Did you know what the heat treat on that bar was? When this stuff gets up to 150 ksi yield is really gets hard to machine. 135 and below isn't nearly as bad.
I'm making a video with all the inconels to show the difference. 718.. A286.. 625.. k500.. 825..etc. I've machined all types and 718 double aged hardened is the daddy. Thanks for your comment. 👍
Has anyone suggested ultrasonic machining? In the 1960s during the Cold War we use ultrasonic machining in extremely sophisticated parts made out of Inconel alloys and titanium alloys inside an argon or helium atmosphere, but mostly in an argon atmosphere. Helium is too expensive but argon is 1% of the total volume of air and is heavier than helium and just as equally as inert as helium. Which means out every 100 cubic feet of air we can extract 1 cubic foot of argon. The use of nuclear power from the military power grid supplied by BREST and MBFSR reactors provides cheap electricity since these two reactors are self-regenerative and consumes their nuclear wastes as fuel and are made out of a zirconia-zirconium cermet fused material similar to your American amorphous glassy bulk metallic metals. Zirconium and zirconia are immune to neutron induced embrittlement and are used in overbuilt nuclear vessels and control rod channels and fuel channels and any components and parts exposed to nuclear radiation. Shielding is provided by a zirconia-zirconium-hafnium alloy. And these are all in the 1960s. Only our military reactors are built these way but not our civilian reactors. But with the Cold War over we have considered in the 1990s to use such materials in our new nuclear BREST and MBFSR power-thermal reactors to provide nuclear electricity and indirect double heat-exchanger heating through insulated pipes and using the waste heat to provide heating through the same indirect double heat-exchanger heating for the community whose families are responsible for these power plants. By the way I am referring to our nuclear complexes in Siberia. Despite the inexhaustible supplies of oil, gas, and coal from abiotic sources we prefer using nuclear power and reserve all inexhaustible hydrocarbon sources as petrochemical feedstocks for the petrochemical industries.
Good old Great British engineering! I found your channel after a shout out from Brian Block on his channel, I wish I’d found it sooner! Fascinating stuff, thanks for posting.
First time I had to turn Inconel, the boss didn't tell me how much it cost till I was done. He said he didn't want to make me nervous. I'm kinds glad he didn't.
Great work Dave! Thanks for sharing, really enjoyed your commentary. My math (71" / 0.003" feed / 34rpm) says that was over 11.5 hours of actual turning, not counting the machine work on the tool and all the carbide and cartridge swaps. Must have been quite an expensive hole!!!
Its how myself an Dave use to quote on jobs, speaking for myself I keep what I call a bible with speeds an feeds for alloys such as 718. I can trepan up to 20" so you can see why it helps,
You sir, are the living embodiment of the kind of stuff that put the Great into Britain. It will be a sad day when you are no longer applying your skill and experience to getting things done. Regards Mark in the UK
Not sure where your piece came from, but I spent forty plus years at the place where they made stuff like that. As I recollect, the MA materials (Mechanically Alloyed) were pretty darn tough too.
I think that it is a sad state of affairs in the UK when a engineer with such a advanced skill set could not survive as his own boss with no shortage of work
Greetings from the U.S, this is incredible work and this is coming for a business owner cutting only exotic material. what is the pad made off @ 1:10? what's your favorite grade for 718 and long does it last on this type of trepanning? Thx
Bought a chunk of 718 to try and machine a blast baffle for a form 1 suppressor, and was quite surprised at how relatively easy it was to machine. ~150-200 SFM and it machined just as easily as 17-4 stainless.
Would the chip evacuation gone any better if you had used say 2 or 3 carbides to cut, left corner, right corner and clean up the middle rather than going the full width of the core drill in one shot?
@@miguelcastaneda7236 CNC. Just a tiny Emco Compact 5 I converted myself. Spindle, Z, X and tailstock. I cut gears amongst other stuff hense Spindle axis. All servos. I like a quiet machine LOL.
@@userwl2850 I know a machinist who worked in Safran group and he machine all kind of duplex alloy and of course inconel 718. He use 0.5mm drill in it... I'm fine! thanks
That's a dam strong insert. I use Walter Inserts. I cut mainly cobalt chrome for medical implants. I'm running 6al-4v right now. It's alot softer then cobalt. Love this kinda stuff. Aweome job man.
Years ago I had to fabricate a small piece of heatshield from the pylon behind the jet engine on a 737. Inconel and only 0.050" thick. There was only about 20 holes in it at 3/16" diameter but I ended going through over 100 cobalt drills. Cxxt of a job.
i used to repair power plant gas turbines. the combustion chambers were made of inco. in those machines the inco gets heat treated with every work cycle. if you don´t shock or overheat it, it will ripe to a state of material performance grade that is way higher than the new stuff. that is the reason why those chambers get used and recycled as long as possible. i wonder what they are building with a cylinder of that lenght and material thickness made of inconel 718 ? something with a corrosive medium up to 1000bar at 900°C maybe ?
I wonder if you could find a "chip breaker" type of insert to help with chip control. Or even just grind some up yourself if you've got a tool and cutter grinder. Something like a roughing end mill(corn cob type). Nice work either way! I know the struggle is real! Stay safe and healthy in these uncertain times! Dan @6-4_Fab Glen Rock, PA USA
Wow, as a fabricator who also operates a Colchester lathe and Bridgeport Miller. Respect where it’s due. Can I ask how many hours that job took? Deepening the tools channels is enough of a job with the length of them and awkward clamp downs etc.
Im glad i never tuched inconel for now, but also sad if you get me... I like the challenge. but for that i would go to ceramic inserts/endmills. Great work, and thnx for sharing
"I'm quite nervous about this" My entire engineering life was a nervous disposition caused by machining tough alloys, the worst being aerospace grade stainless components for Rolls Royce jet engines.
I've done quite a bit of machining on 718, both milling and turning. It's tough stuff alright. You really have to stay on top of your insert condition. If you don't catch an insert failure right away (and you do chew through them) it will destroy the tooling. Hell, even just rough turning rod ends out of 718 would go through a set of corners in 4 parts vs 30 ish parts with stainless steel.
Can you maybe machine 2 extra angles at each of the side reliefs to 'widen' the gap so the scrap doesn't jam-up whilst being evacuated? The 718 bore radius and the reliefs eventually narrow towards the top and causes the chips to jam up.
A quick peek in the bore at the end would have been handy ,perhaps it didn't turn out up to your usual quality, but that job was worth a barrel of John Smiths.
Amazing once again..! Takes some determination along with everything else to go thru that piece! Have you had better luck with your insert cartridge supplier lately?
I’d love to know what makes this so difficult to machine. Any tech explanation most welcome. I’d also love to know the application for such a heavy walled nickel super alloy!
userwl2850 awesome!!!! I’m going nuts here in lockdown. Can’t wait! Postal service being rats slow doesn’t help. Bought first milling machine 6 weeks ago. Ordered er32 chuck and collects 4 weeks ago....still waiting. It’s times like these post can’t go slow.....need to stay sane in the garage machining stuff!!!!
Wow, great job. I cringe every time I use my ISCAR trepanning tools and I'm only going 1" deep. I have had the tool shear off from the material galling up on the insert to when the parting is done and the core gets bound and messes up the part and breaks the insert. I might have to make a set up like yours. I might have to core out 11" dia. X 27" long type 316L stainless bar with a hole of 7. 812. My lath is not very big. I wonder if I could get away with a smaller tool in wall thickness than yours. How did those Micarta bushing fair? Did you replace those often. If the wall finish was rough they would not last long I'm guessing.
Used to work with inconel all time, grey sandvic tips 0.002thou feed seemed to do trick, for trepanning, but when turning always used angle tip (45degrees 60degrees) as if. Straight tip failed would have a tendency to pull into. job.Gundrilling have to change drill ,ie bout every 6" and yes it's a tough material but also abrasive which does most of the damage to tip so as little stopping and starting as possible.
Has anyone suggested ultrasonic machining? In the 1960s during the Cold War we use ultrasonic machining in extremely sophisticated parts made out of Inconel alloys and titanium alloys inside an argon or helium atmosphere, but mostly in an argon atmosphere. Helium is too expensive but argon is 1% of the total volume of air and is heavier than helium and just as equally as inert as helium. Which means out every 100 cubic feet of air we can extract 1 cubic foot of argon. The use of nuclear power from the military power grid supplied by BREST and MBFSR reactors provides cheap electricity since these two reactors are self-regenerative and consumes their nuclear wastes as fuel and are made out of a zirconia-zirconium cermet fused material similar to your American amorphous glassy bulk metallic metals. Zirconium and zirconia are immune to neutron induced embrittlement and are used in overbuilt nuclear vessels and control rod channels and fuel channels and any components and parts exposed to nuclear radiation. Shielding is provided by a zirconia-zirconium-hafnium alloy. And these are all in the 1960s. Only our military reactors are built these way but not our civilian reactors. But with the Cold War over we have considered in the 1990s to use such materials in our new nuclear BREST and MBFSR power-thermal reactors to provide nuclear electricity and indirect double heat-exchanger heating through insulated pipes and using the waste heat to provide heating through the same indirect double heat-exchanger heating for the community whose families are responsible for these power plants. By the way I am referring to our nuclear complexes in Siberia. Despite the inexhaustible supplies of oil, gas, and coal from abiotic sources we prefer using nuclear power and reserve all inexhaustible hydrocarbon sources as petrochemical feedstocks for the petrochemical industries.
I can feel the force is strong with you. ..... I've no idea what you're talking about.. and if you do .... not copied from a txt.... you are Jedi knight.
@@userwl2850 I was involved in the precision machining of the mass production of cermet-based nuclear components and inconel-based vessels and cermet-based vessels for the experimental MBFSR reactors in the mid-1960s, I was 39 years old at that time of 1966. All experimental MBFSR reactors are all a success and then kept under tight wraps. The titanium is also equally trickier to deal with. Machining it with conventional machine tools inside an argon atmospheric chamber is so time consuming. The same can be said for all kinds of cermets-based materials, that includes that inconel. You have no idea of what I am talking about? I was referring to the 1960s Cold War era military machine tool technologies used by both of our countries' military establishments. In fact, in the civilian sector, it was demonstrated in a particular book of two metal strips being ultrasonically fused-welded between two ultrasonically vibrating high pressure pressing wheels as an experiment to demonstrate the true potential of ultrasonic energy to weld and machine metals. The BREST nuclear reactors which was developed both on paper and as a prototype was introduced to the American public and to the American government in the late 1990s. But your American government refused to participate in a joint venture in it when we said IT CAN ALSO CONSUME NUCLEAR WASTES AS IT'S FUEL AND CAN RECYCLE IT'S PLUTONIUM 239 NITRIDE FUEL RODS INDEFINITELY for it can produce new nuclear fuel with it's initial startup nuclear fuel of plutonium 239 nitride nuclear fuel rods. It seems your government in the late 1990s does not like it for it threatens it's multi-billion dollar profit making nuclear waste storage program as a money maker for it's nuclear military and nuclear power plant contractors. We also developed new stainless steel-based alloys immune to neutron bombardment induced neutron embrittlement. The problem of neutron embrittlement which was declassified and disclosed to the American public was made in the 1970s when the Pentagon had admitted that the stainless steel components of it's nuclear warheads made in the 1960s and late 1950s are starting to become brittle and that is the time they discovered the effects of neutron bombardment induced neutron embrittlement in the non-nuclear parts of their warheads and that of their nuclear reactor steel vessels. You have nothing to worry about your nuclear power reactors' nuclear vessels in your present day nuclear power plants which are made of stainless steel cladded carbon steels and USES ONLY FUEL GRADE URANUM 235 AT 2% TO 3% as opposed to the weapons grade uranium 235 at 99.99% content and that of plutonium 239 at 99.99% purity in your American nuclear warheads for their neutron emissions is far higher than that of your power reactors. Provided the nuclear reactor builders and their contractors and sub-contractors behave honestly in meeting the very strict safety requirements of your Atomic Energy Commission at that time.
@@userwl2850 By the way, I forgot to mention that my country has two power grids. The civilian power grid and the military power grid. Come nuclear war the civilian power grid will be heavily damaged but still repairable but the military power grid will remain unscathed and hardened against thermo-nuclear all out bombardment.
1020 sanvicks are good but on 718 but they are good to a point where they just give up with no warning. A slightly softer grade will get you at 53 revs an a 0.032 most of the way but a scraper is always a good thing to have on hand.
I think we must have had a split order as we did some exactly the same recently. I tend to use a very cheap Fake Lamina tip which costs under £4.00. They are not great on the softer stuff but EN24/26 an Alloy 625,718,925 they work well on the speeds an feeds I gave for a 9". If you are on Bacon lane you will find the company where they are from!!! Great stuff Dave I enjoy watching so keep it going an stay safe. Question do you know Pete Marshall from Eckington?
sir...would you please help me informing that what perameters you used and what were the values of that perameters ???? I am in a thesis of machining of Inconel 718 ....
Inconel 718 is just over 50% Nickel, about 20% chromium, about 20% iron, then the rest is niobium, molybdenum, titanium, and finally aluminum, in that order.
You probably know this, but inconel is usually used in hi temp situations. Jet engine hot section blades made from it are found in the turbines, and the X-15 aircraft was skinned in Inconel-X. I couldn't help wondering what you were making here?
Northern machinists best in the world served my time @ Nei parsons in Newcastle 25 year ago.3500 people worked there when I started in 87 place is car park now...all that skill and knowledge flushed down the pan place is car park now.well machine shop A and B are its called progress apparently.
I am wondering if the only consideration is hardness as the definition for the worst material to machine.I have seen some really soft stuff that was almost impossible to machine accurately for the geometry required..thanks for teh squeal of that hard stuff on the cutter makes me fell like the young machinist I once was...
@@userwl2850 Have you machined Nitronic 60? I just had my first job on it. Turning and boring went fine, but when drilling It needed careful re-engagement when peck-drilling (from the tailstock on a manual lathe) so as not to instantly workharden to the point where HSS twist drill behaved as if it was mild steel. I didn't want to resort to carbide in case it broke in the hole because I have no way to disintegrate it without enlarging the hole. I developed a method using the carriage to keep track of the progress of the drill point so I could manage the re-engagement (ie not smack into the end of the hole too hard, but be ready to feed firmly the moment it kissed). I had to use a carbide ball-nose cutter to recover the one time I mismanaged that re-engagement, but I took steps to ensure it would not get stuck down the hole. I found tapping small deep holes a bit challenging, as well, but my trusty SKF brand serial taps (kept for really tough materials) came up trumps yet again. I've had them for decades and never broken one (touch wood).
Here is a bit of trivia : The X-20 DYNASOAR prototype experimental space plane was built out of Inconel, Rhodium and Zirconium alloys. The X-20 was designed to be manually flown by a pilot, entering the Earths atmosphere at Mach-20. The nose cone, leading edges and other structural areas would have glowed bright orange and become translucent. Here is the progress report from 1961 ua-cam.com/video/drfcrl_vc8M/v-deo.html
By heck Dave - that's some challenge.... 'king huge! That workpiece must have cost a small fortune. Can see the problem with chip escape - darned things look like pre-made springs! The stresses on the insert and holder must be incredible... whole job must have taken many hours total - success must have earned at least 1 pint of John Smiths :)
Hi Chris.... all our boozere are shut.. no John Smith's for me 😭 thanks for watching my videos buddy. I always look forward to reading a comment from you. Stay safe buddy.
@@userwl2850 it's certainly tough stuff!, Mind you all those nimonic alloys developed at oak ridge are tough to machine! I believe they were developed for the highly corrosive applications in molten salt reactors and they tend to share that tendency to have extremely tenacious swarf and destroy tools! I found a heavy negative rake helped to get through the damn stuff!😂xx
big bore!! nice!! just imagine if this could be mold injected instead of friction cutting!!! they can 3D print stuff like this! yup! I'll shut my bore hole now!! good luck!!
Did you know what the heat treat on that bar was? When this stuff gets up to 150 ksi yield is really gets hard to machine. 135 and below isn't nearly as bad.
I'm making a video with all the inconels to show the difference. 718.. A286.. 625.. k500.. 825..etc. I've machined all types and 718 double aged hardened is the daddy. Thanks for your comment. 👍
@@userwl2850 Can you explain double age hardened in the video please.
718 is horrible to mill especially 3D milling
Has anyone suggested ultrasonic machining? In the 1960s during the Cold War we use ultrasonic machining in extremely sophisticated parts made out of Inconel alloys and titanium alloys inside an argon or helium atmosphere, but mostly in an argon atmosphere. Helium is too expensive but argon is 1% of the total volume of air and is heavier than helium and just as equally as inert as helium. Which means out every 100 cubic feet of air we can extract 1 cubic foot of argon.
The use of nuclear power from the military power grid supplied by BREST and MBFSR reactors provides cheap electricity since these two reactors are self-regenerative and consumes their nuclear wastes as fuel and are made out of a zirconia-zirconium cermet fused material similar to your American amorphous glassy bulk metallic metals.
Zirconium and zirconia are immune to neutron induced embrittlement and are used in overbuilt nuclear vessels and control rod channels and fuel channels and any components and parts exposed to nuclear radiation. Shielding is provided by a zirconia-zirconium-hafnium alloy. And these are all in the 1960s.
Only our military reactors are built these way but not our civilian reactors. But with the Cold War over we have considered in the 1990s to use such materials in our new nuclear BREST and MBFSR power-thermal reactors to provide nuclear electricity and indirect double heat-exchanger heating through insulated pipes and using the waste heat to provide heating through the same indirect double heat-exchanger heating for the community whose families are responsible for these power plants.
By the way I am referring to our nuclear complexes in Siberia. Despite the inexhaustible supplies of oil, gas, and coal from abiotic sources we prefer using nuclear power and reserve all inexhaustible hydrocarbon sources as petrochemical feedstocks for the petrochemical industries.
@@darthvader5300 Ultrasonic machining requires too much vodka.
With an another example of inco 718 machining , i can appreciate even more what Peter does over at EdgePrecision
Yes he's great. Very intelligent guy.
Good old Great British engineering! I found your channel after a shout out from Brian Block on his channel, I wish I’d found it sooner! Fascinating stuff, thanks for posting.
Thanks buddy 👍
I remember when this was first posted. I still find myself learning something each time I rewatch them. I hope you are well.
First time I had to turn Inconel, the boss didn't tell me how much it cost till I was done. He said he didn't want to make me nervous. I'm kinds glad he didn't.
Oh damn I expected it to be relatively cheap lol I’ll make sure to take that into account
Courage is all about overcoming fear. You sir are a courageous man.
Trepanning is as tough a job as slitting and I’ve always avoided both. In Inconel???? You are a god.
Great work Dave! Thanks for sharing, really enjoyed your commentary.
My math (71" / 0.003" feed / 34rpm) says that was over 11.5 hours of actual turning, not counting the machine work on the tool and all the carbide and cartridge swaps. Must have been quite an expensive hole!!!
Hi Dave. You are bang on with the running time. 👏🏻👍
oh , shit i made that calc aswell , didn't realise someone else did it too :D
Its how myself an Dave use to quote on jobs, speaking for myself I keep what I call a bible with speeds an feeds for alloys such as 718. I can trepan up to 20" so you can see why it helps,
There was a lot of Inconel 718 machining, welding, and heat treat on the SSMEs at Rocketdyne in the 1980s!
Somebody mentioned you over on an Abom79 video and I came to check out your channel. AMAZING! I'm subscribing.
Thanks buddy. Hope you find something you find interesting.
You sir, are the living embodiment of the kind of stuff that put the Great into Britain.
It will be a sad day when you are no longer applying your skill and experience to getting things done.
Regards Mark in the UK
Cheers Mark. That's a very nice comment. Not sure I deserve that but thanks buddy.
Hard earned and well deserved I'd say.
That was amazing as always. You do work that a home hobbyist can only dream of.
I think you mean most professional machine shops can only dream of.
Chris is closer 🤣 it's amazing metal.
Amazing job Dave . A tough one for sure . Cheers .
You are a very patient man ..... beautiful work, sir. I love watching, and learning. Thanks for sharing.
Thanks for the nice comment 👍
WOW,well done sir.a good machinist is worth their weight in gold.keep up the good work!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Not sure where your piece came from, but I spent forty plus years at the place where they made stuff like that. As I recollect, the MA materials (Mechanically Alloyed) were pretty darn tough too.
Greeting from india. This year we saved Like 10 tons of raw materials applying your work process. Thanks and regards .
What company are you , that's great to hear
@@karthimechify we are manufacturing hydraulic cylinders.
I visited two guys in Bradford who use spark erosion machines to shape Inconel. The fit and finish they achieve is unbelievable
I think that it is a sad state of affairs in the UK when a engineer with such a advanced skill set could not survive as his own boss with no shortage of work
Yea Gary it's been hard. The brexit crap killed us. 😠
Greetings from the U.S, this is incredible work and this is coming for a business owner cutting only exotic material.
what is the pad made off @ 1:10? what's your favorite grade for 718 and long does it last on this type of trepanning?
Thx
So when you change a worn insert does it scrape the previous bore going back into the bore with the new insert?
You never give up and always solve the problem. What a great positive attitude you have.
👍👍👍👍👍👍🍻
If it can be done.... it will be done. 😎
Bought a chunk of 718 to try and machine a blast baffle for a form 1 suppressor, and was quite surprised at how relatively easy it was to machine. ~150-200 SFM and it machined just as easily as 17-4 stainless.
pssst, you got scammed and didn't actually get 718.
@@crimpers5543 lol definitely not 😂 bought it on McMaster...
Would the chip evacuation gone any better if you had used say 2 or 3 carbides to cut, left corner, right corner and clean up the middle rather than going the full width of the core drill in one shot?
Wow, you sure do go through a lot of inserts. Mine last forever.
Oh did I mention that mostly make gears out of Acetal. LOL.
🤣😁 try slowing it down 😉
@@userwl2850 Mate, I'm an old fart. Any slower and my machines would be going backwards :P
are you manual machine or cnc
@@miguelcastaneda7236 CNC. Just a tiny Emco Compact 5 I converted myself. Spindle, Z, X and tailstock. I cut gears amongst other stuff hense Spindle axis. All servos. I like a quiet machine LOL.
Wow fantastic that was thanks for taking the time to post
Really tough this 718. Really nice work 👍
Hi buddy. It's incredibly difficult to machine. Everything else is child's play. Hope you are well.
@@userwl2850 I know a machinist who worked in Safran group and he machine all kind of duplex alloy and of course inconel 718. He use 0.5mm drill in it...
I'm fine! thanks
That's a dam strong insert. I use Walter Inserts. I cut mainly cobalt chrome for medical implants. I'm running 6al-4v right now. It's alot softer then cobalt. Love this kinda stuff. Aweome job man.
Cheers Kenny 🍺
Years ago I had to fabricate a small piece of heatshield from the pylon behind the jet engine on a 737. Inconel and only 0.050" thick. There was only about 20 holes in it at 3/16" diameter but I ended going through over 100 cobalt drills. Cxxt of a job.
Bro this I what a true machinist LOVES THE CHALLENGE of machining difficult jobs great 👍🏾 job faceing it head on NEVER WALK AWAY LISTEN FOR TOOL WEAR
That Huron milling machine is really convenient as a support table for the magnificent Bridgeport :) great quote Dave
🤣🖐
@@userwl2850 I`ve got a Huron KU4 really useful & with some proper HP. It came with a quill attatchment but only a 2 axis DRO.
i used to repair power plant gas turbines. the combustion chambers were made of inco. in those machines the inco gets heat treated with every work cycle. if you don´t shock or overheat it, it will ripe to a state of material performance grade that is way higher than the new stuff. that is the reason why those chambers get used and recycled as long as possible. i wonder what they are building with a cylinder of that lenght and material thickness made of inconel 718 ? something with a corrosive medium up to 1000bar at 900°C maybe ?
I think you are the guy for the situation to work on that kind of Rock Metal.....
Best regards
I wonder if you could find a "chip breaker" type of insert to help with chip control. Or even just grind some up yourself if you've got a tool and cutter grinder. Something like a roughing end mill(corn cob type). Nice work either way! I know the struggle is real! Stay safe and healthy in these uncertain times! Dan @6-4_Fab Glen Rock, PA USA
No need this chips really well. 👍
Wow, as a fabricator who also operates a Colchester lathe and Bridgeport Miller. Respect where it’s due. Can I ask how many hours that job took? Deepening the tools channels is enough of a job with the length of them and awkward clamp downs etc.
Have you tried machining mercury?
I would if NASA got me there 🤣😎
Just curious if the broken cartridges oversized the bore?
Regards
This is a rough bore only. 10mm left for finish bore. Yes sometimes they can cut big.
Im glad i never tuched inconel for now, but also sad if you get me... I like the challenge. but for that i would go to ceramic inserts/endmills. Great work, and thnx for sharing
You couldn't do this with ceramics.. it would literally melt the tool. 😲
"I'm quite nervous about this"
My entire engineering life was a nervous disposition caused by machining tough alloys, the worst being aerospace grade stainless components for Rolls Royce jet engines.
Impresionante trabajo USERW. Haz de tener una alberca pará el soluble. I follow all yours vídeos . saludos León México.
I've done quite a bit of machining on 718, both milling and turning. It's tough stuff alright. You really have to stay on top of your insert condition. If you don't catch an insert failure right away (and you do chew through them) it will destroy the tooling. Hell, even just rough turning rod ends out of 718 would go through a set of corners in 4 parts vs 30 ish parts with stainless steel.
Can you maybe machine 2 extra angles at each of the side reliefs to 'widen' the gap so the scrap doesn't jam-up whilst being evacuated?
The 718 bore radius and the reliefs eventually narrow towards the top and causes the chips to jam up.
Yes I do that already. Works great for the first 20mm
That is a shit ton of high end suppressor baffles right there.
A quick peek in the bore at the end would have been handy ,perhaps it didn't turn out up to your usual quality, but that job was worth a barrel of John Smiths.
Hi Chris. This was just a rough bore leaving 5mm for a finish cut.
Great video Dave. Thanks for taking trouble to video whilst struggling through it ....... UBER TURNER 👍👍🤙
Thanks buddy. I just hope my videos help and educate others on difficult jobs. 👍
Amazing once again..! Takes some determination along with everything else to go thru that piece! Have you had better luck with your insert cartridge supplier lately?
Yes. I had some arrive yesterday. They took 12 days to get here. They are 100% now.
Outstanding job David....
Incredible Dave, hope they stood you a pint of JS for that.
Would've been nice but all the boozere are shut 😷
A Super Alloy
What Is That Piece For Earthling
Bless Up
I’d love to know what makes this so difficult to machine. Any tech explanation most welcome. I’d also love to know the application for such a heavy walled nickel super alloy!
Inco is perpetually work hardening so you can almost never get "under" the hard crust.
Hi Mike. Oil rigs
userwl2850 awesome. Thanks for the reply. I wonder if it’s on their drill strings down hole or on surface. Very cool!
@@mikewasowski1411 I have another video in 2 hours today. Maybe you'll find it interesting.
userwl2850 awesome!!!! I’m going nuts here in lockdown. Can’t wait! Postal service being rats slow doesn’t help. Bought first milling machine 6 weeks ago. Ordered er32 chuck and collects 4 weeks ago....still waiting. It’s times like these post can’t go slow.....need to stay sane in the garage machining stuff!!!!
718 - the alloy you hate! There's a good reason why it's known as "nomachinium"!!
Everything is possible Richard 🖐
Wow, great job. I cringe every time I use my ISCAR trepanning tools and I'm only going 1" deep. I have had the tool shear off from the material galling up on the insert to when the parting is done and the core gets bound and messes up the part and breaks the insert. I might have to make a set up like yours. I might have to core out 11" dia. X 27" long type 316L stainless bar with a hole of 7. 812. My lath is not very big. I wonder if I could get away with a smaller tool in wall thickness than yours. How did those Micarta bushing fair? Did you replace those often. If the wall finish was rough they would not last long I'm guessing.
Nice work, you sure earned your pay on that job!
Cheers Bill 🍺
Used to work with inconel all time, grey sandvic tips 0.002thou feed seemed to do trick, for trepanning, but when turning always used angle tip (45degrees 60degrees) as if. Straight tip failed would have a tendency to pull into. job.Gundrilling
have to change drill ,ie bout every 6" and yes it's a tough material but also abrasive which does most of the damage to tip so as little stopping and starting as possible.
Has anyone suggested ultrasonic machining? In the 1960s during the Cold War we use ultrasonic machining in extremely sophisticated parts made out of Inconel alloys and titanium alloys inside an argon or helium atmosphere, but mostly in an argon atmosphere. Helium is too expensive but argon is 1% of the total volume of air and is heavier than helium and just as equally as inert as helium. Which means out every 100 cubic feet of air we can extract 1 cubic foot of argon.
The use of nuclear power from the military power grid supplied by BREST and MBFSR reactors provides cheap electricity since these two reactors are self-regenerative and consumes their nuclear wastes as fuel and are made out of a zirconia-zirconium cermet fused material similar to your American amorphous glassy bulk metallic metals.
Zirconium and zirconia are immune to neutron induced embrittlement and are used in overbuilt nuclear vessels and control rod channels and fuel channels and any components and parts exposed to nuclear radiation. Shielding is provided by a zirconia-zirconium-hafnium alloy. And these are all in the 1960s.
Only our military reactors are built these way but not our civilian reactors. But with the Cold War over we have considered in the 1990s to use such materials in our new nuclear BREST and MBFSR power-thermal reactors to provide nuclear electricity and indirect double heat-exchanger heating through insulated pipes and using the waste heat to provide heating through the same indirect double heat-exchanger heating for the community whose families are responsible for these power plants.
By the way I am referring to our nuclear complexes in Siberia. Despite the inexhaustible supplies of oil, gas, and coal from abiotic sources we prefer using nuclear power and reserve all inexhaustible hydrocarbon sources as petrochemical feedstocks for the petrochemical industries.
I can feel the force is strong with you. ..... I've no idea what you're talking about.. and if you do .... not copied from a txt.... you are Jedi knight.
@@userwl2850 I was involved in the precision machining of the mass production of cermet-based nuclear components and inconel-based vessels and cermet-based vessels for the experimental MBFSR reactors in the mid-1960s, I was 39 years old at that time of 1966. All experimental MBFSR reactors are all a success and then kept under tight wraps.
The titanium is also equally trickier to deal with. Machining it with conventional machine tools inside an argon atmospheric chamber is so time consuming. The same can be said for all kinds of cermets-based materials, that includes that inconel. You have no idea of what I am talking about? I was referring to the 1960s Cold War era military machine tool technologies used by both of our countries' military establishments. In fact, in the civilian sector, it was demonstrated in a particular book of two metal strips being ultrasonically fused-welded between two ultrasonically vibrating high pressure pressing wheels as an experiment to demonstrate the true potential of ultrasonic energy to weld and machine metals.
The BREST nuclear reactors which was developed both on paper and as a prototype was introduced to the American public and to the American government in the late 1990s. But your American government refused to participate in a joint venture in it when we said IT CAN ALSO CONSUME NUCLEAR WASTES AS IT'S FUEL AND CAN RECYCLE IT'S PLUTONIUM 239 NITRIDE FUEL RODS INDEFINITELY for it can produce new nuclear fuel with it's initial startup nuclear fuel of plutonium 239 nitride nuclear fuel rods.
It seems your government in the late 1990s does not like it for it threatens it's multi-billion dollar profit making nuclear waste storage program as a money maker for it's nuclear military and nuclear power plant contractors.
We also developed new stainless steel-based alloys immune to neutron bombardment induced neutron embrittlement. The problem of neutron embrittlement which was declassified and disclosed to the American public was made in the 1970s when the Pentagon had admitted that the stainless steel components of it's nuclear warheads made in the 1960s and late 1950s are starting to become brittle and that is the time they discovered the effects of neutron bombardment induced neutron embrittlement in the non-nuclear parts of their warheads and that of their nuclear reactor steel vessels.
You have nothing to worry about your nuclear power reactors' nuclear vessels in your present day nuclear power plants which are made of stainless steel cladded carbon steels and USES ONLY FUEL GRADE URANUM 235 AT 2% TO 3% as opposed to the weapons grade uranium 235 at 99.99% content and that of plutonium 239 at 99.99% purity in your American nuclear warheads for their neutron emissions is far higher than that of your power reactors.
Provided the nuclear reactor builders and their contractors and sub-contractors behave honestly in meeting the very strict safety requirements of your Atomic Energy Commission at that time.
@@userwl2850 By the way, I forgot to mention that my country has two power grids. The civilian power grid and the military power grid. Come nuclear war the civilian power grid will be heavily damaged but still repairable but the military power grid will remain unscathed and hardened against thermo-nuclear all out bombardment.
By far one of the easiest metals to weld.
Is that a joke or are you serious? Genuine question, I know very little about working with metal but this stuff is interesting to me
Yes I'm very serious.
1020 sanvicks are good but on 718 but they are good to a point where they just give up with no warning. A slightly softer grade will get you at 53 revs an a 0.032 most of the way but a scraper is always a good thing to have on hand.
53 revs on that size cut would last 30 seconds
I think we must have had a split order as we did some exactly the same recently. I tend to use a very cheap Fake Lamina tip which costs under £4.00. They are not great on the softer stuff but EN24/26 an Alloy 625,718,925 they work well on the speeds an feeds I gave for a 9". If you are on Bacon lane you will find the company where they are from!!! Great stuff Dave I enjoy watching so keep it going an stay safe. Question do you know Pete Marshall from Eckington?
sir...would you please help me informing that what perameters you used and what were the values of that perameters ???? I am in a thesis of machining of Inconel 718 ....
what is the make up of the " INCONEL " 70 -30 ?
Inconel 718 is just over 50% Nickel, about 20% chromium, about 20% iron, then the rest is niobium, molybdenum, titanium, and finally aluminum, in that order.
Great stuff Dave, have you ever lost any tips down the hole? I mean have them embed themselves in the surface?
Hi Neil. Yes sure that happens regularly. 😲
@@userwl2850 Then what do you do?
@@markfryer9880 he probably says a lot of choice words.
You probably know this, but inconel is usually used in hi temp situations. Jet engine hot section blades made from it are found in the turbines, and the X-15 aircraft was skinned in Inconel-X. I couldn't help wondering what you were making here?
well done Dave, very chatty today keep em coming and stay
safe
Thanks Kevin. I appreciate that. 👍
I made some Inconel spacer rings with a step on the outside to fit into something . It took me 2-3 hrs to make 3 pcs. 12" dia . 3/4" wide .
Then you know there's no rushing this stuff. Cheers Lance. 🍺
Same job for 40 yrs plus , on this and worse so called exotic alloys at RR , don’t miss it one bit except when I’m in the shit at home 😁
Have you ever worked with Inconel 713C?
That is realy tough too. 😄
It is also one of the most difficult to tig weld!
to choose a CCMT insert.
control the chip to move out easily.
Hi David. Nice work getting through this job! Have you ever worked with Duplex or Super Duplex? I’m curious how they compare to 718.
F51 AND F55 is easy to cut but doesn't chip well.
@@userwl2850 Thank you for the reply David!
Northern machinists best in the world served my time @ Nei parsons in Newcastle 25 year ago.3500 people worked there when I started in 87 place is car park now...all that skill and knowledge flushed down the pan place is car park now.well machine shop A and B are its called progress apparently.
I am wondering if the only consideration is hardness as the definition for the worst material to machine.I have seen some really soft stuff that was almost impossible to machine accurately for the geometry required..thanks for teh squeal of that hard stuff on the cutter makes me fell like the young machinist I once was...
Recently machined some Inconel 718 150KSI, which is even tougher than normal 718. Shure to say, it took some time...
Double aged hardened is the hardest 718... got a video soon comparing all inconel.
@@userwl2850 Have you machined Nitronic 60? I just had my first job on it. Turning and boring went fine, but when drilling It needed careful re-engagement when peck-drilling (from the tailstock on a manual lathe) so as not to instantly workharden to the point where HSS twist drill behaved as if it was mild steel. I didn't want to resort to carbide in case it broke in the hole because I have no way to disintegrate it without enlarging the hole. I developed a method using the carriage to keep track of the progress of the drill point so I could manage the re-engagement (ie not smack into the end of the hole too hard, but be ready to feed firmly the moment it kissed). I had to use a carbide ball-nose cutter to recover the one time I mismanaged that re-engagement, but I took steps to ensure it would not get stuck down the hole.
I found tapping small deep holes a bit challenging, as well, but my trusty SKF brand serial taps (kept for really tough materials) came up trumps yet again. I've had them for decades and never broken one (touch wood).
I have some experience with lathe, 9Y. And I want to work with you.
Y love too much machining ❤️🌋
Please, don't jump this comment 🥺
The Huron mill i use at work is great for heavy work but is limited without a quill, we have a Tos instead of a Bridgeport and is useless
Huron I used had a bolt on quill attachment. Bridge port on steroids. Best manual mill I ever ran.
I really find your videos very helpful and entertaining.
But some times its hard to hear you when you are talking. 👍
I try to speak but the noise from the machine gets loud. 😣
Here is a bit of trivia : The X-20 DYNASOAR prototype experimental space plane was built out of Inconel, Rhodium and Zirconium alloys. The X-20 was designed to be manually flown by a pilot, entering the Earths atmosphere at Mach-20. The nose cone, leading edges and other structural areas would have glowed bright orange and become translucent.
Here is the progress report from 1961
ua-cam.com/video/drfcrl_vc8M/v-deo.html
I remember drawing I600 wire. Shit was nasty on dies, even ate diamond up.
That's just plain impressive ! inconel and all the other HSTR metals are the work of the devil designed to make you go grey .
🤣 you got that right 👍
Happy Easter Dave.
No rest for me. I'm at work now bank holiday Monday. Another video today.
Ohhhh man u r great work
O que e aquela pecinha q ele prende no meio em cima
No PCD inserts?
Great video. I had a hard time hearing you talk about that carbide. What grade?
SANDVIK 1020 grade. It's brilliant. 💪
By heck Dave - that's some challenge.... 'king huge! That workpiece must have cost a small fortune.
Can see the problem with chip escape - darned things look like pre-made springs!
The stresses on the insert and holder must be incredible... whole job must have taken many hours total - success must have earned at least 1 pint of John Smiths :)
Hi Chris.... all our boozere are shut.. no John Smith's for me 😭 thanks for watching my videos buddy. I always look forward to reading a comment from you. Stay safe buddy.
Harder than a hotel heart .. love y9ur work
You keep the core or the client? That's some $$$ there
That core has a value of £12k the customer wanted it back for some reason 😂🖐
@@userwl2850 you'd be surprised what our large clients don't want back.
I'd suggest that Hastelloy B2 is more difficult😊xx
No... I've done it. 718 double aged hardened.
@@userwl2850 it's certainly tough stuff!, Mind you all those nimonic alloys developed at oak ridge are tough to machine! I believe they were developed for the highly corrosive applications in molten salt reactors and they tend to share that tendency to have extremely tenacious swarf and destroy tools! I found a heavy negative rake helped to get through the damn stuff!😂xx
Thats a lot of expensive carbide worn out to do that, but alot of Inconel scrap swarf generated as well.
About £300 in tools and carbide. 718 scrap is $6 kg.
And all the tungsten alloys yell in unison "Hold my beer!!!"
Are inconel as tough as titanium?
Thanks for video
awesome! i wanna be just like you!! thanks Dave.
What 7 kids with different mothers? Don't do it 😲🤣
@@userwl2850 Gawd I hope you're pulling my leg cause that sounds like way too much hard work!!!Lol.
@@craigwalker3256 fun making them though 😉
@@craigwalker3256 New video In 2 hours time.
Awesome, this is what aboms channel used to be like
Thanks. I'll take that as a compliment. 👍
I'll take that worthless scrap core off your hands if no one else laid claim yet :)
The core is worth $7000... get in queue behind me 🤣
David Wilks £3,500? Damn ! That’s a bit of money
David Wilks is this steel or aluminium?
@@pacificcoastpiper3949 inconel its a nickle alloy
keith deraux man it must be pretty damn tough
Wow that’s a tough to cut thanks for the vidio
Is that really 10 inches per hour? Wow if true!
I use to machine that material on a daily basis. Yes, it is hard on tips, and is somewhat difficult to machine.
Is this at your new job?
Yes it's at the place I'm working. I still have my place too.
big bore!! nice!! just imagine if this could be mold injected instead of friction cutting!!! they can 3D print stuff like this! yup! I'll shut my bore hole now!! good luck!!
I'm guessing that bars weight in just over 2000lbs
Not Sure? 🤔👍
That is some bloody big stock.
Wowee
I hear someone talking in the background,
but I can't quite make out what they're saying.
Worked on this metal 30 years ago it was a R.R. job and all I had to do was drill and tap 6 125 dia unf blind holes nightmare job took all day