5 Things I HATE about the UK CAA Drone Consultation!
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- Опубліковано 12 лип 2024
- Hey everyone! There are a lot of positive parts of the UK CAA drone consultation, recently released to review drone rules in the UK. However, there is also some parts to cause a lot of concern! Join Sean as he spells out the 5 things he HATES about the UK CAA Drone Consultation! Agree? Let us know in the comments.
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Sean Hickey, founder of Geeksvana and main channel presenter is a UK registered journalist who seeks to provide accurate information on what is an often misquoted and misrepresented industry and hobby. Sean currently holds certificates from the UK Civil Aviation Authority, including both the A2 Certificate of Competency (A2 CofC) and the General Visual Line of Sight Certificate (GVC). Flying all sizes of multirotor aircraft from the small DJI Mini 2 to larger aircraft including the DJI Inspire series for both hobby flights and commercial work.
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Sean, put the CAA on the spot in an interview and hold them accountable
I still find network remote ID to be a problem that a bored cop could start to look a at historical drone flights and determine that they were beyond VLOS with prosecutions to follow. On the whole I think that the potential hazard of drone flights has been greatly overestimated as shown by the lack of accidents and convictions for dangerous flights. Thanks for your reporting on this I hope we get heard.
Is it not possible to delete your history? Asking for a friend 🤣
They will just use a computer with AI intelligence to monitor flight paths and just send out notices without any human intervention at all.
Think speed cameras.
Very well put.
This is likely another pre-determined UK govt consulation (HMRC / HMT does those regularily) and then will push what they want through regardless...
Speachless. CAA really showing their true colours here. Ignorant , ill-informed on everything. For me there are other things at play here by the "Stakeholders". The same people that called "Drone at Gatwick". Disgusting behaviour by the CAA.
Thank you for including FPV in this! I feel were a forgotten niche when it comes to regulation. Like anyone else i just want to be able to fly in peace and legally under common sense regulation. Im very much a park flyer, dont tun complex camera systems, dont run any kind of automatic just enjoy getting a craft in the air. Its quite stressing the amount of time & money ive out into this basically to have an expiry date of 2028 potentially hanging over it all. More so this is my little escape from life & its stresses, a chance to decompress and enjoy my little bubble of happiness. Im sure there are many in a similar position.
I cant help but feel these rules are being proposed based on stigma alone without a proper boots in the ground investigation but again it feels like rights go to the highest bidder.
I’m with ya buddy , Fpv is my escape , I follow all the rules , it’s very stressful to think goalposts moving might stop us enjoying our hobby
My Mini 3 Pro will be technology junk in a few years time; unless of course I just take my chances. Don't buy anything with remote ID capability and don't update firmware. I use my drone for personal scenic photography only and don't understand all these 'auditors'. Auditors 'dare' the authorities to change the rules; and they then just that. Auditors are like children learning the rules of life before becoming an adult.
Sean, thanks for this update and your views. To be honest, this should not come as a surprise to anyone who has been involved with drones for any real length of time. Back in 2017 I got the PfCO - went along to drone shows and to various gatherings when the CAA was present - from a special event held at Compton Abbas airfield to LAA rallies. Representatives from CAA stated how keen they were for the drone community to have access to airspace and how they were intending to help support and regulate airspace responsibly so that all airspace users can operate safely. I was taken in by it for a short while but as time progressed it became clear to me that they have no intention of working with us. It is clear that they want to wipe out those pesky drone fliers. It is also clear that they are making rules and regulations in the complete absence of facts - it is what they have been doing and, I guess, it is what they will continue to do. No sane person wants drone operators to fly irresponsible or to endanger life or property but is this really the best way forward?
If you want to look to the future my be this is all making way for marketing drone deliveries and the SPACE no pun intended is not for us but Amazon and the likes. Horses where the first form of transport and even today they take right of way without questions. Us model flyers ( I’ve flown with DJI from there first QUAD ) where the first that includes model planes before us or me anyway should hold that right . But I feel it will be taken away from us. Probably like Canada have where your flight exam is the same as a commercial aircraft.
Sean..... So nice to hear you speak so frankly!
I completely agree
Also to me the "Fundamental issue" here that really angers me is that so many of the rules apply because drone is equipped with a camera!
Why has the community allowed this?
Registration because a camera can fly?
Don't buildings have roof?
Don't windows have curtains?
🤬
Anyway keep up the good work..... Especially this hard hitting truth talking direct criticism side of Sean I've not often seen.
Number 5 - 100%, that was my biggest beef.. Well done for calling that out @Geeksvana - and don't get me started on Gatwick!!!!!!
Btw, keeping a rant video under 10 minutes is better than I would manage 🙈🤣
Nicely done, as always 👍😎
Thank you sir! We almost needed electric collars for the live show. How on earth I kept Graham on track shocks me 😂🤣
@@Geeksvana 🤣
Hear what you are saying and very true. But it is exactly that Gatwick drone incident, that ends up spoiling it for everyone else.
Don't forget to 'give thanks' to those special people - the drone auditors, too.
There's no evidence there was ever a drone at Gatwick...
The problem with all this rule changing is its counter productive (and based of VERY questionable data) at the moment I HAVE to listen and take note. I've gone from PfCO to GVC and A2 have a standard Operational Authorization with which I carry out commercial work so I HAVE to take all this onboard.
If I was just doing it as a hobby tbh they would have lost me at the last change of C classifications. ..........as I just want to fly my drone and take nice photos / video in a safe manor.
Great post sean always appreciate you keeping us up to date with regs. Congrats also on your other post "10 Key Facts" another excellent post. Keep up the good work, best wishes Jon
It may be the same now, but a few years ago calling the Police on 121 to 'book in' a legal commercial drone flight was apparently logged as an incident! 😳
Every call to the police is logged as an incident because - if it must be recorded - their record is their incident book. It's a log book, and every record has a serial number, the incident number.
The drone hobbie is nearly dead in the water. But that is the end game, to get us out of the sky. 😢
I will start by saying that I am glad I live in Australia and this is not going to affect us, It seams crazy that UK CAA are changing the rules again, No wonder the Drone pilots are unable to keep up and follow the rules when they are changing every month. The UK CAA have a flawed approach to rule making when they rely on NEWS Media reports as evidence. I agree that Drone manufacturerers will throw in the towel and pull out of the UK market. The UK CAA needs to look at Education of the Drone pilots not set new laws, something that has worked well here with our CASA
It's all a money making scam 🤬
Thanks Sean, Like you I agree the format of this document are huge improvement but sadly the actual rules being suggested for comment is let down by largely being based on complete 'Borrocks', eg Gatwick as you say and lack of actual facts.
However this still needs to talk about actual safety as defined by a grown up, not the primary school lesson they appear to be working on at present with something full of holes and still applying rules that make no damn difference in reality. EG we will still have prop guards only serving to add weight and ignore the fact they remove a huge proportion of the tiny risk that actually does exist. An RID module will add weight to sub 250gm drone, will the same apply pushing it over the limit???? .. or is a useless and potentially dangerous waste of garbage be OK but things that will make a difference still just be added weight?
Finally in terms of safety, why, if there is a need to maintain separation of 50m from soft squidgy easily damaged uninvolved person (ignoring the difficulty on actually working this out with any degree of accuracy), in the A3 category, we need to ensure separation of 150M from any building. WHY??? Do they spontaniously combust or collapse if a drone fails and crash lands 20M away?? Also no reference to whether the building is occupied, or maybe even your own building? Could it be an old derelict barn?
I am all for a very simple set of rules to maintain the safety that has already existed for decades but can we please have the grown up version that actually has some merit with proper rules that will actually make a difference instead of much of what we have which might sound good to the uneducated but in realty makes little or no difference whatsoever.
Utter madness. My prick of a neighbour that I wouldn’t trust to run a bath let alone pilot a plane doesn’t need to have a transponder on his Cessna whilst flying about the country but I have to have a Remote ID on my Tinywhoop Mobula8 because it has a camera on it…. Crazy rules and we are practically obliged now to say no, we won’t be complying anymore - it’s pointless because if they were going to listen to our views we have given previously, would would be making this video - they are simply not listening so we shouldn’t either.
The more I’m hearing about this, the more angry, and thus non compliant, it is making me.
Yes a quick search looks like you can count drone flight convictions on two hands. So really they should be educating busy bodies and the police on regs not sanctioning drone pilots.
It would be interesting to find out where the incidents are - still agree that people who want to cause harm still will - prosecute them all and leave those like us who do things respectfully alone as we will do the right things safely give us advice, register us and follow us - also why with the technology we have you cant fly your drone unless you register with DJI easy fix will be to make people register with the CAA !
They should admit that the Gatwick incident was indeed a UFO 😂 not by a drone.
I can’t get my head around how an unpredictable and uncontrollable firework can reach in excess of 250 metres and yet a fully controllable drone is only allowed to go up 120 meters. Like hello 🤷🏼
I really want to see the CAA equality impact assessment that supports these proposals. Given that some of these act as a pay wall, what mitigations have been put in place to ensure equal access to the hobby? Many home builders are on tight budgets, for example. Tech requirements will price them out.
What about fixed wing? Seems to have been completely forgotten about. Like your 1.2m/1.8m FMS models etc...
What I hate about FPV rules is observer requirements. Especially when the flights are usually low to the ground, video quality is so much better than it used to be and head tracking is getting more popular. Literally mountain biking, skateboarding or even people walking staring at their phones cause more risk to others than vast majority of FPV fliers.
Reports to the police if there were that many reports to the police and they were upheld the police would not be dealing with anything else. I think Mrs Miggins see's a drone and contacts 101. Interesting I left the boys in blue 4 years ago and never heard of a single complaint of a drone flying. The public need to understand what the rules are with the use of drones and we are allowed to fly them. I am sure most members of the public are unaware what a 250g drone is.
Sean I had a Temporary NFZ come up on a map last week when I was on holiday. I was 200-300 m outside the FRZ I did fly because I was outside this zone. Be interested on for definitions of how close you can fly to a FRZ. I think the CAA have left the barn door open and now they are trying to get the beast back in the barn and blaming everyone else for the mistake. Thanks for your continued real great input.
Well put together Sean, but only 5 things😃?
Imagine if they farted about with laws and consultations like this for driving. Every six months you wait to see if your car will still be permitted to be on the road.
Beautifully put …
thanks
This is what it looks like when a regulator simply doesn't care and is looking for excuses to intervene.
Will this affect the drone audits in the UK?
@geeksvana What I want to know is how many of the 18,290 reports were categorised as 'Safety Concern' and what is classified as a safety concern. Reason being that we at Norelo call the Police on 101 every time we are carrying out an operation that is in an area with members of the public around. So would my call for a safe and legal commercial flight could be logged as a Safety Concern? If so the numbers are false in my opinion for the context.
Very true. Agree on all five
As a BMFA member I fly my model aircraft under CAA Article 16.
I feel that most of the consultation proposals are not relevant to me and therefore difficult to answer/comment on.
However there are a few questions towards the end that are relevant to Model Aircraft. Can I just answer and comment on those questions only and submit it?
I am also confused. I have always believed that ‘UAS’ included all model aircraft and multirotors yet the CAA have themselves made a distinction in the consultation. I now feel that the UAS referred to in the consultation are only the prebuilt multirotors such as DJI etc. 🤔
I'm surprised that dji have not made a sub 500g drone for the pro market. Give me a sub 500g with all round sensors, good battery life and 200mb/s or a cine version for those closer to public occasions!
Will the remote ID nonsense be relevant or effect flying an 03 air unit?
I think the whole lot stinks . i'm really starting to get to the point that I just feel like giving the whole drone hobby up. which is a shame . Just when I'm starting to beginning to enjoy it . I can honestly see 3 my drones going up for sale in the near future .
Ive gave up with caa
I'm not waiting for the near future my 2 drones are up for sale as I speak
@@WelshLad. with all this going on is going to kill the industry i feel and the hobby ... which is a great shame..
@@cheekyoscar1353 Totally agree with you
1. Hear, hear!
2. Hear, hear, hear!
3. Hear, hear, hear, hear!
4. Hear, hear, hear, hear, hear!
5. Hear, hear, hear, hear, hear, hear!
Did I hear that Gatwick was just someone switching their drone on indoors to update the firmware?
CAA, do you hear?
...
Their silence is deafening...
There also needs to be proper training for the police. The normal day to day police whole patrol don’t deal with this everyday like the drone police team. It’s the patrol officers that are going to interact with a drone user and they do not have the training or competence to know the rules. This ends up with the drone user explaining that they are allowed to fly there and the police officer spending a fair amount of time trying to find out the rules for that specific location.
Where's the evidence?
"Trust me, bro!"
- CAA
Done the consultation
Leave about half an hour to complete!!!
Sean good to hear you shouting about FPV as I know its not your first concern as a commercial camera drone person, FPV has always been the black sheep of the industry but probably accounts for more flights than any aircraft in the sky (mainly due to the short flight times) as you know 95% of people flying FPV are flying maybe 6 -12 ft off ground racing & 'freestyle' at most is maybe treeline/tallest building as such traditional model aircraft & FPV drones should be excluded (which I know there is article 16 which goes some way to solve the issue) but does not cover commercial operations for FPV as you pointed out is being used more & more for Films/TV/Ad's.
As such the FPV stakeholders have the least say at the CAA table (and this is true globally) and the main reason it is the lowest value even commercially the money it brings in currently is peanuts compared to the big tech & mainstream commercial. so I don't see many FPV pilots complying with any rules that come in mainly cause we have been ignored at the dinner table & CAA trying to enforce remote id on Quadcopters & wings that it simply not needed due to the last 10yrs + with a part of the industry that has had the most flights of any aircraft with zero serious incidents.
It also worth highlighting that the hobbyist of quadcopters has paved the way for the technology as it stands today which started with tinkers using the Nintendo Wii controllers for the Gyros its also the same hobbyist's that started FPV.
What can we feasibly do about it though?
Leave under 250g as is! Introduce a substantial test, both written and practical, with associated costs which will remove most of the nutters and give the rest of us substantial rights.😎
As for the link to the BBC news that has to be made up just so they can get a news story
The way I read the para on the 18,000 complaints is that they have decided what they want to do and are just trying to justify it. Ie, spin, not objective.
How many of those reports are auditors where the original 999 phone call was "there is a man with a camera". Police attend in record time with blue lights and find the auditor has a drone in his bag and doing NOTHING ILLEGAL?
Will RID be restricted to law enforcers. E.g. not organisations.
God you're good!
Boom 😁😎🤣
The data isnt there because its not a consultation, they have slready decided what's happening so need "data" to support it.... even if its not there
Strikes me, this is a Plan, that’s not really been thought out, but then if you’re working from home I mean do we really expect them to get anything right?
I’ll say it again, they don’t actually want or care about our opinion/input they simply want to check a box saying that they asked for it.
Complete joke! They got what they needed from Gatwick, the introduction of detection and jamming to control drones where ever they feel is necessary...it wasn't legal before they had an excuse! The rest is all about opening airspace for commercial use and introduction of policing strategy ( let's face it, the police have a new toy and they now want to be the only users! Even tho they make their own rules up to fly uav's even tho the risks are the same for every commercial operator! ) The new format technology requirements going forward are unmanageable for most users, and as you say Shaun, will make manufacturers think twice about the market value of this small island we live on.
I read the safety reports published by the CAA through the skywise network, I understand and follow the restrictions set out in the published NOTAMS for FRZ'S ( the majority of which are specifically for UAV'S and airspace under 1500 feet these days ) but I understand that most don't, and some just don't care! Is that enough to completely turn this world upside-down?
So thatll be some folks reporting an uncrime but its still on record !!!
Yes - self-build FPV
😎🤝
The merry-go-round continues. Which year is it now? 10th? 11th?
I find the whole thing ridiculous, if RC aero modelling was as bad safety wise as they say, we would have had these measures years ago.
The hobby is much safer now than it ever has been, as for the reports of rogue drones, most of those sightings turned out to be carrier bags flying in the wind 🤣
As for flying near full sized jets, I’ve seen what jet-wash does to a Citroen 2CV, RC aircraft would get nowhere near before being totalled by the turbulence, so that’s complete BS.
They’re overplaying the whole safety thing, why don’t the CAA stick to their lane and govern safe flight of manned aircraft, rather than play judge, jury and executioner to a hobby that for most part causes very little issues, any problems, let the police deal with it like they have done in the past with successful outcomes.
My addition to hates.. Post 2028 There is no benefit to future study,skills improvement or gaining deeper knowledge, A person who passes the trivial flyer id can fly with the same separation distances as one with GVC/A2CoFC and years of experience. Sooo why would I bother?
Killing off the self builds will kill off any development.
If you think manufacturers have invented anything rather than borrowing/stealing from the thousands of self builders that are constantly developing new projects, like they have been doing for 80 years, then I don't know how you think it works.
As you stated Sean, not much evidence to support these allegations. Of any verifiable reports that are available I wonder how many were “responsible” flyers?? People who have done what they should have done for their category? Online tests etc. I think that it would be low. I have said this before and I think it important to recognise that the “tomfoolery “ ( put politely) would be by individuals that don’t care about rules and regs. “It’s just a laugh”. So are these measures going to impact them. NO. Only the people who are likely not to break the current regs will be affected.
Well said. I withdraw my previous thought that you were a CAA stooge.
Bloody EU red tape, oh wait
This made me literally laugh out loud. Thank you 😂
Reporting of drone flights does not mean that offences have been occurring, that’s just people’s perception of an offence not what is an offence. This report is appalling in its presentation.
Honestly it seems its fallen on deaf ears again, there not actually hearing the general drone user, I can see the drone user dwindle in the next 2 years and more lawless users.
It's not great, Michael 😔
@UKDroneClub yea and James from CAA isn't getting it either! Introducing class markings .... dude had that they scrapped it 🤦♂️ they want it safer, how they can make drones even safer as the manufacturer is doing all the safety features (failsafe features)
Seems the CAA don't actually care and just like giving out consultations every few months with the same rethoric and it seems the CAA dont actually know what there saying or doing it seems.
We’re just T.I.T.S to the C.A.A.
(Thorns In The Side)
@@airlessmean none of it bodes well for the hobbyist 😕
I can’t help feeling the majority of these complaints (especially as there are no links to the source) are made by people who think they are being filmed or having their privacy invaded. They probably marvel at the filming on television done by drones. Do they understand that the reason we don’t need to display car rod tax anymore is that there are zillions of cameras out there filming us everywhere we go. There are cameras in shops, banks, workplaces. I’d guess 99% of the mobile phones have a camera on them too. The same people complaining probably take photos with no regard to who or what’s in the background. Personally, when I fly, I will do my darndest to avoid getting uninvolved people in the shot. I’m not interested in them or what they are doing, unless they are doing something they shouldn’t be doing. There is always going to be a minority who abuse the law and unfortunately, it’s these people who will hit the headlines, maybe that’s why they do it. Rant Over.
That's it I'm sorry to say I feel the drone hobby in the UK will be dead by 2030, just won't be worth it. Amazon and the police and other agencies will own all the air space. 🤬😢 What about VLOS, how does that work with Amazon deliveries??? I love the hobby but I can't see how it can carry on after 2030. I'm not happy, The fun has all been taken away from us in the UK. R.I.P drones 😢💀
It seems as if these jobsworth folk are only justifying their miserable existence.
I am a prospective drone pilot, not one yet - I follow you and others to learn before I buy one. I depend on your valuable expertise. I completely agree with every word you’ve said here, the worst thing being presenting news report material on unverified incidents as if it were evidence. I hope Im not a conspiracy theorist but this lack of rigour indicates a) a lack of funding/shortage of time for the consultation (completely normal for all projects) AND/OR a political agenda driving the process - “they” want and expect a particular result and “they” want to justify it by claiming a fair consultation. My view is that consultations are never fair amd always have hidden agendas. The support for brexit having achieved something is one agenda, support for business over the hobbyist is another, appealing by rhetoric to right wing land-owning oiks is another. For the technology and UK business to prosper we dont need a UK marking, we need to harmonise with international approaches to this, including any international standards that exist or are being developed in this area - anything more or less will be disastrous for the UK and the tech world. They already won over global tracking of encrypted content (at the OS/API level). They will do the same here. Thank you for your work, particularly the rigour you show in your reports.