As a grown adult tho, it doesn't matter to me if it's a moped. I HAVE a driver's license anyway, and I wear a helmet. And to be fair, this happened with 49cc mopeds back in the day, they were only bikes if you were pedaling. And I personally don't give a shit if kids under 16 can ride them or not. So, unless there's registration and insurance it doesn't matter to me.
@@ericlindauer7150 I'm not sure what your replying to sir. I was laughing at the JOKE about the HOA running the government....you look like a biker like myself so idk what's going on...
@@drewnelson3149 I think all these bicycle riders should be made to license their bicycles. If they want to feel entitled enough to cut me off in traffic, they should pay registration.
@@bartholomewceremony6981 Woke garbage talk - as usual - as some people behave foolishly and resent govt attempts to rein them in!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
California: “Pedal your powerless bike up hills while sideshows and dirtbike wheelieboys carry on worry free and flip off the one cop they might see in a month”
Florida is right there with California. E-Bike laws in Florida are changing too. It's all of the united states. More and more oppression to show you who's Boss.
Using stupid comments like that do not help the topic most cities in california are not lawless . And those that are probably voted for donold Chump the most criminal man ever elected to be president so they could be lawless. I want protection from you. For simple transportation 28 mph is fine get the plate and DL if you want to go faster. most people won't be riding ebikes in rain or snow and I don't know if there are studded bike tires but you will need them for snow and specially Black ice in the early mornings. oh Pedro my hair is the same color as yours and Ive been riding motor cycles since 1969
Also, dont leave California and head to neighboring states complaining about the shithole that it is- while still voting the same way that caused this hot mess in the first place. Leave WA alone.
@@MikeSmithers That is rare because most of the bills Newsom has passed INCREASED spending on the latest “sanctuary” initiative that is trending. Nobody seems to care about that but they worry about ebikes? WTF is wrong with them people?
I live in the Bay Area California and the cops out here don’t care about e-bikes at all. They have bigger issues to deal with. It really comes down to what city in California you’re living in.
@stevej6824 Exactly. I'm pretty sure people who live in the high desert towns of California don't worry about ebikes. In small desert towns, they don't care about mini-bikes riding on streets either. Yes, bigger crimes.
Riding my e bike in the East Bay, I get the same vibes. Just don't stand out. Meaning, my ebike with a throttle can go up to 35. I keep it at 28. Don't go over.
@ Same here, I live in Oakland. I’ve got a Motor Goat V3 that’ll do 40+ MPH. But I leave it on a lower setting that’ll keep me between 28 and 32 and I’ve never been bothered by any police.
@@UltraBrian California the LA area decades ago made a law where pedal bikes have to be registered and have a sticker with serial number. Don't bet on it.
We have so many laws there is a book called "3 felonies a day" because the laws are SO ONEROUS they make us all criminals in "the land of the free" 😂what a joke
@ yes many of us owned cars and are paying those taxes, I have several cars and motorized RVs, as well as motorcycles, I have paid for the roads in my entire life! You think I’d be able to ride a bicycle on one?
@@christheisgen5683 So you advocate a "pay to play" or nothing ehh? Because I don't want the roads, nor want to pay for them but in order to simply go places I need to be *on* them at minimum as the pavement is everywhere now. So free people can just "shove it" in your opinion?
@@christheisgen5683 How do I do life w/out using pavement? I primarily ride a hay powered horse, then next a man powered bike and occasionally when I go far... on my DIY'd Ebike I made myself and acquire the power myself. I drive on 4 wheels for fun only and in a race/prerun setting. I get it, you feel I must use the system you bought into, or nothing. ............ ua-cam.com/video/v7cxaZaD-TM/v-deo.html
It's about classifying electric motorcycles as motorcycles... buckle up... over 20mph will require a motorcycle endorsement, plates, lights and insurance.
@@JoeStanek-vu7rllet me get this straight. Say you have an e-bike that only goes 30mph max. You think putting this bike on the road that can’t even speed up fast enough, like an actual motorcycle, to get out of the way to save the riders life from a 4000lb death machine is a good idea? You are part of the problem, bud.
@@mikeswanson6145 Cops do as they are ORDERED to BY OUR WOKE AND RADICAL SOCIALIST POLITICIANS!!!!!!!!!! BLAME THE WOKE POLITICIANS who can and will punish cops who do not follow Woke ORDERS FROM POLITICAL SUPERIORS!!!!!!!!!!!
How funny! I was driving my car at 30 miles per hour and a platoon of about 10 guys on road racing bikes passed me as if I was walking. They hate people on e-bikes, they call us names and bully us all the time. This new law is unfair and discriminatory! Thousands of seniors use them as their primary method of transportation!
Unless you were going downhill, I call bullshit. The average speed of a pro peloton on flat ground is between 25-28 mph. These are tour pro riders. I rode road bikes for years and am now on an e bike. I would average about 17 mph on my road bike. My e bike is a lot faster. The young kids on e bikes are the one's causing the issues, and why the laws are changing. I'm in So Cal. There are complaints everyday on Nextdoor about these kids breaking traffic laws and terrorizing pedestrians, and even car drivers. They're riding high voltage e bikes capable of 35-40 mph speeds and have no consideration for other riders, pedestrians, or cars. They're no better on the bike paths. They ride like idiots.
SENIORS DO NOT RIDE AT RECKLESS SPEEDS as too many younger riders do!!!!!!!!! As always the reckless few spoil things for the MANY others!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You wanna know who ruined it for everyone? Large groups of 13-15 year old boys with modified bikes doing +32mph doing wheelies down public roads, running red lights and stop signs day and night. You don’t need to go outside of South Orange County, specifically Dana Point to witness this.
Ah huh and what did boys do all the generations before them? We made ramps, modified to remove excess weight, made go carts, mopeds, when we got a license we modified our cars to go faster and look cooler. This is nothing new. This is a bunch of Karen’s and Ken’s that complain and give no space for teens to be be teens. Skateparks. Bmx parks. Paintball. All things are “banned” cause you all want your perfect neighbor hoods.
@@loamtrailer805 Actually no, I used to race bicycles and only a well trained athlete can sustain 32 mph for any length of time. The e-bike craze is also effecting the mountain bike environment, it used to be that only the fitter riders were able to get back, and deep, into the few wild areas of Orange County, and now that's no longer the case, trails are getting torn up by the torque available with an e-bike. Just imagine the encountering a wild eyed e-biker descending a narrow trail, coming straight at you. He's no longer riding a bike somewhere around 20lbs, he's fully decked out with moto-cross style helmet and pads, you thought you would enjoy the serenity of a once pretty trail.
@markthomas207 dude my analog free ride mtb weighs 34 lbs. I don't ride on hiking trails and if a hiker is on a trail with banked turns, they shouldn't be hiking there. A regular XC bike still does as much erosion as a 34 lb analog bike. Not sure what you're trying to get across.
California "Safety Laws" are never about Safety. It is always a law to create revenue through fines. I drove 18 wheelers for 24 years. I've seen their weigh stations remain open, long after trucks were backed up along the ramp, well onto the highway. No care in the world for Safety having commercial vehicles stopped on the highway. So long as they had a long line of potential revenue cha chings in line. Safety was nose bleed section. Same can be said with their registration practices. Being the most expensive state to register your vehicle in. California by anymeans, wants to suck every last dollar out of its citizens through, fees, taxes and fines. It is why I have always called the state a communist state. It dictates the lives of it citizens and visitors every minute of the day.
Throttles come in handy for two reasons. One is to give a few seconds of torque when leaving intersections and getting up to speed. These bikes are heavy and need a boost to get going. Two is for hill climbing. I have a single gear bike and use throttle, along with pedal assist and brisk pedaling to get up hills.
I only see content creators talking about this CA law, who are NOT in CA themselves. They don’t care here. No one is even messed with while riding emoto. Only a few cities are enforcing anything. Newport Beach recently tried using speed guns which is honestly exactly how the law should work. Bust people for speeding like you do cars. The powertrain, kw, top speed, or having pedals, are all irrelevant. You should be judged for how you ride and not how capable your bike is.
@SirRidezAlot yes you are correct about people talking about it elsewhere but you don't like to hear this kind of talk because these ideas bleed everywhere.
Gavin: “Bob, any stupid ideas that will kill the EV bike market? People are having to much fun!” Bob: “Sure do, let’s make 96.2% of all existing bikes ILLEGAL”
@@oregonebikermark8953 you know, they could potentially hurt their own "go green efforts. " All of the older Riders which may be a little weaker or heavier that can't pedal a 750 watt e-bike about 100 lb up hills. I can see a lot of burnt up controllers. I really hope people in California don't buy e-bikes or at least the older crew. You would think they would be a little smarter but we'll see. I can see a lot of e-bikes in the garbage the next few years in California because people have had enough with not enough power.
RadPower’s Radster models have motors designed to provide as much torque and speed as competitors’ motors that peak between 1200 and 1500W while peaking at only 750W. It can be done. It’s more efficient. Most brands simply cheap out and just pump more current through them.
Cops don’t pay attention or care much about people on ebikes and escooters unless you’re being reckless speeding down the street or running stop signs and red lights, or getting into accidents… so just don’t do that…. My 3 escooters are my primary form of transportation… and I follow the rules of the road, because that’s what we’re supposed to do… and I’ve never had a cop stop me on any of my escooters… 🤷🏽♂
i stopped and asked a cop here if they care and he said they don't. as long as im not doing a wheelie down the street. i pulled up to him on my modded talaria mx4 that looks just like a dirt bike.
Cops are lazy, they will only do what’s necessary. However, when you cause an accident or injure someone on your illegal e-bike say goodbye to your house. Be smart.
I live in the North Bay Area, and we can't even get the police to respond to calls promptly! The only way they respond fast is if there is a gun involved. Sometimes they don't respond to calls at all. They don't have time for important stuff so they need to leave the bikers alone! Period!
I’ve been riding for years a Chinese hub motor modded throttle e-bike that goes 35mph and 1400w. I ride smart and safe. Ridden past police and they don’t care. CA is dumb.
Remember who these people work for. It’s about time you voice your disapproval and force them to obey us or get them removed. Why do we pay taxes for them to regulate us. The only way to change laws is by becoming active.
@jaybomb5022 sad thing is, I would not bet against that. The curious thing is to see if she even makes it to the candidacy. What makes Pelosi look worse, if she does or does not win the candidacy, and if she does or does not win? Because Pelosi was key in throwing Biden out
@@RedBud315 uh, there are at least some throttles that *are* levers. My former bike (was stolen) and my current bike have those. Helps a lot when your knees start to really hurt a ways out from home, say on the way back from paying bills, getting groceries, or going to the doctor. Did all three yesterday. I pedaled as much as I could - about twenty miles - and used throttle the rest of the way, until the battery was looking iffy (50 volts or so) and I had to get on the train so as to get most of the way home. The battery is starting to “lose ground,” as until a few months ago, that 47-49 mile round trip was relatively do-able through pedal or “left thumb.” Note: throttle is usually bottom or second cog on the sprocket, and going much faster than 10-12 mph then is rare. I’m more or less in “limp home mode” then, as usually the fatigue and/or pain is a real problem, as it was yesterday, and I *needed* a nap once I got home.
Having two electric Bicycles myself. Next time you see an e-bike on the streets. And it Doesn't Have any peddle's, sprockets or chains, IT'S Not a E- Bicycle. It's classified as a electric Dirt-Bike. Thus illegal to ride on the streets. Or a electric Street bike. That requires turn signals, brake light, etc. That does require a registration to ride on the streets. Heck some of thease Electric Dirt Bike manufacturers even offer fake Peddle kits. 😶🌫️ And because of it and our incompetent gov.🙄 all of the E- bicycles groups are paying for it
You can throttle to 20. I asked two cops and they said that if im doing 20 and under it wouldnt wven be legal for them to stop me to check out the bike specs.
@oregonebikermark8953 true but I just keep it at the setting where the throttle only goes 20. One of thw cops told me he has a bike similar to mine and he rides it to work everyday. I live in Sacramento and people out here smoke meth out in the open like it's a cigarette. I think the cops are not going to worry about people riding safely.
@@MrDucksBill they may care about the e-bike perps only because they're the ones that will take a ticket and not be unpredictable and may not be violent if they get arrested or fined. The E bikers will just be the easier ones to get money from. Which ones do you think will be easier to get money from? The normies or not the Normie's?
Unfortunately, if your bike is able to be unlocked or modified to go faster than 20 mph, and has a throttle: It is no longer considered to be an e-bike. 😢 That’s the situation I’m in, so I’m gonna remove my throttle which will convert it to a class 1 e-bike.
As an avid walker (to work, grocery stores, banks, etc.) this law is a true life safer for e-bikers using sidewalks with pedestrians. Daily I'm startled by an e-biker on the sidewalk whizzing by without a word, no toot, no 'On your right!' They'd take us both out if I happened to move into their space unwittingly due to a perceived issue or just not expecting someone going 20+miles per hour behind me. Don't say e-bikers shouldn't be on the sidewalk as to be honest, if I had an e-bike I'd most certainly be on the sidewalk due to the narrow streets and preoccupied drivers (texting, eating, etc., so common!). If e-bikers would exercise restraint when passing a pedestrian, it would be less dangerous for us all, but evidently parents are not training their kids to respect pedestrians (90% are disrespectful, I walk approximately 3-4 days out of 7 for enjoyment and health.) I welcome this law for all that use the sidewalks.
@@jeangreen432 if I *have* to use sidewalks, I tend to slow *way* down (~5-7mph or less) - and get off of them as fast as possible. If I encounter anyone, I give them the right of way. Yes, I’m of retirement age. I cannot afford the operating costs of a more-conventional vehicle, and my ability to endure public transport is very limited - as in the sensory overload is exhausting.
As an old guy in a wheelchair my only complaint is when they’re flying by on a narrow sidewalk at 30 If you’re going to go that fast do it on the street! I’ve come very close to being hit as well as my service dog
There was once a time in the U.S. and other countries in which the politicians held a common ideology that supported the average citizen to live their lives freely to practice their rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness with impunity within their safe conduct.
Ride safe, under class 3 bike speeds, keep to bike lanes, slow down around pedestrians if u have to take sidewalks, and u won't have anything to worry about.
@@mkeonine that’s more or less what I do, only I stay under 20 unless I’m coasting downhill, under 6-7 if I *must* go on the sidewalk (stay well clear of other people then; there’d better be a good reason to get on them, and get off as soon as is possible) - and I am still concerned.
@@dennisyoung4631 What kind of bike u have?. I've got the Motor goat v3, in Orange co. CA. I've yet to see anybody with their ebikes pulled over since the new rules implementation. I just ride it the way I've always ride since day 1. That's not to say there won't be issues in the future. Nobody knows. I'm concerned too. I'm looking at other back up bikes, more legal, just in case the day ever comes. We'll see.
@ self-constructed from parts over the course of a year (took that long to get all the parts). BBS-HD, 26 inch wheels, 31 Amp hour battery (which is going to need rebuilding within a year or so, as far as I can tell) hydraulic disks with 180mm rotors. Total cost was “plenty” - didn’t keep records. Is geared for pulling power rather than speed. “It goes fast enough to suit me.”
Eventually, the law makers of California will reason that a skateboard is a vehicle and mandate that everyone register their skate board at some makeshift DMV style department of the California government agency.
If e- bikes are supposed to be a realistic alternative to cars, they need to have throttles and powerful motors.....A 750 watt motor and no throttle will tempt virtually no one to ride their bike instead of their car,,,,. This law is so silly - it will lead to more cars on the roads, which means more pollution and more serious accidents.....Is there a desperate car-lobby behind this madness I wonder......
You are aware that in Europe, the only e-bikes that can be ridden on the same paths as regular bikes are not throttle, pedal assist to 25KPH (15.5 MPH), and max 250 watts of power. Anything past that requires licensing and registration and this cannot be used on the same paths as regular bikes in most cases. It seems to work for them.
E Bikes are not a realistic replacement for cars and motorcycles. In 99% of Americans lifestyle an E bike is just an additional transportation choice. Bikes and E Bikes can never fully replace their larger, better equipped and more convenient competitors. Just one extra choice for those that can somehow incorporate them into life. For the vast majority of families and individuals with a busy daily life, a car, bus or train is going to be the best bet. A bicycle is just an additional luxury to most persons lifestyle.
Since the only difference between a legal class 2 bike and an illegal class 3 bike is the max speed (20 instead of 28 mph), I predict a lot of city cops will be clocking e-bikes and ticketing anyone over 20 mph if they are not pedaling. This sounds like a way to harass most kids on their way home from school and cause parents untold grief. Such nonsensical arbitrary laws need to be overturned. If they are concerned about 28 mph, then just make a 20mph max speed for e-bike engines and grandfather previous bikes.
Personally I think that law went into effect so they can go after the SurRons because even though they are electric dirt bikes, a lot of people who own them are trying to say they are e-bikes to justify riding them everywhere
Sue Ron's are classified as not being street legal because they do not have lights, turn signals and a brake light. Now if you remove the pedals off of an e bike it's not considered street legal. The new law is stupid.
This is the same way government went after drones, every law and regulation imaginable! Every time I go to a park there is a no drone sign! Sex, alcohol, littering, rape, speeding, etc. is permissible.
At what point is an ebike an electic motorcycle that you have to licence and insure. I had to sell my class 1 emtb because they consider it a motorcycle on mtb trails. Ive seen a lot of people getting carried away going 40 mph on modified surrons on streets or even sidewalks and think to myself your not helping people be more accepting of ebikes. One way of looking at it if an ebike requires human power (IE pedal assist) to operate its at least partially a human powered vehicle, If its throttle driven then you could argue its a motorcycle, even little mopeds back in the eighties had to be licensed. Theres a lot of grey area here to figure out and people that push laws to their limits make it so we cant have nice things anymore unfortunately
I've seen those same videos of people on Surron's riding on peoples front lawns right up to doorways on apartment building and thinking someone is going to accidently step out on front of this fool and he might kill them.
Well consider for a second WHY it is that people tend to "push laws to their limits"... Why do you think that is? Is it because human beings are criminal by nature, are we born inherently opposed to laws? Or might it be that the vast majority of people simply have the desire to be free to do as they wish so long as they're not harming anyone else? And this is a heavily debatable topic, I realize. I'm not saying that people should be allowed to do whatever they wish so long as nobody else is harmed. Because there will be times when harm comes or is done to others via the actions of other people. So things can become incredibly complex very quickly, especially when you factor in human emotions, which often tends to fuel our resolve, or our desire to impose our will over others, which inarguably seems to always, without fail, lead to the corruption of goodwill and morality. People are very prone to the human condition. Once a person or a group of people get a taste of power, interesting dynamics begin to manifest in countless ways. Our species, as intelligent as we currently are or fancy ourselves as being, are still incredibly flawed in our ability to exist harmoniously alongside the rest of the living world and especially amongst our very own kind. We have not come anywhere close to achieving such an existence collectively as a whole in all of recorded history, as far as I'm aware. So don't be so quick to point a finger at other people for "ruining it for everyone else" . This has always been so and likely always will be in this world. Has there ever been a rule established by man that's never been broken by another? Has there ever been a time when all people simply lived and let live? No. And I'm not sure if there ever will be or certain that's even possible. Because there is no light without dark. It's yin and yang, black and white, good and evil... With a vast gray area in between representative of the eternal struggle between the two. In the end perhaps the best one can hope for is perfect balance. Not heaven exclusively nor Hell eternally. And this may seem to be a very philosophical comment to be had in relation to the video, but my point is that, as far as I can tell, people will always resist control beyond what they believe is reasonable or necessary, and sometimes even If they know that it is. It's part of human nature. We impose rules and laws and regulations for fear that the entire world might fall into complete chaos and bedlam without them, and yet here we are with no shortage of those very things in any corner of the globe that I'm aware of in spite of all our efforts. Are we really achieving any good by appointing others to uphold the laws, in the name of what is right, rather than being obliged to do it ourselves? I believe that's where our error actually lies. We delegate the responsibility of doing what's right or what's in the best interest of the people to particular government agencies, placing the power in their hands in good faith, rather than keeping it in our own and believing ourselves responsible enough for the task.
Id say anything capable of 28+ mph with the smallest rated rider should require a license. Mopeds & Scooters, like you mentioned, require(d) it so these should as well. These may even be worse since they're quiet. Kids rip through cars all over and are a real problem. Anyone with a driver's license should be quite alright, but a minor child should NOT be permitted to ride one capable of those speeds on any public roads. I see them more times than not, on sidewalks which is a huge problem. Now extorting people for more money just because, that's total BS, but typical of our idiots in Suckramento.
They are trying to stop e-bikes from becoming what they have essentially become = electric motorcycles. Most people I see riding ebikes are not pedaling, but riding it like a motorcycle.
They seem to be a menace in affluent neighborhoods. Their parents buy them an ebike so they don’t have to drive their kids around. Some of the kids respect traffic laws BUT there are more kids breaking the law and making poor choices riding their bikes. It’s not just kids, adults are just as bad or worse.
Leave it to the state government of California to destroy anything that would be fun or advantageous to be able to exercise. I truly can't understand why E bikes would be bad for the people. Just that the government has too much power.
@mikerotchburns1622 it's not so much the throttle helping you to exercise it's there to assist you on pullouts in intersections and Hills riding on a 80lb ebike. If you take that away then you'll just have people that might get an e-bike not get any bike. Then those people probably won't get a bike at all because the thought of powered assist is gone....remember ebikes are portly
@@jessesmith2922 well "Pup" ive been riding bikes and hiking all long as i can remember until a few years back my old ass knees caught up with me and now very hard to do either.My 90 lbs fat tire ebike now allows me do get back out hit the trails I dont use throttle only I pedal when I can and the assist is not so painful and stressful on the knees. So when i was 30 or even 40 it wood not have been as you say "exercise" but nearing 60 I find anything that gets you outdoors and moving is exercise. Peace.
The problem that we are facing in San Diego is that kids are riding surrons in bikeways where kids and other cyclist are riding skateboard, skates, tricycle and regular bikes. They crash constantly and nany are teens without helmets or disregard to anyone. I own a class 1 mountain bike and only use it at the trails or on the street to get to the trails.
I live in California and ride a Fat Murf e-bike responsibly at the beach near my house. I use it as therapy and exercise for my knee which I had replaced a few years ago. I grow weary of the arrogant and wreckless teenagers riding the Suron bikes as if they are badasses in a mototcycle gang. We have already had a bike path along the beach in San Clemente closed to e-bikes because of these irresponsible kids and their over powered e-bikes and I am annoyed that us responsible e-bike riders are now having to deal with ridiculous state laws because of these punks on their e-bikes
E bikes are game changers for Seniors with many healthy benefits . They have a whole different outlook, its not about speed . They can now go where they used to be able to walk or hike to fresh air , scenery and out of the house ! As far as safety goes there are countless other safety issues they cant even get a handle on . I personally dont need over 20 mph but Im more than capable of determining that . Smh !
Anyone driving a car in California is concerned about these kids on e bikes. They don't know the traffic laws and nobody wants to see them get hurt. Last night a kid was in the middle of the road doing 25+ with no lights. It's no different than a motorcycle. The hazards are the same.
Trek sold me a 78 pound bike a year ago , knowing I have mobility issues with both knees . Ok no throttle , what happens if iam unable to pedal for many reasons the throttle was a great life saver. I see a class action suit in the near future. People wont stand for this .
It's a "nothing-burger". They won't waste their time stopping and inspecting every E-bike that they see. As long as you're riding responsibly, they won't bother you. HOWEVER, if you're riding recklessly, being a public nuisance, or riding intoxicated, this rule would help justify confiscation of the bike.
As an Electric Bike Master Mechanic in the Bay Area, I can attest the main reason is that if you could pedal to get the speed to 28 mph (average rider can do that in short burst only), you qualify as experienced rider which is much safer than the Class 2 (rather e-scooter) claimed to be eBike, since the pedals are there just for classification purpose. Mostly those e-Scooters like Super73 ridden by kids come with throttle and the little guys can crank that thing up to 30+ mph. Many parents bought for their kids as toys but the little people may end up hurting themselves and others. Moreover, it's unlawful to ride electric scooters on bike trail! Now, if the law went into effect, folks may have to bring those electric scooters to an electric bike shop to deactivate the throttle, however, those so called e-Bikes were designed mainly to be used with throttle, pedaling will not be very efficient!
I'm not against e-bikes, considering getting one myself, likely Class-III w/o a throttle. Class-III e-bikes have no throttle by federal definition. Having a "Class-III" e-bike with a throttle means it's no longer a Class-III e-bike. What to call it is a different topic.
@@oregonebikermark8953 True, but that's the US federal definition and we all know federal regulations are always crystal clear 🙂 I found this clarification on the MassBike page: "The 20 MPH threshold applies when the e-bike is being operated “solely” under motor power. However, e-bikes are most commonly ridden under a combination of human and motor power. The federal definition does not provide a top speed for when an e-bike is being operated under combined human and motor power. The class 3 definition clarifies this ambiguity by specifying the maximum assisted speed for e-bikes at 28MPH."
More than likely they won’t do anything to your non-complying bike until they have some other reason to stop you like a traffic stop. At that point you’ll probably receive the citation as well as a fix it ticket and you’ll have to prove you’ve removed your throttle or whatever. Agree, it’s a dumb law and makes no sense.
There is a grey zone, IMHO, with these e-bikes. The Class 3 e-bikes appear to have pedals so they can be categorized as e-bikes instead of low powered electric motorcycles. The off road/trail use of e-bikes is becoming a problem on public trails. In the case of the USFS, there are trails designated only for muscle power and livestock with no motorized travel. So, while pedal powered mountain bikes are allowed, there is an arising conflict with e-bikes. As the wattage (horsepower) of e-bikes increases, e-bikes evolve from pedal assisted bikes to motorcycles with pedals. They are fast and virtually silent and often, when encounters occur between these bikes and people on horseback, the horse gets startled, and the rider is caught off guard. There are USFS designated trails for motorized travel and that's where e-bikes belong.
This is why there must be a committee of logical postulation to regulate incoming laws especially for California.The laws being passes are clearly not being thought through or are being past for wrongful reasons.Too many of these beuarcrats are being paid by lobbyists or are resting dead on their laurels and too comfortable and dont want to process information thoroughly enough.
They will most likely make peeps with E bikes register them as motor vehicles, because if you think about it, it is pretty much a motor vehicle at this point. They did the same thing to mopeds in the 70s and a lot of riders got upset over it.
I've been expecting this for years. Built my first ebike in 2006 and complied with what the laws of the time were. However, I've watched these manufactured versions come out that are essentially nothing but motorcycles with pedals attached. They are able run at speeds up to 50mph and weigh well over a hundred pounds. One of my concerns has always been riders who haven't ridden a bicycles in a long time and get out on an overpowered bike and cause an accident. And I've seen a number of novice riders although no direct accidents yet. Many people may remember the same thing happened to mopeds back in the 1970's. I would bet, that eventually we'll have to get tags and insurance on ebikes also.
No offense, but all these laws apply only to manufactured bikes. They are not applicable to kits. Period! So you understand, all these laws are for manufacturers, which are eligible for all KINDS of state programs.
Build your own bike? Oh well, it's illegal to take it to any shop. Oh, you have a Pedego? Here, take it to Pedego, where they get discounts from the state and such👍
Most e-bikes have throttles and I can't imagine them outlawing something so many people already have. I imagine this law was put into effect for the SurRons
Pedal assist be more dangerous. One time, I was leaving my local mini-mart with pedal assist on. I had to make a tight turn to get into the bike lane, and as soon as I started pedaling, it almost shot me straight into traffic. Pedal assist tries to accelerate you to a specific speed before easing up. I quickly hit my brakes and forked my handlebars. I fell off and got dinged up but, luckily, not hit by a car. This law is as ill-conceived as it can be, and I don't plan to pay it any attention.
I get that. Throttle helps me ease on. But if I'm throttling and up the mode then it kinda accelerates to quickly. I wouldn't buy a speed demon I don't feel that safe going above 15 m.p.i anyway lol
I hate models that do that, but there are others available that would be safer. For ones with cadence sensors, there are speed-based and current-based PAS. Think of the first as cruise control with speed presets, think of the latter as throttle presets. The first is what you have and I despise it. I’m actually getting rid of my Espin Nesta because it uses a speed-based power management system. It threw me off the bike twice when I first got it. I increased the number of levels from 5 to 9 and set the speed limits for the first two levels really low, so it only has the chance to send 400-500W of power through the motor before it reaches the speed targets, unlike the 900-1000W it did before. It still surges when I go up through the levels, which I don’t like as it can make me lose control in a turn, and I’d never ride in a group with it due to the surging. For bikes with torque sensors, PAS levels set multipliers on your effort. The more effort you put into the pedals, the more effort the motor supplies. This offers the most amount of control and feels more natural to people who are used to riding non-motorized bikes. Some models also come with throttles for when you need more help than you can exert yourself, some have an additional layer of “maintain peak speed” achieved so long as pedal fast enough (I think that’s what Lectric’s PWR Plus does on their torque sensor models), some have software that lets you tell the bike to treat the torque sensor as an on/off switch like a cadence sensor is treated (Velotric Discover 2, Euphree Stellar Falcon are two models I’m aware of that offer this feature, but it’s a simple software change so any torque sensor bikes could do this), so you have both power management styles available in the same bike. Now, for that last group, you need to check with the brand to see whether that cadence sensor mode on their torque sensor bikes uses a speed or current-based system.
I grew up in the 80s and owned a moped. In order to use my moped I needed a license insurance and a helmet. I see that coming next for ebikes. They travel just as fast or faster than a moped.
Because extra power is required to climb hills and have better acceleration. If every car had a limit of 65 MPH it would be unsafe merging onto a highway, incapable of climbing hills or even reaching the speed limit with a few passengers. It would also be running at maximum RPM putting more stress on the vehicle than necessary.
@@HawkAlumn Yes, you could and if it wasn't for the auto industry lobbying congress with millions of dollars it may have been the case by now. It won't be long before speeding becomes a thing of the past when self driving cars become a standard.
I ride the bike trails and really enjoy them. One of the most dangerous people I see there are people riding regular bikes and one wheel and scooters doing way in excess of the posted speed limit.
Here in California, class 3 has always been pedal assist only just like class 1. The new laws are aimed at the sales of the high speed ebikes. The lega9in the new laws are focused on the capable throttle speed and wattage of the motors. Its ridiculous and more of a money grab than anything else. Im sure that car lobbyists are behind a lot of these stupid laws.
California gave the us the 28 mph class 3 bikes, and now it has put in a new law that takes away the throttle... Primarily from New bikes coming into the market, I'm sure. This will also change the national ebike landscape, for worse in my opinion. If people are concerned about inconsiderate ( excessively fast) ebike use around pedestrians on multi use paths, there are other ways to go about it like a coordinated public education campaign and coordinated signage. Throttles are incredible useful on an e bike that is being used primarily for transportation usage, for accident avoidance in some circumstances, and for starting up at intersections.
Don't confuse eBikes with electric motorcycles. Bicycles aren't intended to be an alternative highway-legal mode of transport. This is practically a non-issue.
I had two spinal fusion operations. I can't pedal a bike constantly even though the power takes over when you do pedal the bikes. What about those who have no use of legs?
@@arguescreamholler “…or limited use of their legs…” Lots of older people (e.g. 64-5, with serious chronic health problems) can pedal up to a point, but after a certain mileage, it either starts to hurt too much, or the fatigue becomes too great to continue (to pedal). That left thumb lever allows me to get home, then - and the usual is to need a nap within an hour or two - *like yesterday, or last Monday!*
I do agree with you. I dont agree with the law. Its stupid. I use the throttle to speed up to safe speeds (28 mph). Some over passes with freeway entrances get messy. As an ebike user, i throttle away from all the cars and big rigs.
This is basically like a jaywalking law. Only in the most HOA, Karen-ridden towns will any cops actually give out tickets or take away bikes. The only negative that may come from this is it may force some of the e-moto companies based in CA to move out or close.
I assume the issue is that electric bicycles are relatively new, but increasing in speed. So much so, they will eventually become very much like street motorcycles - which are licensed, insured, and tagged. What's the fundamental difference between an electric bicycle, and a street motorcycle - it's the motor and drivetrain technology. Or maybe officials are trying to keep some separation between traditional bicycles - which you do have to pedal and are not very regulated, and their electric powered bicycles, which they are beginning to regulate, as they advance in speed and assumed danger?
There are a lot of pros and cons about E-bikes related to protecting youngsters and oldsters from getting hurt or killed, preventing increases in road traffic hazards and car and liability insurance issues. Similar to motorcycle and bicycle helmet regulations.
yep, I'm one that is using my E-scooter as my legal alternative mobilty scooter going into town shopping, paying bills, & to apointments v/s the slow 4 mph mobilty scooter trying to cross a busy road they raised the speedlimited not putting in cross walk lights lol, Like many mobilty disabled, we have no-cost legal services to defend us in court.
i think an argument can be made in that case. a Sacramento couple , disabled, had a powered 3 wheel cart they used for shopping, successfully argued that it was legally an ada protected machine. they drove it on the side of the street without any further trouble.
I followed the legislative path on this, a little, the final results are quite different from what had been working its way through several iterations. California thought to clarify the definitions but still messed up. Obviously it's a response to abusive riding but the same legislators are giving away tons of money to buy people e-bikes, trying to add bike lanes and e-bike suitable traffic patterns and similar "I hate cars!" actions. The bike lobby groups aren't particularly friendly towards e-bikes so aren't, apparently, effective lobbyists, the "technical" side seems disconnected from the reality of the current bike situation, what kind/how many bikes there are that include both throttle and pedal assist features, how ineffective the original "class Label" law or laws are (my bike came unlabeled and it's a bigger, decent brand and from a long term competent store). The industry importers and various brands aren't organized effectively and there are language issues and a complete lack of consistency between various states and the feds on Class definitions, so they seem stuck trying to meet a wide range of differing regulations. Incidentally, over 4000 or so bills are introduced and over 2000 typically end up getting through the process in a session in California.
@@craiggillette4381 , Crip sakes, the controller manufacturers can’t even agree on color coding their wires, and battery manufacturers can’t have warning buzzers.
I've pedaled 6,000 miles on my e bike the past two years, so I see a lot. SOME cyclists do a great job on the road, while others (both e bike and non e bike) are riding dangerously and should not even be able to own a bike. And the dangerous riders come in all age groups. Young fools and old fools alike. When I was 9 years old, the PD came to my school and put me through an obstacle course and gave me information about bike "rules of the road". That was DECADES ago. They issued me a Bicycle Operators License, and I was proud to have earned it. I think all cyclists should have to take such a course, whether e bikers or not. And THEN the cops should actually do some enforcement on the street.
The limitations of class 1, 2 or 3 e-bikes are acceptable for not being required to register, insure and get licensed to operate them on public roads. That’s the bargain. All CA did is codify the industry definition of those ebike classes. You’ll still have a throttle on class 2 models to help you start from a stop and cruise up to 20mph. What was unclear with the voluntary standard is whether class 3 models can have a throttle. I don’t know what CA did there to clarify that, but I’d be fine with those having throttle assistance up to the class 2 limit of 20mph. The comparison to cars is wrong as you are required to do all that to operate them on public roads. Most states already consider higher-powered and faster (with motor assistance) motor-assisted two and three-wheelers as mopeds or motorcycles, so they need VINs, DOT compliant lighting and a place to attach a license plate. A few models already do, but too few.
It’s kinda all ready that way. Minus the throttle on class 3 thing. All the fastest bikes are mostly class 2 and they have been getting around it by having an unlocked mode to go faster. My bike is a little old now but it has 2000 watts unlocked. You can only use that power in the top mode. It even came with a class 2 sticker in case someone checks. In every other mode than the top one, it performs like a standard ebike but unlocked goes beyond the 20 mph class 2 limit
EBIKES THROTTLE ONLY DESIGNED TO GO PAST 20 MPH. READ "ELECTREK". OK STAY UNDER 20 THROTTLE ONLY. YOU MADE IT CONFUSING. STRAIGHT TO POINT. DONT GO OVER 20 THROTTLE ONLY.
This is what happens when the HOA runs the Government.
As a grown adult tho, it doesn't matter to me if it's a moped. I HAVE a driver's license anyway, and I wear a helmet. And to be fair, this happened with 49cc mopeds back in the day, they were only bikes if you were pedaling. And I personally don't give a shit if kids under 16 can ride them or not. So, unless there's registration and insurance it doesn't matter to me.
HOA's can't run anything but people out of their own neighbourhood. Lol Worthless.
you spelled "Karen" wrong
@@ericlindauer7150 I'm not sure what your replying to sir. I was laughing at the JOKE about the HOA running the government....you look like a biker like myself so idk what's going on...
@@drewnelson3149 I think all these bicycle riders should be made to license their bicycles. If they want to feel entitled enough to cut me off in traffic, they should pay registration.
It's nothing to do with safety. It's about control and revenue.
NONSENSE - I have seen e-bikes in my area zipping along sidewalks at speed that THREATEN PEDESTRIANS on a regular basis!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BINGO
yep, When the dem-er -rats create something they can't tax, they out law it 😡
Yep 👍
@@bartholomewceremony6981 Woke garbage talk - as usual - as some people behave foolishly and resent govt attempts to rein them in!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
All these annoying new laws coming to a state where lawlessness runs rampant. Irony is incredible.
Been saying the same thing for years about "gun laws"
California: “Pedal your powerless bike up hills while sideshows and dirtbike wheelieboys carry on worry free and flip off the one cop they might see in a month”
Florida is right there with California. E-Bike laws in Florida are changing too.
It's all of the united states.
More and more oppression to show you who's Boss.
Using stupid comments like that do not help the topic most cities in california are not lawless . And those that are probably voted for donold Chump the most criminal man ever elected to be president so they could be lawless. I want protection from you. For simple transportation 28 mph is fine get the plate and DL if you want to go faster. most people won't be riding ebikes in rain or snow and I don't know if there are studded bike tires but you will need them for snow and specially Black ice in the early mornings. oh Pedro my hair is the same color as yours and Ive been riding motor cycles since 1969
California is safer than your trailer park.... stop the racist LIES..
Californians, remember you voted for these people, the majority of you. You have voices but you chose not to use them.
It's the boomers here that support these morons in office. The mayor's are criminal, and our governor should have been recalled.
I didn’t vote them,I’m a Trumpi,try to vote these idiots out but they fix everything in their favor,it is insane here,no logical thinking going on!
Exactly. Wake up California!!!
Also, dont leave California and head to neighboring states complaining about the shithole that it is- while still voting the same way that caused this hot mess in the first place. Leave WA alone.
You got it 1/2 right.
%40 voter turn out, %60 dem.
So basically %22 of the population voted for them and %60 choose not to use their voice.
In California when a new bill or law comes to committee the first thing discussed is how much revenue it will generate.
@@MikeSmithers That is rare because most of the bills Newsom has passed INCREASED spending on the latest “sanctuary” initiative that is trending. Nobody seems to care about that but they worry about ebikes? WTF is wrong with them people?
Yeah their main priority is money😑
That is why they call it a "bill" because it's going to be issued to the public for a demand of payment!
@rayadams5606... apparently you haven't figured out where the government gets its money for "INCREASED SPENDING"
@@MikeSmithers “they” know if i sneeze 3 times while I’m sleeping it’s gonna cost me 10 cents in tissues
I live in the Bay Area California and the cops out here don’t care about e-bikes at all.
They have bigger issues to deal with. It really comes down to what city in California you’re living in.
@stevej6824 Exactly. I'm pretty sure people who live in the high desert towns of California don't worry about ebikes. In small desert towns, they don't care about mini-bikes riding on streets either. Yes, bigger crimes.
Riding my e bike in the East Bay, I get the same vibes. Just don't stand out. Meaning, my ebike with a throttle can go up to 35. I keep it at 28. Don't go over.
@ Same here, I live in Oakland. I’ve got a Motor Goat V3 that’ll do 40+ MPH. But I leave it on a lower setting that’ll keep me between 28 and 32 and I’ve never been bothered by any police.
They do not give a flip in San Francisco you know that you can ride anything and the cops have bigger things to do that law is not going to work. 🥇
Well enforcement and laws are 2 different things.
They probably want to build up the law on ebikes to later require a registration giving them a bigger budget.
@@UltraBrian yes you can't believe you're lying eyes
@@UltraBrian California the LA area decades ago made a law where pedal bikes have to be registered and have a sticker with serial number. Don't bet on it.
It’s exactly the reason. Like here in Rhode island they’re pretty lowkey right now about it cause of the bridge situation we have here.
Leave it to a politician to screw the people that they suppose to work for.
Yup. They money grab anywhere
They can pry my throttle from my cold dead hands 😂
“…especially when your damaged knees start complaining…” (like mine do.)
That's how Redding or Anderson cops would handle it... and hopefully you don't have your dog with you
If that’s what it takes, then so be it.
We have so many laws there is a book called "3 felonies a day" because the laws are SO ONEROUS they make us all criminals in "the land of the free" 😂what a joke
All of the cars can speed down the road with impunity and yet we’re concerned about an electric bike…
the car owners pay registration and fuel taxes that pay for the roads
@ yes many of us owned cars and are paying those taxes, I have several cars and motorized RVs, as well as motorcycles, I have paid for the roads in my entire life! You think I’d be able to ride a bicycle on one?
@@christheisgen5683 So you advocate a "pay to play" or nothing ehh? Because I don't want the roads, nor want to pay for them but in order to simply go places I need to be *on* them at minimum as the pavement is everywhere now. So free people can just "shove it" in your opinion?
@@sloppyoppie yep, absolutely! if you aint paying into it you got no right to it as far as i'm concerned. stay on the sidewalk
@@christheisgen5683 How do I do life w/out using pavement? I primarily ride a hay powered horse, then next a man powered bike and occasionally when I go far... on my DIY'd Ebike I made myself and acquire the power myself. I drive on 4 wheels for fun only and in a race/prerun setting. I get it, you feel I must use the system you bought into, or nothing. ............ ua-cam.com/video/v7cxaZaD-TM/v-deo.html
It's not about Ebikes, it's about getting these riders onto registered vehicles for the money!
It's about classifying electric motorcycles as motorcycles... buckle up... over 20mph will require a motorcycle endorsement, plates, lights and insurance.
@@JoeStanek-vu7rllet me get this straight. Say you have an e-bike that only goes 30mph max. You think putting this bike on the road that can’t even speed up fast enough, like an actual motorcycle, to get out of the way to save the riders life from a 4000lb death machine is a good idea? You are part of the problem, bud.
Insurance sales even more
@@engr_e "4000 lb death machine" 😂😂🤣😏😎👍🏼
@@engr_e get lost Iranian bot.
They should worry about real crime
A pedestrian who has been run down and injured by a speeding idiot on an e-bike WILL CALL IT A CRIME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
They're too busy arresting parents at school board meetings
@@mikeswanson6145 Cops do as they are ORDERED to BY OUR WOKE AND RADICAL SOCIALIST POLITICIANS!!!!!!!!!!
BLAME THE WOKE POLITICIANS who can and will punish cops who do not follow Woke ORDERS FROM POLITICAL SUPERIORS!!!!!!!!!!!
there's no money in that!
Butt then the crooked politicians would worry abot getting caught doing the hinky things that they do!
Meanwhile illegal drug overdoses, theft and crime runs rampant 😂😂
Smash and grab is legal! But a ebike with a throttle is illegal?
Rampant?
@@HarveyMushman888 the numbers are ramped and rampant
Cause the state gives them free drugs, and handouts
@@alskink6931
Where do you live? Smash and grabs are illegal in The United States, maybe you’re in Russia?
How funny! I was driving my car at 30 miles per hour and a platoon of about 10 guys on road racing bikes passed me as if I was walking. They hate people on e-bikes, they call us names and bully us all the time. This new law is unfair and discriminatory! Thousands of seniors use them as their primary method of transportation!
Agreed.
@@willie90210 they don't hate me... They can see the cred dripping off of me
Unless you were going downhill, I call bullshit. The average speed of a pro peloton on flat ground is between 25-28 mph. These are tour pro riders. I rode road bikes for years and am now on an e bike. I would average about 17 mph on my road bike. My e bike is a lot faster. The young kids on e bikes are the one's causing the issues, and why the laws are changing. I'm in So Cal. There are complaints everyday on Nextdoor about these kids breaking traffic laws and terrorizing pedestrians, and even car drivers. They're riding high voltage e bikes capable of 35-40 mph speeds and have no consideration for other riders, pedestrians, or cars. They're no better on the bike paths. They ride like idiots.
SENIORS DO NOT RIDE AT RECKLESS SPEEDS as too many younger riders do!!!!!!!!!
As always the reckless few spoil things for the MANY others!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
But your not a senior are you?
No no I'm not getting rid of my throttle and I'm in California
My guess is that your throttle will be grandfathered in, and the law will apply to newly purchased ebikes.
@@watchmanonthewall14 that's what I'm thinking. Personally I think that law was put in place to go after the SurRons
Surrons are what they mostly ate after if it's pedal assist with a throttle you should be ok
@@gulfcityndyeah I'm thinking the same
You are such a rebel
You wanna know who ruined it for everyone? Large groups of 13-15 year old boys with modified bikes doing +32mph doing wheelies down public roads, running red lights and stop signs day and night. You don’t need to go outside of South Orange County, specifically Dana Point to witness this.
You can do the same on a regular bicycle dude.
Ah huh and what did boys do all the generations before them? We made ramps, modified to remove excess weight, made go carts, mopeds, when we got a license we modified our cars to go faster and look cooler. This is nothing new. This is a bunch of Karen’s and Ken’s that complain and give no space for teens to be be teens. Skateparks. Bmx parks. Paintball. All things are “banned” cause you all want your perfect neighbor hoods.
@@loamtrailer805 Actually no, I used to race bicycles and only a well trained athlete can sustain 32 mph for any length of time. The e-bike craze is also effecting the mountain bike environment, it used to be that only the fitter riders were able to get back, and deep, into the few wild areas of Orange County, and now that's no longer the case, trails are getting torn up by the torque available with an e-bike. Just imagine the encountering a wild eyed e-biker descending a narrow trail, coming straight at you. He's no longer riding a bike somewhere around 20lbs, he's fully decked out with moto-cross style helmet and pads, you thought you would enjoy the serenity of a once pretty trail.
@markthomas207 dude my analog free ride mtb weighs 34 lbs. I don't ride on hiking trails and if a hiker is on a trail with banked turns, they shouldn't be hiking there. A regular XC bike still does as much erosion as a 34 lb analog bike. Not sure what you're trying to get across.
no dude, a few kids doing wheelies didn't ruin it.
California "Safety Laws" are never about Safety. It is always a law to create revenue through fines. I drove 18 wheelers for 24 years. I've seen their weigh stations remain open, long after trucks were backed up along the ramp, well onto the highway. No care in the world for Safety having commercial vehicles stopped on the highway. So long as they had a long line of potential revenue cha chings in line. Safety was nose bleed section. Same can be said with their registration practices. Being the most expensive state to register your vehicle in. California by anymeans, wants to suck every last dollar out of its citizens through, fees, taxes and fines. It is why I have always called the state a communist state. It dictates the lives of it citizens and visitors every minute of the day.
I'm not removing my throttle. The state can get bent! Just more laws that can't be enforced.
You make riding a bike like a scared little b1tch sound so cool!
Enjoy your ticket, California will put your money to good use (better than you at least).
If you arent pedalling, its an electric motorcycle. Should be regulated as a motor vehicle. Tired of motorcycles on bike trails.
These laws make e-bikes worse than regular bikes
They sound criminal, at least to some.
@@oregonebikermark8953 The entire CA government is a criminal enterprise.
Throttles come in handy for two reasons. One is to give a few seconds of torque when leaving intersections and getting up to speed. These bikes are heavy and need a boost to get going. Two is for hill climbing. I have a single gear bike and use throttle, along with pedal assist and brisk pedaling to get up hills.
@@DriverJ-N ?
@@watchmanonthewall14Well, if you remove the motor and batteries, they will be a lot lighter.
And this is in a state trying to make everyone go with electric vehicles. The stupidity is unreal.
I only see content creators talking about this CA law, who are NOT in CA themselves.
They don’t care here. No one is even messed with while riding emoto. Only a few cities are enforcing anything. Newport Beach recently tried using speed guns which is honestly exactly how the law should work. Bust people for speeding like you do cars. The powertrain, kw, top speed, or having pedals, are all irrelevant. You should be judged for how you ride and not how capable your bike is.
@SirRidezAlot yes you are correct about people talking about it elsewhere but you don't like to hear this kind of talk because these ideas bleed everywhere.
Because California unfortunately has a crazy government now and will ruin everything.
Just like everyone talking a grip of trash on the state that have never been here.
@@phyberopty2k california is an easy state to talk trash about
Most of us live in the USA and are not subject to their tyranny.
Gavin: “Bob, any stupid ideas that will kill the EV bike market? People are having to much fun!”
Bob: “Sure do, let’s make 96.2% of all existing bikes ILLEGAL”
Wow, a bike with a peak of 750 W and no throttle with heavier riders, in San Francisco.... good times to come
Yep, crazy stuff.
@@oregonebikermark8953 you know, they could potentially hurt their own "go green efforts. " All of the older Riders which may be a little weaker or heavier that can't pedal a 750 watt e-bike about 100 lb up hills. I can see a lot of burnt up controllers. I really hope people in California don't buy e-bikes or at least the older crew. You would think they would be a little smarter but we'll see. I can see a lot of e-bikes in the garbage the next few years in California because people have had enough with not enough power.
100% agree
RadPower’s Radster models have motors designed to provide as much torque and speed as competitors’ motors that peak between 1200 and 1500W while peaking at only 750W.
It can be done. It’s more efficient. Most brands simply cheap out and just pump more current through them.
You might as well walk
Cops don’t pay attention or care much about people on ebikes and escooters unless you’re being reckless speeding down the street or running stop signs and red lights, or getting into accidents… so just don’t do that….
My 3 escooters are my primary form of transportation… and I follow the rules of the road, because that’s what we’re supposed to do… and I’ve never had a cop stop me on any of my escooters… 🤷🏽♂
i stopped and asked a cop here if they care and he said they don't. as long as im not doing a wheelie down the street. i pulled up to him on my modded talaria mx4 that looks just like a dirt bike.
BS. There are cops everywhere who would much rather spend their time giving tickets than do actual police work.
Cops are lazy, they will only do what’s necessary. However, when you cause an accident or injure someone on your illegal e-bike say goodbye to your house. Be smart.
I live in the North Bay Area, and we can't even get the police to respond to calls promptly! The only way they respond fast is if there is a gun involved. Sometimes they don't respond to calls at all. They don't have time for important stuff so they need to leave the bikers alone! Period!
I’ve been riding for years a Chinese hub motor modded throttle e-bike that goes 35mph and 1400w. I ride smart and safe. Ridden past police and they don’t care. CA is dumb.
Remember who these people work for. It’s about time you voice your disapproval and force them to obey us or get them removed. Why do we pay taxes for them to regulate us. The only way to change laws is by becoming active.
CA Senste is dominated by Democrats and they do what they want, damn opposition or discussion.
Cuz the majority of CA voters can't possibly concieve of voting conservative
Lol CA would vote in Kamala after Gavin 😂 hopeless
@jaybomb5022 sad thing is, I would not bet against that.
The curious thing is to see if she even makes it to the candidacy. What makes Pelosi look worse, if she does or does not win the candidacy, and if she does or does not win? Because Pelosi was key in throwing Biden out
Yep 👍
What caused this is : The kids riding electric motor cycles 50 mph ... Popping Wheelies etc in the 25 mph bike trails . Now they are cracking down
What's difference between Throttling 28 mph or ghost peddling 28 mph?
Instead of having a twist throttle use a lever like the old Honda ATC and they will just think it's your brake lever. Hopefully.
The difference is that a bicycle is defined by pedal power.. not motor power. Motor power is a motorcycle
@ItsCjhoneycomb Ghost pedaling is when you are pedaling slower than needed, essentially providing no pedal power to help the bike.
@@RedBud315 uh, there are at least some throttles that *are* levers. My former bike (was stolen) and my current bike have those.
Helps a lot when your knees start to really hurt a ways out from home, say on the way back from paying bills, getting groceries, or going to the doctor.
Did all three yesterday. I pedaled as much as I could - about twenty miles - and used throttle the rest of the way, until the battery was looking iffy (50 volts or so) and I had to get on the train so as to get most of the way home. The battery is starting to “lose ground,” as until a few months ago, that 47-49 mile round trip was relatively do-able through pedal or “left thumb.”
Note: throttle is usually bottom or second cog on the sprocket, and going much faster than 10-12 mph then is rare. I’m more or less in “limp home mode” then, as usually the fatigue and/or pain is a real problem, as it was yesterday, and I *needed* a nap once I got home.
Or riding a motorcycle at 28?
Having two electric Bicycles myself. Next time you see an e-bike on the streets. And it Doesn't Have any peddle's, sprockets or chains, IT'S Not a E- Bicycle. It's classified as a electric Dirt-Bike. Thus illegal to ride on the streets. Or a electric Street bike. That requires turn signals, brake light, etc. That does require a registration to ride on the streets. Heck some of thease Electric Dirt Bike manufacturers even offer fake Peddle kits. 😶🌫️ And because of it and our incompetent gov.🙄 all of the E- bicycles groups are paying for it
You can throttle to 20. I asked two cops and they said that if im doing 20 and under it wouldnt wven be legal for them to stop me to check out the bike specs.
But no throttle on bikes that go above 20.
@@oregonebikermark8953really make sense, doesn't it😂
@oregonebikermark8953 true but I just keep it at the setting where the throttle only goes 20. One of thw cops told me he has a bike similar to mine and he rides it to work everyday. I live in Sacramento and people out here smoke meth out in the open like it's a cigarette. I think the cops are not going to worry about people riding safely.
@@MrDucksBill they may care about the e-bike perps only because they're the ones that will take a ticket and not be unpredictable and may not be violent if they get arrested or fined. The E bikers will just be the easier ones to get money from. Which ones do you think will be easier to get money from? The normies or not the Normie's?
Unfortunately, if your bike is able to be unlocked or modified to go faster than 20 mph, and has a throttle: It is no longer considered to be an
e-bike.
😢
That’s the situation I’m in, so I’m gonna remove my throttle which will convert it to a class 1 e-bike.
As an avid walker (to work, grocery stores, banks, etc.) this law is a true life safer for e-bikers using sidewalks with pedestrians. Daily I'm startled by an e-biker on the sidewalk whizzing by without a word, no toot, no 'On your right!' They'd take us both out if I happened to move into their space unwittingly due to a perceived issue or just not expecting someone going 20+miles per hour behind me. Don't say e-bikers shouldn't be on the sidewalk as to be honest, if I had an e-bike I'd most certainly be on the sidewalk due to the narrow streets and preoccupied drivers (texting, eating, etc., so common!). If e-bikers would exercise restraint when passing a pedestrian, it would be less dangerous for us all, but evidently parents are not training their kids to respect pedestrians (90% are disrespectful, I walk approximately 3-4 days out of 7 for enjoyment and health.) I welcome this law for all that use the sidewalks.
@@jeangreen432 if I *have* to use sidewalks, I tend to slow *way* down (~5-7mph or less) - and get off of them as fast as possible. If I encounter anyone, I give them the right of way.
Yes, I’m of retirement age. I cannot afford the operating costs of a more-conventional vehicle, and my ability to endure public transport is very limited - as in the sensory overload is exhausting.
As an old guy in a wheelchair my only complaint is when they’re flying by on a narrow sidewalk at 30
If you’re going to go that fast do it on the street! I’ve come very close to being hit as well as my service dog
There was once a time in the U.S. and other countries in which the politicians held a common ideology that supported the average citizen to live their lives freely to practice their rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness with impunity within their safe conduct.
Ride safe, under class 3 bike speeds, keep to bike lanes, slow down around pedestrians if u have to take sidewalks, and u won't have anything to worry about.
Matbe, but if there is an accident you are presumed gulty and all the laws will prove that.
@@mkeonine that’s more or less what I do, only I stay under 20 unless I’m coasting downhill, under 6-7 if I *must* go on the sidewalk (stay well clear of other people then; there’d better be a good reason to get on them, and get off as soon as is possible) - and I am still concerned.
@@dennisyoung4631 What kind of bike u have?. I've got the Motor goat v3, in Orange co. CA. I've yet to see anybody with their ebikes pulled over since the new rules implementation.
I just ride it the way I've always ride since day 1. That's not to say there won't be issues in the future. Nobody knows. I'm concerned too. I'm looking at other back up bikes, more legal, just in case the day ever comes. We'll see.
@ self-constructed from parts over the course of a year (took that long to get all the parts). BBS-HD, 26 inch wheels, 31 Amp hour battery (which is going to need rebuilding within a year or so, as far as I can tell) hydraulic disks with 180mm rotors.
Total cost was “plenty” - didn’t keep records. Is geared for pulling power rather than speed. “It goes fast enough to suit me.”
Unless there is an accident or injuries.
Eventually, the law makers of California will reason that a skateboard is a vehicle and mandate that everyone register their skate board at some makeshift DMV style department of the California government agency.
If e- bikes are supposed to be a realistic alternative to cars, they need to have throttles and powerful motors.....A 750 watt motor and no throttle will tempt virtually no one to ride their bike instead of their car,,,,. This law is so silly - it will lead to more cars on the roads, which means more pollution and more serious accidents.....Is there a desperate car-lobby behind this madness I wonder......
Some good thoughts, thanks for commenting.
You are aware that in Europe, the only e-bikes that can be ridden on the same paths as regular bikes are not throttle, pedal assist to 25KPH (15.5 MPH), and max 250 watts of power. Anything past that requires licensing and registration and this cannot be used on the same paths as regular bikes in most cases. It seems to work for them.
@@elgato7761 I would guess, the motorcycle lobby and analog bike lobby is behind it.
E Bikes are not a realistic replacement for cars and motorcycles. In 99% of Americans lifestyle an E bike is just an additional transportation choice. Bikes and E Bikes can never fully replace their larger, better equipped and more convenient competitors. Just one extra choice for those that can somehow incorporate them into life. For the vast majority of families and individuals with a busy daily life, a car, bus or train is going to be the best bet. A bicycle is just an additional luxury to most persons lifestyle.
Europe is very strict.
Since the only difference between a legal class 2 bike and an illegal class 3 bike is the max speed (20 instead of 28 mph), I predict a lot of city cops will be clocking e-bikes and ticketing anyone over 20 mph if they are not pedaling. This sounds like a way to harass most kids on their way home from school and cause parents untold grief. Such nonsensical arbitrary laws need to be overturned. If they are concerned about 28 mph, then just make a 20mph max speed for e-bike engines and grandfather previous bikes.
Personally I think that law went into effect so they can go after the SurRons because even though they are electric dirt bikes, a lot of people who own them are trying to say they are e-bikes to justify riding them everywhere
If you’re not peddling, you’re not peddling it doesn’t matter if you’re on an electric bike orSurRon.
Sue Ron's are classified as not being street legal because they do not have lights, turn signals and a brake light. Now if you remove the pedals off of an e bike it's not considered street legal. The new law is stupid.
This
I think this law is aimed at the yahoos on ebikes that ride at 25mph on trails and shared paths
These laws are only passed if WE THE PEOPLE allow it.
Ya been allowing some pretty whacky stuff out that way.
Good Luck
I hear you. Gonna push back against some derranged Christian theocratic nonsense law here shortly I'm sure
This is California. It’s if WE THE ELITES allow it.
We the people are inclusive of 90% stupidity. The government knows that about its "people"
This is the same way government went after drones, every law and regulation imaginable! Every time I go to a park there is a no drone sign! Sex, alcohol, littering, rape, speeding, etc. is permissible.
i fly my drone all the time at places that say no drones, after driving my "illegal" modded talaria mx4 to the park. im a hard core criminal. lol.
@ exactly, they made it so you have to break the law to do those things.
At what point is an ebike an electic motorcycle that you have to licence and insure. I had to sell my class 1 emtb because they consider it a motorcycle on mtb trails. Ive seen a lot of people getting carried away going 40 mph on modified surrons on streets or even sidewalks and think to myself your not helping people be more accepting of ebikes. One way of looking at it if an ebike requires human power (IE pedal assist) to operate its at least partially a human powered vehicle, If its throttle driven then you could argue its a motorcycle, even little mopeds back in the eighties had to be licensed. Theres a lot of grey area here to figure out and people that push laws to their limits make it so we cant have nice things anymore unfortunately
Well said
I've seen those same videos of people on Surron's riding on peoples front lawns right up to doorways on apartment building and thinking someone is going to accidently step out on front of this fool and he might kill them.
Well consider for a second WHY it is that people tend to "push laws to their limits"... Why do you think that
is? Is it because human beings are criminal by nature, are we born inherently opposed to laws? Or might it be that the vast majority of people simply have the desire to be free to do as they wish so long as they're not harming anyone else? And this is a heavily debatable topic, I realize. I'm not saying that people should be allowed to do whatever they wish so long as nobody else is harmed. Because there will be times when harm comes or is done to others via the actions of other people. So things can become incredibly complex very quickly, especially when you factor in human emotions, which often tends to fuel our resolve, or our desire to impose our will over others, which inarguably seems to always, without fail, lead to the corruption of goodwill and morality. People are very prone to the human condition. Once a person or a group of people get a taste of power, interesting dynamics begin to manifest in countless ways. Our species, as intelligent as we currently are or fancy ourselves as being, are still incredibly flawed in our ability to exist harmoniously alongside the rest of the living world and especially amongst our very own kind. We have not come anywhere close to achieving such an existence collectively as a whole in all of recorded history, as far as I'm aware. So don't be so quick to point a finger at other people for "ruining it for everyone else" . This has always been so and likely always will be in this world. Has there ever been a rule established by man that's never been broken by another? Has there ever been a time when all people simply lived and let live? No. And I'm not sure if there ever will be or certain that's even possible. Because there is no light without dark. It's yin and yang, black and white, good and evil... With a vast gray area in between representative of the eternal struggle between the two. In the end perhaps the best one can hope for is perfect balance. Not heaven exclusively nor Hell eternally. And this may seem to be a very philosophical comment to be had in relation to the video, but my point is that, as far as I can tell, people will always resist control beyond what they believe is reasonable or necessary, and sometimes even
If they know that it is. It's part of human nature. We impose rules and laws and regulations for fear that the entire world might fall into complete chaos and bedlam without them, and yet here we are with no shortage of those very things in any corner of the globe that I'm aware of in spite of all our efforts. Are we really achieving any good by appointing others to uphold the laws, in the name of what is right, rather than being obliged to do it ourselves? I believe that's where our error actually lies. We delegate the responsibility of doing what's right or what's in the best interest of the people to particular government agencies, placing the power in their hands in good faith, rather than keeping it in our own and believing ourselves responsible enough for the task.
Exactly why I sold my MX4.
Id say anything capable of 28+ mph with the smallest rated rider should require a license. Mopeds & Scooters, like you mentioned, require(d) it so these should as well. These may even be worse since they're quiet.
Kids rip through cars all over and are a real problem. Anyone with a driver's license should be quite alright, but a minor child should NOT be permitted to ride one capable of those speeds on any public roads. I see them more times than not, on sidewalks which is a huge problem.
Now extorting people for more money just because, that's total BS, but typical of our idiots in Suckramento.
They are trying to stop e-bikes from becoming what they have essentially become = electric motorcycles. Most people I see riding ebikes are not pedaling, but riding it like a motorcycle.
They seem to be a menace in affluent neighborhoods. Their parents buy them an ebike so they don’t have to drive their kids around. Some of the kids respect traffic laws BUT there are more kids breaking the law and making poor choices riding their bikes. It’s not just kids, adults are just as bad or worse.
Some have not all. They just need to enforce a speed limit.
@@rayadams5606 I live in an affluent coastal city and it is a huge problem! Adults and kids all riding like it is a free for all circus.
@@AfficianadoofRC I stopped riding my road bike on the beach paths. Too many uncourteous e-bike riders. I feel safer on surface streets.
@@AfficianadoofRCand not one of them abide by traffic laws.
If you want to ride a motorcycle, buy one instead of dealing with this foolishness.
I’d have no problem with ebikes if they stayed off the sidewalks! I almost get run over daily
Use the bus😂
@ Just trying to get some exercise
i ride on the sidewalk as i don't want to be hit from behind by a drunk driver.
Thanks for the informative video. Where did you get your handlebar mounted mirror? I really like it.
Bought it on Amazon. Here's the Link: shorturl.at/ghtnO
Leave it to the state government of California to destroy anything that would be fun or advantageous to be able to exercise. I truly can't understand why E bikes would be bad for the people. Just that the government has too much power.
explain how a throttle helps you exercise
@mikerotchburns1622 it's not so much the throttle helping you to exercise it's there to assist you on pullouts in intersections and Hills riding on a 80lb ebike. If you take that away then you'll just have people that might get an e-bike not get any bike. Then those people probably won't get a bike at all because the thought of powered assist is gone....remember ebikes are portly
E bike to exercise that's like saying I'm exercising while I'm driving. If you are exercising you should be peddling not the ebike throttle 😂😅
@@jessesmith2922 well "Pup" ive been riding bikes and hiking all long as i can remember until a few years back my old ass knees caught up with me and now very hard to do either.My 90 lbs fat tire ebike now allows me do get back out hit the trails I dont use throttle only I pedal when I can and the assist is not so painful and stressful on the knees.
So when i was 30 or even 40 it wood not have been as you say "exercise" but nearing 60 I find anything that gets you outdoors and moving is exercise.
Peace.
i was replying to comment no longer there saying "Riding an e bike is not exercise"
The problem that we are facing in San Diego is that kids are riding surrons in bikeways where kids and other cyclist are riding skateboard, skates, tricycle and regular bikes. They crash constantly and nany are teens without helmets or disregard to anyone. I own a class 1 mountain bike and only use it at the trails or on the street to get to the trails.
New California Law? Whatever it is, it’s probably gonna hurt rather than help.
It’s not a new law, you are misinformed.
I live in California and ride a Fat Murf e-bike responsibly at the beach near my house. I use it as therapy and exercise for my knee which I had replaced a few years ago. I grow weary of the arrogant and wreckless teenagers riding the Suron bikes as if they are badasses in a mototcycle gang. We have already had a bike path along the beach in San Clemente closed to e-bikes because of these irresponsible kids and their over powered e-bikes and I am annoyed that us responsible e-bike riders are now having to deal with ridiculous state laws because of these punks on their e-bikes
E bikes are game changers for Seniors with many healthy benefits . They have a whole different outlook, its not about speed . They can now go where they used to be able to walk or hike to fresh air , scenery and out of the house ! As far as safety goes there are countless other safety issues they cant even get a handle on . I personally dont need over 20 mph but Im more than capable of determining that . Smh !
Please note that most of the comments have to do with younger riders i doubt many riders over 50 are ever pulled over
Anyone driving a car in California is concerned about these kids on e bikes. They don't know the traffic laws and nobody wants to see them get hurt. Last night a kid was in the middle of the road doing 25+ with no lights. It's no different than a motorcycle. The hazards are the same.
Trek sold me a 78 pound bike a year ago , knowing I have mobility issues with both knees . Ok no throttle , what happens if iam unable to pedal for many reasons the throttle was a great life saver. I see a class action suit in the near future. People wont stand for this .
it’s a bicycle not a mobility scooter.
😂😂
Us gun owners feel you on this one. Stop voting blue 🤦♂️
@@UserUser14880 😂
Get a motorcycle endorsement.
It's a "nothing-burger". They won't waste their time stopping and inspecting every E-bike that they see. As long as you're riding responsibly, they won't bother you. HOWEVER, if you're riding recklessly, being a public nuisance, or riding intoxicated, this rule would help justify confiscation of the bike.
As an Electric Bike Master Mechanic in the Bay Area, I can attest the main reason is that if you could pedal to get the speed to 28 mph (average rider can do that in short burst only), you qualify as experienced rider which is much safer than the Class 2 (rather e-scooter) claimed to be eBike, since the pedals are there just for classification purpose. Mostly those e-Scooters like Super73 ridden by kids come with throttle and the little guys can crank that thing up to 30+ mph. Many parents bought for their kids as toys but the little people may end up hurting themselves and others. Moreover, it's unlawful to ride electric scooters on bike trail! Now, if the law went into effect, folks may have to bring those electric scooters to an electric bike shop to deactivate the throttle, however, those so called e-Bikes were designed mainly to be used with throttle, pedaling will not be very efficient!
A voice of reason.
I'm not against e-bikes, considering getting one myself, likely Class-III w/o a throttle. Class-III e-bikes have no throttle by federal definition. Having a "Class-III" e-bike with a throttle means it's no longer a Class-III e-bike. What to call it is a different topic.
Not sure what is different whether the class 3 ebike has a throttle or not. 28mph is 28mph.
@@oregonebikermark8953 True, but that's the US federal definition and we all know federal regulations are always crystal clear 🙂
I found this clarification on the MassBike page:
"The 20 MPH threshold applies when the e-bike is being operated “solely” under motor power. However, e-bikes are most commonly ridden under a combination of human and motor power. The federal definition does not provide a top speed for when an e-bike is being operated under combined human and motor power. The class 3 definition clarifies this ambiguity by specifying the maximum assisted speed for e-bikes at 28MPH."
More than likely they won’t do anything to your non-complying bike until they have some other reason to stop you like a traffic stop. At that point you’ll probably receive the citation as well as a fix it ticket and you’ll have to prove you’ve removed your throttle or whatever. Agree, it’s a dumb law and makes no sense.
I’m still gonna use a throttle
There is a grey zone, IMHO, with these e-bikes. The Class 3 e-bikes appear to have pedals so they can be categorized as e-bikes instead of low powered electric motorcycles. The off road/trail use of e-bikes is becoming a problem on public trails. In the case of the USFS, there are trails designated only for muscle power and livestock with no motorized travel. So, while pedal powered mountain bikes are allowed, there is an arising conflict with e-bikes. As the wattage (horsepower) of e-bikes increases, e-bikes evolve from pedal assisted bikes to motorcycles with pedals. They are fast and virtually silent and often, when encounters occur between these bikes and people on horseback, the horse gets startled, and the rider is caught off guard. There are USFS designated trails for motorized travel and that's where e-bikes belong.
Gov needs to be put on notice.
This is why there must be a committee of logical postulation to regulate incoming laws especially for California.The laws being passes are clearly not being thought through or are being past for wrongful reasons.Too many of these beuarcrats are being paid by lobbyists or are resting dead on their laurels and too comfortable and dont want to process information thoroughly enough.
Next it will be license, registration, and insurance. The greed of these people to get your money and spend it on things you don't want is endless.
I sure hope not. Enough is enough.
Absolutely!
And do not forget about all the "fees" (TAXES) that are hidden into Insurance costs.
They will most likely make peeps with E bikes register them as motor vehicles, because if you think about it, it is pretty much a motor vehicle at this point. They did the same thing to mopeds in the 70s and a lot of riders got upset over it.
I've been expecting this for years. Built my first ebike in 2006 and complied with what the laws of the time were. However, I've watched these manufactured versions come out that are essentially nothing but motorcycles with pedals attached. They are able run at speeds up to 50mph and weigh well over a hundred pounds. One of my concerns has always been riders who haven't ridden a bicycles in a long time and get out on an overpowered bike and cause an accident. And I've seen a number of novice riders although no direct accidents yet.
Many people may remember the same thing happened to mopeds back in the 1970's. I would bet, that eventually we'll have to get tags and insurance on ebikes also.
No offense, but all these laws apply only to manufactured bikes. They are not applicable to kits. Period! So you understand, all these laws are for manufacturers, which are eligible for all KINDS of state programs.
Build your own bike? Oh well, it's illegal to take it to any shop. Oh, you have a Pedego? Here, take it to Pedego, where they get discounts from the state and such👍
State: We want you to stop driving a car and ride a bike. Wayt, we don't want you getting to work ~that~ fast.
As a resident of Southern California, there is laws you learn to ignore😂 even the sheriffs turned a blind eye to it
Most e-bikes have throttles and I can't imagine them outlawing something so many people already have. I imagine this law was put into effect for the SurRons
Sounds like they are wanting to solve their Surron problems.
Pedal assist be more dangerous. One time, I was leaving my local mini-mart with pedal assist on. I had to make a tight turn to get into the bike lane, and as soon as I started pedaling, it almost shot me straight into traffic. Pedal assist tries to accelerate you to a specific speed before easing up. I quickly hit my brakes and forked my handlebars. I fell off and got dinged up but, luckily, not hit by a car. This law is as ill-conceived as it can be, and I don't plan to pay it any attention.
I get that. Throttle helps me ease on. But if I'm throttling and up the mode then it kinda accelerates to quickly. I wouldn't buy a speed demon I don't feel that safe going above 15 m.p.i anyway lol
I hate models that do that, but there are others available that would be safer.
For ones with cadence sensors, there are speed-based and current-based PAS. Think of the first as cruise control with speed presets, think of the latter as throttle presets. The first is what you have and I despise it. I’m actually getting rid of my Espin Nesta because it uses a speed-based power management system. It threw me off the bike twice when I first got it. I increased the number of levels from 5 to 9 and set the speed limits for the first two levels really low, so it only has the chance to send 400-500W of power through the motor before it reaches the speed targets, unlike the 900-1000W it did before. It still surges when I go up through the levels, which I don’t like as it can make me lose control in a turn, and I’d never ride in a group with it due to the surging.
For bikes with torque sensors, PAS levels set multipliers on your effort. The more effort you put into the pedals, the more effort the motor supplies. This offers the most amount of control and feels more natural to people who are used to riding non-motorized bikes. Some models also come with throttles for when you need more help than you can exert yourself, some have an additional layer of “maintain peak speed” achieved so long as pedal fast enough (I think that’s what Lectric’s PWR Plus does on their torque sensor models), some have software that lets you tell the bike to treat the torque sensor as an on/off switch like a cadence sensor is treated (Velotric Discover 2, Euphree Stellar Falcon are two models I’m aware of that offer this feature, but it’s a simple software change so any torque sensor bikes could do this), so you have both power management styles available in the same bike. Now, for that last group, you need to check with the brand to see whether that cadence sensor mode on their torque sensor bikes uses a speed or current-based system.
Cadence sensor bikes work this way and it is dangerous. Try a torque sensor bike and it's much more natural
I grew up in the 80s and owned a moped. In order to use my moped I needed a license insurance and a helmet. I see that coming next for ebikes. They travel just as fast or faster than a moped.
Why are cars allowed to be sold if they can exceed the Speed Limit.
Great question.
@@oregonebikermark8953 No, it isn't.
Because extra power is required to climb hills and have better acceleration.
If every car had a limit of 65 MPH it would be unsafe merging onto a highway, incapable of climbing hills or even reaching the speed limit with a few passengers.
It would also be running at maximum RPM putting more stress on the vehicle than necessary.
@@stuwest3653I mean you could have a 1000hp supercar with a limiter that stops you at 65mph.
@@HawkAlumn Yes, you could and if it wasn't for the auto industry lobbying congress with millions of dollars it may have been the case by now.
It won't be long before speeding becomes a thing of the past when self driving cars become a standard.
I ride the bike trails and really enjoy them. One of the most dangerous people I see there are people riding regular bikes and one wheel and scooters doing way in excess of the posted speed limit.
Here in California, class 3 has always been pedal assist only just like class 1. The new laws are aimed at the sales of the high speed ebikes. The lega9in the new laws are focused on the capable throttle speed and wattage of the motors.
Its ridiculous and more of a money grab than anything else. Im sure that car lobbyists are behind a lot of these stupid laws.
Thanks for commenting.
the most important thing to remember,DON'T GET CAUGHT!
California gave the us the 28 mph class 3 bikes, and now it has put in a new law that takes away the throttle... Primarily from New bikes coming into the market, I'm sure. This will also change the national ebike landscape, for worse in my opinion. If people are concerned about inconsiderate ( excessively fast) ebike use around pedestrians on multi use paths, there are other ways to go about it like a coordinated public education campaign and coordinated signage. Throttles are incredible useful on an e bike that is being used primarily for transportation usage, for accident avoidance in some circumstances, and for starting up at intersections.
Very informative video! Thank you.
Don't confuse eBikes with electric motorcycles. Bicycles aren't intended to be an alternative highway-legal mode of transport. This is practically a non-issue.
Bicycles are already an alternative road-legal mode of transport
I had two spinal fusion operations.
I can't pedal a bike constantly even though the power takes over when you do pedal the bikes.
What about those who have no use of legs?
@@arguescreamholler “…or limited use of their legs…”
Lots of older people (e.g. 64-5, with serious chronic health problems) can pedal up to a point, but after a certain mileage, it either starts to hurt too much, or the fatigue becomes too great to continue (to pedal).
That left thumb lever allows me to get home, then - and the usual is to need a nap within an hour or two - *like yesterday, or last Monday!*
I do agree with you. I dont agree with the law. Its stupid. I use the throttle to speed up to safe speeds (28 mph). Some over passes with freeway entrances get messy. As an ebike user, i throttle away from all the cars and big rigs.
I’ll just drive my gasoline car. Easier too. No peddling at all.
The law may change again. As more people and companies fight the law.
Yesterday one passed me through the next stop, wheeling
down the next short street and through the next stop and gone all with no regard to speed.
This is basically like a jaywalking law. Only in the most HOA, Karen-ridden towns will any cops actually give out tickets or take away bikes. The only negative that may come from this is it may force some of the e-moto companies based in CA to move out or close.
California taxpayers need to pass a law where government employees/politicians airplanes have to have pedals on them. With a max speed of 150 mph.
750 was already the limit. Youd slap a 750 watt sticker on your 7500 watt bike and call it good. You can thank all the kids doing wheelies at 40+ mph.
thats what i did lol.. class 3 stickers off etsy.
Welcome to Cali where my RC can go faster than my Bike.
I assume the issue is that electric bicycles are relatively new, but increasing in speed. So much so, they will eventually become very much like street motorcycles - which are licensed, insured, and tagged. What's the fundamental difference between an electric bicycle, and a street motorcycle - it's the motor and drivetrain technology. Or maybe officials are trying to keep some separation between traditional bicycles - which you do have to pedal and are not very regulated, and their electric powered bicycles, which they are beginning to regulate, as they advance in speed and assumed danger?
There are a lot of pros and cons about E-bikes related to protecting youngsters and oldsters from getting hurt or killed, preventing increases in road traffic hazards and car and liability insurance issues. Similar to motorcycle and bicycle helmet regulations.
There are riders out there that can’t pedal for medical reasons and making their e-bikes illegal is a violation of ADA.
There are special bikes for those with pace makers that actually use your pace maker as a back up if run low on batt power
yep, I'm one that is using my E-scooter as my legal alternative mobilty scooter going into town shopping, paying bills, & to apointments v/s the slow 4 mph mobilty scooter trying to cross a busy road they raised the speedlimited not putting in cross walk lights lol, Like many mobilty disabled, we have no-cost legal services to defend us in court.
i think an argument can be made in that case. a Sacramento couple , disabled, had a powered 3 wheel cart they used for shopping, successfully argued that it was legally an ada protected machine. they drove it on the side of the street without any further trouble.
Great video brother. I have a 10,000 watt scooter and a 4,000 watt bike.
I followed the legislative path on this, a little, the final results are quite different from what had been working its way through several iterations. California thought to clarify the definitions but still messed up. Obviously it's a response to abusive riding but the same legislators are giving away tons of money to buy people e-bikes, trying to add bike lanes and e-bike suitable traffic patterns and similar "I hate cars!" actions. The bike lobby groups aren't particularly friendly towards e-bikes so aren't, apparently, effective lobbyists, the "technical" side seems disconnected from the reality of the current bike situation, what kind/how many bikes there are that include both throttle and pedal assist features, how ineffective the original "class Label" law or laws are (my bike came unlabeled and it's a bigger, decent brand and from a long term competent store). The industry importers and various brands aren't organized effectively and there are language issues and a complete lack of consistency between various states and the feds on Class definitions, so they seem stuck trying to meet a wide range of differing regulations. Incidentally, over 4000 or so bills are introduced and over 2000 typically end up getting through the process in a session in California.
@@craiggillette4381 , Crip sakes, the controller manufacturers can’t even agree on color coding their wires, and battery manufacturers can’t have warning buzzers.
I've pedaled 6,000 miles on my e bike the past two years, so I see a lot. SOME cyclists do a great job on the road, while others (both e bike and non e bike) are riding dangerously and should not even be able to own a bike. And the dangerous riders come in all age groups. Young fools and old fools alike. When I was 9 years old, the PD came to my school and put me through an obstacle course and gave me information about bike "rules of the road". That was DECADES ago. They issued me a Bicycle Operators License, and I was proud to have earned it. I think all cyclists should have to take such a course, whether e bikers or not. And THEN the cops should actually do some enforcement on the street.
Ouch Here in Las Vegas, My Daily Commuter Customized E-Bike... Twist Throttle and Speed Limiter Disconnected
52 Volt & 2000 Watt Hub Motor ... 41mph.
The limitations of class 1, 2 or 3 e-bikes are acceptable for not being required to register, insure and get licensed to operate them on public roads. That’s the bargain. All CA did is codify the industry definition of those ebike classes. You’ll still have a throttle on class 2 models to help you start from a stop and cruise up to 20mph. What was unclear with the voluntary standard is whether class 3 models can have a throttle. I don’t know what CA did there to clarify that, but I’d be fine with those having throttle assistance up to the class 2 limit of 20mph.
The comparison to cars is wrong as you are required to do all that to operate them on public roads.
Most states already consider higher-powered and faster (with motor assistance) motor-assisted two and three-wheelers as mopeds or motorcycles, so they need VINs, DOT compliant lighting and a place to attach a license plate. A few models already do, but too few.
More stupid laws to raise ticket revenue in california.
Lets vote on it! 😊
It’s kinda all ready that way. Minus the throttle on class 3 thing. All the fastest bikes are mostly class 2 and they have been getting around it by having an unlocked mode to go faster. My bike is a little old now but it has 2000 watts unlocked. You can only use that power in the top mode. It even came with a class 2 sticker in case someone checks. In every other mode than the top one, it performs like a standard ebike but unlocked goes beyond the 20 mph class 2 limit
EBIKES THROTTLE ONLY DESIGNED TO GO PAST 20 MPH. READ "ELECTREK". OK STAY UNDER 20 THROTTLE ONLY. YOU MADE IT CONFUSING. STRAIGHT TO POINT. DONT GO OVER 20 THROTTLE ONLY.
Let's see how this plays out.
CA laws that are senseless and obscurely limiting? Welcome ebikes to the gun laws of CA!