Former lay minister and evangelical outreach director here. The church has gone from preaching and living the gospel, loving their neighbor as themselves, humility, turn the other cheek and charity to this. Politically motivated, arrogant, angry, paranoid/persecution complex, bullies painting the name of Jesus onto their nationalist crusade.
Mainely, may I ask you, whether you're still a believer or have you already become an atheist? I'm interested, 'cause I was born and raised in Southern Italy and the very first step that led me to no longer believe in a divine being was some criticism of the Catholic Church as an institution.
The American evangelicals went that way a long time ago, back before the civil rights movement. Surely you are not just now noticing it? The evangelicals finally got their dream when they became part of the Republican party back in the 1980s. They have been driving the republicans further from sanity ever since.
Except, what's the likelihood of them agreeing on how to "rule in Jesus's name?" How violent will they be to people in town that don't believe THEIR way. There is no ONE "Christian faith."
I think it’s important to replace the phrase “they believe” with “they claim.” “They claim our schools are bad.” We can’t really know what they believe, and most of the time their behaviors don’t line up with what they claim they believe.
It's not likely the leaders of the movement all "believe" in what they claim, but I know for a fact that the rank-and-file followers do. So sad so many people can be duped so easily. I say I know because I live among so many of them. Faced with the facts, they still want to believe what they believe.
The other problem with "God-Given Rights" is that different people who claim to speak for God can and will have different interpretations of those rights and, historically, violently so.
I agree per the discussion that a lot of these purported evangelical "issues" are cooked up from the top down because the republican politicians know their voters will focus on them instead of the issues that matter -- to the point where they will vote against their own interest. Gun rights, vaccinations, critical race theory, abortion, war on Christmas -- the list keeps getting bigger. Has anyone really concluded that the Rx for our nation is weaker gun laws, abortion being outlawed, abandonment of science/vaccines?
I just find it ironic that they claim these all these violations of their personal freedoms, when they are told how to live , what to do, and that they must love and worship god.
I live in north Idaho about 90 minutes from Moscow. I go there for work occasionally. It seems to be a pretty liberal town, but im not surprised since all of North Idaho is pretty extreme right wing. Ive kicked around the idea of starting an atheist group here...seems like the best time to do that was yesterday, but the next best time is today.
I'd go as far as to say that, even if our nation WERE founded as a Christian nation and it was codified in the Constitution, it would be a toxic formula to follow. Look around the world at countries that have a state-mandated "fundamentalist" religion and see how well that's going for them vis a vis human rights. So even knowing that our nation was founded not to be an exclusively Christian one, I regard it as sort of irrelevant -- it's a bad idea even if it were in the Constitution. Slavery used to be implicitly recognized in the Constitution (three fifths compromise); does that make it an inherently worthwhile idea?
It's not only inhuman, it's anti human. Christianity holds every thing inherent with humanity as corrupt, evil and to be ashamed of. We should grovel for forgiveness for just being born human. According to christianity, this world is a fallen, unjust and miserable place that along with your life, should not be enjoyed but only endured until you die and for the saved live your "real" life. Christianity is fundamentally anti human.
We don’t call it a war. They do. We relax and laugh. They position troops and arm them. Our denial of their war hands them their victory. I’m sure Sun Tzu said it much better.
@LuthAMF As a basic lesson in responding, it’s generally best to clearly address points, rather than simply write and rewrite editorial on the poster’s intelligence. For example, do you think I’m stupid because you think I’m in favor of heavily armed religious extremists conducting an ideological genocide, or do you think I’m stupid for not being out there mowing innocent people down with them? Or do you just think I’m stupid because you think I’m being hyperbolic, reactionary, or paranoid? No matter how you edit it, “stupid” is a terribly useless replacement for conversation.
@LuthAMF My OP was about anyone being dismissive towards any aggression. Even in my response I spoke in generalities while asking you to clarify. And you have clarified, by stating both that I’m antichristian, and that my opinions are therefore invalid. Did you have a clearer point?
If I thought tbat giving up on legal abortion would have been. enough, I would say," Give these nuts their way." It's not worth losing the entire country over.. But this is about OPPRESSING others. Damn, I am scared.
The latest story about George Washington at Valley Forge revolves around him having received visions from an angel regarding the future of the United States, as told in a newspaper article that ran in the 1880's.
Here's the problem with freedom.. Everybody wants to be free but few want to suffer the consequences of freedom. Basically everyone wants to be free and dictate, to everyone else, what freedom is.
The one moral action a Christian can do and a secularist cannot do is "love God." Well, that's what they said. It's the only attempt I've heard in answering the question. And it's BS.
The word "Oklahoma" means "red people" in the Choctaw language. They were thinking of the Native Americans who lived here(I was born and raised in OKC) or were moved here when their lands were stolen from them when they named this place. This became the only place for almost all of the Native "red people" in America for a short time before their land was stolen from them again by White Progress. It has now become the home of a different kind of red people and these red people threaten not only the Native Americans whose land they stole, but all of us who believe in REAL freedom. Christian Nationalism is NOT freedom, but it's nearly impossible to get anyone around me to see that. The only words they hear are "Christian" and "Nation" and that's all it takes. I am lucky in that I have found a small group of people who don't believe this way and are happy, though very frightened, to stand up for their rights and the rights we all should be allowed to share. That is a dangerous thing to do because, along with Jesus, the folks around here worship *u*s and *u* culture (algorithm 😒), and many of those deeply red people are not smart enough to keep their *ullets to themselves. We have to all work together to keep our freedom to be who we are. Be brave and stand up! Be ready to duck, but not to run. This is a threat we need to work against together, though it's essential we try to not make it a "fight".
Libertarianism is not "far right", and not all atheists embrace far left politics. I oppose Christian nationalists too, but as an atheist I don't automatically embrace left-wing ideology.
My wife is heavily involved with the local Democratic and Working family parties so she is privy to a certain amount of inside information. Turns out someone spent 4.3 million dollars to influence our local schoolboard elections. There just was no way for hers or anyone else's meager fund-raising attempts.
The title of this video is insane. It’s clearly the other way around. Democrat politicians were successful in using the pandemic to legally close churches for as long as possible, many months, and now that churches have reopened attendance is way down on average.
@Eastern fence Lizard A reasonable person would not lie like you did in your comment that only essential businesses like food were allowed to operate while churches were ordered closed. Liquor stores, bike shops, acupuncturists, bars, strip clubs and many other businesses were allowed to operate while churches were ordered closed by Democrat politicians. And these same leftists and Democrat politicians who supported churches to be closed indefinitely throughout 2020 actively participated in and supported and encouraged hundreds of thousands of people packing together for racial protests in which police were attacked and thousands of buildings and businesses were looted and utterly destroyed. Where was the concern about large groups of people spreading Covid when that was going on? I never heard a single word of concern or criticism about BLM protests spreading COVID from leftists like you. It took a decision by the U.S. Supreme Court to declare illegal Gavin Newsom’s ban on indoor worship services in California in 2021. So you can continue to lie about your support for the necessity of churches remaining closed, but common sense and the U.S. Supreme Court says otherwise. You are a liar and a hypocrite.
@@archapmangcmg using your idiotic logic, why shouldn’t churches still be closed now? The Delta variant is more contagious than ever, new more contagious variants like Omicron are spreading, vaccines do not prevent transmission, there are plenty of unvaccinated people still out there, and more people are being infected and dying from Covid in 2021 than when churches were ordered closed? Are you for a lockdown right now which would close churches, schools, and all “non-essential” businesses, travel and public activities? Do you personally stay home and avoid all non-household contacts? Do you place zero value on first-amendment liberties?
@@iakona23 News Flash: Not all leftists share the same ideology. Most BLM protestors wear masks during their protest. And, I would oppose of them not practicing physical distancing. Are you happy now? Church attendance is down is because ... oh I don't know .... many of them died from the disinformation that your party is spreading .... or because the living ones grew a brain and stop buying into your religious bs.
@UCdUliZKArhDkoSOw9tt1Ceg You would like those who oppose your fanatical fake religion of leftism to all die, no doubt about it. That is why I get back to my point that the title of this video is so ridiculous and is the reverse of what is really happening!
Former lay minister and evangelical outreach director here.
The church has gone from preaching and living the gospel, loving their neighbor as themselves, humility, turn the other cheek and charity to this.
Politically motivated, arrogant, angry, paranoid/persecution complex, bullies painting the name of Jesus onto their nationalist crusade.
It's also their constant vilification and scapegoating, in addition to their persecution complex.
Mainely, may I ask you, whether you're still a believer or have you already become an atheist? I'm interested, 'cause I was born and raised in Southern Italy and the very first step that led me to no longer believe in a divine being was some criticism of the Catholic Church as an institution.
Back in the day My church preached both of these messages in equal measure.
The American evangelicals went that way a long time ago, back before the civil rights movement. Surely you are not just now noticing it?
The evangelicals finally got their dream when they became part of the Republican party back in the 1980s. They have been driving the republicans further from sanity ever since.
Except, what's the likelihood of them agreeing on how to "rule in Jesus's name?" How violent will they be to people in town that don't believe THEIR way. There is no ONE "Christian faith."
“we feel oppressed when we can’t oppress everyone else.”
-american evangelical.
Love Andrew Seidel's hard work!
Kathrine Stewart also has been doing great work with articles and books...
@@Raydensheraj true! I've just never heard of her before. But now I have!
Yes, indeed. I read both of their wonderful books.
I think it’s important to replace the phrase “they believe” with “they claim.”
“They claim our schools are bad.”
We can’t really know what they believe, and most of the time their behaviors don’t line up with what they claim they believe.
It's not likely the leaders of the movement all "believe" in what they claim, but I know for a fact that the rank-and-file followers do. So sad so many people can be duped so easily.
I say I know because I live among so many of them. Faced with the facts, they still want to believe what they believe.
Great post.
Ugh, This is near me and in a college town. These people are scary crazy.
The other problem with "God-Given Rights" is that different people who claim to speak for God can and will have different interpretations of those rights and, historically, violently so.
Christian Capitalism makes liberty a commodity.
I love you Seth, Katherine, and Andrew!
I could listen to Andrew Seidel and Seth all day!
This is serious folks. Very serious.
You got it right. This is sooo dangerous. I don't want to wake up one day to find out I have to go to a camp for rehab for not believing.
Having both Seidel and Stewart....fantastic.
Fantastic is right !
I agree per the discussion that a lot of these purported evangelical "issues" are cooked up from the top down because the republican politicians know their voters will focus on them instead of the issues that matter -- to the point where they will vote against their own interest. Gun rights, vaccinations, critical race theory, abortion, war on Christmas -- the list keeps getting bigger. Has anyone really concluded that the Rx for our nation is weaker gun laws, abortion being outlawed, abandonment of science/vaccines?
I just find it ironic that they claim these all these violations of their personal freedoms, when they are told how to live , what to do, and that they must love and worship god.
Notice that the NC Lt Gov. called the people on the other side of the aisle "the enemy."
I don't want to wake up one day and have to go to a rehab camp because I don't believe in their dogma.
I live in north Idaho about 90 minutes from Moscow. I go there for work occasionally. It seems to be a pretty liberal town, but im not surprised since all of North Idaho is pretty extreme right wing. Ive kicked around the idea of starting an atheist group here...seems like the best time to do that was yesterday, but the next best time is today.
I'd go as far as to say that, even if our nation WERE founded as a Christian nation and it was codified in the Constitution, it would be a toxic formula to follow. Look around the world at countries that have a state-mandated "fundamentalist" religion and see how well that's going for them vis a vis human rights. So even knowing that our nation was founded not to be an exclusively Christian one, I regard it as sort of irrelevant -- it's a bad idea even if it were in the Constitution. Slavery used to be implicitly recognized in the Constitution (three fifths compromise); does that make it an inherently worthwhile idea?
It's not about faith. It's,about ruling over other people, power and claiming a "god-given" advantage (favor.)
Christianity is not only unAmerican it's inhuman
It's not only inhuman, it's anti human. Christianity holds every thing inherent with humanity as corrupt, evil and to be ashamed of. We should grovel for forgiveness for just being born human. According to christianity, this world is a fallen, unjust and miserable place that along with your life, should not be enjoyed but only endured until you die and for the saved live your "real" life. Christianity is fundamentally anti human.
We don’t call it a war. They do.
We relax and laugh. They position troops and arm them.
Our denial of their war hands them their victory.
I’m sure Sun Tzu said it much better.
@LuthAMF As a basic lesson in responding, it’s generally best to clearly address points, rather than simply write and rewrite editorial on the poster’s intelligence.
For example, do you think I’m stupid because you think I’m in favor of heavily armed religious extremists conducting an ideological genocide, or do you think I’m stupid for not being out there mowing innocent people down with them? Or do you just think I’m stupid because you think I’m being hyperbolic, reactionary, or paranoid?
No matter how you edit it, “stupid” is a terribly useless replacement for conversation.
@LuthAMF My OP was about anyone being dismissive towards any aggression. Even in my response I spoke in generalities while asking you to clarify. And you have clarified, by stating both that I’m antichristian, and that my opinions are therefore invalid.
Did you have a clearer point?
If I thought tbat giving up on legal abortion would have been. enough, I would say," Give these nuts their way." It's not worth losing the entire country over.. But this is about OPPRESSING others. Damn, I am scared.
Sorry, but I can't successfully run for office. I live in the Deep South, and I'm an atheist who's on record calling college football "hot garbage".
Heard that. I used to live in Alabama. Talk about football crazy.
The latest story about George Washington at Valley Forge revolves around him having received visions from an angel regarding the future of the United States, as told in a newspaper article that ran in the 1880's.
Yep...more of the same from those raised on fable, fantasy and fairy tales rather than FACT.
Here's the problem with freedom..
Everybody wants to be free but few want to suffer the consequences of freedom.
Basically everyone wants to be free and dictate, to everyone else, what freedom is.
Amazing how few people realise that freedom to act is not freedom from consequences
The one moral action a Christian can do and a secularist cannot do is "love God." Well, that's what they said. It's the only attempt I've heard in answering the question. And it's BS.
The word "Oklahoma" means "red people" in the Choctaw language. They were thinking of the Native Americans who lived here(I was born and raised in OKC) or were moved here when their lands were stolen from them when they named this place. This became the only place for almost all of the Native "red people" in America for a short time before their land was stolen from them again by White Progress. It has now become the home of a different kind of red people and these red people threaten not only the Native Americans whose land they stole, but all of us who believe in REAL freedom.
Christian Nationalism is NOT freedom, but it's nearly impossible to get anyone around me to see that. The only words they hear are "Christian" and "Nation" and that's all it takes.
I am lucky in that I have found a small group of people who don't believe this way and are happy, though very frightened, to stand up for their rights and the rights we all should be allowed to share. That is a dangerous thing to do because, along with Jesus, the folks around here worship *u*s and *u* culture (algorithm 😒), and many of those deeply red people are not smart enough to keep their *ullets to themselves.
We have to all work together to keep our freedom to be who we are. Be brave and stand up! Be ready to duck, but not to run. This is a threat we need to work against together, though it's essential we try to not make it a "fight".
Enough of this nonsense. This country was not founded as a theocracy. WTF is wrong with these people. Have they gone mad,or just power hungry?
I assume the answer to that is, Yes
Libertarianism is not "far right", and not all atheists embrace far left politics. I oppose Christian nationalists too, but as an atheist I don't automatically embrace left-wing ideology.
Tends to be where most people who I see identify as libertarian fall. Nanny state still bad, but I'm not superstitious.
Anybody have a link to part 1?
It's on You Tube, The Thinking Atheist.
ua-cam.com/video/_-G0MwCV1RQ/v-deo.html @One Punch
@@teaburg
Thank you.
My wife is heavily involved with the local Democratic and Working family parties so she is privy to a certain amount of inside information. Turns out someone spent 4.3 million dollars to influence our local schoolboard elections. There just was no way for hers or anyone else's meager fund-raising attempts.
Can’t wait for jurassic world dominion
America is going in the direction of being two faction, war is unavoidable.
They want a theocracy. Get everyone you know to VOTE them out!
If a bloody war would happen, I'm placing partial blame on fox and the alt right. Disinformation played a role for instigating the war.
Well, I know what side I am on, and I'm willing to fight dirty. Preparing as well as I can.
I grew up on Carman as a kid.
Ever watch the music video we need God in America AGAIN? You should talk about that Seth Andrews.
Goebbels would be sooooooo proud.
and now these people want hate pastor greg locke to run for president
Bring on the Taliban, you mean?
/
The title of this video is insane. It’s clearly the other way around. Democrat politicians were successful in using the pandemic to legally close churches for as long as possible, many months, and now that churches have reopened attendance is way down on average.
I'm sorry to see that you're missing the entire point of closing the churches during a pandemic of a highly contagious disease!
@Eastern fence Lizard A reasonable person would not lie like you did in your comment that only essential businesses like food were allowed to operate while churches were ordered closed. Liquor stores, bike shops, acupuncturists, bars, strip clubs and many other businesses were allowed to operate while churches were ordered closed by Democrat politicians. And these same leftists and Democrat politicians who supported churches to be closed indefinitely throughout 2020 actively participated in and supported and encouraged hundreds of thousands of people packing together for racial protests in which police were attacked and thousands of buildings and businesses were looted and utterly destroyed. Where was the concern about large groups of people spreading Covid when that was going on? I never heard a single word of concern or criticism about BLM protests spreading COVID from leftists like you.
It took a decision by the U.S. Supreme Court to declare illegal Gavin Newsom’s ban on indoor worship services in California in 2021. So you can continue to lie about your support for the necessity of churches remaining closed, but common sense and the U.S. Supreme Court says otherwise. You are a liar and a hypocrite.
@@archapmangcmg using your idiotic logic, why shouldn’t churches still be closed now? The Delta variant is more contagious than ever, new more contagious variants like Omicron are spreading, vaccines do not prevent transmission, there are plenty of unvaccinated people still out there, and more people are being infected and dying from Covid in 2021 than when churches were ordered closed? Are you for a lockdown right now which would close churches, schools, and all “non-essential” businesses, travel and public activities? Do you personally stay home and avoid all non-household contacts? Do you place zero value on first-amendment liberties?
@@iakona23 News Flash: Not all leftists share the same ideology. Most BLM protestors wear masks during their protest. And, I would oppose of them not practicing physical distancing. Are you happy now?
Church attendance is down is because ... oh I don't know .... many of them died from the disinformation that your party is spreading .... or because the living ones grew a brain and stop buying into your religious bs.
@UCdUliZKArhDkoSOw9tt1Ceg You would like those who oppose your fanatical fake religion of leftism to all die, no doubt about it. That is why I get back to my point that the title of this video is so ridiculous and is the reverse of what is really happening!