I've seen a lot of people in the D2 community pretty much babying Bungie like "Aw, you made a mistake? That's okay, as long as you learn. I hope Final Shape is good :)" And then Ruri was here like, *I hope you BURN to the Ground* I love it
@@RoboJonbecause they are too attached to the game's incredible universe, art direction and feel of shooting. Its tragic in a way, fans are so patient and forgiving for Bungie to realise Destiny's potential but it will always remain as potential.
Agree that it's time for Bungie to finally have some financial consequence for their continual "innovation" of driving the standards of minimum viable product lower and lower.
Those innovations have destroyed the market in gaming. It's all cosmetic shops and battlepasses, FOMO bull and psychological manipulation. It's so rare to see actual substantial DLC content anymore because it's so much easier to milk a gullible market of naive players. I thought that this was supposed to be Bungie, the people that spearheaded one of the most iconic gaming communities and stories. To think they don't care about their fans this much is... really sad.
@@Trucking4Jesusmaybe you haven't noticed? I have roughly 6.5k hours in I stopped playing just before lightfall and cheaters were common enough where I can safely say I would run into 1 at least once every 10-15 games on pretty regular intervals. in shadowkeep it was like every 4 games and it was more obvious.
Back during Forsaken and Shadowkeep my friends and I would regularly play the Strike playlist. It was our favorite part of the game, and became part of our routine. So it was incredibly discouraging when players would ask why there weren't many new Strikes anymore, Bungie would keep saying "they're really expensive content to make, we'd have to sacrifice too many other things." Based on what we know now I suspect the real reason is "we couldn't figure out how to monetize them and the bean counters won't let us make them any longer."
I tried playing Destiny 2 a while back during a Steam sale and there was just so much shit littered across so many DLCs, season passes, dungeon keys and whatever the fuck else they were selling that I just shook my head and backed out.
They destroyed the structure when they introduced the vault to cut and recycle content. Until and including "Forsaken" it was playbale, downwards after that ever since.
I hope it burns too. I remember trying to get back into it, bought a DLC called something simple like, "[Name of quest line] Pack", then spent an hour or two running around, lost in how the menus had evolved so significantly, trying to find where to start the quest. I googled, contacted support, etc, eventually found that the quest line had been pulled to "make room" for future content. So what the actual hell did you sell me??? I had to fight tooth an nail to get my money back. Sony blamed Bungie, Bungie blamed Sony, it was a hot mess. Eventually I was like, No, Bungie, this is your in game store front, you sold this non-content to me, this was your choice, you owe me my money, and even then, they were like, "well, we'll refund it just this one time, be more careful in the future." Like, F off, I was done.
@@Rellana1 The longer story is that's exactly what I did, put a charge back on my card, got my money back. They had ghosted me entirely, even after threatening to call my bank, so I did it. But then I was given a permanent ban from PSN; couldn't play anything online at all... Yup, they stole $30 from me, and when I made a scene of it they banned me. So then I complained to the BBB, I was furious. It was THEN, that a resolution person finally reached out to me and fixed it, despite initially disagreeing with me until I explained everything, then she got that passive aggressive attitude to try and save face. Utterly ridiculous.
Been “playing” destiny2 since its release….it is the SAME SHIT download after download…play 1.5 hours on TUESDAY after weekly update and everything new is done! Sit around doing nothing new or simply wait until next Tuesday and repeat…you’re done with everything with around 2 months left in season…IT SUCKS!!!!!!! If you don’t purchase seasons, forget it, you get nothing new ever!!!!!
Reminds me of Blizzard ditching Russel Brower. "Oh it'll be ok, we will just have new people, who we can pay much less, copy Brower's style. No one will notice!"
I mean yea fire him because the music is done. And there's no plan for d3 or a new expansion pack after final shape. They are going to put d2 on Maintenance mode and Focus on Marathon
Fully agree with you. I think it sucks that it's come to this but I think it needs to happen. The only part I'm sad about is that none of the executives got sacked.
yeah it was just a bunch of everyday people and bungie veterans like Micheal Salvatori and Lorraine Mclees who, she made the logo for the first halo game and Micheal Salvatori we all know what he did. but the executives will never be the ones to lose their livelihoods
See for me its strange I love Destiny still but I haven't really played it much for years. The only thing that kept me around was Trials and they destroyed that mode. Once i lost interest in trials, I never really touched it other then maybe a rare raid or maybe doing the seasonal content. At this point we have needed massive changes but it seems hopeless that any significant changes will ever happen.
It’s pretty crazy just how much money you need to spend JUST to get into Destiny 2, it’s just a huge money sink. (Glad I got out of playing it when I did at around the time the first dlc was announced.)
@KingThor128 The problem is that they are cutting up the main story and adding them into the season pass content. So you essentially paying $100 USD for a full story per year. And that is the cheapest option. And that you still have to pay for Dungeons! Then if you want to buy cosmetics, they are 20 USD each! And removing entire planets and entire campaigns...just because? Even Gambit the weakest game mode had maps removed, making it even worse.
People have convinced themselves it's basically the same as paying a monthly sub like an mmo. I have played Destiny since the Alpha and I stopped playing about 6 months ago. I'm not going back. Bungie suck and are partly to blame for the state of gaming at the minute. They basically invented the live service concept. I'm not giving them another penny.
go get em Rurikhan! I 100% agree with this take - companies need to finally feel consequences for their eploitative practices. Its not just a good thing for the players but the developers too. No game dev I know got into the industry because they wanted to make monetization riddled garbage. Its a systemic issue and company culture is often so far gone that we need drastic things to happen to get things back on track...
I think the analogy that I'm going to drop fits here. A hard working head farmer looks at a businessman and asks him, "do you see the cows there?" "Yes I do see them," the businessman replies. The farmer says, "these cows are ill do to poor sustenance and exhaustion we need to give them better food and rest." The businessman hmphed, "no we can't do that for it will cost me more money!" "But sir, the cows will either die or leave," exclaimed the farmer. The businessman, having had enough of the farmer's words, fired him. Weeks later the cows die or disappear one by one but the businessman kept milking the cows even to the point of bleeding and those that died were sold to butchers for more money. Eventually all the cows that were left died by blood loss and the businessman went bankrupt for he had no more cows left to milk or sell to butchers. Who do you all think was who in this analogy?
That's a good point, but other videos brought up that fact that this layoff situation was a Bungie decision and not Sony, so it's still a fuck up they made themselves regardless of the intention. And they did also actually layoff people, so they missed their goal by so much they fired 100 people, so it can't be too far off.
@@nerobiblios4086 well, the layoffs are completely bungie's fault because they made the bad projection to begin with. That's what I was getting at. They wanted to look good for Sony, but I don't think Sony instigated the layoffs
@@nerobiblios4086it’s bungie execs that pretty much ruin the game. They don’t listen to the devs, don’t listen to the players and their main priority is their own paycheck.
I like Ruri’s faith in humanity’s ability to learn from bad behavior. I on the other hand have zero faith and believe the industry scum will only become better at hiding their schemes.
Been a destiny player for almost 10 years and I have to say it gets better then substantially worse in an endless cycle. I'm honestly so tired of the way Bungie treats both it's developers and it's players. I'll probably make it through the new expansion and then dip. I have the sunk cost now so I just want to see how this shit ends. Appreciate the coverage bud.
And there it is. There's is no "sunk cost" unless you want one to exist. That's the reason why it's called a fallacy. YOU make the decision to continue to play...to support a shit company because you cannot bring yourself to say "enough". That's on You. 2600+ hours and I finally noped out. Skipped out the last two seasons. The company is only part of the problem. The players are the 800 lb gorilla that everyone (espcially the players) is turning a blind eye to. Because they'd rather support a shit company and continue this toxic behavior than just find something else to play.
Just don’t buy any microtransactions. I’ll check out the reviews for final shape, but I damn sure didn’t pre order and as far as I’m concerned, if the overwhelming majority of reviews say it’s mediocre, then my Destiny journey ended with lightfall.
The only reason I've stuck with it is because I've been with it since D2's launch...that means I've kept up with all the dlcs and content (exotics/weapon rolls) that I can just jump in and start playing whenever something drops...the best way to do it is just get the season pass for the year on a key site (you don't give money to Bungle and get all the content for $20-30 less than on steam, shoutout greenman gaming). New players are faced with such a paywall/time sink I wouldn't recommend it to anyone unless you're like me and are all caught up. Also never buy anything from the eververse unless you're using bright dust (how I get all the cosmetics, no real money spent)...shills that throw $100 at Bungle every time they drop a trailer is the reason they get by releasing the bare minimum and egregious MTX. The game is cool if you're caught up and have all the gear but Bungle is always gonna bungle...been criticizing them since day 1 but most players can't fathom criticizing their precious Bungle (just look at the comment sections for all the vidocs...it's insane)
I came into Destiny during forsaken (PS4) and loved it, and had purchased whatever edition available at the time with the previous expansions. Back then the story made sense. I ended up getting into PC gaming before shadow keep, bought the previous expansions for cheap, bought shadowkeep onPC and PlayStation because crossplay wasn’t available yet. My old Destiny vet friends had already quit the game because they were tired of all the “new” old content (the moon) and reskinned guns. To me everything was new and I loved it. Fast forward to today and now I’m seeing all the same things they saw back then. Light fall was the final draw for me. I barely got through the season pass for the first season, and haven’t played since. I don’t think I will ever play it again. It was a good run, but now Bungie has shown us their true colors.
There were a couple of other bad season in between I didn’t care for. Season of the drifter, and I think the seraph season was pretty bad. I only played that to get the felwinters, but all seasons after that I played through. But yeah light fall was it for me 😢
Pretty much same for me. After playing through Witch Queen (which was a good expansion) I was pretty burnt out, but decided to go ahead and just get the vanilla Lightfall expansion. Man, what a joke that was. I finished (barely) the free season pass, and haven't played more than an hour here and there since.
When a new shooter comes out, we in the community hear "Destiny killer" a lot. As if some other game could possibly end the IP. But we know, the community knows that the only true "Destiny killer" is Bungie itself.
@YEY0806 Now, here's the thing about a game being dead. To someone who either played it and quit or never played a game it appears dead. This is due to you not paying attention to it anymore making it have the feeling of being dead. When in actuality the game has been thriving for years, even through horrible times.
I completely agree. If people want the gaming industry to turn around and be better. (Make better games, be less predatory, and actually listen to communities) Bungie NEEDS to go under. Yes it would hurt their developers, but it would BENIFIT developers across the ENTIRE INDUSTRY by making there publishers have to make better choices and make all of their jobs SAFER. Bungie needs to unfortunately be a cautionary tale smh This is actually what I realized with Bungie 2 years ago and talking to my friends about the decline was like crying into the void.
As player that played destiny 1 at the very beginning, and destiny 2. In d1 I probably spent around 250-300$ to play from start to finish. In d2 I have probably spent around 500$ plus to keep playing to game and keep up to date and it’s still going… Not mention nearly half of that content was snatch away from us only to be half resold labeled as “new”
Crazy that my buddy and I saw this coming just over a year and a half ago in the middle of gameplay. Both of us was like "yo why are we still doing the exact same thing over and over again" basically just grinding yet we're getting charged for a battle pass after already paying for the game and all the dlc when this crap is now ftp for new players oh wait they are deleting content now and haven't made a new strike since release basically. I'm out, You've made your point very clear to us Bungie you never cared about the players time or what want to innovate your product 😤😒 ✌️
The problem is that even if they do fail and they do crash, the lesson won't be learned. Bunjie made Halo became a household name, then got bought by Microsoft, escaped and made Destiny then learned nothing and got bought by Sony. Greedy corpos gonna greed. If lessons were learned Bunjie would've learned from Blizzard who would have learned from Bioware, who would've learned from EA. This cycle will continue until the developers get unionized and actually have the power to fight back. Until then, let's all remember how great Destiny 1 and base game Destiny 2 was.
if you buy the 100€ edition you get all the content, "dungeon Keys" are sold seperatly for ppl who bought the base DLC without the seasonpass which is included in the deluxe edition. I hated that they took away content I paid for and that the game is now very unaccessable to new players. PVP has been neglected for many years and they brokle so many promisses to the palyerbase. I hope management gets what they deserve and that hiring new talent wont be easy for them because now they have shown their true face..
Don't forget they removed it because the game was too big and the code was spaghetti. And people ate that shit excuse up. Remember? Oh wait here are those guns and contents we removed to add back for more $$$. It boils my piss.
There used to be a game called The Dreadnought with a huge potetial. Beta was a lot of fun and soon there was a great community around the game. Then they decided to pass the game to new director - Mike Donatelli (supposedly guy who contributed to death of the Wild Star MMO). At that time the goal was to introduce monetization system and despite countless concerns from the community they decided to introduce progression system 2.0 which contained pretty much all free 2 play scammy practices. As a result most of the community left including me. Athought I was returning every now and then to check what is the state of the game over several years, all they did was to rework progression system several times back and fort, introduce game on other platforms, introduce more microtransactions and tweak balance occasionally. Eventually the game died and the sad thing is that it was prophesied by majority of community when the whole progression 2.0 BS was presented for the first time. I came to realize that perhaps milk and kill was their intention since the beginning. Honestly it's such a shame that people like Mike Donatelli doing their shitty business in industry they don't care about at all.
Great video. I wish there are more videos like you a couple of years ago, when Bungie got caught nerfing XP levels. Few people quit Destiny 2, including some UA-camrs like Deycide but TONS of People still defended Bungie, gave them their money and attacked other people who tried to warn them of Bungie's scummy tactics. Fast forward to today, NOW there are more people who are speaking against Bungie and Bungie knew they messed up big time when they saw more people got their Destiny 2 Final Shape refunds. Was it because of the microtransactions ? The dungeon keys hidden behind a pay wall ? The Gjallarhorn hidden behind a pay wall? The ridiculously high priced expansions that keeps getting less contents ? The way Bungie completely removed the different Factions New Monarchy, Dead Orbit and Future War Cult ? The way Bungie ignored the PvP players and the Destiny veterans who begged Bungie for years to give them what they wanted but Bungie never listened? The way Bungie finally admitted that they were only interested in squeezing more money from their loyal customers while providing them the least content ? The way Bungie transferred most of their workforce to work on Marathon the same way Bioware did when they had Bioware B Team worked on Mass Effect Andromeda while Bioware A Team worked on Anthem? Bungie finally reap what they sow. I've been playing Destiny 1 and I have all the expansions. I played Destiny 2 and I quit playing After Beyond Light because the expansions started getting ridiculously expensive . Marathon will never achieve the same success Destiny 1 and 2 had. Bungie is finished.
I used to play destiny 2 daily. Now it’s become I check out the start of the season then clock out. I really enjoyed pvp but the lack of balance changes, lack of maps, introduction of air effectiveness. The amount of high quality games out there … from fromsoft to valorant to x and x. Bungie stopped innovating. In addition dungeon keys being an extra cost, price increases with the cost of living. Its incredibly difficult to get friends to try it out
Ruri I totally am with you 100% on this. Ever since Bungie fired Marty O’Donnell they have had this coming. They killed the goose that laid the golden egg. Destiny is soulless because this company has no soul. I’m not talking about the developers who I’m sure are trying to do their best, but it’s time for this company to die. I hope the developers weather this storm and go on to make better things. I’m also with you hoping (coping maybe) that Blizzard redeems itself. I really love the WarCraft IP and I’m really sick and sad of what’s happened to it. Maybe… just maybe Microsoft’s purchase will change things, but probably not. It’s just tragic.
I think a frustrating thing about these types of discussions is the tendency to ignore the broader global economy when talking about them. Just because revenue dropped off doesn't mean it was players intentionally organizing against the company or anything it's can be the result of bigger economic pressures. That's not to say that players don't matter, but you can't do things like a revenue forecast without an economist.
I loved destiny 2 during forsaken, but the seasonal system that came after pissed me off, time limited exotics and everything else is just annoying. Concidering exotics are some of the best usable content in the game. If you dont get them during the seasons, you have to grind ages to collect them all, i used to have all of the exotics, now returning and getting them all would be basicly grinding fucking ciphers to buy them from a vendor. instead of integrating them into old dungeons or raids to give players a reason to grind again
I dunno, jumping on the hate-wagon and piling on is pretty scummy; especially if you're wishing that the company folds and goes under. Hope those clicks were worth it.
Years ago, I gave up playing Destiny. My interest in it waned. There was absolutely nothing to anticipate. They are now extinct since they decided to follow the Sony path. Microsoft recently acquired Blizzard; therefore, allow them some time to adjust before seeing any changes. When it comes to major purchases like these, nothing changes instantly.
Damn I was with you until about the 1:15 or so mark where u said u only played til the first raid of D2....thats like me saying I stopped playing cod at world at war...its like taking advice for how to raise and discipline kids and that person has 0 kids...almost had me, but good points the first minute
Fun Fact: 1/3 of the weapons in one of the witch queen dungeons (Spire of the watcher) that you had to pay serperately for were WORLD DROPS, people paid a premium to get kicked in the nuts
The vaulting and then when I started to play the witch dlc I noticed that they inflated gameplay by making you have to farm resources to continue the story. That had started to put me off playing, not sure why I bought the light dlc. Haven't even played in a few months maybe more. Nostalgia maybe, well its sucks this is happening
That’s exactly why I kept buying them for so long, was the nostalgia… what really burned me out, was that entire year, they repeated the exact same seasonal events just different map, and then made the grind even worst. The fact that you’d have to play a million strikes to get anything and they were the same strikes you played when d2 came out and the new strikes were 20-30 minutes long
I agree, I was once a whale for this game back from d1 and d2 up to the season of Osiris. But it was all downhill for me from there. I once tried to get back into the game for the witch queen expansion to find that I needed to pay out over $200 just to get in the game and another 100 to be on par with current players. I hop Bungie falls off a cliff, because that’s the only hop I have of getting back the destiny I liked, weather that’s with Bungie or a new company that buys out the ip
I agree with you on these points but there is also the other aspects of us gamers have been spoiled over what we get for what we have paid for in games these days. As a 50yearold gamer I have been through it all. We used to never get updates or expansions on games 30 years ago. The game was released on disc and that was it, you waiting until they made a sequel and played with the buggy games, for the next 2 years. Now we get updates in days and expansions in months. I know game developers have been talking and looking at this about the cost of games and the amount of hours the has to the amount of hours the employee's put in to make a game. You have to look at this as well, when it comes to designing new raids and dungeons. Take for example a movie cost us 20$ to go see in theaters. and the movies is 2hours long, that is 10$ per hour enjoyed. Now a game is 80$ and you play that for 100hours, that is .80c per hour of enjoyment. But the employees hours put into that game to make 100 hours of game play for your is much higher. I am not condoning what Bungie or any other company has done or may do to get more money out of us but there is other things going on you have to look at. There are a bunch more I can on about but I think I will leave this here for now. Finally yes if the higher ups listened to the core players and team members and fixed the stuff that is majorly wrong everyone would be much happier. But this goes for every industry. No Company is the perfect company.
I am not sure hoping for the ruin of game developers is logical if you enjoy games. We need these developers to succed and improve. Bungie and Blizzard have made some of the best games of all time.
You forgot the part about dungeons where they made the purchase of them only accessible through their silver store and its at a price where you have to purchase more silver than you need because of course you cant just outright by the dungeon (which should be part of the expansion)....
I loved destiny I bought the game and it’s collectors edition when they went free to play I gave it a chance but decided it was no longer for me as I stay away from games driven by seasonal gameplay and micro transactions
I hope the industry looks deeper in the failure of management and learns from their mistake. It sucks that devs suffer for the gross incompetence in management. I want destiny to suckseed and the last DLC to be a banger. But I dont want management in the industry to get away with their bad practises. I love/ hate destiny.. its a complicated relationship. (I have been playing sincve 2014 beta) that said... I love the game but I hate some of their monitization structure. The devs who lost their jobs will find new work with their talent and hard work. But I hope that the managers wont find work in the industry, because this debacle is unacceptable. I have now cancelled my Pre order on steam.
Lmfao my guy, It's "succeed" not "SUCK-SEED"! That's gotta be top 3 misspelled word of all time given that Bungie is the topic at hand and they do and should be sucking the seed right now for sure!
Best take I’ve heard and this is coming from someone who has 1000s of hours in Destiny. I left the game after lightfall and haven’t gone back because the writing was on the wall: content, real content, was no longer a priority to them.
Glad you brought up the xp cap scandal from the start of D2, I haven't seen anyone else bring it up in their vids about the recent stuff but you forgot an important aspect about it. Bungie was also selling xp boosters at the time, effectively they were selling the ability to just reach the xp cap faster. I don't think they ever gave players refunds or compensation of any kind for that piece of 💩 move. The way youtubers and d2 players are acting shocked about Michael Salvatori's firing is frankly disgusting me. I've seen two youtubers barely reference Marty O'Donnell's firing almost a decade ago, they act like Bungie's never done anything this shocking. If Marty hadn't sued and won both his cases, we never would've known that Bungie illegally stripped him of his founder's shares in the company. Their defense in the case of his wrongful termination was that he was a hostile and insubordinate employee and was fired and their defense in the founder's shares case was that he quit the company, thus forfeiting the shares. Funny how with these recent layoffs, the employees who had unvested shares with the company lose them and those shares revert back to Bungie. People act like they can't believe Bungie would screw people over this royally, but we know from Marty's IGN interview after he won his cases that people he'd worked with for two decades lied about him on the stand and wouldn't look him in the eye or even in his general direction in the courtroom. And let's not forget that Bungie forced out Joe Staten, another company founder and the man who wrote the story for the Halo games and destiny's original story. Bungie showed us 10 years ago that they'd become a piece of 💩 company and no matter what scandals or controversies happened in the last decade, enough players supported the company financially to empower it to abuse it's employees and extended it ability to abuse them to this point in time. Destiny 2 is exactly the game it's playerbase deserves, they invested their money into it, they covered for Bungie's 💩 practices and they demonized anyone who criticized the practices or the game's quality. Destiny's final shape is a turd Bungie will spray fart onto their remaining and willing fanatics.
glad to hear someone on YT saying this stuff. Bungie reaped what it sowed. but, as ever, the people that suffer most are the employees which is always management's first line of defence in times like these.
Finally! I've been saying this for years. One of the reason I left Destiny, but far too many players kept buying into it. Even after the GDC, where Bungie said we make sure we under deliver when we launch our gams/dlc. To me thats a huge red flag. Basically doing as little as possible but charging your players as much as possible. Keep it up mate.
It's outrageous call destiny 2 a free to play game even after the removed the red war campaign which was the free to play content and what's left is nearly a demo and the rest is pay walled to hell and back
They really pissed me off when they took away planets during some "expansions". They want to mimic an MMO but I've never played an MMO that literally steals away substantial parts of the game and then gaslights you about it. "Content vault" they called it. Idiots. And of course I am referring to the business people and the executives who make these decisions of course as you noted.
I actually just saw an article about Mortgage companies. They hired all these people and paid $100,000+ bonuses. In the fine print, they put a 2 year clause in it, to keeping the bonus. Now that they are in a downturn, the companies are firing people a month before the 2 year mark and demanding they come up with $100,000 to give BACK to the company. So… yeah… Bungie management acting like the shadiest of the shady and firing people like this says it all.
The over delivery thing is also totally insane. Work your employees at a reasonable non-grind, non-burnout way, and release what you can, when it's ready, or a reasonable price. Then for the next expansion, guess what, you do the same thing. So what happens if it comes out as less content than the last expansion? Yes, you're created expectations and a pattern, so you know what you do? Charge less. If you get even more content made? Charge more. Easy. I totally get that with a base game, you need to be competitive, so you have the same base price as any other game (mostly), but for DLC? Charge whatever it's worth.
Tough, but i agree. I was a big Destiny fan, played the hell out of both 1 and 2, but at some point i just got tired of being asked to pay for stuff endlessly. Even when switched to PC and was thinking of coming back, the idea of having to catch up with so many purchases... awful way of retaining players. I was sad to leave it behind, but now that sadness is gone. There is nothing left, nothing to miss.
Thanks for your video. I can feel our frustation throught your words. I wish things could change, Destiny 2 has given me so many good friends and moments, and honestly I keep coming for them. But probably they will double down on bad practices untile they go down by their own hand. I still hope there is a way to save the studio and the game 🙏
With the dawn of the Internet Age, where people are constantly online, communicating face-to-face less and less, a lot of the people running these big companies have seemingly forgotten that no business venture is a monolith that stands on its own, generating cash out of thin air: you need people to look at your product and decide that its worth spending their money on, so if you piss off your customers and they have alternatives they're straight up just going to stop giving you money. You could have the best product to ever exist but if your consumer-base absolutely *hates your guts,* that's Game Over. This is why "over-delivering" (what an absolutely braindead corpo phrase) is a valuable tool. You are investing in community goodwill that will tide you over *when* things inevitably go bad and times get tough. A company that forgets this is slated for a quick, abrupt death as your consumers finally decide they've had enough and go elsewhere. Bungie spent the last damn-near decade f#cking around and has finally found out.
That opening was so savage, it made me laugh.😂 After hearing what you had to say, and honestly having a very similar experience with Destiny 1, I now totally agree with you. Bungie hasn't done anything truly good for fans since they left Halo.
I was a hard core Destiny player from Kingsfall onward Shadowkeep. I took a long break then returned for Beyond Light. I bailed 100% soon after. I just couldn’t take the constant cycle of disappointment with increasing monetization and content extraction. Honestly, it was seriously liberating to cut the cord with the franchise. The only way things change is if players vote with their feet and wallets.
i saw someone say they kept giving bungie the benefit of the doubt *all this time*…as a former avid d2 played (stopped after BL) i saw the cracks literally since shadowkeep. after forsaken and it’s seasons, the game went to complete shit. you’re on some heavy cope if you think witch queen (from what i saw) and it’s seasons were anywhere close to the quality of forsaken
Bro thank you for this video. I've been trying to tell all my friends, that still buy D2 garbage expansions, that they are supporting the scumbags at Bungie that do not deserve it.
Bungie has the most horrific monetisation ever they can crash and burn i hope the new SONY CEO realizes how much money Sony are bleeding everyday by keeping Bungie afloat. 3.6 billion wasted. Sony Should have made a pass at Capcom , Rockstar or fromsoft instead.
Another super scummy business practice that bungie does is the way the seasons/dungeons are purchased. These add ons can only be purchased in game using destiny in game currency. The seasons are $12-13 dollars but you can only purchase the in game currency in "packs" of $10-$20 so they force you to spend even more money than the actual price of the content. I hope they crash and burn as well.
Bungie is also the reason why the Last of Us 2 multi-player got cancelled. Sony sent some Bungie employees over to Naughty Dog to check out the game and offer their recommendations. The Bungie Reps said that the LoU2 MP wasn't worth saving and so Sony cancelled it. Maybe it wasn't good, or maybe it just needed some tweaking but showed promise...we will never know because Bungie (a direct competitor) trashed it & said it wasn't worth saving. The same Bungie that has seen its own games bleed players and few gamers play anymore. And I said from the very beginning that Sony was making a mistake buying Bungie, and I was mocked & ridiculed. Bungie is NOT the great company that so many think it still is.
When I heard naughty dog delayed factions indefinitely because bungee told them to had me so upset. One of those times you wanted to yell through the screen. I had a feeling this would happen. I’m only hoping that naughty dog can see this as maybe they shouldn’t have listened to bungie. Factions was one of the few games I was looking forward to the most. The first factions was amazing!
I can't really feel bad for the employees on every level. Their situation is unfortunate, for sure, but there comes a time when you have to wonder what they expected. The people that are "just following orders" only get a pass for so long. Also known as "Lay down with dogs, you get fleas".
@@bobross8585 If you work for a company that is doing things that you see as wrong, unethical, or predatory, you should absolutely find a different job. I've done it. It's not the easy road but not every situation has an easy road. If you don't, you aren't the victim when the inevitable collapse happens. You chose to take the easy route of staying and doing nothing for a paycheck and now that paycheck stopped because of the eventual result. It's living with a choice. What happened at Bungee didn't take place over the space of a week. This has been a cancer that has been apparent for literal years but now it's shocked pikachu when the predictable result occurs.
Finally someone says what has needed to be said. I was a fool that dropped close to $400 for the first 14 months of D2 to play content. That content is no longer available. In order for me to jump in and play D2 today it would cost me an additional $400 and that's with the base game being free..... absolute trash practice.
insane on how much effort they put into fixing destiny 1, making it an amazing game. and they giving us d2 wich is worse in every aspect beside combat than destiny 1. what a shame...cashshop is worse, deleting expentions for some dumbass reason, mediocre ballance etc.
They had Activision power behind them to fix D1 and create marvels like The Taken King. Now, they are trash. Sony just joined them, so they are not in the equation yet. Bungie on their own is trash.
I’ve had a whole six year relationship through destiny, two. I introduced my sweetheart to the game, she got popular on the game enough to make her own clan. Now that we’re no longer together quite frankly, I want the game to collapse.
I actually do agree. I get flamed for it most places when I bring up GDC, management abuse, misuse of funds, player abuse, lies told to the community, malicious monetization, cut content, removal of paid for content etc.
I bought Renegade as a return to the franchise, to see its contents being stripped out in next release. Removing paid contents from a free to play live service game is something you cannot walk away with, specially with the campaign. If you keep my contents I can come back, check the current sandbox and decide to pay or not for new contents. If you remove them it would be a foul me twice. Yes man, around 18:00, you got the point, that’s the biggest issue
I played D1 for thousands of hours and I came into it late just a few months before the Siva thing happened, I barely caught the end of the Forsaken King raid for perspective. I loved the game so much that I preordered D2 as soon as I could, fast forward to release date, boot up the game and immediately was put off by the dumbing down of the game. I barely pulled myself to finish the story, and stopped playing until the first raid came out and barely even got in to do that raid, swore off the game after that😂 didn’t even wait to play the first two expansion packs that c ame with the preorder.
Reminds me of what is currently going on with Creative Assembly, the studio behind the Total War franchise. After many years of not giving their fan base what they want, worse and worse technical problems from game to game, yet increasing prices across the board, the community seems to finally have reached the breaking point and the newest game isn't selling at all. That is overly simplyfying the situation of course to avoid writing a massive comment, there is more to it (like recently banning critical voices on the Steam forums. You know, stuff that never fails to make a community happy.) I would argue it's the same type of management bs as here.
You sir are 100% correct Below are the factual trends. The reason why Destiny 2 has fallen is because Bungie pulled a Gamigo. They pulled out more and more egregious monetization upon their player base. This has kept chopping their the player base in halve each time they did this. Sure you have a short term gains and massive peaks of revenue but diminishing returns over the long period. So we have around 30 to 50.000 whales that like to spend money real money on this game. However the larger majority of 1.2 million to 500.000 hardcore players destiny 2 started with have mostly left. AVG around 77.000 since 2019 April 2023 142,128
I played Destiny 1 until Destiny 2 launched, and then I stuck with D2 until about a year ago, and throughout that time I saw how they _repeatedly_ ignored most of the requests and complaints of the people who played their game. I agree, this apparent upcoming crash is well deserved.
I'm with you 100%...Destiny should have gone down in flames all the way back when Curse of Osiris came out...showing that Bungie learned absolutely zero from Destiny 1...I quit the day CoO released.
I'm in full agreement with you on this. I also felt like Destiny 2 had the best gunplay of any game on the market, but I turned away after seeing all the psychological tricks Bungie was playing to keep players invested. The ridiculous number of things that needed to be leveled up and unlocked by grinding, plus the RNG drops, plus the microtransactions, plus the time-locked FOMO content... I looked at the time commitment: I work full time and I'm taking classes, so keeping up with D2 would mean I'd have time for no other games. And you know what? Being beholden to grinding one game felt like work instead of fun. So despite D2's amazing gunplay, I sighed, shook my head, and uninstalled. Now I'm glad I stopped. I used to revere Bungie for giving us the Halo trilogy, but now I too hope they fail. They've become a money machine that preys on players, manipulating their psychology to milk out every damn penny. The removed content is complete bullshit. Absolutely should be illegal. They just take away what you paid for, because "fuck you, give us more money." No, Bungie, fuck YOU.
I stand with you.. unfortunately, i am one of many that fell victim to the monetization going on.. with that said, thats why i still play today.. i havent purchased final shape yet, and as of now… i dont think i will… something needs to happen, and burning to the ground, just might be what they need… shits getting crazy man… blessed be to you and everyone else…
Investors and senior managers don't do things for the benefit of the customers, regardless of the industry. Unrealistic expectations, lack of proper investment, scale back until the customers start to scream and move their business elsewhere... It's a shame.
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
I've seen a lot of people in the D2 community pretty much babying Bungie like "Aw, you made a mistake? That's okay, as long as you learn. I hope Final Shape is good :)"
And then Ruri was here like, *I hope you BURN to the Ground*
I love it
Yep bungie has some seriously disturbing hard-core fan boys that will defend them to the death and eat up any BS bungie feeds them.
@@RoboJonbecause they are too attached to the game's incredible universe, art direction and feel of shooting. Its tragic in a way, fans are so patient and forgiving for Bungie to realise Destiny's potential but it will always remain as potential.
Boy stop lying.... majority of the fan base is jaded since lightfall 3rd week of play.
@@YEY0806i been playing from the start and I hope they fail too
Ikr
Agree that it's time for Bungie to finally have some financial consequence for their continual "innovation" of driving the standards of minimum viable product lower and lower.
@@revenge750 ive got 4k hours on pc and ive never ran into cheaters in crucible and i am a hardcore pvper
Those innovations have destroyed the market in gaming. It's all cosmetic shops and battlepasses, FOMO bull and psychological manipulation. It's so rare to see actual substantial DLC content anymore because it's so much easier to milk a gullible market of naive players.
I thought that this was supposed to be Bungie, the people that spearheaded one of the most iconic gaming communities and stories. To think they don't care about their fans this much is... really sad.
@@Trucking4Jesusmaybe you haven't noticed? I have roughly 6.5k hours in I stopped playing just before lightfall and cheaters were common enough where I can safely say I would run into 1 at least once every 10-15 games on pretty regular intervals. in shadowkeep it was like every 4 games and it was more obvious.
hold up so they used activision and sony for money, damn 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Yup, they made a presentation about how "overdelivering" is somehow a bad yhing lol
Back during Forsaken and Shadowkeep my friends and I would regularly play the Strike playlist. It was our favorite part of the game, and became part of our routine. So it was incredibly discouraging when players would ask why there weren't many new Strikes anymore, Bungie would keep saying "they're really expensive content to make, we'd have to sacrifice too many other things." Based on what we know now I suspect the real reason is "we couldn't figure out how to monetize them and the bean counters won't let us make them any longer."
What fucking other content did they make. 3 hours of campaign missions and seasonal content they going to purge after 3 months anyway?
They took out my favorite ones Savathuns song and Strange Terrain miss those
@@jag9872 Those were mine too. It seemed an injustice that those got cut, yet Exodus Crash remains.
I tried playing Destiny 2 a while back during a Steam sale and there was just so much shit littered across so many DLCs, season passes, dungeon keys and whatever the fuck else they were selling that I just shook my head and backed out.
Good choice.
They destroyed the structure when they introduced the vault to cut and recycle content. Until and including "Forsaken" it was playbale, downwards after that ever since.
Same.
Its so fkin expensive and confusing just to play new content for new players its insane
I bought them and I dreadfully regret doing so.
I hope it burns too. I remember trying to get back into it, bought a DLC called something simple like, "[Name of quest line] Pack", then spent an hour or two running around, lost in how the menus had evolved so significantly, trying to find where to start the quest. I googled, contacted support, etc, eventually found that the quest line had been pulled to "make room" for future content. So what the actual hell did you sell me??? I had to fight tooth an nail to get my money back. Sony blamed Bungie, Bungie blamed Sony, it was a hot mess. Eventually I was like, No, Bungie, this is your in game store front, you sold this non-content to me, this was your choice, you owe me my money, and even then, they were like, "well, we'll refund it just this one time, be more careful in the future." Like, F off, I was done.
This is hilarious 😂
“But sunseting is a good thing” 🤓
I would've said "give me my refund,or I'll file a chargeback with my bank,siting fraudulent practices.
@@Rellana1 The longer story is that's exactly what I did, put a charge back on my card, got my money back. They had ghosted me entirely, even after threatening to call my bank, so I did it. But then I was given a permanent ban from PSN; couldn't play anything online at all... Yup, they stole $30 from me, and when I made a scene of it they banned me. So then I complained to the BBB, I was furious. It was THEN, that a resolution person finally reached out to me and fixed it, despite initially disagreeing with me until I explained everything, then she got that passive aggressive attitude to try and save face. Utterly ridiculous.
Been “playing” destiny2 since its release….it is the SAME SHIT download after download…play 1.5 hours on TUESDAY after weekly update and everything new is done! Sit around doing nothing new or simply wait until next Tuesday and repeat…you’re done with everything with around 2 months left in season…IT SUCKS!!!!!!! If you don’t purchase seasons, forget it, you get nothing new ever!!!!!
The fact they fired such a talented composer with such an extensive background goes to show no one is safe in this industry
Reminds me of Blizzard ditching Russel Brower. "Oh it'll be ok, we will just have new people, who we can pay much less, copy Brower's style. No one will notice!"
To the suits, Salvatori was just an expensive line item in a spread sheet.
That's what happened when you go to college for those kinds of degrees.
first marty then salvatori
I mean yea fire him because the music is done. And there's no plan for d3 or a new expansion pack after final shape. They are going to put d2 on Maintenance mode and Focus on Marathon
When Karma catches up to Greed.
Karma gonna be busy than cause thats an ever increasing problem.
@@SeeYouRyu2032 Karma screwed up alongside reality so screw them both alongside Bungie's Upper-Management. 🗿🗿🗿🗿🗿🗿🗿😶😶😶😶😶😶😶
@Yumt.92neither does god
Fully agree with you. I think it sucks that it's come to this but I think it needs to happen. The only part I'm sad about is that none of the executives got sacked.
yeah it was just a bunch of everyday people and bungie veterans like Micheal Salvatori and Lorraine Mclees who, she made the logo for the first halo game and Micheal Salvatori we all know what he did. but the executives will never be the ones to lose their livelihoods
Give it time…. Sony will make those changes last. You don’t lead a sinking ship to bottom of the ocean without going down with it.
100% based take. Couldn't have happened to a more deserving developer. I'll never forgive them for what they did to what was once my go to game.
See for me its strange I love Destiny still but I haven't really played it much for years. The only thing that kept me around was Trials and they destroyed that mode. Once i lost interest in trials, I never really touched it other then maybe a rare raid or maybe doing the seasonal content. At this point we have needed massive changes but it seems hopeless that any significant changes will ever happen.
It’s pretty crazy just how much money you need to spend JUST to get into Destiny 2, it’s just a huge money sink. (Glad I got out of playing it when I did at around the time the first dlc was announced.)
You can definitely get into it but hard not to spend 60 on a past dlc bundles at least. Much less buy expansions after those for 40-60 each
@KingThor128 The problem is that they are cutting up the main story and adding them into the season pass content. So you essentially paying $100 USD for a full story per year. And that is the cheapest option. And that you still have to pay for Dungeons! Then if you want to buy cosmetics, they are 20 USD each!
And removing entire planets and entire campaigns...just because? Even Gambit the weakest game mode had maps removed, making it even worse.
I heard $200+
People have convinced themselves it's basically the same as paying a monthly sub like an mmo. I have played Destiny since the Alpha and I stopped playing about 6 months ago. I'm not going back. Bungie suck and are partly to blame for the state of gaming at the minute. They basically invented the live service concept. I'm not giving them another penny.
@@csnationyou have no idea the variety that was taken out of gambit
go get em Rurikhan! I 100% agree with this take - companies need to finally feel consequences for their eploitative practices. Its not just a good thing for the players but the developers too. No game dev I know got into the industry because they wanted to make monetization riddled garbage. Its a systemic issue and company culture is often so far gone that we need drastic things to happen to get things back on track...
I think the analogy that I'm going to drop fits here.
A hard working head farmer looks at a businessman and asks him, "do you see the cows there?" "Yes I do see them," the businessman replies. The farmer says, "these cows are ill do to poor sustenance and exhaustion we need to give them better food and rest." The businessman hmphed, "no we can't do that for it will cost me more money!" "But sir, the cows will either die or leave," exclaimed the farmer. The businessman, having had enough of the farmer's words, fired him. Weeks later the cows die or disappear one by one but the businessman kept milking the cows even to the point of bleeding and those that died were sold to butchers for more money. Eventually all the cows that were left died by blood loss and the businessman went bankrupt for he had no more cows left to milk or sell to butchers.
Who do you all think was who in this analogy?
The 45% miss is because the execs overestimated to make the game look better for the playstation acquisition
That's a good point, but other videos brought up that fact that this layoff situation was a Bungie decision and not Sony, so it's still a fuck up they made themselves regardless of the intention. And they did also actually layoff people, so they missed their goal by so much they fired 100 people, so it can't be too far off.
@@nerobiblios4086 well, the layoffs are completely bungie's fault because they made the bad projection to begin with. That's what I was getting at. They wanted to look good for Sony, but I don't think Sony instigated the layoffs
@@nerobiblios4086it’s bungie execs that pretty much ruin the game. They don’t listen to the devs, don’t listen to the players and their main priority is their own paycheck.
I cancelled Final Shape pre-order, I agree, BUNGIE needs a LESSON
You pre ordered... After everything... You're part of the problem.
@@carpathianhermit7228I agree
I like Ruri’s faith in humanity’s ability to learn from bad behavior. I on the other hand have zero faith and believe the industry scum will only become better at hiding their schemes.
Been a destiny player for almost 10 years and I have to say it gets better then substantially worse in an endless cycle. I'm honestly so tired of the way Bungie treats both it's developers and it's players. I'll probably make it through the new expansion and then dip. I have the sunk cost now so I just want to see how this shit ends. Appreciate the coverage bud.
And there it is. There's is no "sunk cost" unless you want one to exist. That's the reason why it's called a fallacy. YOU make the decision to continue to play...to support a shit company because you cannot bring yourself to say "enough".
That's on You.
2600+ hours and I finally noped out. Skipped out the last two seasons.
The company is only part of the problem. The players are the 800 lb gorilla that everyone (espcially the players) is turning a blind eye to. Because they'd rather support a shit company and continue this toxic behavior than just find something else to play.
Just don’t buy any microtransactions. I’ll check out the reviews for final shape, but I damn sure didn’t pre order and as far as I’m concerned, if the overwhelming majority of reviews say it’s mediocre, then my Destiny journey ended with lightfall.
The only reason I've stuck with it is because I've been with it since D2's launch...that means I've kept up with all the dlcs and content (exotics/weapon rolls) that I can just jump in and start playing whenever something drops...the best way to do it is just get the season pass for the year on a key site (you don't give money to Bungle and get all the content for $20-30 less than on steam, shoutout greenman gaming). New players are faced with such a paywall/time sink I wouldn't recommend it to anyone unless you're like me and are all caught up. Also never buy anything from the eververse unless you're using bright dust (how I get all the cosmetics, no real money spent)...shills that throw $100 at Bungle every time they drop a trailer is the reason they get by releasing the bare minimum and egregious MTX. The game is cool if you're caught up and have all the gear but Bungle is always gonna bungle...been criticizing them since day 1 but most players can't fathom criticizing their precious Bungle (just look at the comment sections for all the vidocs...it's insane)
Agreed. I think my journey has ended with Lightfall. Extremely mediocre game now. Playing since D1 week 1. Smh
Rurikahn really just went on his Silverhand arc and said "Wake the F up Guardian, We've got a Game Company to burn!" 😂
I came into Destiny during forsaken (PS4) and loved it, and had purchased whatever edition available at the time with the previous expansions. Back then the story made sense. I ended up getting into PC gaming before shadow keep, bought the previous expansions for cheap, bought shadowkeep onPC and PlayStation because crossplay wasn’t available yet. My old Destiny vet friends had already quit the game because they were tired of all the “new” old content (the moon) and reskinned guns. To me everything was new and I loved it. Fast forward to today and now I’m seeing all the same things they saw back then. Light fall was the final draw for me. I barely got through the season pass for the first season, and haven’t played since. I don’t think I will ever play it again. It was a good run, but now Bungie has shown us their true colors.
Yea right man. I started playing during beyond light and it wasn’t until lightfall where I started calling the game ass
There were a couple of other bad season in between I didn’t care for. Season of the drifter, and I think the seraph season was pretty bad. I only played that to get the felwinters, but all seasons after that I played through. But yeah light fall was it for me 😢
Pretty much same for me. After playing through Witch Queen (which was a good expansion) I was pretty burnt out, but decided to go ahead and just get the vanilla Lightfall expansion. Man, what a joke that was. I finished (barely) the free season pass, and haven't played more than an hour here and there since.
When a new shooter comes out, we in the community hear "Destiny killer" a lot. As if some other game could possibly end the IP. But we know, the community knows that the only true "Destiny killer" is Bungie itself.
Honestly people should come to terms with the fact that Destiny was already dead
@YEY0806 Now, here's the thing about a game being dead. To someone who either played it and quit or never played a game it appears dead. This is due to you not paying attention to it anymore making it have the feeling of being dead. When in actuality the game has been thriving for years, even through horrible times.
I completely agree. If people want the gaming industry to turn around and be better. (Make better games, be less predatory, and actually listen to communities) Bungie NEEDS to go under. Yes it would hurt their developers, but it would BENIFIT developers across the ENTIRE INDUSTRY by making there publishers have to make better choices and make all of their jobs SAFER. Bungie needs to unfortunately be a cautionary tale smh This is actually what I realized with Bungie 2 years ago and talking to my friends about the decline was like crying into the void.
As player that played destiny 1 at the very beginning, and destiny 2. In d1 I probably spent around 250-300$ to play from start to finish. In d2 I have probably spent around 500$ plus to keep playing to game and keep up to date and it’s still going…
Not mention nearly half of that content was snatch away from us only to be half resold labeled as “new”
I never thought I'd see the day where Bungie would stoop lower than 343 studios.
Crazy that my buddy and I saw this coming just over a year and a half ago in the middle of gameplay. Both of us was like "yo why are we still doing the exact same thing over and over again" basically just grinding yet we're getting charged for a battle pass after already paying for the game and all the dlc when this crap is now ftp for new players oh wait they are deleting content now and haven't made a new strike since release basically. I'm out, You've made your point very clear to us Bungie you never cared about the players time or what want to innovate your product 😤😒 ✌️
13:33 "The traditional 'oh we're sorry' jpeg" that is brilliant hahaha
If only customers realized how much power they actually hold. The industry is often a reflection of what people can tolerate.
The problem is that even if they do fail and they do crash, the lesson won't be learned. Bunjie made Halo became a household name, then got bought by Microsoft, escaped and made Destiny then learned nothing and got bought by Sony. Greedy corpos gonna greed. If lessons were learned Bunjie would've learned from Blizzard who would have learned from Bioware, who would've learned from EA. This cycle will continue until the developers get unionized and actually have the power to fight back. Until then, let's all remember how great Destiny 1 and base game Destiny 2 was.
if you buy the 100€ edition you get all the content, "dungeon Keys" are sold seperatly for ppl who bought the base DLC without the seasonpass which is included in the deluxe edition. I hated that they took away content I paid for and that the game is now very unaccessable to new players. PVP has been neglected for many years and they brokle so many promisses to the palyerbase. I hope management gets what they deserve and that hiring new talent wont be easy for them because now they have shown their true face..
Don't forget they removed it because the game was too big and the code was spaghetti.
And people ate that shit excuse up.
Remember? Oh wait here are those guns and contents we removed to add back for more $$$.
It boils my piss.
As a Destiny 2 player I approve this message lol
Yup keep giving them your money lol
There used to be a game called The Dreadnought with a huge potetial. Beta was a lot of fun and soon there was a great community around the game. Then they decided to pass the game to new director - Mike Donatelli (supposedly guy who contributed to death of the Wild Star MMO). At that time the goal was to introduce monetization system and despite countless concerns from the community they decided to introduce progression system 2.0 which contained pretty much all free 2 play scammy practices. As a result most of the community left including me. Athought I was returning every now and then to check what is the state of the game over several years, all they did was to rework progression system several times back and fort, introduce game on other platforms, introduce more microtransactions and tweak balance occasionally. Eventually the game died and the sad thing is that it was prophesied by majority of community when the whole progression 2.0 BS was presented for the first time. I came to realize that perhaps milk and kill was their intention since the beginning. Honestly it's such a shame that people like Mike Donatelli doing their shitty business in industry they don't care about at all.
Really well said. This take just got me to subscribe. Bungie needs to get their heads out of their asses, the likes of Justin Truman especially.
Great video. I wish there are more videos like you a couple of years ago, when Bungie got caught nerfing XP levels. Few people quit Destiny 2, including some UA-camrs like Deycide but TONS of People still defended Bungie, gave them their money and attacked other people who tried to warn them of Bungie's scummy tactics. Fast forward to today, NOW there are more people who are speaking against Bungie and Bungie knew they messed up big time when they saw more people got their Destiny 2 Final Shape refunds. Was it because of the microtransactions ? The dungeon keys hidden behind a pay wall ? The Gjallarhorn hidden behind a pay wall? The ridiculously high priced expansions that keeps getting less contents ? The way Bungie completely removed the different Factions New Monarchy, Dead Orbit and Future War Cult ? The way Bungie ignored the PvP players and the Destiny veterans who begged Bungie for years to give them what they wanted but Bungie never listened? The way Bungie finally admitted that they were only interested in squeezing more money from their loyal customers while providing them the least content ? The way Bungie transferred most of their workforce to work on Marathon the same way Bioware did when they had Bioware B Team worked on Mass Effect Andromeda while Bioware A Team worked on Anthem?
Bungie finally reap what they sow.
I've been playing Destiny 1 and I have all the expansions. I played Destiny 2 and I quit playing After Beyond Light because the expansions started getting ridiculously expensive .
Marathon will never achieve the same success Destiny 1 and 2 had.
Bungie is finished.
Hopefully someone with the right amount of resources will sue them for removing content people paid for (sometimes paid twice).
I used to play destiny 2 daily. Now it’s become I check out the start of the season then clock out. I really enjoyed pvp but the lack of balance changes, lack of maps, introduction of air effectiveness. The amount of high quality games out there … from fromsoft to valorant to x and x. Bungie stopped innovating. In addition dungeon keys being an extra cost, price increases with the cost of living. Its incredibly difficult to get friends to try it out
Ruri I totally am with you 100% on this. Ever since Bungie fired Marty O’Donnell they have had this coming. They killed the goose that laid the golden egg. Destiny is soulless because this company has no soul. I’m not talking about the developers who I’m sure are trying to do their best, but it’s time for this company to die. I hope the developers weather this storm and go on to make better things. I’m also with you hoping (coping maybe) that Blizzard redeems itself. I really love the WarCraft IP and I’m really sick and sad of what’s happened to it. Maybe… just maybe Microsoft’s purchase will change things, but probably not. It’s just tragic.
Its how i feel about rockstar
Bungie has had it coming. The people who got fired didn't
Thanks!
I think a frustrating thing about these types of discussions is the tendency to ignore the broader global economy when talking about them. Just because revenue dropped off doesn't mean it was players intentionally organizing against the company or anything it's can be the result of bigger economic pressures.
That's not to say that players don't matter, but you can't do things like a revenue forecast without an economist.
I loved destiny 2 during forsaken, but the seasonal system that came after pissed me off, time limited exotics and everything else is just annoying. Concidering exotics are some of the best usable content in the game.
If you dont get them during the seasons, you have to grind ages to collect them all, i used to have all of the exotics, now returning and getting them all would be basicly grinding fucking ciphers to buy them from a vendor. instead of integrating them into old dungeons or raids to give players a reason to grind again
I dunno, jumping on the hate-wagon and piling on is pretty scummy; especially if you're wishing that the company folds and goes under. Hope those clicks were worth it.
Was it Curse of Osiris or around Shadowkeep and it’s season where the XP Debacle happened?
Years ago, I gave up playing Destiny. My interest in it waned. There was absolutely nothing to anticipate. They are now extinct since they decided to follow the Sony path. Microsoft recently acquired Blizzard; therefore, allow them some time to adjust before seeing any changes. When it comes to major purchases like these, nothing changes instantly.
Damn I was with you until about the 1:15 or so mark where u said u only played til the first raid of D2....thats like me saying I stopped playing cod at world at war...its like taking advice for how to raise and discipline kids and that person has 0 kids...almost had me, but good points the first minute
I’m really shocked this didn’t happen sooner
Fun Fact: 1/3 of the weapons in one of the witch queen dungeons (Spire of the watcher) that you had to pay serperately for were WORLD DROPS, people paid a premium to get kicked in the nuts
The vaulting and then when I started to play the witch dlc I noticed that they inflated gameplay by making you have to farm resources to continue the story. That had started to put me off playing, not sure why I bought the light dlc. Haven't even played in a few months maybe more. Nostalgia maybe, well its sucks this is happening
That’s exactly why I kept buying them for so long, was the nostalgia… what really burned me out, was that entire year, they repeated the exact same seasonal events just different map, and then made the grind even worst. The fact that you’d have to play a million strikes to get anything and they were the same strikes you played when d2 came out and the new strikes were 20-30 minutes long
I agree, I was once a whale for this game back from d1 and d2 up to the season of Osiris.
But it was all downhill for me from there. I once tried to get back into the game for the witch queen expansion to find that I needed to pay out over $200 just to get in the game and another 100 to be on par with current players.
I hop Bungie falls off a cliff, because that’s the only hop I have of getting back the destiny I liked, weather that’s with Bungie or a new company that buys out the ip
I agree with you on these points but there is also the other aspects of us gamers have been spoiled over what we get for what we have paid for in games these days. As a 50yearold gamer I have been through it all. We used to never get updates or expansions on games 30 years ago. The game was released on disc and that was it, you waiting until they made a sequel and played with the buggy games, for the next 2 years. Now we get updates in days and expansions in months. I know game developers have been talking and looking at this about the cost of games and the amount of hours the has to the amount of hours the employee's put in to make a game. You have to look at this as well, when it comes to designing new raids and dungeons. Take for example a movie cost us 20$ to go see in theaters. and the movies is 2hours long, that is 10$ per hour enjoyed. Now a game is 80$ and you play that for 100hours, that is .80c per hour of enjoyment. But the employees hours put into that game to make 100 hours of game play for your is much higher. I am not condoning what Bungie or any other company has done or may do to get more money out of us but there is other things going on you have to look at. There are a bunch more I can on about but I think I will leave this here for now. Finally yes if the higher ups listened to the core players and team members and fixed the stuff that is majorly wrong everyone would be much happier. But this goes for every industry. No Company is the perfect company.
I am not sure hoping for the ruin of game developers is logical if you enjoy games. We need these developers to succed and improve. Bungie and Blizzard have made some of the best games of all time.
You forgot the part about dungeons where they made the purchase of them only accessible through their silver store and its at a price where you have to purchase more silver than you need because of course you cant just outright by the dungeon (which should be part of the expansion)....
Yup. You want this it's going to cost you 1500 silver but you need to buy 2000 silver to get 1500 silver
I loved destiny I bought the game and it’s collectors edition when they went free to play I gave it a chance but decided it was no longer for me as I stay away from games driven by seasonal gameplay and micro transactions
I hope the industry looks deeper in the failure of management and learns from their mistake. It sucks that devs suffer for the gross incompetence in management. I want destiny to suckseed and the last DLC to be a banger. But I dont want management in the industry to get away with their bad practises. I love/ hate destiny.. its a complicated relationship. (I have been playing sincve 2014 beta) that said... I love the game but I hate some of their monitization structure. The devs who lost their jobs will find new work with their talent and hard work. But I hope that the managers wont find work in the industry, because this debacle is unacceptable. I have now cancelled my Pre order on steam.
Lmfao my guy, It's "succeed" not "SUCK-SEED"! That's gotta be top 3 misspelled word of all time given that Bungie is the topic at hand and they do and should be sucking the seed right now for sure!
Thank you for covering Bungies downfall, I have been waiting for this for years. 1500 hours in D2 and all I have to show for it, is an empty wallet 😢
and a gjallahorn!!!!
Cmon 1500 hrs for how many dollars ? Compare that to any other frivolous stuff for per minute entertainment u spend your money on.
Best take I’ve heard and this is coming from someone who has 1000s of hours in Destiny.
I left the game after lightfall and haven’t gone back because the writing was on the wall: content, real content, was no longer a priority to them.
Glad you brought up the xp cap scandal from the start of D2, I haven't seen anyone else bring it up in their vids about the recent stuff but you forgot an important aspect about it.
Bungie was also selling xp boosters at the time, effectively they were selling the ability to just reach the xp cap faster. I don't think they ever gave players refunds or compensation of any kind for that piece of 💩 move.
The way youtubers and d2 players are acting shocked about Michael Salvatori's firing is frankly disgusting me. I've seen two youtubers barely reference Marty O'Donnell's firing almost a decade ago, they act like Bungie's never done anything this shocking.
If Marty hadn't sued and won both his cases, we never would've known that Bungie illegally stripped him of his founder's shares in the company. Their defense in the case of his wrongful termination was that he was a hostile and insubordinate employee and was fired and their defense in the founder's shares case was that he quit the company, thus forfeiting the shares.
Funny how with these recent layoffs, the employees who had unvested shares with the company lose them and those shares revert back to Bungie.
People act like they can't believe Bungie would screw people over this royally, but we know from Marty's IGN interview after he won his cases that people he'd worked with for two decades lied about him on the stand and wouldn't look him in the eye or even in his general direction in the courtroom.
And let's not forget that Bungie forced out Joe Staten, another company founder and the man who wrote the story for the Halo games and destiny's original story.
Bungie showed us 10 years ago that they'd become a piece of 💩 company and no matter what scandals or controversies happened in the last decade, enough players supported the company financially to empower it to abuse it's employees and extended it ability to abuse them to this point in time.
Destiny 2 is exactly the game it's playerbase deserves, they invested their money into it, they covered for Bungie's 💩 practices and they demonized anyone who criticized the practices or the game's quality.
Destiny's final shape is a turd Bungie will spray fart onto their remaining and willing fanatics.
Rurichad is 100% right here
@@revenge750why tf are you spamming that on every comment.
One of the decisions in my life that has led to a significant amount of increased joy was when i finally quit the game a couple years ago
glad to hear someone on YT saying this stuff. Bungie reaped what it sowed. but, as ever, the people that suffer most are the employees which is always management's first line of defence in times like these.
Completely agree with you. I played destiny 2 again for witch queen, due to my brother, nothing was new. I stopped playing again.
Finally! I've been saying this for years. One of the reason I left Destiny, but far too many players kept buying into it. Even after the GDC, where Bungie said we make sure we under deliver when we launch our gams/dlc. To me thats a huge red flag. Basically doing as little as possible but charging your players as much as possible. Keep it up mate.
It's outrageous call destiny 2 a free to play game even after the removed the red war campaign which was the free to play content and what's left is nearly a demo and the rest is pay walled to hell and back
They really pissed me off when they took away planets during some "expansions". They want to mimic an MMO but I've never played an MMO that literally steals away substantial parts of the game and then gaslights you about it. "Content vault" they called it. Idiots. And of course I am referring to the business people and the executives who make these decisions of course as you noted.
Destiny 2 is fun but for sure needs changing. Bungie upper management unfortunately has a mindset of "don't over deliver"
I actually just saw an article about Mortgage companies. They hired all these people and paid $100,000+ bonuses. In the fine print, they put a 2 year clause in it, to keeping the bonus. Now that they are in a downturn, the companies are firing people a month before the 2 year mark and demanding they come up with $100,000 to give BACK to the company. So… yeah… Bungie management acting like the shadiest of the shady and firing people like this says it all.
The over delivery thing is also totally insane. Work your employees at a reasonable non-grind, non-burnout way, and release what you can, when it's ready, or a reasonable price. Then for the next expansion, guess what, you do the same thing. So what happens if it comes out as less content than the last expansion? Yes, you're created expectations and a pattern, so you know what you do? Charge less. If you get even more content made? Charge more. Easy.
I totally get that with a base game, you need to be competitive, so you have the same base price as any other game (mostly), but for DLC? Charge whatever it's worth.
Tough, but i agree. I was a big Destiny fan, played the hell out of both 1 and 2, but at some point i just got tired of being asked to pay for stuff endlessly. Even when switched to PC and was thinking of coming back, the idea of having to catch up with so many purchases... awful way of retaining players. I was sad to leave it behind, but now that sadness is gone. There is nothing left, nothing to miss.
Thanks for your video. I can feel our frustation throught your words. I wish things could change, Destiny 2 has given me so many good friends and moments, and honestly I keep coming for them. But probably they will double down on bad practices untile they go down by their own hand. I still hope there is a way to save the studio and the game 🙏
With the dawn of the Internet Age, where people are constantly online, communicating face-to-face less and less, a lot of the people running these big companies have seemingly forgotten that no business venture is a monolith that stands on its own, generating cash out of thin air: you need people to look at your product and decide that its worth spending their money on, so if you piss off your customers and they have alternatives they're straight up just going to stop giving you money. You could have the best product to ever exist but if your consumer-base absolutely *hates your guts,* that's Game Over.
This is why "over-delivering" (what an absolutely braindead corpo phrase) is a valuable tool. You are investing in community goodwill that will tide you over *when* things inevitably go bad and times get tough. A company that forgets this is slated for a quick, abrupt death as your consumers finally decide they've had enough and go elsewhere. Bungie spent the last damn-near decade f#cking around and has finally found out.
💯 % agree. I'm still salty for the sunseting. Never got over that.
That opening was so savage, it made me laugh.😂 After hearing what you had to say, and honestly having a very similar experience with Destiny 1, I now totally agree with you. Bungie hasn't done anything truly good for fans since they left Halo.
I was a hard core Destiny player from Kingsfall onward Shadowkeep. I took a long break then returned for Beyond Light. I bailed 100% soon after. I just couldn’t take the constant cycle of disappointment with increasing monetization and content extraction. Honestly, it was seriously liberating to cut the cord with the franchise. The only way things change is if players vote with their feet and wallets.
i saw someone say they kept giving bungie the benefit of the doubt *all this time*…as a former avid d2 played (stopped after BL) i saw the cracks literally since shadowkeep. after forsaken and it’s seasons, the game went to complete shit. you’re on some heavy cope if you think witch queen (from what i saw) and it’s seasons were anywhere close to the quality of forsaken
Loser
Bro thank you for this video. I've been trying to tell all my friends, that still buy D2 garbage expansions, that they are supporting the scumbags at Bungie that do not deserve it.
@@revenge750lmao would you stop with this comment Jesus
Bungie has the most horrific monetisation ever they can crash and burn i hope the new SONY CEO realizes how much money Sony are bleeding everyday by keeping Bungie afloat. 3.6 billion wasted. Sony Should have made a pass at Capcom , Rockstar or fromsoft instead.
You either die Blizzard North, or live long enough to see yourself become Activision.
Another super scummy business practice that bungie does is the way the seasons/dungeons are purchased. These add ons can only be purchased in game using destiny in game currency. The seasons are $12-13 dollars but you can only purchase the in game currency in "packs" of $10-$20 so they force you to spend even more money than the actual price of the content. I hope they crash and burn as well.
First 30 seconds is valid asf. LMFAO
Bungie is also the reason why the Last of Us 2 multi-player got cancelled. Sony sent some Bungie employees over to Naughty Dog to check out the game and offer their recommendations. The Bungie Reps said that the LoU2 MP wasn't worth saving and so Sony cancelled it. Maybe it wasn't good, or maybe it just needed some tweaking but showed promise...we will never know because Bungie (a direct competitor) trashed it & said it wasn't worth saving. The same Bungie that has seen its own games bleed players and few gamers play anymore. And I said from the very beginning that Sony was making a mistake buying Bungie, and I was mocked & ridiculed. Bungie is NOT the great company that so many think it still is.
When I heard naughty dog delayed factions indefinitely because bungee told them to had me so upset. One of those times you wanted to yell through the screen. I had a feeling this would happen. I’m only hoping that naughty dog can see this as maybe they shouldn’t have listened to bungie. Factions was one of the few games I was looking forward to the most. The first factions was amazing!
I can't really feel bad for the employees on every level. Their situation is unfortunate, for sure, but there comes a time when you have to wonder what they expected. The people that are "just following orders" only get a pass for so long. Also known as "Lay down with dogs, you get fleas".
You have no idea what you're talking about
@@bobross8585 Well, you didn't elaborate at all so you surely must.
@@25xxfrostxx you act like these low paid devs should just quit their jobs in protest?
@@bobross8585 If you work for a company that is doing things that you see as wrong, unethical, or predatory, you should absolutely find a different job. I've done it. It's not the easy road but not every situation has an easy road. If you don't, you aren't the victim when the inevitable collapse happens. You chose to take the easy route of staying and doing nothing for a paycheck and now that paycheck stopped because of the eventual result. It's living with a choice. What happened at Bungee didn't take place over the space of a week. This has been a cancer that has been apparent for literal years but now it's shocked pikachu when the predictable result occurs.
Happy N& day bro, you can never forget the music in the background can you it's the best music score that any game has ever had , Roll of ME-5
Finally someone says what has needed to be said. I was a fool that dropped close to $400 for the first 14 months of D2 to play content. That content is no longer available. In order for me to jump in and play D2 today it would cost me an additional $400 and that's with the base game being free..... absolute trash practice.
Hey Ruri, have you played Warframe?
Im just glad the community overall is finally coming together in realizing bungie has been taking advantage of us for years!
insane on how much effort they put into fixing destiny 1, making it an amazing game.
and they giving us d2 wich is worse in every aspect beside combat than destiny 1.
what a shame...cashshop is worse, deleting expentions for some dumbass reason, mediocre ballance etc.
They had Activision power behind them to fix D1 and create marvels like The Taken King. Now, they are trash. Sony just joined them, so they are not in the equation yet. Bungie on their own is trash.
@@rechelieu yeah they are garbage...break my hearth because i adored them in the halo days.
I’ve had a whole six year relationship through destiny, two. I introduced my sweetheart to the game, she got popular on the game enough to make her own clan. Now that we’re no longer together quite frankly, I want the game to collapse.
I actually do agree.
I get flamed for it most places when I bring up GDC, management abuse, misuse of funds, player abuse, lies told to the community, malicious monetization, cut content, removal of paid for content etc.
I bought Renegade as a return to the franchise, to see its contents being stripped out in next release. Removing paid contents from a free to play live service game is something you cannot walk away with, specially with the campaign. If you keep my contents I can come back, check the current sandbox and decide to pay or not for new contents. If you remove them it would be a foul me twice.
Yes man, around 18:00, you got the point, that’s the biggest issue
I played D1 for thousands of hours and I came into it late just a few months before the Siva thing happened, I barely caught the end of the Forsaken King raid for perspective. I loved the game so much that I preordered D2 as soon as I could, fast forward to release date, boot up the game and immediately was put off by the dumbing down of the game. I barely pulled myself to finish the story, and stopped playing until the first raid came out and barely even got in to do that raid, swore off the game after that😂 didn’t even wait to play the first two expansion packs that c ame with the preorder.
Ironically, I've just got back into D2 after 4 years and I'm having a blast.
Reminds me of what is currently going on with Creative Assembly, the studio behind the Total War franchise.
After many years of not giving their fan base what they want, worse and worse technical problems from game to game, yet increasing prices across the board, the community seems to finally have reached the breaking point and the newest game isn't selling at all. That is overly simplyfying the situation of course to avoid writing a massive comment, there is more to it (like recently banning critical voices on the Steam forums. You know, stuff that never fails to make a community happy.)
I would argue it's the same type of management bs as here.
You sir are 100% correct
Below are the factual trends.
The reason why Destiny 2 has fallen is because
Bungie pulled a Gamigo. They pulled out more and more
egregious monetization upon their player base.
This has kept chopping their the player base in halve each time they did this.
Sure you have a short term gains and massive peaks of revenue but diminishing returns over the long period.
So we have around 30 to 50.000 whales that like to spend money real money on this game.
However the larger majority of 1.2 million to 500.000 hardcore players destiny 2 started with have mostly left.
AVG around 77.000 since 2019
April 2023 142,128
I played Destiny 1 until Destiny 2 launched, and then I stuck with D2 until about a year ago, and throughout that time I saw how they _repeatedly_ ignored most of the requests and complaints of the people who played their game. I agree, this apparent upcoming crash is well deserved.
I'm shocked. I rarely agree with you, but today is not one of those days. Completely agree with you on this subject.
I'm with you 100%...Destiny should have gone down in flames all the way back when Curse of Osiris came out...showing that Bungie learned absolutely zero from Destiny 1...I quit the day CoO released.
there was already resentment for live service and now we are at the massive breaking point. took time but, we are finally at the point
I quit playing Destiny when they vaulted content that I paid for. I have a very low threshold for rip off tolerance.
I'm in full agreement with you on this. I also felt like Destiny 2 had the best gunplay of any game on the market, but I turned away after seeing all the psychological tricks Bungie was playing to keep players invested. The ridiculous number of things that needed to be leveled up and unlocked by grinding, plus the RNG drops, plus the microtransactions, plus the time-locked FOMO content...
I looked at the time commitment: I work full time and I'm taking classes, so keeping up with D2 would mean I'd have time for no other games. And you know what? Being beholden to grinding one game felt like work instead of fun. So despite D2's amazing gunplay, I sighed, shook my head, and uninstalled.
Now I'm glad I stopped. I used to revere Bungie for giving us the Halo trilogy, but now I too hope they fail. They've become a money machine that preys on players, manipulating their psychology to milk out every damn penny. The removed content is complete bullshit. Absolutely should be illegal. They just take away what you paid for, because "fuck you, give us more money." No, Bungie, fuck YOU.
I stand with you.. unfortunately, i am one of many that fell victim to the monetization going on.. with that said, thats why i still play today.. i havent purchased final shape yet, and as of now… i dont think i will… something needs to happen, and burning to the ground, just might be what they need… shits getting crazy man… blessed be to you and everyone else…
"The players keep buying." That is the key. If players wouldn't buy, they wouldn't be able to sell. The players are to blame as well.
Wow this guy is for real like me. Thank you for making me feel not guilty
No need to feel guilt they had this coming
Investors and senior managers don't do things for the benefit of the customers, regardless of the industry. Unrealistic expectations, lack of proper investment, scale back until the customers start to scream and move their business elsewhere... It's a shame.