Smyth Busters: Can You Interchange Rifle & Pistol Primers?
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- Опубліковано 15 лют 2021
- Reloaders know that primers come in various designations: large pistol vs small pistol, large rifle vs small rifle, etc. So what's the difference? Can you interchange some of these different primers? The answer from Brownells Gun Techs Caleb Savant and Steve Ostrem is, "Sometimes." Some interchangeability is possible, but you really, really have to be careful. Just because one type of primer will physically fit in the pocket of a case doesn't mean you should use it. Some handgun cartridges actually do use Small Rifle primers (e.g., .454 Casull) and other high-pressure cartridges CAN use Small Rifle primers (e.g., .38 Super). Since the rifle primer is hotter, you'll need to reduce your load and work it back up to make sure it doesn't exceed maximum pressure. Rifle primers have thicker cups, so they can handle the pressure of pistol cartridges, but pistol primer cups are not built to handle the higher pressures of rifle cartridges. A Large Rifle primer is usually too tall to fit in the primer pocket of a pistol case. It'll sit proud of the case head and potentially tie up the rotation of your revolver cylinder or cause a slam fire in your semi-auto pistol. Best advice is to use the primer specified in your loading manual. Otherwise, do a LOT of research with credible reloading sources before you substitute primers.
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Lol. "Murkey" is a great way to describe this. For new fellas coming into loading I tell them to stick with only the primers specified
Back in the mid 70’s I had a Dakota 41 Mag revolver. The hammer mounted firing pin was penetrating the primers. On my loading bench I used rifle primers and the penetrating problem was fixed.
Really appreciate these short info packed shorts. Thank you.
Remington used to label their small primers as suitable for pistol or rifle, I have examples of such.
I would love to see them! Do you have a photo by chance?
Klem Kadidlehopper I found an old box of primers the other day that said that.
@@CalebSavant I have a picture, can't figure out how to post it here. Try this: facebook.com/photo/?fbid=3828513243837734&set=a.243806402308454
Red Skelton
@@farmerwayne1404
saw that too....sure miss his show....always at the end he said, "good night and God bless."
I once spoke with a CCI tech on this very topic. I was told that their specs showed small pistol and rifle primers being identical; same cup material and thickness, the same primer compound, and the same amount of said compound. Of course, this probably varies depending on the primer manufacture.
CCi told me that their standard small rifle primers were identical to their small pistol MAGNUM primers. Standard small pistol
Primers have less compound than the small rifle/pistol magnum. small rifle magnum primers have more compound than both. I don’t think it’s safe to say that all cci small pistol and rifle primers are the same.
after measuring a ton of small rifle and pistol primer cups
they're the same .015" thick brass
other brands are the same as far as I've seen
cci 5.56 primers are the same too
@@spyderxtra777 That's correct. Forgot to mention that only applies to their small pistol magnum and small rifle primers.
True. All primer sheet metal across the board is .0150 thickness. And small rifle is the same as small pistol magnum. Now large rifle primers are .006 taller than large pistol.
Correction to my post about what CCI told me. I just measured my different CCI primers are there are absolutely differences in primer sheet metal thickness. Sorry, but I have to trust my instruments. From .01161 with SP to .01262 with LR
I'm happy to see people addressing these conversations in the shooting world. You guys are good to take the time to go over these things for us new guys. Also Brownells is great..especially since I live so close to them it only takes a day or two for my packages to arrive...very nice..haha
If you can find them, stick to the load data.
People put up vids pressure testing the different types. The ONLY difference is in cup thickness to help contain higher pressures of the powder.
@@festerallday I completely understand, but desperate people might cram what they can and let it fly. The safety of all, is our primary concern. As responsible loaders.
Well you Mr thomasloks are completely correct. Ughhhh responsibilities.
Exactly...wishy washy answers
So pretty much "you can, but our lawyers say don't"
Yep. Super Vel tested 9mm cartridges loaded with pistol and rifle primers and they saw no huge differences in the pressure gauge or with velocity. It depends on the cartridge as well.
I mainly load 22 Hornet, and both pistol and rifle primers are appropriate with just about all the powders used. Currently, I have a Lil'gun load that uses Fed 205M srp, and an H110 load that is in the last legs of testing between using Fed 100M spp and Fed 200M spm.
You can, but the graybeards say not to or you can blow yourself up. Even though you won't.
Yep, pay attention, and rifle/magnum primer cups are mildly harder to get a good primer strike.
For loads in calibers like, say, .22 Hornet and 300blk which utilize magnum pistol powders in many loads, a magnum pistol primer is a solid choice.
@@wisewhiterabbit Same if using pistol magnum primers used in rifle as they seat .003 shallower just have to check each rifle if firing pin will strike primers hard enough to ignite. Works in 3 rifles and no telltale pressure or velocity change
Personally I'm going back to Matchlock.
I'm getting the flintlock ready.
Personally I'm working on a Captain Kirk special for that day a super being drops me on a planet with Gorn.
@@phprofYT lol.
I still have my wrist rocket in a drawer...
@vettelover2009 not in my realm but maybe try misting the exposed side with silicon lube.
You two always have the best answers and don’t take all day long to give the right answer
Really good info. I know a lot of folks are desperate for reloading components and ammo so they can shoot. Of course, desperation is a potential recipe for disaster in the case of reloading. Great video fellas!
Desperation makes getting laid sooo much easier.🍆🍑🤸😖😩🤤😞
Wear eye protection, if the gun blows up it doesn't really matter (as long as you don't get hurt) guns are useless without ammo anyway. If mine goes tough luck, I'm going to die of old age owning a gun without any ammo. I Live in a land locked part of Alaska where almost everything is legal but nothing is available.
Excellent information and enough for me to say to my Father “I was right all along.” He and I have had this ongoing discussion for years, and I caught him doing it (pistol primers in rifle loads) a number of times. He got away with it, but it doesn’t t happen any more, as I’m in charge of all the reloading now.
I’ve been reloading for only about 9 years now. I’m probably going to catch a lot of crap for this comment, but has anyone actually measured the thickness difference between small pistol and small rifle primers? I did and they measured the exact same thickness.
I wouldn’t recommend this in normal conditions, but with the primer shortage I had to give it a try. Me and a friend loaded small pistol primers into some .223 loads. I brought out my lab radar just to check consistency. We worked up our loads from less than the recommended starting load using CFE223 and worked our way up to our standard load of 27 grains.
To my surprise, no split or flattened primers. No slam fires either. They held consistent at around 3000 FPS from a 20” barrel. They worked beautifully. I’m not recommending everyone go out and do this but keep in mind, if the shortage lasts too much longer, you gotta do what’s necessary.
And before the safety nazi’s chime in, I’m aware that this is not best practice
Many manufactures will tell you that their small pistol magnum and small rifle primers are the same thing but it varies. I was told that CCI are the same.
Doing the same thing in 3 files. There is a .003 difference between pistol and rifle primes in depth so have to check rifle firing pin strike. Works great in my rifles
Thank you for this video, had this same question very recently. I am getting low on large rifle primers (cci #200) and recently purchased new brass for my .243, and changed from 100gr BTSP to a 90gr eldx. I wanted to once fire my brass before working up a new load for this new round with new bullets. Not wanting to use up a pack of my cci 200, and having a few packs of large pistol primers, I thought this may be a solution. Using a starting charge of my favorite powder and the old 100grain bullets with the new brass and found the large pistol primers fit, but were recessed about .002. I fired then immediately inspected the case. Seemed to work just fine. Caution is the name of the game when changing components.
Yeah, the large pistol magnum primers seem to have a thicker cup and work pretty well so far.
Thanks guys I had a recent mix up with a couple dillon primer tubes loaded 200 rounds of 9mm with small rifle primers luckily I'm running a stock striker spring
Like you say, I have used Small Rifle primers in loading 9mm. However, that is the only example I have personally tried and can vouch for.
Thanks guys. Appreciate the info👍
Great information and advice. One thing you didn't address that is very relevant these days is interchangeability of regular and magnum primers. Based on another video I saw comparing actual pressures, they are quite interchangeable and the pressure difference was extremely small if any at all and the bullet speeds were almost identical as well. Of course, your advice still stands, if you use magnum primers instead of regular, you should go back to the minimum powder load and work your way back up just to be on the safe side.
I had a good load in a 300winmag once that I tried every primer I had. I used cci 250/200, br2, cci no.34, fed.210match, fed.215m, rem.9½ and 9½m. Of all of them the cci no.34 was the hottest. Makes sense as it is a military primer. It was good for about 30fps over the hottest of the others. Some of the magnum primers were not as hot as some of the standard primers. Don't have that data any more. Wish I still did.
If you're new to reloading the best advice I can give is follow the book to the letter. As you gain experience you begin to research a little outside the lines as you learn the warning signs to look for. I had an old Speer manual that was 6gr hotter on a max load in my winmag with 4831 Than all of the newer manuals so there seems to be a safety factor built in. But if you're new to it, follow the book.
The one case where I DO routinely use small pistol primers in a rifle case is .22 Hornet. For ALL "book" loads.
Pressure is low enough for SP cups and accuracy improves noticeably compared to same loads with an SR.
You can even find this suggestion in some re loading manuals. There, adding to the murk!
I was thinking about doing the same with my 17 hornet. I am thinking that small powder charge might benefit from a less energetic primer. I do wonder however if it would ignite H110/W296?
@@jesusisalive3227
My go to Hornet load is 10gr. W296, .224 45gr. Winchester HP Hornet bullet and a CCI small pistol primer, load in neck sized only cases. Shoots MOA from CZ 527.
Very good information. I did try small magnum pistol primers in 45ACP. But I went with very minimal loads. Seems ok. But it was just an experiment.
Like you can find primers anywhere right now.
I found 1k small rifle primers a few months ago. Took a lot of effort
Excellent advice to all the “been there, I know it all Reloader’s”, especially on The Handloader’s Bench Forum!
I have been making my own primers for 8 years now i use real btw primer compound. all the stuff is easy to get. also on a side note when i say make i mean make from scratch, i bought used surplus stamp presses and made dies. all the cup material for primers is 0.015 thick across all primers. i only make 2 primers large and small for every thing. for example large pistol mag and large pistol non mag are the same height cups both at .119". where a problem can crop up is in example large pistol is .119" height and large rifle is .125 so a over all thickness difference of .006 thou. this is where cases come into play i have some where they don't work but for the most part i don't have any issues. some cases have to have the primer pocket depth cut .006 deeper so the primer is not proud of the case. a little extra time but when there done there done. i cut them with a little end mill on a drill with a home made drill stop and a jig i built.
Wow, you make your own primers with dies too? I just finished manufacturing my own primer anvil stamping punches and dies today. Where do you get your punch materials from?
Edit : I am a member of a group chat of a couple of machinists if you are interested in talking about this in further depth
I have been reloading for 40 years but after reading your comment on primers you sir ARE a reloaded. Hats off to you. Talk about getting into it@
@@scottgorman7166 with that current situation we should start making our own powder soon
May I ask where you can get the compound, I've tried the stuff you get from the 22 reloaded and it's too dirty.
@@amycoffman2092 you have to make it. Go look at aardvarkreloading he has a primer reloading course updated June of last year.
that rabbit hole got me started a long time ago. i use h-48 compound. and no it is not measurably corrosive. For anyone that cleans their stuff on a regular basis. And with anything else like this make small batches at a time, for immediate use. Don't store big batches of it.
327 Federal Magnum is recommended to be loaded with small rifle primers. But then again, that cartridge has an unusually high pressure amongst handgun cartridges. Pretty much a modern 30 carbine. Easier to load since it is not tapered...
The manual is there for a reason, the safety for self and others in shooting sports. Timely video given I have not been able to find small pistol primers for sale.
know a place that says they're getting some 9mm primers soon, and they recently got 9mm projectiles - keep an eye out
Tell that to all the USPSA shooters who have been loading 9mm and 38 Super with rifle primers for years.
@@jimvac77 Keeping it really simple, do those USPSA shooters use small rifle primers when they load 9mm? I'm asking because I honestly don't know.
@@dexm2010 Yes, they do. They're a requirement for those who load 9mm Major.
@@jimvac77 Thank you sir!
Me over here thinking, there is nothing that would make this man laugh, great content guys👍
I’ve been forced to use SRP in my 357Mag (Rossi Lever Action) as no SPMP are available in my country. I started with lower loads. Works fine. I tested Remington SRP and found them to be too soft. Even had a punctured primer. CCI SRP worked best (better than Federal SRP) with Viht N-110 and H100.
Did my own personal experiment when primers weren’t available. I’ve seen some people test a full load. Personally, I only did primer and empty shell for testing. If it ignited, then I worked on a load. Was a little concerned with pressure and so I did shoot some reduced loads before discovering there’s little to no change in fps.
Fun fact cci have the same spec for sr and spm. They have officially said that before. So they can be interchanged.
I use LP primers in rifle cartridges for cast bullet shooting, others do too. We are talking 20k to 30k pressure, works fine. The .010" difference in height has not been a problem in any rifle I have tried this in.
This is the year I spend all my time on the muzzle loader range. It's cheaper and I can still get supplies for not ridiculous prices. Plus antique flintlocks are awesome to shoot not just to own.
Agree. I’ve even gone to shooting high power PCP air rifles. A lot of fun for not much money when it comes to ammo.
@@jerryking3208 Same here, I love that my Texan can shoot the same .358 bullets I feed my SP101 and Big Boy.
@@jerryking3208 I've just recently gotten into air rifles. I just have a .22 one but my friend let me shoot his .357 rifle and I fell in love with it. He also has a .50 caliber one he has hunted bear with but it was like a 4,000 dollar air rifle or some such.
Good to hear I can finally put my Remington 6.5 primers to use in some pistol loads.
A guy gave me 1000 rem 6.5 primers saying he couldn’t load the for his ar. After researching this particular primer, it looks like they make it for rifles like the 22 hornet. I have been wanting to load them for 9 mm but was not real sure about it. How did they work out for you?
This is something timely for me as I am about to invest in a loading set up, primarily for 44 Special and 44 Magnum.
Honestly, get the primers you'll need first. I haven't seen any Large Pistol primers in a store or online in 6 months.
Thank you for this. Do you guys have a how to video on how to start reloading
I would agree about not mixed matching. But in times like these gotta do, what you gotta do. But use some caution
It’s been a very long time since I’ve been able to find any srp , must admit I’ve been eyeing those pistol primers,
As always make sure each time you change lot #s to do some load testing before relying on what you believe to be fact. I've got a few small rifle primers ( CCI, Remington and Winchester ) that come out of lots over 20years old. They seem to be hotter and when used in loading pistol cartridges with them, I've had to reduce powder charges by 1 to 2 grains as compared to using CCI and Winchester small rifle primers of later lots of 10 years or newer in the same loading using the same powders and projectiles. This is backed up by both visual and chronograph data and a few very flat primers.
Other than that so far CCI and Winchester small rifle primers have worked in all pistol loading from 32acp ( this cartridge loading should be checked thoroughly before using load data with any substitutes) to 7.62x25 , 9mm and 40s&w without a hick up. I still reduce the loads a touch out of an abundance of precautions.
As for getting primers, I don't know what planet you two are on but they are basically non existent for most of us. We don't have the obvious connections you two have and myself, I don't have the resources to spend 24/7 scouring the country to find them. And if they do magically appear someplace they are gone faster than Big Daddy on sunny day at the Strip.
Have used SR in 9mm, no problem but common sense load developement should always be used. Do not just substitute components, start low and work up.
Great video
i'v had dropped primers on the floor and workbench that I had not clue whether they were rifle or pistol, and a tube of small primers that wasn't marked, so I just used them on 9mm. Never had a problem.
Yes...there are some substitutions that can be dangerous. Pistol primers in rifle rounds for example, unless they are for very low velocity loads.
*low pressure. A low velocity round can still be high pressure
Reading the manufacturers specifications can clear up a lot of things in many cases. For example S&B recommends the use of their Small Pistol Magnum primers for .22 Hornet, .222 Rem. and 5,6×50 R, which are small rifle cartridges.
Thanx.. I had that question until last week...I thought I was out of small pistol primers...until I found about 4K hidden away and forgotten...niw I can reload the approximately 6 lbs of nickel-plated 9mm brass and approximately 7 lbs if .357 brass...also long forgotten...and found when I rediscovered those small pistol primers...
I have loaded Shotgun Pistol and Rifle for better than 40 years! I have used every primer interchange possible and the only problem I have ever had is occasionally using a pistol primer in a rifle case it will seat to deep and you get a mis fire but even that is rare. Back before the load data was all lawyered up I would back off a bit and work them up but nowadays the load data that is published in not even close to max loads.
If you are going to work a load up go a quarter grain at a time and as soon as you see bulged primers back it off 10% and you should be just fine. (that is only in modern firearms in good condition)
The only primers I have completely blown out was in 22-250 shooting magnum pistol primers at above max data.
Stay with mid range loads and you will be just fine. Sure as hell beats throwing a rock since primers are like gold now days!
I have used large mag pistol primers for 45 colt for years.
But only in new manufactured firearms. Always lower the powder charge and work your way back up to the original load. Slowly.
have u ever used LMP on 45acp?
I have used small pistol magnum primers for 233. I developed the load with those primers- did not substitute into an existing SR load.
What difference did it make in powder charge? Did you end up using more or less?
Smugglers need to get into primers ! Prices right up there with dope !! Maybe higher !!
I loaded some cci standard pistol primers on a 9x19 and plenty of them with no issues. Once for some bizarre reason found small pistol magnum primers also from cci for half the price compared to standard pistol primers. Loaded them, on the crony the speeds are negligible almost identical. However when you manually load a primed case into the chamber with only a primer, no powder, no bullet, the magnum primers certainly has a bigger bang compared to the standard ones. m2c
I haven't used rifle to pistol primers however magnum to standard without issue at all, no velocity changes or pressure signs. I stumbled onto this since Remington and Winchester have labeled their primers for standard or magnum loads. Certainly need to back off the powder charge and verify the load when doing so but I have had no ill effects.
Great information
I would never use riffle primers for pistol loads but I do use a small pistol primers for the 22 hornet it has a better even burn when loading non lead bullets thanks for the info
recently i got to sleeves of 450 ccis in a lotnof 550s i bought. i loaded a few and only half of them fired. I load fairly light these days to conserve powder but only about half of them functions inassume it was to soft of a strike, but i will not use them again based on that situation.
I have had zero issues using CCI 400 small rifle primers in 9mm 115 grain FMJ competition loads in my Glock 17 and 34. I reduced the charges and worked up from a low base. With SP primers in such short supply this workaround has served me well. If you choose this path start with a low charge and be careful! BTW, I loaded primers only into empty cases to check whether my lighter springs would do the job. Fortunately, they do.
What did the charge adjustment ended up being?
I never did an A/B comparison. Just started low and worked up. @@OnePointLander
I load LP primers in my 1874 Sharps .45-70 with a charge of black powder with great result except the primers are extremely dented. I use LR primers for my smokeless loads in the same rifle, those primer fair much better.
I remember years ago reading on some forum about a guy taking berdan primer pocket brass, removing the anvil, and GLUING in boxer primers. The didn't fit so he friggin' glued them in. Talk about sketchy.
Very timely advice because I want to load 5.56 but I only have small pistol primers. I've wondered about using them. The web advice has been the same as you have provided here. I sure hope to find some small rifle primers one of these days. Bullets are available and powder is if you keep looking but I've had no success sourcing primers. Hope you get some soon!!!
looking like a place I know is going to be getting 9mm primers (they have HP projects atm) soon - I don't load or know anyone who does though : |
Ye rather be safe. 5.56 has some serious pressure. You wouldn’t want to risk a primer failing. Good luck. Plenty of SRP here in South Africa. You want CCI or Federal? I’ll send you some 😂 Just send us some again when things are back to normal there! All the best!
1Eagle Don't do it. As stated in the video description, "Rifle primers have thicker cups, so they can handle the pressure of pistol cartridges, but pistol primer cups are not built to handle the higher pressures of rifle cartridges."
1Eagle ...... depends largely on your powder charge..... if you are loading subsonic for instance ..... but I am not a professional so-and-so..... I am just an old man
I've been testing Small Pistol primers in .223 Remington cartridges.
Currently, I've been testing with the little Nosler "Varmageddon" Ballistic Tip 40gr bullets.
According to Hodgdon's Reloading website, IMR 4895 powder at the Starting Load weight of 24.9 grains produces 35,200psi. That pressure is on par with mid-range .357SIG pistol cartridges and only 4% higher than my .40 Smiff & Wessun loads, both of which use Small Pistol primers.
I made 20 cartridges with a powder charge at -15% of the Starting Load, 20 more at -10%, then -5% and finally 20 at the Starting Load. All of them fired, although I did have to adjust my gas block initially. (They fired but didn't cycle the action on that gas block setting.)
Under the magnifying glass, everything looks fine. With that being said, I'm specifically wanting to make cartridges for training on targets within 40 yards, so I don't need the same velocity as someone trying to shoot 500+ yards.
My friend had a Slam-fire event in his AR-15 ( Uncontrolled Mag Dump) after using Pistol primers in 223. it was Scary ....and kinda fun fun watch. we could not recreate the event using a SCAR16 or another AR. so only load a couple, so if/when it runs away from you you don't have to hold on for 3o rounds.
The problem is you can’t get primers and as you said pressures don’t change that much. People are reusing primers out of necessity which is sad because Canada has plenty
@@rubenpicon9541 I wonder if they'll drop'm off by a tree near the border .. lol
Should ship ours back we won’t have anything to use them in at this rate
Locally in Central Oregon there hasn't been any rifle powder for months. And lately even handgun powder isn't available.
@@lapinebob I feel your pain. I am running low on everything except casings and there is nothing in the stores here in Florida
@@dannie3117 I managed to snag 1,000 small pistol primers from BassProShops website in January 6.
Since then, the listings for all their primers and all their powder say, "This product is not available online."
Also, I haven't seen small rifle primers anywhere since August.
I have been reloading for just about fifty years now, and I'd like to think I've gotten pretty good at it over the decades. My very first reloading manual (Lyman 44th Edition - 1967) does not tell me that exchanging "rifle" and "pistol" primers is an OK thing, so I never did. I always figured that there was a reason for the difference, and probably a good one.
As far as I understand it, rifle primers often have a tighter fit and a thicker cup, but dimensionally they often are super close to pistol. You can load rifle primers in pistol rounds, if the dimensions are right and your hammer/striker hits hard enough, but you definitely shouldn't load pistol primers in rifle rounds.
That question was never an issue until the pistol primers started disappearing. That's why everyone started pondering this question. I have been able to shoot for over a year because lack if ammo, primers. But I have thousands of small rifle primers. My wife and i used to shoot 500 rounds a month of 9mm before covid. It's a real downer, we just don't have ammo.
Some small primers say "for rifle or pistol" on the box.
I have used small mag pistol primers in 223 with starting loads without any problems with the primers or with the case. This was with a bolt action savage 111 with a very strong receiver and it seemed to work well. I DON'T think I would try it with regular small pistol primers. I never tried it on an AR . I did with a starting load in a solid receiver to see if I could do it .It worked in a pinch but if you can get the small rifle primers I would stick with them. I tried to make sure it was as safe as possible.
I'll sometimes use large pistol in rifle cartridges. Only when using light cast bullet loads though. Works well. And CCI says that their small pistol magnum & their small rifle primers are the same, no cup differences.
I saw an old gunsmith due to scarcity of 9mm and 45 ACP ammo cut down a .308 to produce a 45 round, he lessened the charge and just handloaded it and it worked
@vettelover2009 Going deep with a tapered reamer, maybe?
@vettelover2009 well I saw him carefully reamed out the interior of the case just enough for a cast lead to be seated
Also, I clearly saw that the original rifle primer was still present at that time, essentially the old gunsmith was making 45 ACP ammo from 7.62mm rounds, making use of a cut down and reamed case and a reduced original rifle powder, the only thing he supplied was a cast lead bullet
Same case head diameter. 10mm originally used 300 Savage cases cut down.
Speer makes plastic training bullets for revolvers that use only a primer and plastic case.
Great for garage plinking.
Still capable of injuries.
I expanded on this.
Use hot glue to make bullets instead of lead.
Use whatever primer fits the hole in the case of my choosing.
The larger the case, and longer the barrel, the less power the round has after leaving the barrel.
Of course none cycle semiauto.
But it’s fun plinking and was good use for primers that weren’t stored properly.
209 primers have nice oomph in a muzzle loader using the glue bullets or crayola erasers without a powder charge.
Caps only tend to leave the bullet stuck in the barrel using the hot glue or wax bullets.
Not a bad activity I’ve you have a nice location, but can’t get to the range.
Great for plinking empty soda cans.
Most only dent the can, but some penetrate.
Still capable of damaging your drywall.
I did try one out of a Glock 35 at the range.
I didn’t feel a breeze, but at 15yards I was able to watch the bullet curve away and miss the entire target by 4 feet 🤪
Murky is right, when they became hard to find I had some CCI BR4 I loaded into 9mm they would not shoot in my Glock 17 or Taurus PT 111 two firearms I was willing to sacrifice in the name of science but fired in my AR style 9mm. I then acquired Fed. 205 and 205M's that worked fine in both handguns.So In essence I would recommend using the proper components along with trial and error. But then who am I to judge ?.
I have used large rifle in 10mm on numerous occasions, some Brass they fit perfect others they are slightly tall so you must measure the pocket depth first other than that no problems and i have only used them for light target loads
My only experience with this is the 22 hornet using pistol primers. It works well but is a low pressure cartridge and the .454 casull which calls specifically for a small rifle primer. I look at it as a more advanced reloader option.
I’ve used small rifle primers In my 38spc +p for over 5k rounds now and they seem to be a proven standard for my loads with 6.5grns of hogdon longshot
I load large pistol primers in black powder 45-70 w/cast bullets.Works fine for me in the BFR and CVA Scout.
I use Rifle primers on some of my 9mm, with an extended firering pin on the handgun, and not one issue, and my loads stay the same.
Speer's reloading manual specifically says to use small pistol primers in the 22 Hornet. I do so and have had no problems. Apparently small rifle primers are hotter than they used to be and are a bit much for such a small case.
Really honest video-very refreshing in a culture of “be dumb first and sue somebody second.”
You are obviously not a reloader. I have done a lot of primer switching just as my own test bed. I have every type of primer available in abundance. A smart reloader will start at a low recommended charge and chrono their way up.
@@shaverlocal ...well the 400-500 rounds I loaded today would say otherwise, but I certainly don’t know everything, and maybe there’s something you know that’s worth learning?
@@pastordoogie8438 believe it was your comment "be dumb first" that caught my attention. Most of us that like to consider ourselves serious reloaders as that is my pastime,look at you as a novice.
@@shaverlocal I reload handgun calibers on a progressive press mainly for ammo shortages and lower costs.
Did I correctly imagine you as more of a rifle caliber reloader?
In our brief exchange you do strike me as the kind of reloader who would experiment, but not someone who would blame someone else if something bad happened-which was more the intent of my comment, but sorry if I came off that way.
@@pastordoogie8438 I reload 8 calibers on 4 presses. yea, One is a Dillon, an 8 station Lyman, An RCBS A2, and an arber press for my Wilson dies. I have three Dillon powder drops + Two Neil Jones measures (look it up) a Redding BR3 +a pistol insert and a couple of grand of misc equipment. I have loaded 11,000 tounds of 9mm , 2500 of 45ACP, and several thousand rounds of 223 in the last 8-9 month's. It is what I do. I was in a bad motorcycle wreck that put me in the hospital for months and I have been reloading again since I can walk. I have loaded thousands of rounds without 1 hickup.
Yeah, I mistook large pistol primers for large rifle primers when reloading some 7x57 Mauser loads. This was a mistake due to not fully reading the labels on the primer container; all I saw was "Large." I mostly got away with it, but I had a few of the primers punctured by the firing pin. I was very lucky. Thankfully the gases didn't shoot back into my face. The punctured primers clued me into checking the component packaging when I got home from the range, and lo and behold, I had mixed the primers up. I count myself lucky... and chastened. Don't do this!
I was just looking this up. Supposedly CCI small rifle primers work as small pistol magnum. Those are the only interchangeable primers that I’ve heard of, use at your own risk.
There are a few situations where I use large pistol primers in rifle cartridges, and this is in large calibre black powder calibres such as .577 Snider, .577/.450 Martini Henry and 11mm Werder. I cannot get the Werder to fire reliably using rifle primers as the strike is too weak and making a replacement spring is not an option. I also tend to use a magnum primer to ensure the flame gets through the black powder charge.
I would agree however that this is not something you should be doing without a very good reason and a clear understanding of the issues.
I've been using Tula/Wolf SRP (non magnum) in .30 carbine with great results...and .30 carbine is a ( for all intents and purposes ) a pistol round using pistol powder.
Thank for answering my question
FWI, I use small rifle primers in 357 magnum loads for my lever action.
But these are loaded with rifle powder & only used in said rifle
WTH is FYI?
I've swapped em back n forth for many years when stuff gets short in supply.
Small primers go back n forth pretty easily.
The issue I found with large primers is the large rifle primers are harder.
So my striker fired weapons took two trigger pulls on occasion to ignite.
Not always.
If you get a misfire this way.
I wound rechamber that round and it would fire.
When I reload primers (yes you can reload primers) theyve all been struck so they work in all applications
I've used matches to reload primers and those snaps that go off when you throw them snd of course you can buy priming compund.
I also use large rifle magnum primers in my large rifle loads.
They make more heat but not more pressure
Thanks for the video. I will have to say I am no better informed now, but I will stick to the intended use for my own safety. lol! I have always bought by the brick and the label on one has a price of $21.90 from about 20 years ago. Being a hoarder has it's rewards sometimes.
prices for primers now are DISGUSTING and Brownells prices are GREEDY crap!!! $60 for 1lb. of Varget, WTF GREEDY apes.
This info pretty much jives with what I’ve seen as well. Nice that there can be some flexibility especially in this day and age having a hard time to find any primers. Reloading can be dangerous to begin with but like you guys stated, start your load tests LOW and work your way up, and continue to check for over pressure signs along the way.
I have interchanged small rifle and small pistol primers in my .22 hornet loads for years
I find that Small Pistol Primers and Small Magnum Pistol Primers work equally well in the low-pressure loads common to Cowboy Action Shooting. With Black Powder loads, Magnum primers seem to give more complete ignition. I have not attempted to load with Small Rifle Primers, although I suspect that with .357 rounds at under 800fps muzzle velocity, they would work well... If the hammer springs are strong enough.
Here in Maine, All i could find was large rifle primers. amd large pistol primers.. i fire 9mm and 3030.. i am worried what my options are for a typical 9mm reloading case?. can a rifle primer use in a 9mm case for semi mag fed pistols?
I have always had this conundrum....I cast my own bullets for 45Colt and have both a rifle and SAA handgun chambered for it. Which large primer do I/can I use?
At the start of this primer shortage I had a box of small rifle primers left over when I ran out of small pistol primers. I thought I'd give them a try and loaded up a some in 9mm to try. I found because the small rifle primers have a thicker cup I had an unacceptable amount of miss fires and gave up on that idea. I'll use them in small rifle cases instead.
CCI has a good piece on using small rifle primers in 38/357. Really no issue because that is a small rifle round to begin with.
I used cut down .454 cases for heavy .45 Long Colt in a M1894 Winchester rifle. I used rifle primers, even though the loads called for Large Pistol primers. That was because my 1873 Peacemaker did not have a strong enough hammer spring to fire the primer. So, if I screwed up and put one of those loads in my Colt, I didn't damage the gun or me by firing something rated for a Ruger Blackhawk or the Winchester but probably twice the PSI as a Colt was rated for. My Ruger's would also fire those primers, btw. Coil over leaf spring, I suppose.
Well said!!
As soon as you make them available for sale ill start using the primer the manual calls for, mean time ill continue to use SRF for all my 9 357 223.
Good advice
small rifle primers specifically 223 are super hard to get ahold of right now, so I definitely would not waist them for a substitute pistol primer.
I found Large Pistol primers to be useful in the sort of reduced loads that the old Lyman cast bullet handbook listed for 38-55. (10 gr of Unique for instance under a 246 gr cast projectile....)That WAS with a suitably lightened main spring. I SUSPECT such primers might also work just fine in the sort of loads of TRAIL BOSS recommended for use in obsolete cartridges, (I use a 90% full case of TB in an old 8x56R Steyr Bolt action - gives about 1350 fps) but have not tried it. I would be a little concerned that the firing pin strike would be too "hard" for the thinner primer cup. Noone wants pierced primers.
Very interesting!
I was expecting full derp and received credible info. Correct, if it seats and you work up a load go for it, but don't ever just interchange them. Impressed with your open and honest response.
Thanks for another informative video. Question - what manufacturer press is that mounted on the bench?
Looks like The Zero by Area 419 (1200 smackeroo's)
the only problem I've had is some light strikes that led to squibs.
but that was in an old s&w 646 that just needed a little work for a harder hit. now it fires fine. and all my friends cowboy guns fire em fine but I've never experienced a more powerful load because of them.
Good info
I'm using Remington 6 1\5 rifle primers in my 9mm had to download the charge quite a bit
I tested a G19 and a Ruger LC9S with starting loads and Wincehster and CCI small rifle primers prior to working up. Guns set off the primers no problem, and cycled normally. As stated, whenever you change a component you MUST work your load up again and make sure it is safe in your firearm. In my case they performed identically to their pistol counterparts during workup, your results may vary.
Is there a difference in power and if so which is more powerful ?