Sonic Frontiers is built off of Sonic Forces, which is built off of Sonic Lost World. In Sonic Lost World there were no traditional Sonic physics, and Sonic had a run button. He could start and stop on a dime, instantly. This is why Sonic feels off in Forces and almost worse in Frontiers, because they modified Lost World and sorta "reverse engineered" it to play similar to Unleashed/Generations.
More like they made Hedgehog Engine 2 and ported over Lost World’s movement code and some of its assets. They retooled the physics to feel more like The Boost Trilogy but more clunky with no hop or drift.
no this game is definitely bulit like that too, the homing attack feels like trash cause its so slow so it makes it feel like your input is delayed cause it inputs way earlier than it needs to
Godddddd it is the absolute worst. Speedrunning through Cyberspace stages is frustrating as all hell because you’re so often taken out of that fluid trance by having to do that “1… 2… 3… 4…” homing attack chain. It DOES make SKIPPING homing attack chains with a well-aimed air boost more satisfying to pull off, but that’s only because you’re actively going out of your way to avoid engaging in a fundamental part of Sonic’s moveset, which feels like a blatant mistake to me. Given that Shadow in Sonic x Shadow Generations is built on the Frontiers engine and based on a couple shots in the newest trailer, it looks like even he has this annoying buffer after homing attacks. So. Needlessly. Bad.
@HS-mn6jc dude i really couldnt agree more it looks like they increased the speed a bit for shadow but i dont know why they cant just make it just like modern sonics. dont fix what aint broke
i’ll be real none of that stopped me from enjoying myself while s ranking the cyber space levels, never got tired of trying again when a level gave me trouble especially when i’m listening to that awesome ost
Well do you want your ps5 or xbox oe whatever your playing it on blowing up, no they really had to slow him down so you can see what you're doing sonic games are based on reflexes. Obviously we don't have the super reflexes sonic has so yeah deal wit it or make a mod
@@Datboi_Carlos7sonic unleashed sonic moves a lot faster then frontiers and that was a 360 and PS3 game if my console blew up then that’s an optimization problem
@Omixity facts. Sonic is sooooo slow in cyber space but luckily not in the open zone. But his momentum kinda sucks. I still love the game but there are still many flaws with speed and momentum. You shouldn’t have to edit your momentum in settings for one. And I’ll give one example of how the momentum sucks. If I hit a spring or dash pad and I don’t boost or am not boosting, I lose all of my momentum from the spring or dash pad and sometimes go to a complete stop. Leaving me to build all that momentum again. Or just boost and get it almost instantly
The excuse that it’s because of Sonic’s memories or whatever fucking sucks when both Mania and Generations reused levels in a much more refined and fantastic way. Copy and paste stages with worse physics, who the fuck is gonna justify that?
It’s especially silly when Generations also did the whole Sonic’s memories ordeal while combining it organically with time travel. The Time Eater was not only erasing Sonic’s past but also his memories. Sonic and Tails didn’t even remember Green Hill and Chemical Plant and assumed it was just “deja vu”
I guess not being a serious sonic fan helped because I enjoyed the game very much. I never felt that he went to slow and whenever it did slow down it was usually because of things I was doing wrong, not the other way around. Maybe the video was made before the updates, but the any sense of slow pacing is absolutely destroyed by the spindash, which only makes the game more fun.
I feel like cyberspace can work as a concept, if you give them WAY more time to work on it, and have someone who knows how to make a good 3D sonic level. Here's a thing, I worked on a concept game inspired by Sonic Frontiers, "La Ligne Rouge: La mélancolie des Orchestres", a little story about a wolf girl fighting a powerful rogue AI on a set of islands, where you'll get to fight a variety of ancient machines. And in said game, you have what's called "Echoes", special levels that take place inside a sort of simulation, creating levels based on the past of the ancient civilization of the story.... That's the first twist compared to Frontiers, instead of relying on the main character memories, I use the Ancient's past to create levels, and give some hints at what happened to them. Second twist, spectacle. At some points in the levels, the main antagonist of the story will appear to act as an obstacle, a set piece, or as a mini boss. That way you get more interactions with the main antagonist (unlike Frontiers), and you also get that question of "What is it gonna do this time ?". That's my take on the Cyberspace concept.
The clunkiness of cyberspace could’ve been resolved if you were able to take the gameplay adjustments from the open zone into the levels and to an extent I can understand why Sega didn’t do that as they wanted it to be fair so people weren’t getting faster times compared to others purely due to their settings but it would’ve at least been more fun
But that happens anyways because of the sliders, and the fact that you can enable the power boost in cyberspace. Also, the spindash exists, so that makes everything I just said not worth jack.😅
For me, it depends, the original levels built around it are so much fun, one of the most fun stages I've ever played in a Sonic game, especially since Frontiers keep 2D stages completly 2D and 3D stages completly 3D, so my favorite stages 4-2 and 4-4 are totally 3D, original in level design, original in aesthetic since both use Eternal Highway theme And the same kinda applies to the Final Horizon Stages, there are some great stuff in there For the returning stages, desfinetly the original stages are more fun, but I wouldn't say Frontiers ones are bad, at least not for me, I find them quite fun to play Actually, there are some parts in Frontiers whogets even better than Unleashed and Gens, while the regular part of the stages are a downgrade with the slower physics and more "precise" gameplay it takes away the fun, however, in the precise plataforming parts that were originally in Unleashed and Gens that DEFINETLY did not work for those games feel better to play here imho I don't think the Frontiers ones are substitutes of course, the originals are still the better pick, but for Frontiers, I think it worked... would be better if the next games did more stages simillar to 4-4, or even if the gameplay changes make new levels to acomodate that gameplay, and for sure keeping it original instead of just copying and pasting past levels, especially if they weren't made for the gameplay you're working with
Eh, the precise platforming segments worked perfectly fine in both Unleashed and Generations, better than they do in Frontiers. The lack of speed and momentum in Frontiers takes away most challenge those stages posed, and just leaves them shallow and uninteresting.
@@snakey888 I would have to disagree, Unleashed Extra Stages and Generations regular stages for some reason really insisted in precise plataforming which never worked for the boost gameplay and the insane speeds of it Trying to be precise in those 2 games like trying to land and stay in small plataforms, trying to fit Sonic into a tiny gap beetween traps, etc. Those things can be really frustrating, and it was a much better experience with Frontiers than the other 2 games for me tbh
@@LuucasIckie It seems the issue is the boost gameplay. If you don't boost, (can be done by releasing the boost button), then you won't be going at insane speeds anymore, but instead you'll be moving at a slower speed, then precision platforming is a breeze, and feels better than any other 3d Sonic game.
@@snakey888 boosting is not the issue in those cases, having to deal with Sonic's slow and not instant decelearation can make pretty hard to stand in small plataforms, and sometimes the games expect you to boost in-beetween traps The Boost gameplay in Unleashed and Generations just doesn't feel like it suits precise plataforming like something such as the Adventure gameplay does since even when not boosting Sonic still is too fast for that, the Boost gameplay in Unleashed and Gens feels like it suits more fast reaction time and imputs, but it instead relies on both precise plataforming and fast reactions In Frontiers I actually feel like I have more control and precision, it feels more comfortable to play those sections
@@LuucasIckie Instant deceleration is honestly one of the worst things to happen to the series, it just makes movement and platforming so awkward and unnatural. Not to mention it effectively removes any notion of momentum, a key staple of Sonic. So can't really agree that platforming is better in either the sa games or Frontiers, the former is just way too floaty, and lack of momentum makes the latter too awkward. Also, what in-between traps that the game supposedly expects you to boost are you referring to?
It’s such a night and day experience from the overworld and the levels. It’s the only thing that actually hurts the game. I hope they improve it in the sequel
It's really not. It suffers from poor physics, lack of momentum, tedious combat, dull graphics, mind-numbing missions, re-cycled level design and just isn't very enjoyable. The boss fight music is fairly good though.
@@snakey888I continued playing after the updates and honestly most of these problems were fixed. The reused missions would be a problem but it's not like the red rings are in the same locations or anything. They're all different levels so I don't see how consistent tasks is a downer
@@Simp4Gwyn The level design if almost copy pasted, the red ring locations don't change that. And to be fair, the updates barely addressed most of the issues, much less fixed them.
@@snakey888 Yeah Sonic Team actually did a pretty good job retroactively fixing the game's problems. Which is more than I can say for games like Forces.😅
I disagree, if the boost did what the spin dash does from the start, the entire game would break. The point of the spindash is to be a reward for mastering the game with the tools you had. What you get is the chance for new movement that fundamentally alters how you see the over world as well as cyberspace
@@Simp4Gwyn yeah you got a point. I was thinking more in terms of speed (going down hill and carrying forward momentum), not the height. I probably shouldn’t have said physics, really left a lot open to interpretation.
Sonic Team has always struggled with the fine details of gameplay, specifically optimization and controls. Unleashed Day and Generations Modern stages only feel good because they use the Havok Physics engine, and Sonic Frontiers was not. There’s a similar reason why Superstars is the first “classic sonic” game Sonic Team has made that has physics accurate to the Genesis era; they bought the engine from Christian Whitehead, who made the entire thing from scratch by himself. Sonic Team has not succeeded in making a realistic (and not buggy as hell, see Sonic 06) physics engine from scratch since Sonic 1 For evidence that they can’t optimize, see just about any port (except possibly SA2B on Gamecube) they have ever made, especially SADX and Colors Ultimate. Even Unleashed, at almost 17 years old, is only NOW able to run a consistent 60 fps through emulation and Xbox Series X backwards compatibility
so the ported levels were great, but what was lazy was Sky Rail having the wrong theme and so on like i think it looked like Green Hill or Radical Highway section looking like generic city
You’re still reusing levels. It don’t matter if you give a story reason. Heck, the story reason in Frontiers of “memories” is too close to Generations which did the same thing but also involved time travel.
@Butwhythough881 yes that’s exactly how I felt it feels like when you reuse the same layouts and levels for 20 years they start to feel less like a callback and more like method of cutting corners
@@garsrandom4358they could've went with any other idea like maybe cyberspace are the memories of the ancients and you play on their home planet learning about how life was there but no they instead say it's Sonic's memories to justify re-using assets from Generations. Again.
There's a sincere lack of smoothness in Sonics movements in and out of cyberspace. Sadly cyberspace just makes it more apparent. Completing every stage has made it impossible for me to return to the game regretfully.
The original Cyberspace levels are really fun tho because the phisics actually work, and i guess the Adventure ones too since Sonic is slower in this game wich is better for those levels, but yeah some of the faster levels got turned pp
I find it kinda hilarious that the only reason older sonic games seem faster is because of the different art directions. Others apply a blur that gives the illusion of speed while Frontiers has the player actually play well in order to feel the speed
If I recall, you can actually change the slowing down speed in the settings! This make it so he can be a bit more or less slippery based on the player's preference! Forget which setting it is exactly though
It's slower and precise and most of the levels are far more based around that than this specific one, so yeah you're not moving as fast but it is still good, precise platforming, it is probably best in 2D
All of this fixable with the sliders and turning on the power boost for cyber space. Which is more than I can say for Forces. Forces in my opinion, has the absolute worst controls of any Sonic game. I think Frontiers, despite the controls being much inferior in cyberspace, has decent controls overall, and I would rather have this over not being able to turn to save yourself.😅
These bad physics are the only reason I dropped that game... It was SOOOO good in unleashed and generations why couldnt the make it like that in frontiers?!!
the original levels and the sa2 ports are actually really fun, i think the main problem is that they pulled from boost games when frontiers isn’t really a boost game of course outside sa2 there aren’t really many older stages to pull from, there’s pretty much just sa1 and 06, and those stages tend to be far longer than the average cyberspace level
@@sukumadehk It's like the mentality they have is that the mere existence of a boost move is the entire formula and what makes things radically different, rather than the actual design of the games and how that all works at the core. It's like they don't realize that the boost itself...is just a move, it's a move that Sonic has in some games and not in others, like other moves he's had. What makes the games actually different is not just whether he literally has a "go faster" button, it's in how the games as a whole are designed and work. But to Sonic fans that nuance and detail doesn't exist I guess, it's just "Oh he has a go fast button and it says 'boost,' therefore it's a Boost game just like the other boost games."
Bro, i was trying to turn Sonic so i can continue with the level, but he's just so slow, and when i turn, he keeps running into the walls and its annoying
Frontiers is mostly took the adventure formula or something..just because frontiers built differently from oyer games like unleashed and generations doesn't.ean the game is actually broken now that's one of those BS take..
It’s feeling like is sonic reliving is memories and it doesn’t really matter anymore since for them to port certain levels from generations though. Yes these physics were not designed for cyberspace levels I feel like they could have changed the physics to feel more boost like generations momentum from the cyberspace levels online while sonic keeps his ability too.
I'm honestly tired of seeing Green Hill period, cause it's so overused to the point Sonic fans are burnt out from it and I am too. Green Hill is a classic, don't get me wrong but it's so annoying to the point I wanna pull my hair out and I got A LOT of hair and that mixed with the frontiers physics makes it unbearable to play through them but I'll still try and play them for that sweet, sweet S Rank.
I had fun playing Sonic Frontiers and enjoyed them basically remastering the stages the fans have been asking for. Also if Sonic feels too clunky you can change that in the settings
They already fixed most of that in new updates with being able to use the speed and turning sliders in cyber space making you faster and turn better and even letting you unlock the boost for it
Well he's right about the momentum and physics of cyberspace it has some issues...and the speed bin cyberspace yeah it does kinda feels slow compare to unleashed and generations i did noticed that and the fact sonic stops in a dime it does show there's no momentum yes all this are valid points and it makes the gameplay abit clunky these are all valid points but atleast the controls of cyberspace are actually responsive and functional and ypu actually have a better control over the boost compare to generations and unleashed you actually have a better control over the boost in frontiers thankfully with the first 2 updates they did made some adjustments and fixed some of the issues of this game and improved the momentum of the game quite abit annd adding the spindash to the game which the spindash also has momentum so this showing that sonic team did received the criticisms about the momentum of this game and improved it with the updates so that's a good thing but here's the thing though the fact that he constantly stops in the game showing he has skill issue too..
I think an even bigger problem I have with Cyberspace is the presentation. Visually, these levels SUCK. It's just asset flips from Sonic Generations, but only from the first 4 levels. Plus, everything has this techno vibe that makes the whole thing seem boring and lifeless. All of that is made even worse for me personally by the soundtrack. I seem to be the only one who thinks this, but I think the Cyberspace stages have the worst music style in the entire series. I'd even rather listen to songs from Sonic the Hedgehog 4 or (classic)Sonic Forces than the garbage in Frontiers.
i disagree, i think it adds a new feeling to the levels, they feel more platform heavy than boost heavy, and of course you know they added spindash which truly changes the level he also doesn't stop on a dime as of update 2, they added a movement slider to adjust when sonic stops
Me watching this guy actively playing badly: "Yeah the point is made much more valid that way." Seriously, most of us don't constantly stop and actively avoid boosting. Obviously they're not the best, but as for what works I feel it's very case-by-case. 1-2 works great I think, but 1-1 is really boring. I would say it's a 50-50 split on what works for the returning levels.
I do agree these controls and physics don’t work when the level design replicates Unleashed and Gens levels (Both Classic and Modern) because as said, those games and even Forces accommodate for their controls and physics in mind. They do work better when replicating SA2 Stages, though as they’re more in-line with the base game itself.
How to change this step one go to settings In game. step 2 click deceleration speed set it to zero. if not working set it to 100. there you slow down. slowly
What's more egregious to me was how the "fans" defended this game... (and also the fact that the community thinks that the second cyberspace level is the hardest ever??!)
Las actualizaciones arreglan muchos problemas que el video indica, aunque en realidad no creo que las físicas del ciberespacio arruinen los niveles, simplemente son una forma diferente de experimentarlos
I dunno, sounds like skill Issue to me. In all your Frontiers clips you're not boosting to maintain your speed, and even so you can still change Sonic's speed parameters both at the start of the game and in the options menu
Either I'm just crazy most of you are just absolutely terrible at cyberspace because I remember flying through those stages and by also replaying them to get better usually what you do in a sonic game but I will admit after playing them for a bit you do feel how the physics can be a bit tight and wonky but the only part of cyberspace I didn't like was final horizons level design
You probably watched Jebtube's video. Whilst I think he's right on some points he overexaggerates for dramatic effect and basically implies if the story and characterisation isn't replicated from Adventure down to T it's somehow failed. Frontiers story isn't the best I don't think it's bad by any means.
@@user-vt6dd4kz5t there's no such thing as "complaining too much" about a product YOU spent your hard earned money on. If your constantly getting complained at in a certain line of work shut your critics up with better output instead of telling them that you're complaining too much.
We’re not about to glorify the generations controls like they were some god send or something😂 sure for the time it came out they were great but the frontiers physics is leaps and bounds better
To me Frontiers is the best Sonic game but, unlike some in the comment section I could put my biases aside and say that yes. The physics don’t work for the cyberspace levels and that the cyberspace levels are clunky especially in comparison to the overworld gameplay.
"Sonic stops on a dime." So don't stop moving. There are a lot of fundamental issues with cyber space. Frontiers slower, heavier physics do make the stages feel clunkier to play, and Sonic's slow ass homing attack are both points that are valid concerns to bring up. But the point of cyber space IS to recycle the past as Sonic is reliving memories. And, again, with the stopping on a dime, you're pretty much just complaining about a self-made issue. First, you can change that setting to, you know, not do that. And also, if you hild forward like you would IN a linear Sonic stage...you won't have that issue.
Stopping on a dime means the game has no momentum, a fundamental aspect of a good Sonic game. Also, if the point encourages or results bad design, then it's a bad point, and there is no reason to defend or justify it.
Sonic Frontiers is built off of Sonic Forces, which is built off of Sonic Lost World.
In Sonic Lost World there were no traditional Sonic physics, and Sonic had a run button. He could start and stop on a dime, instantly.
This is why Sonic feels off in Forces and almost worse in Frontiers, because they modified Lost World and sorta "reverse engineered" it to play similar to Unleashed/Generations.
More like they made Hedgehog Engine 2 and ported over Lost World’s movement code and some of its assets. They retooled the physics to feel more like The Boost Trilogy but more clunky with no hop or drift.
I hate how sonic x shadow generations is going to be built off of Sonic Forces again. Sonic forces was not good! Under any circumstance.
Truly a helpful comment👍
@@Mbox4X Wait, seriously?! Why not use the original Generations engine? Oh god.. SXS is going to be awful, isn't it?
@@Sawtje2 SG's engine is Sonic unleashed'engine but I totally agree.
It's really disappointing that the last game where you really could feel the speed of sound is Generations.
He's super fast in forces, the controls are worse tho
@@Silver_Centralproven to be fast, but the level designs are so empty that does not make it shine in any way
You do feel pretty fast in the overworld tho
One of the things that pisses me off the most in Frontiers is the slight delay after a homing attack into an enemy.
Yeah something always felt off about it
no this game is definitely bulit like that too, the homing attack feels like trash cause its so slow so it makes it feel like your input is delayed cause it inputs way earlier than it needs to
@@memezabelle also when you play as amy or knuckles their homing attacks feel better than Sonic's own in his own game
Godddddd it is the absolute worst. Speedrunning through Cyberspace stages is frustrating as all hell because you’re so often taken out of that fluid trance by having to do that “1… 2… 3… 4…” homing attack chain. It DOES make SKIPPING homing attack chains with a well-aimed air boost more satisfying to pull off, but that’s only because you’re actively going out of your way to avoid engaging in a fundamental part of Sonic’s moveset, which feels like a blatant mistake to me.
Given that Shadow in Sonic x Shadow Generations is built on the Frontiers engine and based on a couple shots in the newest trailer, it looks like even he has this annoying buffer after homing attacks. So. Needlessly. Bad.
@HS-mn6jc dude i really couldnt agree more it looks like they increased the speed a bit for shadow but i dont know why they cant just make it just like modern sonics. dont fix what aint broke
i’ll be real none of that stopped me from enjoying myself while s ranking the cyber space levels, never got tired of trying again when a level gave me trouble especially when i’m listening to that awesome ost
Thats why i really tried to avoid the cyber space because of the physics
Honestly, first i saw the title and was like " what is bro yapping" then i listened to you and you are completely right
The biggest problem is how slow Sonic is😭
Well do you want your ps5 or xbox oe whatever your playing it on blowing up, no they really had to slow him down so you can see what you're doing sonic games are based on reflexes. Obviously we don't have the super reflexes sonic has so yeah deal wit it or make a mod
@@Datboi_Carlos7sonic unleashed sonic moves a lot faster then frontiers and that was a 360 and PS3 game if my console blew up then that’s an optimization problem
@@Datboi_Carlos7 also if you don’t have the reflexes to react fast enough then that’s literally a skill issue
@Omixity oh well i can't say anything about that i never played unleased and yes i do react fast to sonic
@Omixity facts. Sonic is sooooo slow in cyber space but luckily not in the open zone. But his momentum kinda sucks. I still love the game but there are still many flaws with speed and momentum. You shouldn’t have to edit your momentum in settings for one. And I’ll give one example of how the momentum sucks. If I hit a spring or dash pad and I don’t boost or am not boosting, I lose all of my momentum from the spring or dash pad and sometimes go to a complete stop. Leaving me to build all that momentum again. Or just boost and get it almost instantly
The excuse that it’s because of Sonic’s memories or whatever fucking sucks when both Mania and Generations reused levels in a much more refined and fantastic way. Copy and paste stages with worse physics, who the fuck is gonna justify that?
It’s especially silly when Generations also did the whole Sonic’s memories ordeal while combining it organically with time travel. The Time Eater was not only erasing Sonic’s past but also his memories. Sonic and Tails didn’t even remember Green Hill and Chemical Plant and assumed it was just “deja vu”
I guess not being a serious sonic fan helped because I enjoyed the game very much. I never felt that he went to slow and whenever it did slow down it was usually because of things I was doing wrong, not the other way around. Maybe the video was made before the updates, but the any sense of slow pacing is absolutely destroyed by the spindash, which only makes the game more fun.
I've been a fan of Sonic since the 90s and no, this guy is just yapping, Frontiers is the best Sonic has ever felt in 3D lol
@@lookatdemijipers
The lack of momentum helps it a whole lot to not feel anything like Sonic.
@@lookatdemijipersmust have been in cryostasis when unleashed and gens came out
I feel like cyberspace can work as a concept, if you give them WAY more time to work on it, and have someone who knows how to make a good 3D sonic level.
Here's a thing, I worked on a concept game inspired by Sonic Frontiers, "La Ligne Rouge: La mélancolie des Orchestres", a little story about a wolf girl fighting a powerful rogue AI on a set of islands, where you'll get to fight a variety of ancient machines.
And in said game, you have what's called "Echoes", special levels that take place inside a sort of simulation, creating levels based on the past of the ancient civilization of the story....
That's the first twist compared to Frontiers, instead of relying on the main character memories, I use the Ancient's past to create levels, and give some hints at what happened to them.
Second twist, spectacle.
At some points in the levels, the main antagonist of the story will appear to act as an obstacle, a set piece, or as a mini boss.
That way you get more interactions with the main antagonist (unlike Frontiers), and you also get that question of "What is it gonna do this time ?".
That's my take on the Cyberspace concept.
I dont still understand how they broke a good boots gameplay. Only they need to do leave as its. Just how? HOW?
frontiers isn’t a boost game, it’s more akin to the adventure games
@@the_frick
Those aren't mutually exclusive.
I wish they added drifting
i using spin dash to drift in the levels
They can, because in update 3 they literally added drift to Amy on her Power Boost
It is in the game, but it's only in one cyberspace stage, and it SUCKS
@@Kompressor808 you can unlock spin dash in the games you just need to do all the time trials missions that are in the island
@@sonitotsm I know, but we're talking about drifting
I've never dropped a Sonic game until Frontiers, and I didn't even have to pay for it.
Same, besides Xenoverse
The clunkiness of cyberspace could’ve been resolved if you were able to take the gameplay adjustments from the open zone into the levels and to an extent I can understand why Sega didn’t do that as they wanted it to be fair so people weren’t getting faster times compared to others purely due to their settings but it would’ve at least been more fun
But that happens anyways because of the sliders, and the fact that you can enable the power boost in cyberspace. Also, the spindash exists, so that makes everything I just said not worth jack.😅
I feel like there's more platforming than running in cyberspace levels.
For me, it depends, the original levels built around it are so much fun, one of the most fun stages I've ever played in a Sonic game, especially since Frontiers keep 2D stages completly 2D and 3D stages completly 3D, so my favorite stages 4-2 and 4-4 are totally 3D, original in level design, original in aesthetic since both use Eternal Highway theme
And the same kinda applies to the Final Horizon Stages, there are some great stuff in there
For the returning stages, desfinetly the original stages are more fun, but I wouldn't say Frontiers ones are bad, at least not for me, I find them quite fun to play
Actually, there are some parts in Frontiers whogets even better than Unleashed and Gens, while the regular part of the stages are a downgrade with the slower physics and more "precise" gameplay it takes away the fun, however, in the precise plataforming parts that were originally in Unleashed and Gens that DEFINETLY did not work for those games feel better to play here imho
I don't think the Frontiers ones are substitutes of course, the originals are still the better pick, but for Frontiers, I think it worked... would be better if the next games did more stages simillar to 4-4, or even if the gameplay changes make new levels to acomodate that gameplay, and for sure keeping it original instead of just copying and pasting past levels, especially if they weren't made for the gameplay you're working with
Eh, the precise platforming segments worked perfectly fine in both Unleashed and Generations, better than they do in Frontiers. The lack of speed and momentum in Frontiers takes away most challenge those stages posed, and just leaves them shallow and uninteresting.
@@snakey888 I would have to disagree, Unleashed Extra Stages and Generations regular stages for some reason really insisted in precise plataforming which never worked for the boost gameplay and the insane speeds of it
Trying to be precise in those 2 games like trying to land and stay in small plataforms, trying to fit Sonic into a tiny gap beetween traps, etc. Those things can be really frustrating, and it was a much better experience with Frontiers than the other 2 games for me tbh
@@LuucasIckie
It seems the issue is the boost gameplay. If you don't boost, (can be done by releasing the boost button), then you won't be going at insane speeds anymore, but instead you'll be moving at a slower speed, then precision platforming is a breeze, and feels better than any other 3d Sonic game.
@@snakey888 boosting is not the issue in those cases, having to deal with Sonic's slow and not instant decelearation can make pretty hard to stand in small plataforms, and sometimes the games expect you to boost in-beetween traps
The Boost gameplay in Unleashed and Generations just doesn't feel like it suits precise plataforming like something such as the Adventure gameplay does since even when not boosting Sonic still is too fast for that, the Boost gameplay in Unleashed and Gens feels like it suits more fast reaction time and imputs, but it instead relies on both precise plataforming and fast reactions
In Frontiers I actually feel like I have more control and precision, it feels more comfortable to play those sections
@@LuucasIckie
Instant deceleration is honestly one of the worst things to happen to the series, it just makes movement and platforming so awkward and unnatural. Not to mention it effectively removes any notion of momentum, a key staple of Sonic.
So can't really agree that platforming is better in either the sa games or Frontiers, the former is just way too floaty, and lack of momentum makes the latter too awkward.
Also, what in-between traps that the game supposedly expects you to boost are you referring to?
Well because you don't holding the boos- wait. The boost meter is going down... Oh!
Really feels like the settings are off, but it's been awhile since I played this level in frontiers, could be misremembering
It’s such a night and day experience from the overworld and the levels. It’s the only thing that actually hurts the game. I hope they improve it in the sequel
This is something I expect to be fixed in the sequel. Hope SEGA see this short lol
your comment section is the soul reason i will never be a sonictuber. i’m so sorry.
I hate to be that guy but it's "sole" not "soul".
Yo...wtf is this dude talkin about??? Like..not even joking he was playin a different game. Frontiers is mad fun.
It's really not. It suffers from poor physics, lack of momentum, tedious combat, dull graphics, mind-numbing missions, re-cycled level design and just isn't very enjoyable.
The boss fight music is fairly good though.
@@snakey888I continued playing after the updates and honestly most of these problems were fixed. The reused missions would be a problem but it's not like the red rings are in the same locations or anything. They're all different levels so I don't see how consistent tasks is a downer
@@Simp4Gwyn
The level design if almost copy pasted, the red ring locations don't change that.
And to be fair, the updates barely addressed most of the issues, much less fixed them.
@@snakey888 Yeah Sonic Team actually did a pretty good job retroactively fixing the game's problems. Which is more than I can say for games like Forces.😅
@@RClipsGaming101
such as?
*me watching him actively not boosting on the rails*
"Why yes I too like to play the game badly on purpose to make a point"
En realidad si esta acelerando
As he talks about sonic being slow too lmfao
@@ikaigaku nah he's still fast in the open World bruh..
@@user-vt6dd4kz5t I never said he wasn't.
@@user-vt6dd4kz5t I never said he wasnt.
The adventure levels work perfectly tho. Especially when you unlock the spindash
But you gotta s rank ALL the cyberspace levels... 💀💀💀
@@gojifanpat no, you s rank all the open world challenges.
The next game should make it where we can explore the places instead of going in some kind of digital version of it
Spin dash helps a lot with these levels. It’s in a way what the boost should have been physics wise.
I disagree, if the boost did what the spin dash does from the start, the entire game would break. The point of the spindash is to be a reward for mastering the game with the tools you had. What you get is the chance for new movement that fundamentally alters how you see the over world as well as cyberspace
@@Simp4Gwyn yeah you got a point. I was thinking more in terms of speed (going down hill and carrying forward momentum), not the height. I probably shouldn’t have said physics, really left a lot open to interpretation.
Sonic Team has always struggled with the fine details of gameplay, specifically optimization and controls.
Unleashed Day and Generations Modern stages only feel good because they use the Havok Physics engine, and Sonic Frontiers was not.
There’s a similar reason why Superstars is the first “classic sonic” game Sonic Team has made that has physics accurate to the Genesis era; they bought the engine from Christian Whitehead, who made the entire thing from scratch by himself.
Sonic Team has not succeeded in making a realistic (and not buggy as hell, see Sonic 06) physics engine from scratch since Sonic 1
For evidence that they can’t optimize, see just about any port (except possibly SA2B on Gamecube) they have ever made, especially SADX and Colors Ultimate. Even Unleashed, at almost 17 years old, is only NOW able to run a consistent 60 fps through emulation and Xbox Series X backwards compatibility
I hate and I mean hate the homing stop. Like, bro, sa2 was my favorite when it came to homing attacks.
Those zones frustrated me so much since my muscle memory kept playing it like it was sonic generations
so the ported levels were great, but what was lazy was Sky Rail having the wrong theme and so on like i think it looked like Green Hill or Radical Highway section looking like generic city
Cyberspace is a digital demension diffrnet for everyone that use the persons memorys to build it
That still feels like a lazy excuse to reuse levels
Still, the fact that Sonic controls in Cyberspace sucks ass ruins the experience in Cyberspace
You’re still reusing levels. It don’t matter if you give a story reason. Heck, the story reason in Frontiers of “memories” is too close to Generations which did the same thing but also involved time travel.
@Butwhythough881 yes that’s exactly how I felt it feels like when you reuse the same layouts and levels for 20 years they start to feel less like a callback and more like method of cutting corners
@@leonmystique9372 skill issue if you ask me because the controls are responsive..
Sonic got the CW flash treatment.
Nerfed TF out of his speed.
The fact that they are reused may be unoriginal
But the game’s lore justifies it
I was so glad to see the story be taken seriously instead of jokes every two seconds.
The lore really doesn't justify it.
@@blackdot105 you the environments from cyberspace are actually memories of its most recent visitors?
@@garsrandom4358they could've went with any other idea like maybe cyberspace are the memories of the ancients and you play on their home planet learning about how life was there but no they instead say it's Sonic's memories to justify re-using assets from Generations.
Again.
I honestly liked how he controlled in frontiers MUCH more than in unleashed and generations.
There are settings to change deceleration
Me personally i also dont like how weird homing attacks feel, it feels like the game just pauses for w moment everytime you homing attack
There's a sincere lack of smoothness in Sonics movements in and out of cyberspace. Sadly cyberspace just makes it more apparent.
Completing every stage has made it impossible for me to return to the game regretfully.
What is bro yapping about
Well I enjoyed Sonic Frontiers
The original Cyberspace levels are really fun tho because the phisics actually work, and i guess the Adventure ones too since Sonic is slower in this game wich is better for those levels, but yeah some of the faster levels got turned pp
Ian flynn and sonic music team creating an intresting plot and banger soundtrack knowing damn well the gameplay team will create mid to accompany them
I find it kinda hilarious that the only reason older sonic games seem faster is because of the different art directions. Others apply a blur that gives the illusion of speed while Frontiers has the player actually play well in order to feel the speed
If I recall, you can actually change the slowing down speed in the settings! This make it so he can be a bit more or less slippery based on the player's preference! Forget which setting it is exactly though
Settings only apply in the overworld.
The settings do not apply in the Cyberspace Portals.
The unleashed physics are perfect for me i love it in day time
Ok last time I checked who wants to actually stop in cyberspace?
It's slower and precise and most of the levels are far more based around that than this specific one, so yeah you're not moving as fast but it is still good, precise platforming, it is probably best in 2D
All of this fixable with the sliders and turning on the power boost for cyber space. Which is more than I can say for Forces. Forces in my opinion, has the absolute worst controls of any Sonic game. I think Frontiers, despite the controls being much inferior in cyberspace, has decent controls overall, and I would rather have this over not being able to turn to save yourself.😅
These bad physics are the only reason I dropped that game... It was SOOOO good in unleashed and generations why couldnt the make it like that in frontiers?!!
the original levels and the sa2 ports are actually really fun, i think the main problem is that they pulled from boost games when frontiers isn’t really a boost game
of course outside sa2 there aren’t really many older stages to pull from, there’s pretty much just sa1 and 06, and those stages tend to be far longer than the average cyberspace level
True, frontiers' physics would work a lot better with an adventure style level design
@@nyeeeofthestarsz1804I try to say that in the fanbase but they all say frontiers is a boost game then troll me
@@sukumadehk It's like the mentality they have is that the mere existence of a boost move is the entire formula and what makes things radically different, rather than the actual design of the games and how that all works at the core. It's like they don't realize that the boost itself...is just a move, it's a move that Sonic has in some games and not in others, like other moves he's had. What makes the games actually different is not just whether he literally has a "go faster" button, it's in how the games as a whole are designed and work. But to Sonic fans that nuance and detail doesn't exist I guess, it's just "Oh he has a go fast button and it says 'boost,' therefore it's a Boost game just like the other boost games."
I think what helped saved the cyberspace levels was adding the power boost and the sliders to cyperspace
It's a good thing the bigs fishing derby, let's you make it so you never have to go to cyber space EVER AGAIN!
Bro, i was trying to turn Sonic so i can continue with the level, but he's just so slow, and when i turn, he keeps running into the walls and its annoying
Have you’ve tried actually playing the levels? Seems like you’re kind of half assing it in the Frontiers sections
They're cool but that doesn't change the sonic forces-esque physics. But I really enjoyed combat big w
This is what is beautiful about the modding community. Those legends fix the broken parts of these games.
Frontiers is mostly took the adventure formula or something..just because frontiers built differently from oyer games like unleashed and generations doesn't.ean the game is actually broken now that's one of those BS take..
@@user-vt6dd4kz5tthe adventure games had a pretty good handling in it's physics, it just resembles the formula in a visual aspect
It’s feeling like is sonic reliving is memories and it doesn’t really matter anymore since for them to port certain levels from generations though. Yes these physics were not designed for cyberspace levels I feel like they could have changed the physics to feel more boost like generations momentum from the cyberspace levels online while sonic keeps his ability too.
Take that back but I love this short
Sega ruined the boost formula imo, i would be better if frontiers played like an adventure game
That “better -- ya self” meme that someone very inappropriately sent you made me giggle though I’m sorry. I just like laughing at low tier god lol.
I'm honestly tired of seeing Green Hill period, cause it's so overused to the point Sonic fans are burnt out from it and I am too. Green Hill is a classic, don't get me wrong but it's so annoying to the point I wanna pull my hair out and I got A LOT of hair and that mixed with the frontiers physics makes it unbearable to play through them but I'll still try and play them for that sweet, sweet S Rank.
I had fun playing Sonic Frontiers and enjoyed them basically remastering the stages the fans have been asking for. Also if Sonic feels too clunky you can change that in the settings
They already fixed most of that in new updates with being able to use the speed and turning sliders in cyber space making you faster and turn better and even letting you unlock the boost for it
You can adjust the momentum stop and other physics things but w/e😊
just for the overworld, not cyberspace
Well he's right about the momentum and physics of cyberspace it has some issues...and the speed bin cyberspace yeah it does kinda feels slow compare to unleashed and generations i did noticed that and the fact sonic stops in a dime it does show there's no momentum yes all this are valid points and it makes the gameplay abit clunky these are all valid points but atleast the controls of cyberspace are actually responsive and functional and ypu actually have a better control over the boost compare to generations and unleashed you actually have a better control over the boost in frontiers thankfully with the first 2 updates they did made some adjustments and fixed some of the issues of this game and improved the momentum of the game quite abit annd adding the spindash to the game which the spindash also has momentum so this showing that sonic team did received the criticisms about the momentum of this game and improved it with the updates so that's a good thing but here's the thing though the fact that he constantly stops in the game showing he has skill issue too..
I think an even bigger problem I have with Cyberspace is the presentation. Visually, these levels SUCK. It's just asset flips from Sonic Generations, but only from the first 4 levels. Plus, everything has this techno vibe that makes the whole thing seem boring and lifeless.
All of that is made even worse for me personally by the soundtrack. I seem to be the only one who thinks this, but I think the Cyberspace stages have the worst music style in the entire series. I'd even rather listen to songs from Sonic the Hedgehog 4 or (classic)Sonic Forces than the garbage in Frontiers.
Fished till I got most the keys
chad generations green hill vs virgin cyberspace green hill
Problem isn't the game, problem is the person who play the game, beside I'm very good at the Cyberchase levels.
"Get good. The game has no issues"
Yea sure kid.
there IS an issue with the final horizon ones
its not even skill issue, its straight up torture trying to catch up with tails
@@ghostslord-23its pretty easy to catch up to tails
@@ghostslord-23It is easy.
I agree. The controls and mechanics feels WAY too stiff.. far different from Generations and Unleashed.
In the settings menu you can make sonic faster in frontiers
Maybe try tweaking some settings? Cause cyberspace levels didn't feel bad for me
This is why you get the game on pc and play with mods👏
i disagree, i think it adds a new feeling to the levels, they feel more platform heavy than boost heavy, and of course you know they added spindash which truly changes the level
he also doesn't stop on a dime as of update 2, they added a movement slider to adjust when sonic stops
Me watching this guy actively playing badly:
"Yeah the point is made much more valid that way."
Seriously, most of us don't constantly stop and actively avoid boosting.
Obviously they're not the best, but as for what works I feel it's very case-by-case. 1-2 works great I think, but 1-1 is really boring. I would say it's a 50-50 split on what works for the returning levels.
I do agree these controls and physics don’t work when the level design replicates Unleashed and Gens levels (Both Classic and Modern) because as said, those games and even Forces accommodate for their controls and physics in mind.
They do work better when replicating SA2 Stages, though as they’re more in-line with the base game itself.
Yall deadass forgot you can tweak the settings is crazy to me but hay it's the sonic community yall never happy
How to change this step one go to settings In game. step 2 click deceleration speed set it to zero. if not working set it to 100. there you slow down. slowly
The rail grind comparison was the exact same but with a weaker boost and no vfx, what about it
it makes it look and feel more slow, more erratic and less smooth
I didn’t mind the levels
You do know that there is a setting to fix sonic stoping intently
It only applies to the open zone
i mean atleast they cooked with the music
I don't think the cyberspace levels are bad. I mean they were hard yes but they were fun
Idk man I found em pretty fun and smooth
What's more egregious to me was how the "fans" defended this game... (and also the fact that the community thinks that the second cyberspace level is the hardest ever??!)
The Hardest Level To S-Rank, And Even Then The Community's Wrong 1-2 Is A Piece Of Cake To S-Rank, 4-6 Took Me Over 90 Tries💀💀💀
@@SonZillaKingOfTheHedgehogs 1-2 took me like 4 tries, I never understood the whole noise about it
@@tarz1109 1-2 Was Pretty Dang Hard For Me Until I Abused The Magnet Dash/Homing Shot/Homing Dash/Griddy, 4-6 Was Hard Even With Using The Mag Dash
Im sorry but u don't need to stop.
Womp womp
cry
Glazer
Womp Womp
Las actualizaciones arreglan muchos problemas que el video indica, aunque en realidad no creo que las físicas del ciberespacio arruinen los niveles, simplemente son una forma diferente de experimentarlos
I dunno, sounds like skill Issue to me. In all your Frontiers clips you're not boosting to maintain your speed, and even so you can still change Sonic's speed parameters both at the start of the game and in the options menu
That only applies to the overworld
frr finally someone gets it
It sounds like just hate sonic
Did no one here play the DLC Frontiers stages? Pointless hate for this game they already changed the play style.
Either I'm just crazy most of you are just absolutely terrible at cyberspace because I remember flying through those stages and by also replaying them to get better usually what you do in a sonic game but I will admit after playing them for a bit you do feel how the physics can be a bit tight and wonky but the only part of cyberspace I didn't like was final horizons level design
I dont care, Sonic fans who complain about momentum are just stupid😅
You have something against momentum?
He a question Frontier Cyberspace or Forces
Even in Sonic speed simulator he goes faster. A "stupid" roblox game.
took people about 2 years to finally realize frontiers is bad. especially its writing
People didn't like it at release too, I always enjoyed it, it's a 3d sonic did you expect it to be perfect??
You probably watched Jebtube's video. Whilst I think he's right on some points he overexaggerates for dramatic effect and basically implies if the story and characterisation isn't replicated from Adventure down to T it's somehow failed.
Frontiers story isn't the best I don't think it's bad by any means.
Omg stop winning Sega are staring of with a new formula calm down in plus its good it might be the same but it's good
What good is a new formula if it has fundamental flaws, and issues inherited from previous games.
We are paying customers, we have the right to complain about the issues.
@@anthonyyawtwumasimensah197 but the problem is you guys complain abit too much.
@@user-vt6dd4kz5t there's no such thing as "complaining too much" about a product YOU spent your hard earned money on. If your constantly getting complained at in a certain line of work shut your critics up with better output instead of telling them that you're complaining too much.
We’re not about to glorify the generations controls like they were some god send or something😂 sure for the time it came out they were great but the frontiers physics is leaps and bounds better
No, they're really not. Frontiers barely has any semblance to momentum, that alone makes it significantly worse than Generations.
You made great points. Keep up the good work and ignore the haters.
To me Frontiers is the best Sonic game but, unlike some in the comment section I could put my biases aside and say that yes. The physics don’t work for the cyberspace levels and that the cyberspace levels are clunky especially in comparison to the overworld gameplay.
Is Sonic Frontiers an amazing game? Yes! Is it perfect? No.
"Sonic stops on a dime."
So don't stop moving.
There are a lot of fundamental issues with cyber space. Frontiers slower, heavier physics do make the stages feel clunkier to play, and Sonic's slow ass homing attack are both points that are valid concerns to bring up.
But the point of cyber space IS to recycle the past as Sonic is reliving memories.
And, again, with the stopping on a dime, you're pretty much just complaining about a self-made issue.
First, you can change that setting to, you know, not do that. And also, if you hild forward like you would IN a linear Sonic stage...you won't have that issue.
Stopping on a dime means the game has no momentum, a fundamental aspect of a good Sonic game.
Also, if the point encourages or results bad design, then it's a bad point, and there is no reason to defend or justify it.
@@snakey888 then change that in the settings. You can do that.
@@samarius_art_and_games
Settings only apply to the overworld. Cyber stages have set controls.
But the adventure levels feel great
All because the boost was nerfted