We reported this issue to EVGA over 2 years ago as it was frying end user hard drives. As far as we can tell its limited to GQ models. We just got into the habit of testing GQs every time we plug them in with a PSU tester from Thermaltake
So youre telling me with a straight face that the Company that Quit Nvidia because of terrible conditions and communications, is now Bricking computers because of terrible Conditions and communications? We live in a Society i guess.
@@SplarkszterEVGA can be both a good brand and make mistakes. EVGA is a brand that has their PSUs built by other OEMs, rather than Seasonic that makes their own. That's one reason a mistake like this happened, but it doesn't excuse them of course.
@@nicholasvinen While I don't know why the 24 pin is always a 10 + 14 pin on the PSU end instead of a straight through cable, the others aren't necessarily the same because they support multiple types of cables. For example the 8 pin 12V can be an EPS power cable or a PCIe power cable (why PCIe didn't just use the EPS connector is another question and why PCIe decided to be polarity reversed from EPS on top of that). On the multi-voltage side you typically have a 6 pin which terminates to either SATA or the old Molex/Berg connectors on the other end. So using the same pinouts on both ends would reduce flexibility, but they definitely should have standardized.
At the very least, I would have expected that the PSU end of the cables for different pin outs to be keyed differently, in order to physically prevent the use of wrong cables.
@@RBrown-uk4xt If all the companies could coordinate on which off the shelf connectors they're buying for their pinouts to make sure there's no overlap then they could have just as easily (probably more easily) picked a single pinout.
This brings back memories. Years ago I worked at a radio shack. We sold our own branded batteries and we were under a ton of pressure to sell those batteries, along with warranties. I sold a super expensive camera, our best warranty (80 dollars in early 2000s) and three packs of our batteries. Well long story short. Our batteries melted in his camera. Corporate tried to tell me our warranty does not cover battery malfunction. They expected me to tell the customer with a straight face he was out of luck on his 900 dollar purchase yesterday. Needless to say I replaced the camera, gave him real batteries, and refunded the useless warranty.
That makes no sense. If you replaced the camera, then he still had the same need for warranty coverage, and this is a case where the gamble of paying extra for a warranty has paid off, so it would be prudent to keep the warranty rather than refund it. Also, corporate cannot tell you that the warranty does not cover battery malfunction. Either it does, or it doesn't, based on the FINE PRINT. There is no contacting corporate issue, either you are obligated to fulfill the warranty or not. Now the ugly truth: If the batteries were not already leaking and this camera caused them to "melt" (which is nonsense, you must mean they vented?), odds are that the camera had a defective design which did not cause it to shut off in an undervoltage condition, which reverse charged one or more of the cells. This means that if you really want to do the customer right, you do not replace the camera, rather you issue a refund because a defective design is not fixed by another new, replacement camera of the same model, with the same design.
@@stinkycheese804 He means that his store ate the costs rather than corporate which issued the extended warranty. Most smaller businesses still do that. It's part of how they survive against the big guys. Building up loyalty with customers.
@@BikeHelmetMk2 Apple didn’t like when I repaired customer devices under warranty instead of telling them lies. Those customers left great reviews on google and told their friends that we care. Customer wants to buy a new computer. Me: is the old one broken? Customer: yes. Me: I can fix it cheaper than the official price because we buy harddisks from the manufacturer and not from Apple. You even have more storage than before. Our service department usually worked for customers, not big tech companies
@@stinkycheese804 warranties are based on the law, not whatever some illegal contract terms dictate. The extended warranty became useless when the product failed prior to the extended coverage, it's not likely the customer elected to continue using a device that failed so spectacularly.
This is negligence, not malfunction. The customer had basically no way to find out about the issue before they killed their drives. This is a very clear cut case, and EVGA should cover it. They _didn't even send new cables_ with the new PSU.
@@EvenTheDogAgreesYour feelings about malice don't magically make an intentionally falsified model simple negligence. EVGA went out of their way to illegally label two devices with the same model number, something which they had advance notice can and will lead to consumers being harmed. If they accidentally put the wrong cable in the box that would have been negligence, but this was done with intent to harm and with reckless disregard as a matter of course.
@@EvenTheDogAgreesIf you disagree with the bootlickers you're either a bot or overly emotional. Perhaps this makes me an overemotional bot. I'll be collecting my robo-oscar now. Malice malice malice
While I agree with you on liability in general, I still think EVGA should cover cost of the drives in this case, specifically because they instructed the user to retain their old cables and use them with the new PSU. Their instructions directly led to the destruction of those drives and there's no other way it could've gone. In this case, EVGA's directions would ALWAYS lead to dead SATA devices due to the pin-out change. The only way this changes if EVGA informed the user of the the change and supplied them with new cables. EVGA were the only party in this transaction that possessed all the facts needed to avoid this outcome and yet they didn't. This makes them (as a business) culpable, regardless of if it's due to poor support team knowledge, bad knowledge-base systems, organization or plain incompetence. Every decision made by EVGA, primarily the omission of the pin-out changes (in which ONLY EVGA possess every relevant fact in each RMA case), led to this result, and more importantly, will lead to it again if their process doesn't change. There's nothing the user could reasonably do to avoid this.
Couldn't agree more. What's worse, is that EVGA apparently has known about this issue for at least 2 years at this point, meaning it has decided not to take any action to prevent this from happening in the future. I can't think of a way to obliterate user trust more effectively. I'll be avoiding any new EVGA products from now on. I think this should be an easy win in a small claims court as well, if with the help of the community, we can prove that EVGA was aware of the issue. What do they have left to stand on at that point?
@@HazewinDogI doubt you even need to prove that changes in the PSU pinout were made with their awareness. It's not something that just happens overnight.
I agree, and they have a limited number of warr cases already processed where pinout is different AND where only 2-4 weeks has passed since the PSU was returned (people would have made a claim already)
This is the kind of thing I heavily endourse lawyers and lawsuits get involved. This can lead to more issues, and possibly risk of injury, considering I've seen what 12v can do when hitting the wrong thing. I've had an RGB controller blow up in my hand and burn me due to a short on a 12v rail, that sent me to ER. This is something that can quite possibly cause issues with explosion, or even fire. While a lot of lawsuits seem stupid and frivelous, this is the type of issue that can definitely result in injury, and this guy really needs to seek a lawyer. First off, 22TB of drives isn't cheap. I currently sport around 18TB across two raid sets (mix of 1 and 4tB raid) and last I checked, even decommisions SAS 16-bay cabinets aren't cheap used, plus the drives, plus there's more than just 22TB of drives involved if the guy runs RAID-5/6/50/60, etc.. So he really needs to lawyer up. If this goes viral, it's also possible, with eVGA's attitude, they would sue him for defemation. Remember: a good defense is a good offense. This case/scenario applies.
Jesus... if you RMA a PSU you give them the part number, so they instantly have the manufacturing date and everything is logged, the support people should instantly have a red glowing exclamation mark on screen in their Ticket System when this PSU serial number is entered. It should not have been changed this way to begin with, extremely negligible but for whatever reason they did it anyway, so at the very least they have to be aware to swap the cables along with the PSU in this specific case. It is weird that they don't want to test and change cables as necessary to begin with... defective cables are a thing.
When I first started building PCs again 5 years ago, it boggled my mind why the power supply pin-outs weren't all standardized across all manufacturers.
PATENTS. first guy makes a new innovative thing, slaps a patent on it, 2nd guy wants to do the same thing, modifies it enough to not infringe the patent, patents his changed version. 3rd guy.... you see where this is going. 10 manufacturers later you got 10 variants of the thing. Patents last how long? 20 years or so? ...yeah the one standard to rule them all will at least have to wait this long. ...not to mention they all want you to buy THEIR cables, because they sell replacement and extra cables separate.
There is a valid reason for not doing this, if you think about it: trying to reuse a 300W supply's cables with a 1000W supply is just _asking for a fire._
This is still something that can be covered through standardization. Heck could even write the standard to be 4 pins or less than x watts, 8 pins or less than y watts, etc. and have the the pinouts backwards compatible where a 4 pin can be plugged into an 8 pin. As long as it all uses the right gauge of wire it should work perfectly
EVGA is kind of sad when you know what is happening with them. The founder refuses to sell the company so instead they are winding down their operations. Currently they already cut their motherboard and GPU divisions that made them famous. They honestly had some of the best RMA service in the market. Sad to see things are changing.
@@squoosh8285 They got tired of dealing with NVIDIA and the founder is old and doesn't want the company to be controlled by the wrong people. They are slowly winding down their divisions until what I assume is eventually the end of the company.
i would go one step further and say the connectors shouldn't fudging fit into each other. if you swap pins around, why on earth keep the exact same connector on the psu end?? like they had to have cables made especially to fit their new pin layout, so why not make a different connector, that would prevent anyone plugging these ass-backwards cables into previous versions of the psu and vice versa?? what is wrong with their brains :
Yep that's the most elegant solution - in a similar sense as the "warranty void if broken/peeled" stickers. Just block off the connectors with a big sticker explaining exactly what type of cables to use, and what each pin-out does, and a warranty void guide if instructions aren't followed. At that point it's evidently gonna be an end user issue if something arises.
A family member worked in a computer shop in the UK in the 90s. They had a lot of returns that the manufacturers refused to replace because the product "passed our testing". Their solution: The "cat-o'-nine-tails". An ethernet cable, a USB cable, various other cables, all wired into a UK mains plug. Plug in the device, switch on the outlet, BANG, product DOA.
Dang, I'd be livid! EVGA would be getting a brick through their front window.. Depending on the cost of the drives and data recovery, I'd be taking this to court.
!!! YOUR DATA IS STILL ON THE DISKS !!! you just had to remove or replace the TVS diodes and/or fuses right near the power connector on the drive pcbs. very easy and cheap fix. if you remove them though, you wont have protection if this happens again.
i feel like if we look back a few decades to earlier advancements in pc technology, like USB that started of as simple serial RS232 communication, companies were keen to standardise things, and not be entirely cutthroat about everything. working with each other to some degree, just for the sake of progress was actually an option once upon a time.. no longer :
@@nemesis91101 its what happens when you outsource your manufacturing to 3rd party companies, and don't do the necessary QA and end user failsafe checks before shipping it out the door as your own branded product. If EVGA made their own PSU's, then I'd blame the engineering team. But since it's not their own product, I blame their exec management for not ensuring a crucial aspect like this isn't triple checked before it ships to customers.
this ^^ for example, I'll list my current setup. Currently, my PC is a mix of Intel, MSI, EVGA, WD, Seagate, Crucial, Corsair, Thermaltake, Cooler Master, ASRock, Samsung, AOC, and Dell OEM parts. My PC will not stay like this. In fact I've swapped between Intel/AMD quite a few times. When parts fail or need upgraded, I don't care what the current brand is. I'll look for replacement parts that are from reputable suppliers. Will require tons of research, but note this - loyalty to a certain brand is a SUPER limiting factor. Don't get into that habit. For all we know, my next PC will have none of those aforementioned brands in it. Only time and luck/opportunity will tell.
EVGA s stuff ways always way ogerpriced just like all Anus ROG shit is, but yeah, brand loyalty is destroying pcs on all fronts...intel fanboys, nvidia fanboy buying overpriced crap....fanboism is destroying everything.
So, when you RMA they tell you “Don’t send the cables, we will not return them”. At the same time, the unit they send back is the exact same model, doesn’t come with cables, but it actually may have different pinouts. At no point are you warned to check the pinouts and maybe not to re-use the cables they explicitly told you to keep. Yeah, EVGA definitely bears some responsibility here. I get the bankruptcy argument, it would be sad if one mistake sinks an otherwise good company, but I still think they need to make more of an effort than what we are currently seeing. In the short term, plaster RMA’s with warnings of this, and train customer service on how to bring it up. In the long term, change the supply chain in order to make sure at least all units of the same model will have identical pinouts. Also, maybe provide a compensation fund for customers who have been affected. They may not be able to make everyone whole without bankrupting the company, but they could at least provide some money.
Would have been already a major improvement to have a specific policy for RMAs related to models that had pinout change... Model A changed pinout, this thing gets its cables returned and comes back with cables, add BIG warning not to do any cable switching in user manual and you're good...
If they changed the pinout, they should have changed the connector as well so you could not plug the wrong cable in. They should also have changed the model number, but that is not sufficient.
It's astonishing to see such a monumental blunder from EVGA, a former bastion of quality engineering. I thought the company was being gradually shut down and if that's true, they let the last competent person go prematurely.
EVGA has had plenty of engineering screw-ups over the years, such as their exploding Pascal FTW cards and RTX 3090s that started dying due to poor soldering. A lot of their coolers over the years have been very poor too. They've never produced particularly high quality products compared to other companies. It was their superior customer service that gained them their amazing reputation.
Corsair has this same problem. I got a PSU with the wrong cables twice from them. Luckily they replaced it but it's an issue with modular cables having no standardization
@@HeWhoIsWhoHeIsStick with someone who makes their own PSU, there's a lesser chance of this sort of blunder occurring. Neither Corsair nor EVGA make their own PSUs, but Seasonic and Enermax do. Of course, you should ideally check some online opinions since everyone makes blunders, but at least in this aspect you're unlikely to find a change in OEMs.
maybe even deliberate, but yes, incredible incompetence. people are focusing on the messaging around it, but they're wrong, the problem is the design FIRST and foremost.
Connectors ARE keyed, but purpose of key is so it couldn't be inserted in wrong position. But if you just switch 2 wires between each other, then this keyed connector won't help you. Moreover, these keys are literally just normal PCI 8-pin connector pinout for most PSU's iirc. Just because it is extremely mass produced connector. But EVGA should take accountability for this one for sure. They should've provided information and wires with PSU.
@@DimkaTsv Connectors can be keyed to make otherwise identical connectors incompatible. Good example is 8-pin Molex connectors are keyed differently on CPU vs GPU power cables because the 12v and ground wires are completely different between the two.
@@bn880 Their biggest mistake was not putting a new revision number on the model with a new pinout and a giant warning in every box to not mix cables between revisions. That would have avoided this entire mess.
The thing that makes EVGA 100% Liable for this damage is that their specific instruction caused the damage. Do not tell users to keep their cables to use with the RMA'ed Power Supply and not supply new cables, when they know that the new Powersupply isn't compatible with the device. Can users exploit this? Yes. The way they would have to exploit this is by RMA-ing a EVGA Power Supply, being sent one that uses different rails, and then frying their drives. These are all things EVGA Tracks. They KNOW that the user sent in a PSU with connector A and they RMA-ed it with a PSU with Connector B. The way they can trivially stop users from exploiting them to run them out of business is by asking the user to send back the wires, and sending new goddamn wires, or by not changing the connectors on the same model of PSU. If EVGA did something like this to someone who had tons of disposable money, and it fried a significant amount of hardware, they would 100% get taken to court, and they would 100% lose the case. There was no user error. The issue here is that the User, if they had performed no error, would have ended up with fried hardware as the result, because the result of frying the drives is what happens if the user follows the instructions correctly. This person could sue EVGA for the cost of the drives (and likely addition cost for lost work/wage caused by the issue), the TOS/EULA/Warranty Bullshit they spew out is not actually valid in a court of law, and legally they are liable for the instructions to the consumer. The reason they don't get sued is because no one in their right mind is going to spend the next 3 years and $10mil to sue EVGA for $2000-$3000 worth of computer hardware. That's why they can get away with this bullshit.
"Can users exploit this? Yes." NO stop following what youtubers say. For anyone to exploit this they would need to 1* damage their psu in a way that evga won't void their warranty, possible 2* get "lucky" to get sent a psu of the same model with different pinouts 3* get no warning from evga where at some point they can totaly sent an email and tell the customer to destroy the cables, sent them a brand new unit (wires included) with huge red warning labels to not use the old wires. Lastly they can standardise their own pinouts AND make different psu-side plugs for different ones. Problem solved. It isn't even complicated. Just excuses to avoid the cost of the drives and childish behaviour (doubling down instead of taking 2 steps which cost almost nothing to fix a problem and avoid a class action lawsuit).
Sorry but this is 100% user error. Different power supplies using different modular pinouts has been a thing for 20 years now. If a person caused damage by not knowing what they were doing when trying to build a computer that's sad but it's also their fault. EVGA, Corsair, Gigabyte, etc don't make power supplies they just put their name on PSUs built by a variety of companies, this is common knowledge.
@@llynellyndid you not listen to the video? EVGA tells the customers that if theyir power supply has an issue that they need to send in, do not send the courts with the power supply as they will not supply new cables. They send you what's supposed to be the exact same model pack, but if you use the same cables you got with your original Power supply, you run the risk of sending the wrong voltage to the wrong pins because they changed the input on the exact same model
This is 100% on evga, and only evga. How can they or anyone possibly expect anyone to not know the cables they already had for the unit evga sent back wouldn't work. The manufacturer didn't know to the point they didn't send new cables. This is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard, and evga needs to be held responsible, somehow, for ALL of the lost data and time. It looks like evga, all lowercase on purpose, isnt the Saint of a company everyone talked about after all. As far as the bankruptcy thing... I understand that. But... maybe that should be reason enough NOT to switch the pin outs between the same model? It all comes back to their incompetence. 100%
Sorry but this is 100% user error. Different power supplies using different modular pinouts has been a thing for 20 years now. If a person caused damage by not knowing what they were doing when trying to build a computer that's sad but it's also their fault. EVGA, Corsair, Gigabyte, etc don't make power supplies they just put their name on PSUs built by a variety of companies, this is common knowledge.
@@llynellyn as Louis said, it was the exact same model, same everything. Are you seriously suggesting that the customer should manually test the voltage when they have cables for the exact model? This is absurd and no one is going to do this. If your post was a comment on the video instead of a reply, you'd easily receive the pin of shame!
@@DurzoBlunts Damn, I've got 2 pyrex measuring jugs.. fortunately I only use steel (enamel coated) bakeware or ceramics in the oven. Might stick to that habit :P
They do still actually make borosilicate glass cookware, I bought a few pieces while living in Europe. The edge has a distinct blue tint vs green or clear on ordinary glass.
Your trap door analogy was spot on. Talk about a trap for young players. This is a fail on so many levels. First, by using the same plug with a different pinout. Second, by no warnings. This seems like the exact place where those warning labels plastered right over the power ports were made for. I think it more appropriate the box bore a big red label warning Lark's vomit.
They should have send the correct cables with RMAs of the problematic model. It would not be such a loss. But as stated in the pinned comment - they have sent new unit with wrong cables so it is a clear lack of care
I would take them to the small claims court with all their emails / calls as evidence of their incompetence. If they sent the PSU without the required cabling with no warning to not use the one they told you to keep, it's on them for whatever happens. They could have caused a fire or something doing that.
@@stevegircys Whatever you do DON'T SETTLE OUT OF COURT. This needs to start resulting in actual public legal precedents that seriously hurt companies.
@@stevegircys Do you have a picture of your pc with the old psu (or original receipt)? and picture of the new one? Would I be right in saying you had a GQ1000 V1 with the grey "stone textured" box and the "1000 GQ" on the side written in grey? ....While the newer replacement is the GQ1000 V2 with they "1000 GQ" written in gold? (also did it come in a retail box or plain brown OEM?
@@tomstech4390That's a good question. I don't know if I still have the original box, but I certainly don't have any photos of the original power supply, before sending it in. But I can confirm that the new one has the gold / yellow writing on the actual power supply. It shipped in a plain box, though - no identification on the packaging.
@@tomstech4390For some further clarification, the one that I received back from warranty has the gold text on the sides of the power supply, but grey text on the top (opposite from the fan). There is no version number at all on it though - Just 210-GQ-1000.
That modular power supply cables don't even have a minimum level of consistency and defacto standardisation is insane. The absolute minimum should be for an entire generation's worth of them to be identical per manufacturer, and the cables being physically incompatible (i.e. too small, hook in wrong place, etc), when a break needs to be done for the next generation.
This has been a known issue for years. You can't mix and match cables even from the same company. I wasn't aware that this would happen even within two PSUs with the same name, but I can see it happening as these companies can change internals to save money or even change the provider of the PSUs. That said, EVGA should be aware of the change in the pin outs and at the very least provide warning to anyone sending in a PSU for RMA. Ideally they would provide replacement cables so you wouldn't run into this problem.
The problem in this case was that these are two of the same model that aren't the same. Which the same model number implies that they were the same. Like I have a motherboard that has two different versions of. One version has an m.2 slot that is version 5, the other version the m.2 is version 4. Online, the manufacturer tells you how to verify the m.2 version you have. But both have their own unique, but very similar, model number. I've even seen one board that the difference were, one has an extra m.2 slot where the other has the wifi/blue tooth connector, and they also had different serial numbers. Even though in both cases, that one thing was all the difference.
I have never heard of two psus with the same model having a different pinouts on the modular cables. This is a defect and a fire hazard. Gamers nexus needs to light them up.They should add a version or revision number like normal hardware manufacturers use to tell the difference.
@@someusername121No, you cannot mix and match between different models even with Corsair, there is many different types of the cables with at least partly different pin layouts. Just google "corsair psu cable compatibility" and you will find the charts from their site. But between exactly the same models it should be safe.
I had a Corsair SF750 break about 2y ago, I had to include all cables with the power supply which made sense. Cables are an essential part for the working of the power supply, not just accessories.
Louis, this is why companies carry liability insurance! They need to make these customers whole after seeing a returned PS has the mismatched cable set from a previous warranty return. That is not the ‘floodgate’ since it only involves verifying the warranty returns that the did the mismatched cable in the return! Many companies will still be dicks just so their liability insurance premiums don’t go up. EVGA would lose in court because judgements are based upon what a ‘reasonable person would do’; and a judge could easily understand this case and place themselves in the plaintiff’s shoes…
@@bn880 EXACTLY. Then you fire the short-sighted moron design-engineer (and his attendant PCB designer), that would have ever done such a company/reputation risking dumb move! Also, there would be an engineering-quality person to oversee things like this, that can go out the door with the other two clowns…
Along with the fact that this was easily avoidable they should pay. I seriously doubt they would win in court with the best lawyers even if the customers represented themselves. People can't abuse this (except maybe like requiring a couple more drives) as evga know when they sent psus with wrong pinouts AND with no warnings. As for the insurance, in this case i am almost sure they would try to avoid covering it.
Except that EVGA's OWN ACTIONS caused the data loss. They owe him data recovery services at a reputable company, and replacement storage. AT A MINIMUM.
Want to know what's funny, the First modular powersupplies actually used standardized and universal plugs. They used the exact same pins orientation and even keyed EXACTLY the same as the other end that they were to be plugged into. You could flip them end for end and everything would work. OCZ for example on their first modulars, you could take a daisy chain pci-e 6 pin connector, and even connect the middle pci-e 6 pin and connect it to the power supply and the end intended for the power supply connection would fit into the graphics card, leaving the very end of the cable dangling up around the power supply. This made it easier to keep the system's cable management looking clean. You could do the same with the 4 pin molex cables, this was absolutely a win, specially when you had one or 2 optical drives up directly across from the power supply, so you could just grab say a single cable with lets say 3x 4 pin molex on it, plug the center one into the psu, plug the shorter remaining part of the cable into the optical drive, and then the long end initially intended for the PSU connection, down to a hard drive. Systems built were clean clean clean looking. You could also swap cables from one brand to another effortlessly since they all used the same pin out arrangement, they are afterall, and for good reason, using EXACTLY the same STANDARDIZED connections. I mean for fucks sakes it makes sense they would do this since we already have those connectors and the pins and everything, cheap, readily available, ZERO justification for changing them, impossible to mix up. NO one could stick a 4 pin cpu 12v into a 4 pin molex or a 6 pin pci-e or 8 pin for that matter, you couldn't they weren't keyed to allow it, no one ever fucked anything up. But a few years later that's when all hell broke loose, the regulatory agency responsible for making sure companies were complying with standards basically dropped the ball, allowed them to come up with their own special connectors and everything went to hell. It was a few years after the first modular PSUs arrived that they went the route of "i need to be special and build my own unique proprietary connections", and honestly there is more proprietary shit today that is MODEL specific, not just brand, and as i've now found out which i'm glad to be informed since i actually happen to use a lot of EVGA modular power supplies in my customer's builds, i can't even trust hot swaps or testing by hooking the pre-existing cables up to their own fucking identical model power supplies. This is absolutely justification for some kind of class action lawsuit filed against power supply companies by customers as a whole to take them to court in order for them to force standardization. THIS is the kind of shit that REGULATIONS should be required. These are prime examples of WHY when something innovative is designed and released, that once the grace period has been gone through and the concept gets adopted by other companies, that they should be forced to be brought together, agree on a universal standard so shit like this can't ever happen, and if something does, they can be absolutely dealt with immediately without people left standing around scratching their heads trying to figure out who to blame or what they are responsible for.
Thank you so much for this video. I've been repairing computers since 1998 (as a business since 2002) and I would never have guessed EVGA would do something so foolish. Just a few months ago I had a customer bring me in a desktop with a bad EVGA PSU and I was just going to swap out the PSU and leave the cables, it was a gaming PC and cabling this is very time consuming, I thought I could save some time just replacing the unit. EVGA didn't have the same model in stock, so I figured that I could just get any EVGA PSU as the cables would work across the board, same company, I mean, who would ever guess they wouldn't? Fortunately I decided to just go with a Corsair that was on sale and save my customer some money, but because of your video, I'm guessing I most likely saved him a lot more money than just $20 from it being on sale, who knows, what if they changed the pins for the CPU? Or all of them and we lose the motherboard, PSU, CPU, RAM and all the hard drives... Like you, I will never use EVGA's in my builds/repairs again, my customers mean everything to me, and there PC's mean a lot to them, not worth working with a company that is to inept to standardize their cables within their own products. By the way, I love your videos, I can't tell you how many times I'm watching your vids thinking "I've been bitch'n about that, it's about time someone made it public", thank you for what you do.
Maybe only trust those that manufacture their own PSUs' as they would have better QA compared to some brands that don't make their own. It would save you a lot of headache and wouldn't have to do as much research when making sure components are compatiblle. PS. I don't know much about computers but noticed what other comments said and researched it. Its true. I just wanted to say it to you just in case it might help you in the long run. Though, all brands have their own bad apples, so...
I disagree Louis. If EVGA are smart, they'll stop selling this model immediately. At this point they could cover damaged devices by having customers send in the power supply, the mismatched cables, and the blown hardware in a single box. A few minutes (at most) with a multimeter will confirm the cable mismatch, and you're done, pay the person for their devices and the power supply. This way people can only pull the scam for as many power supplies and mismatched cables they can find, thus limiting their liability to a fair level. This would be the fair thing to do because they could have avoided this in one of two ways. One, don't change the bloody pinout in the first place or two, change the bloody model number on the altered power supply so technicians don't mix them up in RMA. The fact that neither of these happened means they should pay for it. I do agree however that they can't be held liable for data recovery costs, that's on the customer. They should pay for a replacement drive though.
i think they can be held liable for the data recovery and drive replacement costs in this particular case. why would they not have to make you whole after such negligence? apparently the issue is old news, but i think you're right, they should have taken the stock back and addressed the problem. i don't actually know what they've done, if anything about the situation, but they knew about it 2 years ago apparently.
An unforseen power supply component failure causing damage to your drives would get nowhere in court. However, this type of utter incomptence causing unnessessary damage to a costomers equipment would, and a small claims court would likely take the customers side. 40 years in the electronics service ind.
@@stevegircys A word of advice for court: keep your records, document absolutly everything, every communication, times, dates, names, who said what. This action should you decide to proceed may take a while and our memories suck. Good luck.
Back in the day got a DTK power supply back on RMA, plugged into DTK mainboard, and they had pinned the plugs in total reverse. Granted this was early into my repair career and did not notice all the grounds(black wires) were in the wrong spots. I most likely would have expected the manufacturer to send me a binary plug that is keyed that it can only be plugged in one way was setup correctly. Thankfully just the mainboard and memory appeared to be damaged, the shop owner saw the power supply leads were pinned wrong from the factory, and DTK covered the damaged components. Customer was also understanding with the delay and was even happier that we had cloned the drives before doing the power supply replacement. Boss was glad I took the time to clone the drives while we waited for the power supply to ship to us.
1 - People may plan the need to Protect Data, as it holds personal value. 2 - Corporations do NOT get to Deny replacing damage due to their error. I'd Expect new *components when Damaged,* after installing Replacement, per Company's Instructions. Reason, is due to *LACK of Company's Instructions;* NO Notification, FYI, Caution, Warning, YO!, Hey You, STOP!. *"Pursuit of Happiness";* Time to Collect. 🇺🇸
After Trump's new 2018 tariffs on Chinese products, a lot of tech companies changed OEMs, who had factories in China, that included EVGA. Also, EVGA and other power supply designers are known to use different OEMs, who builds the power supply, over time. If I recall correctly, a lot of EVGA old power supplies (P2, T2) were made by Super Flower, but after 2018, EVGA contracted their power supplies to other OEMs like Seasonic, FSP, HEC, and others. Also, around that time, power supplies cut costs due to the tariffs. I bought two Seasonic power supplies before and after the tariffs. My older 650-watt Seasonic platinum had a thicker AC power cord vs. my newer 750-watt Seasonic platinum power supply as well as the internal packaging. In the end, EVGA is done after ending graphics card production, and they are only servicing warranties before they likely close up shop forever.
so like do u think the pin switching was accidental due to the change in manufacturers? that would kinda explain why they didn't key it right to prevent using the wrong cables on the same model..
@@outseeker Might be an accident, but EVGA should have taken the precaution to send some cables with the replacement power supply. Nowadays, customers have to do a lot of homework to make sure they don't blow stuff up by accident. If my power supply blew up with a few years on the warranty and I could afford a new power supply, I would buy another one and not go through the hassle of an RMA power supply blowing up my PC hardware. For this to be the optimal solution, we are living in clown world.
Unfortunately many PSUs are just rebrands of GreatWall, Fortron Source Power, Super Flower, etc., power supplies which is why this happens. However, I agree that if I buy two of the same product and they are the same revision, I would expect that their cables are interchangeable.
Very good point at the end. I work in IT and sometimes need to explain the difference between high availability (HA) and disaster recovery (DR) to people who think they are equivalent concepts. They are in fact very different and address different requirements. RAID is for HA, not DR.
I have not built a PC in several years but the last one I did build had a EVGA PS in it! I had no idea.. A true public service for making this video! Proof a honest New Yorker escaped! Bravo! Had Louis stayed in NY the NY Secret Police would be looking for him for spilling the evil beans. :)
My current power supply is a Super Flower because it's who EVGA used to manufacture one of their previous gen power supplies. Went straight to the source and saved money. The change is probably because they switched manufacturers or a manufacturer discontinued a model and EVGA wanted to keep using them. Just a guess.
First and only time I ever had a supeflower psu. It killed a whole pc. Well... Minus 1 ram stick and a half functioning hdd. Also had a Corsair AX 750i delete itself.
@@justinpatterson5291 Strange. They are very high quality with a good warranty, low failure rates, and solid reviews. Every full teardown and testing of them has shown high end components and high performance. Every brand can have failures though.
EVGA replaced two video cards for me because of an issue that was 100% my fault, at no expense to me. Because of this, I've only used EVGA products for whatever I've needed that they make since then. Disappointing to hear about this issue.
I had a similar experience with them, my old 2070 fan was getting noisy, so I emailed them to enquire on the cost of a replacement, it was well outside warranty. After a few emails back and forth to check model numbers and which fan I needed, they just posted the pair of them to my with no charge.
So you abused their RMA policy because of you're wrong doing? And you wonder why manufacturers/retailers have tighter return/exchange policies because of individuals like you have ruined it for others. Now when the company change their policies they're the problem?
@@disguiseddv8ant486 you dont seem to have very good reading comprehension. They covered an issue that they had no obligation to cover, and I've made them my first choice for the hardware they make since then, because they had a customer-centric approach. When it comes to the current issue, did you even watch the video?
I had the misfortune to buy an EVGA Titanium power supply . It didn't work for 10 years like they promised but rather 3 or 4. RMA is not possible where I live so my only option was to go to a repair shop. They fixed it for a hefty price only for it to break the next day. I brought it back and they said they'll fix it for free ( as law requires). Turned out there was a cascade failure and the AA9013 controller was broken. It took them over a week to create and draw the schematics by hand since there's no info anywhere about this power supply. The saddest part is AA9013 controller is basically unobtainable unless there's another similar power supply to take it from. So my ultra expensive power supply is now broken and there's no chance of repairing it. At least the repair shop gave me my money back.
Which model? Anything can happen, but yeah I dislike EVGA’s use of custom IC’s even on their gpu’s.... they usually are the thing that fails a lot on their models which is crazy because it’s custom made for a reason.... right?????? My real complaint with evga
@@sparklingion My model is EVGA SuperNOVA 1000 T2. I wish I could buy that controller separately but there's no data where to find it. Best bet is to buy a donor second hand PSU that has the same controller. That's costly however still cheaper than new Titanium PSU.
@@demonfedor3748 I would contact evga and superflower directly and see if they can send you or have you buy the IC. SF might not carry it, but EVGA definitely had old stock of it (I know they do).
It is a backup. But not raid 0. Just it isn't as fault tolerant as an external or hot site one would be. Like if just one drive died... It could be restored from the copy on a different drive. But multiple copies on the same drive aren't true backups.
Not based on the definition that pops up when I google it. "Backup refers to the copying of physical or virtual files or databases to a secondary location for preservation in case of equipment failure or catastrophe." Pairity data is not a copy.
I recently had to buy a power supply unit for a workstation I was building so that it would support a high power GPU. The unit I bought had modular plugin cables that are proprietary, so I got to researching all sorts of stuff to make sure I didn't burn up this workstation or the GPU. I must have rung out every cable I installed to ensure it was delivering the right power to the right pins. This was a vendor who took pains to provide information about their cable pinouts. I can't imagine what it would be like to deal with a vendor who just changes these pinouts willy-nilly. EVGA used to be a very reputable company. It seems like they are on a downward slide of late. Thanks for covering this.
High end PSU have very long warranty, some are 10 years so getting a completely new model as a replacement is a normal thing. If they just get you to sent them the old cable and give you new cable that go with the replacement this wouldn't happened. Edit: same model replacement but different pin out? WTH
I almost learned this the hard way. I had to replace my PSU as it was smelling like molten plastic, that for some reason I was the only one able to smell it. I got a new PSU and thought nothing of it to simply swap the PSU but not the cables to save my self the hassle. My paranoid hypervigilance made me think that maybe the cables were not compatible, even though I was probably being paranoid, I still decided to check, then I double checked, then triple checked, and low and behold they were not... and I couldn't believe it... so I was going to swap out a fried PSU and almost ended up frying my entire PC along with the new PSU. Since there is no standardization of the cables, I'm not surprised it would even change with the same model of PSU, but I probably would have just swapped the box if the model was the same. It's an incredibly stupid blindspot, I watched a girl pc build channel upload a video where she fried 3 PSU's not knowing this. If you want to see the video it's from "Andie the Lab" - "Almost Electrocuted Myself - New Battlestation Rig"
Thanks for the video and great info, Louis. I had no idea EVGA was doing this with power supplies. It's absolutely insane. By the way, your comments about not being "brand friendly" gave a good chuckle.
Oh my god, this actually happened to me at work. I work in IT at a company and was building some custom PCs for some heavy workloads. I bought 3 identical model EVGA power supplies from the same vendor on the same day, from the same site. At some point one of the power supplies wasn't functioning well, so given that I had 3 I decided to see if the Cable was just bad so I swapped them to check. The power supply still didn't deliver power to the MB. so then I took the "donor" power supply and tested it with the cables that the non functioning unit was shipped with. the motherboard lights came on, but the board was fried. I got lucky and managed to RMA everything and get everything replaced from EVGA. but it took over 5 weeks to get a new board as this specific one had necessary features that no other vendor offered at the same price point. The positive thing is that at least my boss was chill and we tested the voltage output of the replacement unit along with the other 2. Needless to say, there were differences despite being the exact same model.
Louis, Like you, I had NO IDEA that the pinouts on modular power supplies was non-standard in the industry! Thanks for this moment of education. I will file this away in my brain if I ever need to RMA a power supply to make sure I compare the pin outs! You may have saved a lot of people a really bad time by making this video!!
The difference, in this case, is they sent back a *different* model. Their records show that the customer sent in v1 PSU (which was proven to be faulty) and instead of repairing, they sent back a v2 replacement unit. At the time of sending the *different* replacement unit back to the customer, they are aware (or at least should be aware) of the pin-out difference. So they should cover the drives for the customer, 100%, no questions asked! To avoid being scammed and to avoid liability issues, all they need to do is have a *policy* to notify the customer, which they *failed* to do. If that was the case, and my return unit had a warning, there is no way possible as a customer I can scam them.
I'm surprised that EVGA, which has been one of the more reputable companies within the PC enthusiast community, didn't label a PSU of the same model number with a different designation when making changes as significant as pinouts - it can be something as simply as labelling the model number with a "Mark II" suffix while keeping everything else the same. It's one of those very important things that they don't teach you in school - it's very very important deciding on how you call something. Everyone can come up with a name. Very few can do it well.
That's a damn good video Luis on explaining why warranty is hard for the manufacturers as well. Still wtf EVGA - why no simply put a v2 after the number of the PSU and notify people and that V2 has different pinout...
I'd adapt the policy like this, if you had an old supply and we RMA'ed you a different version of the same model with the pin-incompatibility AND we did not tell you about it before we updated the website (so a cut off date), then we'll cover the hardware that got destroyed (up to the current market value for the same or equivalent product) but not for the data recovery. That would mean it would be less easy for any random person to send in old junk hardware and claim it was their EVGA power supply - it limits it to those that would not have been informed about the change and were basically setup by EVGA to use their old cables while not being told that they'd changed. My 10 cents.
I used to be a long-term EVGA customer. Back in the 1080TI days, my EVGA video card caught fire (there are videos by others of this on UA-cam). It was in warranty, so I returned it and received a replacement. Shortly after installing the replacement card, it exploded. Bits rainded down into the power supply, which failed. The incident also took out my monitor. I basically had an unplanned rebuild of my PC because I didn't trust any of the components after this. Didn't even bother returning the video card again because I would never use it or even sell or give it to someone else. EVGA lost a customer that day. Since then, I have emphatically told anyone who was planning to build a PC to avoid EVGA like the plague.
not fanboying for evga or anything but pics or it didn't happen! lol i wanna see the graphics card shrapnel and stuff!! like which chunks explodified? was it the gpu itself, or surrounding components or what?
In particular, I test the power supply's motherboard connector for voltage stability overnight with checks every few minutes before ever plugging it in to a motherboard. I have been testing all power supply outputs since I was working for a used computer dealer about twelve years ago, when he started. It just makes sense.
This is crazy, that you just put this video out, I had same thing happen to me.. have same psu and extra cables because the server I bought on FB Market, I needed old molex power plugs.. and funny thing is it didnt boot.. it was because the same model had different pin out and it wouldnt boot.. luckly the drive I had plugged didnt die.. wow this is nuts and i totally agree with you on this..
As someone who just recently bought a new PSU and upgraded my storage capacity I am happy this got covered. Thanks again Louis for covering all different types of issues in the industry!
Are they the exact same model though? Labelled exactly the same? That's what they're doing now... Changing the pinout mid-production without notifying anyone, and further instructing uses to keep and use the old cables that they are aware will cause this problem. This little bit should place legal liability on EVGA for instructing the user to take actions which, when so done by following the directions precisely, causes the damage. Due to the damage being caused by following their instructions, I'm fairly certain they are liable here.
Type 3 and Type 4 are compatible with each other. Only the 24 pin is different with more sense wires for higher efficiency. There’s type 5 now but it’s physically smaller connectors that won’t fit.
@@tomstech4390 From what Louis said, firstly the labels are identical, other than the manufacturing date, which no one expects to be a problem when they send in an RMA - it's expected to receive a newer unit than you sent in. There was no "v1 or " v2" anywhere on the label. As far as boxes go, secondly, it was an RMA, so probably shipped to him in a plain brown or white cardboard box. Also... If they didn't change the label in the product, they're even less likely to change the packaging, which would be more costly, and... unless corporations are ordered to do things like that by a judge... they tend not to. It's not financially smart for them.
@@tomstech4390 At least from what Louis read, they didn't even provide the new cables and the tech said they would send it to them after it burned up his drives.
damn clickbait, I see cat I click, and then I have to listen to how my once favorite GPU manufacturer is circling the drain. Also EVGA ODM's PSU's at least used to through SuperFlower. Also RAID is not a backup... Love your content, it's the good stuff.
Since EVGA is so big, the customer should sue. And EVGA now notified must immediately send supplemental instructions with rma power supplies, with very clear instructions on checking power connections. Or immediately change RMA to send in cables and new cables sent if new doesn’t match old BY THEIR OWN DESIGN.
Honestly - connectors for different voltages should be made incompatible with each other. 3v should have one type of connector, 5v should have something totally different, and 12v should have something totally different. If you need to change the pinout, then you also change the type of connector to prevent plugging the wrong voltage into the wrong place. That's the real fix for a problem like this.
I remember manufacturers using colored pinouts back in the day so people could actually find out just by looking at the color, but now it's all black, nad modular. It starts to get really creepy when you have multiple modular power supllies lying around and can't remember which cables go with what PSU...
That's unfortunate, personally I had a power supply replacement from EVGA about 4/5 years ago. They told me not to send the cables with RMA and explicitly told me to switch all the cables when I got my replacement power supply. They did include new cables, so maybe this a more recent policy change?
EVGA's RMA department had this problem in the motherboard side. While "We're sorry but we don't make the GTX 1070 anymore, we'll give you a 3070 instead" sounds good, but "We're sorry but we don't make the Z370 FTW anymore, we'll give you a Z690 instead" doesn't really get you going.
it could be that EVGA doesn't make the power supplies, and just buys them from an OEM. they could've switched oems and never made an announcement about it. not ok, but it makes more sense how something like this could happen
Things like that should never be kept secret. Why do they do this? Because they're afraid of losing face? Pisses me off when companies make no effort at transparency with their customers.
I get that they can't just open the coffers up to everyone, but being stupid and cavalier with other people's hardware SHOULD be painful. Molex connectors can be keyed differently to disallow the interconnection of incompatible products. The fact that they did not do this shows an incredible disregard for their customers.
The issue stems from the fact that it is rarely true that the brand name on the side of the psu is the same brand that built the PSU. There are only a couple OEMs that build computer power supplys and its not un common for multiple oems to be used by the same brand across their product lines.
One thing that pissed me off with EVGA is their motherboards... I bought a z690 motherboard for $499 2 years ago with 12th Gen intel CPU .... They stopped updating the bios like a year ago so highest drop in upgrade i can do is 13th gen because there is no bios for 14th gen.
no that's an intel problem. from 2nd to basically 7th gen they were identical and the only reason you had to change the board was because intel says you can only have maybe 1 generation of upgrade. if you want more than that get AMD
@@bradhaines3142 Its not Intel, 12th -14th is same socket... all it needs a BIOs update to work. But apparently EVGA Bios person left a year ago so I cant use 14th Gen.
You have all of the upgradability that you need. The "14th gen" isn't even a generation, it's a refresh of 13th gen where you're lucky to get a couple of percentage points of difference. Be it between the 14900k and 13900k. Or, 13600k and 14600k. Honestly, with the performance difference across the 12000 and 14000 series, unless you're looking to...I dunno, upgrade a 12400 to a 13700k/13900k, there's nowhere near enough performance that would justify the cost of a new CPU.
I think you are wrong about covering damage to other components because this isn't even under are of things warranty defines. Your PSU dies and spike of voltage kills components - that can be discussed under warranty discussion. Still, even in that case, PSU could have some kind of insurance: "we are not responsible, but with purchase you get insurance policy for damages up to...". But this issue is not caused by PSU malfunction, this is caused by gross negligence and company should be held accountable because of negligence, not because of warranty. Even if my PSU is older and not under warranty, and EVGA sells me replacement cable clearly stating it's compatible with my PSU (in EU companies are obligated to provide spare parts even some period after warranty) without any notice like "only compatible with model produced after, or with serial starting with", that is negligence, not malfunction.
I had a run-in with ASUS similar to this. I RMA'd a motherboard of theirs after it failed under warranty. I sent the board in, I later got a message stating that they would not repair the board and that it would be returned to me. The reason it was denied? "Physical damage to board." I received the board back and it had been repacked in a different box than I sent them, and it had an entire corner of it folded! I contacted customer support, posted to their forums, etc...they wouldn't budge. I decided then and there that I'd never buy another ASUS product again, which is a shame because I had been a long-time customer (mobo, gpu, two monitors, a laptop).
EVGA stopped existing to me after they stopped making graphics cards. There were always other companies with better offerings for other products they sold. In this case, why do I want an EVGA power supply when Corsair and Seasonic exist?
I didn't stop buying their PSUs, until I saw a report of the warranty getting cut-down, which made me lose hope! Sadly, that's why for my newest PSU purchase for another build, I got a Corsair RM850x. But, my daily-driver, has an eVGA Supernova 750 G3 from the late-2010s, IIRC, older than the other PC components! Lasted through multiple Ryzen builds and in 2021, IIRC, I got an eVGA 650 GQ for another build in the same room. The Supernova 750 G3, was first installed on a socket FM2+ system, with an Athlon X4 860K, maybe I had it on another PC before 2019.
Thanks for the news Louis! You're right after all these years there should be a standard set in place, and it's kind of shitty thing on EVGA's behalf to do such a thing, especially not informing the customer, that they did change it, and if they did know they should have put the cables in thee to begin with and wrote a big ass WARNING note to go along with it as soon as you opened up the box.
I recently RMAed a Seasonic PSU, and the only cable they told me to keep was power wall cable. They replaced the with the same exact model name PSU, but the new one obviously used different components and must have different cables, but I never checked.
I would expect EVGA to fix this, we'll see. But they are well known for some of the best warranty service in the business. I've experienced it myself, they covered something that wasn't within the warranty period just to be nice. And yes, NONE of the modern PSUs are standardized in terms of pinouts. I mean, it is standardized on the motherboard end, but not on the PSU end. I had to map the pinout with the cable on my recent setup so I could make a jumper cable to plug into the PSU that turned power on when the switch on the PSU is flipped. Yes, you can use the included jumper on the cable itself but I wanted to eliminate excess cables, and this is a second PSU that just powers my fans and pump. Ironically, it's an EVGA. While their RMA process needs to change, or at least include some QC checks that would trigger a call to the customer if something like this happens, I would also point out that it's a very specific set of circumstances that would result in this. It wasn't that he got back a drastically different model, I would bet they would have included new cables with that. He got back a new revision of the same model, and that screwed him. It's probably a situation they didn't consider on the RMA side because they didn't think the engineering side would do that within a model run.
I've tried to get a hold of him through the email listed on their UA-cam page, but I didn't have any luck. (I'm the original poster of this story, by the way)
@@Gokuevp Yes, they ended up paying me for the replacement cost of the drives and a bit extra for my time and hassle. As well as sending me a new G7 1000W power supply.
Not standardizing the connectors and pinouts on modular power supplies must be one of the biggest PC/ATX failures in recent history. I had something similar happen where a BeQuiet PSU failed, some 15 years ago. They also told us to keep the cables and we received a new unit without cables. Support was proud to say that they sent a much better/upgraded unit as a replacement. Well. The cables didn't even physically fit anymore. Had to go back to the shop and get an off-the-shelve replacement unit, after some discussion...
Louis, I think they should cover it all. It would actually be pretty rare that people are frying their HDD's/SSD's to cheat them, AND they have a limited number of processed warranty cases for that specific model where the pinout changed to date. Also anyone that has NOT complained for 2 or 3 weeks after they got their PSU back can be assumed to not have had damage either. Send notices to future clients. Not sending in cables is a GOOD policy. The pinout change is completely irresponsible.
I am an EVGA user, I recently had some new cables for my PSU and EVGA sent me the cables for free because they had a stockpile and no longer made them. About 2 years ago EVGA standardized all their models to use the same pin-outs which has lead to some of their older models now having 2 different pin-outs between model years. When I asked for new cables for my PSU so that I could plug in some new drives, I had went onto their website and realized there was no cables for my model and they had very clear labelling about not mixing cables on older models. I called their support and the service guy was very careful to make sure I had the right model number so that I wasn't sent wrong cables. EVGA as far as I know is the only brand to standardize pin-outs across all of their PSUs.
SeaSonic might have as well. I know I was able to use cables from a build I had 8 years ago with one I built two years ago. Support confirmed I could, but I pinned out both the older cables I used to be sure.
The bad here is that it's the same model. They really need to make a universal standard for modular power supplies. This is just getting insane at this point.
I usually go with Corsair or EVGA for power supplies and have used wires from multiple PSU's in 1 and can't say that anything has ever fried. Like you, I just assumed that they were all the same wires because they have the same connectors, never even thought this wasn't a thing if they are somewhat close it wattage. Luckily you released this when you did because I'm about to upgrade GPU's in our home therefore having to upgrade PSU's and since we all have multiple drives that almost always require 1 or 2 extra cables to connect them, I would have just used an older SATA cable on the newer PSU's. You're the man Ross!
We reported this issue to EVGA over 2 years ago as it was frying end user hard drives. As far as we can tell its limited to GQ models. We just got into the habit of testing GQs every time we plug them in with a PSU tester from Thermaltake
Geez. I was hoping this was a recent issue, not a 2 year one.
@@Slavolko Yeah, 2yr old makes this corporate indifference. Slam dunk on lawsuits.
WTF
Thank you for the heads up
Interesting insight thanks
two fucking years? holy shit EVGA really has dived downhill
So youre telling me with a straight face that the Company that Quit Nvidia because of terrible conditions and communications, is now Bricking computers because of terrible Conditions and communications? We live in a Society i guess.
We live in a society
Crap and i thought EVGA was a good brand.
Also, some(or all i don't know) EVGA PSU's are made by Superflower.
@@Splarkszter was
@@SplarkszterEVGA can be both a good brand and make mistakes. EVGA is a brand that has their PSUs built by other OEMs, rather than Seasonic that makes their own. That's one reason a mistake like this happened, but it doesn't excuse them of course.
@@Splarkszterit was always either CWT, Superflower, FSP or HEC.
"You deserve what you're willing to tolerate." - Big Tech, Gaming, Food Chain, Entertainment, Education, Music, etc.
That's kind of how reality works. Don't let people treat you like shit.
*Immigration
“You get what you f*cling deserve” -Joker Rossmann
Saving this
@@tactik5903what do you mean?
The plugs for modular power supplies should have been standardized in the entire industry more than a decade ago.
I thought the obvious thing to do would be use the same pinouts at each end!
@@nicholasvinen While I don't know why the 24 pin is always a 10 + 14 pin on the PSU end instead of a straight through cable, the others aren't necessarily the same because they support multiple types of cables. For example the 8 pin 12V can be an EPS power cable or a PCIe power cable (why PCIe didn't just use the EPS connector is another question and why PCIe decided to be polarity reversed from EPS on top of that). On the multi-voltage side you typically have a 6 pin which terminates to either SATA or the old Molex/Berg connectors on the other end. So using the same pinouts on both ends would reduce flexibility, but they definitely should have standardized.
At least with EPS and PCIE you have a good shot at just tripping OCP, swapping 12v and 5v is a death sentence.
At the very least, I would have expected that the PSU end of the cables for different pin outs to be keyed differently, in order to physically prevent the use of wrong cables.
@@RBrown-uk4xt If all the companies could coordinate on which off the shelf connectors they're buying for their pinouts to make sure there's no overlap then they could have just as easily (probably more easily) picked a single pinout.
This brings back memories. Years ago I worked at a radio shack. We sold our own branded batteries and we were under a ton of pressure to sell those batteries, along with warranties. I sold a super expensive camera, our best warranty (80 dollars in early 2000s) and three packs of our batteries. Well long story short. Our batteries melted in his camera. Corporate tried to tell me our warranty does not cover battery malfunction. They expected me to tell the customer with a straight face he was out of luck on his 900 dollar purchase yesterday. Needless to say I replaced the camera, gave him real batteries, and refunded the useless warranty.
That makes no sense. If you replaced the camera, then he still had the same need for warranty coverage, and this is a case where the gamble of paying extra for a warranty has paid off, so it would be prudent to keep the warranty rather than refund it.
Also, corporate cannot tell you that the warranty does not cover battery malfunction. Either it does, or it doesn't, based on the FINE PRINT. There is no contacting corporate issue, either you are obligated to fulfill the warranty or not.
Now the ugly truth: If the batteries were not already leaking and this camera caused them to "melt" (which is nonsense, you must mean they vented?), odds are that the camera had a defective design which did not cause it to shut off in an undervoltage condition, which reverse charged one or more of the cells. This means that if you really want to do the customer right, you do not replace the camera, rather you issue a refund because a defective design is not fixed by another new, replacement camera of the same model, with the same design.
@@stinkycheese804 particleman meant they refunded the customer's *extended* warranty (which in most cases is pretty much useless anyway).
@@stinkycheese804 He means that his store ate the costs rather than corporate which issued the extended warranty. Most smaller businesses still do that. It's part of how they survive against the big guys. Building up loyalty with customers.
@@BikeHelmetMk2 Apple didn’t like when I repaired customer devices under warranty instead of telling them lies. Those customers left great reviews on google and told their friends that we care. Customer wants to buy a new computer. Me: is the old one broken? Customer: yes. Me: I can fix it cheaper than the official price because we buy harddisks from the manufacturer and not from Apple. You even have more storage than before. Our service department usually worked for customers, not big tech companies
@@stinkycheese804 warranties are based on the law, not whatever some illegal contract terms dictate. The extended warranty became useless when the product failed prior to the extended coverage, it's not likely the customer elected to continue using a device that failed so spectacularly.
This is negligence, not malfunction. The customer had basically no way to find out about the issue before they killed their drives. This is a very clear cut case, and EVGA should cover it.
They _didn't even send new cables_ with the new PSU.
It's not even negligence, it's MALICE. EVGA explicitly told the user to do something that destroyed their property and could have harmed them.
@@superslash7254 That's still negligence. The strength of your feelings does not alter the meaning of legal terms.
@@EvenTheDogAgreesYour feelings about malice don't magically make an intentionally falsified model simple negligence. EVGA went out of their way to illegally label two devices with the same model number, something which they had advance notice can and will lead to consumers being harmed. If they accidentally put the wrong cable in the box that would have been negligence, but this was done with intent to harm and with reckless disregard as a matter of course.
@@s1mph0ny oh, look, it has learned to mimic language. One would almost suspect it of possessing sentience as well.
@@EvenTheDogAgreesIf you disagree with the bootlickers you're either a bot or overly emotional. Perhaps this makes me an overemotional bot. I'll be collecting my robo-oscar now. Malice malice malice
While I agree with you on liability in general, I still think EVGA should cover cost of the drives in this case, specifically because they instructed the user to retain their old cables and use them with the new PSU. Their instructions directly led to the destruction of those drives and there's no other way it could've gone.
In this case, EVGA's directions would ALWAYS lead to dead SATA devices due to the pin-out change. The only way this changes if EVGA informed the user of the the change and supplied them with new cables. EVGA were the only party in this transaction that possessed all the facts needed to avoid this outcome and yet they didn't. This makes them (as a business) culpable, regardless of if it's due to poor support team knowledge, bad knowledge-base systems, organization or plain incompetence.
Every decision made by EVGA, primarily the omission of the pin-out changes (in which ONLY EVGA possess every relevant fact in each RMA case), led to this result, and more importantly, will lead to it again if their process doesn't change. There's nothing the user could reasonably do to avoid this.
Couldn't agree more. What's worse, is that EVGA apparently has known about this issue for at least 2 years at this point, meaning it has decided not to take any action to prevent this from happening in the future. I can't think of a way to obliterate user trust more effectively. I'll be avoiding any new EVGA products from now on.
I think this should be an easy win in a small claims court as well, if with the help of the community, we can prove that EVGA was aware of the issue. What do they have left to stand on at that point?
@@HazewinDogI doubt you even need to prove that changes in the PSU pinout were made with their awareness. It's not something that just happens overnight.
I agree, and they have a limited number of warr cases already processed where pinout is different AND where only 2-4 weeks has passed since the PSU was returned (people would have made a claim already)
This is the kind of thing I heavily endourse lawyers and lawsuits get involved. This can lead to more issues, and possibly risk of injury, considering I've seen what 12v can do when hitting the wrong thing. I've had an RGB controller blow up in my hand and burn me due to a short on a 12v rail, that sent me to ER. This is something that can quite possibly cause issues with explosion, or even fire. While a lot of lawsuits seem stupid and frivelous, this is the type of issue that can definitely result in injury, and this guy really needs to seek a lawyer.
First off, 22TB of drives isn't cheap. I currently sport around 18TB across two raid sets (mix of 1 and 4tB raid) and last I checked, even decommisions SAS 16-bay cabinets aren't cheap used, plus the drives, plus there's more than just 22TB of drives involved if the guy runs RAID-5/6/50/60, etc.. So he really needs to lawyer up. If this goes viral, it's also possible, with eVGA's attitude, they would sue him for defemation. Remember: a good defense is a good offense. This case/scenario applies.
Jesus... if you RMA a PSU you give them the part number, so they instantly have the manufacturing date and everything is logged,
the support people should instantly have a red glowing exclamation mark on screen in their Ticket System when this PSU serial number is entered.
It should not have been changed this way to begin with, extremely negligible but for whatever reason they did it anyway, so at the very least they have to be aware to swap the cables along with the PSU in this specific case.
It is weird that they don't want to test and change cables as necessary to begin with... defective cables are a thing.
When I first started building PCs again 5 years ago, it boggled my mind why the power supply pin-outs weren't all standardized across all manufacturers.
Well no one bothered to do so
PATENTS.
first guy makes a new innovative thing, slaps a patent on it,
2nd guy wants to do the same thing, modifies it enough to not infringe the patent, patents his changed version.
3rd guy.... you see where this is going.
10 manufacturers later you got 10 variants of the thing.
Patents last how long? 20 years or so? ...yeah the one standard to rule them all will at least have to wait this long.
...not to mention they all want you to buy THEIR cables, because they sell replacement and extra cables separate.
@@ZeroB4NG Nah, can't be that. There are many instances of standardized connectors that don't violate patents.
There is a valid reason for not doing this, if you think about it: trying to reuse a 300W supply's cables with a 1000W supply is just _asking for a fire._
This is still something that can be covered through standardization. Heck could even write the standard to be 4 pins or less than x watts, 8 pins or less than y watts, etc. and have the the pinouts backwards compatible where a 4 pin can be plugged into an 8 pin. As long as it all uses the right gauge of wire it should work perfectly
EVGA is kind of sad when you know what is happening with them. The founder refuses to sell the company so instead they are winding down their operations. Currently they already cut their motherboard and GPU divisions that made them famous. They honestly had some of the best RMA service in the market. Sad to see things are changing.
thats horrible bro why would they do that
the gpu aib partner market is risky and barely profitable, because of Nvidia.
Maybe he won't sell so the new owners won't find out if they been doing shaddy stuff.
@@squoosh8285because you'd complain about it when the company produces shit, people will complain about anything and everything now
@@squoosh8285 They got tired of dealing with NVIDIA and the founder is old and doesn't want the company to be controlled by the wrong people. They are slowly winding down their divisions until what I assume is eventually the end of the company.
It doesn't just need to be printed on the box, it needs to be printed on a sticker over the connector that you plug the cable into.
Yep. That's the ONLY way people will actually read it.
@@carriebartkowiak Maybe
Sticker and new cables.
i would go one step further and say the connectors shouldn't fudging fit into each other. if you swap pins around, why on earth keep the exact same connector on the psu end??
like they had to have cables made especially to fit their new pin layout, so why not make a different connector, that would prevent anyone plugging these ass-backwards cables into previous versions of the psu and vice versa?? what is wrong with their brains :
Yep that's the most elegant solution - in a similar sense as the "warranty void if broken/peeled" stickers. Just block off the connectors with a big sticker explaining exactly what type of cables to use, and what each pin-out does, and a warranty void guide if instructions aren't followed. At that point it's evidently gonna be an end user issue if something arises.
A family member worked in a computer shop in the UK in the 90s. They had a lot of returns that the manufacturers refused to replace because the product "passed our testing". Their solution: The "cat-o'-nine-tails". An ethernet cable, a USB cable, various other cables, all wired into a UK mains plug. Plug in the device, switch on the outlet, BANG, product DOA.
based
Someone there reads The Bastard Operator From Hell!
Hey Louis. Thanks for covering my story on here. Hopefully this can at least prevent a few users from experiencing the same thing that I had to.
Dang, I'd be livid! EVGA would be getting a brick through their front window..
Depending on the cost of the drives and data recovery, I'd be taking this to court.
!!! YOUR DATA IS STILL ON THE DISKS !!! you just had to remove or replace the TVS diodes and/or fuses right near the power connector on the drive pcbs. very easy and cheap fix. if you remove them though, you wont have protection if this happens again.
Is it asinine? Yes. Is it surprising that companies will never standardize unless forced to? Not in the slightest. 😬
I would have at least had a redundancy like a different color connector on the psu to signify a Rev change. Some engineer dropped the ball.
i feel like if we look back a few decades to earlier advancements in pc technology, like USB that started of as simple serial RS232 communication, companies were keen to standardise things, and not be entirely cutthroat about everything. working with each other to some degree, just for the sake of progress was actually an option once upon a time.. no longer :
@@nemesis91101 its what happens when you outsource your manufacturing to 3rd party companies, and don't do the necessary QA and end user failsafe checks before shipping it out the door as your own branded product.
If EVGA made their own PSU's, then I'd blame the engineering team. But since it's not their own product, I blame their exec management for not ensuring a crucial aspect like this isn't triple checked before it ships to customers.
@@Real_MisterSir yea. THAT. Some sorta change to signify... a change.
@@nemesis91101 Different shape so "idiot proof" (here it's idiots on the design side, not consumers, as power mismatch should NEVER fit).
Brand loyalty is something I've foregone eons ago.
Brand loyalty is retarded
this ^^ for example, I'll list my current setup.
Currently, my PC is a mix of Intel, MSI, EVGA, WD, Seagate, Crucial, Corsair, Thermaltake, Cooler Master, ASRock, Samsung, AOC, and Dell OEM parts.
My PC will not stay like this. In fact I've swapped between Intel/AMD quite a few times. When parts fail or need upgraded, I don't care what the current brand is. I'll look for replacement parts that are from reputable suppliers. Will require tons of research, but note this - loyalty to a certain brand is a SUPER limiting factor. Don't get into that habit.
For all we know, my next PC will have none of those aforementioned brands in it. Only time and luck/opportunity will tell.
You should never have that it should be reliability loyalty
EVGA s stuff ways always way ogerpriced just like all Anus ROG shit is, but yeah, brand loyalty is destroying pcs on all fronts...intel fanboys, nvidia fanboy buying overpriced crap....fanboism is destroying everything.
Same. Every pc I build is always different brants than the prior for most components. It's always "which brand has had positive news recently"
So, when you RMA they tell you “Don’t send the cables, we will not return them”. At the same time, the unit they send back is the exact same model, doesn’t come with cables, but it actually may have different pinouts. At no point are you warned to check the pinouts and maybe not to re-use the cables they explicitly told you to keep.
Yeah, EVGA definitely bears some responsibility here. I get the bankruptcy argument, it would be sad if one mistake sinks an otherwise good company, but I still think they need to make more of an effort than what we are currently seeing. In the short term, plaster RMA’s with warnings of this, and train customer service on how to bring it up. In the long term, change the supply chain in order to make sure at least all units of the same model will have identical pinouts. Also, maybe provide a compensation fund for customers who have been affected. They may not be able to make everyone whole without bankrupting the company, but they could at least provide some money.
Would have been already a major improvement to have a specific policy for RMAs related to models that had pinout change... Model A changed pinout, this thing gets its cables returned and comes back with cables, add BIG warning not to do any cable switching in user manual and you're good...
If they changed the pinout, they should have changed the connector as well so you could not plug the wrong cable in. They should also have changed the model number, but that is not sufficient.
I liked the video b/c you expertly baited me with the cute cat thumbnail.
this
@@Dvpainter We will defend!
CAT
@@Swifto_Sweeper CUTE
Same here - baited by the cat ;)
It's astonishing to see such a monumental blunder from EVGA, a former bastion of quality engineering. I thought the company was being gradually shut down and if that's true, they let the last competent person go prematurely.
EVGA has had plenty of engineering screw-ups over the years, such as their exploding Pascal FTW cards and RTX 3090s that started dying due to poor soldering. A lot of their coolers over the years have been very poor too. They've never produced particularly high quality products compared to other companies. It was their superior customer service that gained them their amazing reputation.
Lol they're garbage. Stick with Corsair
Corsair has this same problem. I got a PSU with the wrong cables twice from them. Luckily they replaced it but it's an issue with modular cables having no standardization
@@HeWhoIsWhoHeIsStick with someone who makes their own PSU, there's a lesser chance of this sort of blunder occurring. Neither Corsair nor EVGA make their own PSUs, but Seasonic and Enermax do. Of course, you should ideally check some online opinions since everyone makes blunders, but at least in this aspect you're unlikely to find a change in OEMs.
@@leonro fair enough
Insane that they don't key the connectors to prevent wrong insertion if they change pinout - sheer incompetence.
maybe even deliberate, but yes, incredible incompetence. people are focusing on the messaging around it, but they're wrong, the problem is the design FIRST and foremost.
Connectors ARE keyed, but purpose of key is so it couldn't be inserted in wrong position.
But if you just switch 2 wires between each other, then this keyed connector won't help you.
Moreover, these keys are literally just normal PCI 8-pin connector pinout for most PSU's iirc. Just because it is extremely mass produced connector.
But EVGA should take accountability for this one for sure. They should've provided information and wires with PSU.
@@DimkaTsv Connectors can be keyed to make otherwise identical connectors incompatible. Good example is 8-pin Molex connectors are keyed differently on CPU vs GPU power cables because the 12v and ground wires are completely different between the two.
@@DimkaTsvIndividually keyed. If everything keyed the same despite being wired differently the keying does nothing
@@bn880 Their biggest mistake was not putting a new revision number on the model with a new pinout and a giant warning in every box to not mix cables between revisions. That would have avoided this entire mess.
The thing that makes EVGA 100% Liable for this damage is that their specific instruction caused the damage. Do not tell users to keep their cables to use with the RMA'ed Power Supply and not supply new cables, when they know that the new Powersupply isn't compatible with the device.
Can users exploit this? Yes. The way they would have to exploit this is by RMA-ing a EVGA Power Supply, being sent one that uses different rails, and then frying their drives. These are all things EVGA Tracks. They KNOW that the user sent in a PSU with connector A and they RMA-ed it with a PSU with Connector B. The way they can trivially stop users from exploiting them to run them out of business is by asking the user to send back the wires, and sending new goddamn wires, or by not changing the connectors on the same model of PSU.
If EVGA did something like this to someone who had tons of disposable money, and it fried a significant amount of hardware, they would 100% get taken to court, and they would 100% lose the case. There was no user error. The issue here is that the User, if they had performed no error, would have ended up with fried hardware as the result, because the result of frying the drives is what happens if the user follows the instructions correctly. This person could sue EVGA for the cost of the drives (and likely addition cost for lost work/wage caused by the issue), the TOS/EULA/Warranty Bullshit they spew out is not actually valid in a court of law, and legally they are liable for the instructions to the consumer. The reason they don't get sued is because no one in their right mind is going to spend the next 3 years and $10mil to sue EVGA for $2000-$3000 worth of computer hardware. That's why they can get away with this bullshit.
"Can users exploit this? Yes." NO stop following what youtubers say. For anyone to exploit this they would need to
1* damage their psu in a way that evga won't void their warranty, possible
2* get "lucky" to get sent a psu of the same model with different pinouts
3* get no warning from evga where at some point they can totaly sent an email and tell the customer to destroy the cables, sent them a brand new unit (wires included) with huge red warning labels to not use the old wires.
Lastly they can standardise their own pinouts AND make different psu-side plugs for different ones.
Problem solved. It isn't even complicated. Just excuses to avoid the cost of the drives and childish behaviour (doubling down instead of taking 2 steps which cost almost nothing to fix a problem and avoid a class action lawsuit).
EVGA should absolutely be held accountable for the damage of IDIOTIC policies!
yeah this one feels like a real pants on head moment
Do you mean made bankrupt and vultured to golden parachutes?
Sorry but this is 100% user error. Different power supplies using different modular pinouts has been a thing for 20 years now. If a person caused damage by not knowing what they were doing when trying to build a computer that's sad but it's also their fault. EVGA, Corsair, Gigabyte, etc don't make power supplies they just put their name on PSUs built by a variety of companies, this is common knowledge.
@@llynellyn 100%... but, in this case the user used the cables *for* the model they had, as supplied by the manufacturer...
@@llynellyndid you not listen to the video? EVGA tells the customers that if theyir power supply has an issue that they need to send in, do not send the courts with the power supply as they will not supply new cables. They send you what's supposed to be the exact same model pack, but if you use the same cables you got with your original Power supply, you run the risk of sending the wrong voltage to the wrong pins because they changed the input on the exact same model
The way Louis publicly compliments his staff is very nice.
*That is what a true Servant Leader does. Pity so few exist in our time.*
This is 100% on evga, and only evga. How can they or anyone possibly expect anyone to not know the cables they already had for the unit evga sent back wouldn't work. The manufacturer didn't know to the point they didn't send new cables.
This is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard, and evga needs to be held responsible, somehow, for ALL of the lost data and time.
It looks like evga, all lowercase on purpose, isnt the Saint of a company everyone talked about after all.
As far as the bankruptcy thing... I understand that. But... maybe that should be reason enough NOT to switch the pin outs between the same model?
It all comes back to their incompetence.
100%
Sorry but this is 100% user error. Different power supplies using different modular pinouts has been a thing for 20 years now. If a person caused damage by not knowing what they were doing when trying to build a computer that's sad but it's also their fault. EVGA, Corsair, Gigabyte, etc don't make power supplies they just put their name on PSUs built by a variety of companies, this is common knowledge.
@@llynellyn Found the evga employee
@@llynellyn What a garbage take on the situation.
@@llynellyn as Louis said, it was the exact same model, same everything. Are you seriously suggesting that the customer should manually test the voltage when they have cables for the exact model? This is absurd and no one is going to do this. If your post was a comment on the video instead of a reply, you'd easily receive the pin of shame!
@@mjc0961 I suspect it's a PR bot. This same message is being spammed in lots of different places.
Like when Pyrex famous for temp change resistant borosilicate glassware they decided to make it of soda ash glass with no mention of the change
yeah one does not simply change the product and continue selling it as identical to what it was yesterday..
Yah I had one of those shitty soda glass ones explode coming out of the oven, never pyrex ever again.
@@DurzoBlunts Damn, I've got 2 pyrex measuring jugs.. fortunately I only use steel (enamel coated) bakeware or ceramics in the oven. Might stick to that habit :P
@@DurzoBluntsPyrex owes me a $1500 kitchen floor from my experience, never pyrex ever again.
They do still actually make borosilicate glass cookware, I bought a few pieces while living in Europe. The edge has a distinct blue tint vs green or clear on ordinary glass.
Your trap door analogy was spot on. Talk about a trap for young players.
This is a fail on so many levels. First, by using the same plug with a different pinout. Second, by no warnings. This seems like the exact place where those warning labels plastered right over the power ports were made for.
I think it more appropriate the box bore a big red label warning Lark's vomit.
They should have send the correct cables with RMAs of the problematic model. It would not be such a loss. But as stated in the pinned comment - they have sent new unit with wrong cables so it is a clear lack of care
I would take them to the small claims court with all their emails / calls as evidence of their incompetence.
If they sent the PSU without the required cabling with no warning to not use the one they told you to keep, it's on them for whatever happens. They could have caused a fire or something doing that.
That's what I'm looking at doing. (I am the original poster of this story)
@@stevegircys Whatever you do DON'T SETTLE OUT OF COURT. This needs to start resulting in actual public legal precedents that seriously hurt companies.
@@stevegircys Do you have a picture of your pc with the old psu (or original receipt)? and picture of the new one?
Would I be right in saying you had a GQ1000 V1 with the grey "stone textured" box and the "1000 GQ" on the side written in grey?
....While the newer replacement is the GQ1000 V2 with they "1000 GQ" written in gold?
(also did it come in a retail box or plain brown OEM?
@@tomstech4390That's a good question. I don't know if I still have the original box, but I certainly don't have any photos of the original power supply, before sending it in. But I can confirm that the new one has the gold / yellow writing on the actual power supply. It shipped in a plain box, though - no identification on the packaging.
@@tomstech4390For some further clarification, the one that I received back from warranty has the gold text on the sides of the power supply, but grey text on the top (opposite from the fan). There is no version number at all on it though - Just 210-GQ-1000.
That modular power supply cables don't even have a minimum level of consistency and defacto standardisation is insane.
The absolute minimum should be for an entire generation's worth of them to be identical per manufacturer, and the cables being physically incompatible (i.e. too small, hook in wrong place, etc), when a break needs to be done for the next generation.
yeah, they should just use the same connectors on both sides.. not sure what's going on there
Thank you for repairing my Mac 5 years ago. I only trusted you, and shipped it to NY. It is Still working. ❤❤❤❤
This has been a known issue for years. You can't mix and match cables even from the same company. I wasn't aware that this would happen even within two PSUs with the same name, but I can see it happening as these companies can change internals to save money or even change the provider of the PSUs.
That said, EVGA should be aware of the change in the pin outs and at the very least provide warning to anyone sending in a PSU for RMA. Ideally they would provide replacement cables so you wouldn't run into this problem.
WTF
All PSU's today should be standerized!!
You can mix and match with Corsair. I have a box of cables for like 6 power supplies.
The problem in this case was that these are two of the same model that aren't the same. Which the same model number implies that they were the same.
Like I have a motherboard that has two different versions of. One version has an m.2 slot that is version 5, the other version the m.2 is version 4. Online, the manufacturer tells you how to verify the m.2 version you have. But both have their own unique, but very similar, model number. I've even seen one board that the difference were, one has an extra m.2 slot where the other has the wifi/blue tooth connector, and they also had different serial numbers. Even though in both cases, that one thing was all the difference.
I have never heard of two psus with the same model having a different pinouts on the modular cables. This is a defect and a fire hazard. Gamers nexus needs to light them up.They should add a version or revision number like normal hardware manufacturers use to tell the difference.
@@someusername121No, you cannot mix and match between different models even with Corsair, there is many different types of the cables with at least partly different pin layouts. Just google "corsair psu cable compatibility" and you will find the charts from their site. But between exactly the same models it should be safe.
The irony that this video was uploaded literally the moment the power outage at my house just got restored.
he knew u were just jumping on, so he had something prepared lol :) hope u weren't without power for too long!
They were once lauded as THE best company for RMA and warranty in the GPU space.
Theyre also going out of business, why would you buy anything from them 🤣
I had a Corsair SF750 break about 2y ago, I had to include all cables with the power supply which made sense. Cables are an essential part for the working of the power supply, not just accessories.
Louis, this is why companies carry liability insurance!
They need to make these customers whole after seeing a returned PS has the mismatched cable set from a previous warranty return. That is not the ‘floodgate’ since it only involves verifying the warranty returns that the did the mismatched cable in the return!
Many companies will still be dicks just so their liability insurance premiums don’t go up.
EVGA would lose in court because judgements are based upon what a ‘reasonable person would do’; and a judge could easily understand this case and place themselves in the plaintiff’s shoes…
agreed, plus its a limited number plus you dont need to worry about clients that didnt make a complaint for a month after the PSU was returned
@@bn880 EXACTLY. Then you fire the short-sighted moron design-engineer (and his attendant PCB designer), that would have ever done such a company/reputation risking dumb move! Also, there would be an engineering-quality person to oversee things like this, that can go out the door with the other two clowns…
Along with the fact that this was easily avoidable they should pay. I seriously doubt they would win in court with the best lawyers even if the customers represented themselves.
People can't abuse this (except maybe like requiring a couple more drives) as evga know when they sent psus with wrong pinouts AND with no warnings. As for the insurance, in this case i am almost sure they would try to avoid covering it.
Except that EVGA's OWN ACTIONS caused the data loss. They owe him data recovery services at a reputable company, and replacement storage. AT A MINIMUM.
Want to know what's funny, the First modular powersupplies actually used standardized and universal plugs. They used the exact same pins orientation and even keyed EXACTLY the same as the other end that they were to be plugged into. You could flip them end for end and everything would work. OCZ for example on their first modulars, you could take a daisy chain pci-e 6 pin connector, and even connect the middle pci-e 6 pin and connect it to the power supply and the end intended for the power supply connection would fit into the graphics card, leaving the very end of the cable dangling up around the power supply. This made it easier to keep the system's cable management looking clean. You could do the same with the 4 pin molex cables, this was absolutely a win, specially when you had one or 2 optical drives up directly across from the power supply, so you could just grab say a single cable with lets say 3x 4 pin molex on it, plug the center one into the psu, plug the shorter remaining part of the cable into the optical drive, and then the long end initially intended for the PSU connection, down to a hard drive. Systems built were clean clean clean looking. You could also swap cables from one brand to another effortlessly since they all used the same pin out arrangement, they are afterall, and for good reason, using EXACTLY the same STANDARDIZED connections. I mean for fucks sakes it makes sense they would do this since we already have those connectors and the pins and everything, cheap, readily available, ZERO justification for changing them, impossible to mix up. NO one could stick a 4 pin cpu 12v into a 4 pin molex or a 6 pin pci-e or 8 pin for that matter, you couldn't they weren't keyed to allow it, no one ever fucked anything up. But a few years later that's when all hell broke loose, the regulatory agency responsible for making sure companies were complying with standards basically dropped the ball, allowed them to come up with their own special connectors and everything went to hell.
It was a few years after the first modular PSUs arrived that they went the route of "i need to be special and build my own unique proprietary connections", and honestly there is more proprietary shit today that is MODEL specific, not just brand, and as i've now found out which i'm glad to be informed since i actually happen to use a lot of EVGA modular power supplies in my customer's builds, i can't even trust hot swaps or testing by hooking the pre-existing cables up to their own fucking identical model power supplies. This is absolutely justification for some kind of class action lawsuit filed against power supply companies by customers as a whole to take them to court in order for them to force standardization. THIS is the kind of shit that REGULATIONS should be required. These are prime examples of WHY when something innovative is designed and released, that once the grace period has been gone through and the concept gets adopted by other companies, that they should be forced to be brought together, agree on a universal standard so shit like this can't ever happen, and if something does, they can be absolutely dealt with immediately without people left standing around scratching their heads trying to figure out who to blame or what they are responsible for.
Thank you so much for this video. I've been repairing computers since 1998 (as a business since 2002) and I would never have guessed EVGA would do something so foolish.
Just a few months ago I had a customer bring me in a desktop with a bad EVGA PSU and I was just going to swap out the PSU and leave the cables, it was a gaming PC and cabling this is very time consuming, I thought I could save some time just replacing the unit. EVGA didn't have the same model in stock, so I figured that I could just get any EVGA PSU as the cables would work across the board, same company, I mean, who would ever guess they wouldn't?
Fortunately I decided to just go with a Corsair that was on sale and save my customer some money, but because of your video, I'm guessing I most likely saved him a lot more money than just $20 from it being on sale, who knows, what if they changed the pins for the CPU? Or all of them and we lose the motherboard, PSU, CPU, RAM and all the hard drives...
Like you, I will never use EVGA's in my builds/repairs again, my customers mean everything to me, and there PC's mean a lot to them, not worth working with a company that is to inept to standardize their cables within their own products.
By the way, I love your videos, I can't tell you how many times I'm watching your vids thinking "I've been bitch'n about that, it's about time someone made it public", thank you for what you do.
Maybe only trust those that manufacture their own PSUs' as they would have better QA compared to some brands that don't make their own. It would save you a lot of headache and wouldn't have to do as much research when making sure components are compatiblle.
PS. I don't know much about computers but noticed what other comments said and researched it. Its true. I just wanted to say it to you just in case it might help you in the long run. Though, all brands have their own bad apples, so...
I disagree Louis. If EVGA are smart, they'll stop selling this model immediately. At this point they could cover damaged devices by having customers send in the power supply, the mismatched cables, and the blown hardware in a single box. A few minutes (at most) with a multimeter will confirm the cable mismatch, and you're done, pay the person for their devices and the power supply. This way people can only pull the scam for as many power supplies and mismatched cables they can find, thus limiting their liability to a fair level. This would be the fair thing to do because they could have avoided this in one of two ways. One, don't change the bloody pinout in the first place or two, change the bloody model number on the altered power supply so technicians don't mix them up in RMA. The fact that neither of these happened means they should pay for it. I do agree however that they can't be held liable for data recovery costs, that's on the customer. They should pay for a replacement drive though.
i think they can be held liable for the data recovery and drive replacement costs in this particular case. why would they not have to make you whole after such negligence?
apparently the issue is old news, but i think you're right, they should have taken the stock back and addressed the problem. i don't actually know what they've done, if anything about the situation, but they knew about it 2 years ago apparently.
An unforseen power supply component failure causing damage to your drives would get nowhere in court.
However, this type of utter incomptence causing unnessessary damage to a costomers equipment would, and a small
claims court would likely take the customers side.
40 years in the electronics service ind.
100%
That's the course of action I'm looking into (I'm the original poster of this story)
@@stevegircys
A word of advice for court: keep your records, document absolutly everything, every communication, times, dates, names, who said what. This action should you decide to proceed may take a while and our memories suck.
Good luck.
Back in the day got a DTK power supply back on RMA, plugged into DTK mainboard, and they had pinned the plugs in total reverse. Granted this was early into my repair career and did not notice all the grounds(black wires) were in the wrong spots. I most likely would have expected the manufacturer to send me a binary plug that is keyed that it can only be plugged in one way was setup correctly. Thankfully just the mainboard and memory appeared to be damaged, the shop owner saw the power supply leads were pinned wrong from the factory, and DTK covered the damaged components. Customer was also understanding with the delay and was even happier that we had cloned the drives before doing the power supply replacement. Boss was glad I took the time to clone the drives while we waited for the power supply to ship to us.
1 - People may plan the need to Protect Data, as it holds personal value. 2 - Corporations do NOT get to Deny replacing damage due to their error. I'd Expect new *components when Damaged,* after installing Replacement, per Company's Instructions. Reason, is due to *LACK of Company's Instructions;* NO Notification, FYI, Caution, Warning, YO!, Hey You, STOP!. *"Pursuit of Happiness";* Time to Collect. 🇺🇸
lol
After Trump's new 2018 tariffs on Chinese products, a lot of tech companies changed OEMs, who had factories in China, that included EVGA. Also, EVGA and other power supply designers are known to use different OEMs, who builds the power supply, over time. If I recall correctly, a lot of EVGA old power supplies (P2, T2) were made by Super Flower, but after 2018, EVGA contracted their power supplies to other OEMs like Seasonic, FSP, HEC, and others. Also, around that time, power supplies cut costs due to the tariffs. I bought two Seasonic power supplies before and after the tariffs. My older 650-watt Seasonic platinum had a thicker AC power cord vs. my newer 750-watt Seasonic platinum power supply as well as the internal packaging.
In the end, EVGA is done after ending graphics card production, and they are only servicing warranties before they likely close up shop forever.
so like do u think the pin switching was accidental due to the change in manufacturers? that would kinda explain why they didn't key it right to prevent using the wrong cables on the same model..
@@outseeker Might be an accident, but EVGA should have taken the precaution to send some cables with the replacement power supply. Nowadays, customers have to do a lot of homework to make sure they don't blow stuff up by accident.
If my power supply blew up with a few years on the warranty and I could afford a new power supply, I would buy another one and not go through the hassle of an RMA power supply blowing up my PC hardware. For this to be the optimal solution, we are living in clown world.
@@worldtownfcAre you sure they did not send new cables?
@@jepulis6674 From the video, EVGA sent new cables after the user blew up their hard drives with the original cables of his old power supply.
Unfortunately many PSUs are just rebrands of GreatWall, Fortron Source Power, Super Flower, etc., power supplies which is why this happens. However, I agree that if I buy two of the same product and they are the same revision, I would expect that their cables are interchangeable.
Very good point at the end. I work in IT and sometimes need to explain the difference between high availability (HA) and disaster recovery (DR) to people who think they are equivalent concepts. They are in fact very different and address different requirements. RAID is for HA, not DR.
I have not built a PC in several years but the last one I did build had a EVGA PS in it! I had no idea..
A true public service for making this video! Proof a honest New Yorker escaped! Bravo!
Had Louis stayed in NY the NY Secret Police would be looking for him for spilling the evil beans. :)
My current power supply is a Super Flower because it's who EVGA used to manufacture one of their previous gen power supplies. Went straight to the source and saved money. The change is probably because they switched manufacturers or a manufacturer discontinued a model and EVGA wanted to keep using them. Just a guess.
First and only time I ever had a supeflower psu. It killed a whole pc. Well... Minus 1 ram stick and a half functioning hdd. Also had a Corsair AX 750i delete itself.
@@justinpatterson5291 Strange. They are very high quality with a good warranty, low failure rates, and solid reviews. Every full teardown and testing of them has shown high end components and high performance. Every brand can have failures though.
Here in Romania Super Flower is pretty popular among PC builders. Didn't hear anything negative and I've been aware of the brand for over 10 years.
@@RockstarRomaniamanufacturers often have different production and quality standards in place for the USA and EU due to consumer protection laws.
@@prunabluepepper Right.
EVGA replaced two video cards for me because of an issue that was 100% my fault, at no expense to me. Because of this, I've only used EVGA products for whatever I've needed that they make since then. Disappointing to hear about this issue.
I had a similar experience with them, my old 2070 fan was getting noisy, so I emailed them to enquire on the cost of a replacement, it was well outside warranty. After a few emails back and forth to check model numbers and which fan I needed, they just posted the pair of them to my with no charge.
dont worry, you paid for all that free RMA with inflated price of the card.
So you abused their RMA policy because of you're wrong doing? And you wonder why manufacturers/retailers have tighter return/exchange policies because of individuals like you have ruined it for others. Now when the company change their policies they're the problem?
@@disguiseddv8ant486 you dont seem to have very good reading comprehension. They covered an issue that they had no obligation to cover, and I've made them my first choice for the hardware they make since then, because they had a customer-centric approach. When it comes to the current issue, did you even watch the video?
Informative and unfortunate especially given EVGA's past reputation.
THANK YOU, LOUIS!!! I was in the market for a power supply.. Your report educated me to STAY THE F**K AWAY from EVGA power supplies..
I had the misfortune to buy an EVGA Titanium power supply . It didn't work for 10 years like they promised but rather 3 or 4. RMA is not possible where I live so my only option was to go to a repair shop. They fixed it for a hefty price only for it to break the next day. I brought it back and they said they'll fix it for free ( as law requires). Turned out there was a cascade failure and the AA9013 controller was broken. It took them over a week to create and draw the schematics by hand since there's no info anywhere about this power supply. The saddest part is AA9013 controller is basically unobtainable unless there's another similar power supply to take it from. So my ultra expensive power supply is now broken and there's no chance of repairing it. At least the repair shop gave me my money back.
good guy repair shop.
@@SoulTouchMusic93 I mean they are required to do so by law but the fact they didn't try to weasel out of it speaks volumes.
Which model?
Anything can happen, but yeah I dislike EVGA’s use of custom IC’s even on their gpu’s.... they usually are the thing that fails a lot on their models which is crazy because it’s custom made for a reason.... right?????? My real complaint with evga
@@sparklingion My model is EVGA SuperNOVA 1000 T2. I wish I could buy that controller separately but there's no data where to find it. Best bet is to buy a donor second hand PSU that has the same controller. That's costly however still cheaper than new Titanium PSU.
@@demonfedor3748 I would contact evga and superflower directly and see if they can send you or have you buy the IC. SF might not carry it, but EVGA definitely had old stock of it (I know they do).
That's when you would learn that Raid is not a backup!
Redundant != Backup
I mean it literally is backup. It's just not off-site backup or backup on a second system...
It is a backup. But not raid 0.
Just it isn't as fault tolerant as an external or hot site one would be. Like if just one drive died... It could be restored from the copy on a different drive. But multiple copies on the same drive aren't true backups.
Not based on the definition that pops up when I google it.
"Backup refers to the copying of physical or virtual files or databases to a secondary location for preservation in case of equipment failure or catastrophe."
Pairity data is not a copy.
@@justinjja2 Raid 1.
@@SuperTort0isestill not a back up. If you get ransomware, you lose BOTH sets of data
I recently had to buy a power supply unit for a workstation I was building so that it would support a high power GPU. The unit I bought had modular plugin cables that are proprietary, so I got to researching all sorts of stuff to make sure I didn't burn up this workstation or the GPU. I must have rung out every cable I installed to ensure it was delivering the right power to the right pins. This was a vendor who took pains to provide information about their cable pinouts. I can't imagine what it would be like to deal with a vendor who just changes these pinouts willy-nilly. EVGA used to be a very reputable company. It seems like they are on a downward slide of late. Thanks for covering this.
Just FYI, EVGA, Corsair, Cooler Master etc.... do not manufacturer power supplies.
Actual manufacturers are Super flower, great wall, FSB etc...
yes but you brand it, changes only if you know it, if evga was not informed they can give the damage bill to the real manufacture.
High end PSU have very long warranty, some are 10 years so getting a completely new model as a replacement is a normal thing. If they just get you to sent them the old cable and give you new cable that go with the replacement this wouldn't happened.
Edit: same model replacement but different pin out? WTH
I almost learned this the hard way. I had to replace my PSU as it was smelling like molten plastic, that for some reason I was the only one able to smell it. I got a new PSU and thought nothing of it to simply swap the PSU but not the cables to save my self the hassle. My paranoid hypervigilance made me think that maybe the cables were not compatible, even though I was probably being paranoid, I still decided to check, then I double checked, then triple checked, and low and behold they were not... and I couldn't believe it... so I was going to swap out a fried PSU and almost ended up frying my entire PC along with the new PSU. Since there is no standardization of the cables, I'm not surprised it would even change with the same model of PSU, but I probably would have just swapped the box if the model was the same. It's an incredibly stupid blindspot, I watched a girl pc build channel upload a video where she fried 3 PSU's not knowing this. If you want to see the video it's from "Andie the Lab" - "Almost Electrocuted Myself - New Battlestation Rig"
Thanks for the video and great info, Louis. I had no idea EVGA was doing this with power supplies. It's absolutely insane.
By the way, your comments about not being "brand friendly" gave a good chuckle.
Oh my god, this actually happened to me at work. I work in IT at a company and was building some custom PCs for some heavy workloads. I bought 3 identical model EVGA power supplies from the same vendor on the same day, from the same site. At some point one of the power supplies wasn't functioning well, so given that I had 3 I decided to see if the Cable was just bad so I swapped them to check. The power supply still didn't deliver power to the MB. so then I took the "donor" power supply and tested it with the cables that the non functioning unit was shipped with. the motherboard lights came on, but the board was fried.
I got lucky and managed to RMA everything and get everything replaced from EVGA. but it took over 5 weeks to get a new board as this specific one had necessary features that no other vendor offered at the same price point. The positive thing is that at least my boss was chill and we tested the voltage output of the replacement unit along with the other 2. Needless to say, there were differences despite being the exact same model.
Pretty unfortunate to see from EVGA. Usually they have the best warranty and customer service in the industry.
Corsair does have different pinouts across different models. They do tell you about it though, and separate them by Type number.
Louis, Like you, I had NO IDEA that the pinouts on modular power supplies was non-standard in the industry! Thanks for this moment of education. I will file this away in my brain if I ever need to RMA a power supply to make sure I compare the pin outs! You may have saved a lot of people a really bad time by making this video!!
The difference, in this case, is they sent back a *different* model.
Their records show that the customer sent in v1 PSU (which was proven to be faulty) and instead of repairing, they sent back a v2 replacement unit.
At the time of sending the *different* replacement unit back to the customer, they are aware (or at least should be aware) of the pin-out difference.
So they should cover the drives for the customer, 100%, no questions asked!
To avoid being scammed and to avoid liability issues, all they need to do is have a *policy* to notify the customer, which they *failed* to do. If that was the case, and my return unit had a warning, there is no way possible as a customer I can scam them.
I'm surprised that EVGA, which has been one of the more reputable companies within the PC enthusiast community, didn't label a PSU of the same model number with a different designation when making changes as significant as pinouts - it can be something as simply as labelling the model number with a "Mark II" suffix while keeping everything else the same.
It's one of those very important things that they don't teach you in school - it's very very important deciding on how you call something. Everyone can come up with a name. Very few can do it well.
That's a damn good video Luis on explaining why warranty is hard for the manufacturers as well. Still wtf EVGA - why no simply put a v2 after the number of the PSU and notify people and that V2 has different pinout...
Thanks for the heads-up, I've a box of spare psu cables from various modular psu's, I too thought these were interchangeable.
I'd adapt the policy like this, if you had an old supply and we RMA'ed you a different version of the same model with the pin-incompatibility AND we did not tell you about it before we updated the website (so a cut off date), then we'll cover the hardware that got destroyed (up to the current market value for the same or equivalent product) but not for the data recovery. That would mean it would be less easy for any random person to send in old junk hardware and claim it was their EVGA power supply - it limits it to those that would not have been informed about the change and were basically setup by EVGA to use their old cables while not being told that they'd changed. My 10 cents.
I like the thumbnail.
clickbait we are all happy with
I was so confused. 😂
I used to be a long-term EVGA customer. Back in the 1080TI days, my EVGA video card caught fire (there are videos by others of this on UA-cam). It was in warranty, so I returned it and received a replacement. Shortly after installing the replacement card, it exploded. Bits rainded down into the power supply, which failed. The incident also took out my monitor. I basically had an unplanned rebuild of my PC because I didn't trust any of the components after this. Didn't even bother returning the video card again because I would never use it or even sell or give it to someone else. EVGA lost a customer that day. Since then, I have emphatically told anyone who was planning to build a PC to avoid EVGA like the plague.
??? There is nothing in there that can explode like that? lol I could understand a power suppyly with the condensators or coil but jeez what?
What do you mean "exploded"?
not fanboying for evga or anything but pics or it didn't happen! lol i wanna see the graphics card shrapnel and stuff!! like which chunks explodified? was it the gpu itself, or surrounding components or what?
@@saltysalt7339 electrolytic caps can easily explode
@@outseeker this can and will happen, thats the problem with the internet children need to stay out of adult spaces.
In particular, I test the power supply's motherboard connector for voltage stability overnight with checks every few minutes before ever plugging it in to a motherboard. I have been testing all power supply outputs since I was working for a used computer dealer about twelve years ago, when he started. It just makes sense.
This is crazy, that you just put this video out, I had same thing happen to me.. have same psu and extra cables because the server I bought on FB Market, I needed old molex power plugs.. and funny thing is it didnt boot.. it was because the same model had different pin out and it wouldnt boot.. luckly the drive I had plugged didnt die.. wow this is nuts and i totally agree with you on this..
On a totally unrelated note: I'm wondering why Louis put his couch in front of a door.
I clicked this for the cat
I clicked this for EVGA, PSUs, _and_ the cat.
Two out of three ain't bad, I guess.
yea, Power Supplies having the same stupid rule "Only use my cable which comes with the supply" which was erased for Phones here in EU.
As someone who just recently bought a new PSU and upgraded my storage capacity I am happy this got covered. Thanks again Louis for covering all different types of issues in the industry!
Man i don't like seeing Louis mention EVGA in his title, i know they must have mess up somehow lol.
Yeah, I don't like EVGA anymore either.
It's not just EVGA, I own two Corsair PSU's with two different cable configs. It's a real pain in the butt!
Are they the exact same model though? Labelled exactly the same? That's what they're doing now... Changing the pinout mid-production without notifying anyone, and further instructing uses to keep and use the old cables that they are aware will cause this problem.
This little bit should place legal liability on EVGA for instructing the user to take actions which, when so done by following the directions precisely, causes the damage.
Due to the damage being caused by following their instructions, I'm fairly certain they are liable here.
Type 3 and Type 4 are compatible with each other. Only the 24 pin is different with more sense wires for higher efficiency. There’s type 5 now but it’s physically smaller connectors that won’t fit.
@@someusername121 That requires looking up, the EVGA owner didn't even notice the box was different between his V1 and V2.
@@tomstech4390 From what Louis said, firstly the labels are identical, other than the manufacturing date, which no one expects to be a problem when they send in an RMA - it's expected to receive a newer unit than you sent in. There was no "v1 or " v2" anywhere on the label. As far as boxes go, secondly, it was an RMA, so probably shipped to him in a plain brown or white cardboard box. Also... If they didn't change the label in the product, they're even less likely to change the packaging, which would be more costly, and... unless corporations are ordered to do things like that by a judge... they tend not to. It's not financially smart for them.
@@tomstech4390 At least from what Louis read, they didn't even provide the new cables and the tech said they would send it to them after it burned up his drives.
thank you for the info , i use evga power supplies frequently
Your first example really shows why RAID should never be considered a data backup!
damn clickbait, I see cat I click, and then I have to listen to how my once favorite GPU manufacturer is circling the drain. Also EVGA ODM's PSU's at least used to through SuperFlower. Also RAID is not a backup... Love your content, it's the good stuff.
Since EVGA is so big, the customer should sue. And EVGA now notified must immediately send supplemental instructions with rma power supplies, with very clear instructions on checking power connections. Or immediately change RMA to send in cables and new cables sent if new doesn’t match old BY THEIR OWN DESIGN.
Honestly - connectors for different voltages should be made incompatible with each other. 3v should have one type of connector, 5v should have something totally different, and 12v should have something totally different. If you need to change the pinout, then you also change the type of connector to prevent plugging the wrong voltage into the wrong place. That's the real fix for a problem like this.
I remember manufacturers using colored pinouts back in the day so people could actually find out just by looking at the color, but now it's all black, nad modular. It starts to get really creepy when you have multiple modular power supllies lying around and can't remember which cables go with what PSU...
That's unfortunate, personally I had a power supply replacement from EVGA about 4/5 years ago. They told me not to send the cables with RMA and explicitly told me to switch all the cables when I got my replacement power supply. They did include new cables, so maybe this a more recent policy change?
EVGA's RMA department had this problem in the motherboard side. While "We're sorry but we don't make the GTX 1070 anymore, we'll give you a 3070 instead" sounds good, but "We're sorry but we don't make the Z370 FTW anymore, we'll give you a Z690 instead" doesn't really get you going.
@@Fay7666true lol
It sounds fishy to get a new power supply with no cables. Something seems off on the story.
it could be that EVGA doesn't make the power supplies, and just buys them from an OEM. they could've switched oems and never made an announcement about it. not ok, but it makes more sense how something like this could happen
Bingo. AFAIK the GQ series changed OEMs from FSP to HEC over the years.
Things like that should never be kept secret. Why do they do this? Because they're afraid of losing face?
Pisses me off when companies make no effort at transparency with their customers.
@@jmal ssd manufacture switch storage chips, controller and ram chips linus has a video. pc as a hobby makes no fun, always is some thing stupid
I get that they can't just open the coffers up to everyone, but being stupid and cavalier with other people's hardware SHOULD be painful.
Molex connectors can be keyed differently to disallow the interconnection of incompatible products. The fact that they did not do this shows an incredible disregard for their customers.
The issue stems from the fact that it is rarely true that the brand name on the side of the psu is the same brand that built the PSU. There are only a couple OEMs that build computer power supplys and its not un common for multiple oems to be used by the same brand across their product lines.
One thing that pissed me off with EVGA is their motherboards... I bought a z690 motherboard for $499 2 years ago with 12th Gen intel CPU .... They stopped updating the bios like a year ago so highest drop in upgrade i can do is 13th gen because there is no bios for 14th gen.
no that's an intel problem. from 2nd to basically 7th gen they were identical and the only reason you had to change the board was because intel says you can only have maybe 1 generation of upgrade. if you want more than that get AMD
@@bradhaines3142 my MSI b660m can run 12-14th so not an intel thing.
@@bradhaines3142 Its not Intel, 12th -14th is same socket... all it needs a BIOs update to work. But apparently EVGA Bios person left a year ago so I cant use 14th Gen.
You have all of the upgradability that you need. The "14th gen" isn't even a generation, it's a refresh of 13th gen where you're lucky to get a couple of percentage points of difference. Be it between the 14900k and 13900k. Or, 13600k and 14600k.
Honestly, with the performance difference across the 12000 and 14000 series, unless you're looking to...I dunno, upgrade a 12400 to a 13700k/13900k, there's nowhere near enough performance that would justify the cost of a new CPU.
That is on you, no company can guarantee a future upgrade path. You buy based on what you need today.
I think you are wrong about covering damage to other components because this isn't even under are of things warranty defines. Your PSU dies and spike of voltage kills components - that can be discussed under warranty discussion. Still, even in that case, PSU could have some kind of insurance: "we are not responsible, but with purchase you get insurance policy for damages up to...".
But this issue is not caused by PSU malfunction, this is caused by gross negligence and company should be held accountable because of negligence, not because of warranty. Even if my PSU is older and not under warranty, and EVGA sells me replacement cable clearly stating it's compatible with my PSU (in EU companies are obligated to provide spare parts even some period after warranty) without any notice like "only compatible with model produced after, or with serial starting with", that is negligence, not malfunction.
Great vid Louis. You are a great supporter of the community.
I had a run-in with ASUS similar to this. I RMA'd a motherboard of theirs after it failed under warranty. I sent the board in, I later got a message stating that they would not repair the board and that it would be returned to me. The reason it was denied? "Physical damage to board." I received the board back and it had been repacked in a different box than I sent them, and it had an entire corner of it folded! I contacted customer support, posted to their forums, etc...they wouldn't budge. I decided then and there that I'd never buy another ASUS product again, which is a shame because I had been a long-time customer (mobo, gpu, two monitors, a laptop).
EVGA stopped existing to me after they stopped making graphics cards. There were always other companies with better offerings for other products they sold. In this case, why do I want an EVGA power supply when Corsair and Seasonic exist?
Because of competition dummy. Geezus imagine how much iphones would be if Samsung did not exist
I didn't stop buying their PSUs, until I saw a report of the warranty getting cut-down, which made me lose hope! Sadly, that's why for my newest PSU purchase for another build, I got a Corsair RM850x. But, my daily-driver, has an eVGA Supernova 750 G3 from the late-2010s, IIRC, older than the other PC components! Lasted through multiple Ryzen builds and in 2021, IIRC, I got an eVGA 650 GQ for another build in the same room. The Supernova 750 G3, was first installed on a socket FM2+ system, with an Athlon X4 860K, maybe I had it on another PC before 2019.
Dang Evga used to the best in the biz.
Thanks for the news Louis! You're right after all these years there should be a standard set in place, and it's kind of shitty thing on EVGA's behalf to do such a thing, especially not informing the customer, that they did change it, and if they did know they should have put the cables in thee to begin with and wrote a big ass WARNING note to go along with it as soon as you opened up the box.
I recently RMAed a Seasonic PSU, and the only cable they told me to keep was power wall cable.
They replaced the with the same exact model name PSU, but the new one obviously used different components and must have different cables, but I never checked.
I would expect EVGA to fix this, we'll see. But they are well known for some of the best warranty service in the business. I've experienced it myself, they covered something that wasn't within the warranty period just to be nice.
And yes, NONE of the modern PSUs are standardized in terms of pinouts. I mean, it is standardized on the motherboard end, but not on the PSU end. I had to map the pinout with the cable on my recent setup so I could make a jumper cable to plug into the PSU that turned power on when the switch on the PSU is flipped. Yes, you can use the included jumper on the cable itself but I wanted to eliminate excess cables, and this is a second PSU that just powers my fans and pump. Ironically, it's an EVGA.
While their RMA process needs to change, or at least include some QC checks that would trigger a call to the customer if something like this happens, I would also point out that it's a very specific set of circumstances that would result in this. It wasn't that he got back a drastically different model, I would bet they would have included new cables with that. He got back a new revision of the same model, and that screwed him. It's probably a situation they didn't consider on the RMA side because they didn't think the engineering side would do that within a model run.
Get Steve from GN on the case!!!! He'll go to Taiwan to talk to the executives directly!
Steve isn't going to talk negatively about his EVGA buddies. I guarantee you that he will not mention this.
I've tried to get a hold of him through the email listed on their UA-cam page, but I didn't have any luck. (I'm the original poster of this story, by the way)
@@stevegircys Damn! We'll have to make a bigger stink out of it then!
@@stevegircysyo GN just covered the story did they replace the drives actually?
@@Gokuevp Yes, they ended up paying me for the replacement cost of the drives and a bit extra for my time and hassle. As well as sending me a new G7 1000W power supply.
Not standardizing the connectors and pinouts on modular power supplies must be one of the biggest PC/ATX failures in recent history.
I had something similar happen where a BeQuiet PSU failed, some 15 years ago. They also told us to keep the cables and we received a new unit without cables. Support was proud to say that they sent a much better/upgraded unit as a replacement. Well. The cables didn't even physically fit anymore. Had to go back to the shop and get an off-the-shelve replacement unit, after some discussion...
Louis, I think they should cover it all. It would actually be pretty rare that people are frying their HDD's/SSD's to cheat them, AND they have a limited number of processed warranty cases for that specific model where the pinout changed to date. Also anyone that has NOT complained for 2 or 3 weeks after they got their PSU back can be assumed to not have had damage either. Send notices to future clients. Not sending in cables is a GOOD policy. The pinout change is completely irresponsible.
I am an EVGA user, I recently had some new cables for my PSU and EVGA sent me the cables for free because they had a stockpile and no longer made them. About 2 years ago EVGA standardized all their models to use the same pin-outs which has lead to some of their older models now having 2 different pin-outs between model years. When I asked for new cables for my PSU so that I could plug in some new drives, I had went onto their website and realized there was no cables for my model and they had very clear labelling about not mixing cables on older models. I called their support and the service guy was very careful to make sure I had the right model number so that I wasn't sent wrong cables. EVGA as far as I know is the only brand to standardize pin-outs across all of their PSUs.
SeaSonic might have as well. I know I was able to use cables from a build I had 8 years ago with one I built two years ago. Support confirmed I could, but I pinned out both the older cables I used to be sure.
Fun Fact Louis. Corsair also uses different pinouts for the modular plugs across it's PSU line.
The bad here is that it's the same model. They really need to make a universal standard for modular power supplies. This is just getting insane at this point.
they label it and don’t change it within the same model
did corsair also forget to key the plugs differently so they couldn't be physically plugged into their own "identical" and incompatible power supply?
I don't believe you watched the video. If only that was what this was about lol
@@outseeker - Yes, Reddit is your friend. Issue is not unique to EVGA
I usually go with Corsair or EVGA for power supplies and have used wires from multiple PSU's in 1 and can't say that anything has ever fried. Like you, I just assumed that they were all the same wires because they have the same connectors, never even thought this wasn't a thing if they are somewhat close it wattage. Luckily you released this when you did because I'm about to upgrade GPU's in our home therefore having to upgrade PSU's and since we all have multiple drives that almost always require 1 or 2 extra cables to connect them, I would have just used an older SATA cable on the newer PSU's. You're the man Ross!
Damn
Damn
Damn