I have a 2024 American Vintage II ‘57 Strat, and the finish is a top layer of what their marketing calls “nitrocellulose” (it’s not), over an extremely hard, thick layer of plastic. The “nitro” has plasticizers added to it, and you cannot put checks in it no matter what you do. It’s really false advertising on Fender’s part, and was one of the main reasons I bought the guitar. Fender does this to avoid warranty issues and returns from shipping climate finish damage. I’ve since sanded the entire finish off (with much difficulty), and I’m going to put a hand rubbed varnish from StewMac on it.
Agreed. It’s deceiving. That’s why I went MJT for my telecaster. I did buy a road work fender strat, which is supposed to be nitro finished. The next does wear in but the body… barely wears in
@bagazheful because it's my guitar, and I can do whatever I want to it? I also like modifying my guitars and working with my hands. If you don't, that's fine. I'm not the only person upset by Fender's false advertising. There are lots of posts about this online.
My strat is 20 years old and played quite a bit. Looks like yours, except for chips in the body finish. Basically new, except oxidized and rusty screws/hardware, and fret wear. I bet Leo would be happy about poly finish! I would say that the only practical downside of poly finish is if the wood isn’t fully cured before finished. Poly doesn’t mix with water, so will seal moisture into the wood; it will resell moisture and protect wood though. Nitro allows moisture in the wood to evaporate over time, which won’t have any effect on an electric guitar that was constructed properly
You nailed it. You have to discover the whole neck, & play it. Im versed in level recrown, but once I complete the process, I play the whole neck..., alot, without noticing additional wear after I go through a guitar. I'd like to add, I've developed a light touch over the years, having learned to relax while playing, also use alot of vibrato, & more deliberate note application. What I noticed is, my fret board is polished in the positions that are chorded, or soloed, but the frets do not re-wear. The lesson I can pass on to any beginners. You're playing guitar, A.)you need guitar tools.., neck level/fret rocker/fret file/ neck radius gauge set/crown file SM 5085/fret dressing file SM1175/ multi bit screwdriver set/small paintbrushes for dusting bridge, & headstock, etc. B.) YOU NEED TO LEARN BASIC SET UP, IT WILL 100% IMPROVE YOUR PLAYING, & TONE. Fix your own buzzes, adjust your own truss rod, set your own floyd rose, adjust your own pole pieces, learn to intonate your strings. Your guitar WILL age, even if it is only the woods for a neck, or body. Heck, your axe might be aligned with the right point in space, & time, & go out of adjustment. Learn your axe, age together. TLC goes, a long way.
Bravo, awesome tips! One little tid bit id add if you have never experienced it, nitro relic guitars that also have stainless steel frets. The SS frets do make it a little brighter, but theres something magical about a nitro body and SS frets enabling you to beat the crap out of the frets and have it feel like butter and day 1 frets. I hope more MFG consider that combo, ageless frets but the rest of the guitar allows you to make it your own with no fear of playing hard.
Got a 20 year old jazz bass. One ding near the belt buckle and that’s it. I find people who wear out frets quickly play very hard and the strings beat down the frets. If you have a more careful technique it’s unlikely to happen.
it all depends on how you treat the thing, polyurethane holds up a lot stronger than nitro and its hard to get the raw wood exposed. u can still buckle rash it but looks more sanded down than checked off. most common poly ware is pick scratches and finish chips
@@guitarscience6926 yea ive always hated the way poly chips away. if you want a poly finish to ware closer to nitro u can sand it down to a satin finish with 0000 steel wool but it still wont get the checking
When it rains I leave my Fender professional ii telecaster on the porch for about 2 to 3 hours that gives the brass saddles and the bridge a good beating but make sure it doesn't get to much moisture on it u have to keep a eye on it starting to get just a little rust on the bridge plate.
I prefer the nitro finish on my Setzer Gretsch over the poly Gretsch's. The finish feels better to me. I also like the fact that the finish will wear off over time instead of being coated in poly. I don't think it impacts tone really, but I can feel a difference and prefer the nitro.
If it’s a recent guitar don’t assume the nitro finish is actually the same as vintage nitrocellulose. Fender at least adds plasticizers to it. It will NOT age like a 1950s guitar, not even close.
One of the things to remember is that nitro never really sets on the guitar body its always morphing. Poly sets on the wood and once its on there its on there !
The fret thing i think is a result of good technique and as you mentioned; higher quality alloy. After about 500-800 hours of play (for me about 2 years with 1-2hr/day) my squier cv is finished. I bought a mim classic series after that and it has more play and doesnt even really need its first fret level yet. I use lighter strings and lighter touch now, too.
Interesting. I have a number of CV necks and I'm honestly hesitant to make them everyday players because I'm afraid I'll wear out the cheaper alloy materials. I've recently become a big fan of stainless steel frets. I enjoy the feel and none of my SS fretted necks have developed fret wear over the years.
@@guitarscience6926 yeah its a big difference. Kinda surprised because fret wire is pretty cheap to begin with, also mine is chinese so its possible the indonesian ones have better frets. There are people talking about this online but I guess most people either quit or get another guitar before it becomes a problem? Stainless is interesting, im contemplating getting the tools and refretting it. Dont see any drawbacks with it at all.
I own a 8 or 9 axes at the moment one of my favorites is a Dave rude Flying V I smoke cigarettes but not in my house I really want it to age the binding is yellow already but I hope it yellows one day
I’m not sure about resting the guitar on it’s back vs sitting it and how much that effects string pull other than tuning. More likely there was an environmental change with humidity and temp that took place. When someone says “warped neck” I immediately believe that they don’t understand how adjust the truss rod. Another thing to consider would be an uneven fretboard, but this would be from the factory. I have a Gibson Explorer than needed a fret level because of this. Bought it used but was only a year old (I think that’s why the guy sold it). Once the frets were leveled, the unevenness of the board became a non-issue. Anyway, curvature of the neck can be adjusted with that truss rod. Here in the north east I need to adjust the Rod accordingly depending on what the weather is doing since we have major humidity swings.
Yeah when the GC guy said 'warped neck', I pretty much stopped listening to him. At this point, the guitar is 16 years old and is incredibly stable. Haven't even needed to adjust the truss rod in years, despite having to do so on most of my other guitars seasonally.
Nice! Got a 98 MiM tele that didn't quite make it into this video. I'm not the first, or probably the second owner, but it's still a great axe with 0 problems.
I have a 1997 mim Fender Strat the poly is still pistine but the pickguard has yellowed nicely-also I have wear on the rosewood neck! It looks vintage but ols .
What I'm not understanding is this argument that there's more 'resonance' with nitro. Nitro is softer, wouldn't a soft surface absorb, not reflect vibration?
The tonewood myth on electric guitars makes zero sense. The “logic” is that Nitro is a lighter finish and thus “lets the wood breathe.” Even if that made sense, the application of Nitro was never consistent and sometimes it was even applied on top of a plastic coating.
@@joeltunnah as per google: “Most modern oil varnishes for mid- to high end manufactured violins (violas, celli and double basses) are alkyd varnishes (polyester resin cooked with oil) though some could be phenolic” My man you just played yourself. Not to mention that violin, an acoustic instrument, is NOT A SOLID BODY ELECTRIC GUITAR.
@luistijerina you literally copied the first result in Google. LOL. Gen Z research. Varnish is used on violins, and is nothing like polyurethane in ingredients, application, or results. And if poly doesn't affect resonance, why aren't violins poly'd? A: because it does affect resonance. That's true of a solid or hollowbody instrument. Big manufacturers don't use polyurethane because it sounds better, they use it because it's tougher, faster to apply a thick finish, and cheaper. My man you just played yourself.
Dont replace frets! Do a fret dressing first,It will play better and faster than new frets ,Youll get 10 to 12 more years out of it ,Worked for me my A ,St strat I bought new in97 only had one fret dressing ,It playes better now than it did new, Its played alot and alot of gigs.
I feel like this is a debate more swayed to the cosmetic side of things. Rather than do modern guitars face issues later in life. I think that personally, it's all about charm and having something show some character after you've played it for years, not does it sound better...feeling better you might say perhaps. Anyway It's crazy out there on the relic/ vintage / aged topic!
There's definitely something to that. The feel of the 'broken in' neck, and the aged look, are why I love that guitar. I know I've put the miles on it myself and that makes me like it more.
Nitro is definitely better for acoustic guitars. For instance a Martin. I’ve owned many and they all have a certain tone that poly can’t achieve which is why Martin still uses nitro.
@nicholasaragon4126 play your Strat or Tele without plugging it in. Does it have an acoustic sound you can hear? Yes. Does it resonate? Yes. So it's a relevant question.
@@joeltunnah You're right. I'm a dumbass. Dang. This whole time I've been playing my electric guitars into Amps, PAs, and recording interfaces. I just assumed that's the way to play considering I've never been to a concert or heard a recording where someone is playing their electric instrument unplugged. I'll play unplugged from now on. Thanks for showing me the error of my ways.
@nicholasaragon4126 I'll ignore your childish response and try to continue a dialog. So according to you, since body resonance makes no difference at all to an electric guitar, semi-hollow and hollowbody electrics are just, what exactly? Marketing gimmicks for dumb people? Is there a difference in tone between a Les Paul special and standard? Same electronics.
I have a 2024 American Vintage II ‘57 Strat, and the finish is a top layer of what their marketing calls “nitrocellulose” (it’s not), over an extremely hard, thick layer of plastic. The “nitro” has plasticizers added to it, and you cannot put checks in it no matter what you do. It’s really false advertising on Fender’s part, and was one of the main reasons I bought the guitar.
Fender does this to avoid warranty issues and returns from shipping climate finish damage.
I’ve since sanded the entire finish off (with much difficulty), and I’m going to put a hand rubbed varnish from StewMac on it.
Agreed. It’s deceiving. That’s why I went MJT for my telecaster. I did buy a road work fender strat, which is supposed to be nitro finished. The next does wear in but the body… barely wears in
I'm sorry but... Why would you do that to a new guitar? There's a lot of options on a second hand market.
@bagazheful because it's my guitar, and I can do whatever I want to it? I also like modifying my guitars and working with my hands. If you don't, that's fine.
I'm not the only person upset by Fender's false advertising. There are lots of posts about this online.
My strat is 20 years old and played quite a bit. Looks like yours, except for chips in the body finish. Basically new, except oxidized and rusty screws/hardware, and fret wear. I bet Leo would be happy about poly finish!
I would say that the only practical downside of poly finish is if the wood isn’t fully cured before finished. Poly doesn’t mix with water, so will seal moisture into the wood; it will resell moisture and protect wood though. Nitro allows moisture in the wood to evaporate over time, which won’t have any effect on an electric guitar that was constructed properly
You nailed it. You have to discover the whole neck, & play it. Im versed in level recrown, but once I complete the process, I play the whole neck..., alot, without noticing additional wear after I go through a guitar. I'd like to add, I've developed a light touch over the years, having learned to relax while playing, also use alot of vibrato, & more deliberate note application. What I noticed is, my fret board is polished in the positions that are chorded, or soloed, but the frets do not re-wear. The lesson I can pass on to any beginners. You're playing guitar, A.)you need guitar tools..,
neck level/fret rocker/fret file/
neck radius gauge set/crown file SM 5085/fret dressing file SM1175/
multi bit screwdriver set/small paintbrushes for dusting bridge, & headstock, etc. B.) YOU NEED TO LEARN BASIC SET UP, IT WILL 100% IMPROVE YOUR PLAYING, & TONE. Fix your own buzzes, adjust your own truss rod, set your own floyd rose, adjust your own pole pieces, learn to intonate your strings. Your guitar WILL age, even if it is only the woods for a neck, or body. Heck, your axe might be aligned with the right point in space, & time, & go out of adjustment. Learn your axe, age together. TLC goes, a long way.
Totally agree. Great advice. I used to get frustrated and stop playing when a guitar would go 'out'. Now I just adjust and enjoy it again!
@@guitarscience6926 CHEERS!
Bravo, awesome tips! One little tid bit id add if you have never experienced it, nitro relic guitars that also have stainless steel frets. The SS frets do make it a little brighter, but theres something magical about a nitro body and SS frets enabling you to beat the crap out of the frets and have it feel like butter and day 1 frets. I hope more MFG consider that combo, ageless frets but the rest of the guitar allows you to make it your own with no fear of playing hard.
Got a 20 year old jazz bass. One ding near the belt buckle and that’s it.
I find people who wear out frets quickly play very hard and the strings beat down the frets. If you have a more careful technique it’s unlikely to happen.
it all depends on how you treat the thing, polyurethane holds up a lot stronger than nitro and its hard to get the raw wood exposed. u can still buckle rash it but looks more sanded down than checked off. most common poly ware is pick scratches and finish chips
The scratches don't bother me much but the chips look awful. But if you're careful, it holds up pretty well like my guitar in the video.
@@guitarscience6926 yea ive always hated the way poly chips away. if you want a poly finish to ware closer to nitro u can sand it down to a satin finish with 0000 steel wool but it still wont get the checking
Yeah, it chips off. When I got my first chip in my Jazz, I kind of gave up on it. It kind of looks like Swiss cheese in some spots.
When it rains I leave my Fender professional ii telecaster on the porch for about 2 to 3 hours that gives the brass saddles and the bridge a good beating but make sure it doesn't get to much moisture on it u have to keep a eye on it starting to get just a little rust on the bridge plate.
I prefer the nitro finish on my Setzer Gretsch over the poly Gretsch's. The finish feels better to me. I also like the fact that the finish will wear off over time instead of being coated in poly. I don't think it impacts tone really, but I can feel a difference and prefer the nitro.
If it’s a recent guitar don’t assume the nitro finish is actually the same as vintage nitrocellulose. Fender at least adds plasticizers to it. It will NOT age like a 1950s guitar, not even close.
One of the things to remember is that nitro never really sets on the guitar body its always morphing. Poly sets on the wood and once its on there its on there !
My ‘87 American Standard Strat is starting to show a little bit of aging and checking, but not nearly what a nitrocellulose paint job would show.
I've had same thing happening. American Strat, no strap locks, falls face down on the ground. Pick it up and literally, no scratch on it.
The fret thing i think is a result of good technique and as you mentioned; higher quality alloy. After about 500-800 hours of play (for me about 2 years with 1-2hr/day) my squier cv is finished. I bought a mim classic series after that and it has more play and doesnt even really need its first fret level yet. I use lighter strings and lighter touch now, too.
Interesting. I have a number of CV necks and I'm honestly hesitant to make them everyday players because I'm afraid I'll wear out the cheaper alloy materials. I've recently become a big fan of stainless steel frets. I enjoy the feel and none of my SS fretted necks have developed fret wear over the years.
@@guitarscience6926 yeah its a big difference. Kinda surprised because fret wire is pretty cheap to begin with, also mine is chinese so its possible the indonesian ones have better frets. There are people talking about this online but I guess most people either quit or get another guitar before it becomes a problem?
Stainless is interesting, im contemplating getting the tools and refretting it. Dont see any drawbacks with it at all.
I bought a factory fender body painted with polyester it faded over time
My 22 year old, bolt on neck, MIJ Ibanez has no cracks in the finish in the neck pocket.
I own a 8 or 9 axes at the moment one of my favorites is a Dave rude Flying V I smoke cigarettes but not in my house I really want it to age the binding is yellow already but I hope it yellows one day
I’m not sure about resting the guitar on it’s back vs sitting it and how much that effects string pull other than tuning. More likely there was an environmental change with humidity and temp that took place. When someone says “warped neck” I immediately believe that they don’t understand how adjust the truss rod. Another thing to consider would be an uneven fretboard, but this would be from the factory. I have a Gibson Explorer than needed a fret level because of this. Bought it used but was only a year old (I think that’s why the guy sold it). Once the frets were leveled, the unevenness of the board became a non-issue. Anyway, curvature of the neck can be adjusted with that truss rod. Here in the north east I need to adjust the Rod accordingly depending on what the weather is doing since we have major humidity swings.
Yeah when the GC guy said 'warped neck', I pretty much stopped listening to him. At this point, the guitar is 16 years old and is incredibly stable. Haven't even needed to adjust the truss rod in years, despite having to do so on most of my other guitars seasonally.
Yeah, it also makes me rethink the idea of getting a guitar setup at a GC. 😅
The same is true of my 1991 mim Fender Telecaster! It remains almost showroom, after 30 years!
Nice! Got a 98 MiM tele that didn't quite make it into this video. I'm not the first, or probably the second owner, but it's still a great axe with 0 problems.
I have a 1997 mim Fender Strat the poly is still pistine but the pickguard has yellowed nicely-also I have wear on the rosewood neck! It looks vintage but ols .
vintage but new.
My ‘13 has long finish cracks
I have a 2000 American Series Stratocaster that essentially looks brand new, due to the polyurethane. It's 23 years old!
What I'm not understanding is this argument that there's more 'resonance' with nitro. Nitro is softer, wouldn't a soft surface absorb, not reflect vibration?
The tonewood myth on electric guitars makes zero sense. The “logic” is that Nitro is a lighter finish and thus “lets the wood breathe.” Even if that made sense, the application of Nitro was never consistent and sometimes it was even applied on top of a plastic coating.
Then explain to me why nobody puts polyurethane on violins.
@@joeltunnah as per google: “Most modern oil varnishes for mid- to high end manufactured violins (violas, celli and double basses) are alkyd varnishes (polyester resin cooked with oil) though some could be phenolic”
My man you just played yourself. Not to mention that violin, an acoustic instrument, is NOT A SOLID BODY ELECTRIC GUITAR.
@luistijerina you literally copied the first result in Google. LOL. Gen Z research.
Varnish is used on violins, and is nothing like polyurethane in ingredients, application, or results.
And if poly doesn't affect resonance, why aren't violins poly'd? A: because it does affect resonance. That's true of a solid or hollowbody instrument. Big manufacturers don't use polyurethane because it sounds better, they use it because it's tougher, faster to apply a thick finish, and cheaper.
My man you just played yourself.
Dont replace frets! Do a fret dressing first,It will play better and faster than new frets ,Youll get 10 to 12 more years out of it ,Worked for me my A ,St strat I bought new in97 only had one fret dressing ,It playes better now than it did new, Its played alot and alot of gigs.
I feel like this is a debate more swayed to the cosmetic side of things. Rather than do modern guitars face issues later in life.
I think that personally, it's all about charm and having something show some character after you've played it for years, not does it sound better...feeling better you might say perhaps. Anyway It's crazy out there on the relic/ vintage / aged topic!
There's definitely something to that. The feel of the 'broken in' neck, and the aged look, are why I love that guitar. I know I've put the miles on it myself and that makes me like it more.
Nitro is definitely better for acoustic guitars. For instance a Martin. I’ve owned many and they all have a certain tone that poly can’t achieve which is why Martin still uses nitro.
Never leave a capo on your guitar. That wrecks frets.
Yeah pressing the strings onto the frets for weeks on end is probably bad. I don't believe in capos anyway, so I don't have this problem :)
Damn I am getting old. I have a 15 year bass... Where is the ficking time? That look like brand new. Fucking poly...
nice video...
Have an SG going on 20 years and still no checking reliced guitars is a hoax lmao
My whole 2017 SG is checked top to bottom
👍
i’m trying to tel if this dude trolling or not
There is absolutely no advantage to a plastic encased instrument of any kid.
Exactly. Why don’t they use polyurethane on violins, cellos, etc? Because it kills tone and resonance.
@@joeltunnahThose are ACOUSTIC instruments. This is an ELECTRIC instrument. Not even in the same ballpark.
@nicholasaragon4126 play your Strat or Tele without plugging it in. Does it have an acoustic sound you can hear? Yes. Does it resonate? Yes. So it's a relevant question.
@@joeltunnah You're right. I'm a dumbass. Dang. This whole time I've been playing my electric guitars into Amps, PAs, and recording interfaces. I just assumed that's the way to play considering I've never been to a concert or heard a recording where someone is playing their electric instrument unplugged. I'll play unplugged from now on. Thanks for showing me the error of my ways.
@nicholasaragon4126 I'll ignore your childish response and try to continue a dialog. So according to you, since body resonance makes no difference at all to an electric guitar, semi-hollow and hollowbody electrics are just, what exactly? Marketing gimmicks for dumb people?
Is there a difference in tone between a Les Paul special and standard? Same electronics.