I want to add that a random $16 Chinese Schrade mass production model in 9Cr18MoV tested at 60HRC. So there are no excuses for the many blunders we"ve seen from premium priced brands!
Really like the 154CM... I use a Benchmade Griptillion in 154CM for deer hunting. Usually process 4 or more deer with out needing to strop. Thanks for the video!
Great list Gerald, love it. I still enjoy a "super steel" knife, Cruwear is my fav .... However, your list is so great because they are all do OK in everyday carry, easily sharpened fast, deburr nice, and strop back easy. Truth be told, my old Crux is s35vn STILL gets an awful lots of pocket time. Thanks for the list Gerald, I pray 9cr buries D2 once and for all. 😎
One of the channels tested a remette peacock in 9cr18, I believe it was 62.5 if I remember correctly. I bought 2 of them, a black and a blue. I have a spyderco mule coming in aebl(my favorite budget steel). Bbb tested one his was at 62.5. I don't own any 154cm but now I guess I got to get some😂.
I thought about BD1N except it's really only widely available in a couple Spyderco models so I ended up leaving it out. Had I included it that would have been #1.
Civivi Backlash and Naja 9Cr18 have better cutting results than PARA 3 BD1N (Outpost 76). Civivi Praxis 9Cr18 cut more then most premium steel ( Tom Hosang- Video).
5. 12C27 4. 14C28N 3. VG-10 2. BD1N 1. 154CM This would be my list only because I still can't see S35VN as a budget steel. As long as its still being used as clout to sell knives for an inflated price.
@Strangely Brown It performs right with alot of the S35VN tested by Gerald in working edge outside of the CRK and such. and It's far more of an actual "budget steel" price wise than S35VN in my opinion. Your welcome to yours though. I'd just rather sharpen VG-10 than soft AR-RPM9 or botched D2 from China.
I put S35VN in there because of increasing availability in cheaper knives. Now it's definitely not done as well as it should be from what I've tested. I'd also like to see the more expensive knives with it perform much better than they do. I do have the Medford S35VN test coming this week as an example.
@@Outpost_76 I still can appreciate that you put 154cm as your number 1 budget steel. I absolutely couldn't agree more. I'd love to find it on more inexpensive blades in the future. I'd even go so far as to say I'd love to see its powdered form on more premium knives instead of the underwhelming 20CV/M390/204P they've been peddling us. At least CPM-154 and RWL-34 regularly perform like they should.
1) 420hc/440C 2)9cr18mov 3)12c27n/14c28n 4)D2 5)Aus 8 6)440A/8cr14mov I consider 154cm and s35vn not budget steels unless you get lucky and find something on sale. I consider $65 and under “budget” knives.
14c28n is the best one on that list imo. Also 440a is the same as 7cr17mov, And 9cr18mov very close to 440c, and 12c27m is very close to 420HC. Aus 8 is the same as 8cr13mov. Kinda funny how similar the budget steels are, usually. D2 is the main outlier here, good for high edge retention for cardboard or such.
My edc is a PM2 S35/brown g10. I really like that steel. Easy to sharpen, gets very sharp, obviously doesn't hold that razor edge for a super long time but easy to touch back up.
@@jslaughterofthesoul4939It is still a very good steel, I think most who trash on lower edge retention than the latest and "greatest" fad likely don't know how to sharpen. My dad's friend had a BG42 Sebenza that lasted him 20yrs of pretty heavy use. He passed away and his wife can't find it but she said she is 99% sure he still had it. I hope she can find it, that was the knife that got me into knives 15yrs ago. I love 154cm as well and could easily make a well made blade with it last so long that it would probably outlive me.
But not all is created equal. Dr Larrin had a study that showed that of PM steels, the advantage or potentiation was least significant, which is interesting and speaks flor the steel itself. Rike has probably the most impressive I've experienced, but I am always hunting for more. Underused and commonly overpriced with subpar treatment and potential. Kansept is doing a lot of very affordable and heralded 154CM, high on my list
N690/n690co and AUS10A? Cos I’m thinking for what I’m using my knives for and living in the tropics, I don’t need anything above s30v. Hopefully one day u might test some. Best steel learning. Always anticipating ur uploads. Thank you for all the time u put into your posts
I want to pick up a knife in AUS10a, but availability is limited to mostly Cold Steel. I've heard good things about it. Cedric did a review on it and it beat out even S35VN in the cut test, which surprised me.
@@Uberragen21 I have a cold steel air lite. It hasn’t seen much action. I leave it in my car cos i like carrying 3” and under as my edc. Hoping to get the Demko ad20.5 when I can
I like 440C when done right, like Ganzo does, and BD-1 seems alright. Id go D2 and 14C28N in 3rd and 2nd interchangeably depending on what my requirements are, edge retention or stain resistance. And i mean GOOD D2 not the garbage stuff. Then id probably go AUS-10A although i dont have much experience with it. It seems solid though. And i would prefer 154CM but i just dont see enough variety in it in the budget class yet. My top 5.
I agree with you completely about S35VN being a budget steel. I have never been that impressed with it. I have a few knives with that steel but I avoid buying anymore. I have always liked S30V much better. Great video.
Nice. Thanks. Teo questions Pop up for me as Not top welk umformend Knife Fan: S35VN is supposed to be an ever so slighty Upgrade in rust ressistance toS30V and is Hypes all over the Place behind lower M390/20CV Stufe in the Medium Production Segment. How come S30V isn‘t the oben to her more Budget? Second: What‘s your opinion on Bohler N690 stell Series? Not too Popular but to find amongst Budget knives. It is not prominent except for Extrema Ratio as their Go to steel. Thanks for the amazing Testing work
In my opinion the main reason S35VN showed up everywhere is the lower cost of manufacturing while still maintaining fairly solid performance in comparison to s30v. I don't have any personal experience of Nitro V but by all accounts it's in the same mix as the Sandvik steels and AEB-L.
I think moving forward we are going to see S35VN become the new D2 of budget knives. It seems to show up more and more every month in the sub 80$ range.
New sup, I don’t have a ton of experience with D2, but I have an exclusive Kershaw in D2. It has not been used gently, really has held up well. It is my tool box knife. I also understand heat treat has a lot to do with blade steal. Favorite hard use carry knife is Benchmade 550. I am looking to there custom shop to order a knife, what steel would you recommend for edge stability? I have S30v (have had edge rolling) and I have heard they really over cook the edge on M4.
What would the majority of use be on this new knife? That will help me give you a solid idea of what to go with. As far as D2 goes I'll have a video up soon about wear resistance/edge retention and it will cover all the things not talked about when considering what steel will work for you. D2 and many others will be covered in the video.
Do cut a lot of tape and cardboard, but real issue is heavy hard plastic. Thanks for the reply. The rolling on the S30v is like a significant burr. That’s why I was looking at s90v or m4
It's a bottom tier stainless when it comes to toughness. Not surprising with its high, large carbide count and high degree of retained austenite which won't be processed out in production knives. Its positive portrayal is all down to marketing. Though it's marginally worse in edge retention, something like LC200N eats 154 for breakfast.
Heat treatment is everything… S35VN @ under 60-61 HRC (with CRYO before temper for low retained Austenite) behaves poorly… else, it is excellent steel & very tough, better than COM 154/CM154. Budget knives all too often mean “budget” Heat treatments. 14C28 is easier to Heat treat properly than S35VN, thus is more appropriate for budget knives (bang for the buck). 9Cr18MoV can be quite good: It is really within the 440-C range… BOHLER N-695@ 60-61 HRCis very much equivalent to CM 154: Cudeman does a wonderful job with that steel.
N690, Sandviks, vg10, 154cm, bd1n would be my choices for budget steels. 9cr18 is decent also and aus10a. Not sure if i consider any PM steels budget yet although some can definitely be found for a bargain nowadays.
Personally wouldn't put S35VN or 154cm on a budget list. While you can find them, they are really not common budget steels. Without, mine would be. 1. 14C28/12C27 2. N690/VG-10 3. 440C 4. 1095 5. AUS-8 Especially the sandviks, 440C and AUS-8 are highly underrated. Those are all good steels. 440C and AUS-8 really depend on a decent HT tho. BD1N is also a good one but I don't really have enough experience with it to rank it.
@Strangely Brown I agree that AUS-10A is better but you rarely see that. We'll probably see more in the future tho. N690 is often overpriced but there are quite a few budget folders and VG-10 is almost the same and we have even more in VG-10. That is why I put them together. 440C is old but really performs well and likes to keep a good amount of bite at the edge. 1095 is basic yes but that is the beauty of it. Amazing to sharpen, perfect for the outdoors and edge retention is definitely enough for that purpose. I just like high carbon steels so there has to be one on my list. Also you are saying "this and that is too basic to make the list". My guy this stuff is purely based on personal experience and preferences and not on some data sheets.
What you get from CRK and the older Demko stuff is far ahead of what you get from most S35VN. In use it's much better than even the well done production S30V. While I get the connection to S35VN with CRK I'd like to see another option like Cruwear as an alternative to the stainless.
I personally like 14c28n, aus10, then xhp at least it used to be cheap. They are the 3 I use the most. Besides 1095 and 5160 in my fixed blades. I did have 9cr18mov was a great knife till someone decided I didn't need it and they did. Lol
Everyone has a different meaning of budget, for me sub 100$ and even some over that are budget. Low budget would be sub 30$ and there are some good choices there.
I haven't used it. I have read and researched on it what I could a while back and as said above it's the Chinese version of VG-10. Do some searches and you'll find it's said to have a noticeable decrease in wear resistance compared to VG-10 in the cooking world. At some point I will test and use it to find out myself.
I bought some odd looking 9Cr18 skinning kit blades I turned into kickass oyster shuckers. The kit 9Cr blades are HT hard and hold an edge well. 14C28N isn't a "great budget" steel unless it is up around 62 Rc hard. Nitro V and 14C28N are nothing more than AEB-L/13C27 with .11% Nitrogen. Unless 154CM is above RC 59 it really isn't any better than well treated 440C. Both steels are in the low toughness range. My filet knives in 440C hold an edge at 58 Rc with a distal taper just as well as 154CM at 58, why pay more for 154CM?
I have had no luck with 12C27, but as with all blade steels it depends on how it was treated. 14C28N has worked out well for me, especially real Twosun knives.
Older Morakniv 12C27 steel knives, had way better heat treatment than the new ones. There is n't many companies that make a good heat treatment on that steel. However Manly knives and many custom makers, realy know how to make that stee shine! It's actually a good quality steel, that takes a really sharp edge, (way sharper, than most stainless steels that I have tried). It also has really good toughness, way more than most stainless steels!
@@greekveteran2715 You are right, I forgot about the Morakniv I have. I don't go out in the wide open anymore but those knives (the older ones) top notch!
@@greekveteran2715 totally agree with you assessment. I'm a knife maker here in Australia and I really like using Sandvik steel....the heat treat recipe for 12c27, 14C28N and RWL34 is almost identical, with critical temp on the last 2 just a little higher! In my experience the main difference between 12c27 and 14C28N is I can get 14C28N one or sometimes 2 rockwell points higher. Typically I harden 12c27 to 60hrc or just above and 14C28N always comes in at 61hrc and I have frequently done it at 62hrc....depends on the application and the user. Tests have shown 14C28N to be a smidge tougher than 12c27 as well.....so what does this mean....it means I can safely take 14C28N a little harder without loss of toughness and that extra hardness translates to a bit better edge longevity. All very similar to NitroV which I have taken to 63hrc with very good results. So wrapping up....all 3 steels at 59 hrc will be very close in performance maybe even at 60 hrc....it's after that where you will see the differences. On a small thin belt knife give me rwl34....larger hard use knife 14C28N, NitroV and 14C28N at 62hrc....you would be hard pressed to tell the difference....in my experience!
This was discontinued because it resembled the GM1 I belive, the Biblio wasn't out when this was released. I'm not sure what they were going for but it is a lot like a bigger Biblio.
I actually see a huge difference between 12c27 and 14c28n. 14c28n is a lot easier to get wicked sharp than 12c27. I've used both for years on swiss army knives and my kershaw leek. My leek's blade felt as sharp as shattered glass whenever I'd sharpen it and it would shave arm hair with just the weight of the knife. Just throw an American Kershaw in there and you would definitely tell the difference.
I may revise this list in light of a recent experience. I forgot how much I liked Aus-10 and I think it should have been in this list.
Was just going to ask about AUS10 ;)
It deserves a spot I feel !
I want to add that a random $16 Chinese Schrade mass production model in 9Cr18MoV tested at 60HRC. So there are no excuses for the many blunders we"ve seen from premium priced brands!
Interest assessment on S35VN, didn't think of it as you presented it. Nice video. Cheers!!
Really like the 154CM... I use a Benchmade Griptillion in 154CM for deer hunting. Usually process 4 or more deer with out needing to strop. Thanks for the video!
Great list Gerald, love it. I still enjoy a "super steel" knife, Cruwear is my fav .... However, your list is so great because they are all do OK in everyday carry, easily sharpened fast, deburr nice, and strop back easy. Truth be told, my old Crux is s35vn STILL gets an awful lots of pocket time. Thanks for the list Gerald, I pray 9cr buries D2 once and for all. 😎
One of the channels tested a remette peacock in 9cr18, I believe it was 62.5 if I remember correctly. I bought 2 of them, a black and a blue. I have a spyderco mule coming in aebl(my favorite budget steel). Bbb tested one his was at 62.5. I don't own any 154cm but now I guess I got to get some😂.
Another great list G! 154cm for the win! 😁
I probably would have thrown VG-10 in there as long as it wasn't from Spyderco.
It is hard to argue with that list. I feel that BD1N should be in there. I would probably have it bump 9cr18.
I thought about BD1N except it's really only widely available in a couple Spyderco models so I ended up leaving it out. Had I included it that would have been #1.
@@Outpost_76 I know Kizer uses it in a couple models too, but I have only used the Spyderco BD1N so far. The availability is a very valid point.
Civivi Backlash and Naja 9Cr18 have better cutting results than PARA 3 BD1N (Outpost 76). Civivi Praxis 9Cr18 cut more then most premium steel ( Tom Hosang- Video).
@@Outpost_76 Good point. I've been looking around for available BD1/BD1N blanks for knifemaking and cannot find any so far.
5. 12C27
4. 14C28N
3. VG-10
2. BD1N
1. 154CM
This would be my list only because I still can't see S35VN as a budget steel. As long as its still being used as clout to sell knives for an inflated price.
@Strangely Brown I see it for around 30 - 60 bucks in a lot of knives. I think its more of a viable budget steel than D2.
@Strangely Brown It performs right with alot of the S35VN tested by Gerald in working edge outside of the CRK and such. and It's far more of an actual "budget steel" price wise than S35VN in my opinion. Your welcome to yours though. I'd just rather sharpen VG-10 than soft AR-RPM9 or botched D2 from China.
I put S35VN in there because of increasing availability in cheaper knives. Now it's definitely not done as well as it should be from what I've tested. I'd also like to see the more expensive knives with it perform much better than they do. I do have the Medford S35VN test coming this week as an example.
@@Outpost_76 I still can appreciate that you put 154cm as your number 1 budget steel. I absolutely couldn't agree more. I'd love to find it on more inexpensive blades in the future. I'd even go so far as to say I'd love to see its powdered form on more premium knives instead of the underwhelming 20CV/M390/204P they've been peddling us. At least CPM-154 and RWL-34 regularly perform like they should.
1) 420hc/440C
2)9cr18mov
3)12c27n/14c28n
4)D2
5)Aus 8
6)440A/8cr14mov
I consider 154cm and s35vn not budget steels unless you get lucky and find something on sale. I consider $65 and under “budget” knives.
There are multiple S35VN under 65$.
@@Outpost_76 I would love to see you make a video or to see a list of the knives under say $70 that have 154CM and S30VN 🤩
Me too! Me too!
14c28n is the best one on that list imo.
Also 440a is the same as 7cr17mov, And 9cr18mov very close to 440c, and 12c27m is very close to 420HC.
Aus 8 is the same as 8cr13mov.
Kinda funny how similar the budget steels are, usually.
D2 is the main outlier here, good for high edge retention for cardboard or such.
S35VN, 14C28N, AUS10A, and 1095.
our definition of "budget" differs.. S35VN is modestly even a mid-range.. with most people calling it a High End.
My edc is a PM2 S35/brown g10. I really like that steel. Easy to sharpen, gets very sharp, obviously doesn't hold that razor edge for a super long time but easy to touch back up.
I have one I'll test at some point. I bought it in 2017 so maybe in the next few years I can get to it.
MVP 🏆 thank you for all you do Sir 👍👍👍.
You're welcome
Great list, love sandvik steels, 154cm is another great one, I love my launch 11
I think 154 is under rated, especially the pm version
I am a huge fan of 154cm
@@jslaughterofthesoul4939It is still a very good steel, I think most who trash on lower edge retention than the latest and "greatest" fad likely don't know how to sharpen. My dad's friend had a BG42 Sebenza that lasted him 20yrs of pretty heavy use. He passed away and his wife can't find it but she said she is 99% sure he still had it. I hope she can find it, that was the knife that got me into knives 15yrs ago.
I love 154cm as well and could easily make a well made blade with it last so long that it would probably outlive me.
But not all is created equal. Dr Larrin had a study that showed that of PM steels, the advantage or potentiation was least significant, which is interesting and speaks flor the steel itself. Rike has probably the most impressive I've experienced, but I am always hunting for more. Underused and commonly overpriced with subpar treatment and potential. Kansept is doing a lot of very affordable and heralded 154CM, high on my list
N690/n690co and AUS10A? Cos I’m thinking for what I’m using my knives for and living in the tropics, I don’t need anything above s30v. Hopefully one day u might test some. Best steel learning. Always anticipating ur uploads. Thank you for all the time u put into your posts
I want to pick up a knife in AUS10a, but availability is limited to mostly Cold Steel. I've heard good things about it. Cedric did a review on it and it beat out even S35VN in the cut test, which surprised me.
@@Uberragen21 I have a cold steel air lite. It hasn’t seen much action. I leave it in my car cos i like carrying 3” and under as my edc. Hoping to get the Demko ad20.5 when I can
I'll have an Aus-10 video coming out today.
@@Outpost_76 the best
I like 440C when done right, like Ganzo does, and BD-1 seems alright.
Id go D2 and 14C28N in 3rd and 2nd interchangeably depending on what my requirements are, edge retention or stain resistance. And i mean GOOD D2 not the garbage stuff.
Then id probably go AUS-10A although i dont have much experience with it. It seems solid though. And i would prefer 154CM but i just dont see enough variety in it in the budget class yet.
My top 5.
I agree with you completely about S35VN being a budget steel. I have never been that impressed with it. I have a few knives with that steel but I avoid buying anymore. I have always liked S30V much better. Great video.
Nice. Thanks.
Teo questions Pop up for me as Not top welk umformend Knife Fan:
S35VN is supposed to be an ever so slighty Upgrade in rust ressistance toS30V and is Hypes all over the Place behind lower M390/20CV Stufe in the Medium Production Segment. How come S30V isn‘t the oben to her more Budget?
Second: What‘s your opinion on Bohler N690 stell Series? Not too Popular but to find amongst Budget knives. It is not prominent except for Extrema Ratio as their Go to steel.
Thanks for the amazing Testing work
In my opinion the main reason S35VN showed up everywhere is the lower cost of manufacturing while still maintaining fairly solid performance in comparison to s30v. I don't have any personal experience of Nitro V but by all accounts it's in the same mix as the Sandvik steels and AEB-L.
100% easier to process but still performs well. I like s35vn better personally but s30v seems to hold an edge slightly better.
I think moving forward we are going to see S35VN become the new D2 of budget knives. It seems to show up more and more every month in the sub 80$ range.
New sup, I don’t have a ton of experience with D2, but I have an exclusive Kershaw in D2. It has not been used gently, really has held up well. It is my tool box knife. I also understand heat treat has a lot to do with blade steal.
Favorite hard use carry knife is Benchmade 550. I am looking to there custom shop to order a knife, what steel would you recommend for edge stability? I have S30v (have had edge rolling) and I have heard they really over cook the edge on M4.
What would the majority of use be on this new knife? That will help me give you a solid idea of what to go with.
As far as D2 goes I'll have a video up soon about wear resistance/edge retention and it will cover all the things not talked about when considering what steel will work for you. D2 and many others will be covered in the video.
Do cut a lot of tape and cardboard, but real issue is heavy hard plastic. Thanks for the reply. The rolling on the S30v is like a significant burr. That’s why I was looking at s90v or m4
Civivi 9cr18mov is my favorite budget steel
154 CM is one of my favorites almost regardless of price point. I just prefer a steel that doesn’t sacrifice toughness for edge retention..
It's a bottom tier stainless when it comes to toughness. Not surprising with its high, large carbide count and high degree of retained austenite which won't be processed out in production knives. Its positive portrayal is all down to marketing. Though it's marginally worse in edge retention, something like LC200N eats 154 for breakfast.
Heat treatment is everything… S35VN @ under 60-61 HRC (with CRYO before temper for low retained Austenite) behaves poorly… else, it is excellent steel & very tough, better than COM 154/CM154. Budget knives all too often mean “budget” Heat treatments. 14C28 is easier to Heat treat properly than S35VN, thus is more appropriate for budget knives (bang for the buck). 9Cr18MoV can be quite good: It is really within the 440-C range… BOHLER N-695@ 60-61 HRCis very much equivalent to CM 154: Cudeman does a wonderful job with that steel.
N690, Sandviks, vg10, 154cm, bd1n would be my choices for budget steels. 9cr18 is decent also and aus10a. Not sure if i consider any PM steels budget yet although some can definitely be found for a bargain nowadays.
We will definitely see more and more of them filter down to lower cost knives.
Personally wouldn't put S35VN or 154cm on a budget list. While you can find them, they are really not common budget steels. Without, mine would be.
1. 14C28/12C27
2. N690/VG-10
3. 440C
4. 1095
5. AUS-8
Especially the sandviks, 440C and AUS-8 are highly underrated. Those are all good steels. 440C and AUS-8 really depend on a decent HT tho. BD1N is also a good one but I don't really have enough experience with it to rank it.
That's a really good list!
@Strangely Brown I agree that AUS-10A is better but you rarely see that. We'll probably see more in the future tho. N690 is often overpriced but there are quite a few budget folders and VG-10 is almost the same and we have even more in VG-10. That is why I put them together. 440C is old but really performs well and likes to keep a good amount of bite at the edge. 1095 is basic yes but that is the beauty of it. Amazing to sharpen, perfect for the outdoors and edge retention is definitely enough for that purpose. I just like high carbon steels so there has to be one on my list. Also you are saying "this and that is too basic to make the list". My guy this stuff is purely based on personal experience and preferences and not on some data sheets.
Always interested. Thanks
You're welcome
OMG S35VN a budget steel 🤯, what about the CRKs 35? Fantastic info, thanks G👍😁
@Strangely Brown Thanks👌I was mainly asking about CRKs heat treatment and performance in comparison with "budget S35VN".
What you get from CRK and the older Demko stuff is far ahead of what you get from most S35VN. In use it's much better than even the well done production S30V. While I get the connection to S35VN with CRK I'd like to see another option like Cruwear as an alternative to the stainless.
@@Outpost_76 thanks G👍😁
I personally like 14c28n, aus10, then xhp at least it used to be cheap. They are the 3 I use the most. Besides 1095 and 5160 in my fixed blades. I did have 9cr18mov was a great knife till someone decided I didn't need it and they did. Lol
What do you call low budget?
Ganzo d2, buck 420hc, are budget to me. Also ontario aus 8
Everyone has a different meaning of budget, for me sub 100$ and even some over that are budget. Low budget would be sub 30$ and there are some good choices there.
I love 154CM but ive never really considered it a budget steel. But i guess youre right. It and S35VN is getting cheaper by the day.
What do you think of 10cr15comov? Thanks!
I have no opinion on it since I haven't used it.
What do you think about the 10cr civivi has on some new models I saw at blade show?
10Cr15MoV describes VG10, but not necessarily from Takefuku who trademarked VG10. My guess it is a Chinese analog
@@CKshouta I didn’t know that thanks for the info👍
I haven't used it. I have read and researched on it what I could a while back and as said above it's the Chinese version of VG-10. Do some searches and you'll find it's said to have a noticeable decrease in wear resistance compared to VG-10 in the cooking world. At some point I will test and use it to find out myself.
What about N690?
I haven't used it much so I didn't even consider it. It's just not a steel I've ever thought about picking up.
@@Outpost_76 N690 is the primary budget steel used by Kizer these days. I'd love to see it tested.
Thanks for your vids.
You're welcome
I bought some odd looking 9Cr18 skinning kit blades I turned into kickass oyster shuckers. The kit 9Cr blades are HT hard and hold an edge well.
14C28N isn't a "great budget" steel unless it is up around 62 Rc hard. Nitro V and 14C28N are nothing more than AEB-L/13C27 with .11% Nitrogen.
Unless 154CM is above RC 59 it really isn't any better than well treated 440C. Both steels are in the low toughness range. My filet knives in 440C hold an edge at 58 Rc with a distal taper just as well as 154CM at 58, why pay more for 154CM?
I have had no luck with 12C27, but as with all blade steels it depends on how it was treated. 14C28N has worked out well for me, especially real Twosun knives.
Older Morakniv 12C27 steel knives, had way better heat treatment than the new ones. There is n't many companies that make a good heat treatment on that steel. However Manly knives and many custom makers, realy know how to make that stee shine! It's actually a good quality steel, that takes a really sharp edge, (way sharper, than most stainless steels that I have tried). It also has really good toughness, way more than most stainless steels!
@@greekveteran2715 You are right, I forgot about the Morakniv I have. I don't go out in the wide open anymore but those knives (the older ones) top notch!
@@greekveteran2715 How does toughness compare between 12C27 and 14C28N?
@@chronovore3726 I'm going to find out and do a video about it so we can see if there is some factor that really separates the 2.
@@greekveteran2715 totally agree with you assessment. I'm a knife maker here in Australia and I really like using Sandvik steel....the heat treat recipe for 12c27, 14C28N and RWL34 is almost identical, with critical temp on the last 2 just a little higher! In my experience the main difference between 12c27 and 14C28N is I can get 14C28N one or sometimes 2 rockwell points higher. Typically I harden 12c27 to 60hrc or just above and 14C28N always comes in at 61hrc and I have frequently done it at 62hrc....depends on the application and the user. Tests have shown 14C28N to be a smidge tougher than 12c27 as well.....so what does this mean....it means I can safely take 14C28N a little harder without loss of toughness and that extra hardness translates to a bit better edge longevity. All very similar to NitroV which I have taken to 63hrc with very good results. So wrapping up....all 3 steels at 59 hrc will be very close in performance maybe even at 60 hrc....it's after that where you will see the differences. On a small thin belt knife give me rwl34....larger hard use knife 14C28N, NitroV and 14C28N at 62hrc....you would be hard pressed to tell the difference....in my experience!
No D2?
I agree 12C27 and 14C28N deserve to be on the list. Was there a particular reason you left VG10 off the list??
As VG-10 becomes available less outside of Japanese manufacturing I didn't put it on the list. I have nothing against it.
13c26 goes in there too?
@@leotam3372 i believe 13c26 is an analog of AEB-L
What do you think about Niolox G?
nothing in niolox is budget for some reason
I don't have enough experience with it to give an opinion.
Thank you both 👍
Is that Steve Factor Iconic a GM Biblio ... homage?
This was discontinued because it resembled the GM1 I belive, the Biblio wasn't out when this was released. I'm not sure what they were going for but it is a lot like a bigger Biblio.
No D2 ?! 😮
No d2?
D2's chemistry is fine, it's the carbide size that's the problem. Fortunately CPM D2 is a thing now.
@Strangely Brown tell that to ganzo
So many steels I'd take over D2 any day.
wait, no AUS8/ AUS10?
I strongly considered them both. I currently don't have any Aus-10 and Aus-8 was almost #5. It's still better than what I didn't include in my 5.
Buddy, you have the chunkiest fingers l have ever seen! It’s amazing how you haven’t seriously injured those extra large sausages yet?!
😂🎉
S35 and 154 favorite budget steels?
I mean S30v is budget...I gave up on cheap steel along time ago....
I like S30V more than S35VN.
I actually see a huge difference between 12c27 and 14c28n. 14c28n is a lot easier to get wicked sharp than 12c27. I've used both for years on swiss army knives and my kershaw leek. My leek's blade felt as sharp as shattered glass whenever I'd sharpen it and it would shave arm hair with just the weight of the knife. Just throw an American Kershaw in there and you would definitely tell the difference.
One of the other differences is that you get slightly better rust resistance with 14C28N.
Gerber is just overall a meh company their quality is just awful anymore