Calculate Solar Cost For Your Home - geni.us/solar_reviews 2 Panel Micro Inverter Unit (600W) - geni.us/Z4RdX 4 Panel Micro Inverter Unit (1200W) - geni.us/A0AfAL EG4 BrightMount - geni.us/hbaYeE Original video showing Micro Inverter setup - ua-cam.com/video/ut6LA5faRmI/v-deo.html DISCLAIMER: This video and description contain affiliate links, which means that if you click on one of the product links, I’ll receive a small commission.
@Everyday Solar To answer your question about the electrolytic capacitors: they should NOT run hot or even warm. That would be a sign that they are incorrectly rated for the application. Electrolytic capacitors tend to have a short life in cheap inverters and charge controllers but failure is usually obvious because the top of the capacitor will fracture and vent smoke OR the rubber plug in the bottom of the capacitor will be pushed out. Yours look OK. More likely that a fuse has melted or a semiconductor has blown. It's hard to tell from the video but it does appear that the semiconductor immediately above the toroidal coil (top right on the lower PCB) has exploded.
FYI, I am more familiar to much larger inverter systems. The semiconductors to which you are referring are likely SCR gates, a very common item in an inverter. They are the units that know when to feed the electricity back in and on which correct part of the AC cycle to feed it. And the SCR gates generally are the main source of failures in them. They take a beating. Could be a fuse if there is one. The pads on the capacitor, likely those are simply insulators to separate the aluminum body of the case from the metal part of the capacitor. Someone mentioned that electrolytic capacitors regularly fail. Yes, that is somewhat true. However, you need to consider the practical use to their implementation. If you used a same farad rated foil wrapped capacitor in that spot, it would have to be much larger in physical size and more expensive, that is if it is even available in the first place. Larger inverter systems use oil capacitors and with constant use it is recommended those capacitors be replaced every 7 or so years. Electrolytic capacitors actually hold up better/longer than oil filled, but can't match the rated capacity of oil filled for the physical size of the capacitor. It is basically the only real practical option you have in this type of environment.
Yes, in high speed switching circuits used in digital inverters likenthis, electrolytic capacitors DO get warm and/or hot, because they are discharged/recharged very fast (thousands of times per second), and this causes heating due to internal resistance. The solar panel is providing energy to the inverter, but the solar panel has relatively high output impedance, so the large capacitors have a lot of work to do - to keep the DC voltage stable.
Yeah those Transistors are going to try to dump alot of heat and theyre from CHYNA...Theyre all from CHYNA so thats not a critique on the quality of the unit. Im not seeing a major heat sink. Much less a fan cooled 1. Sometimes they have resistors associated with them that they take out too. It doesnt look like that here. To answer you question on caps. No. Sometimes they fail without visible signs of damage. I think very rarely have I replaced one that showed visible signs of damage, that wasnt my fault for trying to plug it in. If its old they usually fail with no signs of damage, outside of testing. Has nothing to do with this topic since its most likely that rail of transistors. If I was going to re engineer this I would add a push thru forced air cooled heatsink, mounting the transistors up right. put that fan as my intake and add an exhaust case fan. If that didnt solve it then figure out how to up rate the transistors on the power dissipation rating...Like anybody listens tho. Reminds me of Bass guitar amps. where you want max watts for max. loudness so alot of companies want to rate on the edge of what the transistor can safely do long term. Like solar since everyone wants to meek out max. powah. Safely? Long term? hear it looks like not even out of the box. From what Im thinking is if chyna says 3600watts you dont uprate that, you probably want to down rate by 20%. Obviously theyre playing fast and loose with numbers and not providing 20% head room. I dont know what peoples problems is.
Yes, they do resell that power that feeds back into the grid, but you also profit from your own solar system in the long run. Besides, net metering is significantly better than standard metering with a solar system. Not all electrical companies profit from the power you produce either. for example the power company in Alaska pays you for the power you produce at the end of each year. It starts off as a credit like typically net metering, but instead of losing that credit at the role over period they pay it back to you. Personally, I feel this should be a mandatory change for all electric companies. In theory it's an even transaction where they pay you the same rate you pay for power. Then that power is sold to someone else meaning they don't lose money except in standard operational costs. So I could see them buying it back at a reduced rate to cover the cost of maintenance.
@@GadgetTopTips-u7e That's correct but millions of people need to find that out the hard way. They think they're saving the planet but the power company could care less when someone messes with their profit. That's why power companies have political fights to increase usage rates for everyone. Power companies are not anyone's friend, they are greed-driven.
An electrical suicide plug, also known as a male-to-male extension cord, is a highly dangerous device. These cords have male plugs on both ends, unlike regular extension cords that have one male (protruding plug) end and one female (receptacle) end. @@joefrisco
Right. I wonder why we even show these videos to DIYers. Someone is going to get killed someday...but the youtuber will still cash his check. We have electrician's licenses for a reason folks.
@@hildacorea No...just an educated electrician that knows how dangerous electricity is. But be my guest. Electricity doesn't care who you are and when a DYIer hurts or kills someone I'm sure you'll blame the govt.
As an experiment, can you turn your breakers off so the home is not drawing power and show a video of your meter while it is backfeeding. Let’s see if it goes backwards, forwards or stay stationary. I hear lots of opinions, but I have never seen this experiment. thank you.
I've done it several times. It depends on the meter. Many of the old analog meters will most definitely spin backwards. The new digital smart meters will throw an error code... and contact the power company. So don't try it with the smart meters, unless you want the power company to come knocking on your door!
Yes the old ones with the wheel will spin backwards, the newer ones are uni-directional, so if it doesnt give you an error, you will be paying for the backfed power you fed into the grid just the same as if you used it from the grid. The meter doesn't know what way power is traveling it only tracks the amount that passes through it, regardless of if it is going into the house, or being backfed to the grid. bi-directional meter is necessary unless you have the old style. @@ssoffshore5111
@@RonaldDaub-xi5jz Smart meters, if they detect a reverse flow......will trigger a code to the Utility company, also they will bill you as Usage whether if the meter is running backwards or forward.
Turning breakers off is will make your electric bill go down even if those rooms didn’t have anything plugged in and being used. The dissipation of electricity happens at every device, every wire nut or termination point dissipates electricity. So turning the breaker off actually greatly diminishes that dissipation. For 1 entire month, turn off every breaker to your house when you leave for work except the AC and the refrigerator. Then turn them on as you need them once home, do that experiment and report back
I'd always prefer to have a solar backup to mains so I'd prefer batteries. Here in the UK feed-in payments have gone down, they were 100% at first but now it's about 5%. Most times I want backup power, it's already dark so a charged battery is more use than a dark solar panel.
So, the little black devices in the middle of the unit are the things that need heat sinking. If there is a heat issue, it would be there, not the 3 capacitors. You would need to check on the type of devices there. You could also use a infrared camera while the unit is open to check if there is one of those that appears to be hotter than the others. I will bet it will not be easy to get a schematic with parts information, but if you see one or more getting hotter, you can look at the part and there usually is identifying information on them. If you have a warranty, I would not go further, if not and you want to repair, find those parts. desolder the hot ones, and replace them with new parts. Be sure to apply a heat sink compound.
Just do it. How are they Really gonna know unless you have nosey neighbors OR you live in an HOA. Idk....this is America. I just have a hard time asking anyone to anything to my own home. I'd put that thing in my backyard and the county would never know.
@@everydaysolarthere are NO plugin in inverters that meet code requirements in the USA, they are also not UL listed with a plug and adding a plug voids the UL listing.
Had my 2kw solar/9kw battery system producing easily 80% of my needs 4 years now, the first year it produced 95% which was a bit of a struggle in winter but is still amazing for such a small system. Installed it myself so payback is already achieved. Since I did it, its even easier to do yourself with all in one boxes and is a no brainer for anywhere with decent sun.
It addtion to the pads on each of the 6 capacitors, it looks like they may have forgotten to remove the adhesive blue tape from the two big rectangular thermal pads on the components next to the capacitors. It might be resulting in less heat transfer to the case from those components. You can see they made allowance on the cover for those pads to also dissapate heat.
And we can't see if there's sufficient excess thickness of the thermal transfer tape to be compressed. They shouldn't be using that kind of tape, it should be non-adhesive pads (or one-side adhesive) so the cover would be removable for servicing. It would also help if the main lower enclosure had wider lips allowing for more get transfer to the rest of the box. (sure isn't an outdoor weather-proof box, is it?)
I did multiple grid-tie with the crypto mining boom a few years back. Really lowered imported electricity and Bill but my meter never registered/logged any exported electricity so they had a freebie at times. Now I'm semi off grid with LFP batteries and hybrid inverter. I just need to install more panels as what I do have won't maintain batteries on rainy winter days and switches back to grid. Once I'm certain to produce enough solar on the worst days ill get my electricity service disconnected and save $1.60 per day of service charges.
I have 38 panels on my roof and the company talking 20k to install storage setup, what numbers do I need to find out what I need to store energy?HELP!!!
I need to know the best beginner's package...Then each step there after to lead to a full up & running solar system...Someone noted that the companies have no true knowledge or experience, playing it by ear...I need to know...My local electric company has no program at this time...
I just added a two 400 watt panel "Plug and Play" system. Not so much to reduce my electric bill, but we had a power outage and I thought, OK, now what do I do? Bought an EcoFlow Delta 2 and extra battery to keep some electricity 'stored'. Another point is with all the storms, floods, etc. It makes good sense to have some autonomous power capability! I lived on the Gulf Coast for 30 years and we always kept food, water, and extra gasoline in case of hurricanes. My wife is from California and they do the same in case of earthquakes. They don't happen often, but a thousand bucks of insurance will help when they do!
Yes, though this requires a completely different system design, using a hybrid inverter. Small micro inverters can not supply power when there is no grid available... guess it's something like the new Enphase iq8 series - which is capable of creating a micro-grid on just solar alone (very unique), or with a storage battery system. (but it's Solar alone mode can't be enabled without more components from them)
Yes I realized that after a bit of reflection. In my case I can easily disconnect the micro inverter and directly charge my ecoflow. So does that also mean that Thousands of homes with solar panels are useless if the grid goes down ?
@@RobertAnthony-m4q Yep... unless they have a hybrid inverter... and solar-alone as a "grid-loss backup" isn't exactly reliable... ergo why people usually add a backup battery bank.
@@beforebefore It may be better if everything that doesn't need to operate when the user is ready is smart controlled so they can be set to just operate when solar output is sufficient. Like a washing machine or dryer. Load it, delegate to the system to determine when the power is good and will be long enough and auto start it. Though a dryer could be a box with a window and clothes lines inside, vents for optimal passive flow, painted black outside, white or chrome/metalic/mirrors inside.
Thanks for the follow up and I tried to warn people that microinverter is not going to pass code and does not appear to be safe. There are no heat sinks or fans on that unit. Don't recommend anyone buy one and look at off grid system components from reputable dealers not a plug n system that could burn your house down or cost you your insurance coverage.
There is a 600 Watt with 120V out micro inverter made by NEP that looks to have all the certifications needed. I have an email sent out to my utility to get their feedback on this type of setup being approved for Net Metering. Not getting my hopes up but more curious than anything to see what they say.
@ solar cabin I'd rather offset my usage by putting energy into a battery bank and inverter, using it to help lower our usage some. I did see an Asian guy do something similar to what this poster did, but he used a grid tie inverter, plugged into a power strip surge protector, plugged into the wall, to offset some of his usage. He also demonstrated that if there's no power it's not feeding back into the grid. I liked his set up better, but I still would rather offset some of my usage with a battery bank and inverter, or a larger solar generator, that can handle say a refrigerator, freezer, or small ac. For a little bit. Or whilst the sun is out with pass through charging.
While I didn't look up the model of this inverter. Others responding to this thread stated it is a "grid tie" unit. If so, it monitors the grid line Fq, Phase, and Voltage. It will dynamically adjust to synchronize to the grid parameters to optimize load conditions. If designed to regulatory codes, it will also disable it's output if the grid voltage goes under a predetermined "Low Voltage Shutdown threshold". IE, is designed specifically not to back feed solar power to the grid during a grid power outage! There are a multitude of NEC, and Fed/State code and regulations pertaining to grid-tied solar installs. *(While not legal, or advised), and used only for testing on highways in Mexico. 🙄 Simple circuit Breaker(s), adequate sized AWG wire between the micro-inverter and the structure's load panel, and good Earth ground bonding, (is hypothetically) enough to protect from wiring fires from a single defective 1200Watt micro-inverter. Although, it is worth mentioning that many DIY residential solar systems do increase the likelihood of lighting damage to said structure and contents! 👀
Has to be hooked to the grid to work. It can't be hooked to another inverter or generator. Grid tie inverters work by increasing voltage to push power.
I have an old Y&H/ecoworthy inverter (I think they're part of the same company). What I found is that you cant run them a full wattage/full amperage. You need to halve that or it fails. They're coy with the specs on what tolerances their components have. I suspect the top wattages are the company being a little loose with the truth. Some of the ones I looked at inside had some quality control issues where connections had been reversed on the mp4 connectors. I'd strongly suggest checking your polarity on the unit (even the panels).
They are not lying about the voltage. It can cope with the higher wattage but it has to be in a fairly cool environment with a breeze. Some solar erase can have fans mounted to satisfy this requirement.
I'd be interested to get a used solar panel just to run some lights and chargers. Even if it doesn't feed into the grid, it would still replace some power we would otherwise have to pay the utility for.
I do exactly that. I use a EF ECOFLOW Portable Power Station DELTA 2 with 100w panel and charge my power tool batteries and if it hits 100% I plug it into the Tesla! All of it cost me $750 and I will never pay me for the cost and my time, but I love knowing that I am farming my own power:)
Easy enough to do. Just beware of the cheap (Under $20 charge controllers) they are typically rated at 30A. I wouldn't trust them past 10A. Basically, 1x100W panel. I blew up 4-5 of them figuring this out. Hooked up to 2 panels they'd last anywhere from a month to six months. They are designed to be solar powered light pole charge and light controllers. Great for little setups, or you know, solar powered light poles. At this they work just fine.
The issue here is if there is not enough sun and something doesn’t charge you would have to probably invest in a transfer switch and stuff so that if it stops making powerful the charges the grid power can charge things so the grid time away makes sense here
Another informative video, thank you for taking the time to do this experiment. I have 4 GTI installed and on my 1300 watt setup I am getting right around 1 Kw per day and using over 20, so my ROI is over 9 years but offsets and fun are PRICELESS!
it just shows us how far people have to go to gesture the aesthetic of maintaining any sort of control over their lives and then woops, nope, thought you had a great idea to beat the system but now the bottom half of your inverter throws an error light and your idea of energy independence is a non-starter.
Thank you for sharing your experience with solar panels! It's great to see people like you taking steps towards sustainability. If you're interested in a reliable backup power solution for your outdoor adventures, I highly recommend the Segway Portable PowerStation Cube Series. Its massive capacity, fast recharging, and versatile sockets make it perfect for camping trips and RV use. Plus, its rugged design ensures durability in various weather conditions. Happy camping and enjoy the priceless moments with your family! 🌞🚐
@@ARLGD While I appreciate your generic comments, and have looked at the Segway cube, it falls short of my needs and therefore will NOT become part of my options. This is the 3rd time you have commented on one of my comments, all on other sites and shows you are trying to market for Segway.
You need to realise that it’s not always about payback but the fact that’s it’s generally a one off investment is quite good as well because if the energy prices are very unpredictable that investment initially gives you some predictability
madness ! i was able to get a 10kw system complete was a tear off on a foreclosure. for $3800 (guy paid over 26K installed) i did the math i pay .08-.12 a kw hour. so it would of paid for it self in like 5 years or so. then i was like im not putting all this crap on my roof..... so i sold it all for $7000.... the 3200 profit was like 2 years of free electricty lo....
depends if you diy or get a company to do it..... diy I make about 80 cent an hour.. being the panel thing isnt chewing up power... ours is straight into a charge controller.. batteries the panels were cheap, I bought 10000 off made in china, for about a doller a piece... kept 100 and sold the rest for $20 a piece.... storage is the only thing you need... of course they go fast if you sell $300 panels for $20 :-)
For Safety and stability, you should be using a Growatt grid tie inverter. Can add an export limiter so you never back feed anything to the grid, thus does not require a net metering agreement
Based on Availability and price. These tiny ones have lots of issues, even the ones from Enphase have issues. Using something more robust and active cooling will keep them working longer and some have UL Listings making them pass your home insurance requirements.
@@RiggerBrew your information is old. Enphase had problems many many years ago. Today they are rocksolid reliable and active cooling would be a truly dumb idea. Cooling fans fail all the time, a large heat sink never fails.
@@ericeric9208 well said, I am doing exactly what you just described. I had my own solar business for 10 years and I quit because I was sick and tired of permitting and dealing with the local electric utilities. So even though I did everything above board for 10 years I am now using my system behind the meter and I never back feed the grid and screw them! I am not bothering with a permit!
I have a grid tie inverter and pay 12 bucks for a connection fee. Once the warranty on the inverter is up i want to screw the power company also and go off grid since they give me nothing back in Oregon for my excess power. What system do you use? Finding an inverter that is reasonably priced but made to last seems like a suspect proposition currently. 5.44 kw and looking to add kw also in the future. @@Riceman-o1p
I have a background in electrical. I've also installed my own 18 kW grid tide system. Can I can honestly tell you that that micro inverter is way under sized? Or those panels are way oversized for that inverter. You should only be using about 275 Watt panels max. On that micro inverter. That is why you are burning up that inverter. For 360 watt panels, you should be using a sixteen hundred watt micronuter.
I'm all for the the alternative power source, but, unless I am located in the middle of nowhere, I really don't see the need for solar energy and it is confirmed with this video. Very informative and no biased review and for that, you earned my sub!!!
The need comes in after the payback period where all the energy the panels produces is free, which can be significant considering power companies are always increasing the rates. And if your area has frequent power outages solar with battery storage system can be a life saver.
In Australia every third house has roof top solar and the saving are quite dramatic across the board especially if you can afford a storage battery. There are government backed cheap loans available so payback time is reasonable. It used to be a lot better but the power companies have wound back their payments for your excess power . You do have to change your usage pattern a bit to do the heavy electrical use jobs during the daylight hours if you can. In the city of Melbourne alone the power produced from roof top solar equals the output of one of our old coal fired power stations. Night time hours will always be a problem with solar power but with better storage systems being developed and redesigning the power grid to take advantage of our time zones it will become more usable. My personal annual power costs have been cut by two thirds and when I upgrade from a 5 Kw to a 7Kw system by adding more panels the cost will reduce even more. If you have the sunlight put the panels on your roof.
Well I'm not in the middle of nowhere and my solar system offsets my electrical consumption by about $200 per month. And I did it myself so I paid less than $10,000 for it..
@@Riceman-o1p I agree! I have had my system for over a decade, so basically I haven't had an electric bill in most of that time. And now I drive an EV and my system fills its tank for free too!
Looked into this, but was told by some UA-camrs that the power that they fed into their house actually ended up costing them because house meter couldn't tell that this energy was being directed into the house not used from the grid. Hope that makes sense.
I've been told the same thing; unless your meter is specifically set up for delivery back to the grid (ie net metering), you will likely get charged for the kWh you produce because the meter doesnt know if the power is coming or going.
I think you get charged for the power coming in and also the power going out if you are producing excess power and don't have a net metering agreement. This should mean if your appliances are consuming 2 kW of power and you are producing 1 kW of power you would only be getting billed at the 1 kW power consumption. I also bet this is varies across the different utility companies.
You exceeded the wattage Input. The power supply is only rated for 300 watts input as it states on the Amazon listing. So on a sunny day, it likely burned up that side of the inverter.
The inverter type you are using is know for having over heating problems. I suggest the indoor type that is fan cooled or the larger more expensive type that is made to handle an entire system of panels.
Taking into account: initial cost of solar panels, mounting panels, converters, installation permits, electrical permits, electrical inspections, testing, and HOA approval, I have concerns on maintenance. Snow removal from panels, dust removal, cleaning of panels, hail damage, and who do you call for repairs, maintenance, replacement of converter, electrical parts, or damaged solar panels, or worn damaged wiring over time ? ? ? Sounds expensive, a hassle and not worth the effort.
It is worth it if you are smart enough to figure it out and want to change the current polluted environment that we are forded to use from the fossil fuel industry. Otherwise you are at the mercy of the utility and oil companies to keep feeding you power that is still not 100% clean yet. Maybe one day it will be clean but not with the pace they are moving currently.
@@DanielDTUBWeinberger Yeah only for the environment or if you know how to do it. If you don't know then yes it is not worth it, but like anything in life if you research and learn then you can do many things that seem impossible. You just have to want to do it for the right reason and then you can have a solar system that will have a full ROI in less than 5 years.
Mounting constant things like that are very low if you’re a bit clever how you do it but generally for ground mount array there are a lot less approvals due to the lower risk involved of a house burning down
Before you even consider solar you must first do a power audit on your home and increase the efficiency. This will save you big money on your solar. I saved 47% by increasing the efficiency and didn’t need the large solar they told me I needed.
Wondering if the failure could be caused by condensation. If the unit is getting damp inside, any moisture could have dripped to the lower board and shorted it out. Maybe inspect closely and see if you see any signs of water.
Need at least 4kw to come anywhere near running a normal house, inverters need to be rated at least 20-30% over what the max input and needed output are, so they last longer, same for batterys.
I was at a home show at Florida state fair. And there was a guy that was selling this thing that went between your meter and power panel and it would send power back to a through your house basically slowing your meter while not affecting your your neighbors on the lines. I kinda understood it made sense. Because ac power just goes from one house to the next with the meter just being the go between. But all three big eclectic companies shut his product down and it was on the news and they said it was working by slowing down your meter. But I ain't no electrician expert.
Just to clarify multiple houses, buildings may be on a single stepdown transformer from the grid. The power is NOT daisy chained from the first house/meter to the next, and so on. Rather, all loads (structures) are connected to said transformer in parallel. Now, I'm just guessing on the "band power-saver device". There were/are fake BS devices, purported to save energy sold on the Internet. And then there are real ways to trick power meters with electronics. They modify the way the load is presented to the meter. I won't go into details, as I don't want the feds knocking on my door.
This is the kind of setup I wanted to do to learn solar. Something like 8 panels on the ground to offset power use. Im at $0.30 a kwh here. Hoping you do a video with a functional setup.
The most important tip is the installation of a -Anti - Islanding- circuit and a Manuel cut off to not energize the the lines while they are being repaired,for safty .
I have 32 kW system at my house.I did myself. Middle of the summer I put back 130-140 kw a day. winter maybe 40. Summertime when it rains it still spins backwards😊
I have a system that overproduces.at the end of the year they pay you for the difference,and then you start afresh. Come come January. They usually pay me $03 which is nothing
@@williamkreth you have to check because it depends on local things and really what energy company you are with Austin they can change the meter out for free or at the cost. It depends on a lot of things but if it’s at a cost they can offer you the 30 year lower payback or you paying for that meter change
If you want to add solar power without a grid connection, you need batteries, which are enormously expensive. But you could use a heat battery: Heat a tank full of water or sand directly with your solar electricity, and draw that heat to warm your house or water as needed when the sun is not shining.
Well if you are going to open it up and do the things, if you have a 12V source, install a chassis fan for cooling, you can also get heatsinks that you can stick onto the back side of the unit. They use a layer of sticky that is also a thermal conducting layer. Probably could do the same thing inside the unit, with some of those small heatsinks that you can attach to PI processors. Do that while pushing air through the unit, I'll bet you stop getting the overheating errors.
Thank you for the video.. I was curious to see how this would perform. Regarding the failure... Is it possible that too much voltage/amperage got into the microinverter? Its a 1200W inverter hooked to 1440W of panels. Yes, I understand losses. But you mentioned that it was super cold when they failed. If they got some good light while cold, they could have produced over the 300W microinverter rating and harmed the (lets just says "sensitive") electronics inside the micro right? Thanks!
I usually take Chinese ratings and divide them in 1/2. If they say 1200 watts, it's probably really 600 watts. If I was going to do this, I'd pick a 2400 watt inverter. Running things on the edge is asking for failure.
@@quademasters249 Electronics seem to last much longer when they are not maxed out. Look at the Dubai LED light bulb. Longest lasting because it operates at 1/4 of the max rating.
@@Denniss7420 In the army all the ratings were doubled. If the design required a 1 watt resistor a 2 watt resister was used instead. With the Chinese it's just the opposite. When they say "600 watts" you know it's "300 watts".
I run my y&h older 700watt model with 780 watts 36v. Its been running for over two years still works even though its so hot you cant even hold your hand to it. It puts out about 2.5 AC kwh per day. My kwh cost is 30 cents so it produces 75 cents of power per day or around 22 bucks per month (4 months to payoff the inverter)
Bro, you could literally cut the neighbor's grass one day a month and make more than $22. I legit don't understand why people are chasing this solar stuff. The ROI is terrible unless you have a gigantic, underutilized system *and* you are in a state that favors solar.
We make 8 to 12 Kwhrs off grid per day in the summer and 2 to 5 Kwhrs per day in the winter here in TN off grid. Whole house depends on solar as there is no utility. Starting in Nov,Dec, Jan and some of Feb we use 1/4 gallon of gas at night for those months when the suns not out or 1 gallon of gas per day if it continues the following day of no sun. So 21 days of the year we're burning a little fuel. Math thats roughly $3 a gallon x21 = $63 a year.
What’s the ceramic heater you use? Sounds like a good solution. I’ve been looking for some good backup heat sources. I’ve got some buddy heaters just in case but wouldn’t sleep while those are running. I got some of those hot water bags too that I can heat with solar electric or with a jet stove outside. I was thinking of getting a backup merge by wood stove too but looks like they could be dangerous. Im in East TN.
The Y&H 1200W Solar Grid Tie Micro Inverter you've described is a specific type of inverter designed for use in grid-tied solar power systems. Here are some key features and information about this particular microinverter: The microinverter has a power capacity of 1200W, which means it can handle a maximum power input of 1200 watts from the solar panels. This microinverter is designed for grid-tied solar power systems. In grid-tied systems, the solar panels generate electricity, and the microinverter converts the DC power generated by the panels into AC power that can be fed into the electrical grid. MPPT (Maximum Power Point Tracking): The microinverter likely features MPPT technology, which optimizes the power output from the solar panels by adjusting the operating point to the maximum power point. The PV (photovoltaic) input range is specified as DC28-50V, indicating the compatible input voltage range from the solar panels. The AC output range is specified as AC80-160V. It comes equipped with a monitoring display screen that allows users to view data related to the inverter's performance. This can include information such as power output, voltage, and other relevant data. The microinverter has an IP65 waterproof rating, which means it is designed to be protected against dust and low-pressure water jets from any direction. This level of protection makes it suitable for outdoor installation. It's crucial to ensure that the microinverter is compatible with the specific solar panels and system requirements you have. Check the specifications and compatibility guidelines provided by the manufacturer. Installation: Microinverters are typically installed on or near the solar panels. The AC output is then connected to the electrical grid. Ensure that the microinverter complies with relevant safety standards and regulations in your region.
@@Elise-song yes aluminum should be very strong - but where i live its very windy and you need concrete or Stakes to keep everything in place during storms.
Thanks for the video. I thought about solar for backup power needs, but because of where I live (Gulf Coast) and the weather here, I ended up going with a natural gas generator.
Your issue for the damage of the inverter most likely stems from the low temperature that you experienced. Temperature effects power output from the PV array. The lower the temperature the higher the voltage from the array. I would dare to say that due to the low temperature the array power output raised and damaged the inverter due to excessive voltage and power. Bear in mind that the power curve rating for the modules are given for standard test conditions (STC= 77 degrees F). When calculating maximum power input for the inverter, we need to take into account the minimum ambient temperatures that the modules will experience.
Your local inspector would red tag your installation within seconds. You are back feeding an outlet made to supply power. You have also installed a male plug on your system, when unplugged could become energized. Go to home depot and buy the correct outlet, and then wire a female outlet on your system. That would mean you would have to turn your extension cord to work the opposite way.
Actually on this one I called the inspector and he gave the green light. This micro inverter will not supply power unless it detects power at the outlet. So this will ensure no back feeding is the power goes out and also that the prongs aren't hot when unplugged.
Just getting into solar but I agree on the Emporia energy monitoring system. Had it for about 6 months now and it really helps you see where your energy dollars are going. Good video.
Just an FYI you might want to clarify with your utility some Smart meters charge you for putting power back onto the grid. Basically anytime power comes from the grid or from your house you get charged if it passes through the meter. It happened to me in an apartment Several months after I installed it they updated To a smart meter and they told me, Then I was able to track and verify it. If you don't want to be charged for the extra power you feed the grid you need a limiter on your inverter connected to One leg of your power box.
Excellent Point! After my solar system was installed, the installer turned the system on prior to the utility approving net metering for billing. It took two months for the approval, so in July and August my solar production was billed to me ($400 per month) rather than being credited to my account.
We don't use much electricity, and realistically the only things that matter are the fridge and the furnace. We have a backup setup that covers that with some in-between use on jobsites. Worth the peace of mind alone.
I use compressed air to run generators instead of DIRECTLY sourcing solar for power, but what I do to get around all the rules is, I have "emergency" outlets in my house - not grid tied, so no problems with Code or power company rules. Also, I use cheap ($35) solar panels to run small compressors whenever there's sunshine, so my 2,000 gallons of compressed air is free.
Compressed air powered generator system like that would be horribly inefficient... a battery bank would be far, FAR more efficient and reliable. There are so many great sources of "used" LiFePo4 batteries these days, with tons of life left in them... and needing no maintenance. You have so many losses in both directions.... electricity to compressed air, then compressed air back to electricity... and how do you regulate the electricity to correct voltage and frequency??
You need a 2 way meter that your utility provides. A lot depends on how much power you normally use. I have a 4 kW grid tied system on Arizona. My home is all electric. It is a very efficient home. I make more than i use every month .
Interesting stuff!😎 Perchance is there a very small glass fuse (similar to old automotive fuses) soldered into the circuit like they have on modern fluorescent ballasts which are actually unserviceable?
Man I'm so glad I watched this before I pulled the trigger on buying that inverter. On a side note did you ever find something decent? Also for my setup I wanted to put a transfer switch for the inverter and a boost charge controller because it's a small bike shed where I can charge my ebike or Sur Ron for free but when it's not charging the bike I can have it feed some power into the grid to supplement my power. It be cool if you ever could do a video like that, but that might just be a special case. Also it would be cool to see a solar shed with just DC power powering it and see if that runs more efficient than transferring everything to AC. Just a thought!
Nice information, but the part I am missing is understanding how you have provided safety for the utility linemen, whenever the ‘grid’ has been shut down for repairs?
The issue may be at the center of the board where all those little back squares are with Philips screws on them. Looks like they just sit on a thermal layer but that's blocking the chips from dissipating any heat to the outside of the box and the box being be air cooled. Those chips should be the same type you would see in a car amplifier, however decent car amps thermal paste each chip and direct mount them to bare metal inside of the amp. Maybe consider testing this as a fix. Pull the bottom board out, may need to re-solder the chips back on board, but you should consider cutting the purple color layer off the board, thermal paste the metal area and mount those chips with the Philips screws. Should solve the overheat issue,
I would be very surprised if the solar output ever reaches above 80 percent of the rating. It is common to see 400 watt panels mated with a 350 watt inverter such as Enphase. Even if the solar panels put out more that the inverter, a good inverter wouldn't see the excess output and would only process what it is rated for
No, you could use a 1000 Watt "CAPABLE" solar panel on a 200 Watt Inverter, and as long as the panel "no load" voltage rating does not exceed the inverter input voltage rating, the inverter will not be damaged. The inverter will only draw enough power from the panel to achieve its rated output power. Just like an emergency generator... just because you have a 20kW generator and your house only uses 2kW, does not mean that the generator will force 20kWh into the house appliances and burn them up. The advantage of using panels rated for higher Power than the inverter is that it creates a "reserve" of excess energy that allows the inverter to maintain full. rated output power even when there's a drop in solar panel output due to cloudy conditions. Referring back to the 1000W solar panel on a 2p0 watt inverter scenario, that 200 watt inverter would still be maintaining 200W output even when there's only 20%(ish) light intensity hitting the panel from heavy cloud coverage. The inverter will always need slightly more input power than it puts out... because electronic circuits have losses... usually 5-15% per inverter... which is why High Voltage Series Inverters can be more efficient than a bunch of micro-inverters... IF there is no shading issues.
I specked a whole system based on my use, 100W panels are a little smaller and easier to deal with, so I bought 4 but only put two on my controller for testing, Four 105 amphour deep cycle lead acid batteries in full sun in upstate N.Y I am putting 9 Amp to the batteries, thats not half bad, I can run a desktop and all my lights for 8 hours and not draw my Battery bank any lower than 12.1v I havent even added the last battery or last two panels, but even in Rain and clouds I am still getting 3amp charge well worth the setup for a SHTF situation! I have a 150/40 EPever charge controller I think I paid $89 I have been running well over a month on this setup and I like it my panels are HQST ($100 each) and my batteries are just cheap ass walfart 29dc 800amp about $100 each
You can figure out what part failed by swapping the panels from the lower inverter one by one onto the upper inverter it might be a fault in a panel or the wiring from the inverter to the panels. Of course you could also swap the panels from the working inverter to the lower one and see if it goes green. A new system could have any number of faults. You might also try conecting your output to the 2nd connector. It is strange the left output is connected directly to bottom inverter that had the red light and the top one had the green light but it is connected directly to the right side plug. I think I would verify the internal wires between the inverters is solid the thick wire with the black shield.
I feel like it may be easier and more code friendly to only use this setup to run specific devices in your home on dedicated wiring NOT hooked up to the grid with battery storage for use in the evenings. Maybe a washer and dryer that you'll only use during days on the weekend or something like that.
Have you done further experimentation to see if there is a quality MI that can do as you have set up here without failure? I am looking for a four-into-one 240VAC micro inverter that I will simply run a jumper off of my A/C condenser contacter to an identical contacter that controls the "On/Off" of the micro inverter to my A/C condenser. That way without Net Metering I am able to substantially offset my A/C load on my grid (I will keep the watts under what the A/C is actually using) yet I will never backfeed the grid as the contacter can only be closed when the grid is present.
FIRST: buy a real "Grid Tie Inverter" through a reputable solar supplier, not a cheap piece of Chinese equipment.. SECOND: Never plug an inverter (and I don't care what kind it is or what they say it can do) directly into an outlet..this is called back feed. ALWAYS go though a transfer switch. Have "one or the other but not both" functionality via a physical switch not through the inverter. Spend a little more and get good quality equipment and DO IT SAFE/DO IT RIGHT.. This is not only for your safety but others connected to the grid.
Best way to solor for home, is literally rewire it all back in time to DC energy, mainly lighting and small loads. Sure there is large white goods that run on DC, but are small :(
Check to see where the inverter was manufactured. Various Chinese products claim to be certified (UL, NSF, Intertek) but are not 3rd party tested at all.
Given all of the bureaucracies and constraints, I wonder if a better approach might be to completely skip net metering and instead isolating having two power panels in the home, one on-grid and one off-grid, and if you grow it over time... you would of course move circuits from the on-grid to the off-grid portions. And yes, batteries would be needed in the off-grid section, but they seem to be about to significantly drop in price this year.
This is pretty dangerous heck it even comed with its own suicide plug Plus it dangerous for electrician's As they may believe have isolated power when they have not
Here in Germany that is a really common thing called Balkonkraftwerk. And even the VDE (Association of Electrical Engineering) gave their okay with using the usual plug to get the electricity into the house.
@@favo7200 there is no way in a million years that you should be using a plug with male prongs on it to deliver power ... You can use a normal plug but it must be female end and the house most have a isolated receptacle Also this is backpowering the grid ... And no one will know so someone even next door could be effected
@@favo7200 There is a difference between an outlet (female) and a plug (male)... outlets carry power, plugs receive it. To reverse that (a plug supplying power) is called a suicide plug (because you could easily touch the leads, either by mistake or on purpose). Now it's possible that this kind of micro-inverter is intelligent (I don't know that much about it) and only supplies power when it senses power also coming from the outlet, however it all still sounds very suspect and wrong to me. At the very least, the guy in the video should have explained this in more detail (IF that inverter has such functionality)... I can see some idiot wiring up a non-intelligent inverter this way and kill himself or a line worker some day!
@@TheCruisinCrew But thats what I meant. Our VDE allows to use the normal Schuko Plug on the microinverter side to plug into an already installed household outlet. With contacts sticking out on microinverter side. You used to need a special plug and outlet without contacts sticking out but at the start of the year it got changed officially so that anybody could install and register it without an electrician at any point.
Local solar installers charge about 200% more than component cost. The components for my quote were under $5000. They wanted $10000 for a partial day install.
@5:35 Just a clarification - the product doesn't have to be tested by UL but to the UL Standard governing that inverter/controller. There are a number of labs that can certify to that UL standard but it doesn't have to be Underwriter's Laboratories that does the actual testing. So if you don't see a UL mark, there could be a CSA / CUL mark PTL mark or any other number of lab markings along with the UL standard that the lab tested to. It might be marked with something like "UL Certified to UL1741" or it could also be marked "PTL Certified to UL1741" or "CSA / UL Certified to UL1471", etc. All the test labs are audited regarding their equipment and testing methodologies to make sure they are all testing the same and to the standards. A business can also self-certify which means that they have their own in house lab that is certified to test for whichever UL standard(s) their products need to meet. So, don't make it the UL that you are looking for, but the UL Standard, or IEEE standard or CSA standard, etc is marked. I can see one marking, top left, but I cannot see any specifics. The unit is marked CE, which probably means that it meets requirements for the European Economic Area, basically the EU.
Ya know there are tens of thousands of folks who have gone OFF GRID have solar and zero electric bill period. It's a win win. As for feeding excess back into the grid. A few friends do this and their electricity bill is a fraction of what they use to Pay.
You can open any water sensitive electronics like the power display and spray the board and connections with 4 coats of krylon acrylic clear spray to make them resistant. Not saying skip the box but it will help.
I am wondering if you could do a test of this idea. I think you can set eco flo to cut off the utility power and power a circuit that uses the most power when utility power is the most expensive. Say from 4 pm to 11 pm. Then recharge your eco flo overnight when the power is cheapest. I think you could maybe pay for the eco flo just in savings from running the circuit this way.
Do you have thoughts about putting solar on a trailer? For example, I’d like to setup a workshop in a trailer, then have solar to power the trailer. Possibly implement the solar on an RV.
I was sealed reasonably well and in that short of a time period I don't think the root cause was moisture. Seems to just not have a reasonable design for heat rejection.
Between the cost, the variable amount produced, the complexity and all the paperwork ... you really want to have it, they're not making it easy or really affordable. And that's for home owners, forget it when renting, or in a flat
The solution to the utility problem is get rid of the utility. We built our house with that in mind and have no utility bills. We use all the usual domestic stuff and are never short of electricity. Any surplus electricity heats the domestic hot water and the under floor heating pipes. For about 3 months of the year we need to supplement the system with a log fire and back boiler to top up the hot water and underfloor heating. We live at latitude 59°N. We have 5kw worth of solar panels and a home built (Hugh Piggot design) wind turbine.
Thank you. This is some very important information. The bang for the buck on solar is different with some cheap components. Expectations should be lowered. To spend $500 to get only $1 of energy is insane. People are rushing into solar energy with loans that do not make good $ sense. Every one needs to calculate the bang for the buck and the payback for break even.
Solar buyers need to look at the long term benefits. Yes, the unit in the video produced about $1 in a week. As explained, a defect caused only half the solar panels to produce electricity for most of the week. So, it should have been closer to $2/week, 52 weeks in the year, or $104 worth of electricity produced in a year. Payback would be around 5 years. And this was in an area with some of the cheapest electric rates around.
I agree with you. Cheep electric energy is the holy grail. There are thousands of solar powered homes that are depending on solar energy because there is no alternative. We need to evaluate the bang for the buck for all energy and be realistic in our expectations. Some of the best energy is the energy saved with conservation. @@twostate7822
I have a solar and battery setup. Solar is fine IF you have a lot of sunshine. Winter time in the UK i.e. Nov - March, its nigh on a waste of time if you are looking for a fast payback. Winter time, I tend to charge up the batteries to 100% capacity on the cheap rate overnight (16p a unit compared to the day rate of 34.8p) and the capacity I have is enough to see me through the day/night. The solar produced: Nov = 117.5kWh Dec = 50.1 kWh Jan = 88.0 kWh Feb = 141.5 kWh Compare that to June (last year) 642.2 kWh May and July were each over 550kWh For the whole of January '24 I exported the grand total of 5 kWh! Summertime though, it really is all change. The solar arrays are more than enough to not only charge the batteries to 100% with no import required at all but also export a good chunk of electricity. But even then we do get the odd days where sunshine just doesn't shine. Having a smart meter, I have an export display to read. I get paid for what I export. But it ain't great!
I have several grid tie inverters and solar panels and I tested to see if it shuts down when power on the grid goes down. Later I found that if my pellet stove was running with the fan on and auger motor on, if you shut down the main breaker, the motor generates a signal that keeps the inverter running creating its own micro grid. You should check your system to see if that can happen in your case.
Yes I believe the back emf keeps it in sync. It happened when they came to replace my meter with the new smart meter. I asked the meter guy to wait while my pellet stove shut down, but he pulled the meter out of the socket and I was surprised my basement lights stayed on. After he put the new meter in I realized it was my solar panels and inverter with the pellt stove running that kept it generating. It akes sense as I have a 3 phase machine that I run by stating a 3/4 hp 3 phase motor that I start with a phase converter ( I only have single phase in my house) then I can run my 1/2 hp milling machine as if I had 3 phase in my house. Thanks for your reply Bob Hayes @@bobd.6005
Instead of solar tubs for light, I wired in 4 different lights in my house that give me a ton of light no matter what time of day runs off two batteries and one 200-watt solar panel.
For sure, I would like to try the NEP 600-LV but it is hard to find a dependable supplier in the US for the low voltage (120V out) version northernep.com/products/microinverters/bdm-600-lv
To actually save money operate your solar by using a switch box during the morning and afternoon with your solar power than switch back to power at night save about 50% or more on electricity. You must have a switch box though.
I would say with all the regulations being put in place that going off grid is the way now. Grid tie is being used against homeowners now. So just stop using grid. Unless you run out of battery. Basically grid is backup now.
I wish you had a thermal camera. It's probaby a simple component failure which could have been determined with the thermal camera and you could have replaced that overheating part. It's probably a simple fix.
I think you panels are suppose to be 300 watts each and not 360 watts. It's safer to over size the inverter and not run it at max rating for longer life.
if at any time you produce more power than you are using in the house without a proper net meter the meter will register the power you put back onto the grid as you still using it. so they will just take your power and charge you for it.......
Did you try and just use the one that wasn't working by itself and test if it works. It might be the heat produced from the pair which is too much for it. If it works by itself it might be worth separating them putting it in its own enclosure.
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@Everyday Solar To answer your question about the electrolytic capacitors: they should NOT run hot or even warm. That would be a sign that they are incorrectly rated for the application. Electrolytic capacitors tend to have a short life in cheap inverters and charge controllers but failure is usually obvious because the top of the capacitor will fracture and vent smoke OR the rubber plug in the bottom of the capacitor will be pushed out. Yours look OK. More likely that a fuse has melted or a semiconductor has blown. It's hard to tell from the video but it does appear that the semiconductor immediately above the toroidal coil (top right on the lower PCB) has exploded.
FYI, I am more familiar to much larger inverter systems. The semiconductors to which you are referring are likely SCR gates, a very common item in an inverter. They are the units that know when to feed the electricity back in and on which correct part of the AC cycle to feed it. And the SCR gates generally are the main source of failures in them. They take a beating. Could be a fuse if there is one.
The pads on the capacitor, likely those are simply insulators to separate the aluminum body of the case from the metal part of the capacitor. Someone mentioned that electrolytic capacitors regularly fail. Yes, that is somewhat true. However, you need to consider the practical use to their implementation. If you used a same farad rated foil wrapped capacitor in that spot, it would have to be much larger in physical size and more expensive, that is if it is even available in the first place. Larger inverter systems use oil capacitors and with constant use it is recommended those capacitors be replaced every 7 or so years. Electrolytic capacitors actually hold up better/longer than oil filled, but can't match the rated capacity of oil filled for the physical size of the capacitor. It is basically the only real practical option you have in this type of environment.
@@gpenrod5221 Inverters today don't use SCRs, they use MOSFET transistors, and sometimes GaN or Silicone Carbide transistors.
Yes, in high speed switching circuits used in digital inverters likenthis, electrolytic capacitors DO get warm and/or hot, because they are discharged/recharged very fast (thousands of times per second), and this causes heating due to internal resistance.
The solar panel is providing energy to the inverter, but the solar panel has relatively high output impedance, so the large capacitors have a lot of work to do - to keep the DC voltage stable.
Looks like a burnt transistor. Probably an easy repair.
Yeah those Transistors are going to try to dump alot of heat and theyre from CHYNA...Theyre all from CHYNA so thats not a critique on the quality of the unit. Im not seeing a major heat sink. Much less a fan cooled 1. Sometimes they have resistors associated with them that they take out too. It doesnt look like that here. To answer you question on caps. No. Sometimes they fail without visible signs of damage. I think very rarely have I replaced one that showed visible signs of damage, that wasnt my fault for trying to plug it in. If its old they usually fail with no signs of damage, outside of testing. Has nothing to do with this topic since its most likely that rail of transistors.
If I was going to re engineer this I would add a push thru forced air cooled heatsink, mounting the transistors up right. put that fan as my intake and add an exhaust case fan. If that didnt solve it then figure out how to up rate the transistors on the power dissipation rating...Like anybody listens tho.
Reminds me of Bass guitar amps. where you want max watts for max. loudness so alot of companies want to rate on the edge of what the transistor can safely do long term. Like solar since everyone wants to meek out max. powah. Safely? Long term? hear it looks like not even out of the box.
From what Im thinking is if chyna says 3600watts you dont uprate that, you probably want to down rate by 20%. Obviously theyre playing fast and loose with numbers and not providing 20% head room. I dont know what peoples problems is.
DO NOT give the power company any electricity, they are not your friend. They are profiting from your solar hardware expenses.
Yes, they do resell that power that feeds back into the grid, but you also profit from your own solar system in the long run. Besides, net metering is significantly better than standard metering with a solar system.
Not all electrical companies profit from the power you produce either. for example the power company in Alaska pays you for the power you produce at the end of each year. It starts off as a credit like typically net metering, but instead of losing that credit at the role over period they pay it back to you. Personally, I feel this should be a mandatory change for all electric companies. In theory it's an even transaction where they pay you the same rate you pay for power. Then that power is sold to someone else meaning they don't lose money except in standard operational costs. So I could see them buying it back at a reduced rate to cover the cost of maintenance.
The power companies r the most corrupt organizations in the world. They will undermine personnel solar by paying off politicians.
That is not even half the problem...
Power companies will charge you to charge the grid eventually they will charge you even more
@@GadgetTopTips-u7e That's correct but millions of people need to find that out the hard way. They think they're saving the planet but the power company could care less when someone messes with their profit. That's why power companies have political fights to increase usage rates for everyone. Power companies are not anyone's friend, they are greed-driven.
You
Have to pay to use their equipment (the grid). Ask them to cut the lines going into your house
Contraptions like these--especially ones that need to integrate with other systems--really make me appreciate standards and certifications.
I was waiting to see if he used a suicide cord to feed power back into his home distribution.
An electrical suicide plug, also known as a male-to-male extension cord, is a highly dangerous device. These cords have male plugs on both ends, unlike regular extension cords that have one male (protruding plug) end and one female (receptacle) end. @@joefrisco
Right. I wonder why we even show these videos to DIYers. Someone is going to get killed someday...but the youtuber will still cash his check. We have electrician's licenses for a reason folks.
@@Icehso140you must be a government worker
@@hildacorea No...just an educated electrician that knows how dangerous electricity is. But be my guest. Electricity doesn't care who you are and when a DYIer hurts or kills someone I'm sure you'll blame the govt.
As an experiment, can you turn your breakers off so the home is not drawing power and show a video of your meter while it is backfeeding. Let’s see if it goes backwards, forwards or stay stationary. I hear lots of opinions, but I have never seen this experiment. thank you.
I've done it several times. It depends on the meter. Many of the old analog meters will most definitely spin backwards. The new digital smart meters will throw an error code... and contact the power company. So don't try it with the smart meters, unless you want the power company to come knocking on your door!
Yes the old ones with the wheel will spin backwards, the newer ones are uni-directional, so if it doesnt give you an error, you will be paying for the backfed power you fed into the grid just the same as if you used it from the grid. The meter doesn't know what way power is traveling it only tracks the amount that passes through it, regardless of if it is going into the house, or being backfed to the grid. bi-directional meter is necessary unless you have the old style. @@ssoffshore5111
Smart meters don't run backwards
@@RonaldDaub-xi5jz Smart meters, if they detect a reverse flow......will trigger a code to the Utility company, also they will bill you as Usage whether if the meter is running backwards or forward.
Turning breakers off is will make your electric bill go down even if those rooms didn’t have anything plugged in and being used. The dissipation of electricity happens at every device, every wire nut or termination point dissipates electricity.
So turning the breaker off actually greatly diminishes that dissipation.
For 1 entire month, turn off every breaker to your house when you leave for work except the AC and the refrigerator.
Then turn them on as you need them once home, do that experiment and report back
I'd always prefer to have a solar backup to mains so I'd prefer batteries. Here in the UK feed-in payments have gone down, they were 100% at first but now it's about 5%. Most times I want backup power, it's already dark so a charged battery is more use than a dark solar panel.
It’s worth knowing that batteries can raise the system cost by thousands and they have expenses of replacing them and maintaining them
So, the little black devices in the middle of the unit are the things that need heat sinking. If there is a heat issue, it would be there, not the 3 capacitors. You would need to check on the type of devices there. You could also use a infrared camera while the unit is open to check if there is one of those that appears to be hotter than the others. I will bet it will not be easy to get a schematic with parts information, but if you see one or more getting hotter, you can look at the part and there usually is identifying information on them. If you have a warranty, I would not go further, if not and you want to repair, find those parts. desolder the hot ones, and replace them with new parts. Be sure to apply a heat sink compound.
I should have ran it with the cover off that would have been a fun test with a FLIR camera 👍
Permitting in my county is to complicated for a DIY, they talk green, but the use red tape.
Yeah, it can be a brutal process. I am super interested in these plug and play systems. More videos to come 👍
Just do it. How are they Really gonna know unless you have nosey neighbors OR you live in an HOA. Idk....this is America. I just have a hard time asking anyone to anything to my own home. I'd put that thing in my backyard and the county would never know.
@@everydaysolarthere are NO plugin in inverters that meet code requirements in the USA, they are also not UL listed with a plug and adding a plug voids the UL listing.
What are talking about permit? What do you need, a permission slip from your mom? Grow up.
@@everydaysolar as am I, use to have plug and plays for TV when I was a child many games on them as well
Had my 2kw solar/9kw battery system producing easily 80% of my needs 4 years now, the first year it produced 95% which was a bit of a struggle in winter but is still amazing for such a small system. Installed it myself so payback is already achieved. Since I did it, its even easier to do yourself with all in one boxes and is a no brainer for anywhere with decent sun.
Yes, but the winter there îs problem.
@@MrGigi-dz9cv Whats your point ? Don’t use solar because it’s less efficient in the winter ?
@@stephencrowther524 You need ellectricity in the winter too ...
I think that's where inverters come in and batteries
i didn't know the sun doesn't exist in the winter @@MrGigi-dz9cv
It addtion to the pads on each of the 6 capacitors, it looks like they may have forgotten to remove the adhesive blue tape from the two big rectangular thermal pads on the components next to the capacitors. It might be resulting in less heat transfer to the case from those components. You can see they made allowance on the cover for those pads to also dissapate heat.
I just saw that too. You've got a good eye.
And we can't see if there's sufficient excess thickness of the thermal transfer tape to be compressed. They shouldn't be using that kind of tape, it should be non-adhesive pads (or one-side adhesive) so the cover would be removable for servicing.
It would also help if the main lower enclosure had wider lips allowing for more get transfer to the rest of the box. (sure isn't an outdoor weather-proof box, is it?)
I did grid-tie for years, now I just bought more poly solar panels, and went fully off grid!
Are you able to do a video on your experience??? Explain your different set-ups for each stage...Would be much appreciated if you could...😁☺️
I did multiple grid-tie with the crypto mining boom a few years back. Really lowered imported electricity and Bill but my meter never registered/logged any exported electricity so they had a freebie at times.
Now I'm semi off grid with LFP batteries and hybrid inverter. I just need to install more panels as what I do have won't maintain batteries on rainy winter days and switches back to grid. Once I'm certain to produce enough solar on the worst days ill get my electricity service disconnected and save $1.60 per day of service charges.
I have 38 panels on my roof and the company talking 20k to install storage setup, what numbers do I need to find out what I need to store energy?HELP!!!
I need to know the best beginner's package...Then each step there after to lead to a full up & running solar system...Someone noted that the companies have no true knowledge or experience, playing it by ear...I need to know...My local electric company has no program at this time...
@@mickwolf1077 Any vital information will be much appreciated...
I just added a two 400 watt panel "Plug and Play" system. Not so much to reduce my electric bill, but we had a power outage and I thought, OK, now what do I do? Bought an EcoFlow Delta 2 and extra battery to keep some electricity 'stored'. Another point is with all the storms, floods, etc. It makes good sense to have some autonomous power capability! I lived on the Gulf Coast for 30 years and we always kept food, water, and extra gasoline in case of hurricanes. My wife is from California and they do the same in case of earthquakes. They don't happen often, but a thousand bucks of insurance will help when they do!
Yes, though this requires a completely different system design, using a hybrid inverter. Small micro inverters can not supply power when there is no grid available... guess it's something like the new Enphase iq8 series - which is capable of creating a micro-grid on just solar alone (very unique), or with a storage battery system. (but it's Solar alone mode can't be enabled without more components from them)
Yes I realized that after a bit of reflection. In my case I can easily disconnect the micro inverter and directly charge my ecoflow. So does that also mean that Thousands of homes with solar panels are useless if the grid goes down ?
@@RobertAnthony-m4q Yep... unless they have a hybrid inverter... and solar-alone as a "grid-loss backup" isn't exactly reliable... ergo why people usually add a backup battery bank.
@@beforebefore It may be better if everything that doesn't need to operate when the user is ready is smart controlled so they can be set to just operate when solar output is sufficient. Like a washing machine or dryer. Load it, delegate to the system to determine when the power is good and will be long enough and auto start it. Though a dryer could be a box with a window and clothes lines inside, vents for optimal passive flow, painted black outside, white or chrome/metalic/mirrors inside.
Thanks for the follow up and I tried to warn people that microinverter is not going to pass code and does not appear to be safe. There are no heat sinks or fans on that unit. Don't recommend anyone buy one and look at off grid system components from reputable dealers not a plug n system that could burn your house down or cost you your insurance coverage.
There is a 600 Watt with 120V out micro inverter made by NEP that looks to have all the certifications needed. I have an email sent out to my utility to get their feedback on this type of setup being approved for Net Metering. Not getting my hopes up but more curious than anything to see what they say.
@ solar cabin I'd rather offset my usage by putting energy into a battery bank and inverter, using it to help lower our usage some. I did see an Asian guy do something similar to what this poster did, but he used a grid tie inverter, plugged into a power strip surge protector, plugged into the wall, to offset some of his usage. He also demonstrated that if there's no power it's not feeding back into the grid. I liked his set up better, but I still would rather offset some of my usage with a battery bank and inverter, or a larger solar generator, that can handle say a refrigerator, freezer, or small ac. For a little bit. Or whilst the sun is out with pass through charging.
While I didn't look up the model of this inverter. Others responding to this thread stated it is a "grid tie" unit.
If so, it monitors the grid line Fq, Phase, and Voltage. It will dynamically adjust to synchronize to the grid parameters to optimize load conditions.
If designed to regulatory codes, it will also disable it's output if the grid voltage goes under a predetermined "Low Voltage Shutdown threshold". IE, is designed specifically not to back feed solar power to the grid during a grid power outage!
There are a multitude of NEC, and Fed/State code and regulations pertaining to grid-tied solar installs.
*(While not legal, or advised), and used only for testing on highways in Mexico. 🙄 Simple circuit Breaker(s), adequate sized AWG wire between the micro-inverter and the structure's load panel, and good Earth ground bonding, (is hypothetically) enough to protect from wiring fires from a single defective 1200Watt micro-inverter.
Although, it is worth mentioning that many DIY residential solar systems do increase the likelihood of lighting damage to said structure and contents! 👀
this is an easy addon to an RV system without any wiring needed.
Has to be hooked to the grid to work. It can't be hooked to another inverter or generator. Grid tie inverters work by increasing voltage to push power.
I have an old Y&H/ecoworthy inverter (I think they're part of the same company). What I found is that you cant run them a full wattage/full amperage. You need to halve that or it fails. They're coy with the specs on what tolerances their components have. I suspect the top wattages are the company being a little loose with the truth. Some of the ones I looked at inside had some quality control issues where connections had been reversed on the mp4 connectors. I'd strongly suggest checking your polarity on the unit (even the panels).
They are not lying about the voltage. It can cope with the higher wattage but it has to be in a fairly cool environment with a breeze. Some solar erase can have fans mounted to satisfy this requirement.
I'd be interested to get a used solar panel just to run some lights and chargers. Even if it doesn't feed into the grid, it would still replace some power we would otherwise have to pay the utility for.
I do exactly that. I use a EF ECOFLOW Portable Power Station DELTA 2 with 100w panel and charge my power tool batteries and if it hits 100% I plug it into the Tesla! All of it cost me $750 and I will never pay me for the cost and my time, but I love knowing that I am farming my own power:)
Easy enough to do. Just beware of the cheap (Under $20 charge controllers) they are typically rated at 30A. I wouldn't trust them past 10A. Basically, 1x100W panel. I blew up 4-5 of them figuring this out. Hooked up to 2 panels they'd last anywhere from a month to six months.
They are designed to be solar powered light pole charge and light controllers. Great for little setups, or you know, solar powered light poles. At this they work just fine.
@@dfreadhoff terrible idea these premade solutions are really expensive and impossible to fix easily
The issue here is if there is not enough sun and something doesn’t charge you would have to probably invest in a transfer switch and stuff so that if it stops making powerful the charges the grid power can charge things so the grid time away makes sense here
Another informative video, thank you for taking the time to do this experiment. I have 4 GTI installed and on my 1300 watt setup I am getting right around 1 Kw per day and using over 20, so my ROI is over 9 years but offsets and fun are PRICELESS!
There is just something about harvest the sun that sucks a lot of us in 🙌
it just shows us how far people have to go to gesture the aesthetic of maintaining any sort of control over their lives and then woops, nope, thought you had a great idea to beat the system but now the bottom half of your inverter throws an error light and your idea of energy independence is a non-starter.
Thank you for sharing your experience with solar panels! It's great to see people like you taking steps towards sustainability. If you're interested in a reliable backup power solution for your outdoor adventures, I highly recommend the Segway Portable PowerStation Cube Series. Its massive capacity, fast recharging, and versatile sockets make it perfect for camping trips and RV use. Plus, its rugged design ensures durability in various weather conditions. Happy camping and enjoy the priceless moments with your family! 🌞🚐
@@ARLGD While I appreciate your generic comments, and have looked at the Segway cube, it falls short of my needs and therefore will NOT become part of my options.
This is the 3rd time you have commented on one of my comments, all on other sites and shows you are trying to market for Segway.
$2800 worth of equipment to produce 84 cents worth of electric in a week?!#$ Nuff said. Solar payback in one's lifetime is very risky business.
You need to realise that it’s not always about payback but the fact that’s it’s generally a one off investment is quite good as well because if the energy prices are very unpredictable that investment initially gives you some predictability
madness ! i was able to get a 10kw system complete was a tear off on a foreclosure. for $3800 (guy paid over 26K installed) i did the math i pay .08-.12 a kw hour. so it would of paid for it self in like 5 years or so. then i was like im not putting all this crap on my roof..... so i sold it all for $7000.... the 3200 profit was like 2 years of free electricty lo....
I looked into this just deeply enough to come to the conclusion that I wouldn't live long enough to break even.
depends if you diy or get a company to do it..... diy I make about 80 cent an hour.. being the panel thing isnt chewing up power... ours is straight into a charge controller.. batteries
the panels were cheap, I bought 10000 off made in china, for about a doller a piece... kept 100 and sold the rest for $20 a piece.... storage is the only thing you need...
of course they go fast if you sell $300 panels for $20 :-)
@@HarmonRAB-hp4nk link on panels?
@HarmonRAB-hp4nk yes I second that. Need the link?😮
you must be very old!?
I burn so little electricity a solar system would never pay for itself😂
For Safety and stability, you should be using a Growatt grid tie inverter. Can add an export limiter so you never back feed anything to the grid, thus does not require a net metering agreement
Why that one? There are 100 varieties.
Based on Availability and price. These tiny ones have lots of issues, even the ones from Enphase have issues. Using something more robust and active cooling will keep them working longer and some have UL Listings making them pass your home insurance requirements.
@@RiggerBrew your information is old. Enphase had problems many many years ago. Today they are rocksolid reliable and active cooling would be a truly dumb idea. Cooling fans fail all the time, a large heat sink never fails.
@@ericeric9208 well said, I am doing exactly what you just described. I had my own solar business for 10 years and I quit because I was sick and tired of permitting and dealing with the local electric utilities. So even though I did everything above board for 10 years I am now using my system behind the meter and I never back feed the grid and screw them! I am not bothering with a permit!
I have a grid tie inverter and pay 12 bucks for a connection fee. Once the warranty on the inverter is up i want to screw the power company also and go off grid since they give me nothing back in Oregon for my excess power. What system do you use? Finding an inverter that is reasonably priced but made to last seems like a suspect proposition currently. 5.44 kw and looking to add kw also in the future. @@Riceman-o1p
I have a background in electrical. I've also installed my own 18 kW grid tide system. Can I can honestly tell you that that micro inverter is way under sized? Or those panels are way oversized for that inverter. You should only be using about 275 Watt panels max. On that micro inverter. That is why you are burning up that inverter. For 360 watt panels, you should be using a sixteen hundred watt micronuter.
I'm all for the the alternative power source, but, unless I am located in the middle of nowhere, I really don't see the need for solar energy and it is confirmed with this video. Very informative and no biased review and for that, you earned my sub!!!
The need comes in after the payback period where all the energy the panels produces is free, which can be significant considering power companies are always increasing the rates. And if your area has frequent power outages solar with battery storage system can be a life saver.
In Australia every third house has roof top solar and the saving are quite dramatic across the board especially if you can afford a storage battery. There are government backed cheap loans available so payback time is reasonable. It used to be a lot better but the power companies have wound back their payments for your excess power . You do have to change your usage pattern a bit to do the heavy electrical use jobs during the daylight hours if you can. In the city of Melbourne alone the power produced from roof top solar equals the output of one of our old coal fired power stations. Night time hours will always be a problem with solar power but with better storage systems being developed and redesigning the power grid to take advantage of our time zones it will become more usable. My personal annual power costs have been cut by two thirds and when I upgrade from a 5 Kw to a 7Kw system by adding more panels the cost will reduce even more. If you have the sunlight put the panels on your roof.
@@Resist4 Residential AC power rates with tax have been very consistent in Will County IL for years @ .13kw/h all in with taxes.
Well I'm not in the middle of nowhere and my solar system offsets my electrical consumption by about $200 per month. And I did it myself so I paid less than $10,000 for it..
@@Riceman-o1p I agree! I have had my system for over a decade, so basically I haven't had an electric bill in most of that time. And now I drive an EV and my system fills its tank for free too!
Looked into this, but was told by some UA-camrs that the power that they fed into their house actually ended up costing them because house meter couldn't tell that this energy was being directed into the house not used from the grid. Hope that makes sense.
how? its not coming from the meter?
I've been told the same thing; unless your meter is specifically set up for delivery back to the grid (ie net metering), you will likely get charged for the kWh you produce because the meter doesnt know if the power is coming or going.
I think you get charged for the power coming in and also the power going out if you are producing excess power and don't have a net metering agreement. This should mean if your appliances are consuming 2 kW of power and you are producing 1 kW of power you would only be getting billed at the 1 kW power consumption. I also bet this is varies across the different utility companies.
@everydaysolar-ps3xg well in California they are about to pass a law that will charge you for the power you get from your panels.
Only If you’re using more than it’s producing.
You exceeded the wattage Input. The power supply is only rated for 300 watts input as it states on the Amazon listing. So on a sunny day, it likely burned up that side of the inverter.
The inverter type you are using is know for having over heating problems. I suggest the indoor type that is fan cooled or the larger more expensive type that is made to handle an entire system of panels.
Taking into account: initial cost of solar panels, mounting panels, converters, installation permits, electrical permits, electrical inspections, testing, and HOA approval, I have concerns on maintenance. Snow removal from panels, dust removal, cleaning of panels, hail damage, and who do you call for repairs, maintenance, replacement of converter, electrical parts, or damaged solar panels, or worn damaged wiring over time ? ? ? Sounds expensive, a hassle and not worth the effort.
It's not worth the effort in most cases I can think of, even excluding the permits, testing, inspections, approvals that you may or may not need.
It is worth it if you are smart enough to figure it out and want to change the current polluted environment that we are forded to use from the fossil fuel industry. Otherwise you are at the mercy of the utility and oil companies to keep feeding you power that is still not 100% clean yet. Maybe one day it will be clean but not with the pace they are moving currently.
@@DanielDTUBWeinberger Yeah only for the environment or if you know how to do it. If you don't know then yes it is not worth it, but like anything in life if you research and learn then you can do many things that seem impossible. You just have to want to do it for the right reason and then you can have a solar system that will have a full ROI in less than 5 years.
Mounting constant things like that are very low if you’re a bit clever how you do it but generally for ground mount array there are a lot less approvals due to the lower risk involved of a house burning down
Before you even consider solar you must first do a power audit on your home and increase the efficiency. This will save you big money on your solar. I saved 47% by increasing the efficiency and didn’t need the large solar they told me I needed.
Wondering if the failure could be caused by condensation. If the unit is getting damp inside, any moisture could have dripped to the lower board and shorted it out. Maybe inspect closely and see if you see any signs of water.
of course the condensation must be the cause. If the heat would be the culprit then the upper part would be damaged not the lower one.
Need at least 4kw to come anywhere near running a normal house, inverters need to be rated at least 20-30% over what the max input and needed output are, so they last longer, same for batterys.
I have a new unit showing up this week with more capability. We shall see if it lasts 🤞
I was at a home show at Florida state fair. And there was a guy that was selling this thing that went between your meter and power panel and it would send power back to a through your house basically slowing your meter while not affecting your your neighbors on the lines. I kinda understood it made sense. Because ac power just goes from one house to the next with the meter just being the go between. But all three big eclectic companies shut his product down and it was on the news and they said it was working by slowing down your meter. But I ain't no electrician expert.
Just to clarify multiple houses, buildings may be on a single stepdown transformer from the grid.
The power is NOT daisy chained from the first house/meter to the next, and so on. Rather, all loads (structures) are connected to said transformer in parallel.
Now, I'm just guessing on the "band power-saver device". There were/are fake BS devices, purported to save energy sold on the Internet.
And then there are real ways to trick power meters with electronics. They modify the way the load is presented to the meter. I won't go into details, as I don't want the feds knocking on my door.
This is the kind of setup I wanted to do to learn solar. Something like 8 panels on the ground to offset power use. Im at $0.30 a kwh here. Hoping you do a video with a functional setup.
Dang, what state are you in?
@@everydaysolarmost likely MA we are getting skinned alive
The most important tip is the installation of a -Anti - Islanding- circuit and a Manuel cut off to not energize the the lines while they are being repaired,for safty .
An Island is always included in this type of inverter
I have 32 kW system at my house.I did myself.
Middle of the summer I put back 130-140 kw a day.
winter maybe 40.
Summertime when it rains it still spins backwards😊
How much do they pay you per kwh?
I have a system that overproduces.at the end of the year they pay you for the difference,and then you start afresh. Come come January. They usually pay me $03 which is nothing
dang!!!
@@williamkreth you have to check because it depends on local things and really what energy company you are with Austin they can change the meter out for free or at the cost. It depends on a lot of things but if it’s at a cost they can offer you the 30 year lower payback or you paying for that meter change
If you want to add solar power without a grid connection, you need batteries, which are enormously expensive. But you could use a heat battery: Heat a tank full of water or sand directly with your solar electricity, and draw that heat to warm your house or water as needed when the sun is not shining.
This is wrong, you do not need batteries.
@@Nova-m8d
Of course not, but most people who put in off-grid solar want to have some of that electricity when the sun isn't shining.
@@BigGuy8059 You're doing it wrong.
Well if you are going to open it up and do the things, if you have a 12V source, install a chassis fan for cooling, you can also get heatsinks that you can stick onto the back side of the unit. They use a layer of sticky that is also a thermal conducting layer. Probably could do the same thing inside the unit, with some of those small heatsinks that you can attach to PI processors. Do that while pushing air through the unit, I'll bet you stop getting the overheating errors.
Thank you for the video.. I was curious to see how this would perform.
Regarding the failure...
Is it possible that too much voltage/amperage got into the microinverter?
Its a 1200W inverter hooked to 1440W of panels.
Yes, I understand losses. But you mentioned that it was super cold when they failed.
If they got some good light while cold, they could have produced over the 300W microinverter rating and harmed the (lets just says "sensitive") electronics inside the micro right?
Thanks!
You can't force-feed an inverter. It will draw as much power as it's designed to. The rest will go to waste.
@@britishtechguru You can certainly over-draw your inverter, so is it possible there was just too much passing through the micro?
I usually take Chinese ratings and divide them in 1/2. If they say 1200 watts, it's probably really 600 watts. If I was going to do this, I'd pick a 2400 watt inverter. Running things on the edge is asking for failure.
@@quademasters249 Electronics seem to last much longer when they are not maxed out. Look at the Dubai LED light bulb. Longest lasting because it operates at 1/4 of the max rating.
@@Denniss7420 In the army all the ratings were doubled. If the design required a 1 watt resistor a 2 watt resister was used instead.
With the Chinese it's just the opposite. When they say "600 watts" you know it's "300 watts".
I run my y&h older 700watt model with 780 watts 36v. Its been running for over two years still works even though its so hot you cant even hold your hand to it. It puts out about 2.5 AC kwh per day. My kwh cost is 30 cents so it produces 75 cents of power per day or around 22 bucks per month (4 months to payoff the inverter)
Not too shabby! Thanks for the feedback 👍
Bro, you could literally cut the neighbor's grass one day a month and make more than $22.
I legit don't understand why people are chasing this solar stuff. The ROI is terrible unless you have a gigantic, underutilized system *and* you are in a state that favors solar.
Looking forward to you testing other 120v inventors . Question, do you have to plug this into a dedicated outlet?
Yes, technically these go to a dedicated circuit to prevent any possible screw up with overloading the wires before reaching breaker capacity.
Please provide the link to the other inverter you mentioned that you were trying to get approved by your Net metering service provider. Thank you!
We make 8 to 12 Kwhrs off grid per day in the summer and 2 to 5 Kwhrs per day in the winter here in TN off grid. Whole house depends on solar as there is no utility. Starting in Nov,Dec, Jan and some of Feb we use 1/4 gallon of gas at night for those months when the suns not out or 1 gallon of gas per day if it continues the following day of no sun. So 21 days of the year we're burning a little fuel. Math thats roughly $3 a gallon x21 = $63 a year.
What’s the ceramic heater you use? Sounds like a good solution. I’ve been looking for some good backup heat sources. I’ve got some buddy heaters just in case but wouldn’t sleep while those are running. I got some of those hot water bags too that I can heat with solar electric or with a jet stove outside. I was thinking of getting a backup merge by wood stove too but looks like they could be dangerous. Im in East TN.
The Y&H 1200W Solar Grid Tie Micro Inverter you've described is a specific type of inverter designed for use in grid-tied solar power systems. Here are some key features and information about this particular microinverter:
The microinverter has a power capacity of 1200W, which means it can handle a maximum power input of 1200 watts from the solar panels.
This microinverter is designed for grid-tied solar power systems. In grid-tied systems, the solar panels generate electricity, and the microinverter converts the DC power generated by the panels into AC power that can be fed into the electrical grid.
MPPT (Maximum Power Point Tracking):
The microinverter likely features MPPT technology, which optimizes the power output from the solar panels by adjusting the operating point to the maximum power point.
The PV (photovoltaic) input range is specified as DC28-50V, indicating the compatible input voltage range from the solar panels. The AC output range is specified as AC80-160V.
It comes equipped with a monitoring display screen that allows users to view data related to the inverter's performance. This can include information such as power output, voltage, and other relevant data.
The microinverter has an IP65 waterproof rating, which means it is designed to be protected against dust and low-pressure water jets from any direction. This level of protection makes it suitable for outdoor installation.
It's crucial to ensure that the microinverter is compatible with the specific solar panels and system requirements you have. Check the specifications and compatibility guidelines provided by the manufacturer.
Installation:
Microinverters are typically installed on or near the solar panels. The AC output is then connected to the electrical grid.
Ensure that the microinverter complies with relevant safety standards and regulations in your region.
Love the structure for holding the panels
I don't. The wooden fundament layout is poor und will wear out rapidly when the panels start to swing in the wind.
We might need a stabilizer like stakes of some sort depending on the wind
@@ianmcnally8501Why not use aluminum frames? My family uses aluminum, it is particularly sturdy.😄
@@Elise-song yes aluminum should be very strong - but where i live its very windy and you need concrete or Stakes to keep everything in place during storms.
Thanks for the video.
I thought about solar for backup power needs, but because of where I live (Gulf Coast) and the weather here, I ended up going with a natural gas generator.
Everybody has to start somewhere. There's nothing like making your own electricity.
Amen 👍
Emporia monitoring system is great, I've been using it since 2020 good accurate gadget
Put a set of aluminum fins on the back of the controller box. Use the computer paste for cpu. Put a sealed bag around that display.
Your issue for the damage of the inverter most likely stems from the low temperature that you experienced. Temperature effects power output from the PV array. The lower the temperature the higher the voltage from the array. I would dare to say that due to the low temperature the array power output raised and damaged the inverter due to excessive voltage and power. Bear in mind that the power curve rating for the modules are given for standard test conditions (STC= 77 degrees F). When calculating maximum power input for the inverter, we need to take into account the minimum ambient temperatures that the modules will experience.
Your local inspector would red tag your installation within seconds. You are back feeding an outlet made to supply power. You have also installed a male plug on your system, when unplugged could become energized. Go to home depot and buy the correct outlet, and then wire a female outlet on your system. That would mean you would have to turn your extension cord to work the opposite way.
Actually on this one I called the inspector and he gave the green light. This micro inverter will not supply power unless it detects power at the outlet. So this will ensure no back feeding is the power goes out and also that the prongs aren't hot when unplugged.
Grid Tie inverters Do Not have what you think of as a "suicide plug".
Just getting into solar but I agree on the Emporia energy monitoring system. Had it for about 6 months now and it really helps you see where your energy dollars are going. Good video.
Just an FYI you might want to clarify with your utility some Smart meters charge you for putting power back onto the grid. Basically anytime power comes from the grid or from your house you get charged if it passes through the meter. It happened to me in an apartment Several months after I installed it they updated To a smart meter and they told me, Then I was able to track and verify it. If you don't want to be charged for the extra power you feed the grid you need a limiter on your inverter connected to One leg of your power box.
It looks like you have solar in your house so that won't make much difference because you already have a solar agreement
Excellent Point! After my solar system was installed, the installer turned the system on prior to the utility approving net metering for billing. It took two months for the approval, so in July and August my solar production was billed to me ($400 per month) rather than being credited to my account.
We don't use much electricity, and realistically the only things that matter are the fridge and the furnace. We have a backup setup that covers that with some in-between use on jobsites. Worth the peace of mind alone.
I use compressed air to run generators instead of DIRECTLY sourcing solar for power, but what I do to get around all the rules is, I have "emergency" outlets in my house - not grid tied, so no problems with Code or power company rules.
Also, I use cheap ($35) solar panels to run small compressors whenever there's sunshine, so my 2,000 gallons of compressed air is free.
How much electricity can you store in 2,000gallons of compressed air? What psi?
@@kalradic1252
80 psig my electricity needs are minimal, but I can make enough to run my meat freezer 5 hours a day as a rule.
Compressed air powered generator system like that would be horribly inefficient... a battery bank would be far, FAR more efficient and reliable. There are so many great sources of "used" LiFePo4 batteries these days, with tons of life left in them... and needing no maintenance.
You have so many losses in both directions.... electricity to compressed air, then compressed air back to electricity... and how do you regulate the electricity to correct voltage and frequency??
@@beforebefore
Hey, I have the perfect solution to this energy-storage conundrum: You do your thing and I'll do mine.
@@kalradic1252
How much?
Enough
PSI?
40
You need a 2 way meter that your utility provides. A lot depends on how much power you normally use.
I have a 4 kW grid tied system on Arizona. My home is all electric. It is a very efficient home. I make more than i use every month .
Interesting stuff!😎 Perchance is there a very small glass fuse (similar to old automotive fuses) soldered into the circuit like they have on modern fluorescent ballasts which are actually unserviceable?
Man I'm so glad I watched this before I pulled the trigger on buying that inverter. On a side note did you ever find something decent? Also for my setup I wanted to put a transfer switch for the inverter and a boost charge controller because it's a small bike shed where I can charge my ebike or Sur Ron for free but when it's not charging the bike I can have it feed some power into the grid to supplement my power. It be cool if you ever could do a video like that, but that might just be a special case. Also it would be cool to see a solar shed with just DC power powering it and see if that runs more efficient than transferring everything to AC. Just a thought!
Nice information, but the part I am missing is understanding how you have provided safety for the utility linemen, whenever the ‘grid’ has been shut down for repairs?
These micro inverters shut off when there's no power
If converter unit is protected from rain and hopefully sun you can buy some metal mesh, cut and screw on as new back, to allow heat to pass through.
As long as your inverter produces less than your house base load you wont get charged.
Right, but for the week I ran I few plenty back to the grid just because the load of the house is so low.
The issue may be at the center of the board where all those little back squares are with Philips screws on them. Looks like they just sit on a thermal layer but that's blocking the chips from dissipating any heat to the outside of the box and the box being be air cooled. Those chips should be the same type you would see in a car amplifier, however decent car amps thermal paste each chip and direct mount them to bare metal inside of the amp. Maybe consider testing this as a fix.
Pull the bottom board out, may need to re-solder the chips back on board, but you should consider cutting the purple color layer off the board, thermal paste the metal area and mount those chips with the Philips screws.
Should solve the overheat issue,
OVER HEATING BECAUSE U ARE PUTTING 1440 watts into a 1200 watt inverter. (360 watt solar panel x 4 = 1440 watts). That’s probably your issue.
Three is the magic number. But too late now.
I would be very surprised if the solar output ever reaches above 80 percent of the rating. It is common to see 400 watt panels mated with a 350 watt inverter such as Enphase.
Even if the solar panels put out more that the inverter, a good inverter wouldn't see the excess output and would only process what it is rated for
i would have stuck some old alluminium cpu heat sinks to the side of that panel to help discipate the heat from the inverter.
No, you could use a 1000 Watt "CAPABLE" solar panel on a 200 Watt Inverter, and as long as the panel "no load" voltage rating does not exceed the inverter input voltage rating, the inverter will not be damaged. The inverter will only draw enough power from the panel to achieve its rated output power.
Just like an emergency generator... just because you have a 20kW generator and your house only uses 2kW, does not mean that the generator will force 20kWh into the house appliances and burn them up.
The advantage of using panels rated for higher Power than the inverter is that it creates a "reserve" of excess energy that allows the inverter to maintain full. rated output power even when there's a drop in solar panel output due to cloudy conditions. Referring back to the 1000W solar panel on a 2p0 watt inverter scenario, that 200 watt inverter would still be maintaining 200W output even when there's only 20%(ish) light intensity hitting the panel from heavy cloud coverage.
The inverter will always need slightly more input power than it puts out... because electronic circuits have losses... usually 5-15% per inverter... which is why High Voltage Series Inverters can be more efficient than a bunch of micro-inverters... IF there is no shading issues.
@@beforebefore I agree! Good explanation
I specked a whole system based on my use, 100W panels are a little smaller and easier to deal with, so I bought 4 but only put two on my controller for testing, Four 105 amphour deep cycle lead acid batteries in full sun in upstate N.Y I am putting 9 Amp to the batteries, thats not half bad, I can run a desktop and all my lights for 8 hours and not draw my Battery bank any lower than 12.1v I havent even added the last battery or last two panels, but even in Rain and clouds I am still getting 3amp charge
well worth the setup for a SHTF situation!
I have a 150/40 EPever charge controller I think I paid $89 I have been running well over a month on this setup and I like it
my panels are HQST ($100 each) and my batteries are just cheap ass walfart 29dc 800amp about $100 each
Three AMP diddly shit
@@davidmann4533 LOL, yes it is a small amount but not all us roll coal and have a 10000 foot house in texass like you do. So what is your point again?
You can figure out what part failed by swapping the panels from the lower inverter one by one onto the upper inverter it might be a fault in a panel or the wiring from the inverter to the panels. Of course you could also swap the panels from the working inverter to the lower one and see if it goes green. A new system could have any number of faults. You might also try conecting your output to the 2nd connector. It is strange the left output is connected directly to bottom inverter that had the red light and the top one had the green light but it is connected directly to the right side plug. I think I would verify the internal wires between the inverters is solid the thick wire with the black shield.
It's nothing more than Chinese Junk. You can't fix junk.
I feel like it may be easier and more code friendly to only use this setup to run specific devices in your home on dedicated wiring NOT hooked up to the grid with battery storage for use in the evenings. Maybe a washer and dryer that you'll only use during days on the weekend or something like that.
Dryer's requires thousands of watts.
Can alway hang dry the old way.
This is why grid tie was designed but it's complicated
Pull A UL sticker off of a appliance and stick it on the inverter.😊.
And thus have your insurance company refuse to pay out when your house burns down.
Have you done further experimentation to see if there is a quality MI that can do as you have set up here without failure?
I am looking for a four-into-one 240VAC micro inverter that I will simply run a jumper off of my A/C condenser contacter to an identical contacter that controls the "On/Off" of the micro inverter to my A/C condenser. That way without Net Metering I am able to substantially offset my A/C load on my grid (I will keep the watts under what the A/C is actually using) yet I will never backfeed the grid as the contacter can only be closed when the grid is present.
FIRST: buy a real "Grid Tie Inverter" through a reputable solar supplier, not a cheap piece of Chinese equipment.. SECOND: Never plug an inverter (and I don't care what kind it is or what they say it can do) directly into an outlet..this is called back feed. ALWAYS go though a transfer switch. Have "one or the other but not both" functionality via a physical switch not through the inverter. Spend a little more and get good quality equipment and DO IT SAFE/DO IT RIGHT.. This is not only for your safety but others connected to the grid.
Best way to solor for home, is literally rewire it all back in time to DC energy, mainly lighting and small loads.
Sure there is large white goods that run on DC, but are small :(
always run at 50 % never run at rated add fan
Yeah, I think there are better options for the Microinverter. Working on getting a more reliable solution.
Check to see where the inverter was manufactured. Various Chinese products claim to be certified (UL, NSF, Intertek) but are not 3rd party tested at all.
God gives us everything we need: water, oxygen, fruits, vegetables, animals, family, etc. even sunlight to power my phone. What an amazing God! 🙏❤
Amen!
Given all of the bureaucracies and constraints, I wonder if a better approach might be to completely skip net metering and instead isolating having two power panels in the home, one on-grid and one off-grid, and if you grow it over time... you would of course move circuits from the on-grid to the off-grid portions. And yes, batteries would be needed in the off-grid section, but they seem to be about to significantly drop in price this year.
This is pretty dangerous heck it even comed with its own suicide plug
Plus it dangerous for electrician's
As they may believe have isolated power when they have not
Yeah, that looked highly dangerous and illegal!
Here in Germany that is a really common thing called Balkonkraftwerk. And even the VDE (Association of Electrical Engineering) gave their okay with using the usual plug to get the electricity into the house.
@@favo7200 there is no way in a million years that you should be using a plug with male prongs on it to deliver power ...
You can use a normal plug but it must be female end and the house most have a isolated receptacle
Also this is backpowering the grid ... And no one will know so someone even next door could be effected
@@favo7200 There is a difference between an outlet (female) and a plug (male)... outlets carry power, plugs receive it. To reverse that (a plug supplying power) is called a suicide plug (because you could easily touch the leads, either by mistake or on purpose). Now it's possible that this kind of micro-inverter is intelligent (I don't know that much about it) and only supplies power when it senses power also coming from the outlet, however it all still sounds very suspect and wrong to me. At the very least, the guy in the video should have explained this in more detail (IF that inverter has such functionality)... I can see some idiot wiring up a non-intelligent inverter this way and kill himself or a line worker some day!
@@TheCruisinCrew But thats what I meant. Our VDE allows to use the normal Schuko Plug on the microinverter side to plug into an already installed household outlet. With contacts sticking out on microinverter side. You used to need a special plug and outlet without contacts sticking out but at the start of the year it got changed officially so that anybody could install and register it without an electrician at any point.
It needs fans placed inside to bring in cool air and exhaust hot air OR much much better heat synchs to exhaust the heat.
Local solar installers charge about 200% more than component cost. The components for my quote were under $5000. They wanted $10000 for a partial day install.
You can't fool me, you're the guy who showed me that Spax screws were cool!
@5:35
Just a clarification - the product doesn't have to be tested by UL but to the UL Standard governing that inverter/controller.
There are a number of labs that can certify to that UL standard but it doesn't have to be Underwriter's Laboratories that does the actual testing. So if you don't see a UL mark, there could be a CSA / CUL mark PTL mark or any other number of lab markings along with the UL standard that the lab tested to.
It might be marked with something like "UL Certified to UL1741" or it could also be marked "PTL Certified to UL1741" or "CSA / UL Certified to UL1471", etc.
All the test labs are audited regarding their equipment and testing methodologies to make sure they are all testing the same and to the standards. A business can also self-certify which means that they have their own in house lab that is certified to test for whichever UL standard(s) their products need to meet.
So, don't make it the UL that you are looking for, but the UL Standard, or IEEE standard or CSA standard, etc is marked.
I can see one marking, top left, but I cannot see any specifics. The unit is marked CE, which probably means that it meets requirements for the European Economic Area, basically the EU.
Ya know there are tens of thousands of folks who have gone OFF GRID have solar and zero electric bill period. It's a win win. As for feeding excess back into the grid. A few friends do this and their electricity bill is a fraction of what they use to Pay.
I burred two of 300W before I figured it out how to keep this device cool, just install any kind of cooling fan....
Thank you for the video. What is the device in your breaker box you mentioned please?
You can open any water sensitive electronics like the power display and spray the board and connections with 4 coats of krylon acrylic clear spray to make them resistant. Not saying skip the box but it will help.
First Impressions: no DC or AC breakers or manual disconnects to deal with inverter failure and fire
Get a few Enphase microinverters!
(If you must go 120v an autotransformer is all you need)
I am wondering if you could do a test of this idea. I think you can set eco flo to cut off the utility power and power a circuit that uses the most power when utility power is the most expensive. Say from 4 pm to 11 pm. Then recharge your eco flo overnight when the power is cheapest. I think you could maybe pay for the eco flo just in savings from running the circuit this way.
Do you have thoughts about putting solar on a trailer? For example, I’d like to setup a workshop in a trailer, then have solar to power the trailer. Possibly implement the solar on an RV.
Great video man :) That inverter enclosure doesn't look that weatherproof to me ! Perhaps the lower half has moisture damage ?
I was sealed reasonably well and in that short of a time period I don't think the root cause was moisture. Seems to just not have a reasonable design for heat rejection.
Between the cost, the variable amount produced, the complexity and all the paperwork ... you really want to have it, they're not making it easy or really affordable. And that's for home owners, forget it when renting, or in a flat
The solution to the utility problem is get rid of the utility. We built our house with that in mind and have no utility bills. We use all the usual domestic stuff and are never short of electricity. Any surplus electricity heats the domestic hot water and the under floor heating pipes. For about 3 months of the year we need to supplement the system with a log fire and back boiler to top up the hot water and underfloor heating. We live at latitude 59°N. We have 5kw worth of solar panels and a home built (Hugh Piggot design) wind turbine.
Thank you. This is some very important information. The bang for the buck on solar is different with some cheap components. Expectations should be lowered. To spend $500 to get only $1 of energy is insane. People are rushing into solar energy with loans that do not make good $ sense. Every one needs to calculate the bang for the buck and the payback for break even.
Solar buyers need to look at the long term benefits. Yes, the unit in the video produced about $1 in a week. As explained, a defect caused only half the solar panels to produce electricity for most of the week. So, it should have been closer to $2/week, 52 weeks in the year, or $104 worth of electricity produced in a year. Payback would be around 5 years. And this was in an area with some of the cheapest electric rates around.
I agree with you. Cheep electric energy is the holy grail. There are thousands of solar powered homes that are depending on solar energy because there is no alternative. We need to evaluate the bang for the buck for all energy and be realistic in our expectations. Some of the best energy is the energy saved with conservation. @@twostate7822
I have a solar and battery setup. Solar is fine IF you have a lot of sunshine. Winter time in the UK i.e. Nov - March, its nigh on a waste of time if you are looking for a fast payback. Winter time, I tend to charge up the batteries to 100% capacity on the cheap rate overnight (16p a unit compared to the day rate of 34.8p) and the capacity I have is enough to see me through the day/night.
The solar produced:
Nov = 117.5kWh
Dec = 50.1 kWh
Jan = 88.0 kWh
Feb = 141.5 kWh
Compare that to June (last year) 642.2 kWh
May and July were each over 550kWh
For the whole of January '24 I exported the grand total of 5 kWh!
Summertime though, it really is all change. The solar arrays are more than enough to not only charge the batteries to 100% with no import required at all but also export a good chunk of electricity. But even then we do get the odd days where sunshine just doesn't shine.
Having a smart meter, I have an export display to read. I get paid for what I export. But it ain't great!
I have several grid tie inverters and solar panels and I tested to see if it shuts down when power on the grid goes down. Later I found that if my pellet stove was running with the fan on and auger motor on, if you shut down the main breaker, the motor generates a signal that keeps the inverter running creating its own micro grid. You should check your system to see if that can happen in your case.
Wow! That's interesting. As the motor spins down the back emf must be picked up by the inverter as grid power and the inverter stays on. Or such?
Yes I believe the back emf keeps it in sync. It happened when they came to replace my meter with the new smart meter. I asked the meter guy to wait while my pellet stove shut down, but he pulled the meter out of the socket and I was surprised my basement lights stayed on. After he put the new meter in I realized it was my solar panels and inverter with the pellt stove running that kept it generating. It akes sense as I have a 3 phase machine that I run by stating a 3/4 hp 3 phase motor that I start with a phase converter ( I only have single phase in my house) then I can run my 1/2 hp milling machine as if I had 3 phase in my house. Thanks for your reply Bob Hayes @@bobd.6005
Instead of solar tubs for light, I wired in 4 different lights in my house that give me a ton of light no matter what time of day runs off two batteries and one 200-watt solar panel.
You mention there is another microinverter you are looking into that may fit the standard requirements - can you share which one?
For sure, I would like to try the NEP 600-LV but it is hard to find a dependable supplier in the US for the low voltage (120V out) version northernep.com/products/microinverters/bdm-600-lv
@@everydaysolar thank you!
To actually save money operate your solar by using a switch box during the morning and afternoon with your solar power than switch back to power at night save about 50% or more on electricity. You must have a switch box though.
I would say with all the regulations being put in place that going off grid is the way now. Grid tie is being used against homeowners now. So just stop using grid. Unless you run out of battery. Basically grid is backup now.
I wish you had a thermal camera. It's probaby a simple component failure which could have been determined with the thermal camera and you could have replaced that overheating part. It's probably a simple fix.
I think you panels are suppose to be 300 watts each and not 360 watts. It's safer to over size the inverter and not run it at max rating for longer life.
4X360W solar panel isn't it too much for a 1200W controller to handle?
how did you phase in your inverter to the grid?
if at any time you produce more power than you are using in the house without a proper net meter the meter will register the power you put back onto the grid as you still using it. so they will just take your power and charge you for it.......
Did you try and just use the one that wasn't working by itself and test if it works. It might be the heat produced from the pair which is too much for it. If it works by itself it might be worth separating them putting it in its own enclosure.