maybe a little bit lucky that I've never been one to dive headfirst. I always wade my way in so I avoid getting in over my head with something that maybe isn't best. Well, 90 percent of the time. But yeah, I agree
@@LipSyncLover Me either, I have Aspergers so I HAD to observe, learn and often the hard way, and am easily led if I don't actually have my critical thinking skills on because I'm lost in a sensory experience. You'd really be surprised how manipulative certain mystical experiences are to your brain. I had a time where I thought "If I don't get chills, God's not here." Linda Kay Klein talked about it in "Pure" that you begin to associate certain doctrines, ideas, and methods with a particular response in your body, which can make you associate that response with something good, and can reinforce all or nothing mentalities. Anyone in therapy will tell you those are never healthy for our brains. They make us too emotional and we're easily led. We don't have to be ALL IN. We need to be able to change with new information and even then, we need to have fun too. Fun is good for the brain chemicals.
'Progressive' Christianity is just like 'mainstream' Christianity but more solipsistic.
This is awesome.
Though I feel Christianity is a false religion, and a demon, which is guilty of many atrocities and blood shed, and crimes against humanity, It is still nice to see at least some one actually try to do something nice with the religion, but why is no one eles?
I'm far from an advocate for Christianity - especially as far as it is mostly portrayed in America. But there are many beautiful expressions within the Christian tradition along the way if we have eyes to see. Sure I think they can be built on and transcended... but in the words of Ken Wilber we would do well to transcend AND include rather than think we can merely transcend Christianity.
@@PhilDrysdale but the root problem is their Bible, as long as their Bible exist as a used holy book there is always going to be a problem, that book is outdated having slavery and human trafficking being admonished along with other evils our world can do without
@@newageandspritualistchurch7275 absolutely anyone who reads an ancient spiritual wisdom text as a static book of goals will always be pulling society backwards as opposed to moving it forwards. Most progressives however tend to look for the direction recorded in their scriptures... in that they seek to keep moving in that direction. Again, I'm not a progressive but I do think that model of Christianity is certainly a lot less rife with issues.
What did you say those stages were called of development to look up? Thank!
Audio. Plz fix
I have wanted this collab for years! So impressive, guys. Thanks for everything you’re doing! Xx
Thanks Dherran. Glad you liked it!
Immediately signed up for the network! So glad I found out it existed
Hope it helps you connect with some amazing people!
.........wow...I....there is alot to unpack here.... I'm kind of speechless....just wow....I pray those blinders fall off ya'll eyes one day
@MrCalidan69
(Due to technical problems it's at the moment not possible to answer directly under s.o.'s post.)
Oh man, you again. All that we needed! You have no idea what you’re talking about! Have you even listened to this conversation? It seems not. Why don’t you mind your own business and get on people’s nerves? Do you really think only *_one_* person is interested in your spam? Do you believe this draws only *_one_* person into the kingdom of god? Or brings him/her nearer to Jesus? And - if you don’t like this channel why don’t you just stay away? Your behavior is self-contradictory.
I am deconstructing and learning a lot I think your channel will be a big help can you interview the channel Chasing Truth? He’s decontructing too and his channel is amazing he’s got a lot of interesting thoughts and opinions
Hei Brenda, can you maybe talk sometimes about the Labrants? They are christian youtuber and influencer. But I think the way of showing their children on the internet ist disgusting and they really sell their oldest daughter. I would like to hear your opinion on that.
"in the flavor it's offered" damn that was a good way to say it. Good job guys 😊
Thanks for a great discussion. Very helpful all round...
I do want to play devils advocate for Mike Pence (ew those are words i thought id never say). I dont know his exact motives. see if you think youre going to jump on a woman or be overcome with lust for someone who isnt your wife just by being in a room with them....thats weird....and extreme....and fearful. I just watched a great video from Aba & Preach the other day though about men being afraid of women in the workplace and that's moreso because of legitimate fears of workplace gossip, rumors, and false accusations that HAVE ended people's careers and even marriages before, all because of a false accusation and they brought up a good example of a man this happened to who was proven beyond a reasonable doubt to be innocent (they have footage). It creates an unfair workplace environment for both sexes too. So, idk, if that's Pence's reasoning, i have sympathy. if its purity culture nonsense, not at all.
Yeah, I believe when we don't explain WHY a rule is in place it can be warped. This is why conversation is so important, and for the love of all things holy language is defined by the USER not the hearer. I get so mad when people say "they said this, so this means that." Not everyone uses the same word the same way, or applies meaning where it's not meant to be. Like when people accuse purity culture of being racist, as if there was INTENT there, is sick. You can highlight how maybe Tahitian women dancing using their hips is meant to express joy, not sexuality and someone can adjust their expectations in an interaction accordingly. European soliders, as you can imagine, had no idea how to handle what they perceived to be overwhelming come ons. They perceived the action a particular way and some acted extremely, because they were handed a script, and no one was there to say "um, please don't do that, that's unethical." Modernist lenses on ancient practices is what creates a lot of outrage. People were ignorant of in general, and just passing on what they knew. To subscribe INTENT to people drives me nuts. You can explain how something makes you feel, you just have to accept that intent is not always meant. People are usually not meaning to cause objective harm to you, unless there's something seriously wrong with them. Ignorance is often not intended.
@@lauraberg6272 you're going to have to stop saying all the things I tend to privately think its uncanny lol. But yeah, i can't stand assumed intent. Somewhere we lost the art of conversation and trying to ensure that we know what a person means by something they said, BEFORE we try to offer our counterpoints. Sometimes if people do this they might find they didnt actually disagree at all. I think modernist lenses and the accompanying biases tend to skew a lot of what is taught about our own history as a country, sadly. And furthermore it has been a problem when people try to look at the bible, for quite some time. For example, atheists just see the genocide part or the rape part and go "why the hell would anyone abide by this?" ....but i can also hardly blame them because we've had as the video points out this new mainstream view that the entirety of bible is indeed God's word, word for word, every letter. what can i say maybe there's just not as many brains out there willing to do this kind of analyzing. Some say there's just rampant stupidity but i actually kind of think its laziness. many modern brains are lazy, perhaps made worse by technology doing too much for us.
@@LipSyncLover Think of the reason a lot of people make youtube videos, or create platforms or make their LIVES about a particular label in order to make money. They are SELLING you and idea, or product, right? They will make their own case up, go after low hanging fruit(also called nut casing), appeal to popularity, and rely on their audience to be uneducated. It's not entirely the creator's fault sometimes, because an atheist like Jimmy Snow for instance, has genuine trauma, and PROJECTS his experience, (and even has admitted it at times but he does it a LOT) onto anything that he thinks links to it. He's also got a big ego bias. My mom often asks me "how are you having these conversations? Why are you questioning things?" Because without investigation, real investigation, we are easily manipulated. It's ok that you don't know something, but the question is, how badly do you want to find out? We just need to be kind to each other, or we'll never get through to each other if we don't.
Progressive Christianity isn't Christianity.
I want to know where he got the statistic... that 2700 people leave church every day. It was a slow unraveling, but the day I drew the line in the sand was March 1st, 7 years ago. I’ll never forget that day.
That statistic is from Pew Research Center May 2015 - hope that helps :)
Phil Drysdale Thank you!
I'd love to start a support group...I miss worship ❤
Czy to oznacza, że natura Boga zawsze się zmienia? Please explain
When he was talking about how this is the biggest spiritual movement, it reminded me of the Great Awakenings of the past. I wonder if this is like a third Great Awakening??
There is a third great awakening coming but it is not progessive Christianity.
HEY! I'M FROM CHILE
I'm gonna lool those dudes up and say "weeeeeena weoooonnn"
@@daniibp23 haha I love my Chilean family!!! Welcome!
I LOVE this
God bless you.
can you talk about falwell?
Easy, it’s heresy.
I thought that in the middle age the people were also reading the bible very literally
To some degree. But in defense of most people, in the middle ages very few people had bibles to read in any way and just accepted whatever the church told them (which frequently was not particularly connected to the Bible but tradition)
@@PhilDrysdale ah I never thought of that
Guess you want find out how to go to Heaven on this you tube channel so if you want to go to Heaven and are listening go to Romans 10; 9 and 10 ( the Bible ; Gods Word ) and do those two things GOD says to do to avoid hell and have your sins forgiven !! Pretty simple right question mark !!!
yeah! daniel risk is here again. waited for him so long. It was high time.
The sinner mouth uses cussing word.
I love you 🥺