I absolutely love this video! It's like opening a big window in a dark room and all of a sudden you start seeing very clearly everything you were struggling to grasp in the shadows. THANK YOU!
When it comes to pop music I think the word you're looking for is monody, which is when you have a single melody paired with a homophonic, harmonic accompaniment. Really love your videos! They're concise, yet cover a lot.
These and the Schenkerian analysis videos: thank you! I've been looking and looking and looking and looking for in-depth music theory that I didn't have to pay to get another degree for.
Thank you so much for specifying that this is a western music tradition. My college professor simply said it's necessary to understand and write good music.
Great channel, subscribed. I find it hard to differentiate between the melodies of the Cantus Firmus and the fourth and fifth species. Without the score I'd never have heard the polyphony. I hope my ear improves.
I want to understand writing counter melodies for modern music (hiphop, pop, modern R&B, blues, old R&B) - does anyone have any fundamental videos they'd recommend?
Great job Gran, could you make a video or reply on this comment with regards to book recommendation for studying species counterpoint. Thanks a ton in advance.
True, it doesn’t include ^6, which we think of as the characteristic sound of the Dorian mode. Fux’s Lydian CF also does not include ^4. But if we think of Dorian as “the mode beginning and ending on D,” then this CF would have to be considered Dorian.
I do believe that if Knud Jeppesen's Counterpoint book on the Palestrina style had co-existed with the Gradus, Gradus would never have made it! I did study Gradus to begin with but in all ways it is inferior to the newer (historical correct and scientific) counterpoint book by Knud Jeppesen. Do you like Fux as a composer compared to Palestrina ? Didn't those teachers who have used the Gradus in their teaching alter it to their own taste anyway ? It's a great outline on how to teach but all the examples are debatable belonging to Fux's own style of composition, certainly NOT Palestrina. This to me shows that the original first edition of the Gradus is useless (unless you really want to compose like Fux). If you are going to teach from it you need to pick a specific composer or a style period and fit all examples to that changing the original examples in the book. Not to mention the fact that Gradus was aimed at teaching how to compose for the voice (ease of singing), in instrumental counterpoint you are free to break almost all of the rules (a bit exaggerated but somewhat true). I know this is a bit harsh but I do honestly believe that studying the Gradus can do more harm than good. We need to pick an ideal composer and start with what he/she did. To what degree did J.S. Bach follow the examples from the Gradus ? And W.A. Mozart ? I can only recommend people to avoid Gradus and use Knud Jeppesen's Counterpoint book instead. I haven't read newer books on modal counterpoint so can't recommend them.
I partly agree. I think of it like neo-classical architecture being a later generation’s interpretation or idealization of an earlier generation’s style. That in no way renders the US capital building a useless piece of architecture because it isn’t authentic. Jeppesen and Taneev both do a better job of describing the style of Palestrina and 16th c vocal polyphony than Fux, but Gradus was so influential for such a long period of the common practice (and his species pedagogy was also successful and influential) that I think it makes an excellent starting point for understanding how counterpoint functions in the common practice in general. Students need to progress beyond it, of course, to see how counterpoint works in specific styles by studying real repertoire rather than rule based exercises.
11:45 can it be a combination of whole note ,half note and qauter notes sir...? can we still call it first species counter point....... i mean say for example we took a 8 bar melody and considered it as a cantus firmus....and i follow the rules of firrt species counter point and write a melody on top or below c.f....will it be still first species counter point? tq so much in advance wonderful videos thanks a lotttt
Good question. The Cantus firmus was traditionally given in slow and equal note values, either breves, whole notes, or sometimes half notes, and so the counterpoint melody would also be written in equal note values. A CF with mixed note values is possible in real music (as opposed to in an exercise) but it would be thought of in terms of fifth species rather than first species.
I don't know anything. 've only gone through one of your videos, the discussion of the schenker analysis from the published collection of 5. Got excited and would like to go through all your materials. Where should I start, species? If not, where? Also, does each video refer me to the proper next one? For example when I get to last one in species series am I referred to the next subject? Is there a flow chart of the videos so I don't end up somewhere for which I'm not prepared?
The cult of Fux or the cult of Schenker, which has done more damage? Nevertheless your seduction is so good I will have to listen to the dark potions bubble.....with antidotes by Gjerdingen kept in reach.
I am nothing if not seductive, lol. (By the way I would recommend the videos in the "Tonal Voice Leading" playlist rather than these older species counterpoint videos. They are better made, more thorough, and cover the same material from Fux, plus later counterpoint authors.)
![АЛАУДИНОВ у Скабеевой: эти их ВСУ нас НЕ ДОГОНЯТ 😁 [Пародия]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/an0anqU4WGQ/mqdefault.jpg)
I absolutely love this video! It's like opening a big window in a dark room and all of a sudden you start seeing very clearly everything you were struggling to grasp in the shadows. THANK YOU!
That’s very generous; thank you!
We homeschool and this is going into our art routine, thank you so much
I've been dipping my toes into baroque style composition and this series is just what I needed, thank you.
I've been looking for a real beginner counterpoint lesson and I've finally found it. Merci beaucoup.
When it comes to pop music I think the word you're looking for is monody, which is when you have a single melody paired with a homophonic, harmonic accompaniment.
Really love your videos! They're concise, yet cover a lot.
You have a gift for explaining these ideas clearly _and_ with some reasoning behind them. Your analogies are superb. Thank you.
Very very very very good!
Thank you very much, Dr. Jacob Gran!
it's crazy how well you explained species counterpoint. I love it, great job.
These and the Schenkerian analysis videos: thank you! I've been looking and looking and looking and looking for in-depth music theory that I didn't have to pay to get another degree for.
Thanks so much Jacob! This is just what I needed! God Bless
Perfect explanation of basics of counterpoint. I passed the Species Counterpoint lessons before I tried to compose my first four-voice fugue.
Fantastically clear and logically presented, can't wait to see the other videos in the series, thank you.
I'm glad I finally looked into this. There is a lot of research and experimentation to be done!
Extremely interesting and crystal clear explanations! Thank you! 🙏
Excellent video series. Thanks for doing these and sharing.
Glad you like them!
Great video series. Much appreciated.
" The most important thing to know about counterpoint is What it's purposes is..." The glory of God... great and accessible video!!
Thank you for this clear explanation
Very good video! Very clear and on point
Thanks for making this absolutely beneficial videos.
It is really like solving a musical sudoku
Thank you so much for specifying that this is a western music tradition. My college professor simply said it's necessary to understand and write good music.
10:16 - Aha! I had long heard the term “florid counterpoint,” but I’d never heard it defined. Thanks!
Thank you so much for those lessons 😄
My pleasure!
It feels like I'm committing a crime watching this video. The quality of your channel makes me believe I shouldn't be able to watch this for free.
Thank you so much for this information!
It is very useful!
Great video
Great introduction. Thanks.
Thank you for this excellent explanation.
Glad you got something out of it!
love it!!
Great channel, subscribed. I find it hard to differentiate between the melodies of the Cantus Firmus and the fourth and fifth species. Without the score I'd never have heard the polyphony. I hope my ear improves.
You deserve more views ⭐️👌🎶👏🏻
❤
👏
I want to understand writing counter melodies for modern music (hiphop, pop, modern R&B, blues, old R&B) - does anyone have any fundamental videos they'd recommend?
Great job Gran, could you make a video or reply on this comment with regards to book recommendation for studying species counterpoint.
Thanks a ton in advance.
How is this cantus firmus in dorian? it seems like it only appears dorian once the counterpoint is added
True, it doesn’t include ^6, which we think of as the characteristic sound of the Dorian mode. Fux’s Lydian CF also does not include ^4. But if we think of Dorian as “the mode beginning and ending on D,” then this CF would have to be considered Dorian.
I do believe that if Knud Jeppesen's Counterpoint book on the Palestrina style had co-existed with the Gradus, Gradus would never have made it! I did study Gradus to begin with but in all ways it is inferior to the newer (historical correct and scientific) counterpoint book by Knud Jeppesen.
Do you like Fux as a composer compared to Palestrina ? Didn't those teachers who have used the Gradus in their teaching alter it to their own taste anyway ? It's a great outline on how to teach but all the examples are debatable belonging to Fux's own style of composition, certainly NOT Palestrina.
This to me shows that the original first edition of the Gradus is useless (unless you really want to compose like Fux).
If you are going to teach from it you need to pick a specific composer or a style period and fit all examples to that changing the original examples in the book. Not to mention the fact that Gradus was aimed at teaching how to compose for the voice (ease of singing), in instrumental counterpoint you are free to break almost all of the rules (a bit exaggerated but somewhat true).
I know this is a bit harsh but I do honestly believe that studying the Gradus can do more harm than good. We need to pick an ideal composer and start with what he/she did. To what degree did J.S. Bach follow the examples from the Gradus ? And W.A. Mozart ?
I can only recommend people to avoid Gradus and use Knud Jeppesen's Counterpoint book instead. I haven't read newer books on modal counterpoint so can't recommend them.
I partly agree. I think of it like neo-classical architecture being a later generation’s interpretation or idealization of an earlier generation’s style. That in no way renders the US capital building a useless piece of architecture because it isn’t authentic. Jeppesen and Taneev both do a better job of describing the style of Palestrina and 16th c vocal polyphony than Fux, but Gradus was so influential for such a long period of the common practice (and his species pedagogy was also successful and influential) that I think it makes an excellent starting point for understanding how counterpoint functions in the common practice in general. Students need to progress beyond it, of course, to see how counterpoint works in specific styles by studying real repertoire rather than rule based exercises.
11:45 can it be a combination of whole note ,half note and qauter notes sir...? can we still call it first species counter point....... i mean say for example we took a 8 bar melody and considered it as a cantus firmus....and i follow the rules of firrt species counter point and write a melody on top or below c.f....will it be still first species counter point?
tq so much in advance wonderful videos thanks a lotttt
Good question. The Cantus firmus was traditionally given in slow and equal note values, either breves, whole notes, or sometimes half notes, and so the counterpoint melody would also be written in equal note values. A CF with mixed note values is possible in real music (as opposed to in an exercise) but it would be thought of in terms of fifth species rather than first species.
@@JacobGran tq soo much sir....😊
Do you offer online music theory help?
I have a Patreon for questions about counterpoint, and I am in the process of making some online courses that will hopefully go live this summer.
Thank You
I don't know anything. 've only gone through one of your videos, the discussion of the schenker analysis from the published collection of 5.
Got excited and would like to go through all your materials. Where should I start, species? If not, where?
Also, does each video refer me to the proper next one? For example when I get to last one in species series am I referred to the next subject? Is there a flow chart of the videos so I don't end up somewhere for which I'm not prepared?
Cool
good
The cult of Fux or the cult of Schenker, which has done more damage? Nevertheless your seduction is so good I will have to listen to the dark potions bubble.....with antidotes by Gjerdingen kept in reach.
I am nothing if not seductive, lol.
(By the way I would recommend the videos in the "Tonal Voice Leading" playlist rather than these older species counterpoint videos. They are better made, more thorough, and cover the same material from Fux, plus later counterpoint authors.)