The only reason I could come up with was that Quimir’s ship only had 2 seats, but that’s just dumb writing. I will say that previously Quimir was gonna kill her after she failed him and wanted to turn herself in. I guess it was clear he wouldn’t train her anymore.
doesn’t it help “close the loop” and throw the Jedi off their scent? if all 3 vanished together, the Jedi keep hunting for them; if Mae takes the fall to help her sister, the Jedi have their trophy killer, and the trail goes that much colder
well leaving her behind is arguable, I believe qimir would have perhaps agreed to take her somewhere. But certainly working together isnt a plan and I believe the jedi would always been able to read her mind somehow or manipulate her in an interrogation scenario to unravel the truth and qimirs identity. So him wiping her memory is actually logical imo. And as to why there leaving her there : I guess it helps solidify the Alibi with Sol and helps to have an accusator towards him especially as he is already dead and cannot defend himself. The only person KNOWING qimir was involved is his former master and she has some explaining to do with that scar on his back so I believe she cannot simply leak that he is alive..
I mean, Mae don't want to go with Stranger, and with no ship she cant escape Jedi. She knows almost everything, so only way to hide it from Jedi was memory wipe. And if she would escape, then with no killer, Jedi would Look for Sister and Stranger becouse he dont want to lose His new apprentice Osha. But with Mae captured, whole murders could be finish and covered from Senate again. Finally Vernestra has again confort to do investigation on her own, with master Yoda, but with no senators looking.
IIRC mae had a deal with qmir and since she failed/betrayed him, he was supposed to kill her. Osha negotiated with qmir to let her live in exchange of being his acolyte. The Jedi would use mae to find osha and qmir so healthy erased her memories
You are okay with braindead consumers supporting a racist sexist company? The show runner and cast exposed themselves countless times but please, turn off your brain and enjoy because it looks like star wars.
This was a series with a strong potential and an intriguing hook- A High Republic era murder mystery with possible Sith involvement. But there’s been a lot of strange decisions made along the way. Character motivations, backstory, and logic all have had some fuzzy and strained moments, all in service of having to move the plot along as fast as possible because these episodes are too short and there aren’t enough of them. To me it comes off as a sign that this show simply wasn’t long enough to fit in everything it wanted to in a way that makes people actually care about the characters and their dynamics. Somehow this had a higher budget than Andor with less episodes, shorter run time, and at times lower production quality. If this had been a 10 or god forbid a 12 episode season, with episode runtimes averaging at 45-50 minutes, I think most of these plot holes and weird decisions could have been smoothed over. But I think we’ve been left with a lot of wasted potential and a sinking feeling that this only existed to set up a way more interesting season 2 that we very well may not get since I don’t think this show has gotten the reactions that they wanted.
@@lunarmodule6419 I think it’s partially the result of announcing this show too early and with too few details. It allowed people (myself included) to get too hyped up thinking we’d actually get a series from the perspective of a Bane-lineage Sith apprentice/acolyte. Honestly this might have even been given the wrong title. Maybe “Star Wars: Vergence” might have been more appropriate? Either way, I think if more people had been aware in the months leading up to this show that this was gonna be more of a story about two sisters, with the murder mystery element basically taking a backseat after the literal first episode of the show, I think some people would have approached it differently. I know I would have. But then, I was already going in with fairly low expectations once we got closer to the release.
@@lunarmodule6419 I don’t see how politics played a role at all, that’s mostly coming from people who automatically think that the mere existence of non-straight or non-white characters = political. And there’s definitely been some spots of bad writing, but on the whole I’d say it’s more that the writing was constrained, both by the length of episodes and by this weird need to try and keep the audience in the dark on whatever mysteries they’re wanting to prop up to keep watchers invested- such as the origin of the twins, or Qimir’s backstory, etc.- when I think the reality is that audiences would actually engage with the show more if it stopped trying to keep things vague and gave more direct answers. That was Andor’s approach. And its political messaging of being anti-fascist was a hell of a lot more overt than anything in Acolyte.
Vernestra tells Yoda... something. Either she lies and he falls for it, not sensing the cover-up, which makes him a fool. Or Yoda is told the truth, insofar as Vernestra knows it, and Yoda goes along with it, making him complicit in the lie. Ok, show, which is it? These are adept Force users, and they're not hiding Iran/Contra, this is about effing Sith!
@@thribs she should infer it, however, as Quim is back, more powerful, and darkside, and hunting freaky vergence padawan, sooo... I dunno. I had though she was an avowed Sith, in hiding, but I suspect the better explanation is that Plagueis is merrily influencing dupes and idiots, including Vernestra.
They set up Plagueis and the Knights of Ren and failed to pay it off. I thought Headland said Kylo Ren's theme meant something. This show's highs were high (ep5), but its lows were lower.
She's got, from what I remember, up to 4 season total planned out as a story, so whatever we'll see about the Knights of Ren will be later on. It would be too much going on if it were done this season when things are just being set up.
@@ezrameraz-lerma6604 that would be a flimsy defense if it were true, but the truth is, the writing is sh•t and they've already cancelled future seasons and spinoffs because the show is garbage. Though, they blamed the lead actress for making that idiotic response video to people who disliked the show. The show was never destined to go anywhere, and now it is buried beneath the hubris of a showrunner who spent her career enabling a r•pist, writers and actors who knew nothing about Star Wars, and a plot that retconned major pieces of canon at every turn
The fact that *this show* gave us the first live action depiction of Plagueis kills me inside (I'll give them credit tho, his design is amazingly creepy)
this is my biggest take away. bums me out that in an alternate universe some where both of them would get the roles and script they deserve for a star wars series, if not A MOVIE since at this point i'm convinced the lucas film story group simply cannot write good television.
I honestly think if they make a second season they need to get new writer that are on the same page. But yeah it’s nice to see Darth Plagueis on screen for the first time.
Agree I wanna see a second season cuz I think there’s a lot more to explore with the story and characters….but gotta get new writers and show runners…this show coulda been great
@@Bayard1503 it's legends material, there's no rewrite, they did the same thing with thrawn. Your emotions betray you thoughts, and give you lazy takes.
The writing was the biggest flaw in this show. Osha/Mae’s actress wasn’t the best but it really was the writing that screwed this show over the most which is a shame as the acting was mostly great and the choreography was great as well. I hope for a season 2 and I hope that the writing gets better for that season. With potentially Yoda and Plagueis in season 2, they better not have bad writing as those two characters are quite loved
I don't like that Sol died and how vernestra speaks of him. I know that she isn't totally wrong to me it was like she presented him as the enemy or bad guy even with mae. I really hoped to see more of him in the future.
@@kings5223 i mean he's speaking from bad faith but u also can't really blame him due to all of the meta knowledge of Disney's operations and response to fans. Its a sign of broken trust on Disney's part and frankly it's not exactly his fault for feeling that way
And I’m guessing that THAT is the reason Anakin is the valid Chosen One not the “failed twins”. Created by the Force as a natural response to counter the tipping scales forcefully made by Plagueis. Like a body producing white blood cells to counteract a disease.
@@itsbunch Yeah but he probably 1. Was way closer, Brendok is supposed to be out in nowhere. 2. Order 66 had so many jedis dying I'm pretty sure him sensing it is supposed to be a throwback to Obi sensing Alderaans destruction.
There’s literal witnesses and alibis to vindicate Sol of Indara and Torbin murders. Some of them being Ki Adi Mundi & those other Jedis in that chat room discussing Mae Christ how can that be overlooked and how does that make sense
The Mae/Osha/Witches stuff didn't work at all. Maybe it was the poor acting or the writing, but the show would have been much stronger focusing on literally everything else. Sol and Qimir were excellent. They could have focused on Sol and Indara and the band of Jedi and revolved everything around that to tell their story. There was some good potential but it needed better direction. Maybe it'll improve in season 2 - seems like they're setting up for more of the same though.
I mean, on the at all thing: I don't know, the opening scene of episode 8, where he's trying to get the mask off of her, and he freaks out, was pretty compelling to me. The idea of introducing Plagueis means that we could see some weird shit
The episode was perhaps the most painful to watch, as you could see how the story could have been just as great as the fights, but then you get frequent whiplash from people yet again making nonsensical decisions out of the blue, particularly leaving Mae behind. Even after all the stupidity throughout the season, I was flabbergasted.
I want to know how many rewrites the script went through before we got this final version because it seems like it went through maybe just one. Or maybe two...but if it went through many....Jesus Christ...
@Deuteromis Yeah, it feels like they looked at the first draft and went "good enough", which is damning enough if true, but they may still become good writers if they learn their lesson of humility. However, if this is their "refined" version, they're too severely lacking in talent.
I really don't think they handled the jedi "not knowing" about the sith well. They objectively did know. They just covered it up from specifically the senate. The sith are the greatest threat to the jedi order. Even if they're keeping it from the senate, there's no reason they wouldn't be handling it internally, meaning phantom menace can't happen the way that it did. And considering headland said she didn't want to make the jedi in the prequels look bad, they sure managed to make them look bad through these cameos. Bare minimum both Yoda and ki adi mundi are part of the cover up, meaning they're both responsible for the events that led to qui gonn's death.
Vernestra knows about he fallen padawan, that's it. Fallen padawan's are typically just dark jedi, not Sith. Fallen Jedi have been a constant in Star Wars lore, and considering this is a period of time where Sith are believed to be extinct, it's normal that they just think its a fallen Jedi.
@lespaul5734 she knows a lot more than that. She knows about qimir training Mae, she knows qimir turned to the dark side, and that osha was also turned by him. That's enough to conclude bare minimum he's taking on sith teachings as hes actively finding an acolyte. But also she sensed his mind, which would indicate she becomes aware of his sith nature. But even if it were just that he's taking up the sith teachings and going against the jedi, that makes him basically a sith in terms of where it matters.
I honestly thought much more was going to happen…why was that Kylo Ren theme playing throughout the entire show. Why leave Mae alive instead of fully completing Osha’s turn to the dark side by killing her, no Knights Of Ren, 2 seconds of Plagueis and that’s it…just overall disappointing, show ended with a wet fart.
Mae was left alive because Qimir promised to spare her, if he had killed her Ohsa would never have joined him, which was clearly his goal. Plagueis and the Knights of Ren are likely meant as hints to season two, that's why they where only hints.
The Kylo Ren theme is there because Osha and his relationship are similar, but in this case, he succeeds in turning her to the dark while Kylo ren fails. Obi-wan's theme from episode 4 was quickly expanded into being a more general force theme, so this isn't a new thing at all.
What's sad is that the idea of a show about Plagueis moving in the shadows and doing experiments in the force in what ends up being the birth of Anakin would be AMAZING if done right
I feel like the show is trying to get you to root for Osha who just straight-up murdered an unarmed Jedi. I get that it was done out of revenge but why is the show trying to get us to be like "you go girl" for that? Osha just committed murder and it doesn't matter how bad you hate someone, you can't just kill an unarmed person. There's no character in this show that embraces virtue, every character either blindly follows their passion/feelings or is only looking after their own self interest. So at the end of the day (and perhaps the reason no one really likes the show) there's no one in the story that is actually worth telling a story about.
See you broke it down so smooth and efficient like. If only the writers could execute seamless storytelling, cause I liked the actors involved but not their characters.
Sol being framed makes 0 sense. There were literal witnesses in episode 1 to prove it was Mae wtf. He was also at the temple teaching during the murder😂
All in all i liked the finale and the show overall but whilst it had good ideas and action it really suffered from pacing problems. Felt like this could have been, and probably started in concept as, a movie rather than an 8 episode series and we'd have lost nothing over value.
I told you the last episode would break about everything & everyone even worse than what came before. Again, PEAK Monty Python, GREAT slapstick-comedy/satire, in that regard NOTHING can beat this, it's now even more "Spaceballs" than "Spaceballs" itself. Search your feelings, you know this to be true. Even "The Last Jedi", which I fucking hate, I called it "Spaceballs 2: The Lost Jedi", isn't that bad, and it is easily 1 of the best of THE VERY BEST from the worst of THE VERY WORST. Everything else Disney-SW before, well, most of it, was slo-mo self-destruction, but "The Acolyte" is basicly all the coffin nails at once, with lightspeed. And, yes, of course they will do more, because they'll have to save face & there's always more money to waste for bad shit spraypainted gold. Different name though, same with "Ahsoka", I guess. Let them, not enough slapstick-comedy/satire out there. So badass, as in bad & ass, inconceivably funny, and braindamaging, but still funny nontheless. Give it a couple of years, Disney-SW will be on the same level as "Sharknado" & "The Asylum" stuff. If Hollyweird has to invent another useless oscar-category, it should be something like "and the oscar for the most laughably BAD handled franchise goes to... Dismal Disney, because SW, aaand the MSHEU (hands them 2 golden clowns)", I even would watch that live.
Having Master Sol die was a big mistake he was the only Jedi that had compassion and cared for others. Also he destroyed the stranger twice he wasn’t going to lose to Osha or Mae.
It was so bad and so antithetical to the whole Star Wars franchise I have had to resort to watching the finale in small pieces to get through it... What's TRUELY ironic is these awful Hollywood writers wanted the jedi to be evil bad guys SO BADLY...that like SUDDENLY MAGICALLY OUT OF THE BLUE the Jedi are complete emotional wrecks...just lost souls every one of em. They made them SEEM either completely incompetent or corrupt , but, turns out, they were mainly just morons (spoiler alerrt) In fact other than the Green lady the Jedi that were assassinated never once really did anything entirely wrong in the show and the people they TRIED SO HARD to paint as the good guys...WERE STRAIGHT UP EVIL... Qimir and Mae were just murdering fools left and right and Mae in fact killed a whole bunch of witches as a child AND THE WITCHES everyone is crying about were actually evil as well.. crazy how INSANELY AWFUL these script writers were (not to mention how bad Amandla was in this "role") And I imagine its all because these Hollywood types can't CONCEIVE of a world were people consider actually deplorable acts evil...I mean you can tell they were TRYING to make the Jedi like Sol seem awful but turns out it really was Mae, Qimir..and then Osha who they tried to frame as the good guys...just BLECK all the way around...Its the first time Ive commented on something on UA-cam and while thinking back on it wanted to throw up in my mouth.
Only one of them was really like that. Well, 2. Sol and torbin. The Jedi aren't portrayed as evil, or bad. They're portrayed as flawed. There is a difference. They're still good and the sith are stil bad. But this show is about a character becoming a sith I take it you would hate.old classic star wars novels like bane, or plagueis or even the revenge of the sith novel. They aren't very kind to the Jedi You're filling in a lot of things u didn't understand with like, ur own interpretations of it
See bud, the main issue here, is that you feel attacked because the jedi are portrayed as flawed and weak. Which cool it's not ideal when we've seen them be bad ass. But the whole point is to show that not even jedi can be trusted to be 100% true to their institution
The Jedi have always had poor decision making skills. An organization being good in general doesn't mean it's infallible and it certainly doesn't mean that everyone within that organization is a good person. Sol wanting to protect innocent children was noble but there's no way to justify killing someone so you can kidnap their children because you don't like their religion or because you perceive them to be bad based on feels and vibes. Another content creator made a parallel between Sol and the Waco, Texas Branch Davidian situation and it was so spot on.
I’m just more confused than anything at this point. I don’t think we ever had to do so much extended mental digesting in Star Wars before. And I don’t think any of us were ready for that
Ok I'll tell you what you're feeling! It was so frustrating and silly - here you have it - the Jedi are bad - the Sith are good. If Yoda knows about the "incident" he's scum - if he gets played he's dumb :-( And why is the tracker even sabotaging the ship?
@@simpletown323 sol was putting the ship in danger, flying thru the asteroid field. Bazillwas trying to stop him but that was a dumb way to do it, which I think is the point
The Jedi aren't bad as an Order. But the show is making a point that even good institutions can contain flawed individuals. "Road to hell is paved w good intentions" If you actually ever read legends this isn't even slightly out of place. Yoda finds out at the end of the show when vernestra comes in and talks to him, or maybe before when shes doing her press conference thing. No one suspects the sith are involved except Vernestra, who might not even know qimir is actually a Sith, just a fallen Jedi from her perspective. Although idk she does seem like, extra worried. But she's also just presenting the evidence she has about what went on. She can't actually even prove someone else killed sol. The jedi covered up quite a bit in the prequel movies. It's nothing new There's a lot of reaching required, and misunderstading/ignoring what was actually on the screen to come up w a lot of these critiques I'm noticing. The execution was weak at times, but people acting like this somehow contradicts other star wars releases or breaks lore or misunderstands star wars fundamentally are missing a lot of stuff
@@cloudmaster182 But Sol was never corrupt, he only made a reasonable mistake, the witches throughout the series were hostile and even killed Torbin, in that part Anyzeia transformed into smoke to attack him when moments before he said that his daughters would not leave and the whole rest died when they tried to kill the rest with kelnaca it was not their fault
I don't think the Bunta tree is the vergence. I think the vergence is actually tied to the planetary/lunar alignment. Something about a perfect eclipse when all are in a line creates a nexus of power. It might even be dark centric, specifically tied to the moons being in the shadow of the system's sun. Perhaps cores of Kyber or something along those lines that resonate when aligned (perhaps why the deep well is where they conduct their rituals, its like a vent of that power source), or maybe hidden ancient sith temples on each moon that do the same. The witches are more powerful when the moons are up, but probably most powerful when the moons are in a perfect eclipse, which is kinda alluded to as well.
It was basically a romantic comedy telling the story of two people who despite their differences learned to work together and eventually fell in love. Such a farce of a tv show.
This show wasn't even just a bad starwars show it would be considered bad even without the starwars brand attached to it. That's just my opinion if you enjoyed the show im glad at least a few people found joy in this
I swear to God when Mae and Osho were face-to-face I thought they were going to kiss, there was no direction whatsoever on the series, I genuinely believe it was all on auto pilot and written by AI.
"Got a lot of things right and wrong???" What did it even get right. Look, If you like this show, more power to you but I personally can't with Disney anymore.
w/r/t the vergence and the idea of it being the failed attempt at creating the chosen one; and if the vergence is what caused Brendok to be teaming with life, then shouldn't tatooine no longer be a desert wasteland if that's where Anakin was created?
I think we should have gotten a fight between Vernestra and Qimir. It probably would have been a pretty good fight and we need more of the lightwhip rather than vernestra pulling it out to slice up a bug for no more than 2 seconds. I loved seeing Plagueis and Osha bleeding Sol's crystal was... something. I definitely enjoyed seeimg that. I wish the high council had more of an appearance though. I do think that Osha becoming Qimir's apprentice could lead to an interesting sequence of events, except for them leavimg Mei behind which really wasn't the right choice, but at least we might not see her again, cause I'm not really a fan of Mei.
This is not saying much, but if episode 7 was removed, and both prospectives (Sol and Mae) in a clear way cleaned up a lot of the writing, toned down the overacting, the show would be better. I don't like how Mae and Osha were created by the Force witches, giving Darth Plagueis who was hiding in the shadows there, the idea to create his own force baby, aka the chosen one. Or, to be more corect force pushed back on him and Sidious for trying to push the balance toward the dark side.
The way the Osha and Mae relationship ended really felt like it was an afterthought, the entire time I was wondering why on earth they had to leave her, it makes no sense, it's like they were done with the character but didn't want to commit to killing her off, just really odd, definitely the weakest part of the finale
My disbelieve was suspended too much in this one... The Osha-Mea thing still does not work at all. They killed one of the 3 good characters and had him act like a lobotomite AGAIN. The actor pulled so much out of what was given to him. Sad his role was written like it was. And whats going on with that rat-person, is he just an agent of chaos?!
I honestly hope for a season 2. I am disappointed by some parts of this season, but I feel like a second season could be fairly redeeming for the show. Unfortunately after the reaction to this show (some parts justified calling out bad writing, other parts culture war bs) it seems unlikely that we will get that second season.
It's not crazy at all, considering the nightsisters had many powers over life and could grand force sensitivity. Savage had no or very limited force sensitivity before the nightsisters changed him, and these are powers neither the Jedi nor Sith have. So it's hardly improbable that different force cults have different abilities. Also, Plagius an Sheev never make life.
@@lespaul5734 the night sisters were already poorly executed and created plenty of lore breaking things. George partly realized this and decided to kill them off in the same way he did with the jedi as he is solely responsible for the clone wars episode in which they are genocided in. saying these witches are similar to the night sisters already implies major world breaking plot holes that not only break the clone wars but also the acolyte itself. if you want a farther break down i recommend watching sheev talks video on how the clone wars doesn't hold up. as someone who adores the clone wars it was very eye opening to have things such as the night sisters broken down and their lore breaking capabilities exposed among other things. also having anything less than a sith lord create life is already retarded as it implies that anakins existence is brought about less because of plagueses meddling and more of these random witches that have no right to do such a thing.
@@rmw9420 The Clone Wars are canon, whether we like them or not, and whether we think they break the lore or not. As established canon, it is the lore, it doesn't break it. Also, a sith lord never created life. The canon is they (Plagius and Sidious) tried to, but failed, and the will of the force created Anakin as a result. That's a very different scenario to what we saw in this show.
@@lespaul5734 yeah yeah, I'm not pissed off that the clone wars are cannon as they brought us the inhibitor chips and other actual good things, I am not part of the sub sect of the fandom that believes the clone wars multi media project did better service to the clone wars than what we got in the tcw TV show. Now addressing your other point, there is no way in hell that you can look me dead in the face and say plagus, arguably one of the sith most obsessed with creating life from the force, being quite literally CUCKED out of his main thing as far as we know was a good decision for this show among other stupid decisions this show decided to take. if they wanna make quimir absolutely OP without making him a full on sith then that should go to show just how powerful the sith were and there for show that their abilities are far above that of fallen jedi as well as a coven of weak witches. to be absolutely clear, and if you wanna use the plagus novel as reference, there is no way plagus would allow a random coven of witches to do the very thing he was striving for so long without just killing them all off and using the vergence in the force for himself to do the very thing he was propped up to be most interested in doing. if anything this show would have made plageus a main character and showed just how close he was to achieving his goal with the power of the vergence in the force only to be foiled by the jedi if not osha or mei drawing attention to it. in conclusion, the fact that they brought plagus into this period completely discredits sheevs whole speech in revenge of the sith as something like this would surely be brought up, if not for making the jedi even stupider in not realizing what was going on. I cannot in good faith accept what this show has done to the major players of the prequels with less than 100 years to go before them happening. this show defiles georges vision as well as bastardizes the plagus we all know and love from the novels. another thing, nothing against you for trying to make sense of it all. that is what dedicated fans are supposed to do so I hold no grudges against you or your reasoning.
@@rmw9420 I have nothing against you either, I appreciate the convo and the arguments you make. I didn't see Plagius getting "cucked" here. The last episode ends with Sol saying "somehow" the twins aren't real twins due to how they were created. We have no idea, and neither does Sol, how and why that happened. It could be that Plagius was involved or aware of the witches experimentation. Maybe he egged them on, advised them, etc... Perhaps it was one of the first experiments he oversaw or investigated. We literally don't know, so I don't see the point of getting upset at something we don't know yet. If there is one thing the Sith are good at, its manipulating larger events from the shadows, or at the very least, twisting them to their advantage. It may be that you're right, but maybe not. I'm not going by the Plagius novel, it isn't canon. As much as I enjoyed those stories, I look forward to what they will do with his character. I don't want a copy paste of Legends, but I also don't want them to completely change his character. As for Palpatine's speech, it's pretty obvious he is either lying or exagerating to seduce Anakin to the Dark Side. Palpatine had not inherited the wisdom over life and death he claims his master had, he couldn't save Padme but he wanted to convince Anakin he could, and he had no solution to solution as seen in the sequels. I thought the witches were pretty boring imo. "Weak" idk because we were shown so little and so little was explained about their powers. I have no issue with force cults having knowledge and techniques the Sith and Jedi don't have, they just have the be explained better. Both the Jedi and Sith are dogmatic and narrowminded in their own ways.
After watching episode 8, it made me more interested in sol and qigib and everyone else actually. There was no need for the twins to be in the show. They wanted to make a show about the view of the Jedi from a bad guys point of view and they could've without the twins. Shows the potential it had but also showed the lack of competence from creators
Star Wars with great bad guys are important. Good people turning to the dark side good. Jedi that hides the truth is at its core. Building for more stories. The story is actually good, but the story-telling can improve.
This was without a doubt, the WORST Star Wars project thus far. The writing was awful - Mae was never a real character and they character assassinated Sol so bad.
@@sirkingjames4656 this was a fanfic. boba fett was literally unwatchable even compared to this. I am proud to state that it was the first starwars show I just couldn't bring myself to continue watching after the train episode, and I'm so glad I made the right choice seeing how it ended. either way this show has done the same song and dance of pooping on what came before, just to areas that hit much more close to home for general starwars fans.
Mae and Osha being a failed creation makes the most sense. Why would Plagueis allow Qimir to train both Osha and Mae, when Plagueis is following the rule of two. Seems like he'd want to test both of them so see how strong they are. Qimir is just following the plan.
Tbf, the Sith weren't always working within the confines of the Rule of Two. In fact, in Legends Plagius was happy to forgo the rule of two when he killed Tenebrous. And I'm pretty sure he had numerous apprentices at any given time. That being said, that's legends, so we will have to wait and see what they will do with Plagius' character
Love the show or hate it, I always longed for someone like that senator to tell the Jedi truth to Force. They are posing as religion and pretending to be in control of own feelings, while they are neither. He is almost prophetic when he says that one day a fallen Jedi will be doom of both Order and Republic. Best character in series!
So I haven’t watched the Acolyte and if I ever do it’s going to be after a while to get some distance from the discourse. What I’ve gathered from second hand is Darth Plagueis was fooling around trying to create life with the Force and that’s so how going to led to Anakin’s creation either by Plagueis or more likely as a reaction by the Force to his playing with life like in Legends. Which is kind of an interesting idea this series seems to have a few of those but the execution falls short is what I’m getting.
The Acolyte had only two good episodes. Number 5 and 8 were written with some heart, but all the other episodes were badly written. If season two happens, they better not mess it up.
Pity. No Multiversal unsanctioned operative shocker of a plot twist. Well, now that that's crappy slog is over, seems a lot of SW content creators are finally going to move on to better things, even if they are Legends oldies. I hope.
I like all these theories but none of them were mentioned in the show. If I didn't know anything about star wars I would be very confused about the show.
Mannnnnnnn i desperately want to like this show. They do sooooo many cool things from the comics and books, both legends and canon, yet so much of it falls flat. . . Like when i think avout what they acrually did with the story and what they were trying to go for, i get excited, but they just failed to execute it all in a way that kept me engaged. I love the sirh and how he destroyed the jedi in ep5. I loved Sol as a charcter and was for a while one of my all time favourite jedi, but they kill him so unceremoniously. They showed kyber crystal bleeding but i feel like it should have been done in a ceremony, after she kills sol, not during, but i get why it happened. Mae and Osha's storyline just sucked imo. The entire season depended on the success of episodes 3 and 7, setting up the backstory and motivations of all the charcters and it failed to do that satisfyingly for me. I loved how they handled Qimir/The Stranger and set up plagueis, the cotosis mines and how they are paying respect to legends, but this storyline needed the tension and character work that House of the Dragon does. It needed more time to tell its story and it needed to be MORE EXCITING.
Honestly, it was surprising to me. . . that Osha and Mae "are the failed test of creating the Chosen One" and instead are . . . two bodies, with one person? How. . . How does that work? Actually, it's. . . kinda tragic in a way: two twins who wanted to live their own lives, only to find out that one LITERALLY can't live without the other. Right?
By far the worst Star Wars series ever. Osha and Mae are basically an abomination created through witchcraft and are not twins but the same person somehow. Mae killed all those Jedi but because she has amnesia and she started a fire that completely burned down her home killing even more people its somehow ok and the green Jedi lady is going to make it up to her? WTF? They left Mae for absolutely no reason in the end. Sol the worst Jedi ever gets blamed for the deaths of his friends even though it was Mae. Then they tarnish Yoda by getting him involved at the end.
Even with that Sol was never corrupt, he just made a reasonable mistake, the witches throughout the series were hostile and even killed Torbin, in that part Anyzeia transformed into smoke to attack him when moments before he said that his daughters would not leave and all the rest. he died when they tried to kill the rest with kelnaca it was not his fault
You burn down our home! He lying! BTW I'm sorry for burning down our home. I feel like they weren't even focus on the plot. It feels like the whole point of the series was to do the Doctor Who origin story. There was a women of color born by the force before white male. At first I was even thinking that but then they did away with the Anakin shenanigans. I so let me guess Plagueis is going to be like oh they can create life out of nowhere well I'm going to do the same thing. I'm going to train my Apprentice everything I know but this current Apprentice isn't doing so well I'll wait till he dies off maybe I'll go adopt some Naboo kid when he's born. No way he will kill me in my sleep.
I’m hoping they don’t make another season bc of horrible writing. We still didn’t get any back story of Qimir that I’m disappointing about that. It didn’t explain why the witches died of quickly or how Mea survive from the fall? I’m still wondering how the Jedi is the bad guys. They literally defended themselves from the witches and if Mother Annasiaya just told what she’s going to do it will never happen actually Master Sol did told the truth that it was an accident. The issue is Master Sol should’ve tell OSHA the whole story to what happened but in episode 7 he retell the story to Mea to what happened even though she was there and saw the whole thing. Not once the sister acknowledged that her other mother Karol and other witches try to prevent osha going with the Jedi. At least Mea apologies to OSHA that she caused the fire and not blaming the Jedi but Mea did destroyed her home.
75% of the audience stopped watching this series after the first 2 or 3 episodes. Imagine being a theater performer, and almost everyone gets up and walks out. Are those people coming back? Most likely not. Is that going to keep the theater in business? No. What's left is those trying to defend Disney SW EU to the bitter end. Is it Disney's franchise? Yep. Can they do what they want with it? Absolutely. However, most of the big Disney SW projects have been shortened down or canceled. It's even well possible that Episode 10 might actually fail at the box office just as Indy 5 or The Marvels did. What's left after this series (just as many of the other live-action series and Disney sequel trilogy) is an eroded, alienated audience. If you like The Acolyte, more power to you, but all it did was drive a stake into the Disney SW EU. It's done more damage than The Last Jedi, which resulted in almost half the profit returns of The Force Awakens. Disney probably needs another 180 million for a season 2. If you like the series, go help them out, and maybe they'll do it. Otherwise, it's a coin toss for Disney, whether they want to keep burning more of their money or not.
I hope we don't get a Season 2. One Season was bad enough. The writing was nonsensical in many places. Do we really want a second season of more of the same?
The action was great imo but everything else is so inconsistent. Like after Maemuders multiple Jedi masters and a wookie she decides to have the moral high ground when Sol was on the ground
I’m not a fan of the “saber bleeding” nonsense Disney have introduced. Just seems too silly. Plus it doesn’t make sense since Anakin’s never went red in Episode III.
Leaving Mae behind for absolutely no reason is the epitome of this show’s writing.
Lmao 💯
I like that she for some reason decided that "her betraying the Sith and turning herself in" wasn't in her interest
The only reason I could come up with was that Quimir’s ship only had 2 seats, but that’s just dumb writing. I will say that previously Quimir was gonna kill her after she failed him and wanted to turn herself in. I guess it was clear he wouldn’t train her anymore.
@@kevint1911*Qimir
doesn’t it help “close the loop” and throw the Jedi off their scent? if all 3 vanished together, the Jedi keep hunting for them; if Mae takes the fall to help her sister, the Jedi have their trophy killer, and the trail goes that much colder
Leaving Mae and erasing her memory was completely random and makes no logical sense at all whatsoever.
well leaving her behind is arguable, I believe qimir would have perhaps agreed to take her somewhere. But certainly working together isnt a plan and I believe the jedi would always been able to read her mind somehow or manipulate her in an interrogation scenario to unravel the truth and qimirs identity. So him wiping her memory is actually logical imo. And as to why there leaving her there : I guess it helps solidify the Alibi with Sol and helps to have an accusator towards him especially as he is already dead and cannot defend himself. The only person KNOWING qimir was involved is his former master and she has some explaining to do with that scar on his back so I believe she cannot simply leak that he is alive..
I mean, Mae don't want to go with Stranger, and with no ship she cant escape Jedi. She knows almost everything, so only way to hide it from Jedi was memory wipe. And if she would escape, then with no killer, Jedi would Look for Sister and Stranger becouse he dont want to lose His new apprentice Osha. But with Mae captured, whole murders could be finish and covered from Senate again. Finally Vernestra has again confort to do investigation on her own, with master Yoda, but with no senators looking.
Especially the part about being able to seletively wipe someones memory of the most important person in their life.
It was what their mother tell them about having to "sacrifice a part of yourself". At the end, Mae did it so her sister could have her own thing
IIRC mae had a deal with qmir and since she failed/betrayed him, he was supposed to kill her. Osha negotiated with qmir to let her live in exchange of being his acolyte. The Jedi would use mae to find osha and qmir so healthy erased her memories
to the people who liked this show, power to you, but i literally cant say the same whatsoever
*power to not that maaaannnyyyyy
@@reeyeesguy7384lol Reeyees
You are okay with braindead consumers supporting a racist sexist company? The show runner and cast exposed themselves countless times but please, turn off your brain and enjoy because it looks like star wars.
I liked it, would be glad to discuss why you didn't
@@nikolaimyhre1187Bad writing, subpar acting, more retcons, cringe.
This was a series with a strong potential and an intriguing hook- A High Republic era murder mystery with possible Sith involvement. But there’s been a lot of strange decisions made along the way. Character motivations, backstory, and logic all have had some fuzzy and strained moments, all in service of having to move the plot along as fast as possible because these episodes are too short and there aren’t enough of them.
To me it comes off as a sign that this show simply wasn’t long enough to fit in everything it wanted to in a way that makes people actually care about the characters and their dynamics.
Somehow this had a higher budget than Andor with less episodes, shorter run time, and at times lower production quality. If this had been a 10 or god forbid a 12 episode season, with episode runtimes averaging at 45-50 minutes, I think most of these plot holes and weird decisions could have been smoothed over. But I think we’ve been left with a lot of wasted potential and a sinking feeling that this only existed to set up a way more interesting season 2 that we very well may not get since I don’t think this show has gotten the reactions that they wanted.
Not the expected reaction is an understatement lol
@@lunarmodule6419 I think it’s partially the result of announcing this show too early and with too few details. It allowed people (myself included) to get too hyped up thinking we’d actually get a series from the perspective of a Bane-lineage Sith apprentice/acolyte. Honestly this might have even been given the wrong title. Maybe “Star Wars: Vergence” might have been more appropriate?
Either way, I think if more people had been aware in the months leading up to this show that this was gonna be more of a story about two sisters, with the murder mystery element basically taking a backseat after the literal first episode of the show, I think some people would have approached it differently. I know I would have. But then, I was already going in with fairly low expectations once we got closer to the release.
@@Jedi-Exile nope - just politics and bad writing - they burned 180 millions
@@lunarmodule6419 I don’t see how politics played a role at all, that’s mostly coming from people who automatically think that the mere existence of non-straight or non-white characters = political. And there’s definitely been some spots of bad writing, but on the whole I’d say it’s more that the writing was constrained, both by the length of episodes and by this weird need to try and keep the audience in the dark on whatever mysteries they’re wanting to prop up to keep watchers invested- such as the origin of the twins, or Qimir’s backstory, etc.- when I think the reality is that audiences would actually engage with the show more if it stopped trying to keep things vague and gave more direct answers. That was Andor’s approach. And its political messaging of being anti-fascist was a hell of a lot more overt than anything in Acolyte.
@@Jedi-ExileMaybe the interviews with the cast and the show runner that literally involves politics every few minutes...
Btw the dude Venera met with wasnt the Chancellor. He was just a Senator
Vernestra*
That's true, but the Senator name dropped the Chancellor, and Vernestra spoke to the Chancellor at the end, I believe.
@@reeyeesguy7384 true
@@petera.michaelsen4657 yeah lol
Chancellor Door lmao
Vernestra tells Yoda... something. Either she lies and he falls for it, not sensing the cover-up, which makes him a fool.
Or Yoda is told the truth, insofar as Vernestra knows it, and Yoda goes along with it, making him complicit in the lie.
Ok, show, which is it? These are adept Force users, and they're not hiding Iran/Contra, this is about effing Sith!
What truth do you think Vern might tell Yoda??
Vern only knows about a fallen padawan. She knows nothing about the Sith
@@thribs she should infer it, however, as Quim is back, more powerful, and darkside, and hunting freaky vergence padawan, sooo... I dunno. I had though she was an avowed Sith, in hiding, but I suspect the better explanation is that Plagueis is merrily influencing dupes and idiots, including Vernestra.
@@mxvega1097 I seriously doubt it. There is nothing to indicate that in the novels. It would be a weird thing to do to her character now
Yoda was a downright moron in the prequels. Would fit his character 100%.
They set up Plagueis and the Knights of Ren and failed to pay it off. I thought Headland said Kylo Ren's theme meant something. This show's highs were high (ep5), but its lows were lower.
She was banking on there being another season of this nonsense, clearly, but thankfully, we don't live in _the worst_ timeline for Star Wars
There were no highs
She's got, from what I remember, up to 4 season total planned out as a story, so whatever we'll see about the Knights of Ren will be later on. It would be too much going on if it were done this season when things are just being set up.
@@ezrameraz-lerma6604 that would be a flimsy defense if it were true, but the truth is, the writing is sh•t and they've already cancelled future seasons and spinoffs because the show is garbage.
Though, they blamed the lead actress for making that idiotic response video to people who disliked the show.
The show was never destined to go anywhere, and now it is buried beneath the hubris of a showrunner who spent her career enabling a r•pist, writers and actors who knew nothing about Star Wars, and a plot that retconned major pieces of canon at every turn
Plagueis was literally in the episode
This entire show was a waste of money and time. Spending an entire season to just set up the next one is a failure of a season
The fact that *this show* gave us the first live action depiction of Plagueis kills me inside (I'll give them credit tho, his design is amazingly creepy)
Fr, cool to see plagueis in live action, sucks it has to be in such a terrible show
Rip Dafne Keen and Lee Jung Jae, you deserved a better show
this is my biggest take away. bums me out that in an alternate universe some where both of them would get the roles and script they deserve for a star wars series, if not A MOVIE since at this point i'm convinced the lucas film story group simply cannot write good television.
Hands down those amazing actors deserved better than this
Agreed...This should have been the Lee Jung Jae, Dafne Keen, Manny Jacinto show.
the actors werent dead
@@MrThecrazyzombiebut the time they wasted are.
I honestly think if they make a second season they need to get new writer that are on the same page. But yeah it’s nice to see Darth Plagueis on screen for the first time.
I think a second season would be way more refined, over all I'm happy with season 1
Agree I wanna see a second season cuz I think there’s a lot more to explore with the story and characters….but gotta get new writers and show runners…this show coulda been great
It should have been Darth Tenebrous considering the year but hey, who cares, right?? Nobody has heard of him so let's rewrite this as well.
@@Bayard1503 it's legends material, there's no rewrite, they did the same thing with thrawn. Your emotions betray you thoughts, and give you lazy takes.
The writing was the biggest flaw in this show. Osha/Mae’s actress wasn’t the best but it really was the writing that screwed this show over the most which is a shame as the acting was mostly great and the choreography was great as well. I hope for a season 2 and I hope that the writing gets better for that season. With potentially Yoda and Plagueis in season 2, they better not have bad writing as those two characters are quite loved
I don't like that Sol died and how vernestra speaks of him. I know that she isn't totally wrong to me it was like she presented him as the enemy or bad guy even with mae. I really hoped to see more of him in the future.
She is sooo baddy-bad!
He is a Man , he is the oppressor, he is a jedi , he is the bad guy now!
@@JustNando503 You're trying too hard. Sol was pictured as the tortured hero and Vernestra was clearly pictured as sinister and secretive.
thats the point. they put all the blame on Sol to keep the jedi reputation
@@kings5223 i mean he's speaking from bad faith but u also can't really blame him due to all of the meta knowledge of Disney's operations and response to fans. Its a sign of broken trust on Disney's part and frankly it's not exactly his fault for feeling that way
The best part of the whole show is the Yoda cameo.
I'm like 99% certain the "vergeance" is the giant hole they did the ceremony by lol.
Anikan wasn't created by the sith. He was the force's reaction to Plaugis trying to tip the balance
And I’m guessing that THAT is the reason Anakin is the valid Chosen One not the “failed twins”.
Created by the Force as a natural response to counter the tipping scales forcefully made by Plagueis. Like a body producing white blood cells to counteract a disease.
Omg I’m so glad someone else finally said. All the people crying about the retcons such didn’t actually watch the show I swear
The mothers used the force in creating the twins like a tool while Anakin was made by the force itself
YODA NOT SENSING A SINGLE JEDI DEATH IS RIDICULOUS. He’s only 100 so years away from death. He’s 900 I’m sure he sense the death of a Jedi
Why is it ridiculous? There's a lot of Jedi he didnt sense dying
@@nikolaimyhre1187 yoda sensed order 66 from another planet away. You dont think he'd sense anything here? Lets not kid ourselves lmao
@@itsbunch Yeah but he probably 1. Was way closer, Brendok is supposed to be out in nowhere. 2. Order 66 had so many jedis dying I'm pretty sure him sensing it is supposed to be a throwback to Obi sensing Alderaans destruction.
@@Juel92 He sensed Anakin going through deep turmoil when he was slaughtering the tuskens as well as when he became Darth Vader.
@yohannesaklilu2697 I thought that was because of Qui Gon who was already trying to break through the nether world as we hear during that scene.
There’s literal witnesses and alibis to vindicate Sol of Indara and Torbin murders. Some of them being Ki Adi Mundi & those other Jedis in that chat room discussing Mae Christ how can that be overlooked and how does that make sense
Disney and Headland have an answer to that. It's called "Shut the fuck up and gives us your money."
I didn't get the impression that he was blamed for those murders. He was blamed for the murders on Khofar.
The Mae/Osha/Witches stuff didn't work at all. Maybe it was the poor acting or the writing, but the show would have been much stronger focusing on literally everything else. Sol and Qimir were excellent. They could have focused on Sol and Indara and the band of Jedi and revolved everything around that to tell their story. There was some good potential but it needed better direction. Maybe it'll improve in season 2 - seems like they're setting up for more of the same though.
I mean, on the at all thing: I don't know, the opening scene of episode 8, where he's trying to get the mask off of her, and he freaks out, was pretty compelling to me.
The idea of introducing Plagueis means that we could see some weird shit
The episode was perhaps the most painful to watch, as you could see how the story could have been just as great as the fights, but then you get frequent whiplash from people yet again making nonsensical decisions out of the blue, particularly leaving Mae behind. Even after all the stupidity throughout the season, I was flabbergasted.
I want to know how many rewrites the script went through before we got this final version because it seems like it went through maybe just one. Or maybe two...but if it went through many....Jesus Christ...
@Deuteromis Yeah, it feels like they looked at the first draft and went "good enough", which is damning enough if true, but they may still become good writers if they learn their lesson of humility. However, if this is their "refined" version, they're too severely lacking in talent.
@Deuteromis
I agree. The show seems like they just shot the first draft. It could also be post-production editing.
I really don't think they handled the jedi "not knowing" about the sith well. They objectively did know. They just covered it up from specifically the senate.
The sith are the greatest threat to the jedi order. Even if they're keeping it from the senate, there's no reason they wouldn't be handling it internally, meaning phantom menace can't happen the way that it did.
And considering headland said she didn't want to make the jedi in the prequels look bad, they sure managed to make them look bad through these cameos. Bare minimum both Yoda and ki adi mundi are part of the cover up, meaning they're both responsible for the events that led to qui gonn's death.
Vernestra knows about he fallen padawan, that's it. Fallen padawan's are typically just dark jedi, not Sith. Fallen Jedi have been a constant in Star Wars lore, and considering this is a period of time where Sith are believed to be extinct, it's normal that they just think its a fallen Jedi.
@lespaul5734 she knows a lot more than that. She knows about qimir training Mae, she knows qimir turned to the dark side, and that osha was also turned by him. That's enough to conclude bare minimum he's taking on sith teachings as hes actively finding an acolyte. But also she sensed his mind, which would indicate she becomes aware of his sith nature.
But even if it were just that he's taking up the sith teachings and going against the jedi, that makes him basically a sith in terms of where it matters.
I liked plagueis idc he looked cool 😎 idk why they just don’t make a series based on the plagueis novel just cancel this crap and start a new
I honestly thought much more was going to happen…why was that Kylo Ren theme playing throughout the entire show. Why leave Mae alive instead of fully completing Osha’s turn to the dark side by killing her, no Knights Of Ren, 2 seconds of Plagueis and that’s it…just overall disappointing, show ended with a wet fart.
Mae was left alive because Qimir promised to spare her, if he had killed her Ohsa would never have joined him, which was clearly his goal. Plagueis and the Knights of Ren are likely meant as hints to season two, that's why they where only hints.
The Kylo Ren theme is there because Osha and his relationship are similar, but in this case, he succeeds in turning her to the dark while Kylo ren fails. Obi-wan's theme from episode 4 was quickly expanded into being a more general force theme, so this isn't a new thing at all.
They used kylo's theme because they didn't have the money to create a new one probably 😂😂😂
this show was somehow really well written and absolute shit at the same time
What's sad is that the idea of a show about Plagueis moving in the shadows and doing experiments in the force in what ends up being the birth of Anakin would be AMAZING if done right
They keep taking away the good stuff ending with the unnecessary death of Master Sol. A bored Stormtrooper wrote this fanfic with all the misfires.
I feel like the show is trying to get you to root for Osha who just straight-up murdered an unarmed Jedi. I get that it was done out of revenge but why is the show trying to get us to be like "you go girl" for that? Osha just committed murder and it doesn't matter how bad you hate someone, you can't just kill an unarmed person. There's no character in this show that embraces virtue, every character either blindly follows their passion/feelings or is only looking after their own self interest. So at the end of the day (and perhaps the reason no one really likes the show) there's no one in the story that is actually worth telling a story about.
Huge fan of this channel. This is the first time I've seen some one talk good things about the show.
This was a great episode and a great series. Bring on season two.
See you broke it down so smooth and efficient like. If only the writers could execute seamless storytelling, cause I liked the actors involved but not their characters.
Sol being framed makes 0 sense. There were literal witnesses in episode 1 to prove it was Mae wtf. He was also at the temple teaching during the murder😂
It wasn’t very good. I just don’t care about the twins. The Vernestra/Sith story is way more interesting
All in all i liked the finale and the show overall but whilst it had good ideas and action it really suffered from pacing problems.
Felt like this could have been, and probably started in concept as, a movie rather than an 8 episode series and we'd have lost nothing over value.
It pretty much confirms it's Bal'demnic
I told you the last episode would break about everything & everyone even worse than what came before.
Again, PEAK Monty Python, GREAT slapstick-comedy/satire, in that regard NOTHING can beat this, it's now even more "Spaceballs" than "Spaceballs" itself. Search your feelings, you know this to be true.
Even "The Last Jedi", which I fucking hate, I called it "Spaceballs 2: The Lost Jedi", isn't that bad, and it is easily 1 of the best of THE VERY BEST from the worst of THE VERY WORST.
Everything else Disney-SW before, well, most of it, was slo-mo self-destruction, but "The Acolyte" is basicly all the coffin nails at once, with lightspeed.
And, yes, of course they will do more, because they'll have to save face & there's always more money to waste for bad shit spraypainted gold.
Different name though, same with "Ahsoka", I guess.
Let them, not enough slapstick-comedy/satire out there. So badass, as in bad & ass, inconceivably funny, and braindamaging, but still funny nontheless. Give it a couple of years, Disney-SW will be on the same level as "Sharknado" & "The Asylum" stuff.
If Hollyweird has to invent another useless oscar-category, it should be something like "and the oscar for the most laughably BAD handled franchise goes to... Dismal Disney, because SW, aaand the MSHEU (hands them 2 golden clowns)", I even would watch that live.
Having Master Sol die was a big mistake he was the only Jedi that had compassion and cared for others. Also he destroyed the stranger twice he wasn’t going to lose to Osha or Mae.
Hey the whole thing is there to say the Jedi are bad - the Sith are good - lol
From the moment we saw him see the sith it was known that he was going to die. He just couldn’t live.
@@chewy99. it's all silly - don't make out anything out of it lol
@@chewy99.Except master Vanestra at the end acknowledged the Stranger was her padawan and had turned to evil.
@@Goyanks28 She does not know he is/was a sith
Sol died from cringe
Qimir is fulfilling his master wishes , and tenebours helmet not only see in the future but protect it's user
Gotta be the worst Star Wars ever made, and I thought The Last Jedi was bad.
Hope they scrap this and never make Season 02.
It blew all expectations. To be percise, it blew the bedrock my expectations haf reached.
A great and powerful end (with some weak points like the twins admittedly) to a series full of good and bad intertwined.
It was so bad and so antithetical to the whole Star Wars franchise I have had to resort to watching the finale in small pieces to get through it... What's TRUELY ironic is these awful Hollywood writers wanted the jedi to be evil bad guys SO BADLY...that like SUDDENLY MAGICALLY OUT OF THE BLUE the Jedi are complete emotional wrecks...just lost souls every one of em. They made them SEEM either completely incompetent or corrupt , but, turns out, they were mainly just morons (spoiler alerrt) In fact other than the Green lady the Jedi that were assassinated never once really did anything entirely wrong in the show and the people they TRIED SO HARD to paint as the good guys...WERE STRAIGHT UP EVIL... Qimir and Mae were just murdering fools left and right and Mae in fact killed a whole bunch of witches as a child AND THE WITCHES everyone is crying about were actually evil as well.. crazy how INSANELY AWFUL these script writers were (not to mention how bad Amandla was in this "role") And I imagine its all because these Hollywood types can't CONCEIVE of a world were people consider actually deplorable acts evil...I mean you can tell they were TRYING to make the Jedi like Sol seem awful but turns out it really was Mae, Qimir..and then Osha who they tried to frame as the good guys...just BLECK all the way around...Its the first time Ive commented on something on UA-cam and while thinking back on it wanted to throw up in my mouth.
Only one of them was really like that. Well, 2. Sol and torbin.
The Jedi aren't portrayed as evil, or bad. They're portrayed as flawed. There is a difference. They're still good and the sith are stil bad. But this show is about a character becoming a sith
I take it you would hate.old classic star wars novels like bane, or plagueis or even the revenge of the sith novel. They aren't very kind to the Jedi
You're filling in a lot of things u didn't understand with like, ur own interpretations of it
See bud, the main issue here, is that you feel attacked because the jedi are portrayed as flawed and weak. Which cool it's not ideal when we've seen them be bad ass.
But the whole point is to show that not even jedi can be trusted to be 100% true to their institution
The Jedi have always had poor decision making skills. An organization being good in general doesn't mean it's infallible and it certainly doesn't mean that everyone within that organization is a good person. Sol wanting to protect innocent children was noble but there's no way to justify killing someone so you can kidnap their children because you don't like their religion or because you perceive them to be bad based on feels and vibes. Another content creator made a parallel between Sol and the Waco, Texas Branch Davidian situation and it was so spot on.
@@larynOneka8080 generation tech fan I see 😌
Look on the bright side we finally got plagiues on screen
I’m just more confused than anything at this point. I don’t think we ever had to do so much extended mental digesting in Star Wars before. And I don’t think any of us were ready for that
I loved Sol's final fight scene
Much better than most of the lane fights in Ashoka and Obi Wan
Ok I'll tell you what you're feeling! It was so frustrating and silly - here you have it - the Jedi are bad - the Sith are good.
If Yoda knows about the "incident" he's scum - if he gets played he's dumb :-(
And why is the tracker even sabotaging the ship?
Yessss why did the tracker sabotage the ship????????? That was so random and unexpected
@@simpletown323 the acolyte was random an unexpected! Lol
@@simpletown323 sol was putting the ship in danger, flying thru the asteroid field. Bazillwas trying to stop him but that was a dumb way to do it, which I think is the point
The Jedi aren't bad as an Order. But the show is making a point that even good institutions can contain flawed individuals. "Road to hell is paved w good intentions"
If you actually ever read legends this isn't even slightly out of place.
Yoda finds out at the end of the show when vernestra comes in and talks to him, or maybe before when shes doing her press conference thing. No one suspects the sith are involved except Vernestra, who might not even know qimir is actually a Sith, just a fallen Jedi from her perspective. Although idk she does seem like, extra worried. But she's also just presenting the evidence she has about what went on. She can't actually even prove someone else killed sol. The jedi covered up quite a bit in the prequel movies. It's nothing new
There's a lot of reaching required, and misunderstading/ignoring what was actually on the screen to come up w a lot of these critiques I'm noticing. The execution was weak at times, but people acting like this somehow contradicts other star wars releases or breaks lore or misunderstands star wars fundamentally are missing a lot of stuff
@@cloudmaster182 But Sol was never corrupt, he only made a reasonable mistake, the witches throughout the series were hostile and even killed Torbin, in that part Anyzeia transformed into smoke to attack him when moments before he said that his daughters would not leave and the whole rest died when they tried to kill the rest with kelnaca it was not their fault
I don't think the Bunta tree is the vergence. I think the vergence is actually tied to the planetary/lunar alignment. Something about a perfect eclipse when all are in a line creates a nexus of power.
It might even be dark centric, specifically tied to the moons being in the shadow of the system's sun.
Perhaps cores of Kyber or something along those lines that resonate when aligned (perhaps why the deep well is where they conduct their rituals, its like a vent of that power source), or maybe hidden ancient sith temples on each moon that do the same.
The witches are more powerful when the moons are up, but probably most powerful when the moons are in a perfect eclipse, which is kinda alluded to as well.
It was basically a romantic comedy telling the story of two people who despite their differences learned to work together and eventually fell in love. Such a farce of a tv show.
This show wasn't even just a bad starwars show it would be considered bad even without the starwars brand attached to it. That's just my opinion if you enjoyed the show im glad at least a few people found joy in this
Oh I know what to feel…
I swear to God when Mae and Osho were face-to-face I thought they were going to kiss, there was no direction whatsoever on the series, I genuinely believe it was all on auto pilot and written by AI.
Please... I hope this dosen't get a season 2
Oh it will.
"Got a lot of things right and wrong???" What did it even get right. Look, If you like this show, more power to you but I personally can't with Disney anymore.
You're being way too nice... this show was BEYOND bad...almost as if it was written during the writer's strike.
no season 2 for this show thankfully and hopefully
Venestra seemed to know more than Indara told her.
w/r/t the vergence and the idea of it being the failed attempt at creating the chosen one; and if the vergence is what caused Brendok to be teaming with life, then shouldn't tatooine no longer be a desert wasteland if that's where Anakin was created?
실질적으로 가장 강했던 솔을 저렇게 명예롭지 못하게 죽이다니.
시즌 2가 나오든 말든. 난 다시는 스타워즈 안 볼 거야.
I think we should have gotten a fight between Vernestra and Qimir. It probably would have been a pretty good fight and we need more of the lightwhip rather than vernestra pulling it out to slice up a bug for no more than 2 seconds. I loved seeing Plagueis and Osha bleeding Sol's crystal was... something. I definitely enjoyed seeimg that. I wish the high council had more of an appearance though. I do think that Osha becoming Qimir's apprentice could lead to an interesting sequence of events, except for them leavimg Mei behind which really wasn't the right choice, but at least we might not see her again, cause I'm not really a fan of Mei.
This is not saying much, but if episode 7 was removed, and both prospectives (Sol and Mae) in a clear way cleaned up a lot of the writing, toned down the overacting, the show would be better. I don't like how Mae and Osha were created by the Force witches, giving Darth Plagueis who was hiding in the shadows there, the idea to create his own force baby, aka the chosen one. Or, to be more corect force pushed back on him and Sidious for trying to push the balance toward the dark side.
The way the Osha and Mae relationship ended really felt like it was an afterthought, the entire time I was wondering why on earth they had to leave her, it makes no sense, it's like they were done with the character but didn't want to commit to killing her off, just really odd, definitely the weakest part of the finale
My disbelieve was suspended too much in this one... The Osha-Mea thing still does not work at all.
They killed one of the 3 good characters and had him act like a lobotomite AGAIN. The actor pulled so much out of what was given to him. Sad his role was written like it was.
And whats going on with that rat-person, is he just an agent of chaos?!
I honestly hope for a season 2. I am disappointed by some parts of this season, but I feel like a second season could be fairly redeeming for the show. Unfortunately after the reaction to this show (some parts justified calling out bad writing, other parts culture war bs) it seems unlikely that we will get that second season.
Star Wars is like a all you can eat buffet take what you want leave what you don't like behind.
Simple.
Yaaaassssss
so again.... random witchs were able to make life before plagus or sheev.... you gotta be joking
It's not crazy at all, considering the nightsisters had many powers over life and could grand force sensitivity. Savage had no or very limited force sensitivity before the nightsisters changed him, and these are powers neither the Jedi nor Sith have. So it's hardly improbable that different force cults have different abilities. Also, Plagius an Sheev never make life.
@@lespaul5734 the night sisters were already poorly executed and created plenty of lore breaking things. George partly realized this and decided to kill them off in the same way he did with the jedi as he is solely responsible for the clone wars episode in which they are genocided in. saying these witches are similar to the night sisters already implies major world breaking plot holes that not only break the clone wars but also the acolyte itself. if you want a farther break down i recommend watching sheev talks video on how the clone wars doesn't hold up. as someone who adores the clone wars it was very eye opening to have things such as the night sisters broken down and their lore breaking capabilities exposed among other things. also having anything less than a sith lord create life is already retarded as it implies that anakins existence is brought about less because of plagueses meddling and more of these random witches that have no right to do such a thing.
@@rmw9420 The Clone Wars are canon, whether we like them or not, and whether we think they break the lore or not. As established canon, it is the lore, it doesn't break it.
Also, a sith lord never created life. The canon is they (Plagius and Sidious) tried to, but failed, and the will of the force created Anakin as a result. That's a very different scenario to what we saw in this show.
@@lespaul5734 yeah yeah, I'm not pissed off that the clone wars are cannon as they brought us the inhibitor chips and other actual good things, I am not part of the sub sect of the fandom that believes the clone wars multi media project did better service to the clone wars than what we got in the tcw TV show.
Now addressing your other point, there is no way in hell that you can look me dead in the face and say plagus, arguably one of the sith most obsessed with creating life from the force, being quite literally CUCKED out of his main thing as far as we know was a good decision for this show among other stupid decisions this show decided to take. if they wanna make quimir absolutely OP without making him a full on sith then that should go to show just how powerful the sith were and there for show that their abilities are far above that of fallen jedi as well as a coven of weak witches. to be absolutely clear, and if you wanna use the plagus novel as reference, there is no way plagus would allow a random coven of witches to do the very thing he was striving for so long without just killing them all off and using the vergence in the force for himself to do the very thing he was propped up to be most interested in doing. if anything this show would have made plageus a main character and showed just how close he was to achieving his goal with the power of the vergence in the force only to be foiled by the jedi if not osha or mei drawing attention to it.
in conclusion, the fact that they brought plagus into this period completely discredits sheevs whole speech in revenge of the sith as something like this would surely be brought up, if not for making the jedi even stupider in not realizing what was going on. I cannot in good faith accept what this show has done to the major players of the prequels with less than 100 years to go before them happening. this show defiles georges vision as well as bastardizes the plagus we all know and love from the novels.
another thing, nothing against you for trying to make sense of it all. that is what dedicated fans are supposed to do so I hold no grudges against you or your reasoning.
@@rmw9420 I have nothing against you either, I appreciate the convo and the arguments you make.
I didn't see Plagius getting "cucked" here. The last episode ends with Sol saying "somehow" the twins aren't real twins due to how they were created. We have no idea, and neither does Sol, how and why that happened. It could be that Plagius was involved or aware of the witches experimentation. Maybe he egged them on, advised them, etc... Perhaps it was one of the first experiments he oversaw or investigated. We literally don't know, so I don't see the point of getting upset at something we don't know yet. If there is one thing the Sith are good at, its manipulating larger events from the shadows, or at the very least, twisting them to their advantage. It may be that you're right, but maybe not.
I'm not going by the Plagius novel, it isn't canon. As much as I enjoyed those stories, I look forward to what they will do with his character. I don't want a copy paste of Legends, but I also don't want them to completely change his character. As for Palpatine's speech, it's pretty obvious he is either lying or exagerating to seduce Anakin to the Dark Side. Palpatine had not inherited the wisdom over life and death he claims his master had, he couldn't save Padme but he wanted to convince Anakin he could, and he had no solution to solution as seen in the sequels.
I thought the witches were pretty boring imo. "Weak" idk because we were shown so little and so little was explained about their powers. I have no issue with force cults having knowledge and techniques the Sith and Jedi don't have, they just have the be explained better. Both the Jedi and Sith are dogmatic and narrowminded in their own ways.
After watching episode 8, it made me more interested in sol and qigib and everyone else actually. There was no need for the twins to be in the show.
They wanted to make a show about the view of the Jedi from a bad guys point of view and they could've without the twins.
Shows the potential it had but also showed the lack of competence from creators
Star Wars with great bad guys are important. Good people turning to the dark side good. Jedi that hides the truth is at its core. Building for more stories. The story is actually good, but the story-telling can improve.
This was without a doubt, the WORST Star Wars project thus far. The writing was awful - Mae was never a real character and they character assassinated Sol so bad.
Tripping
Nah the Boba Fett show was way worse at least this show didn’t take one of the most iconic Star Wars characters and completely ruin them
100% agree
@@sirkingjames4656 both are bad
@@sirkingjames4656 this was a fanfic. boba fett was literally unwatchable even compared to this. I am proud to state that it was the first starwars show I just couldn't bring myself to continue watching after the train episode, and I'm so glad I made the right choice seeing how it ended. either way this show has done the same song and dance of pooping on what came before, just to areas that hit much more close to home for general starwars fans.
Mae and Osha being a failed creation makes the most sense. Why would Plagueis allow Qimir to train both Osha and Mae, when Plagueis is following the rule of two. Seems like he'd want to test both of them so see how strong they are. Qimir is just following the plan.
Tbf, the Sith weren't always working within the confines of the Rule of Two. In fact, in Legends Plagius was happy to forgo the rule of two when he killed Tenebrous. And I'm pretty sure he had numerous apprentices at any given time. That being said, that's legends, so we will have to wait and see what they will do with Plagius' character
What was the violin music at the end? The chords sound very familiar.
For me it sounds like a homelander's theme rip off
It was great. Gave me what I wanted.
Throw the whole show away!
OSHA created palpatine while her memory loss sister created the chosen one
And how old this "Chosen one", if its about 87 years before phantom menace?
Love the show or hate it, I always longed for someone like that senator to tell the Jedi truth to Force.
They are posing as religion and pretending to be in control of own feelings, while they are neither.
He is almost prophetic when he says that one day a fallen Jedi will be doom of both Order and Republic.
Best character in series!
So I haven’t watched the Acolyte and if I ever do it’s going to be after a while to get some distance from the discourse.
What I’ve gathered from second hand is Darth Plagueis was fooling around trying to create life with the Force and that’s so how going to led to Anakin’s creation either by Plagueis or more likely as a reaction by the Force to his playing with life like in Legends.
Which is kind of an interesting idea this series seems to have a few of those but the execution falls short is what I’m getting.
The Acolyte had only two good episodes. Number 5 and 8 were written with some heart, but all the other episodes were badly written. If season two happens, they better not mess it up.
Pity. No Multiversal unsanctioned operative shocker of a plot twist.
Well, now that that's crappy slog is over, seems a lot of SW content creators are finally going to move on to better things, even if they are Legends oldies. I hope.
plaugies was 14-17 at that time and darth tenebrous had only 2 apprentices and none of them was human
I like all these theories but none of them were mentioned in the show. If I didn't know anything about star wars I would be very confused about the show.
Mannnnnnnn i desperately want to like this show. They do sooooo many cool things from the comics and books, both legends and canon, yet so much of it falls flat. . . Like when i think avout what they acrually did with the story and what they were trying to go for, i get excited, but they just failed to execute it all in a way that kept me engaged. I love the sirh and how he destroyed the jedi in ep5. I loved Sol as a charcter and was for a while one of my all time favourite jedi, but they kill him so unceremoniously. They showed kyber crystal bleeding but i feel like it should have been done in a ceremony, after she kills sol, not during, but i get why it happened.
Mae and Osha's storyline just sucked imo. The entire season depended on the success of episodes 3 and 7, setting up the backstory and motivations of all the charcters and it failed to do that satisfyingly for me.
I loved how they handled Qimir/The Stranger and set up plagueis, the cotosis mines and how they are paying respect to legends, but this storyline needed the tension and character work that House of the Dragon does. It needed more time to tell its story and it needed to be MORE EXCITING.
it was complete æss…
that’s how you should feel about it.
If this storyline does get continued, I’m expecting more of a one off comic rather than a season 2.
nah this show deserves another season, over all it was pretty good, a second season would be way more refined.
Honestly, it was surprising to me. . . that Osha and Mae "are the failed test of creating the Chosen One" and instead are . . . two bodies, with one person?
How. . . How does that work?
Actually, it's. . . kinda tragic in a way: two twins who wanted to live their own lives, only to find out that one LITERALLY can't live without the other.
Right?
By far the worst Star Wars series ever. Osha and Mae are basically an abomination created through witchcraft and are not twins but the same person somehow. Mae killed all those Jedi but because she has amnesia and she started a fire that completely burned down her home killing even more people its somehow ok and the green Jedi lady is going to make it up to her? WTF? They left Mae for absolutely no reason in the end. Sol the worst Jedi ever gets blamed for the deaths of his friends even though it was Mae. Then they tarnish Yoda by getting him involved at the end.
Even with that Sol was never corrupt, he just made a reasonable mistake, the witches throughout the series were hostile and even killed Torbin, in that part Anyzeia transformed into smoke to attack him when moments before he said that his daughters would not leave and all the rest. he died when they tried to kill the rest with kelnaca it was not his fault
Darth Plageis was a crazy part, I wish we saw more tbh
The story went south, but Sol's acting kept me watching S1. Now that he's gone.. S2? Not sure about that.
so glad this show is finally over, if you can even call it a show
You burn down our home!
He lying! BTW I'm sorry for burning down our home. I feel like they weren't even focus on the plot. It feels like the whole point of the series was to do the Doctor Who origin story. There was a women of color born by the force before white male. At first I was even thinking that but then they did away with the Anakin shenanigans. I so let me guess Plagueis is going to be like oh they can create life out of nowhere well I'm going to do the same thing. I'm going to train my Apprentice everything I know but this current Apprentice isn't doing so well I'll wait till he dies off maybe I'll go adopt some Naboo kid when he's born. No way he will kill me in my sleep.
0:17 "good job"
Tbh i would've wish they fuse like ray and kylo (excluding the kissing) did but thats me
Man I wanted to at least see the tracker creature die
Everything about the scene with the changing crystal and blade was absolutely wrong
OMG 🤯🤦🏻♂️
well it’s a ship that sank sorry it didn’t feel like it went anywhere to me
we deserve better
No road maps again..?
I’m hoping they don’t make another season bc of horrible writing. We still didn’t get any back story of Qimir that I’m disappointing about that. It didn’t explain why the witches died of quickly or how Mea survive from the fall? I’m still wondering how the Jedi is the bad guys. They literally defended themselves from the witches and if Mother Annasiaya just told what she’s going to do it will never happen actually Master Sol did told the truth that it was an accident. The issue is Master Sol should’ve tell OSHA the whole story to what happened but in episode 7 he retell the story to Mea to what happened even though she was there and saw the whole thing. Not once the sister acknowledged that her other mother Karol and other witches try to prevent osha going with the Jedi. At least Mea apologies to OSHA that she caused the fire and not blaming the Jedi but Mea did destroyed her home.
75% of the audience stopped watching this series after the first 2 or 3 episodes. Imagine being a theater performer, and almost everyone gets up and walks out. Are those people coming back? Most likely not. Is that going to keep the theater in business? No. What's left is those trying to defend Disney SW EU to the bitter end. Is it Disney's franchise? Yep. Can they do what they want with it? Absolutely. However, most of the big Disney SW projects have been shortened down or canceled. It's even well possible that Episode 10 might actually fail at the box office just as Indy 5 or The Marvels did. What's left after this series (just as many of the other live-action series and Disney sequel trilogy) is an eroded, alienated audience.
If you like The Acolyte, more power to you, but all it did was drive a stake into the Disney SW EU. It's done more damage than The Last Jedi, which resulted in almost half the profit returns of The Force Awakens. Disney probably needs another 180 million for a season 2. If you like the series, go help them out, and maybe they'll do it. Otherwise, it's a coin toss for Disney, whether they want to keep burning more of their money or not.
I hope we don't get a Season 2. One Season was bad enough. The writing was nonsensical in many places. Do we really want a second season of more of the same?
The action was great imo but everything else is so inconsistent. Like after Maemuders multiple Jedi masters and a wookie she decides to have the moral high ground when Sol was on the ground
Welp, that was a waste of 180 million.
I’m not a fan of the “saber bleeding” nonsense Disney have introduced. Just seems too silly. Plus it doesn’t make sense since Anakin’s never went red in Episode III.
Same. Like, I know it looks flashy and cool and all, but lore-wise it's just silly.