I think the most heartbreaking part is that Lenore understands right away. Before Verna sits on the bed she knows that she's going to die, and she just... listens. Lenore always listened.
"that choice you made echos through millions of lives" and the same could be said for her grandfather but in the exact opposite direction! this scene is the inverse of the falling bodies scene in Roderick's conference room, masterful.
Exactly. In fact the same music plays, when detective speaks with Roderick for the very first time about documents. It was his turning point. The choice Roderick made that day echoed through millions of lives, as well as lenore did
@@sampostolov4398 oh that's awesome! It only just clicked in my mind while I was watching this scene again that Lenore's legacy is the exact opposite of Roderick's but I love that there's even a musical cue indicating that it's a deliberate parallel!
@@sampostolov4398 Lenore really is the best of all of the Ushers! It's awesome when they both show and tell you something in a story, it's so satisfying.
i was JUST thinking something similar while watching. i can't believe i hadn't realised before, but Lenore is literally the antithesis to Fortunato (which is obvious), but also in the way that millions that they killed and scarred for money that made the body count for Verna originally was somewhat remedied by the lives later saved because of her defiance, i love it
Verna is such a fascinating character. She can be cruel and vicious when dispatching justice to those who deserve it, even sadistic, but when she faces kind souls like Lenore she's so warm and comforting. Carla Gugino really nails the unearthly nature of this being well.
@Kable-ph2ll that's right. In the last episode, there's a flashback showing Roderick and Madeline make a deal with Verna to perish with their entire bloodline near the end of Roderick's life in exchange for getting away with their crime and taking over Fortunado
More than just warm and comforting. She gets choked up as she's telling Lenore about all the people her mother saves. There are tears forming in her eyes as she tells her "You did that." Verna: this grim reaper? devil? Spirit of vengeance?this whatever she is is genuinely moved by the knowledge that so much goodness in the world can come from one small act. It truly is an amazing performance.
Verna openly states in Rue Morgue that any of them could have had a peaceful, quiet death if they had simply left well enough alone. Pure Usher stubbornness and shameless self-sabotage (in addition to spite, vindictiveness, jealousy and any number of other traits) were the foundation of the others' more gruesome demises.
I initially wondered why Lenore, as the youngest Usher, wasn't the first to die, since it seems like Verna is working up from youngest to oldest. But this scene makes clear that she is not happy that Lenore has to die as part of the deal, as she's the one Usher who is a good person and might have made a difference. Which is probably why she dies last before the twins. Verna can't change to deal to spare her, so she instead tries to give Lenore as much time as she still can.
I think because she was an offspring. Verna worked her way through the first level relatives and then Lenore. She also was the most innocent of them all, and as Verna says, she feels no joy in doing what she has to do with her. The others were a game, Lenore is pure collateral.
I love this scene. Verna didn't have to tell her these things. She could have simply collected what was owed to her and been done with it. Furthermore, she could have killed Lenore in a brutal fashion like the others. She was simply collecting a debt. This scene made me think that Verna was not truly evil, or malicious in any way. She showed compassion and even pity for circumstances that were out of Lenores control.
Exactly my thoughts back when i watched it for the first time! She wasn't obliged to do anything other than collect, but she did anyway because there's a human side of her.
This is one of the reasons I love death as a character. For anyone who's ever read anything by Neil Gaiman, or Terry Prachett. you know that death is nothing to be feared. To have someone kind to hold your hand, and tell you the impact your existence had on the people you love, on the whole world, who could think of a better way to go?
When I think about it, Verna told Tamerlane that she didn’t prefer she go out this way, rather she preferred if she was lying down. I think all those gruesome deaths could have been avoided if each of them actually listened (especially that whole scene with Victorine ignoring what she was saying and being greedy instead). Well, except Frederick. As she said, he HAD it coming 😂
(1). I also think Lenore saving Morrie was a reason Verna delayed Lenore’s death. (2). Second viewing finished and I think of Verna kind of like Solitude in Suzanne Vega’s song Solitude Standing, (palm is split with a flower and a flame)
This scene broke my heart. But it's important that Lenore knows "she did that", basically admitting that Verna had no influence (voluntarily or otherwise) over the choice Lenore made.
Once the "deal" is made clear, and it hit me suddenly that "oh shit, Lenore is an Usher", I was wondering how they would handle her moment... and then this scene completely blindsided me with how pure and beautiful her life was and the effect she has on others after her death would be. Gugino is so perfect in this role.
This part made me love Verna. She killed the others driving them to madness, or facing them with their cruelty, but Lenore had the sweetest death we wish to have : no pain, brief and hopeful for the future.
this scene shows that Verna is all about balance. she gave power to those who took the lives of millions as a result, but also sent into motion events that would save the lives of millions more. its brutal balance.
Aww you cut off the best part! In the beginning when Verna said it wasn't her job to explain what the words "entire lineage" meant, it was already very clear that she has a distaste about carrying out this particular death. And Carla Gugino did that with just her voice! That's some top tier acting right there!
This is the saddest scene of all. It just goes to show Verna isn’t as evil as everyone thinks it’s just the way we perceive death whether she will be bad or good. You might call Verna the Angel of Death.
By far, she is one of my favorite characters in film ever and reminds me of several strong, terrifying and caring women in stories I've read. Carla played this role beautifully.
IMO, Verna is like a genie but works within 'Destiny's order'. Sure, she looks evil and she grant wishes of twisted people, but nothing is free in this world. She makes wishes come true while also make sure the payment (including consequences of the wish) fulfilled, like karmic debt.
If You think Verna is Evil You missed the entire Point of the Story. Verna is the Consequence of the Deal they made Decades ago. She is literally Powerless unless You give Her the Power over You and Yours. Verna is Accountability.
my understanding is that Morella gets the inheritance that would have gone to Frederick as his widow, and also(sadly) Lenore's trust fund share as her only next of kin.
Guessing her signing off on the liquidation of Fortunato is how Morella gets her inheritance which she then uses to help millions of people. Or that's just the money owed to her being a widow of Fred Usher
and there's still one thing I don't understand because Verna gave the choice that Prospero might still have time to stop it, but she didn't give Leonora that option. And I also don't like the fact that their death depended on their parents' selfish decision, and none of these people asked what to do next during the "execution", and most of them wanted to bribe death, what an idiot you have to be to suggest it.
Their deaths were foregone, the consequences of the deal the twins made with Verna. I think the "might still have time to stop it" was a choice to die peacefully or terribly. Each of the children were given that choice.
yes, you are obviously right that it was all about choosing the suffering associated with death itself. but the idea that you were good will die peacefully and if you are bad you will die in agony, unlike the fact that children suffer because of their parents' decisions. As for the series itself, the music, scenery and Verona's acting are outstanding
I would... I would just make sure I did GOOD... TRUE GOOD. she never says your going to hell by doing the deal... But choice I guess... I guess by killing Rufus they had already condemned themselves...
@@Iris_1217 I want to make the deal and not be an internal torment though LOL 😆 I'd like to think if they use their money for good and not painful purposes and change the world for the better I'd like to think that they would have eternal peace 😆
What was the point of Verna even telling her that story if she was gonna kill her immediately after? Can Lenore’s spirit return to haunt Verna? Verna said she loves her job 🤔 I wonder who her boss is
She told her the story to give the both of them comfort. She has to kill a child, and it's tough on both of them. I don't believe she has a boss; I think she's her own entity with her own power, but her power works on certain rules.
I assume she's Death itself and if that's the case she wouldn't really have one. That compassionate side of her we briefly got to see reminded me of Neil Gaiman's version of Death (which is the best one imo) though she doesn't enjoy her job to the point of sadism like with Verna.
I think the most heartbreaking part is that Lenore understands right away. Before Verna sits on the bed she knows that she's going to die, and she just... listens. Lenore always listened.
I think Verna had her spellbound at that point, hence why she was so calm and complacent
Shame she didn't win an Emmy for this scene - she really nails it.
"that choice you made echos through millions of lives" and the same could be said for her grandfather but in the exact opposite direction! this scene is the inverse of the falling bodies scene in Roderick's conference room, masterful.
Exactly. In fact the same music plays, when detective speaks with Roderick for the very first time about documents. It was his turning point. The choice Roderick made that day echoed through millions of lives, as well as lenore did
@@sampostolov4398 oh that's awesome! It only just clicked in my mind while I was watching this scene again that Lenore's legacy is the exact opposite of Roderick's but I love that there's even a musical cue indicating that it's a deliberate parallel!
Yep, scrinwriters and composers did their very best)@@feelingReckless13
@@sampostolov4398 Lenore really is the best of all of the Ushers! It's awesome when they both show and tell you something in a story, it's so satisfying.
i was JUST thinking something similar while watching. i can't believe i hadn't realised before, but Lenore is literally the antithesis to Fortunato (which is obvious), but also in the way that millions that they killed and scarred for money that made the body count for Verna originally was somewhat remedied by the lives later saved because of her defiance, i love it
Verna is such a fascinating character. She can be cruel and vicious when dispatching justice to those who deserve it, even sadistic, but when she faces kind souls like Lenore she's so warm and comforting. Carla Gugino really nails the unearthly nature of this being well.
Evil is like a funny joke and every demon loves a jester, but at the end of every comedy is the desire for a Good ending
@Kable-ph2ll that's right. In the last episode, there's a flashback showing Roderick and Madeline make a deal with Verna to perish with their entire bloodline near the end of Roderick's life in exchange for getting away with their crime and taking over Fortunado
More than just warm and comforting. She gets choked up as she's telling Lenore about all the people her mother saves. There are tears forming in her eyes as she tells her "You did that." Verna: this grim reaper? devil? Spirit of vengeance?this whatever she is is genuinely moved by the knowledge that so much goodness in the world can come from one small act.
It truly is an amazing performance.
I love this scene. Verna took no pleasure in killing Lenore, so she made her send off as beautiful and peaceful as she could.
Verna openly states in Rue Morgue that any of them could have had a peaceful, quiet death if they had simply left well enough alone. Pure Usher stubbornness and shameless self-sabotage (in addition to spite, vindictiveness, jealousy and any number of other traits) were the foundation of the others' more gruesome demises.
I initially wondered why Lenore, as the youngest Usher, wasn't the first to die, since it seems like Verna is working up from youngest to oldest. But this scene makes clear that she is not happy that Lenore has to die as part of the deal, as she's the one Usher who is a good person and might have made a difference. Which is probably why she dies last before the twins. Verna can't change to deal to spare her, so she instead tries to give Lenore as much time as she still can.
I think because she was an offspring. Verna worked her way through the first level relatives and then Lenore. She also was the most innocent of them all, and as Verna says, she feels no joy in doing what she has to do with her. The others were a game, Lenore is pure collateral.
Throughout this episode i keep hoping that lenore was never fred's real child and never has Usher's bloodline. Well, i was hoping too much.😢
Same! I thought she might have been adopted. Lenore was really the only innocent Usher.
I love this scene. Verna didn't have to tell her these things. She could have simply collected what was owed to her and been done with it. Furthermore, she could have killed Lenore in a brutal fashion like the others. She was simply collecting a debt. This scene made me think that Verna was not truly evil, or malicious in any way. She showed compassion and even pity for circumstances that were out of Lenores control.
Exactly my thoughts back when i watched it for the first time! She wasn't obliged to do anything other than collect, but she did anyway because there's a human side of her.
This is one of the reasons I love death as a character. For anyone who's ever read anything by Neil Gaiman, or Terry Prachett. you know that death is nothing to be feared. To have someone kind to hold your hand, and tell you the impact your existence had on the people you love, on the whole world, who could think of a better way to go?
When I think about it, Verna told Tamerlane that she didn’t prefer she go out this way, rather she preferred if she was lying down. I think all those gruesome deaths could have been avoided if each of them actually listened (especially that whole scene with Victorine ignoring what she was saying and being greedy instead). Well, except Frederick. As she said, he HAD it coming 😂
(1). I also think Lenore saving Morrie was a reason Verna delayed Lenore’s death. (2). Second viewing finished and I think of Verna kind of like Solitude in Suzanne Vega’s song Solitude Standing, (palm is split with a flower and a flame)
This is why I think she's possibly more Death than a demon. A demon wouldn't show compassion like this to cruel or kind souls alike.
If we remember one thing it's " you did that, that choice you made echoes through millions of lives"
This scene broke my heart. But it's important that Lenore knows "she did that", basically admitting that Verna had no influence (voluntarily or otherwise) over the choice Lenore made.
Once the "deal" is made clear, and it hit me suddenly that "oh shit, Lenore is an Usher", I was wondering how they would handle her moment... and then this scene completely blindsided me with how pure and beautiful her life was and the effect she has on others after her death would be. Gugino is so perfect in this role.
This part made me love Verna.
She killed the others driving them to madness, or facing them with their cruelty, but Lenore had the sweetest death we wish to have : no pain, brief and hopeful for the future.
this scene shows that Verna is all about balance. she gave power to those who took the lives of millions as a result, but also sent into motion events that would save the lives of millions more. its brutal balance.
There is speculation that she is a demon or Death itself, but now your comment has me thinking...Anubis?
Aww you cut off the best part! In the beginning when Verna said it wasn't her job to explain what the words "entire lineage" meant, it was already very clear that she has a distaste about carrying out this particular death. And Carla Gugino did that with just her voice! That's some top tier acting right there!
Dirty rats made me believe she was gonna be spared :(
I love this scene so much. Finally someone downloaded.
I just had to. Carla Gugino (Verna) is absolutely amazing throughout the series, and this scene was beautiful yet so painfully sad.
This is the saddest scene of all. It just goes to show Verna isn’t as evil as everyone thinks it’s just the way we perceive death whether she will be bad or good. You might call Verna the Angel of Death.
By far, she is one of my favorite characters in film ever and reminds me of several strong, terrifying and caring women in stories I've read. Carla played this role beautifully.
The whole episode I was wondering about this death. And it was so sad to see 😢
IMO, Verna is like a genie but works within 'Destiny's order'.
Sure, she looks evil and she grant wishes of twisted people, but nothing is free in this world. She makes wishes come true while also make sure the payment (including consequences of the wish) fulfilled, like karmic debt.
If You think Verna is Evil You missed the entire Point of the Story. Verna is the Consequence of the Deal they made Decades ago. She is literally Powerless unless You give Her the Power over You and Yours. Verna is Accountability.
Ooh Carla you’re one of the best and you earned it, thank you
This scene broke me. It still does
I cried my eyes out. This scene and her AI text messages. It made me so angry and just broke my heart.
I cried so much during this scene ❤
This scene is beautiful
It's interesting that she says this is a "job".
I mean, dexter probably thinks of it the same way
Sad asf
I thought you should know that.
Wonder what the official cause of death would’ve been🤔🤔
Cardiac arrest probably
This was so sad
I was kinda confused because Verna says Lorna gets the fortune, but we see Juno signing off assets to help victims of addiction
Do u think Juno got all of them?
@@resurgingflame I thought that was the implication but I could be wrong
my understanding is that Morella gets the inheritance that would have gone to Frederick as his widow, and also(sadly) Lenore's trust fund share as her only next of kin.
Guessing her signing off on the liquidation of Fortunato is how Morella gets her inheritance which she then uses to help millions of people. Or that's just the money owed to her being a widow of Fred Usher
Anybody know the title of the score?
and there's still one thing I don't understand because Verna gave the choice that Prospero might still have time to stop it, but she didn't give Leonora that option. And I also don't like the fact that their death depended on their parents' selfish decision, and none of these people asked what to do next during the "execution", and most of them wanted to bribe death, what an idiot you have to be to suggest it.
"The sins of the fathers are visited upon the children." I think that quote from the bible pretty much sums it up
Their deaths were foregone, the consequences of the deal the twins made with Verna. I think the "might still have time to stop it" was a choice to die peacefully or terribly. Each of the children were given that choice.
yes, you are obviously right that it was all about choosing the suffering associated with death itself. but the idea that you were good will die peacefully and if you are bad you will die in agony, unlike the fact that children suffer because of their parents' decisions. As for the series itself, the music, scenery and Verona's acting are outstanding
Is Lenore's actress Abra from Dr. Sleep?
Yep
Does anybody want to make a deal?
What kind of deal
😆😆😆
I would... I would just make sure I did GOOD... TRUE GOOD. she never says your going to hell by doing the deal... But choice I guess... I guess by killing Rufus they had already condemned themselves...
@@dannydark1452 Or just do what Madeline did and... don't have kids.
@@Iris_1217 I want to make the deal and not be an internal torment though LOL 😆 I'd like to think if they use their money for good and not painful purposes and change the world for the better I'd like to think that they would have eternal peace 😆
What was the point of Verna even telling her that story if she was gonna kill her immediately after?
Can Lenore’s spirit return to haunt Verna?
Verna said she loves her job 🤔 I wonder who her boss is
She told her the story to give the both of them comfort. She has to kill a child, and it's tough on both of them.
I don't believe she has a boss; I think she's her own entity with her own power, but her power works on certain rules.
I assume she's Death itself and if that's the case she wouldn't really have one. That compassionate side of her we briefly got to see reminded me of Neil Gaiman's version of Death (which is the best one imo) though she doesn't enjoy her job to the point of sadism like with Verna.
Can you upload the scene when verna tries to make a deal with pym? Please please please