I've always aligned vehicles to the preferred settings, which 9/10 times is a bit of toe in, not out. The road force on the tires basically zeros out the toe while driving down the road.
Thank you so much for actually showing measurements! So many people just say "I measured" and skip it. Perhaps they think it is boring, but these planning details are the difference between a great modification and an alignment nightmare. I learned a lot watching this.
The safety spacer keeps the rodend from coming off the bolt head if it fails. Aircraft use large area washers to prevent complete disconnect. They fail usually because they aren't lubricated regularly.
Exactly. It's called a safety misalignment. If the helm fails / Comes apart,, the the safety misalignment is bigger than the hole through it. Also keeps from having to put a large washer, which would be a separation spot to be able to break. But, I have put a large washer on top of the misalignment one anyway with no problems... But,,,,,, if the bolt broke,, all that safety,, just went out the window..
It actually depends on the scrub radius of the steering geometry. Your typical macpherson strut configuration has a toe out setup. In this case, the steering would be toed in, as you pointed out.
Yea but it really depends. Usually FWD cars use littlebit toe out because tires has habit to toe in when driving. RWD's uses toe in because those front wheels doesnt have so much pulling force at them as FWD cars. I dunno which one is right one at AWD cars but I think that both of them are ok at AWD setup. If tires wont get ruined due wrong steering angles and it goes straight at road, I wouldnt think it too much
every alignment I've done called for toe in regardless of macpherson,dual a arm,solid axle or twin I beam but i can't think of any reason why it make a difference it should have the same effect either way
I just destroyed it at King of the hammers so a new one will be built on the channel! It will be a little while until I get to it but I have to build a new one before I take the jeep out again. 🤘
The safety misalignment spacers eliminates the need for a safety washer. If the heim fails the wide part won't allow the bolt/heim center to pull out and separate.
The Safety spacers are for if the Heim joins fail and the ball gets out of the joint the rod will still stay attached to the bolt and help steer to safety. Without these Safety spacer the joint will fly off the bolt and you have wheels going where ever they want.
Ruffstuff makes awesome parts, ordered quite a bit from them for my 3 link 1ton swap, keep up the good work Nate! Hope to catch you out on the trail when my rig is back up
As always, more great content from BleepinJeep! It is also cool to see you use the 'budget' tools (even though you have better options available) and include the special caveats that matter when using them. The kit looks like a nice addition to your rig! I also like your suggestion of adding a touch of negative toe - once the camber is sorted out, dialing in a bit of negative toe really improves the road manners!
I made my own tools out of a old metal bed frame drilled one hole the size of my lug stud and made them like 30 inches long you bolt them to axle with stud and lug my dually Dana gm 60 was 77 wide cross over high steer using tie rod ends .
Nice job Nate. I am getting ready to do the same kit on my tj. Good to see some of the things you had to do as it was things I have tried to foresee(the bends) but wasnt sure until I get my links. It confirms I will have to, to be able to keep sway bar in stock location.
Seems tough enough. Angle grinder cuts just don't have enough precision and tend to be the easy way vs. the right way to cut a nice 90 degree angle etc., in my opinion. I may be off a tad, I thought that the recommended tow was slightly towed in vs. out ? The drag link could be a tad too close to the sway bar link when on the trail ? Nice design and parts.
Great video. I enjoy watching you fab stuff, you make it look so easy. How is that harbor freight bender? I was considering it for when I get ready to do some cage additions
@@bghouse2853 the short answer is no. These benders dont do well with thin tube. It tends to kink. There are some techniques you can use to make it work ok but I wouldn't recommend a project that big or important. That said, people make some ghetto shit and think it's fine lol. Maybe I should do a harbor freight bender how to video
It looks like that drag link joint on the high steer arm is almost maxed out and it's sitting at ride height. Did you test the droop at all? It looks to me like it's going to hit and cause damage to the joint the first bump you hit
Nate if you could do a video on the tire carrier, I would love to know how you built it or where you bought it. The bumper carrier I have wobbles way too much for my liking even after I have stiffened it. If you could that would be great.
The point of the safty missalignment is if the rod end fails and the housing breaks away from the ball that flare is larger then the rod end housing so it cannot come totally undone
the angle of the top rod joint looks like it might bind when at flex. have you tested this yet? or is it just the way it looks on camera. Thanks for sharing.
If you’re bending the bars and using heims, how are you keeping them from twisting when you lock everything down? You had the joints centered and I didn’t see anything that would keep them in place. Might have missed something 🤷♂️
Nothing in this case. On my crawler I didn't use the misalignment spacers on the tierod just washers. That way there is very little rotation. I would bet the ram is rotating the tierod in this case. On the draglink you just have to let it twist, because you don't want to limit the articulation. I also don't have bends on either that can cause rotation. This video reminded me I need to call up Ruffstuff and order a replacement heim. I use all Ruffstuff.
Not bad actually! It looks like it would be bad but its manageable enough that I haven't felt the need to upgrade it. It's been like this for about 9 years, That being said I plan to relocate the panhard bar and some other things in an upcoming video series
I’m doing a swap in my 92 f150 with a 79 d44 I’m wanting the high steer and I see you said you used the knuckles from a 250. Does that mean I would need to do spindle hubs etc for a 250 as well?
Nate! Please explain to me how you are running 3/4 ton knuckles with 1/2 ton outers and 5 lug, I want to do the exact same instead of using Chevy knuckles and mixing up parts.
The geometry of the track bar and drag link does not look good to me. Plus i think you needed to add another bend to the drag link to keep the heim joint from getting in a bind. The axle is resting on stands right now but if jack up the frame I think you will see some concerns.
Nate. How does the 5 lug parts fit on the 8 lug knuckles? I have a f250 44 for my yj and i was just curious. I understood that its all interchangeable, but you had to keep knuckles, stub shaft, and hubs as a matched set.
so i have a question. i decided to go with flex joints "johny joints" for my trailing arms for a couple reasons. my rig is a daily driver and weekend warrior and wanted something not as clunky and rebuild-able. i know this rig is mostly for offload so it probably doesn't matter . but using hiem joints for steering components. would that be less clunky or is there an alternative for that too?
I'm not quite sure what you're meaning when you say "clunky" but here's my 40+ years of Jeep experience: Stick with a high quality company such as Moog for your steering needs. Inexpensive, greasable and always easy to fund at any parts store. If you're daily driving and weekend warrior'ing your Jeep, there's no need to go beyond, even if you're running a tire as big as a 35.
Bent tie rod and drag link....nice!!!! Flopping around and scrubbing inside edge of tyres every time you brake on the road due to flex...again...nice!!!
Wish I could find a cheap welding shop. Last time I went to our local welding shop I needed 1 bar welded in 2 spots, about 5 minutes of work and they wanted $140 for it. Ridiculous.
I wish you could do this on my grand wagoneer... I just had a bar put in the back .. it racked me... Because it's a custom job 9" on 35s... Things all over the road.
I've always aligned vehicles to the preferred settings, which 9/10 times is a bit of toe in, not out. The road force on the tires basically zeros out the toe while driving down the road.
i toe in 1/8" with an old school alignment stick. I go down the road straight as a grizzlies dick!!! I agree on the slight toe in.
Thank you so much for actually showing measurements! So many people just say "I measured" and skip it. Perhaps they think it is boring, but these planning details are the difference between a great modification and an alignment nightmare. I learned a lot watching this.
The safety spacer keeps the rodend from coming off the bolt head if it fails. Aircraft use large area washers to prevent complete disconnect. They fail usually because they aren't lubricated regularly.
That makes sense, thanks brother!
Exactly. It's called a safety misalignment. If the helm fails / Comes apart,, the the safety misalignment is bigger than the hole through it. Also keeps from having to put a large washer, which would be a separation spot to be able to break.
But, I have put a large washer on top of the misalignment one anyway with no problems...
But,,,,,, if the bolt broke,, all that safety,, just went out the window..
Factory alignment settings are usually toed in, not out.
It actually depends on the scrub radius of the steering geometry. Your typical macpherson strut configuration has a toe out setup. In this case, the steering would be toed in, as you pointed out.
Yea but it really depends. Usually FWD cars use littlebit toe out because tires has habit to toe in when driving. RWD's uses toe in because those front wheels doesnt have so much pulling force at them as FWD cars. I dunno which one is right one at AWD cars but I think that both of them are ok at AWD setup. If tires wont get ruined due wrong steering angles and it goes straight at road, I wouldnt think it too much
every alignment I've done called for toe in regardless of macpherson,dual a arm,solid axle or twin I beam but i can't think of any reason why it make a difference it should have the same effect either way
That's not true.
@@steven14621462 I agree. Only cars that required toe out in my expeeice were typically police vehicles. Maybe for quicker maneuvers
Nate, make a video of your rear tire carrier. That thing looks rad.
I just destroyed it at King of the hammers so a new one will be built on the channel! It will be a little while until I get to it but I have to build a new one before I take the jeep out again. 🤘
I learn a lot from you Bleepin guys! XJ girl!
A Bug’s Life Nice looking XJ’s Bug! 😜
That angle of the top Heim looks like it will bind when it flex’s up, if you drop that first bend down a little it might help level the Heim out.
Gotta thumbs up Nate’s videos!
I've got a few Ruff Stuff parts/kits. Great quality.
The safety misalignment spacers eliminates the need for a safety washer. If the heim fails the wide part won't allow the bolt/heim center to pull out and separate.
The Safety spacers are for if the Heim joins fail and the ball gets out of the joint the rod will still stay attached to the bolt and help steer to safety. Without these Safety spacer the joint will fly off the bolt and you have wheels going where ever they want.
Ruffstuff makes awesome parts, ordered quite a bit from them for my 3 link 1ton swap, keep up the good work Nate! Hope to catch you out on the trail when my rig is back up
As always, more great content from BleepinJeep! It is also cool to see you use the 'budget' tools (even though you have better options available) and include the special caveats that matter when using them. The kit looks like a nice addition to your rig! I also like your suggestion of adding a touch of negative toe - once the camber is sorted out, dialing in a bit of negative toe really improves the road manners!
Another clutch video Nate! Gives me an excuse to go buy a tubing bender from harbor freight lol
I made my own tools out of a old metal bed frame drilled one hole the size of my lug stud and made them like 30 inches long you bolt them to axle with stud and lug my dually Dana gm 60 was 77 wide cross over high steer using tie rod ends .
Great video Nate! Great job keep it up!!
Nice job Nate. I am getting ready to do the same kit on my tj. Good to see some of the things you had to do as it was things I have tried to foresee(the bends) but wasnt sure until I get my links. It confirms I will have to, to be able to keep sway bar in stock location.
Toe out is for front wheel drive. Toe in is for rear wheel drive
Great video. That is one awesome Jeep. I love that rear tire carrier on your Jeep. It's bad to the bone
How do you adjust the steering wheel to center it? The way you have the drag link in one piece, I’m not sure you have room to make any adjustments?
Nice video. I just got done putting my kit on my truck. I plan to make a video of the results.
Great video Nate! Your tj is too Cool with that VW diesel. It seemed to work great at KOH! From what I seen on the BK video. Thanks.
Seems tough enough. Angle grinder cuts just don't have enough precision and tend to be the easy way vs. the right way to cut a nice 90 degree angle etc., in my opinion. I may be off a tad, I thought that the recommended tow was slightly towed in vs. out ? The drag link could be a tad too close to the sway bar link when on the trail ? Nice design and parts.
Let the bungs cool off after welding, then run in the appropriate tap. Good work
Great video. I enjoy watching you fab stuff, you make it look so easy. How is that harbor freight bender? I was considering it for when I get ready to do some cage additions
Not bad but not great. The low price makes it worth having for stuff like this
Could you build a roll cage with it
@@bghouse2853 the short answer is no. These benders dont do well with thin tube. It tends to kink. There are some techniques you can use to make it work ok but I wouldn't recommend a project that big or important. That said, people make some ghetto shit and think it's fine lol. Maybe I should do a harbor freight bender how to video
Yea I’m not about to fill every tube with sand before I bend it. Sounds like a major pain in the a$$
Have you ever use Barnes offset heims?
It looks like that drag link joint on the high steer arm is almost maxed out and it's sitting at ride height. Did you test the droop at all? It looks to me like it's going to hit and cause damage to the joint the first bump you hit
Great video enjoyed the install
Nate if you could do a video on the tire carrier, I would love to know how you built it or where you bought it. The bumper carrier I have wobbles way too much for my liking even after I have stiffened it. If you could that would be great.
You're guys is awesome 👍 thank you
Good job, as always Nate!!
The point of the safty missalignment is if the rod end fails and the housing breaks away from the ball that flare is larger then the rod end housing so it cannot come totally undone
Nice video! Love your Jeep! I want to do a diesel swap after seeing your videos.
the angle of the top rod joint looks like it might bind when at flex. have you tested this yet? or is it just the way it looks on camera.
Thanks for sharing.
If you’re bending the bars and using heims, how are you keeping them from twisting when you lock everything down? You had the joints centered and I didn’t see anything that would keep them in place. Might have missed something 🤷♂️
Nothing in this case. On my crawler I didn't use the misalignment spacers on the tierod just washers. That way there is very little rotation. I would bet the ram is rotating the tierod in this case. On the draglink you just have to let it twist, because you don't want to limit the articulation. I also don't have bends on either that can cause rotation.
This video reminded me I need to call up Ruffstuff and order a replacement heim. I use all Ruffstuff.
How much bump steer does this rig have? I notice the track bar is sitting quite a bit below the new drag link connection at the wheel.
Not bad actually! It looks like it would be bad but its manageable enough that I haven't felt the need to upgrade it. It's been like this for about 9 years, That being said I plan to relocate the panhard bar and some other things in an upcoming video series
Hydro assist steering will mask that bump steer
@@BigTireGarage absolutely
Great video looks like some really good steering. I need to get one for my Cherokee build
I’m doing a swap in my 92 f150 with a 79 d44 I’m wanting the high steer and I see you said you used the knuckles from a 250. Does that mean I would need to do spindle hubs etc for a 250 as well?
Fist person I see doing wider toe in the front for Jeep
Nate! Please explain to me how you are running 3/4 ton knuckles with 1/2 ton outers and 5 lug, I want to do the exact same instead of using Chevy knuckles and mixing up parts.
Nice job 👍 I like your wheel alignment tool 👍 if it works it works 👌👊
this was totally awesome DIY.. Thank You
Ordering mine tomorrow
Great video man! Where did you find the LED lights your using? They look pretty cool!
Awesome a nate video lol love the whole crew though
If you had a Rogue Fab bender, you would be able to bend anything
Did you think of using off set joint?
Are you using any thread locker on those steering nuts? And what are you torquing them to
I like to drill a hole through the nut and bolt and put a big cotter pin in. 1/8" dia. works perfect.
How much length did you leave from the bend to the end of the tube? Building a tie rod and need to put some bends in.
The geometry of the track bar and drag link does not look good to me. Plus i think you needed to add another bend to the drag link to keep the heim joint from getting in a bind. The axle is resting on stands right now but if jack up the frame I think you will see some concerns.
The one issues I have is my hydro assistance ram turning up and down steering side to side
What kind of light do you have set up at the first of the video under the jeep? Nice video.
Would you suggest this kit over the TRE kit for daily or weekend drivers less off-road more on-road driving
where can i get that tube and the heims?
Noticed you are using a Milwaukee cordless impact wrench. Which one do you use.
Nate. How does the 5 lug parts fit on the 8 lug knuckles? I have a f250 44 for my yj and i was just curious. I understood that its all interchangeable, but you had to keep knuckles, stub shaft, and hubs as a matched set.
Did you get the 7/8 -7/8
So what happens if I wanna switch to this style when my knuckles are already reemed for 1 ton steering tierod ends?
Good video and information
What Kit did you use for the high steer mounts onto the knuckles? Thanks for the video! Im starting my first high steer project this week.
Nate what brand is the yellow mig welder you use?
I would like to know where u get those work light's?
How are the joints holding up? Been thinking about getting this kit.
Thanks for the video, great for what I'm doing on my Rocky project.
so i have a question. i decided to go with flex joints "johny joints" for my trailing arms for a couple reasons. my rig is a daily driver and weekend warrior and wanted something not as clunky and rebuild-able. i know this rig is mostly for offload so it probably doesn't matter . but using hiem joints for steering components. would that be less clunky or is there an alternative for that too?
I'm not quite sure what you're meaning when you say "clunky" but here's my 40+ years of Jeep experience:
Stick with a high quality company such as Moog for your steering needs. Inexpensive, greasable and always easy to fund at any parts store.
If you're daily driving and weekend warrior'ing your Jeep, there's no need to go beyond, even if you're running a tire as big as a 35.
You should have tiny bit of toe in, not toe out. Toe in helps it track straight at higher speed. Toe out will make it twitchy.
Actually too much or either will make it twitchy. The type of toe you adjust all depends on the suspension configuration.
Bent tie rod and drag link....nice!!!! Flopping around and scrubbing inside edge of tyres every time you brake on the road due to flex...again...nice!!!
This is rad
Yeh shout out
Ditch the sway bar
The first time I've ever watched an ad the whole way through lmao
Be careful with that bender. They have a tendency to kink the tube
When are you going to fix your mono sound?
My right ear likes!
Is there a way to get ahold of you? Email? To ask a question?
Should have bought offset heim joints. Then you wouldn't have to bend your tie rod
freakin genius and an artist. Me? I just replaced my tie rods with MOOG.
Hi
Heims are not street legal that saftey piece is to prevent the Heim from pulling over the bolt head and losing steering..
Do you have a name for your Jeep?
Wish I could find a cheap welding shop. Last time I went to our local welding shop I needed 1 bar welded in 2 spots, about 5 minutes of work and they wanted $140 for it. Ridiculous.
Try a sheet metal shop. I run one and will do a quick burn or 2 for cheap. But I know welders that won't break out the machines for less then $100.
First!
I wish you could do this on my grand wagoneer... I just had a bar put in the back .. it racked me... Because it's a custom job 9" on 35s... Things all over the road.