Why do people stay with narcissists? | Effective narcissistic manipulation
Вставка
- Опубліковано 1 лип 2019
- This video answers the question: Why would someone stay in a romantic relationship with a narcissist? Narcissistic manipulation is effective at keeping people in relationships, even if they believe the relationship is destructive. There are variety of logistical, financial, emotional, cognitive, and behavioral reasons people remain in these relationships.
Narcissism:
There are two types of narcissism: With grandiose narcissism we see characteristics like being extroverted, socially bold, self-confident, having a superficial charm, being resistant to criticism, and being callous and unemotional. Vulnerable narcissism is characterized by shame, anger, aggression, hypersensitivity, a tendency to be introverted, defensive, avoidant, anxious, depressed, socially awkward, and shy.
I would add: someone stays with a narcissists because they do not know they are with a narcissist; most of us do not know what a narcissist really is ...until we do.
So true, especially if you are brought up with a naraccistic family. There are no boundaries, because you were never taught that you could have boundaries.
EXACTLY - then you run like hell. You never knew them and it's scary as hell when the mask comes off! TRUST those who have been through this!
yes, yes, if anyone knows what a narcissist truly is and haven't jumped out of the window with a parasuit to escape the minute he/she knows then probably they just don't know exactly what a narc is. no excuse....you are better off and safer homeless....than living with a narc. Ask me...I skillfully avoided the antifreeze-coffee I was served every day near the end...there is not one single reasonable excuse knowing and choosing to stay with a dangerous psycho
@@donnalangley117 I have friends that are married to Narcissists. Their Mother or Father was a Narcissist. Then as soon out of high school their first boyfriend is a Narc. 50 years later, they still do not know. Many people lack curiosity...and intelligence seems to have little to do with their choices. I've debated enlightening such friends, and I evaluate each situation differently. I back away from the friends who are too dependent on their husbands. Do you think I am doing the right thing?
Financial dependence cuz no matter what he makes sure I never have enough money to leave. Also he's trapped me w our daughter, I have to wait until she's old enough so he can't take her via $ + judge.
Trapped until I can figure a way out.
Best line, "narcissists have a high degree of loyalty...to themselves" (with the perfect pregnant pause!) Another great "Grandeos" moment! I love your sense of humor, Dr. Grande, when it just so subtly peeks out!
@M Z Of course Dr. Grande is probably the most humble UA-camr on the planet. But we're talking about narcissism, so I think it's inappropriately apropos!
This is my other favorite comment from this video. Loyalty to themselves. It's ingrained and automatic. They will throw you under the bus and their own mother who is having a stroke if it means protecting themself. You won't believe it till you see it but we've all seen it which is why we're here.
Does it not defeat the meaning of loyalty when its not loyalty with another person 😂😎??
he is so humble, you dont even know the degree to how much. he has never made a video about himself, he makes this good informative content for free. i love you dr grande!
narcissists destroy self-esteem, and are very adept at manipulation
@@Peteyzee98 TrollBaby...
Yes, but they can be defeated.
May I ask you a question ❔
Kind regards
@@Peteyzee98 hmmmm. Looking for some attention?
YES, this too
Just wow. Also your mention of being too tired to leave the narcissist. The rope-a-dope they pull on you is excruciatingly tiresome. They do love to fight and they somehow make you believe you love to fight. They are geniuses at starting the fight then sitting back and watching the fireworks.
Yes, they love to see your facial expression right after they hurt you. They want to see you hurt. They’re sadists, how else can we really define them? The word narcissist, as a person with no empathy, is specious. Having no empathy, does not necessarily mean you need to go around hurting other people, but that is what they do. It’s a need to inflict pain on others. Sadists.
@@bigcitylittlehomestead I guess mine was malignant - because he loved to punish - covertly - his loved ones
@@prant8998 Incisive. Elegant. Penetrating. Thank you!
They stir the pot and we don't even know that they are the ones doing it...I thought it was everybody else starting trouble...when I see the signs, it quickly pointed to them...
6:34 “narcissists don’t mind complaining about you so this helps them make allies” a very underrated fact yet confusing to the victim.
1 million likes to this. Such an astute observation
I literally am diffusing comments to allies right now from his complaints
Oh yes, the LIES about me and same directly To me.
To me, the smear campaign is proof that 'evil' exists with these beings. To knowingly spread lies and hate about your SO takes a very special kind of demonic thinking....
There is a subtype of this: which is that they never complain about you, but in a social setting by pushing your buttons (so gently that no one realizes) and provoking you they get the reaction from you that makes them look like a victim, makes you look like a bad person, that YOU are the problem in that relationship. It is much more fucked up than plain complaining about you. Terrifying.
They are very very cunning and manipulative. Some of the abuse is so subtle you don’t even understand what’s going on. If I’d known about narcissists at he beginning I would never have got involved. Narcissistic abuse should be taught because it’s life destroying
It irritates me that your videos don't have millions of views. I love your videos; I watch them everyday!
Why? He doesn't "offer them a beautiful lie." It's usually the "ugly" truth. Ugly meaning stark, which I don't think it means in the dictionary but it does in that sentence.
@C M some of us adore that exact reason.. I'm not saying Dr Grande is unemotional, I am saying the doc seems to deal in facts.. & so many people in this world spruke bullshit or church shit up for any number of self serving reasons!
Dr Grande's approach, helps me remain clinical when considering or entertaining particular things... because sometimes empathy can cloud judgement or even sometimes emotions can dictate us.. Facts, one can never go wrong with facts imo.
He has 93 K subs. Thats no small feat.
@@lenore1075 I never said anything about subscribers.
Mongo I feel he deserves quite a lot more and they need his type of special way of explaining the things he does. His personality is trustworthy and calming and intelligent, committed to his title which I get the feeling he has good manner on UA-cam, and would be a good doctor face to face.(speaking from experience) never could I understand why some prefer terrible gossip and drama instead.
Maybe I’m “old-fashioned”? I am not a “groupie lol but I really in my gut think and feel he’s pretty great.
I’m here for all components of what he has to offer. It’s been a gift.
I’m just so low I maybe cannot articulate well. But I agree with you Mongo💜
BOOM! My life in a nutshell, for 26 years. All the reasons. I was shaking my head yes on every point. But I left. So, no more! And life as a single person is pretty good. 😉
Do you regret leaving yet?? I’m 29 yrs in
melony never !!! there not worth it at the end they never loved you
When everything is good they act like you're a problem, and that they might leave you. To keep you chasing them.
But when you decide to leave then they will say anything you want to hear, but they never really mean it. They just want you to want them, so they can go back to not wanting you
This is so true. You said it's so simply and it is so true
So Very True, Experts at LoveBombing , Promises.
Thank you Dr. Grande! This is something that people who have never been in one of these relationships don't understand. I'm tired of people saying "it takes two to tango". I'm glad that you point out that this is not a normal relationship because you are not dealing with normal, rational people. We try to impose our own assumptions about how "normal" humans act, which is the primary reason why people get into these relationships and why others cannot understand the toxic dynamics of the relationship.
The art of learning when not to dance!
People who use that reasoning about abusive relationships either cannot understand because of a lack of experience or I fear they are blaming the victim for not leaving sooner. Not always so harsh, yes, but it feels horrible to the abused person because it compounds the trauma from the manipulation.
@@WhyYouAskinAllTheseQuestions you are absolutely right! It is traumatic to have your reality denied, and feel blamed when your reality has been denied and you've been consistently blamed for others' bad behavior...
Miss E - When my father wanted me to walk out of a relationship he would look at me very hard and say, “it takes two to tango.” He was pretty accurate as I saw their next relationship encounters and it wasn’t usually what I wanted or needed.
Narcissists never leave and make you dependent of them. Your videos are awesome
I think they leave sometimes
I sensed Dr. Grande’s humor strongly today: Narcissists have incredibly high loyalty..... to themselves.
They have been successfully beaten down and emotionally manipulated...the devil they know is better than the unknown........so sad.
David Thomspson I think there is also an inadequate societal response, which leaves people stuck.
I agree David Thomspson - that is very sad....
Staying with a narcissist is NEVER a good idea.
NEVER!!!
That’s what I was trying to say
But if you dont know that it even exist like a whole lot of people in this world..then you would be until something ticks then you go researching like most of us on here.
@@sexygabby30 Then once you realize it GET OUT.
@@edunlap6594 and honestly ol'school on it...when it found out lots are far beyond damaged and have nothing literally to even get out, I had a cousin who went through it and she went bat shit mute...and my mom just died of it so you see the draining is soo detrimental. Your whole life sabatoged I've even noticed a lot even have that dead look to them because of, unrecognized stress due to this is very impacting. They know how to pick em. This is something we can teach our children...better yet just don't even put them in a position to meet one or become one and that is definitely teaching compassion and respect. Anyone before are basically already dead and just existing.
You couldn't pay me enough to stay with a Narcassist. I find them to be exhausting after awhile. They lose their cute real fast!
Thank you, Dr. Grande for a great deal of empathy and understanding expressed in this video. Post-adolescence, I ceased to consider jealousy a form of flattery. I seriously questioned the emotional stability of men who believed jealousy was "proof" of love. It seems to me the opposite. 🤷🐯
nobody nowhere That’s very wise!
@@brittaolson6550 Thank you. ☺
nobody nowhere mine said he didn’t love me enough to kill me 😱🤷🏻♀️🤔😒
nobody nowhere - you are so right. Jealousy is proof of romantic love; NOT proof of deep down heart and soul love.
Inordinate amts of jealousy keeps their vic glued to them. When one is continually kept off balance, they never have a moment of clarity to even contemplate a life without their abuser. One is constantly having to mount a defence and stay alert, ever ready for the next onslaught of baseless accusations. It is an exhausting, impossible task, like treading water, trying to keep your head above water.
Does anyone else click like on dr grande's videos before you've even watched them? Because that is something I have come to notice myself doing and up until now, I have never been wrong to. Thank you Dr Grande, you have become a big inspiration to me. :)
Being honest, I now realize that I use my narcissist as an excuse for not trying harder to make something out of life on my own. Also, being around someone so angry and terrible all the time does make me feel a little better about my inner self-doubt s of being a good enough person, while at the same time providing punishment to appease my self hatred. The longer I take the easier path and stay, the longer I feel deserving of such a situation. There, I acknowledged it to the world....1st step towards recovery right. Ha ha ughhhhh.
Power to you honey x
Keep trying. Taking one step is huge. It’s all about momentum, and moving toward freedom and self realization is what we all need for our souls. That first single step is fifty percent of the whole process. Without it, where are we? Stuck.
“Narcissists are loyal only to themselves.” Oh my gosh once again Dr. Grande aces it. They have those ready made excuses for their true deceptions ready at hand. They practiced it on prior relationships. Here’s a line I bet you’ve heard: “When I came into this relationship I really wanted to be true to you. But, you made me change.” Then you find out the guy or woman before that got the same story. Reality is; “A cheater has got to cheat, sexually, financially and any other way they can think up.” They enlist same sex friends to help so you will be the most publicly humiliated no matter reality. They can’t let go; they destroy your complete environment. Narcissist NEVER just walk away. They pretend that the word “fraud” is just too sophisticated a word for them to understand.
A few factors may have been left out?... Initial naivety, stupidity or denial, which could be partially characterized as faulty optimism and, depending on the behaviors of the narcissist, subsequent fear of physical harm to themselves or their children. Imagine someone who picks up and plays with a knife, staring at the partner like some sort of angry lion, when the partner brings up seperation. When asked why they do that or told that it's scary, they act as if it's all coincidental, he's "just fidgeting," or "it's just a joke." If pressed to stop, he/she gets mad and acts like you're being completely ridiculous or as if you've wounded them to the core by not fully trusting them.... you end up apologizing. You have this nagging sense that they could snap and kill the whole family if you split. You've considered leaving with the kids and going into hiding but you've been told by him that if he wanted to, he'd use his military sniper skills from a distance and he'd never be caught. Maybe he or she is extremely manipulative and you don't trust that the system would understand and they would fail to help you protect your children... so you stay until your kids are grown and you can be absolutely certain they'll be safe. Staying also allows you to better shield your children from abuse, where if they were alone with him for long, you know his issues would be turned on them and you'd be unable to stop it. You know he's ok so long as you stay, not because he genuinely loves you, but because he says referencing you, "I like to have the best of things and I won't let it go once I have it." For reasons beyond your comprehension, he precieves you to be some sort of "best." This might seem complimentary at first but it's more delusional, creepy, and threatening than any type of compliment. This doesn't necessarily mean he's not cheating either... you're a dusty shelf trophy to him. So you stay, smile, and let the years pass until the time comes to leave. Some mistakes are lifelong if not realized early on, hence stupidity being a big factor imho. I suppose this scenario might also fall into the calculation category but I think stupidity, denial, and fear deserve thier own address.
If you're in this sort of situation, leave early on. Seriously, don't doubt yourself. You ARE right. If you're already stuck, writing helps to minimize the mindfuckery in a situation like the one I described. It's a way of putting up a secret boundary around your mind in order to maintain mental strength. Also, tell someone about your fear so that if anything happens to you, they'll catch him and protect your children.
He was menacing you as he toyed with the knife.
All done.
Start squirreling away money. Be crafty, cunning and make plans to back out. Be gone, to another state, change names and trust no one, to not blab.
@@katiess9708 yes, I believe he was. It wasn't the first or only time. He once picked up a big butcher knife and started chucking it at a cardboard box across the room. I was frozen momentarily until I slowly made my way to the door and ran. He acted like it was all some big accident, like "oh oops! Didn't mean to do that!"... Like it was not a conscious thing. I'd have to be really dumb to not realize it's intentional at this point, particularly because it only happened when I used to bring up seperation.
I just think it's best to not rock the boat for now. Skipping town like in the movies seems completely unattainable. I've spoken to some women's shelters but everything seems like I'm asking for trouble. I'll figure things out eventually. Thank you for your concern ❤.
@@eyeamme1917 Oh my. And I reread your earlier post. You have children.
Now you must be a actress and ever vigilant.
Do:
Squirrel away money every chance you can.
Make a bolt bag.
Either for the future, or dire emergency.
You need a plan, in case things go south.
Enough to tide you over for a bit if you and kids are in jeapordy.
Set up an email account only you have access to.
Keep things that are not obvious weapons close at hand in different rooms.
If it comes down to it, your only advantages are surprise, being underestimated, maximizing your environment and planning ahead.
Everytime you squirrel a dollar away, you are buying space.
Stay safe and try to cultivate people. It is much easier to abuse someone if they are isolated.
Well said
@@katiess9708 All really good ideas. Thank you again ❤.
Wow after listening to pretty much everything on narcissism on UA-cam, this is the sleeper hit of the summer. This was absolute genius and so meticulously correct. Thank you the most for your final point regarding calculating the value of leaving and why it sometimes makes sense to not leave. It does seem to be a point unattended to by mamy people.
Some other highlights were that narcissists don't mind complaining about you and narcissists have incredibly high loyalty to themselves. Pure genius.
Yes, that fact that they make you think that you are the problem is absolutely true. I have spent my entire life asking myself "why am I the problem" and trying to fix it (me). But exactly as you say, if I was not the problem, I could not fix the problem so I was stuck and convinced that my mother was right in saying to me that I am "too sensitive" , "aggressive" " not good enough at anything" -in spite of my professional success that even she can not deny. etc etc....It is so liberating now to finally understand that IT WAS NOT ME and that oddly enough, "I am enough"....
I wish I could forgive myself for staying with my narcissist. I stayed too long and I hate myself for it.
Lindsay Antwine Would you want to hear an argument and strategy for becoming able to forgive yourself?
I wish i was enough to have that value for a guy to keep me for years aka more company, even for the wrong reason, cause to them, im worth enough to be in their life. Time is value, if you were so “worthless” you wouldnt be kept longer than a “worse woman.” Im 21 and my past is to embarassing to get any worse. I wanna be enough for a guy to keep me, and not forgotten like im nothing, unlike most girls my age.
@@lunabinofsin my only "value" to this person was in what he could get from me. How much he could use me. And because he enjoyed tormenting me and playing games that ended with me having PTSD from our time together. You are only 21, that is soooo young. You have all the time in the world to find someone who treats you right. Do not accept anything less. I know it can feel like if you haven't found someone when you're in your 20's that it'll never happen. I am 35 and the age 21 seems so distant to me now. Lol I was in my mid twenties when I was involved in this abusive relationship. I was 29, almost 30 before I married my husband. It took me several years to even trust him because I was so convinced that every guy was gonna do me the same way. But thankfully, he has proved himself to be a loving man. They are out there. I truly know it seems like dating today is pointless and overwhelming. But if you get clear on what you want and make sure you let them know you expect to be treated with love and kindness and respect, you will find who you're looking for. Please do all of us former 20 somethings a favor and take care of yourself and love yourself. YOU ARE ENOUGH. 100% I promise you. From someone who has been there. Don't ever let anyone tell you differently. Sending you love and strength. ♥
"People believe what they want to believe" BINGO,
Yes charming does appear to be key with these types..have recently heard the term hoovering up ,which means sucking the person back in...sounds like the stuff of nightmares
I think your evaluation could be summed up by 'trauma bonding' due to remittant reinforcement. Narcissistic individuals are incredibly good at baiting their 'captive's' to the point of complete nervous exhaustion/terror. The abuse is insidious and calculated. The abuser also isolates the victim so they have few allies to turn to.
All too true, Acer Tree. They keep the object of their desire on an intermittent reinforcement schedule, very diff to break the conditioned response.
In response to your comments about weighing the pros and cons and having a good counselor, THAT is EXACTLY why I stayed until I was able to leave successfully. As you said, the counselor helped me to have a balanced understanding of the situation and helped me to get stronger in preparation for my exit. I am eternally grateful for the professional assistance that I received!
I am really happy I listened to the end. Dr. pointed out that narcissists are only loyal to themselves is an amazing revelation. It’s so true. Even if they seem to be happy with a family member- that person is adoring them at a level that is unnatural. It’s a multi-layered cake of adoration and smiles at the top and abuses directed toward the bottom. They find ways to hack up very good people and place them at the bottom. It’s all about a timing game for a narcissist. Just sitting around coiled up like a snake for the strike. Boa Constrictors can digest socials circles until they are dead.
Thanks Dr. Grande.....you are spot on once again! For me leaving would be financial suicide and I have a child to think of. Very selfish individuals, with no loyalty whatsoever to the partner.
Lack of knowledge. Eroded self esteem. Hope for change. And everything else you mentioned.
Plus guilt trips galore and waiting for the person (who they presented themselves as), you fell in love with to show up again.
Familiarity.
The target leaves the narc around seven times on average before finally leaving for good.
If you look at it all as though you're like a dog that keeps going back to its vomit when you go back time after time then that can be a big help to stay no contact.
Graphic I know but it works!
Great video as always Dr. Grande 📹👍😊
Ok, yuck!!!! Funny though! 🤮🤮🤮🤮🤮🤮
Hello Dr. Grande, at 5:30 you say that the narcissists "may change" and I am intrigued because in my experience they don't change. At least the pathological ones. It also seems to be the general opinion among experts that a narcissist can't completely change. They may change for a while to trick you to come back to them but that is not real change. The narc in my life is my mother and I have just recently (2 years ago) discovered that she is a pathological one that ticks all the boxes...so to speak, she is "by the book'. It took me my entire life to figure out that she will never change and that I can never have a normal relationship with her. I wish I have discovered your channel sooner. Thank you for your excellent videos!
It may also hapend with sisters... Sad...
@@gomogomez7300 It can happen with anybody...unfortunately...
@@cristinamagurean Asa este, din pacate... Salutari!
@@gomogomez7300 Salutari back to you! :)))
I wanted to add to the idea that "people will believe whatever they want to believe." I have a family member that stayed in her abusive relationship because she was in complete denial. I think the truth hurts, and being in denial was her way of protecting herself. She did not want to admit to herself that she made a mistake in choosing her partner, and stayed in the marriage for all the wrong reasons. She wanted to keep up a facade that her life was perfect and that she had the perfect family and the perfect life. So she would lie, manipulate & over exaggerate this illusion to hide her shame. She wanted to believe she could change him and fix him. She wanted to believe that if she went to church twice a day and prayed with her rosary...he would miraculously change. Well, it never happened. She was holding onto a fantasy.
The interesting thing that I found out about myself and the number one reason I stayed in a relationship with a toxic person was because it was easier than dealing with my own toxicity to myself. A very wise friend explained to me how in extreme boredom I could see the kinds of thoughts that I really have in my head and how to use this as an analysis for myself. There's no boredom in wanting to fix a six year old adult is what I have figured out. The mind finds many methods of not being discovered and staying in a toxic relationship is one of it's useful tools.
I got a migraine anytime I went near him.
@@jenniferhartranft3394 I agree with you about not separating the mind from the body. Migraines literally dictated where I could go and not go. Almost as if my body was warning me of danger when I didnt want to believe it or accept it. My fear, frozenness and migraines eased almost immediately after moving 400 miles away and then I healed over a few more years. So much more to life than that crazy self degradating way. It has been lonely at times but totally worth it. I sometimes wonder if its narcissictic, bpd or some combo of both Guess it doesnt really matter; just that Im safe and happy now.
@@lenore1075 body doesnt lie
I didn’t stay. As soon as my psychiatrist told me what I was dealing with, I got the hell out. He hoovered for weeks. I got a no-contact court order. He’s sick!
Was there physical abuse to get the no contact order, if I may ask?
Comment 484: 24,298 views.
Good as always Dr. Grande 😀😀😀
Learning so much about myself, and my relationships.🥰
21,291 views correction.🥰🥰🥰
Reasons to stay:
1. Superficial charm accomplished purpose.
2. People tend see best.
3. Narcissist convinced you - gaslighting
4. N. Used other people to convince you are problem.
5. You invested in their success
6. Jealous of Romantic rivals makes you feel good.
7. Narcissist convinced you that you will never find someone.
8. N. Performed just well enough to make them acceptable.
9. Being with N makes tired, worn down, fatigues
10. Calculation to stay is better...
🥰🥰🥰🥰
You got a new shirt! Looks nice. And great video 👌
Kathrin Johnson - I agree his shirt and tie are perfect.
Even more handsome 🖐 🤚
Thank you Dr. Grande for answering this question, most or these reasons ring very true for me. There are so many voices screaming about narcissism on the internet. This is by far the most intelligent logical explanation for the complex reasons people stay. It’s going to be hard to find a good therapist after watching your videos, the bar is pretty high. Thanks again!
My goodness, narcissism is so insidious. I have to say though that their manipulation and charm can be highly effective, especially in the beginning of a relationship.
Thank you for raising awareness about this sad disorder.
Much appreciated.❤
Uplifting realistic video!!
Math doesn't lie.
To have someone in your corner, is always a good idea.
💐💐💐
i was married to one cleaver narcissist for 16 years..he gaslighted me into being "mean"..and he in my families' view (except my mother who saved me) was so "nice" ..it has been 6 years since we divorced...I'm finally learning to be a healthier person....and not ever repeat that pattern of abuse.
Good list. Back in the dark ages of DSM II, when our culture had less psychological awareness, my husband's picture could have been used as the illustration for narcissism (maybe sub clinical). His many good qualities seemed to balance some of his undesirable ones: witty, intelligent, wonderful family of origin, hard working, affectionate and appreciative (except for the chilling 3 day silent treatments, and the one sided nurturing). He gave me a puppy when we had been dating 6 weeks, when I lived in an apartment which didn't allow pets, effectively making me somewhat dependent on him. My own family was abusive and alcoholic, so I had poor role models for what healthy relationships looked like, and very low expectations. When he periodically left me, he returned bearing outrageous gifts he knew I wouldn't resist: a Triumph Spitfire, a beautiful 3 year old tricolor Pinto Arab stallion (who I shared good times with camping and trail riding cherishing him until his death at age 26). At the age and level of development that I was at in my 20s, staying with the devil I knew made more sense than the devil I didn't. If I had managed to pick a healthy partner it would have been a total accident, (and I suspect that I would have found him "boring" or some other puzzling deficit).
I don't think he could have helped being what he was, it wasn't some evil machinational process. I suspect that personality disorders are much more normal, or widely distributed, in our culture than are perfectly healthy personalities, whether because of internal family stresses (addiction, mental and physical illness, poverty, divorce) or cultural and historical forces.
This makes me think of "Prince Charming" in a whole new way!
@Forever True true that forever :)
If it's too good to be true, it's not true love!
@@misse7154 yes girl!!!!!!
Charming like a snake preparing to strike. Keeps us on our toes!
These points were all dead-on in my personal experience of working through leaving.
Wow!! Dr. Grande, You really did a Great Job on the subject of Narcissism in Romantic Relationships in this Video! I spent 5 years straight, then another 8 years on and off with a Narcissist and never knew it!! Almost all characteristic you laid out in the Video, He Had!!! The word Narcissist wasn't even a thought to me. Thank You so much for this Video. I now know, this relationship is never going to meet my needs, it makes it a bit easier to move on.
My father chose to stay with his wife who was Narcasistic possibly sociopathic. She was a a nightmare however he had ptsd and was disabled. The trade off was she took care of him and gave him a social life he enjoyed. It was hard for me to understand until I became disabled myself. He eventually learned how to keep her flattered and charmed enough to keep her from daily explosions.
Surprised to not hear anything about their ‘trauma-bonding’. Regardless, many thanks for bringing your professional and learned knowledge to this subject rather than the untrained or unqualified UA-camrs on the subject we usually run across
only the smart ones know how to do it
he made this video for all narcissists, not just for the smart ones
😱 You are frigg'n BRILLIANT Doc!!!
You hit the nail RIGHT ON THE HEAD everyyyyyy time! 💪👍👌🤪
Much love, gratitude and admiration from South Africa! 🌈🌍🌞🦏
hell yea thats the spirit
I cannot express how much I appreciate this video. I stayed with an NPD until our child could get out on his own as an adult. Then, although it meant losing financially, I won emotionally when I left. I had to dig deep for the courage and strength, but it was worth it.
Excellent topic! It seems most of my life has been eaten by abusive relationships. I think my history of severe trauma (childhood physical, emotional, and sexual abuse) makes it hard for me to identify abuse early in a relationship. Also, I think something about my personality makes me a target. I am currently in this type of relationship. I have often suffered extreme guilt over abandoning an abuser and still feel crippling guilt for leaving an abuser when he finally hit my child. I always told him that would be the last straw and it was. I guess because I put up with so much he didn’t believe me that I would protect my child. I am also filled with guilt for what my child had to witness and then suffer with that attack. I know I should probably take a step back from relationships entirely. I have only had a few serious relationships in my life but they have all been abusive. I am very afraid of going through the guilt again that I still experience after my divorce.
Also, I have noticed these abusive partners with narcissistic traits are always extremely good lovers...almost always. I have been with four of them, and all but one were AMAZING in that regard. I think they make sure to perfect those skills because they are then reflected as good lovers (ego), and to help gain control of their partner. I don’t know if I’m wrong for having difficulty leaving a strong sexual bond, but it’s certainly an effective strategy, if one is a cold strategist.
You never get bored with a Narcissist. You only remember the special things, places, situations and events from your past that you never did before, new, fresh information so that you can grow!!! . And with a Narcissist it is 1 big rollercoaster of special moments. So that's why you keep remembering the Narcissist We admire the Narcissist deep inside of us, because they have elements inside what we so deeply want. It is a kind of jealousy. They don't give a F they do what they want without fear and pitty emotions. And you only can watch and keep your mouth stuck by your over contructed concepts with their overloaded emotions that keep you back to really express yourself !!
good points, another reason why people get stuck with narcissists is their own low self esteem which could have its own origins in previous abuse etc.(they are just used to be around them, think they don't deserve better)
This is so reassuring to hear, another really interesting talk. I wonder if many victims of narcissistic abuse feel guilty that they didn’t leave earlier; especially if there are children involved. The gaslighting is the worst part and if done effectively can keep the victim like a hamster running on a pointless and utterly exhausting wheel. Dr Grande, if people would like to ask you questions where can they send them? Could you talk about whether it is possible for narcissists or narcissistic psychopaths to genuinely care for their children? Thanks for all this information, you present it really cogently, so it’s easy to understand even if the subject matter can be a bit triggering 🙏🏼
Something that strikes me as odd all these years later, is that as AWFUL as I was allegedly and he never paused for breath telling me how awful I was, he still HATES me for leaving! He hates me that I didn't stay to take more of the endless hate and criticism! He sees no irony there.
👍🏻 video Dr. Gorgeous Grande. I think it’s good that a professional states the reasons people stay, because often over people state that “ they” would NEVER stay. Dr. Phil even stated on TV that a woman should go live under a bridge before tolerating a man calling her names. I am not saying that people should stay, often maybe always it’s better to leave. That’s a personal decision, and when a child is involved there can be negative consequences either way. If someone’s decided that experiencing better relationships and teaching their child better values then the Narc displays then setting a goal and proper planning can work out much better then suddenly leaving, unless they’ve gotten physically violent, shew....
M Z they usually do start showing their bad side during, and they do get jealous of their own children
@M Z oh yeah that's right. That would make a great video, about narcissist jealously of their children.
I'm emigrating next year.. I'm not ready for the extra stress of going through the divorce. I'm greatful to be alive , greatful that I finally excepted what he is, greatful to be alive and most importantly greatful that my children are out of his way.
I've been blessed with an opportunity to move forward and the huge gift of a support network of friends and family that refused to let me get lost in cognitive dissonance and the gaslighting. .. still healing, still hiding. I am overwhelmed thinking of how people less fortunate would cope or believe in themselves to move forward when every possible despicable action is made to extract dignity or self worth and strength. Greatful is and understatement.
Same here. Was considering getting back in touch just to ask how she is.... But I know it is a bad idea. Maybe hiding is actually the most mature thing that two people can do when neither can handle the personality of the other. I only think about her occasionally now... Less than once a week. And whilst I get the urge to contact her when I do think about her I also know it will just set me back to the pits of mental hell. Her too probably. I don't want to go back to square one, I can't do that to myself. I used to think about her constantly, so once a week or so is progress.
Better to remain married in name only than be in contact. That way it is just... forgettable. With time.
Stay strong and find whatever crumbs of happiness you can elsewhere. It's not much but better than the misery you know awaits from answering the phone.
Excellent and concise, thank you Dr.Grande.
There was no one in my corner, even the therapist suggested a few more rounds on eggshells.
Thank you for this perspective. In support groups there seems to be a certain shame and weakness associated with staying with the narcissist. But like you said people may choose it for all the reasons you spoke about.
I have been listening to you for a few months now. I love your videos. I must disagree with you about going to counseling with the narcissist. All he did was manipulate the counselors. It was like reliving the experience over and over again each week. On the bright side, I learned my lesson. After over a year and a half of counseling, therapy, group therapy, reading and watching youtube video, I can say I will not be trapped into a relationship with one of those things again! I know myself. I love myself. I have high standards and strong boundaries. No one is getting through that. More importantly, I like myself and I'm okay with being single.
For me leaving meant facing the “alone, abandoned” feeling which was 100% seemed scarier than putting up with the abuse.
Kitsch This is precisely the issue for millions of people in these types of "relationships" and I've experienced it, especially in regard to the last highly narcissistic ex!
It can be more difficult when older as well, because there's less chance of meeting someone else. I'm not even looking anymore though, for reasons that are too much to go into now. ❤
I learned the hard way about this stuff. And, it seems like many of the reasons you give here also apply to staying with a borderline or histrionic. 25 years married to an npd. 5 to a bpd. I recognize all these reasons for staying.
they suffer too
Good video again Dr. Grande 👍
Thank you so much 😃
“The narcissist knows your breaking point and brings on the charm.” So true. Got reeled in so many times until I decided enough was enough. He made too many promises that he didn’t keep. 💪👋
Thanks for acknowledging we stay for so many reasons even if we are aware. Also thanks for not making it gender specific. Usually seems to be the male who's the antagonist.
This video is extremely accurate. Both women and men ought to listen to Dr Grande's analysis of Narcissism. Excellent and true to real Narcissists' living behaviors when in long term relationships.
And true to life reasons for partners that stay or go.
i think you went through a checklist of my most recent relationship. thank you for doing this series of videos about narcissism, Doctor. it has helped me to rationalise how i have been abused, and has helped me deal with the lingering depression and self-doubt that i stayed with her in order to avoid. i am very glad that i subscribed to your channel at the start of this year, and i wish you as much success as you desire. again, and this is very sincere - thank you.
They have no core values. Always searching for who they are through other people. When you have children, you fear not having them alone with the narcissistic person (as well as court- court with a narcissist is extremely difficult).
Excellent video that covers all the myriad of reasons I stayed for 20 plus years. Appreciate your well researched and dispassionate presentations. I've heard it said that trauma bonding is a facet of why people stay in relationship with narcissists. It would be great if you could do a video about that subject. Thanks Dr. Grande!
Thank you for analysing this so precisely and for adding that there can be situations where staying with a narcissist may be the better option. That really shows an ability to look at a situation from a multitude of perspectives. Highly appreciated.
Not wanting to admit they made a huge mistake defending the red flags/acting as flying monkeys, sacrificing their own integrity early on...definitely a lot of factors in addition to trauma bonds and finances...and yes, one is the history of the non-disordered person. Not blaming the victim, but our childhoods and earlier relationships are a factor as well. If you had breadcrumbs from a parent, for example, you might be more accepting of them later.
Yes my mom and my husband have been gaslighting and blaming me. I left my mother. I am still with my husband but I get extremely angry sometimes and I yell at him. But this angry ranting and pointing out the neurosis to him has never done any good. He feels like the perpetual victim. I cried very deeply today mainly over the sadistic psychopaths in the world. I kept saying "the whole world hurts".
My mother used to gaslight me to keep me corralled and safe inside her nest where I, worn down and weary, can sleep my life away. The problem is that even as a small child I suffered from claustrophobia.
This is spot on and exactly what I needed to hear. Thank you !
It's not so much that they employ people against me, it's more like "so what did you do today?" "did this happen?" "did that happen?" "did you make sure that this or that happened?" Drives me nuts
Dear Dr. Grande, you did this summary of reasons beautifully. I went into this trap a few times in my live and the reasons were of pure psychological nature, as I had no ties to this men, like kids, house, having a joint company etc., that would explain or at least rationalize it. So I hope this is interesting for you. I try to be short.
I would say, this kind of relationship breaks your spirits (in my mother tongue we say "something breaks your backbone", that fits better for me). The structure of the relationship erodes exactly those qualities that you need, when you leave a person, it paralyses your minds' legs. After a breakup I felt regularly like an amputee, and it felt as if the other person had run away with important psychological properties of mine. Thus I had to give up a part of myself, and not only separate from a person.
I like to emphasize that I consider this as being the consequence of this type of relationship, and not as the fault of a single person, called "the narcissist" . It takes two to tango.
Nemesis.. imo inadvertently that's what a narcissists partner is!
@@oksanaml9279 You are right with this. Interesting. I have to think about this contradiction. Thanks you very much.
As always ... very accurate insight. Thank you, Dr. Grande.
This analysis would drive a Narc TO spiral IT'S DEAD ON! "Narissistist are loyal to themselves" Wow! Best analysis I've seen yet. I also appreciate how causal your analysis is - you completely script the power and fear away "math doesn't lie." You've intelligently gave back the power to possible victims in this video by not acknowledging Narcs over other types of abuse. Most analysis says watch out they have super human emotional abuse skills. In fact any abuse is a danger this is just one type and people stay as you stated, sometimes the choice is best for their situation. Theyre not always weak in making this choice its often from an informed place.. Dr. GRAnDE! You snapped Sir!
Boy, you sure hit THAT nail squarely on the head! After being married 1 week to what I thought was the nicest guy in the world, I called my parents and said, "This isn't gonna work." My dad told me to "MAKE it work!" I've been making it work for 32 years. But, truthfully, now that I know what the name of the game is, it makes it (somewhat) easier to play my side of the game. It also seems to help that everytime I see the narcissistic traits beginning to rear their ugly head, I laugh as if he's being hilarious, and that seems to make him simmer-down. Also, since I've learned what the game is, I am able to stand my ground and refuse to play and refuse to give him the upper-hand over me and my life. After 32 years, it's still difficult, but this has been a tremendous help to me. Thank you!
This one is gold. Keep the good work. Some other points: The Narcissist can achieve some thing far better than his or her level of expertise and intelligence will predict, because they often have some structures that make people considerate diminished. Also some are pretty good at spotting weak areas in people personalities, not because they have gift, but because they are thinking on how to take advantage all time.
This is one of the most definitive explanations. Brilliant work.
I was already in a low place when we got together, and he was so attentive. A few people who knew him for a long time warned me, which made me defensive of him and us. Then when the stupid arguments started, I could see where I could have handled things better so it seemed like both of us. The really manipulative abuse ramped up slowly enough that even though I knew something wasn't right, I couldn't see how very bad it really was until much later when I was free. I finally broke it off completely when I saw proof of him cheating, and I found out that he was waiting until I got my tax returns and he was going to take them and leave with her. After I left, I was amazed at what I put up with, and how absolutely over the top horrible and ridiculous it had been. I spent several years figuring out why I attracted people like that, and what about me made me attracted to them. I'm with an amazing and very loving and supportive partner now, so there is hope!
I stayed until I was discarded then I went to war. It was long and hard but in the end it was worth it. Don’t ever give up. They don’t always win. Karma takes care of that.
Speaking from experience: all these points are spot on. Thank you Dr. Grande for sharing!
Oh my God. This is my life a hundred per cent. I sit here now with a lump in my throat, my hands are hot and numb and I've known this for a long time. You have given it a name I guess I could say. Counselling for him is out of the question. I am just so unhappy. I don't even want to live sometimes. This is unhealthy also.
I hope you get out of that situation, you don't deserve to be abused.
Bingo. This entire video was spot on for me. Thank you, Dr. Grande!
How true. Dealt a lot😫 fatigue surrender😥😭 How true!
I think you are the only therapist who can make me cry with laughter at myself. Thank you! Very validating. Sincerely thank you Dr Grande
I have been stuck "coparenting" with a narcissist for almost 4 years. My opinion is, the best thing you can do for yourself, is create your own support system. The narcissist doesn't want to be accountable for their relationships, so don't count on it. This goes for the relationship with their kids too.
Almost to 100k subs!!! Whooohoooot! Great content and lots of love! Thank you, kind sir, for educating the masses!
i'm aways so taken by the level of knowledge and prep in these videos.
The psychology behind this is SO disturbing. Yet incredibly interesting and addictive to learn about
Lack of boundaries and optimism.
OMG!!! This is the best explanation of why I have been unable to leave. I am in counseling. Again. Thanks for the video.
I have said this before but I will say it again. I wish I would have had you in my corner when I was married to my ex narc. It would have made my life soooooo much easier. I am so grateful for your videos. I know you will help someone like my old self!
Narcissists also do a survey on your needs and tend to provide what they think you need, mostly material goods, so they can continue with their manipulation, and this makes your relationship seem like kind of a give and take relationship
Thank you Dr Grande! Keeping it real As always! I am confident, you are helping more people than the comment section suggests 😃
Great video. Though I'm a little surprised not to find in this video the main source of a narcissist's attraction - cortisone and endorphin oscillation
Narcissist are great at withholding love and approval. If you're the kind of person who's parents did the same thing, giving up that need for the narcissists approval can be very difficult. You have to dig deep to find a way to give yourself what the narcissist never will.
Thank you for pointing out that sometimes it’s wise to stay. I wish I had allowed my son to move with his grandmother, yet stayed in my marriage for about another year, until I finished school and figured out how to leave without financial ruin. I feel that many abused women often get revictimized by others who tell them what they need to do, often attacking their character if they don’t. I feel that my leaving in the way I did was a kamikaze move I can never adequately recover from. Of course we can never know for sure how it would’ve turned out another way but I’m just glad you mentioned that.
I made a calculated decision to stay until a certain point when I knew I would be successful in my escape with my children. The average woman in a domestic violence situation leaves and returns 7 times. I knew I would have only one shot to get free; if I failed he would make sure I never had another chance. It took me 5 years of planning and gathering evidence, but I did it. One year out, and things are going well. Still trying to get the divorce, but I believe I will be 100% free eventually. Things are getting better every day.