My father thought screaming at his kids and beating us with a belt would "whip us into shape". Instead we're all dysfunctional losers, two of whom are just as monstrous as he was.
Thats awful.Sorry. The fact that you have some awareness around it? Means there's always wiggle room for improving your wounds (I should say heal) This stuff is sooo complex. Was mostly neglected as a kid, and then gaslit to THIS day by my 84 year-old mom. It's almost comedy if it wasn't so damaging. I'm now without my right leg/kidneys from a terrible fent. poisoning. I can draw a straight line from my childhood to my addictions/ disturbances that led to me losing my leg
I “only”got the actual belt a few times, but they are still some of my most traumatic memories. 30 years later and I’m STILL CRYING over the extreme pain and humiliation of being made to bare my behind to my parents as a teenager and take that belt. I really do hate my parents for what they did to me.
I hear you. And up to this day, I can promise you this: my father will never, *ever* accept that he was responsible. In his mind? He did everything right. he was *always,* and *will always be,* "right."
On purpose but not primarily to hurt us. Primarily to protect themselves from whatever they are fearing at that moment. We are collateral essentially. ❤
My mom is the Reactor. She could scream, get angry, say and do what she wanted - but I wasn't allowed to be emotional, I wasn't allowed that same luxury. My dad would be considered the Safe One I think. He never overtly did anything to me, however he left me with my mother after they got divorced. I really feel like he didn't fight for me or protect me in the way I needed him to.
Yeah. My mom was pretty much the same. She had one set of expectations for her that were the bare minimum for an adult (not even) but my sister and I were expected to be fully independent before I was in second grade. I realize you are mad at your dad but maybe there is more to the story. My parents divorced in the 80's so my mom got us but if she divorced now a days he would have gotten us.
It's rather surreal to point out that they're doing something abusive only for them to do it again, completely unaware that they're doing it. This happened three times in a row the day before last: she told me I was angry when I was pointing out her cognitive distortions, to which I calmly told her I wasn't angry and that policing my demeanor like that was an attempt to manipulate me and derail the conversation. She cried after calling me angry and emotional several times and failing to provoke that reaction from me. Is this healing?
Your dad would know that the family courts would put you with your mother as long as that was what she wanted. He may have only stayed in a bad relationship as long as he did because it was the only way to stay with you. Have you maintained a relationship with your dad? Dads often don't have any choice in these things. I don't know your circumstances but this is often the case. You will never see this from your mother's accounts.
My stomach rolled the entire time watching this video. I witnessed my mother change personas based on her audience. With me, she was the reactor. Always screaming or sighing when I had needs. She tolf stories about the abuse and laughed. (Anytime you were hurt, you hid from me and it drove me nuts!) To my other siblings, she was the child and them, her flying monkeys. To the neighborhood, she was the method actor: selfless, giving and sweet. At her funeral, I listened to the stories my siblings shared and I was shocked and saddened. Hearing those stories, I couldn't hide from how much contempt and hatred she held for me.
I am in the absolute same position. Im struggeling with not becoming a method actor parent and completely absorbing myself in a mother role. I just want my daughter to have everything I didn't
@alexandraonai8187 I believe the method actor, when used in a healthy way, can be compared to the emergence of self that occurs during adolescence. You try on different "hats" and take away what feels genuine or helpful. As childhood trauma survivors, we missed those appropriate developmental windows. It took me several years to develop my own personality and become comfortable in my own skin. The fact you are aware and intentionally working to provide your daughter a different experience means you're already in a better place. Prayers for your journey in creating your best self. ❤️
My issues with limerence and emotional dis-regulation come from my "I just work here" dad. He was totally emotionally absent when I was growing up and never took any interest in me. With hindsight I realized my perfectionism as an adolescent was an attempt to (finally) earn my dad's approval and interest by finally becoming "good enough". That paradigm hurt my ability to connect with people in a healthy way more than I realized at the time. It's been really hard to try to course correct in my late 30's but I'm working on it.
I experienced a lot of similar things to what you describe. Definitely perfectionism and never-good-enough-ness. Performance reviews are a terrible time for me.
@@babyshoozI'm 56 and over weight and just been diagnosed and even though I knew my childhood was bad, I did not understand until lately just how much it effected me. I understand how you feel. 😐.
Agree 💯. I'm 53 and still working this all out. The never good-enoughness is a horrible burden. My "Safer one" mom died right after retirement and now I'm the point person for my "I just work here" father's elder care. Luckily I live across the country now and only have to deal with it by phone. But it's been a lot, with early dementia, schizophrenic episodes, police arrests, hospitals, emergency treatment facilities, nursing homes, etc. It's all keenly painful, horrible, and laughable.
I never saw some of my issues as a parent until I started to work on my own complex trauma and now I feel so guilty that I was a lousy parent. Generational trauma sucks!!
I think this is an extremely difficult thing to deal with, and frankly a huge reason that a lot people will never put in the work (it's too difficult to face one's own short-comings with clear eyes). If you're still in contact with your kids, even if they are adults, having some conversations and letting them know what you regret and now wish you had done differently can go a long way. It is so hard to reparent ourselves. Even as adults, I'm sure your children would appreciate you helping them with that work, if your current relationship allows for it.
@@jadelinny We are just starting to have discussions surrounding the trauma that has passed from one generation to another and I have apologized a lot. We have a lot of ground to cover and I have a lot of making up to do. My kids thankfully don’t hate me. We are a work in progress though and I’m thankful that they are open to talk about everything. 💕🙏🏼
Just finding out about “The Safer” one was enormous. I have felt so guilty for finally starting to face how betrayed and unprotected I felt with my mother. It has taken me years to take her off the pedestal I had her on. Partially, I put her up there to keep her safe from The Monster. It is a really confusing archetype. Lots of guilt.
Yeah its very sickening! Took me years to figure it out. One day they're telling you what a dirty s.o.b. your dad is and the next day they're taking his side and knifing you in the back. The safer one is so manipulating it's hard to see what's really going on as you're growing up in it. 😡
I felt such a strange cold floaty feeling when you started describing the monster’s fixation on one child…I’ve never really been able to explain that before. Thank you so much for this!
My stepdad (since I was 2,) was always way more “monstery” with me than my younger brother (his biological son) and when I was young, I rationalized that he was meaner to me because I wasn’t his child.
@@crystalw8050 I’m so sorry you had to deal with that! I bet you were such a sweet kid and I wish things had been better for you 💕 my father was a really weird mix of mean and explosive but then also…kind of clingy and intense with me in a way adults aren’t (usually) with kids? To this day I’m still pretty confused about what he was, everything’s kind of blurry and hard to process
That strange cold floaty feeling is probably dissociation. That's the feeling I get when I hear something uncomfortably familiar to some incident from my past.
Both my parents are reactors. I spent my childhood and most of my adult years thinking I was the only one bad enough to make my parents mad all the time. It's amazing to find out how many other people were living the exact same childhood like the parents were reading from a script. I can't even give them credit for originality lol.
I suspect the type I grew up with is the super common pairing. I wouldn't ship it though. The monster father and the safer one mother. Father was always just a monster to me. Safer one mother stayed with him through prison. My mind is still all wrapped up in it even though we are estranged.
@@Purplesquirrels that sounds really scary and emotionally damaging and just plain sad, stranger. I really hope you find peace from that. Dr. Gabor Mate says the trauma is not what happened to you, it's the psychological wounds that haven't healed yet. Everyone can heal though.
Patrick, you mentioned hoarder parents as an example of the Child archetype and that struck a nerve in me. Would you consider making a video specifically exploring the trauma experienced by children of hoarders? For context, I grew up in my mom's hoarding situation. Though I moved out long ago and keep a reasonably tidy home, I am still haunted by the mess. I struggle to occupy and control my own space now that I don't have to make myself small enough to fit next to her garbage. I sometimes feel apprehensive I'll get into trouble while throwing out my own belongings. I don't know how to receive guests because I wasn't allowed to have friends in the house. We hid whenever the doorbell rang. How do I heal the betrayal, shame, and disgust?
I second this request, as hoarding is generational in my family, particularly on my dad's side. I struggle having people over for similar reasons to yours, and I can't purchase new clothes, even though I want and can afford to improve my wardrobe, because I was always told I had too many. I didn't, there just was never space next to all the junk my parents kept around. I get fixated on keeping things tidy, but also can't keep up with chores sometimes due to a combination of executive dysfunction and trauma responses.
for real, i was never allowed to have friends over because of the state of the house and that they didnt want to have to have other peoplpe in the house and while i keep my own space relatively tidy now (i still kinda have a mess issue sometimes) and have brought people over regardless it is so crazy the difference in my mental health when i actively engineer my spaces not just for me but for others comfort. the house has always been something we've fought against but it really does feel good to bring others into your safe spaces my friends sitting on my bed makes me so happy. not being able to have people over also created conflict around always being driven to see friends with any frequency and it was always dissonant to hear my parents talk about gas money and the time it took to pick me up but when i ask if they could come over it was always an absolute no because of the effort it would take not to get my room clean, but the rest of the house clean. WHILE ALSO TELLING ME I SHOULD HAVE MORE FRIENDS AND MAKE MORE FRIENDS "why dont you hang out with your friends you need to get outside"
I suffered from hoarding in both parents (one who was a psychologist!) I would love to see a video on this. Thank you for all you do, Patrick. I love your approach.
My mom has always been a child. She’s also a narcissist. I was extremely parentified as a kid and I never want to have a child of my own because of this. I’ve been no contact with her for over a year and it has been the best decision I’ve ever made. Some people have kids when they shouldn’t have.
So true...I told my mother about my divorce decision..she became immediately very agitated, stating my husband could kill the children and himself. When my father died, she rang me up threatening suicide. After his death, she could not live with the peace of not having to cope with the financial and violent chaos anymore. She started creating more trouble between her children, being nasty to my ex husband who had always been very kind to her, creating scenes in shops . 6 years no contact. Bliss
I’m sorry 😞! I feel your pain my Mom when she was raising us was absolutely crazy and made horrible decisions and I grew up in total dysfunction and fear it’s so weird how you think your alone but we are here now sharing our trauma together 😢! Pat, you are totally giving back! 😍👍
Congratulations for doing the right thing. Stay away. This is the best thing you could’ve ever done for your life. You will have no regrets. Let others be stuck being abused by parents their entire lives because it will never stop. I also made that decision. I now have a life.
My mother spent decades working with and helping to care for intellectually disabled people, and told me I wasn't allowed to say stop when I was being groped constantly by one of the kids she was caring for. Always put this great big thing out into the world about how important it was to treat the disabled with kindness and love, and everyone freaking loved her. Of course, when my own disabilities gets in the way of what she wants, I'm a bad child for not leaving myself distraught for days to make her happy.
That was very bad, unprofessional,inappropriate, and abusive of her on all accounts. First of all for allowing ' anyone ' to do that to you. Also, to the disabled person by not working to correct the behavior. I'm sure they went on to act in this manner to others. I also worked with the mentally disabled, including many with behavior problems. One in particular was sexually aggressive and had a history of attaching to a preferred staff, and I became the preferred staff for a long stretch. She was not simply allowed to act like this. A program was in place to correct the behaviors. I'm very sorry this happened to you. I don't mean to insult your mom,but this was completely inappropriate.
So insightful. I lived with the sociopathic monster mom and the safer parent. The safer parent died when I was 22 and every therapist I've had shuts me down with "they did the best they could" when I discuss my frustration with the safer parent. I wish there was internet when I was trying to figure all this out bc I got remarkably crappy advice from every adult I turned to. All the advice was along the lines of downplaying the monster and making a hero out of the safer parent (especially bc they died when I was so young) so I found more monsters and downplayed their abuse and wasted my life looking for someone to rescue me. I gotta say, Catholic culture led me astray at every single point from the active abuse part to the "making meaning of it" part. Religion is a salvation for so many abuse survivors, and they have historically made things worse for abused children and adult survivors of abuse bc martyrdom, keeping families intact regardless of circumstances, and patriarchy. I am VERY grateful for the information you've shared in your videos, it has been a tremendous help.
Just to say I do understand where you are coming from. Particularly because I was brought up Catholic and was brainwashed into family unity being sacred. This made it impossible to confide in anyone, including my Parish Priest. The other thing is counsellors, particularly back in the day giving unhelpful or even hurtful advice, causing the burden of guilt and shame to be even more heaped up around our shoulders. Thank God I came back to the Lord as a non denominational Christian, after years of turning away. I'm still not 100% healed after the years of abuse and neglect but I am better, thank you Most High for that. Don't give up hope ever, I implore you. Remember also that ALL human beings are floored. I say this with love and pray that God will bless you, pour out His love for you and heal your life in His timing. 😘
I can relate. My mom was the safer parent. And even though I know she was loving and kind and is essentially the loving, kind part of me today, I have so much anger towards her that she married someone who abused me, emotionally, physically and sexually. A few years ago, in an argument about how her marriages to abusers have affected her children’s lives in adulthood (we all have mental illness, addiction issues, poor coping skills, etc) I said I just wanted her to apologize, and she sort of just scoffed at me. I’ll never forget it.
I grew up Catholic, and I know what you mean about how it praises and perpetuates martyrdom and makes it even harder to say you have value and you will not tolerate abuse. It makes it seem like that response is selfish, when it is self-preservation, which is completely different and necessary.
My mum is reactor (with a bit of method actor) and my dad is the "safer" one (also "I just work here"). She's always been super obsessed with being the best mother ever and eventually maintaining that fantasy required suppressing my reality. For so long I thought if I could help maintain her fantasy that she might show up in a real way. I cut her off last year and I know it was the right choice, but it was certainly the hardest decision I've ever had to go through with. Sometimes I regret it, but I know now that's my codependency trying to keep the "peace"
oh I know and they tell everyone they know the same story that they did for you as a child like over boiling your bath and making sure the water is 100 percent germ free so she thinks she's better than everyone and the best mother in the world therefore no one can disagree and her emotional and physical neglect is nonexistent because she cooked me food and gave me a clean bath when I was a few months old. I can't believe growing up I actually believe that bs, how did all the adults around not realise she is fucking delusional and crazy. The only way is to cut them of ( cos they are crazy too) They live in some made up fake reality where they are the victim and everyone else is the villain and they will always have stories to tell you why they are the best mother. Also just remembered she would always give me excruciating hot baths and make me stay until my face would turn red and only let me go when I would start having bad heart pains at age 4. She even took me to the doctor like how delusional are you. Ofcourse the doctor said I was "fine" so now she could continue to do this. She was so passive to everything my dad did. Honestly everyday was hell
oh my god samee. my mother was a bit of a child instead of the method actor tho. i'd explain to her calmy in specific ways how she hurt me but she'd get incredibly offended and react emotionally. she had a physically and emotionally abusive mum so her standarts for good parenting wasnt the best and she often compared our struggles a lot. for example ''i need to be the depressed one with how hard my life is, not you'' is what she tells me when i complain about my mental health. i was also parentified to the core and not only had to be my mum's therapist but raise my trouble maker brother too.
Hi Patrick. There is another I rarely see acknowledged, and that is when a child is simply ignored. I was born missing senses (all of smell and most of taste) and no one ever noticed. I finally began to understand it a bit in a high school science experiment, and mentioned it at the dinner table. Still no one ever thought I might need help or ever took me to a doctor. They simply ignored me. They weren't really mean, but carelessly oblivious. None of my sibs had those issues, and they had a fine time in the family. I just didn't speak, and no one noticed that either. I think I may be on the autism spectrum, but still no one knows.
Me, my husband, and my children are all on the spectrum, and at least one of my children is non-verbal. With my youngest it's too early to tell, but he is delayed. It is definitely possible that you may be on the spectrum, or at the very least, have some sensory processing issues. Look up an article online about the 8 senses. It might give you an introduction. It's possible to be either overly sensitive or under sensitive in any sensory area. If you think you could benefit from certain therapies, maybe look into trying to get a diagnosis for yourself? Unfortunately this isn't always feasible.
No one noticed that I needed glasses, all through my childhood. I just squinted my way into my early twenties before my older sister took me to an eye doctor because it was that obvious I was SO nearsighted. I just didnt feel like the world would believe that I deserved glasses
What I really dislike is when people use "you need some therapy" for daring to expose the abuse they did to you. They don't actually mean "you need some therapy" it's more like a one up you, like calling you crazy but not calling you crazy... depending on the tone, it can even mean a "f-U" but they definitely don't really mean you need therapy, because then that would mean that you would have to speak about them and all their abuse in therapy. They cause shame in those of us they hurt, when they use the "get some therapy" line.... even though they're the ones that need that therapy the most. They're the ones going around causing so many other innocent people to need therapy.
Once I had a panic attack and didn’t know what was happening, but it was bad and I didn’t want to scare my kids or stress even more because I was clearly struggling to breathe and I needed to be alone. The kids and I were at my mother’s house and when I asked her to please take the kids out somewhere, the look of horror she gave me, as if to say “What is WRONG with you?” And made a huge fuss about getting my children away from me. Taking them out on the spur of the moment was never something she had an issue with, she loved it, that is until I was dealing with something she found repulsive. It was as if I was still the “difficult” teenager, she yelled at or treated with silence for days. The shame of my children seeing that still makes me furious!
My mom said that my wife and I needed therapy when we decided not to let her move onto our property because of her past behavior. It makes sense bc it was her way of saying "FU" to us for not getting her way. And she always says that, " You hurt me to the core" like we're doing something so extremely awful by setting boundaries and making informed decisions.
Totally agree with this. We are told we need therapy after suffering toxic trauma. My mother is a cross between 1-3, my father is 4. Waited 1.5 years for state therapy and in just 3 sessions she has triggered me three times. Therapy needs to be upgraded to help people, not further pathologies them. Listening to dr carter dr ramani and Patrick has helped me far more in understanding and healing. It's a long hard road. We don't need people pointing the finger when we are doing the work ✌✊
My dad was a mix of reactor/ monster/ child and my mom was the safer one/ ‘just working here.’ I become so enraged when I see any injustice. It’s a lot harder to heal from her lack of caring than my dad’s outright abuse.
I’m 30-something but I always think of the scene in AdventureTime when Finn’s trying to return the Jiggler to his mom and he screams “mama _loves_ baby!!” because she keeps flailing and spitting baby Jiggler back out of the nest. My mama didn’t love her baby.
Very much processing my feelings about my “safer” parent right now. Thanks for this. Very validating to hear that this type is perhaps the most difficult one to process
Oh, when I was about 25 I realized my safer mother was more toxic than my physically and mentally abusive father. I remember starting at age 12 I would beg her to leave him and tell her I would live underneath the bridge and get a job if she would just leave him. No she would rather stay. She would tell us since we were kids she was going to get his money after he died. Sure enough she put us through hell so that she could get his millions when he died. Now she tries to use money to buy us. Fu you messed up the rest of my life and you think you can pay me off now? No contact for over 25 years
100%, I'm realizing my Dad was the "safer parent." And my golden child sister, who was enmeshed with my reactor/monster mother, is the method actor -- she is *literally* an actress, playwright and director -- and has just turned the entire family against me! It was my mother's failed dream. She is just a false self.
@@kathysue9890 I have a similar story - my adoptive dad was an alcoholic/bipolar and from late teens, I used to try and encourage my adoptive mother to leave him, but she never would. One of her reasons was that she didn’t want to split assets with him. Nowhere near millions but it’s the principle of the thing. He died two years ago after having an accident. A-mum knows how I felt about him, yet still tried to offer me things he owned to remember him by. I didn’t even keep the order of service from his funeral - it quietly went in the recycling bin at the first opportunity.
When you watch these videos, don't forget to examine yourself and where you might be showing up like this with your own children. I have a lot of trauma from my childhood but I know that being in survival mode I probably passed a lot of it on already so I am doing the work to fix it and move forward. ❤
My trigger around responsibility always fires when I watch your videos because I never managed to find any therapist or counsellor even come close to your level of helpfulness in navigating childhood trauma, instead I've found those therapists to resemble The Safer One a whole lot. "Maybe your criminally insane family did the best they could?" SMH Thanks for your work.
I’m so tired of hearing ‘they did the best they could’. It leaves the adult child feeling as though there should be no accountability of the parents. And the cycle continues.
@@Laurie-kz1uw And it's also such a cop-out lie in so many ways. Like, let's compare it to time-sensitive assignments. Some people will put time and care and effort into those from the start and so their results will be awesome. Other people will push them off until the eleventh hour and then have to rush through the entire process to provide a sub-par result in the end. Did that second group do all they could and maybe even accomplish some impressive stuff, given the tiny amount of time they had? Sure, but _they_ are the ones who caused that time-crunch in the first place. There was no reason to push things off for that long and no reason to rush through it all and no reason to ignore the assignment until everything had reached that bad of a situation. All of that was completely unnecessary and self-imposed. The same goes for bad parents. They could've done more, like researched how to raise a kid right or done some self-reflection to become better people. They just decided not to. And the result was that any time we spent exposed to them was miserable for us as their kids, in ways we sometimes can't even put a finger on.
How do you stop, if you see yourself in these toxic types? As a single mother of a lot of kids, working 3 jobs. I can’t do therapy. I’m trying to keep our house and buy groceries. Literally not a dime left at the end of the payday. Do you have any videos for toxic parents? Because I truly love my children with every ounce of my being. They are my number one priority. However, I am looking very reactive and childish.
That feeling when you are convinced Patrick had cameras in your childhood home! Creepy how accurately he describes my parents! Very helpful video. Thanks Patrick!
I wish somebody would start pointing out how financial hardship often doesn't let the mother have the option to leave and if they do they become an absent overworked single parent without any tools to protect the child from the main abuser because of the awful court system. I had a female judge yelling at me if she heard the word safe one more time, she was going to puke. My 16-year-old son was ordered to see his abusive father and became suicidal. I got "punished" financially by the judge and ended up taking a loan to keep my son alive and safe. I was called codependent by a therapist because I was managing the family situation for 10 years, knowing that it would just get worse. If single parents would get more support, especially financial from the government and the community, we would have less trauma. I love your channel but the trauma of financial hardship is rarely mentioned. It might seem like a choice.
My mother was the Reactor and the Safer One. I'm still triggered when anyone has a negative emotion, and it's taken me 40 years to see she's not emotionally safe at all. My father was the I Just Work Here parent who repeatedly abandoned us and never showed up as promised. I'm triggered when I feel left out. Thank you so much for your work, Patrick! I'm going to watch your Unfinished Business video next.
Its hard when you feel like one doesnt care at all and the other "safer" one cares too much/is unstable... You always have more time to heal! And i wish you a lot of even-keeled and truly safe people in your life 😊
It took me a long time to see my adoptive mother, while supportive in some ways, wasn’t a safe parent for me, either, growing up. Not even now in some ways, but I can deal with it a *little* easier since moved out and have more physical/emotional distance from her. My adoptive father was bipolar/alcoholic/narc and was like a black hole in the centre of the whole family.
@@ShintogaDeathAngel wow. so sad to see that even some people who jump through all the hoops to adopt a child are not emotionally prepared for it. So sorry that happened (or is still happening) to you!
Very helpful, as usual. Needy people really trigger me ... Probably because my mum was needy but I wasn't allowed to be. She is the child, the safer one, and a little bit of everything except the monster. Refused to take responsibility for anything ... So much more Will have to journal through this for sure. Thank you
Thankyou for pointing that out. My mother was soo needy but aloof and a monster covertly, behind the scenes setting me up for dads abuse and being very manipulative and vindictive. She admitted with justification (because of course it was my fault) that she had to 'knock me off my pedestal', she was jealous of me 🙄. But the needy thing matched with her other behaviours made me cringe at needy people and you just helped me join the dots.
I can kinda relate. I can be needy but I try hard to not be - and growing up, my feelings were often dismissed, but I was expected to deal with my parents’ emotions, especially a-mum, and put up with nasty insults from a school “friend” who got dropped off at our house in the mornings during middle school years. But god forbid I upset any other kids I was around.
Once I fought my dad because he got physical with me and this was an ongoing thing for years. This time I decided to do something about it and my motive was to protect myself, but also my mom who I really cared for and I thought she was a victim aswell. As you are mentioning in this video, she was the one that soothed me after my dad hit, grabbed, or choked me, but she didn’t do anything to stop this. Since I moved out at 18 (now 24) it seemed as though the tension between me and my parents was slowly disappearing and we could talk about the simple things in life without fighting. On some occations I tried to get to a deeper level conversation with them but they didn’t seem to care and I thought it was okay like this because at least there was no fighting. This year, they asked me and my gf to go with them on holiday and although I got anxiety of the thought I would be with them for a longer period I said yes to the invitation because I really want things to change. But unfortunately they showed their true nature again. I was sad but also happy that my gf was with me this time because now I feel like someone really understands what I’ve been struggling with this whole time. And the weird thing is, is that it looked like they pinpointed my gf this time. Now at a later age (24) I am realising thanks to your video that my mom was the “safer” one. She has dissapointed me because up to this point I thought that we had a connection in some way and she understood me. But, during the holiday there was a tension buildup where they would passively insult me and my gf and give us the silent treatment. I tried to start a rational normal convo but they instantly got very aggressive, especially my mom which really suprised me because my dad was the one that get very aggressive most of the time. What you said about the safer one becoming aggressive when the truth is presented to them is true and I can really relate to this. As my mom noticed that we wanted to clear the tension by talking about eachothers flaws she started screaming in our faces and harrassing my gf. Thank you for this video, I am beginning to see things more clearly now 🙏 Edit: posting this was like therapy to me
3 years doing the work and it wasn't clicking, I started watching these videos a few months ago and have been able to finally piece together and make sense of it all. Being validated in person was difficult, believing it and not being able to feel it was hard to explain. I had always felt validation was a pity play because of toxic shame. Hearing it from someone who'd never met or heard of me, yet knew everything was weird. For the first time, I actually listened without feeling attacked or getting defensive. Game changer.
1. The Reactor: Lots of shame & control issues (they are reacting to their past). Drama and chaos guide their actions. Key component: Makes a child's situation worse. The child walks on eggshells. 2. "I Just Work Here" Parent: The parent is removed from the needs of the child. Aloof. "You're on your own!" Neglecting children is a silent trauma. 3. "The Safer One" (the lesser of two evils). This parent may be soothing but puts the child in harms way. Teaches codependency and submission. 'Go along to get along'. They know about the abuse but do not take steps to remedy it. 4. The Monster: Delights in seeing the child suffer. They are malignant, sadistic, & duplicitous. They have turbulent relationships and are aggressive and bullying. Their mantra is "you OWE me!!" 5. The Method Actor: The toxic parent assumes another identity/character. Coping with their mediocrity by assuming a position of 'specialness'. Lots of cognitive dissonance. Indifferent, preoccupied. They are expert manipulators because they are manipulating their external environment. They immerse themselves in a 'new role' for a healthy sense of self. "Public persona vs. Private reality". 6. The Child: Profoundly 'stuck' on childhood behaviors, functioning. They have a primitive conflict style-- "Why are you being so mean to me?" Immature, magical thinking but "doing their best!!" 🙄. Limited personal relationships. Poor boundaries. "Should I divorce your father??" Poor modeling to children. Children are parentified in order to avoid shaming circumstances. These parents put their children in danger. OMG. I am super triggered right now. 😢
This video is eerily accurate. My father is very much "The Child" and whenever I would bring up abuse, he would say "you're harassing me". Me and my mother had to do everything for him like putting together a budget, and house hunting. He would also throw "tantrums", where he would get mad and walk away from arguments in the middle of it, just like a toddler! I definitely struggled with parentification and almost felt like I had to push him to do basic things that he should have done on his own. And he was certainly very "goofy" when not given expectations. Thank you so much for this!! ❤
My dad passed away a few months ago so now I am the new parent for my younger siblings. I am unprepared in so many ways and am guilty of many of the toxic activities you mentioned here, Patrick. I am very much a "I just work here" parent and would have never been aware of these extremely toxic traits without you sharing your wisdom. Thank you.
Hang in there. You are trying, here seeking therapy so I’m sure you are doing the best you can and more. Sometimes you have to accept things won’t be perfect, and just settle for good enough. I’m sure it will work out for you, just do what you have to.
Do cut yourself some slack too, even if it might be difficult at times. You were never meant to be their parent and you did not decide yourself to have kids just to end up treating them badly, so just in that beginning-aspect you are already not the same as the vast majority of the toxic parents this video applies to. You were pushed into this situation and so of course it will take some time for you to cope with it and master a skill that you couldn't have predicted you'd need right about now. I hope you get there and can in the end be an immensely positive influence on your little siblings' lives - after all, you're already on a good way there, with paying attention to your own mistakes and aiming to not repeat them in the future. It's more than many toxic parents will ever do, so that's something to take pride in. Here's to you and your siblings living the happiest life you all can and please feel hugged, because you deserve some hugs right now.
I had an alcoholic I Just Work Here dad and a Safer mother. So confusing because I was like my mom’s therapist /BFF for a long time until I realized that was also very abusive. It took me forever to realize that my mom just looked the other way and minimized all of the issues and used me to meet her needs. Thank you Patrick for breaking it all down!
Your story is the same as mine. I'm enmeshed with my mum. I struggle to detach from her. I feel she's part of me. I feel I need to look after her. She use to bad mouth my dad and how crap he was. She did that too all my siblings but I guess I was more sensitive and listened acted as her therapist. I now take on the role as therapist with people with friendly with but realized people don't a therapist friend. I can't have healthy friends just people I need to help. My dad and me don't really talk. He isn't an alcoholic but had a work addiction. His father was a violent alcoholic. But addictive to not engaging emotionally.
I was on my own and never had any guidance. I had to lead the way for them a lot and I was the youngest family member. I’m so glad I cut off from them.
My mom was a full reactor and full method actor, 1/2 monster, 1/3 child parent. My dad was an ijwh parent. The cause of my sheer agony, self loathing, shame, fatigue, confusion, depression, hopelessness, and rage I have felt my whole life is put to words. Thank you so much Patrick. I could never figure out what was happening b/c I was always (and still am) dissociating constantly. I thought it was simply my fate to suffer for my crimes of being born inferior and subhuman.
The safe parent was my dad- a loyal marine. He knew how to kill a person, but he was such a gentle giant 😢 My mother however, is the dragon mother of achievement and status. Think Joan Crawford in the film “Mommy Dearest.” Thank you, Patrick, for using the word “perpetrator.” It means a lot to me.🙏
The method actor, sociopath, cult leader who isn’t able to feel was my father. He used the church to look like he was such a great guy. If you expressed any emotion other than “happy”you were disowned verbally to the whole family. He was always putting us down and making fun of my mother. Even when she would cry. In fact he enjoyed it. Adding to that was my reactor mother who hit us kids with whatever she could find. Usually belts. She was extremely emotionally absent, always shaming, and never once did I hear I love you. She felt like giving us a home and food was enough.
All my life, my father stole the spotlight in terms of being the abusive parent since he was openly and extremely abusive, particularly physically -- which means, it kept me from recognizing my mother's abusive behaviour. All this time, grew up thinking it's normal for my mother to always fly off the handle at any perceived slight, including from strangers. That it's normal for her to always throw a girl-child tantrum, always shouting, slamming doors. Always making it so that *we* the children have to be the ones to calm her down. *We* having to be the parent. One of my memories is of a time when she got me mad about something, and though I was angry I was also trying to be non-confrontational and just be quiet and mind my own business. When she kept prodding and poking (something she always liked to do whenever she sensed one of us was upset, like she's tormenting us - and it's something that's REALLY pissed us off but we were always too young and brought up under her to even think we had a right to be angry), I eventually just quietly uttered "why don't you just leave me alone." So what did she do? She went quiet for a few seconds, walked away, then suddenly turned around and said in a loud, mocking, high-pitched whining voice "Why don't you just leeeave meeee aloooone?" You'd think that was bad enough on her part, but then immediately she started just angrily packing away the dishes extremely loudly and violently, clashing the ceramic angrily like she wanted to break them. Non-physical abuse, especially from women (no offense to them, obviously it's not all women), tends to live in a place between narcissism and social acceptance as we normally tend to be more forgiving to female actors of abuse, in fact even associating it with femininity in general. All this time, I didn't know that it was not normal, and not OK, that my mother always shrieked and screamed and slammed doors angrily and acted like a *little girl.* I thought it was normal and OK, because she's a woman and she's also been subjected to my father's abuse -- but the truth is I should have expected better of her just as I should have expected of my father.
'...we tend to be more forgiving to female actors of abuse...' Can I gently ask who is 'we' here? I think you may be using a man's sense of being the default gender here. I'm not so sure women are more forgiving of female actors. The reason I mention this is not to be picky or contrarian, but because you mentioned the gender divide yourself, and I thought you might be open to the idea, even if you don't agree. All the best to you x
@@nicolab2075 "We" being just society in general, I wasn't using men as being the default gender. Generally speaking, society is more lenient towards female actors of abuse (moreso in female-on-male abuse) compared to male actors of abuse (especially in male-on-female abuse). This is a very broad biologically-informed (and hence socially common) pressure, so it affects basically every level, from whether the act in question is to be called abuse, to whether it's even "a big deal," to whether the charges will be dismissed, to how the court of social opinion authentically regards the situation. But while I am saying it's a broad pressure, I'm speaking in averages and generality and not saying that it's the very same result on each level. For example of course in sexual abuse there are far more male-on-female cases than vice versa. But my original comment was talking about other forms of abuse (especially emotional which is harder to detect or even often not treated as abuse anyway). For me personally, I can go on about the abuse my father perpetrated on me including graphic stuff, but such forms of abuse (especially so perpetrated by males) is very common knowledge by now and pretty much unanimously condemned (although social shame of the victim continues to be a real issue too) - but I wanted to talk about the kind of thing that isn't so recognized and goes under the radar. For example yes my father was the direct abuser and he absolutely is the core reason why I'm set up for failure - but his mistress was/is standing there beside him, it's not like he's the only person contributing. She is more than happy to have had him redirect pretty much all his resources towards her instead, and manipulate him against me and my siblings/mother. Meanwhile as I am trying in every little way to rebuild myself and get help, I am finding that more often, I'm being treated coldly and with apathy by most women (including at the clinic which is completely female-staffed and female-owned, and this includes those who know of my history of being abused) whereas I'm being treated with more friendliness and a sort of awareness by most men (drivers, service workers etc).
One of the worst things about my parents "disciplining" me was that I became very sensitive to sudden movements, and I would flinch whenever my mother put her hands on me non-aggressively, and it absolutely infuriated her. Both my parents couldn't understand that it was an involuntary reaction because they never saw themselves as doing something wrong. And then, later in adulthood, they accused me of making up stories if I tried to bring up how they neglected me. She would always tell me I dreamt it up, and it fcked me up mentally so bad that I struggle to understand what memories are real. But I will never ever forget being punched and slapped.
My mom was a Method Actor & I Just Work Here. She's a huge narcissist who only really cares about being perceived as "good" and "helpful". I'm pretty sure she only had me because all her peers were having kids and it was the thing to do so she would be normal and get included in all the stuff her peers were doing. Edit: Nope, she's a Child with the other two. Her go to line is "What, I can't forget?"
I’m a 37 year old child of a mother with borderline personality disorder and I’m still in an enmeshed codependent relationship. She’s the child parent . My dad was the safer one. I had no idea why I was so passionate about injustice. Until now.
I accidentally made my sister burst into tears when we were talking about our bad childhoods 😬 we were bitching about how bad our mother was as usual and I just said "when dad would drive off when she was screaming like that, why didn't he bring us with him? He always left us with her." All of us had the issue with idolising him as the 'reasonable' parent. She hadn't realised until I pointed that out. My older siblings protected me far more than he ever did. I loved him, but he was the one who rationalised and normalised her abuse, and made me believe that she had exploded because of something I had done.
Both of my parents are a big ol mix of all of these. And my brother followed suit too. I haven't talked to them since May and I didn't invite them to my wedding in October. I'm a little sad but I'm mainly sad about how I don't even miss them. How can I not miss them?! That saddens me most. The ones I do miss are my Niblings but oh well. I'm so at peace with my new husband and pets. They're my family.
This is the first time I have heard anyone say the safer parent. This is very validating. The safer over appears to be so gentle. But they cause so much pain.
My mom is a combination of all of these while my dad is the safer one. The one that got me the most was the "I just work here" type. When I first got my period, my mom kept pestering me about how I should just try tampons cause they're so much better blah blah blah. A couple months later I did try them and she immediately turned into the "I just work here" parent. "How do I do it right?" "I don't know! Look it up! I don't know." ???? How could you NOT know? Thank god for UA-cam because she was not willing to give me any advice at all. I always thought this was weird--especially since it's something she could have easily helped me with--and I never knew how to verbalize this until now. She also turns into this parent whenever we ask how long we should heat something in the microwave (I only ask to get a second opinion), "I don't know! Why do you kids always ask me this like I'm some chef? I just guess." Like...it's not that deep but she always acts like it is or as if it's a bizarre thing to ask your mother.
My mother is The Safer One EXACTLY. Just this year my father cheated on her yet again and the same ole pattern played out. She was all gung ho about leaving and then they “talked” for like 3 days and suddenly everything was ok and us kids weren’t supposed to be upset anymore. I finally cut her off after that. 27 years of betrayal is enough.
I saw my mother in The reactor.. Especially in the variation that was said about infantilization.. that is very difficult.. let me do it for you.. and if I refused the help she would feel upset.. I didn't learn to do almost nothing because my mother wouldn't let me help her with household chores because she did it better and faster... and using help and trying to do something alone I think it was seen as not valuing her... so I learned to I do a lot of things only when I leave my parents' house.
I love your sign off. After nodding my head to many of the situations you describe, it’s like walking towards the fireplace and beginning to feel the heat when once you were burned. Your sign off reminds that I’m in the present, I’m an adult who can protect myself, speak up, and pursue healing and happiness. Thank you, thank you, thank you. ❤
I had a "safe" mother and let me tell you, she was anything but safe. I realized it years and years later, and I was astounded to hear you explain her so perfectly. She could be so nice and sweet and then turn around and tell everyone that wanted to hear how once I left my little brother (adopted golden child) at the pool to go use the bathroom, and she and my father both pushed me down on the floor and beat me when they found out. I was sixteen, and I don't think that was much of an accomplishment. It didn't even matter that my other cousin was there looking after him, and he was ten! You'd think a ten year old can swim by himself. I went no contact with her two years ago, my father died seven years ago, and the final nail in the coffin was her demented ass telling my niece that story with so much glee. So I said oh really, and what were you doing while your ten year old and his cousins were swimming. Tell us why we were banished outside? They were watching porn with my aunt and uncle. She went really pale and denied, denied, denied. Just like she always did. After that day I put her in a car and dropped her off at her favorite grandchild's house and said good bye, I'm moving 2000km away and I'll probably never see you again. Have a nice time. Oh, but she's your mother, how can you do that to her? She loves you.... bla bla bla, tag me in a Facebook post about how you should be glad you still have your mother. I'm free of her, but I'm still apologizing to my kids for thinking she could take care of them while I was at work, or sending them on vacation with their grandparents and aunt, because their dad and I couldn' t get vacation time and at least they'd see the ocean. The last time I let them go they returned and I got a lecture about how something was wrong with my then ten year old son, because he wouldn' t pee next to the road like all the other boys. I got a lecture about how my daughter, then nine was too overweight and i had to do something or she'd get fat. All my eldest at twelve did all day was build the deck, and they hardly ever saw the ocean. I had a hissy fit for the first time in my life! My little boy was painfully shy, and besides like their father my kids went to pee in a bathroom, not next to the road like homeless people. My daughter was the perfect weight for her age, and my eldest cried because he didn't have a vacation. They didn't go with them again, and I wish I'd gotten a babysitter, but there just wasn't money until much later. Damage done. I took Dr Teahan's test, and it confirmed that I had a severely toxic home environment; I just never realized I was good enough, or worthy enough to be treated better. To not be neglected. I am so messed up that I'm still worried my husband of thirty years doesn't love me! I asked him on our wedding day if he was sure he loved me and really wanted to marry me. He said don't be stupid, of course I do. I have to remind myself that my children love me, because they tell me they do whenever we talk; but it's so hard to believe that I'm worthy of it. Oh yes, I had a very safe parent.
Dad was a sadistic misogynistic bully to his girls. We were just servants who did housework. Mom was a malignant narcissist who absolutely hated me and put me down continually even about things I did well.
So my abandonment issues and extreme dislike for any sort of injustice is, in part, actually from my father choosing to not protect me and taking her side even when he heard me scream? That makes sense
When I was 3 (and I know I was 3, because at 4 we moved house) I hit my knee, and saw in shock how a thin line of blood started slowly running down my leg. I curbed the pain and the panic and made a strategic decision. I would grit my teeth and sneak up to the first floor to my grandma. There I would get a bandaid and a hug. If I went to my mother instead i would get a bandaid and yelled at and beaten for daring to damage her child. Mom was a reactor, violent, controlling based on fear. A toxic kind of love that misses all the kindness. Interestingly I started fighting back. I never fell for the "it's my own fault"-kind of trauma. I knew it was my mom who was weird from like the age of 6. I developed coping mechanisms, like dogding, hiding, evading, stealth. I kept an incredibly low profile at home. If something went wrong that I could not sweep under the rug, like a bad grade in school, I went to my father, the "safer one", for a signature. And I tried to limit it to him. My mother was an intelligent, dominant, manipulative and controlling person. She also used leaves out of the method acting book, if sheer aggression didn't work. But in my teenage years I went out of the stealth and started fighting back. More and more often I would use that growing amount of power I had, like my understanding of technology, to stand up to her. And it turned out, I was stronger in the end. We had ridiculous fights, like when I bought glasses for myself that she didn't like. We were not on speaking terms for weeks, because of it, but eventually - the glasses stayed and she had to accept them. I reagard myself lucky. I was terrified of my mother at times, even as an adult. But I got out with scratches and dents, not with a fullblown trauma. The biggest damage that I sustained is that I am constantly stuck on high alert mode. Always vigilant, everything could be a danger, always ready to strike and never ever can I allow myself a second of weakness, because deep down I know it will be punished. By whoever, the world, fate, bad luck...
My dad was the reactor and my mom was the "safer" one. I've watched decades of finger pointing without understanding. Now I do understand and I have exactly the distance I need. I don't feel the slightest bit guilty about leaving them wondering in silence for all the times I was told to "get over it".
Both of my parents were a combination of method actors and the child. They had six kids. They were “engaged” as parents but in a really out of touch way. When a real problem came along, one of the kids had to take over, but in a subtle enough way that their egos don’t get wounded. We really feel like we raised each other. My oldest sister (36) is still very enmeshed with them and always coaching them on how to parent better.
My dad was an emotionally absent parent. He often tunes me out, ignores me, neglects me dismisses me. My mom is unpredictable. Sometimes she's angry and full of rage, sometimes she is nice and gentle. Bipolar vibes. Both of my parents are very defensive and have very poor listening and communication skills. Yet they are still married 36 years in. I never felt seen or heard by either one of my parents. Which has led to a ton of resentment and rage. And avoidant tendencies. I am 31 and have never had a successful relationship with a man. I'm single and working on healing my wounds ❤
Thank you for your work. 🌈 I take small doses with your content, as it can cause reverberations after listening. Even with 10 years of therapy already. ~ Gratitude. You have a unique skill for verbalizing clearly, very helpful concepts. TY ~ another Oregonian
My Mom just out of nowhere divorced my Dad. Took on a whole new persona. She has taken on more religion and her new boyfriends persona. It is crazy how much as an adult that inner child still cries out. Now I'm working on trying not to be codependent with my child father. Thank you so much for your videos. They are such a great help.
Wow this is spot on. My narcissistic mother definitely checks the box for the "I just work here" parent lol! My codependent father was the "safer one," who I idealized but enabled the emotional neglect and abuse. I have spent the first three decades of my life disentangling this intergenerational trauma mess (including getting away from a narcissistic ex) just to find myself again. It was hard to accept that my parents could have unconsciously colluded in scapegoating me for all of their issues. They were trauma-bonded emotionally-orphaned immigrant parents and it breaks my heart that they tried their best but it still wasn't enough to raise me in a healthy way. Healing from C-PTSD and narcissistic abuse in my 30s...wish someone was there to guide me when I was younger because the colonial patriarchal nuclear family unit was like a secret torture chamber.
Mine was a Reactor and Bully, with a lot of "control" too. He used yelling. screaming, cornering, and heavy hitting. He demanded absolute perfection in everything - nothing was good enough. Losing a fight at school (grade school) meant more punishment for losing. ALL money was tightly controlled. He controlled all the money - even our mother, his WIFE - had to ask for money. There was no budget or allowance, you had to go to "his majesty" and ask. After he passed, we found out he had small bank accounts hidden all over the city, I know there are some we never found. When I got big enough and strong enough, I returned anger for anger. That worked.
Im a first generation eldest daughter aka "why do you go to school if you dont know how to fill out my forms?" Interesting how the child archetype doesnt know how to do ish until theyre giving you the silent treatment and they have to do it on their own. My mother was also big on "talk to your sister. She doesnt listen to me" growing up. Ugh
I came to the comments to see if anyone else had a parent who was more than one of these too. I'm so glad I found your channel. It makes me feel like I wasn't crazy and the things done were not okay!
Dysfunction is rarely a solo play. I find it is most common to see 2+ major types of dysfunction and it causes compounding problems for those near ground zero. You're in good company, friend.
This was painfully accurate. My alcoholic dad was reactive, freaking out over every little thing. My mom was the "safer" one, comforting me afterwards but never doing anything. Fantastic video
vor 1 Sekunde I had the Reactor and the Safe parent. I finally also went no contact with the latter And experience A LOT of guilt. Hearing you say it helped me to better grasp that he should have protected me! Not just not harm me.
My reactive and just my job parent was my safe parent. An incident when I was 9 showed me he wasn't on my side. He wasn't safe. I wish I detached from him then, the way I already had with my high spectrum overt NPD mother. I'm having such a hard time getting this mess straightened out emotionally. He broke my heart back then, and it's still broken.
My mom was a big reactor (the sad/guilt kind), but mostly only with me in my experience. I suppose she might've been like that with my grandma, but I paid less attention then because I didn't become "in charge" of her emotionally until after Gams died. After that, the parentification became full time (at 11). When I was sexually assaulted at 13 in the home by a family member, I didn't tell my mom because I knew the upheaval it would cause and, inevitably, that I would have to repair and console her. She was never diagnosed, but I'm sure she was a borderline. As you mentioned, she had a history of trauma and loss. When I opened up to her later in life about my BPD and Bipolar 2 dxs as well as my cutting, she only cared about what she must've done wrong. I definitely think she falls under the child parent category as well, although she was pretty high functioning for the most part. Dinner was almost always made, laundry done, bills paid, etc. The problem was emotional. She was also quite a method actor at being the life of the party. Now I don't know if this just seemed false because she was struggling with mental illness so she only put on the front with everyone else or if it was always her personality and mental illness had just eventually caused it to be too difficult to maintain all the time, but either way... everyone I know loved my mom, it was impossible not to. She was like the sun. But when she got home, the sun quickly set.
Woahh… my mother is ”the safer one” and when you said the child can feel immense guilt for them but the prent don’t have same feeling of guilt for the child, I was mind blown!
It's interesting to see how my sisters also picked up a lot of our parents habits with their own kids. They might be better in some angles but still toxic in others
I’ve noticed the same in mine and looking back at my own parenting journey I realized I was the reactive parent as I was so mired in the trauma of marrying an addicted alcoholic husband from his own dysfunctional family. The difference between me and my sisters however is while my kids were still at home I started therapy and my now adult children have been apologized to and know that I am working hard everyday to heal all the trauma of the past. I wish my sisters would join me on this journey so they can protect their children.
@@dnk4559My siblings didn't have kids and I only had one. None of us are with partners, we are all in our 50s. Our childhood was bad and it shows. But we are all pretty close and support each other in this. But it's really hit home with Patricks video's. It's hard hitting but freeing and validating in some way also.
I'm taking inventory on how I was as a parent. I was somewhat "safe parent" afraid to stand up to some stuff their dad did, because I believed he loved them and would leave me. I also was partial method acting, pretending to be a good parent, but missing the point how often I was trauma responding and disappearing emotionally. I relate the most to the child parent. It's hard to grow up, and I am really working hard on it. Some parts of me are mature, but other parts of me are very immature. I believe a lot of it has to do with autism, and also trauma I experienced growing up (both at home and at school/public) as well as in marriage/divorce. realizing these things is helpful, forgiving my parents crucial, and taking responsibility for my mistakes with my kids absolutely necessary.
I feel like I have met every one of these people, some of them in casual encounters, some in parents, some in friendships, and some in employers. I don't know if that is a genuine onservation or if watching this has me connecting dots that ought not be connected.
that example of ''the brownies have to be perfect at the sale'' kinda hit me, my family is a lot like this, every littlest thing has to have the highest stakes and stirr up immense ammounts of rage and chaos on every step of the way. It's a bit affecting to me to even to realize that i learned that way of seeing the world, just not with outwards rage but an internally directed version of it. In my therapy there's a lot of efforts directed to expanding the world beyond these petty squabbles, to see that it isn't the end of the world that family member #5 is raging that the door is squeaking, let them rage and wallow in their own little pond of misery. I love and feel immensely validated that you touched on this subject
I really liked what you say about "nailing your triggers." I have triggers from childhood trauma and I am starting to nail some of those bastard triggers. :_)
2 child parents: Mother did all the household, daily task responsibility things, but with an immature and naive way of understanding the world. That parent was emotionally weak and could not develop a mature emotionally supportive role, but still relying on her own parents for financial support and stability and help with childcare despite being a "housewife" herself. The grandparents had to pick up the slack for the overgrown irresponsible adolescent husband. My fattherwas an overgrown sibling style bully who played with us but in a class clown way, and could not be relied upon, teasing and suddenly going from playmate to angry and negating punitive grownup, He was selfish and very manipulative, teasing, bullying, taking things for himself that were meant to be shared, etc. He did not have an adult sense of responsibility for support of the family or proper coparenting, more likely to cause squabbles and chaos, which mother had to try to straighten out by worrying, scolding, criticising and shaming him. "Ignore him" was her advice to us. And childish outrage and embarrassment about his behaviour. She constantly berated and dumped her feelings about him on us children.
Love the nuance of “they were always early to things” My mother is early to every appointment. She will also ask for a ride somewhere and text/call me 30min before to see where I am, as if I’m supposed to be early. Worst part is, when she shows up early she expects everyone to cater to her. God forbid she has to wait in a line or in a waiting room. It’s so embarrassing.
My mother was a total reactor and she behaved exactly as you said. She never comforted me the way other parents did to their children. You have been amazingly accurate, including down to concerns as to what we were wearing. I have only just started wearing pink flowery outfits after years of enormous arguments with her. I find NOONE comforts me now. Yes NEEDS DO get me into trouble, even today. But with me, I find those that at least TRY to comfort really does help. Makes me feel cared for for a change. Carry on the great work Patrick.
I used to watch videos like this to find out what kind of parents I had. Now I watch them to be careful I don't fall into becoming one. Often, I think its easy for those of us raised in severely traumatic households to slip into these behaviors and patterns without even realizing how bad we've become. I love my children deeply and I know I can harm and traumatize them more than anyone. I have to be careful and mindful at all times to do the least amount of damage possible. I think of how I want to be treated and remembered by them when their older... Its my deepest hope and wish that they always love me, we remain close, and they speak well of me. As well as any wrongs I couldn't correct or fix I can help them find ways not to do the same to their own children, if they decide to have any. Thank you for these videos. I'll keep watching. I'll keep reflecting. I'll keep learning. I'll keep changing.
Looking forward to this, I’m in the UK but I’ll be up to catch this or listen to it tomorrow. I find Patrick to be very informative and a massive help in my healing journey.
Maturity is realizing that I also possess some of these traits you described. Luckily my child is very young and this video is giving me awareness of this. I just want to be the best parent possible. I always get alot of insight watching your videos! You are a real one in a sea of gurus on UA-cam.
Patrick, thank you! Thank you so much for all the work you put into these. They are so full of info, metaphors, examples, and detailed explanations. All of it is super helpful, and extremely validating. And I know it took tons of time, energy, and work to get this into the great format you shared with us. We're all benefiting from your willingness to do this for us. Thank you. And hugs to all the child parts of you who might need it. 🤗
We know a Real one _ will the Real Therapist stand up. Thanks for caring work your provide for all of us terrified to go to abusive therapists _ there's no regulations around the profession _ it's like church _ full of helpy narcissists with Goldy Goldy complexes.
It's not becoming these same kinds of people that's so hard. I tell my kid that what has happened doesn't define her. She does. Not what I expect her to be. Not what her grandmother expects her to be. Not what her friends or her teachers or even her therapist expects her to be. She can look at everyone in her life and choose the good parts and reject the bad parts, and piece herself together just how she sees fit. I am painfully aware that my trauma has adversely affected my parenting. I let my daughter know it. When it's relevant, I tell her that this is not what great parenting looks like. I don't say that as an excuse for my parenting, rather to remind myself that I can also pick and choose between the behaviors of those in my past. I don't think my parenting will ever look the way I would like it to look. I have done leaps and bounds better than those who brought me up. Sadly, leaps and bounds aren't enough. But my daughter knows that I am aware of my faults, and I actively work on them. I admit when I'm wrong, and I apologize. Most importantly, in my opinion is that I have seen to it that she knows that even if I fail her in some way, she is not required to fail her children in the same way. It's hard, way hard to crawl out of the trauma cycle. I think that, just as it takes generations to perpetrate and perpetuate trauma, it takes generations to fully heal it as well. We all have to start somewhere.
This is well said. I feel the same. I wish there were a free course on how to parent well when you were never parented well. Single mom here. I think I did okay in the younger years, but as my daughter became a teen and started challenging me more and pulling away, I’ve been struggling to find a middle path between too authoritarian and too permissive. I want us to be closer again but don’t want to be the friend type of mom. I feel like I’m calm and rational and loving and understanding, because compared to how I was raised I am all those things and I work hard to be a better parent than I ever experienced as a child. She feels like I’m grumpy and unpredictable and not very interested in her life. Here’s to incremental positive change❤
Every time I watch your videos I am simultaneously amazed, thankful, saddened, shocked, and filled with rage all at once. I have to schedule time to watch them because everything you say hits the nail on the head so much, it’s overwhelming. but I will continue to watch because you have spoken more truth than anyone on this platform
My dad has traits of the "Reactor", "Monster", and "Method Actor" My mom is the definition of the "Safer One" And my Grandmother who helped raise me is the definition of the "Child" They've kept me co-dependent under constant threats even now (my late 20s). I genuinely hate the life they have given me; it feels like an absence of one-- like I'm slowly suffocating under the weight of being hated for being alive, but gaslit into believing they love me. Telling me I can "Do anything I want with my life", while actively conditioning me to never do anything for myself or seek work, then threatening me with kicking me out any time they don't agree with me. Screaming about how all my dreams are childish and not "reality", and escalating the conflict every time I try to walk away or present my case. There is no winning. They all throw me away the moment it's convenient, and spend the rest of their time insidiously convincing me to doubt myself, my ability to make it on my own, or that anyone is capable of helping or saving me. They purposely moved away from family, only invite over friends of theirs that agree with them, avoid ever making friends with neighbors, and convinced me that everyone in the "outside world" is more hateful than they are. I have no friends, and they've convinced me it's my fault.
Thank you for another great video. Each of my parents has a personality disorder. And, there was a frightening synergy between them. I couldn't admit to my young self that the two people I had to rely on were broken monsters. But, I recall first reading about antisocial personalities as a teen. It seemed incomprehensible. I was blown away by the concept that some people could have no empathy or even a conscience. And, I absolutely could not consciously consider that I lived with a couple of them. It took 20 years to realize that these deficiencies perfectly described my mom and dad. And, 40 years on, I am still working hard in therapy to heal my damaged inner child. Work such as yours helps immensely.
Just thinking of my father sometimes makes me angry. We grew up as three siblings. My oldest brother (who was still younger than me) became a drug addict and committed suicide. My other brother became a man-child without education or a job, just sitting home and playing video games and streaming. And eating. He is extremely obese, and often need support to be able to walk. I don't have an education or a job either. And no social life, no girlfriend, no family or anything. And our divorced parents behave like they are the victims, and wonder what they did to deserve such horrible children that has brought them so much shame. I can actually never remember a single positive or kind word from any of them, or see any of them show any kind of affection towards us or each other. And they are never had a real conversation with us, showed support, tried to understand or showed any interest in our life (except our mother, who is just nosy).
I think many of us had parents that often flipped between these types... i know that mine did. I believe the cognitive dissonance of never knowing the reaction my parents would have really contributed to my dissociation problems. I could never predict what was safe and it was always like picking the "lesser evil" over just receiving actual help and support. I could get the "i just work here" parent one hour and then a helicopter parent the next.
My "safer" parent was also the I just work here parent. He is now 93, has Alzheimers and is in a care home. I visit often and worry about him all the time. I am only lately realising the effect he has had on my romantic relationships - my mum was the critical, overbearing one so I overlooked my dad's enablement for years. Hmmm...
The film Coraline is exactly the combination you described at the end: "I just work here"/Child/Safer One dad and Monster mom. Highly recommend it to anyone interested in this topic.
My parents were both method actors, my mother particularly deliberately. No one in my family understands why I cut her off. Everyone saw her as the child, unable to handle the world around her. I experienced the monster, especially before I left. Insane to see how cold she could be. My dad was the IJWH and reactor on top of it (divorced) and the two households could not have been more different while equally disfunctional. Terrible to go between as a child, wouldn't recommend. I'm triggered by pretty much everything mentioned but working on it 😅
Looking forward to this! I started my healing journey and I sometimes wonder when I speak with my trauma therapist I don’t always hear what he says but rather what I think I hear. I am learning that is because therapy is emotional and learning from you here has been giving me an education and appealing to my analytical skills in a different way! Thank you
My father thought screaming at his kids and beating us with a belt would "whip us into shape". Instead we're all dysfunctional losers, two of whom are just as monstrous as he was.
Thats awful.Sorry. The fact that you have some awareness around it? Means there's always wiggle room for improving your wounds (I should say heal) This stuff is sooo complex. Was mostly neglected as a kid, and then gaslit to THIS day by my 84 year-old mom. It's almost comedy if it wasn't so damaging. I'm now without my right leg/kidneys from a terrible fent. poisoning. I can draw a straight line from my childhood to my addictions/ disturbances that led to me losing my leg
I had a mother like this. and a father who thinks all women are crazy. lol it's gonna take time to work these things out. good luck everyone!
I “only”got the actual belt a few times, but they are still some of my most traumatic memories. 30 years later and I’m STILL CRYING over the extreme pain and humiliation of being made to bare my behind to my parents as a teenager and take that belt.
I really do hate my parents for what they did to me.
same here with my birthgiver. she was the method acting monster. im 40 and i have no life to live.
I hear you. And up to this day, I can promise you this: my father will never, *ever* accept that he was responsible. In his mind? He did everything right. he was *always,* and *will always be,* "right."
When you realize your parents did it all on purpose to bring you down, and were persistent about it.
They’re psychotic. I’m convinced that for whatever reason, our parents, collectively, got off on our pain and fear.
Shit, at least we're not alone in it thanks to UA-cam.
On purpose but not primarily to hurt us. Primarily to protect themselves from whatever they are fearing at that moment. We are collateral essentially. ❤
@@Jbp-tbshthank you. I just read that, and said wtf! Well said. Thank you
😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮
I was sexually assaulted in high school & never told my parents because I knew they'd blame me
I'm very sorry 😢.
I'm sorry.
I didn't tell my dad because I thought he might kill the guy and end up in prison.
My mom is the Reactor. She could scream, get angry, say and do what she wanted - but I wasn't allowed to be emotional, I wasn't allowed that same luxury. My dad would be considered the Safe One I think. He never overtly did anything to me, however he left me with my mother after they got divorced. I really feel like he didn't fight for me or protect me in the way I needed him to.
Yeah. My mom was pretty much the same. She had one set of expectations for her that were the bare minimum for an adult (not even) but my sister and I were expected to be fully independent before I was in second grade. I realize you are mad at your dad but maybe there is more to the story. My parents divorced in the 80's so my mom got us but if she divorced now a days he would have gotten us.
It's rather surreal to point out that they're doing something abusive only for them to do it again, completely unaware that they're doing it. This happened three times in a row the day before last: she told me I was angry when I was pointing out her cognitive distortions, to which I calmly told her I wasn't angry and that policing my demeanor like that was an attempt to manipulate me and derail the conversation. She cried after calling me angry and emotional several times and failing to provoke that reaction from me. Is this healing?
Your dad would know that the family courts would put you with your mother as long as that was what she wanted. He may have only stayed in a bad relationship as long as he did because it was the only way to stay with you. Have you maintained a relationship with your dad? Dads often don't have any choice in these things. I don't know your circumstances but this is often the case. You will never see this from your mother's accounts.
I had the same situation with my mom. I wasn't allowed to be emotional, but she was free to throw temper tantrums.
@@DonnieBrook69YES. this is MASSIVE PROGRESS healing. I am so impressed and proud of you!!! Wow
My stomach rolled the entire time watching this video. I witnessed my mother change personas based on her audience. With me, she was the reactor. Always screaming or sighing when I had needs. She tolf stories about the abuse and laughed. (Anytime you were hurt, you hid from me and it drove me nuts!) To my other siblings, she was the child and them, her flying monkeys. To the neighborhood, she was the method actor: selfless, giving and sweet. At her funeral, I listened to the stories my siblings shared and I was shocked and saddened. Hearing those stories, I couldn't hide from how much contempt and hatred she held for me.
Wow I resonated with this. You are not alone. Thank you for sharing.
I am in the absolute same position. Im struggeling with not becoming a method actor parent and completely absorbing myself in a mother role. I just want my daughter to have everything I didn't
I was about to ask can a parent have more than one archetype..but then I read the first comment!
@alexandraonai8187 I believe the method actor, when used in a healthy way, can be compared to the emergence of self that occurs during adolescence. You try on different "hats" and take away what feels genuine or helpful. As childhood trauma survivors, we missed those appropriate developmental windows. It took me several years to develop my own personality and become comfortable in my own skin. The fact you are aware and intentionally working to provide your daughter a different experience means you're already in a better place. Prayers for your journey in creating your best self. ❤️
@carriey1012 thank you validating my experience and hope you're healing and taking care of your beautiful inner child 💕
My issues with limerence and emotional dis-regulation come from my "I just work here" dad. He was totally emotionally absent when I was growing up and never took any interest in me. With hindsight I realized my perfectionism as an adolescent was an attempt to (finally) earn my dad's approval and interest by finally becoming "good enough". That paradigm hurt my ability to connect with people in a healthy way more than I realized at the time. It's been really hard to try to course correct in my late 30's but I'm working on it.
I experienced a lot of similar things to what you describe. Definitely perfectionism and never-good-enough-ness. Performance reviews are a terrible time for me.
i can related, except im in my 40s. I get pissed thinking about how much time I lost
@@babyshoozI'm 56 and over weight and just been diagnosed and even though I knew my childhood was bad, I did not understand until lately just how much it effected me. I understand how you feel. 😐.
I also had an emotionally absent dad ...felt like I did not matter
Agree 💯. I'm 53 and still working this all out. The never good-enoughness is a horrible burden. My "Safer one" mom died right after retirement and now I'm the point person for my "I just work here" father's elder care. Luckily I live across the country now and only have to deal with it by phone. But it's been a lot, with early dementia, schizophrenic episodes, police arrests, hospitals, emergency treatment facilities, nursing homes, etc. It's all keenly painful, horrible, and laughable.
I never saw some of my issues as a parent until I started to work on my own complex trauma and now I feel so guilty that I was a lousy parent. Generational trauma sucks!!
I think this is an extremely difficult thing to deal with, and frankly a huge reason that a lot people will never put in the work (it's too difficult to face one's own short-comings with clear eyes).
If you're still in contact with your kids, even if they are adults, having some conversations and letting them know what you regret and now wish you had done differently can go a long way. It is so hard to reparent ourselves. Even as adults, I'm sure your children would appreciate you helping them with that work, if your current relationship allows for it.
When my mom apologized to me it meant so much to me. Maybe try apologizing to them?
@@jadelinny We are just starting to have discussions surrounding the trauma that has passed from one generation to another and I have apologized a lot. We have a lot of ground to cover and I have a lot of making up to do. My kids thankfully don’t hate me. We are a work in progress though and I’m thankful that they are open to talk about everything. 💕🙏🏼
@@melissasmuse I have. Profusely. Thanks! 🙏🏼 😊
@@jwiki1 That's lovely to hear, that you guys are starting to work toward healing together. I wish you all the best!
Just finding out about “The Safer” one was enormous. I have felt so guilty for finally starting to face how betrayed and unprotected I felt with my mother. It has taken me years to take her off the pedestal I had her on. Partially, I put her up there to keep her safe from The Monster. It is a really confusing archetype. Lots of guilt.
you start to feel even more guilty when the safer one begs over the years that you never leave, but getting away from the monster is the safest choice
Yeah its very sickening! Took me years to figure it out. One day they're telling you what a dirty s.o.b. your dad is and the next day they're taking his side and knifing you in the back. The safer one is so manipulating it's hard to see what's really going on as you're growing up in it. 😡
I felt such a strange cold floaty feeling when you started describing the monster’s fixation on one child…I’ve never really been able to explain that before. Thank you so much for this!
My stepdad (since I was 2,) was always way more “monstery” with me than my younger brother (his biological son) and when I was young, I rationalized that he was meaner to me because I wasn’t his child.
@@crystalw8050 I’m so sorry you had to deal with that! I bet you were such a sweet kid and I wish things had been better for you 💕 my father was a really weird mix of mean and explosive but then also…kind of clingy and intense with me in a way adults aren’t (usually) with kids? To this day I’m still pretty confused about what he was, everything’s kind of blurry and hard to process
That strange cold floaty feeling is probably dissociation. That's the feeling I get when I hear something uncomfortably familiar to some incident from my past.
@@kathrynparke1711this is what I was going to say. Yes, sounds like dissociation.
That strange cold floaty feeling is dissociation. I would do that when my mother went over the top.
I always thought my mother was stuck in a very immature state. But hearing this descriptions, she is both a monster and a child parent...
Kinda wild how like 30 seconds into the video he is already talking about my family. These archetypes must be pretty wide spread and/or common.
I feel that. My mom is a reactor and my dad is a I just work here 😢
@@adriennebrown1040I think both of my parents and my uncle were actually each a bit of a couple of these
Both my parents are reactors. I spent my childhood and most of my adult years thinking I was the only one bad enough to make my parents mad all the time. It's amazing to find out how many other people were living the exact same childhood like the parents were reading from a script. I can't even give them credit for originality lol.
I suspect the type I grew up with is the super common pairing. I wouldn't ship it though. The monster father and the safer one mother. Father was always just a monster to me. Safer one mother stayed with him through prison. My mind is still all wrapped up in it even though we are estranged.
@@Purplesquirrels that sounds really scary and emotionally damaging and just plain sad, stranger. I really hope you find peace from that. Dr. Gabor Mate says the trauma is not what happened to you, it's the psychological wounds that haven't healed yet. Everyone can heal though.
Patrick, you mentioned hoarder parents as an example of the Child archetype and that struck a nerve in me. Would you consider making a video specifically exploring the trauma experienced by children of hoarders? For context, I grew up in my mom's hoarding situation. Though I moved out long ago and keep a reasonably tidy home, I am still haunted by the mess. I struggle to occupy and control my own space now that I don't have to make myself small enough to fit next to her garbage. I sometimes feel apprehensive I'll get into trouble while throwing out my own belongings. I don't know how to receive guests because I wasn't allowed to have friends in the house. We hid whenever the doorbell rang. How do I heal the betrayal, shame, and disgust?
I second this request, as hoarding is generational in my family, particularly on my dad's side. I struggle having people over for similar reasons to yours, and I can't purchase new clothes, even though I want and can afford to improve my wardrobe, because I was always told I had too many. I didn't, there just was never space next to all the junk my parents kept around. I get fixated on keeping things tidy, but also can't keep up with chores sometimes due to a combination of executive dysfunction and trauma responses.
Ditto. I’d love to see one specifically about hoarder parents or having a nasty house as a kid where no one was allowed to come in.
@patrick Yes, I also vote for a video on this!
for real, i was never allowed to have friends over because of the state of the house and that they didnt want to have to have other peoplpe in the house and while i keep my own space relatively tidy now (i still kinda have a mess issue sometimes) and have brought people over regardless it is so crazy the difference in my mental health when i actively engineer my spaces not just for me but for others comfort. the house has always been something we've fought against but it really does feel good to bring others into your safe spaces my friends sitting on my bed makes me so happy. not being able to have people over also created conflict around always being driven to see friends with any frequency and it was always dissonant to hear my parents talk about gas money and the time it took to pick me up but when i ask if they could come over it was always an absolute no because of the effort it would take not to get my room clean, but the rest of the house clean. WHILE ALSO TELLING ME I SHOULD HAVE MORE FRIENDS AND MAKE MORE FRIENDS "why dont you hang out with your friends you need to get outside"
I suffered from hoarding in both parents (one who was a psychologist!) I would love to see a video on this.
Thank you for all you do, Patrick. I love your approach.
My mom has always been a child. She’s also a narcissist. I was extremely parentified as a kid and I never want to have a child of my own because of this. I’ve been no contact with her for over a year and it has been the best decision I’ve ever made. Some people have kids when they shouldn’t have.
No child of my own. Would never want to put anyone through a shadow of any part of what I went through.
So true...I told my mother about my divorce decision..she became immediately very agitated, stating my husband could kill the children and himself. When my father died, she rang me up threatening suicide. After his death, she could not live with the peace of not having to cope with the financial and violent chaos anymore. She started creating more trouble between her children, being nasty to my ex husband who had always been very kind to her, creating scenes in shops . 6 years no contact. Bliss
Awful. Super sad. I'm so sorry
Do you think she projected your father on to your ex?
Not that, that makes it acceptable or excuses it.
I’m sorry 😞!
I feel your pain my Mom when she was raising us was absolutely crazy and made horrible decisions and I grew up in total dysfunction and fear it’s so weird how you think your alone but we are here now sharing our trauma together 😢!
Pat, you are totally giving back! 😍👍
@@orielwiggins2225 96 and still causing trouble. The devil takes care of his own!
Congratulations for doing the right thing. Stay away. This is the best thing you could’ve ever done for your life. You will have no regrets. Let others be stuck being abused by parents their entire lives because it will never stop. I also made that decision. I now have a life.
My mother spent decades working with and helping to care for intellectually disabled people, and told me I wasn't allowed to say stop when I was being groped constantly by one of the kids she was caring for. Always put this great big thing out into the world about how important it was to treat the disabled with kindness and love, and everyone freaking loved her.
Of course, when my own disabilities gets in the way of what she wants, I'm a bad child for not leaving myself distraught for days to make her happy.
💞
No loving parent should be okay at all with their child getting groped constantly. That's not okay for adults to do that. Not okay for kids either.
🤮 so sorry you were put through that. Why do some mothers put the welfare or even just feelings of other kids above their own?
That was very bad, unprofessional,inappropriate, and abusive of her on all accounts. First of all for allowing ' anyone ' to do that to you. Also, to the disabled person by not working to correct the behavior. I'm sure they went on to act in this manner to others. I also worked with the mentally disabled, including many with behavior problems. One in particular was sexually aggressive and had a history of attaching to a preferred staff, and I became the preferred staff for a long stretch. She was not simply allowed to act like this. A program was in place to correct the behaviors. I'm very sorry this happened to you. I don't mean to insult your mom,but this was completely inappropriate.
I really hope you got the help you needed so you can heal
So insightful. I lived with the sociopathic monster mom and the safer parent. The safer parent died when I was 22 and every therapist I've had shuts me down with "they did the best they could" when I discuss my frustration with the safer parent. I wish there was internet when I was trying to figure all this out bc I got remarkably crappy advice from every adult I turned to. All the advice was along the lines of downplaying the monster and making a hero out of the safer parent (especially bc they died when I was so young) so I found more monsters and downplayed their abuse and wasted my life looking for someone to rescue me.
I gotta say, Catholic culture led me astray at every single point from the active abuse part to the "making meaning of it" part. Religion is a salvation for so many abuse survivors, and they have historically made things worse for abused children and adult survivors of abuse bc martyrdom, keeping families intact regardless of circumstances, and patriarchy. I am VERY grateful for the information you've shared in your videos, it has been a tremendous help.
Just to say I do understand where you are coming from. Particularly because I was brought up Catholic and was brainwashed into family unity being sacred. This made it impossible to confide in anyone, including my Parish Priest. The other thing is counsellors, particularly back in the day giving unhelpful or even hurtful advice, causing the burden of guilt and shame to be even more heaped up around our shoulders. Thank God I came back to the Lord as a non denominational Christian, after years of turning away. I'm still not 100% healed after the years of abuse and neglect but I am better, thank you Most High for that. Don't give up hope ever, I implore you. Remember also that ALL human beings are floored. I say this with love and pray that God will bless you, pour out His love for you and heal your life in His timing. 😘
I can relate. My mom was the safer parent. And even though I know she was loving and kind and is essentially the loving, kind part of me today, I have so much anger towards her that she married someone who abused me, emotionally, physically and sexually. A few years ago, in an argument about how her marriages to abusers have affected her children’s lives in adulthood (we all have mental illness, addiction issues, poor coping skills, etc) I said I just wanted her to apologize, and she sort of just scoffed at me. I’ll never forget it.
😢 Hugs
I grew up Catholic, and I know what you mean about how it praises and perpetuates martyrdom and makes it even harder to say you have value and you will not tolerate abuse. It makes it seem like that response is selfish, when it is self-preservation, which is completely different and necessary.
Lousy therapists really suck. And there are plenty of them. Finding a good therapist can be gold, and I hope you find one.
2 yrs and going strong of no contact with my parents. Both parents meet multiple archetypes. :/
This is brilliant. Thanks for using types rather than diagnoses-it’s direct, honest and very helpful / validating.
Yes, very validating and helpful!
My mum is reactor (with a bit of method actor) and my dad is the "safer" one (also "I just work here"). She's always been super obsessed with being the best mother ever and eventually maintaining that fantasy required suppressing my reality. For so long I thought if I could help maintain her fantasy that she might show up in a real way. I cut her off last year and I know it was the right choice, but it was certainly the hardest decision I've ever had to go through with. Sometimes I regret it, but I know now that's my codependency trying to keep the "peace"
Okay, maybe more than a little bit of method actor
I'm sorry, that's so so tough. It's just not right.
I thought you were one of my siblings for a bit there
oh I know and they tell everyone they know the same story that they did for you as a child like over boiling your bath and making sure the water is 100 percent germ free so she thinks she's better than everyone and the best mother in the world therefore no one can disagree and her emotional and physical neglect is nonexistent because she cooked me food and gave me a clean bath when I was a few months old. I can't believe growing up I actually believe that bs, how did all the adults around not realise she is fucking delusional and crazy. The only way is to cut them of ( cos they are crazy too) They live in some made up fake reality where they are the victim and everyone else is the villain and they will always have stories to tell you why they are the best mother. Also just remembered she would always give me excruciating hot baths and make me stay until my face would turn red and only let me go when I would start having bad heart pains at age 4. She even took me to the doctor like how delusional are you. Ofcourse the doctor said I was "fine" so now she could continue to do this. She was so passive to everything my dad did. Honestly everyday was hell
oh my god samee. my mother was a bit of a child instead of the method actor tho. i'd explain to her calmy in specific ways how she hurt me but she'd get incredibly offended and react emotionally. she had a physically and emotionally abusive mum so her standarts for good parenting wasnt the best and she often compared our struggles a lot. for example ''i need to be the depressed one with how hard my life is, not you'' is what she tells me when i complain about my mental health. i was also parentified to the core and not only had to be my mum's therapist but raise my trouble maker brother too.
Hi Patrick. There is another I rarely see acknowledged, and that is when a child is simply ignored. I was born missing senses (all of smell and most of taste) and no one ever noticed. I finally began to understand it a bit in a high school science experiment, and mentioned it at the dinner table. Still no one ever thought I might need help or ever took me to a doctor. They simply ignored me. They weren't really mean, but carelessly oblivious. None of my sibs had those issues, and they had a fine time in the family. I just didn't speak, and no one noticed that either. I think I may be on the autism spectrum, but still no one knows.
I’m so sorry, that sounds awful. I’m not sure if it resonates but it sounds like you’re describing the invisible child?
Me, my husband, and my children are all on the spectrum, and at least one of my children is non-verbal. With my youngest it's too early to tell, but he is delayed.
It is definitely possible that you may be on the spectrum, or at the very least, have some sensory processing issues. Look up an article online about the 8 senses. It might give you an introduction. It's possible to be either overly sensitive or under sensitive in any sensory area. If you think you could benefit from certain therapies, maybe look into trying to get a diagnosis for yourself? Unfortunately this isn't always feasible.
parents like that are exactly why chris-chan exit.
No one noticed that I needed glasses, all through my childhood. I just squinted my way into my early twenties before my older sister took me to an eye doctor because it was that obvious I was SO nearsighted. I just didnt feel like the world would believe that I deserved glasses
What I really dislike is when people use "you need some therapy" for daring to expose the abuse they did to you. They don't actually mean "you need some therapy" it's more like a one up you, like calling you crazy but not calling you crazy... depending on the tone, it can even mean a "f-U" but they definitely don't really mean you need therapy, because then that would mean that you would have to speak about them and all their abuse in therapy.
They cause shame in those of us they hurt, when they use the "get some therapy" line.... even though they're the ones that need that therapy the most. They're the ones going around causing so many other innocent people to need therapy.
Once I had a panic attack and didn’t know what was happening, but it was bad and I didn’t want to scare my kids or stress even more because I was clearly struggling to breathe and I needed to be alone. The kids and I were at my mother’s house and when I asked her to please take the kids out somewhere, the look of horror she gave me, as if to say “What is WRONG with you?” And made a huge fuss about getting my children away from me. Taking them out on the spur of the moment was never something she had an issue with, she loved it, that is until I was dealing with something she found repulsive. It was as if I was still the “difficult” teenager, she yelled at or treated with silence for days. The shame of my children seeing that still makes me furious!
@@Tamcginn ❤️
My mom said that my wife and I needed therapy when we decided not to let her move onto our property because of her past behavior. It makes sense bc it was her way of saying "FU" to us for not getting her way. And she always says that, " You hurt me to the core" like we're doing something so extremely awful by setting boundaries and making informed decisions.
@@daniellucas6831 ❤️
Totally agree with this. We are told we need therapy after suffering toxic trauma. My mother is a cross between 1-3, my father is 4. Waited 1.5 years for state therapy and in just 3 sessions she has triggered me three times. Therapy needs to be upgraded to help people, not further pathologies them. Listening to dr carter dr ramani and Patrick has helped me far more in understanding and healing. It's a long hard road. We don't need people pointing the finger when we are doing the work ✌✊
My dad was a mix of reactor/ monster/ child and my mom was the safer one/ ‘just working here.’
I become so enraged when I see any injustice. It’s a lot harder to heal from her lack of caring than my dad’s outright abuse.
exactly mine swell
@@elinaj3689 How do you keep from screaming? I can’t.
I’m 30-something but I always think of the scene in AdventureTime when Finn’s trying to return the Jiggler to his mom and he screams “mama _loves_ baby!!” because she keeps flailing and spitting baby Jiggler back out of the nest.
My mama didn’t love her baby.
who said that I do??. Well mostly I suppress it (codependency) and then lash out eventually. @@angry-lucky-catty
THIS. Same combination in my household growing up. It’s so hard to articulate to others!
Very much processing my feelings about my “safer” parent right now. Thanks for this. Very validating to hear that this type is perhaps the most difficult one to process
It really screws you up around trusting people
Oh, when I was about 25 I realized my safer mother was more toxic than my physically and mentally abusive father. I remember starting at age 12 I would beg her to leave him and tell her I would live underneath the bridge and get a job if she would just leave him. No she would rather stay. She would tell us since we were kids she was going to get his money after he died. Sure enough she put us through hell so that she could get his millions when he died. Now she tries to use money to buy us. Fu you messed up the rest of my life and you think you can pay me off now? No contact for over 25 years
100%, I'm realizing my Dad was the "safer parent." And my golden child sister, who was enmeshed with my reactor/monster mother, is the method actor -- she is *literally* an actress, playwright and director -- and has just turned the entire family against me! It was my mother's failed dream. She is just a false self.
@@kathysue9890 I have a similar story - my adoptive dad was an alcoholic/bipolar and from late teens, I used to try and encourage my adoptive mother to leave him, but she never would. One of her reasons was that she didn’t want to split assets with him. Nowhere near millions but it’s the principle of the thing.
He died two years ago after having an accident. A-mum knows how I felt about him, yet still tried to offer me things he owned to remember him by.
I didn’t even keep the order of service from his funeral - it quietly went in the recycling bin at the first opportunity.
@@jennw6809 Same 🖐️ Long-suffering martyr mom was way worse than violet angry dad...... where's the she bear we SHOULD have had?
When you watch these videos, don't forget to examine yourself and where you might be showing up like this with your own children. I have a lot of trauma from my childhood but I know that being in survival mode I probably passed a lot of it on already so I am doing the work to fix it and move forward. ❤
I'm not even a parent yet, but I can see how I'm starting to fall into these archetypes! Super scary
I can’t help but do that that’s why it makes these videos hard for me to watch. I feel like I’m all of these assholes sometimes.
Ok not all of them 😳
@@alyqat4 I feel like if you're here, you're doing better than a lot of people ♥️
@@rachelmel thank you friend. doing the inside work to the best of my ability 🩵🙏🏼
My trigger around responsibility always fires when I watch your videos because I never managed to find any therapist or counsellor even come close to your level of helpfulness in navigating childhood trauma, instead I've found those therapists to resemble The Safer One a whole lot.
"Maybe your criminally insane family did the best they could?" SMH
Thanks for your work.
My dad had a therapist friend who always said that. Couldn’t trust a therapist enough to see one because of her, till I found this channel, that is.
I’m so tired of hearing ‘they did the best they could’. It leaves the adult child feeling as though there should be no accountability of the parents. And the cycle continues.
@@Laurie-kz1uw And it's also such a cop-out lie in so many ways.
Like, let's compare it to time-sensitive assignments. Some people will put time and care and effort into those from the start and so their results will be awesome. Other people will push them off until the eleventh hour and then have to rush through the entire process to provide a sub-par result in the end.
Did that second group do all they could and maybe even accomplish some impressive stuff, given the tiny amount of time they had? Sure, but _they_ are the ones who caused that time-crunch in the first place.
There was no reason to push things off for that long and no reason to rush through it all and no reason to ignore the assignment until everything had reached that bad of a situation. All of that was completely unnecessary and self-imposed.
The same goes for bad parents. They could've done more, like researched how to raise a kid right or done some self-reflection to become better people. They just decided not to.
And the result was that any time we spent exposed to them was miserable for us as their kids, in ways we sometimes can't even put a finger on.
How do you stop, if you see yourself in these toxic types? As a single mother of a lot of kids, working 3 jobs. I can’t do therapy. I’m trying to keep our house and buy groceries. Literally not a dime left at the end of the payday. Do you have any videos for toxic parents? Because I truly love my children with every ounce of my being. They are my number one priority. However, I am looking very reactive and childish.
That feeling when you are convinced Patrick had cameras in your childhood home! Creepy how accurately he describes my parents! Very helpful video. Thanks Patrick!
The parent I feared truly loved me but did not know how. The other "good cop," covert narc, was the most destructive.
Ditto.
Yup.
This!
May I ask, in what ways?
I wish somebody would start pointing out how financial hardship often doesn't let the mother have the option to leave and if they do they become an absent overworked single parent without any tools to protect the child from the main abuser because of the awful court system. I had a female judge yelling at me if she heard the word safe one more time, she was going to puke. My 16-year-old son was ordered to see his abusive father and became suicidal. I got "punished" financially by the judge and ended up taking a loan to keep my son alive and safe. I was called codependent by a therapist because I was managing the family situation for 10 years, knowing that it would just get worse. If single parents would get more support, especially financial from the government and the community, we would have less trauma. I love your channel but the trauma of financial hardship is rarely mentioned. It might seem like a choice.
My mother was the Reactor and the Safer One. I'm still triggered when anyone has a negative emotion, and it's taken me 40 years to see she's not emotionally safe at all. My father was the I Just Work Here parent who repeatedly abandoned us and never showed up as promised. I'm triggered when I feel left out. Thank you so much for your work, Patrick! I'm going to watch your Unfinished Business video next.
Its hard when you feel like one doesnt care at all and the other "safer" one cares too much/is unstable... You always have more time to heal! And i wish you a lot of even-keeled and truly safe people in your life 😊
It took me a long time to see my adoptive mother, while supportive in some ways, wasn’t a safe parent for me, either, growing up. Not even now in some ways, but I can deal with it a *little* easier since moved out and have more physical/emotional distance from her. My adoptive father was bipolar/alcoholic/narc and was like a black hole in the centre of the whole family.
@@ShintogaDeathAngel wow. so sad to see that even some people who jump through all the hoops to adopt a child are not emotionally prepared for it. So sorry that happened (or is still happening) to you!
You just made me realize that I also feel triggered if I feel left- out. Interestingly, I have always felt like an outsider.
Very helpful, as usual. Needy people really trigger me ... Probably because my mum was needy but I wasn't allowed to be. She is the child, the safer one, and a little bit of everything except the monster. Refused to take responsibility for anything ... So much more
Will have to journal through this for sure. Thank you
Thankyou for pointing that out. My mother was soo needy but aloof and a monster covertly, behind the scenes setting me up for dads abuse and being very manipulative and vindictive. She admitted with justification (because of course it was my fault) that she had to 'knock me off my pedestal', she was jealous of me 🙄. But the needy thing matched with her other behaviours made me cringe at needy people and you just helped me join the dots.
I can kinda relate. I can be needy but I try hard to not be - and growing up, my feelings were often dismissed, but I was expected to deal with my parents’ emotions, especially a-mum, and put up with nasty insults from a school “friend” who got dropped off at our house in the mornings during middle school years. But god forbid I upset any other kids I was around.
Once I fought my dad because he got physical with me and this was an ongoing thing for years. This time I decided to do something about it and my motive was to protect myself, but also my mom who I really cared for and I thought she was a victim aswell.
As you are mentioning in this video, she was the one that soothed me after my dad hit, grabbed, or choked me, but she didn’t do anything to stop this.
Since I moved out at 18 (now 24) it seemed as though the tension between me and my parents was slowly disappearing and we could talk about the simple things in life without fighting. On some occations I tried to get to a deeper level conversation with them but they didn’t seem to care and I thought it was okay like this because at least there was no fighting.
This year, they asked me and my gf to go with them on holiday and although I got anxiety of the thought I would be with them for a longer period I said yes to the invitation because I really want things to change. But unfortunately they showed their true nature again. I was sad but also happy that my gf was with me this time because now I feel like someone really understands what I’ve been struggling with this whole time. And the weird thing is, is that it looked like they pinpointed my gf this time.
Now at a later age (24) I am realising thanks to your video that my mom was the “safer” one. She has dissapointed me because up to this point I thought that we had a connection in some way and she understood me. But, during the holiday there was a tension buildup where they would passively insult me and my gf and give us the silent treatment. I tried to start a rational normal convo but they instantly got very aggressive, especially my mom which really suprised me because my dad was the one that get very aggressive most of the time.
What you said about the safer one becoming aggressive when the truth is presented to them is true and I can really relate to this. As my mom noticed that we wanted to clear the tension by talking about eachothers flaws she started screaming in our faces and harrassing my gf. Thank you for this video, I am beginning to see things more clearly now 🙏
Edit: posting this was like therapy to me
3 years doing the work and it wasn't clicking, I started watching these videos a few months ago and have been able to finally piece together and make sense of it all. Being validated in person was difficult, believing it and not being able to feel it was hard to explain. I had always felt validation was a pity play because of toxic shame. Hearing it from someone who'd never met or heard of me, yet knew everything was weird. For the first time, I actually listened without feeling attacked or getting defensive. Game changer.
1. The Reactor: Lots of shame & control issues (they are reacting to their past). Drama and chaos guide their actions. Key component: Makes a child's situation worse. The child walks on eggshells.
2. "I Just Work Here" Parent: The parent is removed from the needs of the child. Aloof. "You're on your own!" Neglecting children is a silent trauma.
3. "The Safer One" (the lesser of two evils). This parent may be soothing but puts the child in harms way. Teaches codependency and submission. 'Go along to get along'. They know about the abuse but do not take steps to remedy it.
4. The Monster: Delights in seeing the child suffer. They are malignant, sadistic, & duplicitous. They have turbulent relationships and are aggressive and bullying. Their mantra is "you OWE me!!"
5. The Method Actor: The toxic parent assumes another identity/character. Coping with their mediocrity by assuming a position of 'specialness'. Lots of cognitive dissonance. Indifferent, preoccupied. They are expert manipulators because they are manipulating their external environment. They immerse themselves in a 'new role' for a healthy sense of self. "Public persona vs. Private reality".
6. The Child: Profoundly 'stuck' on childhood behaviors, functioning. They have a primitive conflict style-- "Why are you being so mean to me?" Immature, magical thinking but "doing their best!!" 🙄. Limited personal relationships. Poor boundaries. "Should I divorce your father??" Poor modeling to children. Children are parentified in order to avoid shaming circumstances. These parents put their children in danger.
OMG. I am super triggered right now. 😢
This video is eerily accurate. My father is very much "The Child" and whenever I would bring up abuse, he would say "you're harassing me". Me and my mother had to do everything for him like putting together a budget, and house hunting. He would also throw "tantrums", where he would get mad and walk away from arguments in the middle of it, just like a toddler! I definitely struggled with parentification and almost felt like I had to push him to do basic things that he should have done on his own. And he was certainly very "goofy" when not given expectations. Thank you so much for this!! ❤
My dad passed away a few months ago so now I am the new parent for my younger siblings. I am unprepared in so many ways and am guilty of many of the toxic activities you mentioned here, Patrick. I am very much a "I just work here" parent and would have never been aware of these extremely toxic traits without you sharing your wisdom. Thank you.
Hang in there. You are trying, here seeking therapy so I’m sure you are doing the best you can and more. Sometimes you have to accept things won’t be perfect, and just settle for good enough. I’m sure it will work out for you, just do what you have to.
That sounds incredibly tough and I’m sorry. It is good that you’re here, though, finding ways to help yourself.
Self awareness such as you show here is something missing in many (most?) toxic parents. I think you can be a good parent xxx
You have taken- on a responsibility that typically would not be yours. I hope you find the wisdom and strength you need.
Do cut yourself some slack too, even if it might be difficult at times.
You were never meant to be their parent and you did not decide yourself to have kids just to end up treating them badly, so just in that beginning-aspect you are already not the same as the vast majority of the toxic parents this video applies to. You were pushed into this situation and so of course it will take some time for you to cope with it and master a skill that you couldn't have predicted you'd need right about now.
I hope you get there and can in the end be an immensely positive influence on your little siblings' lives - after all, you're already on a good way there, with paying attention to your own mistakes and aiming to not repeat them in the future.
It's more than many toxic parents will ever do, so that's something to take pride in.
Here's to you and your siblings living the happiest life you all can and please feel hugged, because you deserve some hugs right now.
I had an alcoholic I Just Work Here dad and a Safer mother. So confusing because I was like my mom’s therapist /BFF for a long time until I realized that was also very abusive. It took me forever to realize that my mom just looked the other way and minimized all of the issues and used me to meet her needs. Thank you Patrick for breaking it all down!
Your story is the same as mine. I'm enmeshed with my mum. I struggle to detach from her. I feel she's part of me. I feel I need to look after her. She use to bad mouth my dad and how crap he was. She did that too all my siblings but I guess I was more sensitive and listened acted as her therapist. I now take on the role as therapist with people with friendly with but realized people don't a therapist friend. I can't have healthy friends just people I need to help. My dad and me don't really talk. He isn't an alcoholic but had a work addiction. His father was a violent alcoholic. But addictive to not engaging emotionally.
I am finally ready. Sending positivity to all. It’s not always easy but it’s always possible 💯💫👍
Good for you! Remember "I'm possible" there is no impossible ❤️! You got this friends!
Its so hard 😢😢
I was on my own and never had any guidance. I had to lead the way for them a lot and I was the youngest family member. I’m so glad I cut off from them.
Your situation (in some aspects) was similar to mine...
My mom was a full reactor and full method actor, 1/2 monster, 1/3 child parent. My dad was an ijwh parent. The cause of my sheer agony, self loathing, shame, fatigue, confusion, depression, hopelessness, and rage I have felt my whole life is put to words. Thank you so much Patrick. I could never figure out what was happening b/c I was always (and still am) dissociating constantly. I thought it was simply my fate to suffer for my crimes of being born inferior and subhuman.
The safe parent was my dad- a loyal marine. He knew how to kill a person, but he was such a gentle giant 😢
My mother however, is the dragon mother of achievement and status.
Think Joan Crawford in the film “Mommy Dearest.” Thank you, Patrick, for using the word “perpetrator.” It means a lot to me.🙏
The method actor, sociopath, cult leader who isn’t able to feel was my father. He used the church to look like he was such a great guy. If you expressed any emotion other than “happy”you were disowned verbally to the whole family. He was always putting us down and making fun of my mother. Even when she would cry. In fact he enjoyed it. Adding to that was my reactor mother who hit us kids with whatever she could find. Usually belts. She was extremely emotionally absent, always shaming, and never once did I hear I love you. She felt like giving us a home and food was enough.
All my life, my father stole the spotlight in terms of being the abusive parent since he was openly and extremely abusive, particularly physically -- which means, it kept me from recognizing my mother's abusive behaviour. All this time, grew up thinking it's normal for my mother to always fly off the handle at any perceived slight, including from strangers. That it's normal for her to always throw a girl-child tantrum, always shouting, slamming doors. Always making it so that *we* the children have to be the ones to calm her down. *We* having to be the parent.
One of my memories is of a time when she got me mad about something, and though I was angry I was also trying to be non-confrontational and just be quiet and mind my own business. When she kept prodding and poking (something she always liked to do whenever she sensed one of us was upset, like she's tormenting us - and it's something that's REALLY pissed us off but we were always too young and brought up under her to even think we had a right to be angry), I eventually just quietly uttered "why don't you just leave me alone." So what did she do? She went quiet for a few seconds, walked away, then suddenly turned around and said in a loud, mocking, high-pitched whining voice "Why don't you just leeeave meeee aloooone?" You'd think that was bad enough on her part, but then immediately she started just angrily packing away the dishes extremely loudly and violently, clashing the ceramic angrily like she wanted to break them.
Non-physical abuse, especially from women (no offense to them, obviously it's not all women), tends to live in a place between narcissism and social acceptance as we normally tend to be more forgiving to female actors of abuse, in fact even associating it with femininity in general. All this time, I didn't know that it was not normal, and not OK, that my mother always shrieked and screamed and slammed doors angrily and acted like a *little girl.* I thought it was normal and OK, because she's a woman and she's also been subjected to my father's abuse -- but the truth is I should have expected better of her just as I should have expected of my father.
'...we tend to be more forgiving to female actors of abuse...'
Can I gently ask who is 'we' here?
I think you may be using a man's sense of being the default gender here. I'm not so sure women are more forgiving of female actors.
The reason I mention this is not to be picky or contrarian, but because you mentioned the gender divide yourself, and I thought you might be open to the idea, even if you don't agree.
All the best to you x
@@nicolab2075 "We" being just society in general, I wasn't using men as being the default gender. Generally speaking, society is more lenient towards female actors of abuse (moreso in female-on-male abuse) compared to male actors of abuse (especially in male-on-female abuse). This is a very broad biologically-informed (and hence socially common) pressure, so it affects basically every level, from whether the act in question is to be called abuse, to whether it's even "a big deal," to whether the charges will be dismissed, to how the court of social opinion authentically regards the situation.
But while I am saying it's a broad pressure, I'm speaking in averages and generality and not saying that it's the very same result on each level. For example of course in sexual abuse there are far more male-on-female cases than vice versa. But my original comment was talking about other forms of abuse (especially emotional which is harder to detect or even often not treated as abuse anyway).
For me personally, I can go on about the abuse my father perpetrated on me including graphic stuff, but such forms of abuse (especially so perpetrated by males) is very common knowledge by now and pretty much unanimously condemned (although social shame of the victim continues to be a real issue too) - but I wanted to talk about the kind of thing that isn't so recognized and goes under the radar. For example yes my father was the direct abuser and he absolutely is the core reason why I'm set up for failure - but his mistress was/is standing there beside him, it's not like he's the only person contributing. She is more than happy to have had him redirect pretty much all his resources towards her instead, and manipulate him against me and my siblings/mother. Meanwhile as I am trying in every little way to rebuild myself and get help, I am finding that more often, I'm being treated coldly and with apathy by most women (including at the clinic which is completely female-staffed and female-owned, and this includes those who know of my history of being abused) whereas I'm being treated with more friendliness and a sort of awareness by most men (drivers, service workers etc).
One of the worst things about my parents "disciplining" me was that I became very sensitive to sudden movements, and I would flinch whenever my mother put her hands on me non-aggressively, and it absolutely infuriated her. Both my parents couldn't understand that it was an involuntary reaction because they never saw themselves as doing something wrong. And then, later in adulthood, they accused me of making up stories if I tried to bring up how they neglected me. She would always tell me I dreamt it up, and it fcked me up mentally so bad that I struggle to understand what memories are real. But I will never ever forget being punched and slapped.
My mom was a Method Actor & I Just Work Here. She's a huge narcissist who only really cares about being perceived as "good" and "helpful". I'm pretty sure she only had me because all her peers were having kids and it was the thing to do so she would be normal and get included in all the stuff her peers were doing.
Edit: Nope, she's a Child with the other two. Her go to line is "What, I can't forget?"
I’m a 37 year old child of a mother with borderline personality disorder and I’m still in an enmeshed codependent relationship. She’s the child parent . My dad was the safer one. I had no idea why I was so passionate about injustice. Until now.
I accidentally made my sister burst into tears when we were talking about our bad childhoods 😬
we were bitching about how bad our mother was as usual and I just said "when dad would drive off when she was screaming like that, why didn't he bring us with him? He always left us with her."
All of us had the issue with idolising him as the 'reasonable' parent. She hadn't realised until I pointed that out. My older siblings protected me far more than he ever did.
I loved him, but he was the one who rationalised and normalised her abuse, and made me believe that she had exploded because of something I had done.
Both of my parents are a big ol mix of all of these. And my brother followed suit too. I haven't talked to them since May and I didn't invite them to my wedding in October. I'm a little sad but I'm mainly sad about how I don't even miss them. How can I not miss them?! That saddens me most. The ones I do miss are my Niblings but oh well. I'm so at peace with my new husband and pets. They're my family.
This feels so odd; to be so seen and validated in my experiences.
This is the first time I have heard anyone say the safer parent. This is very validating. The safer over appears to be so gentle. But they cause so much pain.
My mom is a combination of all of these while my dad is the safer one. The one that got me the most was the "I just work here" type. When I first got my period, my mom kept pestering me about how I should just try tampons cause they're so much better blah blah blah. A couple months later I did try them and she immediately turned into the "I just work here" parent. "How do I do it right?" "I don't know! Look it up! I don't know." ???? How could you NOT know? Thank god for UA-cam because she was not willing to give me any advice at all. I always thought this was weird--especially since it's something she could have easily helped me with--and I never knew how to verbalize this until now. She also turns into this parent whenever we ask how long we should heat something in the microwave (I only ask to get a second opinion), "I don't know! Why do you kids always ask me this like I'm some chef? I just guess." Like...it's not that deep but she always acts like it is or as if it's a bizarre thing to ask your mother.
My mother was an " I just work here" She literally told me once that I never needed her even as an infant and that that's why she was hands off. 🙄
My mom said that too. I’m adopted and she’d sometimes say, “People always told me babies are a lot of work. They were wrong.” 😢
My mother is The Safer One EXACTLY. Just this year my father cheated on her yet again and the same ole pattern played out. She was all gung ho about leaving and then they “talked” for like 3 days and suddenly everything was ok and us kids weren’t supposed to be upset anymore. I finally cut her off after that. 27 years of betrayal is enough.
I saw my mother in The reactor.. Especially in the variation that was said about infantilization.. that is very difficult.. let me do it for you.. and if I refused the help she would feel upset.. I didn't learn to do almost nothing because my mother wouldn't let me help her with household chores because she did it better and faster... and using help and trying to do something alone I think it was seen as not valuing her... so I learned to I do a lot of things only when I leave my parents' house.
I love your sign off. After nodding my head to many of the situations you describe, it’s like walking towards the fireplace and beginning to feel the heat when once you were burned. Your sign off reminds that I’m in the present, I’m an adult who can protect myself, speak up, and pursue healing and happiness. Thank you, thank you, thank you. ❤
I had a "safe" mother and let me tell you, she was anything but safe. I realized it years and years later, and I was astounded to hear you explain her so perfectly. She could be so nice and sweet and then turn around and tell everyone that wanted to hear how once I left my little brother (adopted golden child) at the pool to go use the bathroom, and she and my father both pushed me down on the floor and beat me when they found out. I was sixteen, and I don't think that was much of an accomplishment. It didn't even matter that my other cousin was there looking after him, and he was ten! You'd think a ten year old can swim by himself. I went no contact with her two years ago, my father died seven years ago, and the final nail in the coffin was her demented ass telling my niece that story with so much glee. So I said oh really, and what were you doing while your ten year old and his cousins were swimming. Tell us why we were banished outside? They were watching porn with my aunt and uncle. She went really pale and denied, denied, denied. Just like she always did. After that day I put her in a car and dropped her off at her favorite grandchild's house and said good bye, I'm moving 2000km away and I'll probably never see you again. Have a nice time.
Oh, but she's your mother, how can you do that to her? She loves you.... bla bla bla, tag me in a Facebook post about how you should be glad you still have your mother. I'm free of her, but I'm still apologizing to my kids for thinking she could take care of them while I was at work, or sending them on vacation with their grandparents and aunt, because their dad and I couldn' t get vacation time and at least they'd see the ocean. The last time I let them go they returned and I got a lecture about how something was wrong with my then ten year old son, because he wouldn' t pee next to the road like all the other boys. I got a lecture about how my daughter, then nine was too overweight and i had to do something or she'd get fat. All my eldest at twelve did all day was build the deck, and they hardly ever saw the ocean. I had a hissy fit for the first time in my life! My little boy was painfully shy, and besides like their father my kids went to pee in a bathroom, not next to the road like homeless people. My daughter was the perfect weight for her age, and my eldest cried because he didn't have a vacation. They didn't go with them again, and I wish I'd gotten a babysitter, but there just wasn't money until much later. Damage done.
I took Dr Teahan's test, and it confirmed that I had a severely toxic home environment; I just never realized I was good enough, or worthy enough to be treated better. To not be neglected. I am so messed up that I'm still worried my husband of thirty years doesn't love me! I asked him on our wedding day if he was sure he loved me and really wanted to marry me. He said don't be stupid, of course I do. I have to remind myself that my children love me, because they tell me they do whenever we talk; but it's so hard to believe that I'm worthy of it.
Oh yes, I had a very safe parent.
Raised by a reactor/child and a method actor/I just work here/child :(
Dad was a sadistic misogynistic bully to his girls. We were just servants who did housework. Mom was a malignant narcissist who absolutely hated me and put me down continually even about things I did well.
So my abandonment issues and extreme dislike for any sort of injustice is, in part, actually from my father choosing to not protect me and taking her side even when he heard me scream? That makes sense
When I was 3 (and I know I was 3, because at 4 we moved house) I hit my knee, and saw in shock how a thin line of blood started slowly running down my leg. I curbed the pain and the panic and made a strategic decision. I would grit my teeth and sneak up to the first floor to my grandma. There I would get a bandaid and a hug. If I went to my mother instead i would get a bandaid and yelled at and beaten for daring to damage her child.
Mom was a reactor, violent, controlling based on fear. A toxic kind of love that misses all the kindness.
Interestingly I started fighting back. I never fell for the "it's my own fault"-kind of trauma. I knew it was my mom who was weird from like the age of 6. I developed coping mechanisms, like dogding, hiding, evading, stealth. I kept an incredibly low profile at home. If something went wrong that I could not sweep under the rug, like a bad grade in school, I went to my father, the "safer one", for a signature. And I tried to limit it to him.
My mother was an intelligent, dominant, manipulative and controlling person. She also used leaves out of the method acting book, if sheer aggression didn't work. But in my teenage years I went out of the stealth and started fighting back. More and more often I would use that growing amount of power I had, like my understanding of technology, to stand up to her. And it turned out, I was stronger in the end.
We had ridiculous fights, like when I bought glasses for myself that she didn't like. We were not on speaking terms for weeks, because of it, but eventually - the glasses stayed and she had to accept them.
I reagard myself lucky. I was terrified of my mother at times, even as an adult. But I got out with scratches and dents, not with a fullblown trauma.
The biggest damage that I sustained is that I am constantly stuck on high alert mode. Always vigilant, everything could be a danger, always ready to strike and never ever can I allow myself a second of weakness, because deep down I know it will be punished. By whoever, the world, fate, bad luck...
My dad was the reactor and my mom was the "safer" one. I've watched decades of finger pointing without understanding. Now I do understand and I have exactly the distance I need. I don't feel the slightest bit guilty about leaving them wondering in silence for all the times I was told to "get over it".
Both of my parents were a combination of method actors and the child. They had six kids. They were “engaged” as parents but in a really out of touch way. When a real problem came along, one of the kids had to take over, but in a subtle enough way that their egos don’t get wounded. We really feel like we raised each other.
My oldest sister (36) is still very enmeshed with them and always coaching them on how to parent better.
My dad was an emotionally absent parent. He often tunes me out, ignores me, neglects me dismisses me. My mom is unpredictable. Sometimes she's angry and full of rage, sometimes she is nice and gentle. Bipolar vibes. Both of my parents are very defensive and have very poor listening and communication skills. Yet they are still married 36 years in. I never felt seen or heard by either one of my parents. Which has led to a ton of resentment and rage. And avoidant tendencies. I am 31 and have never had a successful relationship with a man. I'm single and working on healing my wounds ❤
Thank you for your work. 🌈 I take small doses with your content, as it can cause reverberations after listening. Even with 10 years of therapy already. ~ Gratitude. You have a unique skill for verbalizing clearly, very helpful concepts. TY
~ another Oregonian
My Mom just out of nowhere divorced my Dad. Took on a whole new persona. She has taken on more religion and her new boyfriends persona. It is crazy how much as an adult that inner child still cries out. Now I'm working on trying not to be codependent with my child father. Thank you so much for your videos. They are such a great help.
Wow this is spot on. My narcissistic mother definitely checks the box for the "I just work here" parent lol! My codependent father was the "safer one," who I idealized but enabled the emotional neglect and abuse. I have spent the first three decades of my life disentangling this intergenerational trauma mess (including getting away from a narcissistic ex) just to find myself again. It was hard to accept that my parents could have unconsciously colluded in scapegoating me for all of their issues. They were trauma-bonded emotionally-orphaned immigrant parents and it breaks my heart that they tried their best but it still wasn't enough to raise me in a healthy way. Healing from C-PTSD and narcissistic abuse in my 30s...wish someone was there to guide me when I was younger because the colonial patriarchal nuclear family unit was like a secret torture chamber.
Mine was a Reactor and Bully, with a lot of "control" too. He used yelling. screaming, cornering, and heavy hitting. He demanded absolute perfection in everything - nothing was good enough. Losing a fight at school (grade school) meant more punishment for losing. ALL money was tightly controlled. He controlled all the money - even our mother, his WIFE - had to ask for money. There was no budget or allowance, you had to go to "his majesty" and ask. After he passed, we found out he had small bank accounts hidden all over the city, I know there are some we never found. When I got big enough and strong enough, I returned anger for anger. That worked.
Im a first generation eldest daughter aka "why do you go to school if you dont know how to fill out my forms?"
Interesting how the child archetype doesnt know how to do ish until theyre giving you the silent treatment and they have to do it on their own. My mother was also big on "talk to your sister. She doesnt listen to me" growing up. Ugh
I came to the comments to see if anyone else had a parent who was more than one of these too. I'm so glad I found your channel. It makes me feel like I wasn't crazy and the things done were not okay!
Dysfunction is rarely a solo play. I find it is most common to see 2+ major types of dysfunction and it causes compounding problems for those near ground zero. You're in good company, friend.
This was painfully accurate. My alcoholic dad was reactive, freaking out over every little thing. My mom was the "safer" one, comforting me afterwards but never doing anything. Fantastic video
vor 1 Sekunde
I had the Reactor and the Safe parent.
I finally also went no contact with the latter And experience A LOT of guilt. Hearing you say it helped me to better grasp that he should have protected me! Not just not harm me.
My reactive and just my job parent was my safe parent. An incident when I was 9 showed me he wasn't on my side. He wasn't safe. I wish I detached from him then, the way I already had with my high spectrum overt NPD mother. I'm having such a hard time getting this mess straightened out emotionally. He broke my heart back then, and it's still broken.
My mom was a big reactor (the sad/guilt kind), but mostly only with me in my experience. I suppose she might've been like that with my grandma, but I paid less attention then because I didn't become "in charge" of her emotionally until after Gams died. After that, the parentification became full time (at 11). When I was sexually assaulted at 13 in the home by a family member, I didn't tell my mom because I knew the upheaval it would cause and, inevitably, that I would have to repair and console her. She was never diagnosed, but I'm sure she was a borderline. As you mentioned, she had a history of trauma and loss. When I opened up to her later in life about my BPD and Bipolar 2 dxs as well as my cutting, she only cared about what she must've done wrong. I definitely think she falls under the child parent category as well, although she was pretty high functioning for the most part. Dinner was almost always made, laundry done, bills paid, etc. The problem was emotional.
She was also quite a method actor at being the life of the party. Now I don't know if this just seemed false because she was struggling with mental illness so she only put on the front with everyone else or if it was always her personality and mental illness had just eventually caused it to be too difficult to maintain all the time, but either way... everyone I know loved my mom, it was impossible not to. She was like the sun. But when she got home, the sun quickly set.
Woahh… my mother is ”the safer one” and when you said the child can feel immense guilt for them but the prent don’t have same feeling of guilt for the child, I was mind blown!
When you said "Oh sighing, that's the worse." I feel so seen.
It's interesting to see how my sisters also picked up a lot of our parents habits with their own kids. They might be better in some angles but still toxic in others
I’ve noticed the same in mine and looking back at my own parenting journey I realized I was the reactive parent as I was so mired in the trauma of marrying an addicted alcoholic husband from his own dysfunctional family. The difference between me and my sisters however is while my kids were still at home I started therapy and my now adult children have been apologized to and know that I am working hard everyday to heal all the trauma of the past. I wish my sisters would join me on this journey so they can protect their children.
@@dnk4559 that's beautiful ❤️
@@dnk4559My siblings didn't have kids and I only had one. None of us are with partners, we are all in our 50s. Our childhood was bad and it shows. But we are all pretty close and support each other in this.
But it's really hit home with Patricks video's. It's hard hitting but freeing and validating in some way also.
@@dnk4559 I salute you, it’s hard but you’re already doing great.
I'm taking inventory on how I was as a parent. I was somewhat "safe parent" afraid to stand up to some stuff their dad did, because I believed he loved them and would leave me.
I also was partial method acting, pretending to be a good parent, but missing the point how often I was trauma responding and disappearing emotionally.
I relate the most to the child parent. It's hard to grow up, and I am really working hard on it. Some parts of me are mature, but other parts of me are very immature. I believe a lot of it has to do with autism, and also trauma I experienced growing up (both at home and at school/public) as well as in marriage/divorce.
realizing these things is helpful, forgiving my parents crucial, and taking responsibility for my mistakes with my kids absolutely necessary.
I feel like I have met every one of these people, some of them in casual encounters, some in parents, some in friendships, and some in employers. I don't know if that is a genuine onservation or if watching this has me connecting dots that ought not be connected.
that example of ''the brownies have to be perfect at the sale'' kinda hit me, my family is a lot like this, every littlest thing has to have the highest stakes and stirr up immense ammounts of rage and chaos on every step of the way. It's a bit affecting to me to even to realize that i learned that way of seeing the world, just not with outwards rage but an internally directed version of it.
In my therapy there's a lot of efforts directed to expanding the world beyond these petty squabbles, to see that it isn't the end of the world that family member #5 is raging that the door is squeaking, let them rage and wallow in their own little pond of misery. I love and feel immensely validated that you touched on this subject
I really liked what you say about "nailing your triggers." I have triggers from childhood trauma and I am starting to nail some of those bastard triggers. :_)
2 child parents: Mother did all the household, daily task responsibility things, but with an immature and naive way of understanding the world. That parent was emotionally weak and could not develop a mature emotionally supportive role, but still relying on her own parents for financial support and stability and help with childcare despite being a "housewife" herself. The grandparents had to pick up the slack for the overgrown irresponsible adolescent husband.
My fattherwas an overgrown sibling style bully who played with us but in a class clown way, and could not be relied upon, teasing and suddenly going from playmate to angry and negating punitive grownup, He was selfish and very manipulative, teasing, bullying, taking things for himself that were meant to be shared, etc. He did not have an adult sense of responsibility for support of the family or proper coparenting, more likely to cause squabbles and chaos, which mother had to try to straighten out by worrying, scolding, criticising and shaming him. "Ignore him" was her advice to us. And childish outrage and embarrassment about his behaviour. She constantly berated and dumped her feelings about him on us children.
Love the nuance of “they were always early to things”
My mother is early to every appointment. She will also ask for a ride somewhere and text/call me 30min before to see where I am, as if I’m supposed to be early. Worst part is, when she shows up early she expects everyone to cater to her. God forbid she has to wait in a line or in a waiting room. It’s so embarrassing.
My mother was a total reactor and she behaved exactly as you said. She never comforted me the way other parents did to their children. You have been amazingly accurate, including down to concerns as to what we were wearing. I have only just started wearing pink flowery outfits after years of enormous arguments with her. I find NOONE comforts me now. Yes NEEDS DO get me into trouble, even today. But with me, I find those that at least TRY to comfort really does help. Makes me feel cared for for a change. Carry on the great work Patrick.
I used to watch videos like this to find out what kind of parents I had.
Now I watch them to be careful I don't fall into becoming one.
Often, I think its easy for those of us raised in severely traumatic households to slip into these behaviors and patterns without even realizing how bad we've become.
I love my children deeply and I know I can harm and traumatize them more than anyone.
I have to be careful and mindful at all times to do the least amount of damage possible.
I think of how I want to be treated and remembered by them when their older...
Its my deepest hope and wish that they always love me, we remain close, and they speak well of me.
As well as any wrongs I couldn't correct or fix I can help them find ways not to do the same to their own children, if they decide to have any.
Thank you for these videos.
I'll keep watching.
I'll keep reflecting.
I'll keep learning.
I'll keep changing.
I’m watching this as someone who had toxic parents & is currently pregnant and learning about what I shouldn’t do
Looking forward to this, I’m in the UK but I’ll be up to catch this or listen to it tomorrow. I find Patrick to be very informative and a massive help in my healing journey.
My mom described my step-dad as Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde.
I would call my bio dad "two face" over 20 years ago. Still has at least 2 faces and hates my authentic self 🙃 they hate us cause they ain't us 🎉
Maturity is realizing that I also possess some of these traits you described. Luckily my child is very young and this video is giving me awareness of this. I just want to be the best parent possible. I always get alot of insight watching your videos! You are a real one in a sea of gurus on UA-cam.
Patrick, thank you! Thank you so much for all the work you put into these. They are so full of info, metaphors, examples, and detailed explanations. All of it is super helpful, and extremely validating. And I know it took tons of time, energy, and work to get this into the great format you shared with us. We're all benefiting from your willingness to do this for us. Thank you. And hugs to all the child parts of you who might need it. 🤗
I Love 💗 your comment ‼️
We know a Real one _ will the Real Therapist stand up. Thanks for caring work your provide for all of us terrified to go to abusive therapists _ there's no regulations around the profession _ it's like church _ full of helpy narcissists with Goldy Goldy complexes.
It's not becoming these same kinds of people that's so hard.
I tell my kid that what has happened doesn't define her. She does. Not what I expect her to be. Not what her grandmother expects her to be. Not what her friends or her teachers or even her therapist expects her to be. She can look at everyone in her life and choose the good parts and reject the bad parts, and piece herself together just how she sees fit.
I am painfully aware that my trauma has adversely affected my parenting. I let my daughter know it. When it's relevant, I tell her that this is not what great parenting looks like. I don't say that as an excuse for my parenting, rather to remind myself that I can also pick and choose between the behaviors of those in my past.
I don't think my parenting will ever look the way I would like it to look. I have done leaps and bounds better than those who brought me up. Sadly, leaps and bounds aren't enough.
But my daughter knows that I am aware of my faults, and I actively work on them. I admit when I'm wrong, and I apologize.
Most importantly, in my opinion is that I have seen to it that she knows that even if I fail her in some way, she is not required to fail her children in the same way.
It's hard, way hard to crawl out of the trauma cycle. I think that, just as it takes generations to perpetrate and perpetuate trauma, it takes generations to fully heal it as well.
We all have to start somewhere.
This is well said.
I feel the same.
I wish there were a free course on how to parent well when you were never parented well.
Single mom here. I think I did okay in the younger years, but as my daughter became a teen and started challenging me more and pulling away, I’ve been struggling to find a middle path between too authoritarian and too permissive.
I want us to be closer again but don’t want to be the friend type of mom. I feel like I’m calm and rational and loving and understanding, because compared to how I was raised I am all those things and I work hard to be a better parent than I ever experienced as a child.
She feels like I’m grumpy and unpredictable and not very interested in her life.
Here’s to incremental positive change❤
Every time I watch your videos I am simultaneously amazed, thankful, saddened, shocked, and filled with rage all at once. I have to schedule time to watch them because everything you say hits the nail on the head so much, it’s overwhelming. but I will continue to watch because you have spoken more truth than anyone on this platform
My dad has traits of the "Reactor", "Monster", and "Method Actor"
My mom is the definition of the "Safer One"
And my Grandmother who helped raise me is the definition of the "Child"
They've kept me co-dependent under constant threats even now (my late 20s). I genuinely hate the life they have given me; it feels like an absence of one-- like I'm slowly suffocating under the weight of being hated for being alive, but gaslit into believing they love me. Telling me I can "Do anything I want with my life", while actively conditioning me to never do anything for myself or seek work, then threatening me with kicking me out any time they don't agree with me. Screaming about how all my dreams are childish and not "reality", and escalating the conflict every time I try to walk away or present my case. There is no winning. They all throw me away the moment it's convenient, and spend the rest of their time insidiously convincing me to doubt myself, my ability to make it on my own, or that anyone is capable of helping or saving me. They purposely moved away from family, only invite over friends of theirs that agree with them, avoid ever making friends with neighbors, and convinced me that everyone in the "outside world" is more hateful than they are. I have no friends, and they've convinced me it's my fault.
Thank you for another great video. Each of my parents has a personality disorder. And, there was a frightening synergy between them. I couldn't admit to my young self that the two people I had to rely on were broken monsters. But, I recall first reading about antisocial personalities as a teen. It seemed incomprehensible. I was blown away by the concept that some people could have no empathy or even a conscience. And, I absolutely could not consciously consider that I lived with a couple of them. It took 20 years to realize that these deficiencies perfectly described my mom and dad. And, 40 years on, I am still working hard in therapy to heal my damaged inner child. Work such as yours helps immensely.
Just thinking of my father sometimes makes me angry.
We grew up as three siblings. My oldest brother (who was still younger than me) became a drug addict and committed suicide. My other brother became a man-child without education or a job, just sitting home and playing video games and streaming. And eating. He is extremely obese, and often need support to be able to walk. I don't have an education or a job either. And no social life, no girlfriend, no family or anything.
And our divorced parents behave like they are the victims, and wonder what they did to deserve such horrible children that has brought them so much shame.
I can actually never remember a single positive or kind word from any of them, or see any of them show any kind of affection towards us or each other. And they are never had a real conversation with us, showed support, tried to understand or showed any interest in our life (except our mother, who is just nosy).
I think many of us had parents that often flipped between these types... i know that mine did. I believe the cognitive dissonance of never knowing the reaction my parents would have really contributed to my dissociation problems. I could never predict what was safe and it was always like picking the "lesser evil" over just receiving actual help and support. I could get the "i just work here" parent one hour and then a helicopter parent the next.
My "safer" parent was also the I just work here parent. He is now 93, has Alzheimers and is in a care home. I visit often and worry about him all the time. I am only lately realising the effect he has had on my romantic relationships - my mum was the critical, overbearing one so I overlooked my dad's enablement for years. Hmmm...
The film Coraline is exactly the combination you described at the end: "I just work here"/Child/Safer One dad and Monster mom. Highly recommend it to anyone interested in this topic.
My dad is definitely a "I just work here", and my mom a "Child". I have been parentified and emotionally neglected
My parents were both method actors, my mother particularly deliberately. No one in my family understands why I cut her off. Everyone saw her as the child, unable to handle the world around her. I experienced the monster, especially before I left. Insane to see how cold she could be. My dad was the IJWH and reactor on top of it (divorced) and the two households could not have been more different while equally disfunctional. Terrible to go between as a child, wouldn't recommend. I'm triggered by pretty much everything mentioned but working on it 😅
Looking forward to this! I started my healing journey and I sometimes wonder when I speak with my trauma therapist I don’t always hear what he says but rather what I think I hear. I am learning that is because therapy is emotional and learning from you here has been giving me an education and appealing to my analytical skills in a different way! Thank you