Future of VR & Positive Toxicity in Quest and PCVR - Where Is Virtual Reality REALLY Heading?
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- Опубліковано 7 жов 2024
- Do you LOVE VR? Love your Quest 2 or Quest 3 headset? Do you play the high-end games on PCVR like Half-Life Alyx, or even the standalone games like Walkabout Mini-Golf, Walking Dead Saints & Sinners, or Demeo? How do YOU feel about VR? And, do you feel that youtubers (like me) are TOO positive about their feelings about VR, and you feel they aren't really representing what virtual reality is REALLY like right now? Toxic positivity might be a thing, or maybe it's not, but let's have that discussion. After watching Mr. VR Voice's recent video about toxic positivity in VR, I felt compelled to make this video in response to it. You might be surprised by how I felt about what Mr. VR Voice had to say. I'd love to hear what YOU have to say about it as well in the comments. Let's discuss!
LINK TO MR. VR VOICE's video: • The Toxically Positive...
Music by Jolly Julian
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I've been into VR for about a year. The biggest reason I love VR, I'm 56, and my aiming skills continue to deteriorate, mostly cause I'm lazy. I love how VR let's me point and shoot...or stab etc. The immersion is wonderful. I've only mostly played RE 4 and Golf+ with the DriverElite club (I'm addicted). I purchased a few games from Meta and about 5 games from Steam, Half Life: Alyx, Red Matter 2 and others like them to help support both platforms. I played Red Matter 2 for about 30 minutes. I can't wait to start that game alone.
Sorry for the short novel. I appreciate your attitude.
Thanks Jolly Julian!
thats actually kinda cool.
for me its always suprising when older people play any video games at all, but vr? playing VR is like playing DnD. Something that only the biggest nerds do, its the hardcore.
or at least that is the vibe i get from this community.
Great comment, and love your enthusiasm for VR. We are right around the same age, and having been a computer gamer of some sort all my life, it hasn't been till VR that I felt - CONSUMED. In all the best ways. I look forward to hearing more about your VR adventures as you go forward, and I have to play RE4 yet! I've played RE7 all the way through, and loved it so much in VR. Thanks for the comment - great stuff!
One mindset that I try to follow is that even though I do consider a content creator recommendation and verdict, I will also consider the chance of me having a completely different experience with anything I'm interested.
Many times have I looked at an experience that others have praised to heavens and back, just to realize it is not for me which is okay, like some horror games that I am sure are awesome but would literally kill me if I tried.
And another point that made me follow this very channel is, that above all the views and recommendations, it is clear that you are being honest about what you say. But then again, we can't blame other content creators for going for what nets them more views, aiming for the negative stuff, the doom and gloom and titles with bold words in all caps. I'm glad you seem to really enjoy what you are doing here, we don't get many content creators like you these days...
Wonderful comment here, and I've had that experience as well - something that was very highly rated (or opposite), and I experienced something very different when playing myself. Horror is definitely one that can be very subjective, as each person finds different things "scary." I'm glad you appreciate the tone of my approach here, and I intend to keep going that way for sure. Loving VR, and pointing out what could be better along the way. Thanks!
"Toxic positivity"........really, jeez? Your enthusiasm is contagious and enjoyable. None of us are incapable of discerning the difference between positively presented acurate information vs false hype. You were very kind in your analysis of "Mr VR voice's" commentary.....frankly, I think that he came across as a pompous ass.
LOL - thank you for the comment, and while I do hope that most can discern between enthusiasm and "hype," I do understand a bit of where Mr. VR Voice was coming from. I don't fully agree with him, and just glad a discussion has been started, so hopefully more will get who those of us who love VR as much as we do love it as much as we do. Thanks much!
love you attitude towards content 🤩👍👍👍👍👍👍
Well, appreciate that very much - thank you!
I've been watching Mr VR Voice's videos for some time now. I typically agree with his criticisms like VR game mechanics and controls often being poorly implemented. They are valuable critiques I hope the industry will take to heart. _However,_ I often do not agree with his overall conclusions about a game or the industry. These seem very jaded to me.
This has really struck home with me because I had previously avoided buying some games after watching his scathing video reviews of them digging into their janky aspects. But then I ended up buying a game, Arizona Sunshine 2, and playing a lot of the way through it before seeing Mr VR Voice's video slicing that game to pieces. I did agree with many of his criticisms, but I also felt that a portion of them were only because he never played past the tutorial level. Moreover, I didn't feel that the janky aspects he was complaining about and highlighting actually destroyed the game as a whole being fun.
Mr VR Voice goes on to question the sensibilities and/or integrity of anyone who disagrees with his conclusions like this. According to him, if I enjoyed Arizona Sunshine 2, then my standards are very low, or I'm not being honest with myself, or I'm getting caught up in the VR hype train, etc.
I think Mr VR Voice goes too far when he suggests that there's something wrong with anyone who holds a different overall opinion than he does. He's very focused on the armpits of a game, and that clearly ruins it for him. I see those same armpits and agree with him about them, but I feel he often misses how much fun the rest of the game is because he's so focused on the negative. I've realized I can't trust his reviews as being indicative of whether I will personally enjoy a game or not.
I'm with you that just being in VR in itself makes a game significantly better than flat. VR is a new wild west, and it's not as developed and mature as flat gaming is yet. But to me it's akin to going from silent movies to movies with sound. Maybe the early audio wasn't done well at first and there were problems with silent movie actors not being practiced in speaking roles, etc... but having sound makes the movie better than even the most refined silent movies anyway. Just inherently.
That's an opinion. You could have someone who appreciates the older, more mature format more, but that doesn't make my opinion invalid or mean I have low standards or something. That person's critiques about low audio quality could be spot on, and I agree. But I still prefer my movie with sound.
That's how I feel about VR. I'm not interested in flat games anymore as a medium. It's all old obsolete technology to me. The comparisons to flat games mean little to me. I'm more interested in comparisons relative to other VR games and where the VR industry is at as a whole. And that has generally been getting better over time, so I think some positivity is warranted.
No matter how well informed and experienced one might be, they should never place their own opinions as superior to anyone else's, that is a good point and one reason why I also don't consider game reviews when picking my next game anymore. I would say that we can benefit from every content creator out there as long as we are able to filter these out, and remember to give ourselves a chance to like or dislike something even if the all-knowing reviewer said otherwise.
Love this - a very well stated, and personal, look at this! And I agree with what @davidlucena6797 said as well. I think all view points are valid, but we have to take many in, and then, ultimately, form our own opinion. I also think that, the more we find creators who have similar sensibilities to our own, the more we can look to them for first impressions, and maybe be more likely to have them be close to what we might feel. Thanks for the great comment!
has anyone seen the anime "solo leveling" imagine a game/ menu like that for AR on the quest 3. where its like "do 100 push ups, 100 situps, 100 squats, 10km run" every day and you unlock gear, rewards, dungeons, for the ar game. and you get fit doing so
and there are like custom dungeons that pop up around you that you can fight to level up and unlock new exersorsizes and gear to fight the dungeon in, and skills and magic.
i think if someone just made a good Vr mmorpg that would be the closest to the korean regression manhwa thingy
I've not seen this yet, but that sounds intriguing to me. I do love fitness in VR, although the sweat is an issue. So I use my Quest 2 for exercise, and take the face gasket off so it's open and let's more air through. I'll have to check this out!
Hya Julian ;) I have to admit i that, at first, i thought you sound like the stereotypical used car sales rep. Buit following you was great idea and now i get your honest vibes too. I haven't seen the video you refer to, and chances are pretty slim that i will, because he sounds like a machine generated voice and i like genuine vids with real people narrating. Yes, he surely has a point, because one can hardly tell if the video is bought or not, unless the channel clearly states it. But to be honest: IMHO VR is the best invention since sliced white bread. Admittedly there are good, bad and ugly games. But i noticed that my PC on its own gets way less screen time since i hot my electrical dreamcap. Examples? Today i went on a trip through Bankok and then Tokyo. I was up on the ISS and after dinner i'm gonna patrol a virtual city for replicants and run other police errands ;) Better visuals - sure, i'd buy those for a proverbial dollar - but what we have now is the best that's currently available. So why not sing a little praise but keep the drawbacks on the radar? No need to bash VR -especially not for clicks - keep doing what you do the way YOU want it! Best redards from that old German fart. 👴
love this comment so much - and always welcome people from all over the world into our little Virtual community here. Good to have you hear. Love the used car sales rep part - I know where you're coming from. Sometimes it's hard to get on board with someone who is really excited about something, without it feeling like "hype." But glad you're enjoying the honest feelings coming at ya! You're getting some really great varied experiences in there, and that's so awesome... the "traveling the world" and "experiencing real things you maybe won't ever get to" are some of the things I love about VR the most. Hope to run into you in VR sometime soon!
Genuine Julian!
Love that! I'm nothing if not.... who I am. LOL (for good or bad)
Have you got your new PC yet ?
He did, check out a video with his unboxing/review.
I did, and I'm liking it very much! More updates to come, but have been playing with it a TON over the last few weeks. Really pushing it in MSFS2020 - the HOG of VR!
At 80 I've been 2d game playing for as long as I can remember (Moon Lander on a 1970 PDP-8 with a teletype !!) so I feel that I'm fairly qualified to talk briefly about the present state of VR. Like computerised telescopes are to the average Joe, VR is, and always will be, a niche product. Attempts by manufactures to attract the masses is never going to work. That Meta tv advert where a man uses his Quest 3 to assemble a baby's cot is an unfortunate joke. I agree with you, Julian, I would rather play a graphical poor game in VR then a Ray traced master piece in 2d, but, and it's a big but, it's not for everone and I'm afraid it never will be. But like amateur astronomers with their state of the art computerised marvel or Radio Hams with a 5000 pound transreceiver, VR in its present state can only be for the technical curious amongst us. VR is a wonderful hobby and long may it continue. Thanks for your brilliant and entertaining videos.
The comparison to telescopes or ham radios is a false analogy. Those are both examples of technologies which are inherently niche. The subject in itself is only interesting to a small subset of the population no matter how good the technology gets.
By contrast, VR is an evolution of video gaming, and video gaming has broad appeal. The only thing that makes VR a niche right now is limitations of the technology and limited content.
What happens when VR technology reaches the point of surpassing flat monitors in every way? You could argue that it never will, but at that point you're not arguing that VR is inherently niche. You're just arguing that the technology will never be good enough.
And I think that's a poor bet to take.
@@SargonDragon Point taken. I stand corrected.
Love the conversation started here between you and @sargondragon! These are the discussions I love to see. No one being snippy or cruel - just people with differing outlooks talking about a thing we all love - VR. I think you make some great points, @faz323. I think the biggest challenge to get VR / AR to the mainstream is the PHYSICAL aspects of the tech more than anything. This is something you wear, and not two people (or faces) are the same. I'm anxious to see where this goes in the future, for sure. I do believe that AR, at the very least, will be mainstream. It's only a matter of time. VR, I also believe will become very mainstream, but maybe not to the level of, say, smart-phone adoption. But AR GLASSES? Oh yeah. I could see those being as big as smart phones some day. A ways from now, but maybe in the late 2030s?
I hate vr haters they are slowing us down. Vr is awesome
I'm there with ya - hating for hating sake I hate.... wait.... you know what I'm saying.... LOL
I own a quest and i cant tell how many times i bought a game because of positive reviews, just to refund it after a couple minutes.
Truly subjective, for sure - possibly because VR is so much more "personal." Everyone has different aspects of VR that connect with them, and things that don't. I've had those experiences as well....
“ Toxic positivity” is NOT a thing . Uninformed and inexperienced people stating their opinions as facts IS toxic though lol .
VR still needs a userbase , most has to be centered toward new users , adults don’t adapt to VR as easily as kids . Meta is spending to mass adoption and working on everything in the tech .
Plus about a thousand other factors outside of gaming . People trying to talk about the “ state of VR “ without taking these factors into account are merely guessing and most likely wrong because they aren’t considering them .
Reviews of games shouldn’t be that hard . Separate personal opinion and preferences from facts . Be able to understand why others like genres you may not . Flat out take an online journalism course or something to understand the basic principles of reporting information I guess lol .
You can be as positive and opinionated as you want , as long as it is tempered with unbiased information and keep um separate lol .
There is A LOT more “ toxic negativity” in VR then whatever they are complaining about though . From those that have been in the longest and feel slighted by meta being extremely shortsighted and ignoring that we wouldn’t be here without what they are doing .
I play all kinds of stuff , just like games . Some think what they like about VR is the ONLY thing good about it ….. screw them lol .
Keep on keeping on . Positivity being looked at as a bad thing is if people are being disingenuous… that isn’t what’s happening . People don’t figure out what they like in VR and try random things and random genres . Then blame the creator for liking a game they don’t ….. that’s dumb .
As consumers we need to figure out what we like in VR which requires trying random stuff till you find it …
They are complaining about the process of figuring out what kind of VR genres they like lol Then just blame it on someone they listened to but didn’t understand .., hence why being clear is so important .
Good luck bud . There are a lot of opinions in the VR world … problem is most are from out of context and missing information that makes that opinion more then bias .
For what it’s worth I think what you do is very good . Also the “ positive “ reviewers grow exponentially faster then the negative reviewers. There are channels from pcvr days that haven’t grown since quest barely because all they do is complain about the most popular headset and it’s games . Effectively running off ANY potential new subscribers because they most likely just bought a quest….. lol .
Your good dude .
Okay, you just said SO MUCH of what I'm feeling, and you said it even better than I could. Truly a strong perspective on the climate of VR right now, and the importance of INFORMED critique, taking into account not only what YOU like or dislike, but what others may feel as well. Really a fantastic comment, and I truly hope others see it as well. Hope to run into you in VR sometime. I think we would have lots to talk about. Keep VR-ing!