I've seen tons of other critics lambaste The Last Jedi, but they fail to touch on just why the movie stung so much. For there was good in it, I felt it.
Don’t forget the utter destruction of Luke Skywalker’s character, and killing him way too early and having him act entirely out of character the whole movie. Making Rey a nobody and complete Mary Sue boring as hell. I could go on and on, Star Wars is dead.
You're not the only one! I read every official canon SW book, until TLJ. Since then, I've had NO desire... What they did, to Luke, crushed alot of peoples' joy.
I should clarify here that when it comes to the ideas I liked (Luke’s use of the force. The dynamic between Kylo, Luke, and Rey. The death of snoke) I simply liked them as concepts. The way they were executed is a different story entirely. If the movie was based more around hitting those plot points and expanding on them, I feel like the movie would have been significantly better and more well received. As they stand in execution though, I will admit that they were a little half baked.
DejaVoodooDoll The point seems to be going over your head. 1. Leia was in space. Unconscious. You need to do a lot more than pull slightly in order to survive in space. Leia had to be force breathing or something in order for her body to not completely freeze over. Not to mention it’s just dumb. 2. If you’re going to defend the shot of literal nutsack tits then we haven’t nothing to discuss. 3. Being against slavery does not make you a well developed character. Most everyone is against slavery. An on the nose message is not a good substitute for nuanced story telling. Best example I can give you is look at something like Ferngully. It just comes off as pretentious and virtue signaling (even though I agree with it.) Not to mention the scene is just dumb. 4. Holdo wants Poe to not question her authority and therefore withholds information from him. She makes that clear. Stop defending dumb decisions. They were bad and you know they were bad. Like the good if you want. Hell, I loved 1/3 of this movie. But don’t defend nutsack tits please.
DejaVoodooDoll Bro you’re defending lazy writing, Leia Supermaning through space, “muh slavery”, and LITERAL nutsack tits. Stop projecting. You’re filling in what the movie presented with what you WANT to see. Not what was actually shown. It’s silly. That’s what it comes down to. It’s silly and done in a moronic and poorly written way. I agree, Rose can be against slavery and that’s good. But having her grandstand to the audience is lazy.
DejaVoodooDoll To counter on the points raised in this conversation, Leia using the force while in space is unrealistic because she should have died from either the exposure to space, the shockwaves from the explosion that destroyed the bridge, the vacuum that sent her into space, or any combination of the three. For Luke drinking the milk, just because he does it doesn't mean that we should see it. If that were the case then we would probably see everyone use the toilet at least once in the saga to establish that they poop. Also, on Tatooine, we never see Luke or his family ever have any animals or any place where an animal might go on the farm, thus making it likely that his family's farm didn't raise animals. For Rose and her bit with the children and the animals, all of that entire planet could have been cut out if the First Order was competent and detected the star that Crait orbits. From this they could have easily deduced that the Resistance was going to a potential planet in the system and stopped Holdo's plan before it even got off the ground. With the Prequels, the politics cannot be taken out because they were weaved into the story better than with the politics in The Last Jedi.
Why wasn't Snoke working with the emperor in the original trilogy? We have no reason to assume he wasn't there during the original trilogy. Snoke looks old enough to have been alive.
I’m with you brother! I found myself in somewhat of a slump/mini depression after The last Jedi. I’m crossing my fingers that episode nine will bring us some of what we’re looking for in a Star Wars movie.
First, happy your back! Second, couldn’t agree more with you! They had so much potential and just bent the franchise over. Even my friends who are fans tried to convince them selfs it was good, but they just want to believe in the lie... ugh! Happy your back but damn this video reminded me how much my bunghole still hurts from this film.
Snoke dying is sort of fine (minus the lack of competent antagonists), but it's a real shame they didn't use his character as a vehicle for explaining the ridiculous situation the galaxy is now in. Exploring the character of Snoke could have showed us how we got from Rebel victory to Lame Empire vs Lame Rebels, and how Luke failed Kylo. Both of those explanations were desperately needed, and we got neither, and now Snoke is possibly actually dead, and those explanations coming in another manner in Ep. 9 would be far too little, far too late. Even as a poorly thought-through mystery box, Snoke could have been used to good effect prior to his death if Rian Johnson weren't so determined to senselessly subvert everything he could.
Yeah, not explaining the situation was an Ep. 7 problem, but one Rian could have fixed here. They were so afraid of being like prequels that they didn't want to have any politics in the sequels. If you ask me, politics and Palpatine manipulating them was the only thing that was consistently good in the prequels. I might be in the minority there, though.
Indeed, 7 ought to have explained it, and then Rian ought to have when 7 didn't. I agree that politics isn't the bad part of the Prequels -- the general outline of the trilogy, including the politics, is actually pretty good. Unfortunately, many of the particular details and the execution were flawed. Ultimately, it isn't that politics is a bad thing for Star Wars -- it's just that there are better and worse ways to include them, and execution is critical. Since the political situation of the Sequels is so absurd, it really could have used more politics. Without them, it's so difficult to care about anything that's going on. For all that they supposedly wanted to avoid associations with the Prequels, we got the whole Canto Bight mess, and plenty of Prequel-esque slapstick humor, with no shortage of hamfisted, politically-inspired lectures.
J. J. Abrams sets up his stupid mystery boxes, the round head decides to show us there's nothing inside. That is kind of interesting and subversive, but you end up with whole lot of nothing in the end. That is not good. The villain point is what I agree with most. I liked Snoke more than you, but that might be because there simply wasn't any other villain to take seriously.
I remember watching this in the theater, I knew from the title crawl that it was in trouble. I felt like I was watching a parody of the Force Awakens. The change in direction from JJ to RoundHead Ruin Johnson was sooo jarring.
I always looked at Star Wars as a character driven franchise as the background/macro story was always window dressing. My point is that there is a formula to these films that made the Originals successful and they keep overthinking it. We are not watching Star Wars for the spaceships, or the Lightsabers, or even Death Star 2/Starkiller Base. What always drove the narrative for me was the characters, their arcs, the relationship with each other, and a theme that ties it altogether. The theme of the Originals is friendship, and how they will do anything for each other to the point of sacrificing themselves. I honestly don’t what the theme is of this Trilogy or what the point is? Luke’s destiny was tied to his father and that redemption in ROTJ satisfied his and Vader’s arc. What is Rey’s arc? Kylo Ren’s arc? This Trilogy is just a hodgepodge if ideas from JJ and Rian Johnson thrown into a salad bowl, shaken up and then served on screen. There is no reason to call this 7,8,9 as the narrative/theme has very little to do with 1-6? In fact they actually limit their storytelling because every time they want to go in a new direction they are married to the 1-6 narrative. We essentially end the movie with Rey as the next Jedi and Kylo as the main villain. So what is the point of Episode 9 that has any interesting character arc that will bridge an overall theme to this Trilogy? Which goes to my original point is that SW is a character driven story......until Disney took over. Now it’s plot driven and that is really boring.
So you could survive the Phantom Menace which had racial stereotype characters, villains with convoluted motives, a Sith who only has one line of dialogue, an one the nose vergin birth of a chosen Christ child, a Queen that occasionally sounds incredibly hokey, a Dart Vader that sounds like a little baby despite being a slave mechanic pilot, that same kid being able to destroy an entire space station first try with little to no experience, the introduction of medichlorians that make the force seem like it's not spiritual at all, and Jar Jar Fucking Binks and his army of Gungans that are more useless and annoying than the ewoks. But this is the movie that made you think, "Star Wars is dead, sorry guys flew too close to the sun."
Call me a fanboy, but I would have much preferred to see Luke go force-unleashed on the First Order or at least live long enough to have a real fight with Kylo instead of die an old lonely man :( His story arc wasn't all that compelling at all. Did he really accomplish anything by force projecting himself when he could have been there and died just the same? Fuck, Rose ruined everything. Luke didn't need to die.
Star Wars is the domain of feminists and social justice advocates. It is no longer an epic space story but more a vehicle for the distribution of propaganda. There is little hope for anything good to come from the next episode or expanded movies with the current production and directorial leadership.
I completely 100% disagree with the reasons you liked it. . .I'm sorry. . .I like character development not subversion of expectations just because. Subvert them with substance, not nihilism. . .
You say that you are afraid of future movies not taking risks. If that's the case, why do you dislike The Last Jedi? You admit that it took risks, and that both bad and good things come out of risks. Seems to me you should be celebrating the Last Jedi for taking risks, even the ones you didn't like, because they were risks all the same. If you're guaranteed to like the movie, it's probably because of boring corporate machinations and not because of an artistic vision.
Matt Chatham this entire video praises the movie for taking risks. They were just bad risks. Just because it takes risks doesn’t mean I have to bend over and praise it.
Matt Chatham, most of the risks in the film were stupid ones that should never have been attempted. I could take a risk and jump in front of a car to see if I'd survive or not, but that doesn't mean I should.
Don’t forget the utter destruction of Luke Skywalker’s character, and killing him way too early and having him act entirely out of character the whole movie. Making Rey a nobody and complete Mary Sue boring as hell. I could go on and on, Star Wars is dead.
You're not the only one!
I read every official canon SW book, until TLJ. Since then, I've had NO desire...
What they did, to Luke, crushed alot of peoples' joy.
You can't change EVERYTHING in the 8th episode of a 9 episode saga, without ruining it...
I should clarify here that when it comes to the ideas I liked (Luke’s use of the force. The dynamic between Kylo, Luke, and Rey. The death of snoke) I simply liked them as concepts. The way they were executed is a different story entirely. If the movie was based more around hitting those plot points and expanding on them, I feel like the movie would have been significantly better and more well received. As they stand in execution though, I will admit that they were a little half baked.
DejaVoodooDoll The point seems to be going over your head.
1. Leia was in space. Unconscious. You need to do a lot more than pull slightly in order to survive in space. Leia had to be force breathing or something in order for her body to not completely freeze over. Not to mention it’s just dumb.
2. If you’re going to defend the shot of literal nutsack tits then we haven’t nothing to discuss.
3. Being against slavery does not make you a well developed character. Most everyone is against slavery. An on the nose message is not a good substitute for nuanced story telling. Best example I can give you is look at something like Ferngully. It just comes off as pretentious and virtue signaling (even though I agree with it.) Not to mention the scene is just dumb.
4. Holdo wants Poe to not question her authority and therefore withholds information from him. She makes that clear.
Stop defending dumb decisions. They were bad and you know they were bad. Like the good if you want. Hell, I loved 1/3 of this movie. But don’t defend nutsack tits please.
DejaVoodooDoll Bro you’re defending lazy writing, Leia Supermaning through space, “muh slavery”, and LITERAL nutsack tits. Stop projecting.
You’re filling in what the movie presented with what you WANT to see. Not what was actually shown.
It’s silly. That’s what it comes down to. It’s silly and done in a moronic and poorly written way. I agree, Rose can be against slavery and that’s good. But having her grandstand to the audience is lazy.
Sir Nekk Just ignore the obvious troll here, he isn't worth your time.
DejaVoodooDoll To counter on the points raised in this conversation, Leia using the force while in space is unrealistic because she should have died from either the exposure to space, the shockwaves from the explosion that destroyed the bridge, the vacuum that sent her into space, or any combination of the three. For Luke drinking the milk, just because he does it doesn't mean that we should see it. If that were the case then we would probably see everyone use the toilet at least once in the saga to establish that they poop. Also, on Tatooine, we never see Luke or his family ever have any animals or any place where an animal might go on the farm, thus making it likely that his family's farm didn't raise animals. For Rose and her bit with the children and the animals, all of that entire planet could have been cut out if the First Order was competent and detected the star that Crait orbits. From this they could have easily deduced that the Resistance was going to a potential planet in the system and stopped Holdo's plan before it even got off the ground. With the Prequels, the politics cannot be taken out because they were weaved into the story better than with the politics in The Last Jedi.
Why wasn't Snoke working with the emperor in the original trilogy? We have no reason to assume he wasn't there during the original trilogy. Snoke looks old enough to have been alive.
I thought the astral projection was fine, and punked Kylo, but having him die after was stupid.
I’m with you brother! I found myself in somewhat of a slump/mini depression after The last Jedi. I’m crossing my fingers that episode nine will bring us some of what we’re looking for in a Star Wars movie.
First, happy your back! Second, couldn’t agree more with you! They had so much potential and just bent the franchise over. Even my friends who are fans tried to convince them selfs it was good, but they just want to believe in the lie... ugh! Happy your back but damn this video reminded me how much my bunghole still hurts from this film.
The force is strong in you Sir Nekk
Long time no see sir nekk
Snoke dying is sort of fine (minus the lack of competent antagonists), but it's a real shame they didn't use his character as a vehicle for explaining the ridiculous situation the galaxy is now in. Exploring the character of Snoke could have showed us how we got from Rebel victory to Lame Empire vs Lame Rebels, and how Luke failed Kylo. Both of those explanations were desperately needed, and we got neither, and now Snoke is possibly actually dead, and those explanations coming in another manner in Ep. 9 would be far too little, far too late.
Even as a poorly thought-through mystery box, Snoke could have been used to good effect prior to his death if Rian Johnson weren't so determined to senselessly subvert everything he could.
Yeah, not explaining the situation was an Ep. 7 problem, but one Rian could have fixed here. They were so afraid of being like prequels that they didn't want to have any politics in the sequels. If you ask me, politics and Palpatine manipulating them was the only thing that was consistently good in the prequels. I might be in the minority there, though.
Indeed, 7 ought to have explained it, and then Rian ought to have when 7 didn't.
I agree that politics isn't the bad part of the Prequels -- the general outline of the trilogy, including the politics, is actually pretty good. Unfortunately, many of the particular details and the execution were flawed. Ultimately, it isn't that politics is a bad thing for Star Wars -- it's just that there are better and worse ways to include them, and execution is critical. Since the political situation of the Sequels is so absurd, it really could have used more politics. Without them, it's so difficult to care about anything that's going on.
For all that they supposedly wanted to avoid associations with the Prequels, we got the whole Canto Bight mess, and plenty of Prequel-esque slapstick humor, with no shortage of hamfisted, politically-inspired lectures.
Movie was boring it never earned any of it's deaths or great moments. I have no problem with what was attempted, it's the execution i hate.
This is one of the best videos I've seen on The Last Jedi
J. J. Abrams sets up his stupid mystery boxes, the round head decides to show us there's nothing inside. That is kind of interesting and subversive, but you end up with whole lot of nothing in the end. That is not good. The villain point is what I agree with most. I liked Snoke more than you, but that might be because there simply wasn't any other villain to take seriously.
I remember watching this in the theater, I knew from the title crawl that it was in trouble. I felt like I was watching a parody of the Force Awakens. The change in direction from JJ to RoundHead Ruin Johnson was sooo jarring.
I always looked at Star Wars as a character driven franchise as the background/macro story was always window dressing. My point is that there is a formula to these films that made the Originals successful and they keep overthinking it.
We are not watching Star Wars for the spaceships, or the Lightsabers, or even Death Star 2/Starkiller Base. What always drove the narrative for me was the characters, their arcs, the relationship with each other, and a theme that ties it altogether.
The theme of the Originals is friendship, and how they will do anything for each other to the point of sacrificing themselves. I honestly don’t what the theme is of this Trilogy or what the point is? Luke’s destiny was tied to his father and that redemption in ROTJ satisfied his and Vader’s arc. What is Rey’s arc? Kylo Ren’s arc?
This Trilogy is just a hodgepodge if ideas from JJ and Rian Johnson thrown into a salad bowl, shaken up and then served on screen. There is no reason to call this 7,8,9 as the narrative/theme has very little to do with 1-6? In fact they actually limit their storytelling because every time they want to go in a new direction they are married to the 1-6 narrative.
We essentially end the movie with Rey as the next Jedi and Kylo as the main villain. So what is the point of Episode 9 that has any interesting character arc that will bridge an overall theme to this Trilogy? Which goes to my original point is that SW is a character driven story......until Disney took over. Now it’s plot driven and that is really boring.
The last Jedi broke me! That is the whole point!
The last jedi is boring
This video perfectly explains my opinions on this film
#WalkAway
So you could survive the Phantom Menace which had racial stereotype characters, villains with convoluted motives, a Sith who only has one line of dialogue, an one the nose vergin birth of a chosen Christ child, a Queen that occasionally sounds incredibly hokey, a Dart Vader that sounds like a little baby despite being a slave mechanic pilot, that same kid being able to destroy an entire space station first try with little to no experience, the introduction of medichlorians that make the force seem like it's not spiritual at all, and Jar Jar Fucking Binks and his army of Gungans that are more useless and annoying than the ewoks. But this is the movie that made you think, "Star Wars is dead, sorry guys flew too close to the sun."
Call me a fanboy, but I would have much preferred to see Luke go force-unleashed on the First Order or at least live long enough to have a real fight with Kylo instead of die an old lonely man :( His story arc wasn't all that compelling at all. Did he really accomplish anything by force projecting himself when he could have been there and died just the same? Fuck, Rose ruined everything. Luke didn't need to die.
Rian is a hack.
idk, i liked the movie.
Me too.
So you have never seen the OG trilogy. That is probably the only way you like these movies. Not that there is anything wrong with that
Star Wars is the domain of feminists and social justice advocates. It is no longer an epic space story but more a vehicle for the distribution of propaganda. There is little hope for anything good to come from the next episode or expanded movies with the current production and directorial leadership.
Well said sir. That's exactly it, a vehicle for propaganda now.
I completely 100% disagree with the reasons you liked it. . .I'm sorry. . .I like character development not subversion of expectations just because. Subvert them with substance, not nihilism. . .
You say that you are afraid of future movies not taking risks. If that's the case, why do you dislike The Last Jedi? You admit that it took risks, and that both bad and good things come out of risks. Seems to me you should be celebrating the Last Jedi for taking risks, even the ones you didn't like, because they were risks all the same. If you're guaranteed to like the movie, it's probably because of boring corporate machinations and not because of an artistic vision.
Matt Chatham this entire video praises the movie for taking risks. They were just bad risks. Just because it takes risks doesn’t mean I have to bend over and praise it.
Matt Chatham, most of the risks in the film were stupid ones that should never have been attempted. I could take a risk and jump in front of a car to see if I'd survive or not, but that doesn't mean I should.
Matt Chatham TLJ took the wrong kind of risks...