GERMANY'S CONTROVERSIAL INTERCITY TRAIN / DB IC2 TWINDEXX VARIO REVIEW
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- Опубліковано 13 січ 2022
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Hello and welcome back to Germany for an Intercity review on the channel!
Today we will be seeing if the controversial DB IC2 Twindexx Vario sets are worthy of the Intercity name, or are they just a glorified regional train with carpets... Enjoy the video!
Date of Filming: 22/9/21
Camera: GoPro Hero 7 Black
Operator: Deutsche Bahn (DB)
Departure: Dresden Hbf, Germany
Arrival: Leipzig Hbf, Germany
Cost: Adult First Class Super Saver - €29.90 (£25.24, $33.84)
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To add another perspektive to the controversy: back in the 90s there was a great *InterRegio* Network. Basically long distance regional trains (capable of 160kph!) which were a very cheap alternative to the ICEs, especially when using a "Wochenend-Ticket" -- there was no need to book stuff in advance.
That IC2 is basically replacing what had been scrapped 20 years ago... with marginal extra comfort for premium pricing.
Yes, i don't think it was ever meant to be a full blown IC service...? 🇩🇪
Those InterRegio trains were quite okay and relatively comfy. Some even had a Bistro like the Schiphol to Berlin ones and the Hengelo - Cottbus ones.
@@NonstopEurotrip kinda...The size of the ICE Fleet is growing quickly and the ICE4 is also controversial because it is "not a true ICE". The ICE 4 is taking some lines that were previously IC lines. So in a way the "ICE territory" is expanded towards slower trains and simultaneously the IC trains get also downgraded in a way. So there is a shift, not a simple 1 to1 transition.
Personally i am okay with it, i am not that obsessed with tradition and brand identity etc... With the changes there will be an increase in passenger numbers and that is what matters in my opinion.
You got to work with what you have and the reality is that Germany has only some "real" high speed lines, the rest is more higher speed. Building high speed lines is such a huge endeavor because the resistance from NIMBY and environmentalist groups is way to strong, so the "slow" ICE4 makes a lot of sense, we don't have that many lines where the slower speed is an disadvantage.
@@tzarcoal1018 and the ICE Sprinter is basically what the ICE used to be.
One example of what used to be an IC and now an ICE is no the Main-Weser-Bahn between Kassel and Frankfurt via Trysa, Marburg and Gießen. Some section on the line are only buid to 80kph.
I only rode the IC2 train set once and didn't have a good impression, but I had a, stressful few days, a dog and a lot of luggage.
In general I rarely get to ride ICs (1 or 2) because most Cities in Germany are one seat ICE rides from Frankfurt HBF.
Also only rode the IC1 train set once and never an ICE 4 trainset.
Overall I still prefer the IC1 sets, tey look a bit more luxurious to me, and I somewhat like to more moody lighting, makes it feel more calm.
I think it would be useful if the bring back to InterRegio, not because I'm nostalgic towards them they where discounted before I was born, but a lot of people connect the brand with something positive, which could boost ridership.
Something I'm nostalgic about is the "Heckeneilzug" a long distance train serving a variety of branch lines, giving every village in the country at least a twice a day connection to every other place in the country (with only one interchange).
The service s are sadly long gone (even well before the IR).
I think the DB (and this and future Government in extention) will habe to build a s**t load of High Speed rail in the next decade, just to achieve the Deutschland Tackt (on our climate goals)
It should be mentioned, InterRegio only existed, because state politics wanted (and subsidised) it.
Since then much has changed.
Subsidised public transport is organized on a local level, now.
That is why we have centralized structures around towns.
Regional trains connecting two Cities require both authorities working to gether and sharing budgets.
Cool video, I’d definitely say it’s more of an intercity than a glorified regional train from a Danish perspective, I’d say it’s much nicer and brighter than our regional double deckers but has a lot of the same features as our double deckers! Watching this from isolation! Thank you so much for the content it’s interesting!
Ah stay safe! Agree it's more than a regional train, but I prefer the loco hauled ones 😁
@@NonstopEurotrip same! In 2024/25 we will get Talgo wagons from Spain! They will be so good in DSB’s fleet and be pushed by the vectron locomotives, they will go between Copenhagen and Hamburg and Fredericia and Hamburg until there’s electrical wires till Aarhus! Then they will go between Aarhus and Hamburg as well, rn it’s IC3 on both stretches.
@@Denden16995 I'm excited for this! I've got a video coming up on the Hamburg Copenhagen IC3 soon 👍🏻
@@NonstopEurotrip nice! I am very excited to try it myself one day as well!
@@NonstopEurotrip hmm i wonder when that video will be uploaded
One of the reasons these are also controversial is the top speed. Not that 160kph is very slow, it's just that the old IC1 sets from the 70s and 80s these are replacing can do 200kph. So 160 is quite a downgrade.
Also the 2nd series, wich features DB class 147 locos, have quite a few software problems. So much so that at one point DB refused to take delivery of new sets from Bombardier. Like for example the bord computer frequently crashes when the train is supposed to change direction of travel. And Bombardier/Alstom never managed to get them certified for use in Switzerland, wich is now completely scrapped (DB now want's to use the Stadler Flirts IC sets for that route).
But where is the problem with the top speed? The IC2 will only be used on routes where the top speed is capped at 160 kph anyway.
@@darksoundzz It will be used on lines that allow faster speeds. Infact it is in this very video ... between Riesa and Leipzig the line is set up for 200kph.
@@darksoundzz on the line cologne-dresden they had to cut out a stop in ''bad oeynhausen'' just to be on the same traveling time schedule as the older train sets
I agree with pretty much all this 😊
@@mici01 And yet, the Twindexx design was rated for 186kph while they can even be upgraded to 200kph as that was a requirement by the Belgian railroads in order to qualify for the M7 project. They ammended the requirements to state that upon delivery the 200 was not a requirement, but all trains would have to be upgraded at some point to make it possible.
So it sounds like DB dropped the ball in getting these for only 160kph service.
I love that you don’t talk or play music over your videos, very nice to hear all the other sounds and makes me feel like I am back in my home country
I'm glad you like the way I do it, thanks 🙏🏻
Love your channel! Discovered your channel through Dylan’s Travel Reports (another great channel!). Great video! Beautiful train stations & amazing canopies!
Welcome along! Be sure to check out my other 100+ videos 😄 Dylan is my good friend 🙏🏻
Excellent video! Have an IC 2 in my collection of n scale trains! It was great to be able to see the inside of the prototype and learn more about it! Thank you!
I must say these station buildings look gorgeous. Great video as always. Thanks!!
Absolutely agree ☺️
As a guy who lives in Leipzig and study in Dresden I really enjoyed your video! This route was btw Germanys first long distance railway, opened in 1839. If you visit Leipzig again, you can go on top of the tower at Augustusplatz in the city center to have a nice view. Also you can take one of the trams (second largest german tram-network) and take a ride to the famous "Völkerschlachtdenkmal".
Keep up your great work!
Glad you enjoyed the video Harald 🙏🏻
For longer trips, it often pays to play around with the options. I was once riding the train from Innsbruck (Austria) to Erfurt, and the cheapest(!) option proved to be First Class with a bicycle. It was cheaper than First Class without the bicycle and even cheaper than Second Class. Apparently, there were leftover First Class seats with reserved bicycle spots.
9:30 About here you were passing the site of the first German rail tunnel (ok, ok, there has been a tunnel at a field railway, but this one was not public), built between 1837 and 1839, the so called Oberauer Tunnel. Here the rails cross the terminal moraine of the Saale glaciation. Being too small for two rail service, the tunnel was replaced by a cut through the hills in the 1930ies. Today, only an obelisk above the station Niederau remembers the tunnel.
13:30 My personal theory why Leipzig Hauptbahnhof is so large is bragging. It was built as a joint project of Prussian State Railways and Royal Saxon State Railways, which each had a terminal in Leipzig. Because each of the railway companies, being representative of their respective country, had different interests regarding Leipzig's connection to rails, there was intense infighting, often called Prussian-Saxon Railway Wars. As no company wanted to look stingy or corwardly, they agreed on the most pompous project plans possible.
Thank you for a lovely comment 😊
9:30 That is on the slow line Riesa Niderau-Coswig Dresden Hbf this IC train uses Coswig Bypass line then the Weißig-Böhla Line to merge with Riesa-Coswig Dresden line
Thank you for an excellent review. I really like the IC2 trains and cannot understand what all the fuss is about. Having travelled in several of them, in 1st Class, I found them extremely comfortable and sitting upstairs gives wonderful views ! The D.B have been very wise in using these trains on routes where any of the ICE units would be inappropriate. How I wish we had trains like the IC2 in the U.K !
I agree Anthony, even though I prefer the old school loco hauled coaches with a bordbistro onboard. They're not as bad a people make out though! 👍🏻🇩🇪
Thanks for an enjoyable video - it seemed like a pretty comfortable IC train today. Even the drink/snack service to your seat is a suitable substitute for for a bordbistro for a a journey of only a couple of hours. As a fan of railway stations I appreciated seeing Leipzig and Dresden. One day I hope to see Gleis 24 in person.
Absolutely Linda! Not bad, but could be better probably just about sums it up 😂
Great video as always and I too think that this regional train is great in terms of features and comfort and damn Germany 🇩🇪 got some 😍 beautiful looking train stations and now I know what to do first when I visit Germany, visit train stations. 😁
Thanks mate! Germany does have lots of impressive stations, yes 😃 Hopefully you can get to travel here one day 👍🏻🇩🇪
Thanks for sharing your journey. You are right... the canopies on those stations are huge. Really nice stations, all of them!
Absolutely Michael ☺️
Looked perfectly fine to me. I was surprised how quiet it was on board. . And despite all of the station canopies I've seen, on my travels I still think London Paddington is the grandest of all. Enjoyable video as always .
York or St Pancras for station canopies.
Actually Milano Centrale 😁
If were talking about impressive canopies then definitely Liège Guillemins
St Pancras for me 🙃
Great review!! Good value for the money. I think the food should be complimentary in first class as it is in the US.
Thanks Max for sharing this trip with us😀😀♥️♥️
There ain't no such thing as a free lunch
No mater if they call it free or complimentary or what ever, the price is always calculated to include the costs. So why should i pay more just so that i get some food on a journey that just takes a bit over one hour?
@@sonkeschluter3654 Thank you for your input. But I still say long distance first class travel in the US food is included in the fare. True....there is no free lunch. And I would not have bought food on that 1 hour 9 minute ride. I've also discovered via other UA-camRS that many European long distance trains only offer food for sale!!
I agree on a longer Journey a complimentary meal and drinks in first class really should be standard, and not just the seat upgrade. Like you said Scott, it's not needed on shorter trips. This is why I like UK and Spanish full IC First Class with meals and lounge access included 👍🏻😁
@@NonstopEurotrip Absolutely😀😀♥️♥️
You folks in Europe are so lucky to have had the foresight to establish such a tremendously efficient and comfortable rail network. I have to chuckle when I see videos like this that describe the "controversial" nature of various European trains that, by comparison are, and will remain, light years ahead of what the U.S. will ever be able to field. Since becoming an automobile driven society after the mid 1940's rail service here in the U.S. has all but become a third tier transportation network.
Amtrak has some fantastic transcontinental routes that are a wonder (and fun way) to travel long distances but they are only once a day (at best), barely reliable schedule wise (freight traffic takes precedence), extremely expensive, and antiquated by modern standards of fuel efficiency and comfort ability standards. For those that are true train buffs, Amtrak is like a ride through the glory days of rail travel in the U.S. If you've got the time and the money to enjoy the experience it's pretty much an opportunity not to be missed.
For anything else, take your car or fly the route. Outside of the Northeast corridor or within major urban centers commuter rail services here in the U.S. are pretty dismal, if not altogether non existent.
Kudos mate. I enjoy your videos. Can't wait to enjoy European rail services once again once Covid is under control.
Thanks for a lovely comment! Honestly American trains are well covered on UA-cam and don't really interest me that much. Maybe when I've run out of the rest of the world 🤣 glad you enjoy the videos! Where are you going to go first, post Covid?! 🙂
We have an IC2 (also going as RE34 between Dortmund and Dillenburg) in Iserlohn-Letmathe. Honestly, i travelled with that train quite a bit (also between Hagen and Wuppertal one time) and personally, i really like it. It's quiet and i get around fairly quickly.
I have not travelled on a german IC train since the early 90's, but this really looks like a downgrade. The old Bm235 coaches were far more comfortable. Also the IC-trains back then had a BordRestaurant coach. This looks more like an InterRegio service, although I think the Bimz carriages actually had slightly better comfort.
Pretty much correct yes 🤣
I had the chance to stop by at Dresden Hbf a loooong ago on a service to Prague which broke down unexpectedly and had to wait there until a replacement one arrived. I find it, jointly with St Pancras, Antwerp and Milano Cle, one of the prettiest stations I have ever been to. Gorgeous building.
Regarding the ride, I think it was more than satisfactory considering the time elapsed, can't imagine why they would complain! Cheers
Yeah I pretty much agree with all this 😊
@@NonstopEurotrip they also say Mumbai has a breathtaking station as well, but haven't ventured that far to make an opinion
Leipzig has the best main station in Germany imo
@@davinnicode I had not seen it before watching Max's video but it looks nice indeed!
@@davinnicode I agree, it's even better than Dresden Hbf
I used this type of train between Singen and Stuttgart. This line was sold as IC and as RE(Regional Express) at the same time, to get the subvention for regional traffic from Baden-Wurttemberg. And the number of stops on that line were equal to an RE and not to an IC. This link also was involved into a discussion, on wether it can be used with the present
cheap regional monthly tickets (fom June to August)
Took it, Dresden-Bielefeld in early january 2020 (short before you-know-what). When we ordered food around 11h50, all they had left were ridiculous cold slices of bread with cheese in a plastic bag... and non-reclinable seats.
On our way to Dresden, we did Frankfurt-Dresden with ICT, that was MUCH better, we had a very good Kartoffel-Eintopf before arriving in the evening.
Thanks for sharing ☺️
I think the main difference, and essential ingredient for IC/ICE is the small pillow on the seats to rest your head on. I love those !
Oh yeh 🤣
Much better than the old IC‘s. Thank you for this Great video:)
You're welcome 😁
Thanks for the extra footage around the station in Leipzig.
You're welcome 😁
10:27 Note yellow stickers on the door indicating that it's not working. You need to go to the other end if you want to go out.
I guess the train is ok for shorter trips like this but I would not enjoy taking it all day from one end of the country to the other.
Agree yes 👍🏻💯
Nice video I Like the twindex Defently a Train to Ride in the Future
😎😎😎
Great trip. The design looks cool btw
I like it too 👍🏻
Great video !!
Thank you Theo 👍🏻
Great video 👍👍👍 bro very nice trip🥰🥰❤️❤️🌹🌹🌹
Thanks so much 😁
Great video. thank you very much
You're welcome 😄
Your review is not unlike the style of Dylan's Travel Reports! Are you sure you're not Dylan? :) Anyway, a nice video. I love the interior styling of the DB ICE trains, in particular the 1st class. Never travelled on the IC2 before but it looks just fine.
I'm pretty sure I'm not Dylan, but I am going for dinner at his house later 😂
Awwww ... home sweet home!! 😊❤
Leipzig that is, not Dresden! 😅
Glad you liked it there.
As for the train, well imo the Stadler Kiss do a much better job. I frequently use them between Rostock and Berlin. This service continues to Dresden which is why I thought for a moment you'd be reviewing those. My only complaint with those EMUs is that they're currently only in sets of 4 coaches, which is a bit small for a long distance train. 6 coach sets are supposed to arrive soon though.
Also did you notice that the cap car on your IC2 looks different than the other ones? The doors are on the lower level and narrower, the other coaches have wider doors on the middle level more to the ends of the coach.
I sometimes which I knew how DB comes up with it's prices though. Sometimes first class is just a few bucks more than 2nd, sometimes it's almost double. So it's really a hit and miss if you're able to get good value for money.
It really is sometimes you can travel around the continent for 20 bucks and then a 1hour journey can cost you more than 100
You see I prefer these to the kisses 😂 And I really enjoyed Leipzig 😍
That was a great video...😀 I agree with you that they do need a cafe car...
Absolutely Harry! 👍🏻
Great review, however yes it is unfortunatley a gloryfied regional train, which I take regularly. As a kid I took an IC from Nuremberg to Kehl, it was much cozier and had a Bordbistro.
The speed of 100mph is nothig to write home about. The regional trains that i've taken recently among those even a Diesel powered one regularly hit 100mph.
Back in the days of trains where you could manually open windows, were lacking indivdual seating and A/C the IC was a great upgrade, but the basline for Trains today is thankfully way higher, and in this regard the IC is just a polished regional train.
Agree mostly, yes 🙏🏻
In Czechia, we have a similar case of a regional train converted to "intercity" by simply upgrading seats and making the train a bit longer. It is called InterPanter, manufactured by Škoda Electric and based on RegioPanter platform. Instead of two or three carriages, it has five or six. And, to be honest, it is not bad. The ride is smooth enough, the train has a good acceleration, wide doors, space for bikes, Wi-Fi and large windows offering great view of the Czech landscape. I think, there is a niche for such trains.
Haha yes I've been on them! I see what you mean, but you also have RJ and SCP so it's good 😎
I enjoyed the video and I thought it looked like a great service .😊.
It was!
Love the i intro with the music etc.
Thanks Ruben 🙏🏻
During the seat tour you missed the height adjustable headrest. It's almost a hidden feature it seems because a lot of passengers don't know about it despite being documented in the leaflets you find in the seat pocket. If you are upwards of 180cm it helps making the journey more comfortable and it's available both in 1st and 2nd class. After traveling on the IC2 D for years (usually 3-4h in one go) I definitely am thankful for the possibility to travel in 1st class as the 2nd class forced me to wander around every 1,5h. For a few month at the end of 2019 I was taking this service every morning from Dresden to Leipzig but I preferred taking the ICE-T in the afternoon. All in all a nice video that brought back memories from different journeys.
The headrest that isn't reclinable
@@burgerpommes2001 It's correct that the headrests won't recline and they aren't connected to the seats reclining mechanism. They just move up and down. To make a real comfy seat the backrest would need to tilt like s car seat including the heasrest. The benefit of the IC2 D mechanism is that the tray table of the seat behind will always stay level.
Thanks for the information! 👍🏻😁
Merci, nonstop eurotrip ! J'adore les trains à deux étages. Ta vidéo est magnifique. J'aime bien quand ton logo part dans tous les sens et que les images vont à l'envers comme ça, c'est très contemporain. Tu progresses.
Thank you, nonstop eurotrip! I love double-decker trains. Your video is wonderful. I like it when your logo goes all over the place and the images go upside down like that, it's very contemporary. You progress.
Merci beaucoup Louis, j'essaye toujours d'améliorer mes vidéos et ça fait plaisir quand ça ne passe pas inaperçu ! Je suis content que vous ayez apprécié la vidéo ! À la semaine prochaine!
@@NonstopEurotrip Oops I just realized that I forgot to remove the original text that I sent to the translator right after, but hey, you have both versions. Sorry again. Excuse me.
@@louislegrand2865 Pas de problème Louis!
Beautiful train connecting two beautiful cities. Dresden city is awsome. Leipzig station is out of the world. Thank u for the video
You're very welcome 😁
LOL nice sticker on the tray table ^^
😂😂😂
I think it's obvious what DB is trying to do. Most IC Services will be converted to ICE services (which already happens each December when DB rolls out their new timetables) and the IC brand will be used for regional long distance travel or for touristic routes to the North and Baltic Sea and to the Alps
The silence was deafening! Great soundproofing. The menu could be enhanced even on trolley service. Now call me old fashioned - but doesn't First Class travel lack the luxury of years gone by? Giving more leg room and a leather seat doesn't make it First Class - it just makes it a tad better than Second.
I do agree Jon, the train was good but I would rather pay a little extra and get First Class service, complimentary drinks and snacks as a minimum 👍🏻🇩🇪
Unfortunately (Stairs!) there isn't a trolley service. DB acquired Bombardier double deckers for regional trains equipped with a small bistro ("ZugCafé") in the lower floor for use on regional trains. This would have been an adequate solution for IC2 trains.
@@NonstopEurotrip You pay 10€ to get drinks and snacks worth 3€. You cannot be german. Travelling first class is kind of .. for the millionaires. This special Dresden-Leipzig track has been rebuilt in the last decade, since than it's more silent and also more punctual due to seperate tracks (4 lanes) from low speed commuter trains near Leipzig and Dresden..
Certainly better than most trains in the UK. What struck me was how quite the ride was even before you mentioned it, and the pricing is very reasonable to . Little disappointed on the offer of refreshment offred but for a short journey perhaps just enough.
Completely agree, but free Haribo right? 🤤
I enjoy your video's so much. I am not able to travel myself due to health issues but you take me with you. Thank you for that! Greetings from a Dutch fan...
Thanks that means a lot, be sure to check out my 100+ other videos too 👍🏻😊
Great trip report
Thanks Luis 😀
Excellent
Thanks 👍🏻
good review, pretty much sums up my experience as frequent user. btw: your map at the beginning is wrong, the train goes via "Berliner Bahn" to Riesa, not "Dresdner Bahn" like shown
Oops, sorry 🙈
@@NonstopEurotrip One way to remember the routing provided you are interested in train simulators you purchase train simulator world 2 deluxe edition rush-hour disk you get Nahverkehr Dresden route where the ICE Frankfurt Am Main Dresden services uses the same path as the IC55 Köln Wuppertal Hagen Bochum Langendreer Dortmund Helmstedt Marienborn Magdeburg Leipzig Riesa-Dresden service by using the Berlin Dresden Line from Radebeul Ost Junction to the avoiding line
Best part of that trip was the stations with their impressive canopies. Stunning!
Absolutely Mark, stunning! 😊
Isn't this the default on any huge station ? On small stations only the platforms are covered. For a wide span you need a huge height, which was also necessary for the steam locomotives, in the time they were built. Dresden has a tent construction as a roof, designed by Sir Norman Foster. It's not glas any more. This needs less bars and enables more light.
@@holger_p Many UK stations have been built on for commercial reasons so have lost their canopies.
It would have been an idea to show and mention the narrow gauge steam railway at Radebuel Ost after leaving Dresden Neustadt station. Instead that was when you were fiddling around with the seat's functions. A glimpse of it was seen in the background at that point.
Thanks for the information ☺️
I travel between Dresden and stendal frequently and exclusively use the connections via Berlin specifically to avoid these trains. The seats are just awful, at least in 2nd class, worse than some regional trains I've been on. Add the still not completely solved swaying issue and you've got a recipe for a horrible trip. An hour or so is fine, any longer than that is just torture.
Yeah I can't imagine a longer journey is mega fun!
Yes the second class seats are not nice. However the train is walkable, so you can wald off any sitting sores. Or the 90 degree rotated ones allows to stretch the legs.
It‘s still a worse experience compared to the IC1
Nice video! I regularly ride these trains on the exact same route.
Most of these trains have free WIFI Service. I didn't see the symbol on the dividers in your video and you didn't mention it so i guess it was one of the few without this extra.
I also liked the old IC trains way more. Sometimes one of these still operates as a replacement on the route, when an IC2 breaks down.
The seats are really not very good in 2nd class. I rode the whole distance from Cologne to Dresden once and it is really not comfortable enough for such a long ride.
Thanks for the comment ☺️
Note that in second class there are different versions of the interior, they differenciate in minor things but its something to talk about:
You either get sunblinds or footrests in second class (idk about first class) on the Gäubahn Stuttgart at least
Thanks 🙏🏻
Great video, you surely put a lot of money (high price of the ticket!) and effort to ride by that train. Anyway, do they have problems because of the trains riding on that line? It's unbelievable - in Poland, there hardly ever is a good connection between big cities (for example Bydgoszcz and Toruń) - two capital cities of Kuiavia-Pomerania Voivodeship - trains with 3-4 cars, one deck, every two hours. I don't know where the problem is.
Yes there is still work to be done for sure 👍🏻
From across the pond in New Jersey, looks to me like somewhere in between NJ Transit and Amtrak. Definitely has some commuter equipment vibes!
Yes, but overall comfier imo
Excellent...!!!
Thanks Emilia 👍🏻
Interesting Video, I personally didn't know that the IC2 isn't allowed to operate in Switzerland! Now it makes Sense that the IC I recently saw at Darmstadt Hbf with the Destination of Zürich, Suisse was one of the old-fashioned IC1 from the Last century. To be honest, I Like this Design more than the modern one which really Looks Like a refitted RB "double-decker' train.
RB means Reichsbahn and not RedBull, which is more popular now in Germany and specifically Leipzig
@@o.-w.heinze1350 Oops, that was a little spelling mistake from me! I meant DB ofc 😅
Dass war ein sehr schönes Video
I have travelled on a few of these IC2 sets on the Karlsruhe - Stuttgart - Nurnberg route and also in the Hannover area and my opinions are very mixed. Fine for shorter journeys but not so good on 2+ hours at all. Their reliability is extremely indifferent and certainly seem better when running with Class 147.5 locos but oh those newer ones are appalling and have failed twice on me, mid journey.
Double deck intercity trains are not new and DB need to look at their SBB loco hauled cousins using a 460 locomotive and see what they should be following.
Agree for the most part. Having not experienced any problems myself, i can't comment on reliability 🇩🇪😊
DB ICE 2 intercity trains are incredible trains. I like how Germany relies on high speed and intercity railways as well local and regional railways. Plus Dresden station is amazing.
They do the job, but i prefer loco hauled ICs 🇩🇪😎
@Paseos por Madrid He never said this was...
Enjoyable video....😊
Thanks Raj 😁
It‘s basically a regio train with snacks, beverages and a juicy surcharge 😃 I don‘t like them, except of the good noise insulation wich is a huge upgrade to the old ICs from the 90ies
Pretty much 😂
About a restaurant car, it should be possible to integrate it on both levels maybe with some stairs, that the assistants can access both levels easily.
I don't think there's enough space 🤷🏻♂️
Or you use a car that hasn't two decks.
I have been on this train from Leipzig to Dresden just by accident as my initial train ICE4 from Freiburg to Frankfurt was late. I was acutually supposed to take the ICE-T from Frankfurt to Dresden but, due to the delay I got to travel in the IC from Leipzig. To be honest I liked more than the ICE service (mainly do to delays that are more common on ICEs than in ICs)
I have also travelled in the S-bahn trains of Dresden. Although similar with few obvious differences the IC2 trainsets are more comfortable.
Thanks for sharing 😊
Now Dresden and Leipzig are on my "bucket list!"
Good good 👌🏻😊
In Germany its more common seeing them as Regional Train, but the Intercity ones do look soooo much bettery cleaner and more comfy.
With carpets 😂
Considering the price of €13 for regular RE between Weilheim and Munich (60km), €17 for second class an longer distance seem like a really good price
Wow expensive! 😄
The IC2 is in my pov a good train. The comfort is really a difference to regional trains especially the 1st class. It is a lot better.
The max speed of 160km/h isn't really a problem because these trains travel on routes where they cant reach 200km/h like Stuttgart - Singen or Karlsruhe - Nürnberg. And the future routes won't be diffrent.
In Munich, Frankfurt, Hamburg and Berlin there are driving identical trains (without locos) as regional trains and they have the same seats as the ic2... just with other seat covers
@@_roshan._.537_ I know but dont forget, that these trains aren't so common anymore. They are only used on long distance regional trains where they replace in some cases old IR Routes like Stuttgart - Lindau or Hamburg - Flensburg. In most cases the regional trains have a worse comfort than the IC2.
I agree, mostly! 😁🇩🇪
Interesting video. IC2 seem to slot between conventional IC and RE, probably as intended. Is it an historic thing? Double deck always associated with lesser services than IC. Could be.
Maybe, but don't see why it should. I do prefer the loco hauled ICs myself 😎
As far as I know DB already had an option with Bombardier for RE Dostos and needed IC carriages quickly, so they were ordered in a version adjusted for IC services. They are also more or less operated as a fixed train set, because any alteration in the consist would require software modifications.
Complimentary Haribo? Sold!!
I know right 😁
quite usefull regional train - we have similar - a generation older (around 2000) but beetter inside designed - in Prague area. In plan to be replaced between 2027 and 2030
NICE
Thanks!
As an American, I think the IC is just fine, and SO much better than anything we have in the U.S.
I Love Leipzig Hbf, and first saw it in DDR times, when it was almost empty, and quite sad.
What a bustling place it is now! 👍😁
I agree, but i do prefer the older style loco hauled trains 👍🏻🙂🇩🇪
Looks like a Dutch Intercity.....
P.S. What App are you using to read the Kmh (speed)?
He probably used Speedometer.
It's called 'GPS Speedo' on Android 👍🏻
@@NonstopEurotrip Got it - thank you....
You don't actually need an app for these trains. The speed is displayed on monitors in the carriages.
I think most people who don't like these trains are just a bit spoilt...
Older German IC-trains and also the ICE trains are so amazing that German people seem to forget that - in a lot of other countries - IC trains don't have a bordbistro or bord restaurant on the train, don't ride with speeds of up to 200 km/h and don't offer incredibly comfortable seats... so yea... if you are used to the comfort of those trains and then you get this, while still paying (almost) the same as for one of those trains, I can understand that you might be a bit disappointed. And if you add to that that these trains are also used on some regional routes.. but that takes nothing away from the quality that these trains have and, as long as you don't have to travel for more than 4 or 5 hours, I think these trains are perfectly capable of doing a good job as Intercity trains.
A valid point of criticism could be, though, that the reliability of these trains has been a bit lacking. Especially the ones being pulled by a newer generation of Traxx locomotives has had a lot of reliability issues. That isn't really great of course, and I can very well understand that some people don't like these trains for that reason...
only because they dont use ironing boards doesnt mean they cant or shouldnt do better
Yes i agree in principal with most of this 😂
for me the quality of a trainset is decided when walking along the length of the train. The "comfiest" 70ies IC coach seems outdated when being in that super noisy area in between. Compared to the ICE that makes you forget there are separate waggons this IC2 set has only marginally more modern feel compared to the old ones when walking along, lot of up-and-downs for my taste.
Trains should be a nice alternative to a car (or even a plane), so a similar chair would be nice. It's more expensive and takes longer after all. But worst of all: trains already had those seats, but decided less comfort was good enough... For comfort one could upgrade to 1st class. Ok, fine. But now even 1st class seats have a lot left to be desired. I just don't understand it.
Another route where they run on is Ruhr Sieg Nord Hagen Hbf to Finnentrop Siegen Gißen Marburg Frankfurt Am Main IC34 line
Ah thank you 🙏🏻
Good film and interesting. You mention ticket prices - well here in UK a similar journey (Manchester to Birmingham 80 miles / 132 kms) a return ticket, no restrictions €105 2nd class and €253 for 1st class. And you think Germany is expensive! Seriously though are these prices meant to incentivize us to travel on a train??
I was travelling on an interrail pass so the price didn't matter too much. But yes I take your point, the German walk-up flexible fare with lounge access would be triple the supersparpreis fare too. 🇩🇪👍🏻
You've been in my hometown, Germanys most beautiful city Dresden, and didn't say "hello" to me? I'm very very sad about it! 😢😢😢
I did post it on Instagram, so if you didn't see it 😉
Good video. I have been to Leipzig too. That is where JS Bach was buried in a church / cathedral. As for IC2, as I see it in your video, the speed was 160 KPH ( 100 MPH ). I believe DB did this to lessen the speed fuer die UMWELT! I have experienced the ICE1 and they were superfast over 2 decades ago . Even the main car engine is NOT streamlined which causes DRAG and slows the speed of die zug. . The old ICE1 was much more aerodynamic thus can travel schneller. Und Ja, ich spreche ein bischen Deutsche auch.
These are the fleet of double deckers. They where made by Bombardier. From 2017-present.
I like the "gap filler" that extends to make boarding safer. The video shows the entry lower than the platform; is this because the platform is higher than standard?
It's pretty level!
Actually the entry areas of the double decker coaches are lower than standard. Otherwise they would have either an even steeper slope (to adjust to the lower deck level) or steps (bad for strollers and wheelchairs). But different platform heights are a completely different problem for german railways... There are three different heights: 38cm (old standard from 1905), 76cm (standard for far distance trains, but also for S-Bahns in several cities) and 55cm (started in the former GDR, being used by the double decker coaches for regional traffic). The IC DD wagons are the same ones like for regional trains, just a different interior. But IC is a far distance train, and this means, the 55cm wagons now stop at the 76cm platforms.
On the other side, the Deutsche Bahn tries to standardize all platforms to 76cm. They do this even at purely regional stations and stops, where only the 55cm wagons are being deployed. If they had future plans to replace the 55cm wagons with 76cm wagons - well, then this could make some kind of sense. But in reality, they are using more and more 55cm double decker wagons to increase capacity and even make double allocation of a platform possible (planned for new Stuttgart train station). So the result is, for double deckers the passengers almost always have to make a step, either up or down. There is a lengthy Wikipedia article only about the german "Bahnsteighöhe", which tries to explain the whole mess.
Why I don't like these trains: They're like a regional train, except the carpet. That is not an upgrade being worthy called a long-distance train when I can get the same comfort in regional trains. The other "IC2" (IC KISS) therefore I don't include in this contemplation, that's a really noble long-distance train.
I agree, the KISS sets are better 👍🏻
Taking this as some type of regional/commuter rail ... In Ontario with the GO trains for 100 km ride from Barrie to Toronto, you might pay ~$13 CAD or about $10.50 USD (one-way). The trainset has more storage than ours and we do not have any classes. OUr trains are limited to about 105 km/h and so 119 with stops might take a bit longer. However, if this was trip I had to take regularly, it would be expensive. .
If you have to commute with long distance trains DB offers special, monthly, tickets instead of individual ones every day.
And longer distances don't tend to cost that much more...
@@NonstopEurotrip It depends on when you book, DBs pricing system is similar to airlines where the prices get higher at peak booking times, or when the train is starting to fill up. If you book 6 months in advance, you can find tickets as low as 12€ for a 8h journey!
From a belgian perspective, this definitely an intercity, merely with bad chairs to increase the capacity. For sure they could learn a thing or two from our M6 and M7 fleet! The top speed is also rather sad considering Germany has the infrastructure for speeds of 200 and above. So it is a step back. Nice video!
Agree yes, but still not bad! 👍🏻
Nah, I think the M7s and the IC2s are the same comfort wise. Both pretty good. 160 is totally fine considering that DB is a private company compared to SNCB, so they need to make a profit with their operations (although they never once were profitable since more than 20 years...)
@@mstrmren The M7 chairs are super comfortable and offer much more legspace than the IC2's for sure. They are also much quieter! I wouldn't really call it close... In terms of speed I just find it sad that they are taking steps back instead of forward. Comfort at 200km/h would attract more travellers but I'm sure they considered all consequences! It's just "too bad"... :)
I can only talk about second class, but the seats on the IC2 are better than on M6. The latter also has too many seats in a vis-a-vis-setup, but is probably more designed to provide high passenger capacity on shorter distances. Apart from that, both carriages are really comfortable and both seem to have very stable ride characteristics.
@@patrickreuvekamp I think the vis-a-vis setup is something heavily dependant on the country where it serves. Belgians are pretty comfortable sitting across strangers, which I can easily see not being the case in others. I've actually had the chance to board a IC2 a few weeks ago and I still think the puffier M6 seats are more comfortable and stable, the same goes for the M7. I guess that's just up to personal experience! I'll however for sure stand with my opinion that the IC2 does not meet the standards DB has been setting when it comes to innovation and comfort...
As a person under 27, with the super Sparpreis young and a BahnCard25 the IC sometimes is cheaper and faster than the Regional train on that route😂. If you don't have a Semesterticket as a Student of Dresdens University and the Regional train is "free".
Wow that's excellent ☺️
I like IC2 trains. First class with single seats is much better than the outdated compartments in the older IC trains.
Agree, but prefer the style of the older trains 🚂
That's True 👍
These prices are way to expensive for this short journey.
DB prices depend heavily on how far in advance you book and the occupancy of the train. It's a bit of a hit and miss with huge differences in price on the same routes. But it pays to book far in advance and maybe be a little flexible.
I was travelling on an interrail pass so the price didn't matter too much, but yes, i agree 👍🏻
seems pricey for a 1h journey. The same flat fee would also pay for a 4-5h trip like Berlin>Munich on ICE trains. If combined with a BahnCard25 rebate I once got as low as 13,90€ for 2nd class single fare.
Historically (pre 2014) I used to spend 45+€ one-way with an expensive Bahncard50 to go 3,5h to visit my parents, nowadays I rarely pay more than 20€ only needing a BC25.
Personally I think that the seats are fine for an IC service and while they use similar seat models on their Regional trains it just shows how good the seats are compared to other Regional service in my opinion.
This IC2 is lightyears ahead of hungarian railways (MAV) IC. Most of the carr 30+ years old, no easy access (still you have to "climbe"to the cars) - and the hungarian IC top speed is 120km/h (but mostly ar around 100 km/h). Seats are uncomfortables, toilets are small and dirty, often without water (btw. exit from to toilets to directly to the rails...)
I've done a few MÁV ICs and I find them ok. I do prefer a loco hauled train over a unit though. Agree accessibility could be much improved though 👍🏻
The problem is that it's not consistent experience. If you're lucky and get a refurb coach it can be a great experience, but if you get a non refurbished one, then it's bad.
I traveled the ICE from Innsbruck to Nuremburg via Munich. I loved it because I LOVE trains however when we left Munich I was surprised because we suddenly started traveling backwards. I really don't like traveling backwards so that was a bit of a let down. Other than that it was quite satisfactory.
Well that's what happens at a terminus station 😂
You must have noticed that Munich HBF is a terminus station?
The last time I was anywhere near Leipzig was in 1976 when I was posted to West Berlin for a few weeks when stationed there with the British Army. There where only really two ways of getting to Berlin then, through a regulated road corridor or on the British military train which if memory serves me right left from Hanover and ran with only one stop at the East German border for a document check by the Russians. Have a comma or full stop in the wrong place and you where held on a Russian jail until the train returned. According to my docs I was a petty officer in the Royal Navy for some strange reason lol. But never the less it was a comfy train and no problems from thieves or hooligans as you where locked on the train and it was patrolled by armed guards lol
I guess it's changed a lot since then 🤣
6:52 I like the sticker.
🥰
I've taken this train from Leipzig to Hannover for 4 or 5 times now and it's okay. Just like people say - long distance service in a "better regional train"
True yeah 🤣
@@NonstopEurotrip I never had a chance to try the Stadler Kiss version DB got from the austrian Westbahn. They should be a bit better.
ICE has priority, IC is the second, regional #3.
If something unexpected happened, they ensure that the ICE is in time and IC has to wait.
Aye yes! And the ICEs still run late loads 😂
@@NonstopEurotrip The main Problem is, that a late train has always priority in germany. In Switzerland, a late train has onle priority if he is not mor than 10 minuts late. If a train has a heighter delay it goes to the lowest prio and has to wait on any ither train. With this system Switzerland prevents a domino effect. You can see this domino effect in Germany verry god.
But In Switzerland delays of 10 minutes are really rare.
@@unifaeggi Exactly, whereas in Germany..... 😅
Regarding the price. I think 17 Euro for a second-class seat is fine. The DB has to fight with sustainability anyway but a seat for something between 10-15 Euro for that distance would be a treshold to bring even more people on the train.
Yes I think that's fair 😊
Come back for WGT. Beats the heck out of New Jersey rail. Hahahaha.
😂😂😂
Mantap kawan👍
😎😎😎
Hummm, weren't the previous IC sets capable of 200 km/h? Some of the lines they use certainly are, so these trainsets might not be quite suited for this service.
The idea is that this train set will only be used on tracks that don’t allow higher speed anyway.
However I was en route with one of those train sets on the highspeed line between Mannheim and stuttgart and it took about 1 1/2 as long as it would with an ice
The IC2 trains only replace IC1 trains on routes where the lower highspeed doesen't make a huge difference. All other services will be replaced with ICE 4 or ICE L train sets.
The IC 2 carriages are designed for 189 km/h but currently there are no Traxx locos available that are authorised to this speed. The loco and carriages are licensed as a unit like an ICE 1. So you can not add carriages or swap the loco for i.e. a 101. And they would lack the WTB connection that these sets use.
Yeah once they can use the 190kmh locos, hopefully time savings will come too?
Very little to complain about except…….the price which seems expensive. 👍🏻🏴
Yeah I agree 😊
this flat fee super saver price would apply for much longer journeys too, doesn't correspond with the distance traveled like the regular fare.