Skyrim - The Problem with the College of Winterhold
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- Опубліковано 1 гру 2017
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In our latest Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim video we are talking about the problem with the college of winterhold.
The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim is an open world action role-playing video game developed by Bethesda Game Studios and published by Bethesda Softworks. It is the fifth main installment in The Elder Scrolls series, following The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion, and was released worldwide for Microsoft Windows, PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360 on November 11, 2011.
The game's main story revolves around the player character and their quest to defeat Alduin the World-Eater, a dragon who is prophesied to destroy the world. The videogame is set two hundred years after the events of Oblivion, and takes place in the fictional province of Skyrim. Over the course of the game, the player completes quests and develops the character by improving skills. The game continues the open world tradition of its predecessors by allowing the player to travel anywhere in the game world at any time, and to ignore or postpone the main storyline indefinitely.
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"I went to the college to learn, but they turned me to an arch-mage before I even learned Illusion spells"
-Dragonborn, 4E 201
Learning magic is hard? Stupid nords I made it to Arch mage on Flames and Healing alone tch.
To be fair, in the College the Psyjik put interest in you (and nearly everybody knows it), and you were capital in stopping Ancano (literally only you and him in the room). Nothing related to the leading and management qualities of an Archmage, but it's still better than the Companions Guild bombarding you Harbinger while you did nothing more than Aela, which is far more of a veteran than you...
@@NWolfsson with the companions it is explained why they chose you: Fark wasn't the 'leader type' but more of a follower, Vilkas had the brains but also a very closed mind on most things like his staunch opposed behavior towards you or how he felt too much guilt and revenge hatred to even face the trials of the honored dead. Lastly Aela is literally#1 hot head blood boiling wolf bound. She's not really much for 'wisdom' as more so one hell of a fighter and wild child. You're all that remains of the circle at that point and was viewed as 'neutral' glue when there was in fighting. The one to replace Kodlak was supposed to be Scyor(can't spell it sorry) but...well he died. The harbinger must have all of the skills of the circle members which from their perspective: you do, they all excel at one characteristics while you embody them all in one way or another. More evidence of this is found in Kodlaks journal and reasons for his decision.
@@NWolfsson also Faralda is Master Destruction mage...why she no fight more lol only one I don't expect to fight is Colette..cause.... restoration ya know. And the Irony of Alteration scholar Tolfdir getting paralyzed by Ancano smh
More like "i went to the college for the main quest, but they suckered me in and i had to do it to clear my log. even though my favorite word is smash"
*Literally my life*
Wake up
Get ready
Go to school
Take a couple classes
Dont learn much of anything because its only one day
Principal dies
*becomes principal*
Makes sense
Skyrim in a nutshell tho
Seems legit
Seems legit, the principal of my high school couldn't even write on the chalk board (or black board?). Maybe that's why we saw him once in three years.
Just be glad you weren't at the White House when the president dies.
Imagine being Tolfdir, dedicating your whole life to this weird sketchy college, and when you’re the senior member, the arch-mage dies and some random brand-new student with no investment in the college becomes the new arch-mage.
I mean like, it's his own fault as he makes you the arch-mage.
the guy has lost his own alembic how many times now...what do you expect?
He’s the one who makes you the Arch Mage. It would make more sense if he promoted Mirabelle
That's nothing... imagine being a Nord that's dedicated to go to Sovengarde, but then some dude kills you and traps your soul and you end up in the Soul Cairn.
@@Nottyastro i mean, they didn't have to kill off mirabelle off screen. she's the perfect person to take over the college.
Dragonborn: *Breaths*
Tolfdir: Remarkable, you truly are a remarkable mage
He breathes fire and gets praise, easy.
Considering our very breath is the equivalent to reality warping, can you blame the old man?
@@hahmann It would be, if there was ANY dialogue option that allowed even one main faction to acknowledge you as Dragonborn. Like any at all.
It is certainly remarkable ehen you can cause magic damage without using magicka.
@@ThrillaWhale See that's the thing that bugs me about Skyrim. The game ingores what skills you invest in,your race,whether or not you unlocked shouts etc. It makes being the dragonborn rather pointless if it does not matter to the world. So why retcon what a dragonborn is in this series and make us one yet do nothing with it?
The average mage dungeon has more magic users than the College.
you find more people that have been kicked out of the college just wandering around skyrim than people in the college.
It's an issue most bethesda games suffer from in general, skyrim is just... An extreme case. I cannot play this game without a mod that expands upon locations and adds in more npcs. Visiting an empty college or a "capital" of an entire region and only seeing a few people and a few shacks just feels wrong!
Good point
Wolfie just a hardware problem really considering the game came out in ps3 days . Hopefully the new elder scrolls will have really lived in city’s
@@ButterBoyism In morrowind and Oblivion there where tones of members.
College of Winterhold questline in a nutshell:
- Cast a ward
- Find a ball
- Find a staff
- Kill Ancano
- Arch-mage
easier said than done
@@apreks1277 I disagree. I think it was just as easily done.
@@apreks1277 definitely as easy as stated...
@@apreks1277 Only If you play on Legendary with no mods or glitches well also playing as a pure mage with only clothing and no armor. Then its harder.
Its bad enough that If you go battlemage through the questline then its just easy streak until the last quest because Ancano being a cheap baby with Invincibility phases that you need the spoopy stick to remove.
Vince A go fight some of those mages on legendary with overhaul mods :P the whole games that easy if you play normally
turns out the spell "greatsword power attack" works in almost all scenarios this questline throws at you
A powerful spell indeez
maybe if you are playing on easier difficulties. The questline is actually quite hard if you play it on legendary.
@@vic44rd well I'm sure lots of things are quite hard on legendary
This reminded me of a manga called Mashle. It's about a super strong kid using insane athleticism to bullshit his way through magic school.
Exactly...what a sham...
And then you get promoted to "Arch Mage"??!! I found myself falling back on bow and swords, and gave up the bullsh mage attempts at solving things which were far better fixed by conventional methods.
What a sham!
The only interesting thing about the college is the spawn rate of an ancient dragon in it
No. J'zargo is
Lmaooo 🤣
@@jzargo5797 How has your quest to master expert-level destruction spells been going?
@@demogod4955 Masterfully
bruh its so
annoying because i have to ranged attacks 😭
The College is so under populated because Faralda won't let anyone come in to learn magic unless they already know how to use magic.
Anthony Delfino nah it's pure genius
A college that teaches how to do basic magic (at least how it's classes seem)
Requires you to be able to use advanced(novice restoration for example) magic spells.
UUGHHHHHH!!!
good argument IF she wouldn't give you the book to learn the spell
its about controlling the magic not able to use it
I've more than once ran into a situation where she demanded I cast a spell to gain entry that cost more mana than I had available to me.
+Shroom
And I'm about shitting on things to get like, Even if it's false.
The college questline feels half finished because it IS half finished. Have you ever read the original plans online? The initial plan was to have the questline culminate in an ending which involved time travel, revealing that the Dragonborn his/herself was directly involved with the Great Collapse somehow, casing more light on Aren, Ancano and bringing the Psijic Order more into the game. Unfortunately, for Bethesda to make that all-mighty 11/11/11 release they had to make some cuts due to time constraints. The college got the short end of the stick, in my opinion. The College, the civil war, and several side quests were cut down. Personally, I would much rather have had a finished game than a cool sounding release date, but whatever.
I still can't believe they didn't add generic "students." The weird assassin cult has more members than the college.
In today's day and age, it almost feels unacceptable that a game would be "unfinished" due to deadlines.
Just release it as a workable copy and finish it later.
I totally wouldn't have minded paying $30 for a "Guilds" DLC that enhanced the Thieves, Assassins, Mages, Companions, and whatever else I'm forgetting right now, even if it came out a year after Dragonborn/Dawnguard/whichever was the latest.
Fin... Finished game?...
Is that even English?
tg93williams it sounds right to me
Right actually during the gameplay you hear missing students from one of the teachers (i dont remember which one was them) , he mentions that there were a list but there wasn't a quest!
I like how he teaches you how to block a spell but then sends you to a ruin of draugr which don't even use spells for the most part, and the ones that do also use weapons
hey i just ran through there half the draugrs lived
The thing is, he did not expect the draugr to be there. They had never made it further into the ruin then that first room and had no reason to assume that they would. It was supposed to be completely safe.
@anthonypendergrass353 true but it's skyrim 90% of the ruins have draugr. Even if they are certain no draugr are around, why teach the c one spell only designed to counter mages and not oakflesh or something good against spiders or something too? I know spiders aren't likely but it's a more reasonable approach than the anti-mage spell.
Your lesser ward can't stop 500+ Fus Do Ras. Thanks Tolfdeir. You blithering idiot.
@@Lord_necromancer Has he ever heard of a Nordic ruin, they are always swarmed with Draugr.
Oblivion: Go do unique quests in each of the cities to get a referral to get into the main college with all the big cool stuff.
Skyrim: cast one spell and you're in.
or use bucket and kill a student
Imagine a glitch to get into the college taking longer than the actual initiation. Lmfao.
Or just get the Frost Crag DLC for Oblivion and get all the cool stuff from jump.
Yeah but you have to spend 3,000 gold for each thing of candles, which if you're not using a dupe glitch or whatever can be a lot.
@@HeisBeppo There's a black dude in Imperial City Talos Plaza area named Dorian. His house is right across from the hotel. You can paralyze and pickpocket him. When you click to take his gold it glitches so you can take as much gold as you want. You'll get arrested after robbing him but you get to keep all the money you pickpocket off of him when you get out of jail. Infinite source of gold.
the issue with the college was perfectly summed up for me from a meme I saw on reddit once. it showed a picture of an orc wearing the arch mages robes with the caption "grug good wizard, grug know three spells".
Is that not the while game?
Brilliant hahaha
You need 4 not 3. Unless that's a side quest Im thinking of.
@@prime_optimus you can skip the entry spell if you pass the speech check
@@idkwtcm984 you can also skip the ward lesson with spellbreaker shield
College of winterhold: *gets roasted*
Bards college: *nervous laughter*
at least the bard's college doesn't make you the head bard a few hours after showing up. they treat you like the player should be treated since he doesn't play anying. you're a gopher and they don't even try to hide it.
Lol dab
@@thomasjenkins7506 Mage which can slain with his magic dragon and make himself more powerful by absorbing his soul... And is chosen one... Decent quality for high position.
Bards college so useless to me I forget it's a faction
at least the Bard's college has more students
I remember when Ancano released his magical blast at the Eye of Magnus. Savos the Arch-mage who you supposedly would assume to be the most powerful in the college simply just dies. Mirabelle the Master Wizard gets badly wounded and you leave completely unharmed. Logic is already distorted at this point. Either way you go speak to Tolfdir who tells you to protect the college and first thing I see is Drevis Neloren, Phinis Gestor and Colette Marence running to their rooms in fear with no intention of helping at all. Basically a master illusionist, expert conjurer and expert restoration mage just bailing outta there leaving it to the new student to sort things out. I couldn't help but start laughing hysterically. Anyhow I make my way to the bridge and is luckily met by Faralda and Arniel Gane who are actually gonna help. Credit to them haha. We make our way across the bridge and right as I start thinking things couldn't get more absurd, Arniel Gane straight-up just starts throwing punches at the anomalies like "come at me bro, u want some I'll give it ya" style. I went into a coma at this point.
I headcanon Arniel throwing punches is him out of mana and no daggers/weapons on his person. I even panicked at that time cuz he's going to get himself killed throwing himself like that. Fortunately, he survived XD
@@precioustories03 Haha I see it before my eyes now XD
@TheWugglet Exactly lol
Same thing happens when you attack Savos Aren. He is a freaking Archmage, but instead of incinerating that fool who attacked him he... starts punching him.
@@vecna2101 hahaha what the hell
The amount of times my pure mage low level character straight up died in Saarthal isn't funny Tolfdir.
I accidentally power leveled my character, while trying to level my sneak to finish the “diplomatic immunity” quest. Once I had, like, level 95 sneak, my level was so high, that my enemies were *leagues* stronger than me. I couldn’t even defeat the first draugr in Saarthal. Lesson learned. Don’t cheat the game.
@@arcader8138 it's worse too if you play on legendary and don't have good health lol
Dude idk if it's due to one of the mods I have, but, remember the boss that has the staff of magnus? Defeating that ducker at lv35 was impossible, if you got remotely close, as in, close enough to acknowledge his existance, shock damage would just apply to you over time, in fact, I lied, cause that shit still applied to you even if you were behind a wall, plus the dude summoned a storm antronach, and I was playing in master
@@mk-ul5tv iirc that was a dragon priest, and all of the (non dragonborn dlc) ones are level 50 so it makes sense that you struggled
@@aradia9726 thanks for giving my suffering validation, to kill that fuck I used every potion, every venom, every arrow, I had to cheese him, there was just no way, even with shouts like become etherial or slow time
Psijic Monk: "Know that you have set in motion a chain of events which cannot be stopped."
Me: *Walks away and forgets all about the College.*
Psijic Monk: "Shit."
That's what bothered me the most like why do I stumble onto this crap in the first 3minutes of the questline. Why not like companions go on a few expeditions then find a book that points to sarthal theeeen the whole end of the world arc can be understood
@@SoraTsubasa it’s just a shame that Bethesda thinks everything has to be handed to you, that you need to be the savior in every situation. Why can’t stuff be earned? Why can’t the pain OC order only approach you when you’re worthy? It’s just frustrating
@@MrSkeltal268 the only time it was appropriate to make you the one in charge was with the dark brotherhood
(Because everyone else is dead)
@@nathanielgarza9198 And also because one of the gods the Dark Brotherhood worships is only willing to speak to you
"Hey, you, new guy, run a couple errands and you're archmage. Deal?"
Two days later, wearing the kick ass archmage robes:
Farengar: "If you got the aptitude, you should go to the mages college of Winterhold."
Dragonborn: "K"
I feel like giving farengar a slap only a dragonborn could give
@@gavinpoley2314 the good old FUS RO DAAH! :D
Wait a second, does he say ‘aptitude’? I always thought he said ‘attitude’.
is farengar high on skooma or what
to be fair, farengar is an asshole, so it's in character.
It’s almost like going to actual college: they don’t teach you the things you went there for and you learn more after you’ve finished
There should’ve been a quest involving the restoration of Winterhold, which results in the city being rebuilt to the glory it had before the great collapse… always bothered me that this wasn’t done.
I agree. I know it's Game Limitations, but Winterhold is like... 2 houses and a Bar. That can't even be classified as a Hamlet!
This can be said about the game as a whole, theres no semblance of time passing or the world changing to major story events, the closest we get is civil war where some cities get different guards, thats pretty much it
The college should've taught you all spells through quests. Books is so boring and unrealistic in terms of the world setting. You litterally cast two spells in the college quest line and that's it.
Or give you repeatable Quests where you could earn the Gold to buy the books in the first place. Like pretty much any other guild.
Even more both of those spells are provided for you if you don’t already know them. And the first one can be skipped if you pass the speech check
@@MrMitchbow yeeeeaaah. By the time you have the speech and perks to pass that check, the measly amount they ask for the spell its so miserable its basically useless to waste time in checks
@@MegaAgamon Put the problem with that is obtaining gold is so easy in Skyrim that you'd only need to do at max 5 side quests and between the gold from them and gold from the loot you got you'd be able you buy all the spells you want/need for you build. So unless they made gold harder to obtain I.E made valuable items rare and non enchanted items only sell for at max 100 gold and made the spells cost thousands of gold.
*literally
First time I went to the College I went there with the intention of learning magic and improving my skills. About 6 missions later I was Archmage of the place despite only being able to cast apprentice level spells.
I was like, "Really? I'm in charge? Already? I'm crap at magic though....that's why i came here in the first place......"
Peter Badger I would really like having lessons or people that could help you get higher level on conjuration, destruction etc, like students that are practicing outside or something :(
Sorry for bad eng
It becomes more ridiculous when you do the college as a Muscle Wizard run.
I became the archmave with my highest magic skill being around 20 points (restoration iirc), the rest haven't even progressed.
That's kind of why I join and go through the forced guided tour, but then go off and get training in magic from the various trainers there and throughout Skyrim (and Solstheim) before I ever go to the "First Lessons" with Tolfdir. That way I feel like I legitimately learned and grew as a mage, as a student of the College of Winterhold, and so it doesn't feel so out of place when I can actually defend myself in Saarthal or why the Psijic Order would at all be interested in me and my abilities. And when I eventually become Arch-Mage, it feels earned.
I only wish the whole quest-line for the College was handled a lot better by Bethesda. But seriously, all their quest-lines in Skyrim feel cheap and cobbled together. I think they grew complacent and relied a bit too heavily on radient quests, thinking we were too stupid or gullible to know the difference.
I always assumed you got made archmage because the events of the college questline damaged the college's already terrible reputation even further and nobody else wanted the job. I actually kinda liked it when my meathead fighter who almost never used magic became archmage because it almost seemed like a shrewd political move for dealing with the local Nords, and it meant that I basically got to be Ridcully from Discworld.
Accurate College of Winterhold Experience:
"Oh, hey, its J'zargo. Neat."
"Glowy guy. Huh, neat."
"A skeletal dragon? Neat."
"Guess I'm the arch mage now. Neat."
J'zargo should be the arch-mage. His innovations in destruction magic are remarkable, especially the suicide vest.
If one could make a dremora use it in their stead.
Winterhold: “Everyone’s only here for the college!”
*Walks into college*
*Practically empty*
Exactly.
Every single fucking tavernkeeper in Skyrim will tell you about the college the millisecond you ask for magic, and plenty of guards constantly talk about it in the streets.
Yet they have 3 students.
@@Z7Games in its defense, the place is practically surrounded by a blizzard. most who would be interested in studying there would probably not be able to make it anyway, and those who can handle it tend to be the type to prefer a warrior path. my question is why the college is not somewhere more accessible, or having another college under the same name
well, they certainly aren't there for the town, so it makes sense.
@@Underworlder5
A yes, the very remote and hard to get Winterhold. Almost impossible to reach by humankind.
Unless you pay a measly 50 gold to the carriage guy of course...
It's been 200 years since it collapsed and the bridge is still broken. Conjure up a hammer and fix it already.
lol..... senile scribbles much?
Ahaha senile scribbles.
Also it was only 80 years wasn’t it?
I get that joke.......senile scribbles
Dude actually expected Skyrim fans to not get a reference from a Skyrim video
Wise Ferret senile scribbles eh?
You even run into some NPC's throughout Skyrim whose schtick is basically "I have magical talents, but it's looked down upon in Skyrim. What shall I do?" Why can't you, a College Mage, or may even the Archmage at that point, just direct them toward your institution. It would've been so cool.
Try using follower tweaks to create followers and make them stay in the specific locations or make that location their home. In other words you would be recruiting more members for your faction by using the follower tweak mod to change the home of an NPC and switch it with the location of your choosing.
@JustSomeGuyOnTheNet I'd say they've gotten lazier with each game in the series, and it has peaked with Skyrim. I think the main reason for this is that rather than adding new features in each iteration, they take them out or dilute them down to a basic level. I've played the series since Daggerfall, and Morrowind is one of my all-time favourite RPGs. I still play it now (heavily modded, of course, hah). I still love Skyrim, but it always holds your hand far too much for my taste. I very rarely felt actually challenged by anything in Skyrim, speaking in general, not combat (also, Morrowind's combat system was a challenge in itself, haha) it was just a case of go to map marker, do thing, go to next marker, et c.. That's probably what I liked most about Morrowind, the sense of achievement when you finally figure out where you're supposed to go, or what you were supposed to do.
I'm praying that TES VI goes back to that style of game but updating it with things like Skyrim's combat/magic system. Unfortunately, based on Bethesda's recent performance that doesn't seem at all likely.
Lilferiby sheesh I recommend you don’t look into how dumbed down Fallout 4 got coming from Skyrim... FO4 makes Skyrim look like a super in-depth RPG.
Keep in mind Skyrim was made 9 years ago. They also put the game out sooner than they wanted without finishing it, because a company also was putting its game out that year and money wasn’t going to be coming in as steady for there games because of it.
This is what i been saying for 10 damn years now!
I think the College could have worked better if you had to pass all the master spell quests to become Arch Mage in addition to finishing the College Quest Line
I feel like Master would take a while. Maybe reach Expert level in all of the skill trees, which is 75 for each if I remember correctly?
My biggest gripe with the mage guild in Skyrim was how useless it felt. I personally think all spells beyond basic ones should be taught there and incorporate mini quests that act as classes for each spell. It would make going to the school essential for anyone who wants to be a mage. I also wish they expanded on the quest line and incorporated more of the Psijic order after the events with Ancano.
@@pancakes8670 expert in all but master of one would make more sense I think, like you are essentially a PhD of Illusion now so here's your tenure and job offering of Dean
Yeah like the thieves guild having you restore its former glory which also proves you to be a master thief
My level 130 mage in Skyrim would still be a noob then. Think I'm missing 2 master quests still.
I found it funny how you get told that your actions would be judged but there are no choices you can make.
And also if you even kill someone, you pay a fee and it's as if nothing happened. There's no consequences for your very limited choices.
All the earlier quests in the game, especially quests in Riverwood, reveal how much choice they planned for the player to have before running out of time and deciding to make everyone essential and holding your hand with a vice grip
@@timtam4596 what quests in river wood, just wondering, all I can think of is fetching the golden claw and delivering faendals letter lol
@@fireice8828 Those are the only two, but the Golden claw can be discovered my talking to Lucan, or visiting the Barrow. And the quest can be completed even if Lucan is dead, by giving the claw to his sister. As for the letters, you can help, or betray, either Faendal or Sven. Being able to work around your choices appears to be a larger priority early in the game
@@timtam4596 ah gotcha
Does anyone else find it incredibly lazy that the player character so often is made the leader?
I'm a stealth archer. I don't want to be fucking Arch Mage. I joined the college largely because I wanted to complete the question, and going through the questline is necessary for getting some of the shouts.
Leave Mirabelle alive, and make _her_ the arch mage.
I mean it’s the case for ever guild/faction in almost every game. It is what it is. These missions are clearly designed to be played by a character of the specific type. They barely finished the missions and dialogue they had, I wouldn’t expect them to have branching paths depending on your individual skill distribution. I’m more upset that you don’t get anything for ever being in charge. It would be cool if you could send groups to go do an expedition with you like the case for sarthaal, or recruit members in random encounters or people you have built relationships with through other missions elsewhere.
@@Theevilrhino the only benefits from leadership is being able to take certain things items from a specific room without it counting as theft. even then, that will only stop a player doing a good guy playthrough. i doubt anyone will sell the daedra heart you find in kodlaks room (why would he have a daedra heart lying around anyway?)
god same, i also don't like it in the thieves guild and the companions (tbh i dont really remember id the dragonborn became the ""leader"" in the end, i don't join the companions very often). i don't wanna be no boss, i came here only for the main quest/shouts. at least in the dark brotherhood the night mother is technically the leader, instead of the dragonborn...
they could've given a choice if you want to become a leader of some fraction??? u get extra benefits if you do (for examples thieves giving you some gold they've stolen if you're the thieves guild leader, not only when u have the nightgale armor on) and if you don't want to be the leader, then you just chose not to be and another npc is the boss
@@Theevilrhino Not quite true. You can't be the leader of different factions in Fallout. Couldn't when I last played it anyway.
@@satinizer8021 There's also the fact that you're approached to join the apparently illegal Thieves Guild. You could have no stealth perks and be a hulking brute in full Ebony armor with a huge battleaxe strapped to your back, and stupid Brynjolf will say you're a thief.
The reason there are only three students is because Tolfdir used the rest as meat shields while fighting draugr
It made me laugh how he told a new student in the college to go ahead without him and explore a dangerous ruin more
Winterhold Illusion Master: "Am i even invisible?"
Some Khajiit student in the Mages Guild: "its just a prank lmao"
I feel like it wasn't meant as the conventional "learn from professors" kind college, and more like "social club for the magically gifted".
More like the universities of antiquity honestly. Reminds me of how the Library of Alexandria worked
Mystic-Malevolence I saw it as more of an organisation of scholars, with the elders naturally helping out new scholars. Less a strict student-teacher relationship.
Mystic-Malevolence sounds like a private college lol
Mystic-Malevolence even so you almost can’t train your magic in the college the only thing you can do is cast spells in the void, which don’t train your magicka
That was actually the original meaning of college. They were essentially research institutions, the presence of students was incidental.
You would think they would fix the fucking bridge after 90 years
At least throw some fucking wooden railings up for Talos' sake! I've actually died falling off of it due to accidentally hitting Q while waiting for the high-elf with pigtails to trundle her ass up the stairs.
Just fucking conjure up a hammer and just fuck rebuild that shit
Harri Phd
That spell doesn't exist....yet. ;-;
What about Fallout4? You would think after 200 years someone could have found a broom and some fucking paint? Some if the cities in Europe were bombed into fucking rubble 70 years ago, they were rebuilt.
Goro
Someone should conjure up a fucking Hammer and fix the goddamn bridge already.
Did ya get the reference
So I've been playing through Skyrim (again). And I have a theory that the Thieves guild was the most well thought out faction. Because of this, I've been thinking of ways they could have made the other factions just as good.
In order to become guild master of the Thieves guild, you have to do more than just finish the questline. You have to take jobs in other holds in order to establish a presence there. And after doing so in each of the walled ones, and finishing a capstone quest, you get one step closer to it.
They could have done the same with the College. And tied it in with Urag and the Enchanting guy just like they did with Vex and Delvin's quests, this time with the unwalled holds like Morthol and Dawnstar. Find some books here, do enchanting services there, that sort of thing. With each hold having a capstone quest that gets you closer to becoming Archmage. Your goal isnt to be a master of the Arcane, but to re-establish the "good graces" of the College. Each capstone quest could result in a new student, mirroring the vendors in the Thieves guild.
Finally, and additional objective of the Thieves guild is finding the collectibles for the shelf. In the College, this could be something else. Maybe instead of collectibles, it's some sort of Arcane Anomally off the main path resulting from the eye of magnus you have to dispel.
Sure, this basically boils down to "Make everything like the Thieves Guild." But a majority of the factions have the same theme of "Return to Glory." And it all could have made for a better experience.
That would definitely be cool. However, I kind of liked how the reputation of the college remains piss poor and unsavable because all its mages just don't give a damn. The thieves guild wants to reinvent itself and rise to glory again, the college doesn't really seem to think there's a problem with how things are. Being arch age is more like making sure a group of kindergarten students with flame throwers remains within the property lines.
I've always wondered if the events of Skyrim happen as is BECAUSE we are Dragonborn. Like we're the person in Kodlak's dreams, or the Listener of the Nightmother because our inborn will to dominate(As stated by Paarthurnax) doesn't always mean it's us consciously dominating things, but the world kinda bends to us regardless. For example, the arrival of Alduin in Helgen. What if the world, or perhaps time, was bent to release Alduin when the Dragonborn was in trouble. That's why Alduin just so happened to attack when he did. Or when the Psyjic Order says you alone can change the future, it's them being bent by the world, or them realizing the that Dragonborn has an innate ability to dominate whatever situation they're in.
Maybe that's a little far fetched, but that's how I rationalize us being able to join and lead guilds like the Dark Brotherhood and Companions, or be the Champion to multiple Daedric Princes at the same time. The world, and perhaps even those beyond, are being bent by the power of Akatosh held within us, and it's why the Dragonborn is often so strong(Like Miraaq, who made a shout to dominate the very wills of others).
So the Dragonborn is a canon Gary Stu/Mary Sue?
@@thesittingtraveller3467 Being a child of the Dragon God of Time has its perks I guess
I will say that the way Bethesda has gone about this before, from what I recall, is that while we as the player get to do all the fun guild things, it canonically isn’t the protagonist doing it - it’s just some random person. So in the canon of Skyrim, the Dragonborn isn’t the one leading the various factions; you just play through them because it’s more fun that way. So in canon, the person who saves the College is just some random person, separate from the dragonborn and the people who go onto lead the other guilds
@@everettw.9610so you're saying our actions mean nothing
@@funnyvalentine4078 I mean, yes and no. If anything, it's a way Bethesda protects the player's choices. In Skyrim, the Hero of Kvatch is barely ever mentioned, if at all, because of this principle. If the Last Dragonborn was also, canonically, the Archmage of Winterhold, Listener of the Dark Brotherhood, etc etc, then that is honestly pretty wild and there's no reason that that person isn't as idolized as much as Ysgramor or the likes. In TES you get to choose every aspect of your character, and having the world where your character does everything you could possibly do in the games puts a lot of pressure on the lore to specifically name the Last Dragonborn, invalidating the basic premise of creating a character
Skyrim somehow succeeded in making magic the LEAST interesting part of an Elder Scrolls game.
Although I disagree with you there, I do think that the college of winterhold is the worst guild in Skyrim
Yeah it feels naff asf and makes your character extra squishy, unlike in Oblivion where you were holding back majorly if you weren't using magic. Skyrim made magic feel pointless, why encumber yourself with cheap party spells when you could just cave skulls in with a big two-handed hammer.
kekinator Both magic and hand to hand combat have their uses in the game. It just takes mages longer to be powerful but when they do they become stronger than if they'd chosen to be a warrior. magic can be really powerful and it definitely is not all party tricks
Zohaib Ajmal Magic is pretty bad in skyrim, especially comparatively to a warrior build late game. You're not only squishy most spells are shrugged off unless you stagger lock with fireball which does meager damage later on. Magic doesn't really scale well in a game where the scaling is already pretty bad but at least when using a sword or whatever that gets scaled with you along with great armor.
no...it's not. Magic is nowhere close to the power you can achieve through mellee. There are no ways to buff or increase magic damage via enchanting, look at all the options you have for mellee. You can buff +20% damage on to every piece of gear, and then on top of that you can buff the weapon damage from crafting up to legendary tier. Magic is a fucking joke in Skyrim.
College of Winterhold's approach to handling new students:
First day of classes:
Hello new guy. Here, cast a shield while I try to roast you. You survived? Good! Now, the whole class is (individually) trekking across the Yeti-infested glacier, to explore an ancient tomb full of vengeful Draugr.
.
Somehow I don't think the College is OSHA-certified.
The college is Oh Shit certified.
dont forget the oh this guy cant be harmed ill let you the student fight this being while i drain this orb of magicka then maybe you can kill him... lets hope so
remember that the students have been complaining the entire time, that they want to do something more advanced :D
Yah and for a collage of magic they only teach one spell
I had a geology professor that led us on a walk around the city looking at the stones used in construction and a few natural outcroppings. The guy wore a Gilligan hat and carried his papers in a collapsible steel bucket. To be clear, yes I am talking about a real professor teaching a real class that I really took in a real college.
The Saarthal quest is utterly within my expectations of a magic college.
what bothers me the most is that the second you enter the guild, you guessed Ancano as a Thalmor is gonna betray you. And then you give him the benefit of doubt, thinking the game won't do something so easy, and then Ancano is indeed a traitor and you're supposed to be chocked, after having pretty much 0 interaction with him.
Wouldn't it have been cooler if the game invited you to suspect Ancano, but he turns out to be the good guy and, I don't know, Savos Aren is the traitor? Or the psyjics?
Edit: with some videos I have a bad habit of commenting before watching, now I know he says it XD
Skill checks need to come back. You shouldnt be able to complete a mage centric quest line without heavy investment into those skills.
And it doesn't have to be simple "have x amount in this skill" type stuff. You can get interesting with it. Like maybe add a magical bridge in saarthal that requires a constant stream of the Sparks spell to stay active, meaning you have to have enough points invested into magika and/or reduction of destruction spell costs to make it across the bridge. Could do many things like that.
Or potions
But then people would bitch about How difficult it is to Cross a certain bridge when you're a fucking Dragonborn with Daedrik armor and what not. And how "The Game forces you" to put points in Magicka...
People will always have complains.
My problem with it is tht you become archmage, and it means nothing. Not once do any of the letureres or ANYONE ask you to make any descision that is relevant to the running of the college. I am not suggesting getting bogged down in book keeping, but just every now and then doing some Archmaging.
Lmao right, I remember accepting Onmund's request, then finishing the storyline without following up on his side-quest. I became Arch-Mage, then talked to Enthir and he was still talking to me like I'm the retarded apprentice who wants Onmund get his amulet back. Learn some respect, boy.
It means you can take free stuff from archmage quarters without stealing it :)
K L That’s what I call the Guild Problem. You become the leader and never have to make a single damn choice
I mean, you also didn’t have any responsibilities in Oblivion so I don’t see your point...
Honestly think a dragonborn/adventurer shouldn’t be able to become archmage... it’s like becoming Jarl.
Honorary master title or something should be good enough
No magic build = "Youre the archmage now"
Harapeko I only joined to get all the masks
Has warrior build and only uses healing spells. "apparently one of the best mages"
I mean as Dragonborn you're the master of the Thu'um which is technically a school of magic.
@@FilmsNerf2 are you though? you can beat the game with just 4 shouts: unrelenting force, whirlwind sprint, dragonrend, and clear skies. they are all just handed to you, too.
@@thomasjenkins7506 fire breath. Which is also handed to you
I feel like the College of Winterhold must have been done towards the end of the development cycle because it feels like there is just a bunch of cut content all around it feels unfinished
I liked how in Morrowind, the Mage's Guild quest givers would only give quests to you based on your rank. So you would need to increase your skills before you completed all the quests. In Skyrim you can do all the quests without learning much magic at all.
I did find it interesting that after progressing to 50 restoration without doing the college questline, a prospective student approached me and asked me to demonstrate how to use wards for his entrance exam. I used a ward while he attacked with magic. Then Lydia killed him because he shot a firebolt at me. I shrugged, looted him, and left his naked corpse in the middle of the streets of Whiterun.
This is why I leave Lydia at Breezehome. She can take care of my house while I do the killing.
@@shadowstrider5033 lydia is the best steward, though. that aggressive behavior is perfect then.
I was once getting out of Winterhold when said guy came to me asking the same thing. As soon as I started casting my ward, a dragon appeared and started attacking me. It was very frustrating
Amazing how after all these years I still haven't encountered this
Thomas Jenkins I married her lmfao
Everything in Skyrim moved too quickly. I feel like I do a few quests here and there and.... wait, I'm in the circle already??? You really trust me enough to do important thieves guild jobs after i acted tough to some shopkeepers? The sense of progression in TES V is completely fucked. It's way too fast.
You do one tiny pickpocket gig for them and your first mission is to do what their "best infiltrator" couldn't.
Very true. I just start the game two quest later maybe one if you stumble upon the dragon stone early and im revealed to be the most powerful being in tamriel. The civil war was awful, it needs a much larger scale battle and it had a lack of espionage or tactic also one single soldier could simply end a war. Alduin was far to easy, and overall dragon born quests were more challenging and captivating. And the dead high king couldve had a LOT of potential for the dragon born leading an army to become the high king then have ro resolve skyrims issues and rebuild it either as a lone country or part of the empire but i understand Bethsde wants a vague story line so they can make sure the next game makes sense
MJPK and DB had optional killing bonuses for the named targets👍
I know this is an old comment, but I actually feel like the Thieves Guild is the only one that made progression feel like work. With the Companions, you can kill a random wolf in a house and be inducted into the Circle and trusted with secrets. Granted, Mercer does send you out to try to do what Vex couldn't - though we know later he kinda hoped you'd die - but each of the quests felt like I had to work for it. Then there's the plot itself, which was unique - betrayals, conspiracies, secret orders - and you don't even become the official guild master until you've done like 50 radiant quests.
The rest were p bad in comparison. The Arch Mage thing was silly, the fact that you can be Harbinger at, like, level 5 is ridiculous, and the DB questline was obvs an attempt at Oblivion nostalgia, w the vampire character, the shadowscale character, and a betrayal. (Tho I'll never complain about Shadowmere or Lucien's ghost.) The assassinations were easy and uncreative; wow, killing someone by pushing over a statue AGAIN... really, if I hadn't played the games in reverse order, I probably would've been annoyed. And the fact that Oblivion's DB questline stood out so much after playing Skyrim first only proves that they failed the story in that regard moving forward. (The only funny thing with playing Skyrim's DB first is that you freak tf out when the Night Mother, essentially a corpse, starts talking to you. I had no idea wtf was going on.) Granted, Cicero and Nazir were iconic characters imo, so they got those guys right.
The Companions questline is a joke tho. I had it modded to make the requirements to progress more fleshed out, but when I played SSE w the unmodded questline again since forever... I hated it. The College could've added so much more weight to it too, or they could have at least not have made you the leader of every faction ever.
I mean, they're fun and all ofc, but they all could've been handled w more complexity.
It was much better in morrowind, so many quest and with the ranks you feel like you deserve the title, in Skyrim everyting is give to you so easy
2017 FudgeMuppet: "Wish we knew more about the Augur or Dunnlain"
2020 Camel: "Allow me to introduce myself, and my 3 hour video on the subject"
The Labrynthian is an amazing dungeon especially as a mage build. One of the best
The Thalmor guy turned out to be the bad guy. Ooooh noooo, I am sooo surpriiiised... *falls asleep*
Well, I do not think the writers aimed to surprise the players by showing Ancano (the thalmor) as the bad guy. Almost everyone at the College warns you not to trust him. The "surprise" in that story is about what the Arch-mage did to his old friends in Labyrinth.
Fegelein, *FEGELEIN!*
Syrus2006
DAMMIT! you beat me to it
Soon as I saw his name (and subsequently his display picture) I had to.
The scream was welling up within me.
Trueeee
Fun fact: The last generation of students from the college are almost all dead. You can find a lot of their corpses throughout Winterhold. One was killed by a bandit, in the journeyman's nook east of the city. Another one's charred corpse can be found on the coastline surrounded by fire, with a flame cloak spell on the ground in front of him, and so on.
Tanner McNeill true
Honestly it's probably because they don't have many places they can go. They're normal people with no fast travel so they had to be somewhere local but not near the townspeople since the nords wouldn't put up with it.
Funny enough those students who you find dead are part of a cut quest line that was removed for no real reason
There also was 4 students that died trying summon daedra in midden.
wasn't that supposed to be quest, and it got cancelled?
I really like the idea of arcano being the good guy and the archmage being the villain
It's such a shame that every Mage, Necromancer, Witch that we run into in the Wild attacks us immediately and has to die because of it.
I always thought the whole College of Winterhold was underwelming. Even aesthetically it was dull. It seems so cold and uninviting.
Surely a Mage’s College should have magical fireplaces and a cozy interior...not the ‘classic’ Nord architecture.
I expected it all to look like the arch-mage's garden but no, fuck me for wanting a nice anything to look at in the north of skyrim
Giant Miniature Space Giraffe
Well, the North is a cold and inhospitable place. Of course people would want their homes to be as warm and invit.....oh wait, as cold and miserable as the outside.
Damn stubborn Nords.
I hated the inside a lot I walked inside and it had one room for study and a few generic rooms for its students I was like what is this SMH. But then like the quest line wasn't even dope it was just ight
Twice19 That’s why one of the first mods I got for Skyrim when I got it on ps4 was a mod that changed the college. It was always so boring before. It’s nothing insane or anything but the stuff it adds was really needed in my opinion.
Drew 38 Yeah
I was love how they teach you how to put up a quickly draining wall, and then expect you to fight a entire tomb full of draugr, a necromancer guild, and a dwemer ruin full of dangerous machines.
And Falmer ...don't forget the FaLmER
i was only level 8 and i wanted to learn some more magic, i absolutely did NOT deserve any of that
I was stuck in the first part of the quest, when you have to explore saarthal, because the draugr were too powerful. That’s right, my level was too high and my gear was so weak, that I couldn’t finish the questline.
My biggest problem with Tolfdir and his ward test is it sometimes takes him so long to cast the firebolt that you can run out of magicka if you literally came straight from Helgen/Whiterun.
"You have to keep the ward up. I don't want to h-"
Me: "YOU GOT EIGHT SECONDS! MOVE IT OLD MAN!"
The thieves guild was kind of a gold standard for guilds in skyrim, it literally turns Riften, probably one of the worst big cities in Skyrim, into the best one by unlocking the vendors. They could have done something similar with the College restoring Winterhold to its former glory, or another progression system involving separate questlines themed around the magic schools.
I would have loved a quest revolving around the Great Collapse, what caused it and why 🤔 some kind of big conspiracy
+Ashbee Gaming Agreed
Well, the immersive college of winterhold mod kind of features a quest, which includes travelling into the depths of Winterhold and fighting your way through the ruins of the collapsed city. It is only available after the end of the college questline when becoming archmage, and starts in the midden.
Fafnir Geser and it's, if not scary at least, unsettling. It was also as intence as it could get.
Ashbee Gaming It'S tHe BuGs In JaRs!!!
Bethesda really droped the great collapse idea too easily. Just like "No One Escapes From Cidna Mines" was more or less the conclusion of The Markarth incedent they could have made a quest chain that allowed the truth of The Collapse to be explored and for Winterhold and The College's relationship to be rebuilt between that and rebuilding the town.
Every time I go to the collage there's a Dragon killing the Town.
Same
It is a mercy killing from the dragon.
Every. Single. Time....
That’s just the definition of Skyrim. There’s ALWAYS a dragon where you are.
Paarthurnaax: I will teach the other dovah through the way of the voice.
The other dovah: always trying to kill the Dragonborn
Two things about there not being students there:
A) There is another mage school that is offering a faster path to power through evil magic.
B) The nords attack and kill mages with impunity. Anyone wanting to join the guild that sank the town into the sea is probably harassed a lot.
They also have a main mission about the student who stole books to join some baddies and I believe there’s a side mission to find the missing students. They occasionally reference others who left to perform “unsavory” research. I agree with a lot of the people that are saying there should have been more npcs but they gave the same lazy excuses and suffer from the same problems as the other factions...
@@Theevilrhino Oh my God, I think you made me realize something...
(The moment you join them)
The Dark Brotherhood, nearly thriving since they invite in anybody that has enough killing instinct to take on their place= 7 named NPCs, no generics.
The Companions, a well-established mercenary guild: 10 NPCs, a few associates.
The Mages' college, in a very bad place, with a bad rep but not in shambles: 16 named NPCs.
The Thieves' guild, in shambles, nobody willing to associate with them because of their bad luck: 12 named thieves, 7 named associates *in the ragged flagoon* , and unnamed NPCs and supporters outside of the guild...
Guys... I think they've built the guilds backwards...
@@NWolfsson i don’t think the dark brotherhood would be thriving at all, they’re by far the most secretive and protected of all the guilds because of, you know, murder, and the thieves guild is built on influence and numbers no matter how rundown they are. The companions should definitely be bigger though.
@@evanhansen5064 IMO the Brotherhood basically recruit you because you managed to get wind of a contract before them (or even, because you took on a contract they wouldn't take because of the contractor not being a solvable individual), and I don't see any indicator that it wouldn't happen more often.
But I see what you're saying.
They totally should have given us the option to join the evil mages
I was actually really hyped for the rest of the quest when I did training with tolfdir (casting a ward as practice)
That was exactly what I was looking for, actual training, tips and improvement to my magic.
The last one certainly happened but the rest just felt like any other quest.
I always thought Tolfdir, Mirabelle, the arch mage and the librarian were the only staff and the expert mages were more like upper class men
It does seem improbable that a college thousands of years old, which is the only place in the whole country that you can study magic in, would only have a handful of students
Yes, more like the X-men than a university.
@@dzonbrodi514 actually it's *not* all that improbable once you take that fact in the context of in-game recent events. After the Oblivion Crisis, Nords began to trust magic less and less. Add that to the fact that most of those within the Dominion are magic-users and the fact that the College is the only thing left standing after the Great Collapse and you get a recipe for Nord parents who shun the magic found in their kids rather than let them go to the College. And you also get the recipe for why there are so few students and so many younger mages who are being taught magic by not-so-trustworthy people instead of a well-trained person at the most prestigious and well-organized college in the country (because it's the *only* one in the country). So, the recent unpopularity of magic leads to less and less students. This is like going to an unpopular school with a shady history, realizing that there are not many students there, and asking why is there so few students at this place when the reasons are obvious. If things get any worse magic-wise in the Elder Scrolls universe, I'd say that the mages of Tamriel should Harry Potter it up, and study magic in secret, make magic, as a whole be something that next to know one knows even exists. Make the existence of magic be forgotten by the people of Tamriel, and continue their existence in secret, turn it into something that only exists in fairytales and legends.
I like the arch mages quarters and everything but... Mirabelle deserved to be arch mage more than I did
@Red Red Well, considering there are ways of killing just about anyone, he might of just accidentally killed her. Happens to alot of people, apparently.
EDIT: Well, apparently she does die. I haven't played it, but he doesn't seem to be the only one saying this. Maybe something happened in your playthrough, and she bugged out and survived, lol.
@@jonathandoe1367 yeah, I was halfway done mentally writing a reply. She dies. I've played through the college dozens of times, I've never had her survive a single time. No idea what could even cause that.
When you consider that YOU are the one who dealt with Ancano, Labrynthian, the Eye, the staff, the synod, the caller, and with Faralda and Sergius saved the city and were already third in command it kinda makes sense that you're the new archmage.
@@iami3rian394 Well, it could make sense that you've demonstrated qualifications for defending the college, but that's very different from running it.
@@KarmasAB123 right, so we should have to seal the only other surviving members of our class in a tomb, enthralled to imprison a dragon priest lich for all time because we can't deal with him....
Or maybe insist that the Auger is a fairy tale, but be absolutely nonplussed on hearing that others have consulted him....
Or just be completely oblivious in general to the enemy agent infiltrating the college and capturing quite possibly the most powerful relic in Nirn....
Maybe let the new recruit deal with the city being overrun with magical anomalies the college caused, while simultaneously whining about the negative reputation it's attained....
Or maybe lie about the cause of the great collapse (in game references rather strongly indicate that whatever created the Auger was also the cause of the great collapse.... unless you believe the eruption _two hundred years ago_ was the cause.)...
Perhaps any one of _THOSE_ would indicate the ability to run the college more adequately.
@@iami3rian394 I didn't say the previous guy was any good, but either way that doesn't change the fact that I'm not qualified.
Say what you will, but they have a fantastic teacher to student ratio.
Dude just perfected the entire college in 25 minutes. All he'd have to do now is make it a mod or something and the whole faction would be so much better.
"Not everything is a competition, you know."
- "Ohh, but you are wrong. The only reason you could disagree, is because you're losing so badly, you cannot see it."
To me, J'Zargo is the best aspect of the College, period. x) Somehow amongst the approximately or archetypally written and acted characters there is this gem of perfect balance between sass, pride and charisma.
best character in the college, and one of my fave followers 😍
Yeah. He's a tosser. An arrogant little clown mumbling non-sensical drivel thinking it's profound and highly applicable; and all the intellectual wannabes fall for it. Ha!
Clown planet 🤡
first time I heart it I burst out laughing lmao 🤣🤣
I think what bugs me the most about simple plot holes in ANYTHING is when they can be fixed by five second's worth of dialogue. For example, regarding the three students in the entire school issue, how difficult would it have been to have Mirabelle say something like, "You just missed the big event. We had twenty students graduate a couple of weeks ago," as she walks you around?
Issue solved and it took two lines of dialogue.
Right?! It'd also add some world building continuity. For example every aggressive mage in the world. One could always ponder if they once attended the school
I don't think it makes sense for a secretive, reviled institution to graduate more students than there are members. Its not meant to be a "college" in the modern sense but an association of scholars. You don't "graduate," you join
The College is supposed to be a faction of scholars, not a place that teaches & then graduates students & then send them off.
‚Another student has been incinerated‘ Easiest fix through dialogue ever.
What I think would have been great in this storyline is say they had in game lessons. Depending on what u want to meditate on. U gain 5 points in that skill, and perhaps there was a specific spell they were teaching several students. Much like when u first interacted with Tolfdir u learn basics of that spell. Then u come back possibly another time to learn a more advanced version of said spell, until u know them all. After that u just gain 5 in ur magic class or something. It would make one feel like there's an actual lesson and actual "teaching" going on here, and it would feel like ur actually rising in knowledge about magic. It would also be cool if there were study sessions in various parts of the place. U know like what Maribelle first pitches to u when u first arrive? Like I specific time frame for each teacher to instruct and location of said instruction session. These would have made this college feel more alive. Mod authers have added more NPCs to college, and there's 2 mods that make the college look less bland. Its a step in the right direction. But studies and practices would have been more engaging and more intresting with actual study sessions lol
Hell, I'm still trying to figure out how ice wolves in the area are more dangerous than the two dragons I fought on the way to the college. 🤷🏻♂️
I think the main issue stems from the fact that skyrim assumes that you're a "sword and board Nord" and so the dev's wanted to make sure that you can always complete the whole game no matter what.
The guilds and factions just all seemed very *small* . . . like, you'd think the Dark Brotherhood would be massive, considering how many fucking assassins Astrid keeps sending my way, and that the guard constantly whisper "pssst.... hail Sithis!" once you join
Court Fool
Actually for the dark brotherhood the size of a small group of highly skilled assassin's makes sense given
Ya know
All that bounty they'd gather on their heads
And
You either complete your assassination or die
So
Or if you don't die they now know they're being hunted for murder and you've just risked arrest
It really does make sense only a small number of people make it as would be assassin's plus the only way to become a member is to be contacted directly by the brotherhood
Lucas Galaxy The DB isn't supposed to be "a small group of assassins", but it is in Skyrim. In Oblivion, the DB is larger, with more influence and the black hand scattered across Cyrod. Sanctuaries were once all over Tamriel, but had been hunted down to the last sanctuary in Falkreath (hence why Cicero flees to Skyrim with the night mother). The Brotherhood definitely doesn't have to be tiny.
Court Fool
Personally still it makes sense
I didn't say it had to be smaller but its understandable with a well enough explanation---
The lack of students is a big issue for me as well. But the thing that really irritated me about this storyline was the first time I played through: I was an archer/thief character and had no interest in Magic. I managed to get through the whole storyline without casting any spells stronger than the novice spells or using scrolls and staffs when needed. I was then given the title ArchMage with almost no magic training or proficiency. After that first playthrough, I installed the "Immersive College of Winterhold" mod and that made the college better. And at least you can decline to be ArchMage and pass the title on to Tolfdir.
@@dominickd3807 shield + 1 hand heavy ftw
Immersive college of winterhold mod?? What s that??
@@maryblue6071 the title is pretty self explanatory
I used a Blizzard Scroll, but you can guess the situation I used it in.
I never understood this criticism - you could RP a witch-hunter or non-mage scholar. Even if you don't use magic for combay, you're doing very high level magical research in discovering the Eye and killing all these powerful wizards.
The mages guild just really shows how lazy Bethesda has gotten with their story telling and game design in general.
It's more that the deadline screwed them over. They had plans to include time travel, the great collapse, the psijic order, etc. But the stupid time constraint meant it had to be cut down, same with the Civil War questline, which would've been an actual war worthy of the great characters at the head of both sides.
@@plaidpvcpipe3792 lmao, just look how TES VI is gonna have content removed due to "time constraints" even though they will have had over 10 years of time developing the game
@@Obla1337 it was nothing like that. They literally had to because zenimax were being assholes about releasing it on 11/11/11. They also had but a few years between Oblivion and Skyrim.
@@plaidpvcpipe3792 Poor planning is all that is. They knew the dealine and they didn't plan efficiently enough.
@@plaidpvcpipe3792 they had to hand fnv to obsidian, and obsidian manage to do better in 18 months.
The first "wizard" I played didn't know a single spell.
He talked his way into the college and used staffs for everything else.
It was fun role-playing a character which had no magical talent whatsoever, while somehow also ending up as the Arch mage.
The sad thing is, this wasn't intended by Bathesda, they just didn't put that much thought into the faction and it's associated quests...
I wish all the quest in the guild were like the first quest, when you learned how to use wards and stuff like that.
You mean actual magic lessons at the magic college? Absurd!
But, wards don't protect against swords, how'd I pass the companions test?
no please
Come here let me see if I can get those bindings off
+Tom Eccles haahaha
Tom Eccles If you're bound up then you should take some laxatives.
Why fid the college not tell you about the forge? I didnt find it until last year
Come here let me see if i can get those bindings *O N* ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Mega Gaming omg HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
To join the psijic monks would have been awesome! Maybe once you reach 100 in at least 3 magic disciplines you get a visit from a psijic monk, and get an invite to their "hidden" island...new quests, powerful spells, it could've been a whole new faction story line!
I actually liked the quest for the master level conjuration spells (which also happened to be the only really cool master level spells imo)
Beating a Dremora Lord until he stops being stubborn really is one of the best master quests, especially when random thugs and A dragon shows up during the mission
I almost always have a permanent storm atronach or two ready for when dragons appear. They can hit the dragon in the air while the other types fail.
That said, I will often have a flame out as well due to the Frostfall mod and a patch that makes the flame atronach count as a bonfire. Just too bad that 95% of the time their fireballs will miss a dragon in flight.
Imo, these are two of the most useful spells in the entire game.
Real talk, when I first went to the College of Winterhold I thought it was gonna be like Harry Potter.
Gosh I thought I was the only one 😂😂😂
Same :/. I was so excited especially because my first character was a magic user. Once I heard of the college I wanted to go there immediately. Needless to say I was very disappointed. Only 3 students? That place was way overhyped and unfinished
Me too bro i was severely let down
There’s a mod that makes the college look less boring 👏
@@AstarionWifey what’s the name?
I am of the opinion that all the colleges in Skyrim suck as a pejorative representation of the state of higher education these days
Extremely underrated comment
found the American.
Ah man. This comment came off as pompous and pretentious as hell lol
@@gregorybarker8835 which one
"All the colleges in Skyrim"
"You're now the arch-mage!"
Me, who is decked out in Daedric Armor using nothing but a Greatsword throughout the entire questline, only using magic and staffs when I had to: "Neat"
I feel this, i know its a year old but i just fuck around with heavy armor and a Greatsword only spells i know are armor and healing spells
The sad part is that you can do the entire quest by casting only one spell. I know its for player convenience but they should have added more magic in order to progress. Like exploring ruins, for example. You can either cast the spells yourself to progress or have one of the students tag along who can cast spells for you. That way, there's a little more magic and we could get to know the other students and have them react to it.
*enters college*
*saves college and becomes principal*
*enters white house
saves president and becomes president.*
@@sci_pain3409 That's how mafia works
@@sci_pain3409 more like:
*enters white house
watches president being murdered
murder the murderer
becomes president*
Just beat the devil out of it
I felt like there were too many quests were you're the only one that can save the world from ending. Skyrim was like end of world fatigue.
Totally agree, especially when there's no actual time pressure on you and each of the world ending events just queue up and patiently wait for the previous event to be resolved one by one.
Agreed. You save the world like 3(+?) times. I get it for the main quest, but it feels kind of ridiculous after a while.
@@erodiumminer I think at least 4? Dragon Crisis, Vampires trying to turn everything to permanent night and the Possible return of Miirak and the eye of Magnus.
And every NPC is dumb as shit....
@D. R. Lol 😂😂😂
Winterhold needed a mission to expand on the eye of magnus to use the eye of magnus to reenact shaladors spell that made winterhold and revive the broken hold to it's former glory.
In the meantime, Tolfdir has magically and discreetly moved this giant orb from sarthal to the college of Winterhold. Excellent work! - Michael
A Psijic DLC would’ve been absolutely amazing.
YESSSSSS! Finally someone points out how stripped down the magic options were in Skyrim. As one who favors Conjuration, I felt this hard.
Necromancer magician or summoner?
Still don't get how everyone is a necromancer...mannimarcos staff had a 30 second raise corpse power and was super dangerous and yet the ritual stone raises everyone in 75ft...ridiculous
Call me dumb or Something else, but imo conjuration is one of, if not, the best kinds of magic in skyrim and at least somehow Worth it. Maybe illusion is good for stealth but everything else is pretty disappointing.
@@nuke1863 I feel like conjuration is not that great late game
With the Ordinator mod, conjugation is tons of fun. I stroll in to most situations with an army of skeletons, conjure dremora, and raise the dead to fight for me, all in the same fight. It’s just like showing up and being the ultimate badass. I don’t even lift a finger
The only way the college of winter hold quest line makes sense is if your character is self taught or had formal training elsewhere because it still annoys me that they’re so willing to make you arch mage so quickly
Right up until the reveal in the College of Winterhold questline, I was holding onto the possibility that Savos Aren was the antagonist betraying his fellow mages, and that Ancano was, despite all appearances, genuinely trying to help. I was incredibly disappointed with the reality, but I often role-play this version of events anyway.
How about ancano, a thalmor being in winterhold in the first place considering it's under stormcloak occupation
The College didn't take sides in the war and as long as he wasn't a prick to them he was as welcomed as any one else allowed in the college. Kinda shady but yeah since no one even trusted him anyways.
@@jackmendez1367 he'd still have to pass through Stormcloak territory in order to get to the college, theres no way they'd just let him pass through
Johnny Silverhand he could have traveled through portal possibly
Johnny Silverhand or just threw on a cloak and moved covertly. The storm-cloaks aren’t the brightest.
Early on they fought the empire and nearly won, they signed a treaty the White Gold Condrat I think so they can pretty much go anywhere they please thats why they can capture and kill people without consequence. And the Winterhold College didn't take sides in the war
You could literally know 2 spells and become the arch mage....
You literally only need to ever learn: lesser ward, frostbite and flames. The only other time you might need another spell is getting access to the bridge but even that can be circumvented
Squiffles go watch one of ymfah’s video,he became the arch mage without learning any spells
@@Dante101Virgil Yes I am aware of ymfah, but I meant if you played through it without purposefully trying to avoid magic. You could be the average player just using a sword and shield and simply use those spells as and when required and become arch mage. Ymfah takes it to a whole new level
Snape I mean I finished the thieves guild as a mage with like level 22 lockpick 16 pickpocket and 15 sneak...These are skyrim “problems”that aren’t unique to any one guild. You are given honorary titles that mean nothing, attained in a day or two, regardless of your actual skill distribution..I’m just shocked they didn’t let me become a Jarl for more meaningless power
On one of my first few playthroughs of Skryim, I was playing as a tanky, armoured warhammer weilding Nord. To actually get into the college, I chugged an extra magika potion to cast the thing Faralda wanted me to do. Lesser ward, frost and flames, were the only spells that you actually need to complete the quest. I otherwise got through the entire thing by crushing everything with my daedric warhammer. Made some of the fights especially sad.
Morokei who drains Magicka was pretty funny for this reason. Ancano was also a complete joke. He couldn't hurt me because I had also gone for enchanting all my armour to resist all kinds of magical attacks. So all destruction magic was virtually useless on me. Plus I had my health regeneration boosted constantly due to my armour and lifesteal enchantment on my warhammer.
The whole questline is arguably a lot easier if you aren't a mage, because more often than not, your biggest foes will better counter you if you use magicka.
I still remember gathering mushrooms in morrowind for the very first time in morrowind. Made it feel all the more accomplishing when I finally became Arch-Mage
what never fails to get to me is when you get to the college after collecting the staff, and you're told by tolfdir that mirrabelle literally died to save the rest of the college, she gave her life to make sure that everyone else got out safe....and then you get past the barrier and everyone is still just wandering around in there, hanging out in their rooms, barely even have more than one line each of unique dialogue, and...thats it. she died for literally nothing.
Fancy yourself a mage, eh? I'm more of a warrior myself.
Devansh Kumar i play an mage assasin that focuses on ice magic and necromancy
cool i play an disabled snow elf who is a master in speechcraft
i had you figured for a mage
Devansh Kumar Fancy the bow eh I'm a sword man myself
SiefausOsna you cant play as snow elves
11:47 Are we not gonna address the half naked guy standing in the middle of a blizzard?
failed invisibility spell bro. only worked on his clothes. WHOOPS
LOL, can't breath.
M O D S B R O
Also why is Tolfdir dressed like a roadman?
we won't
if future elder scrolls games ever come back to the region of Skyrim I'd love to see how they flesh out winterhold and rebuild after the great collapse.
I was honestly expecting to learn about the various types of magics and how they could be put into practice to encourage players to choose different strategies as mages. All I learned is Candlelight and how to use a Ward. The rest is from spells I already knew, plus a magical artifact.
“I’m looking for a Jizz.....last name Argo?”
Yes I love seanzoz
Yeah your test came back positive
I've got another three letters here for you
ITS J'ZARGO
ITS JZHARGO
I think that no guild should make you the leader by the end. It always feels weird when the boss man is doing a menial task.
at least with teh companions you see them out there DOING stuff from time to time.
I mean, they could *offer* you to be their leader at the end but you couldn't accept either way and automatically are forced to decline since you are *new* and you are *the fucking dragonborn*. Seriously. A leader should be present at the headquarters and lead the troup. The former archmage was always present in the college. Now you are the archmage and have only few reasons to visit the college once more. I always feel weird when I walk by it and get greeted with the title of arch-mage. Also, the title should have more impact on others. I know guards tell you that you messed up but I got a quest (after already being the archmage) to steal some staff because someone wants to pretend to have good relations to the college. Seriously, he asked the ARCH MAGE of the college for an item so he could pretend having relations to you..? Why not just establish good relations with you after you've become arch mage. Ugh..
Aickavon the Techpriest yeah I ran into them randomly near Riften
I agree, it would make much more sense to become the second-in-command instead. Especially since as the Dragonborn, you're not going to stay in one place for long anyway.
Bethesda really needs to find a dictionary that explains what "Leader" actually means and entails. This is a problem in most of their games including Fallout 4. Heck in Fallout 4 its worse.
First, there's a militia called the Minutemen who have been basically rendered extinct. Only one actual Minuteman, Preston remains when you meet him and rescue him and four villagers from baddies. He asks you to join, you agree, you save a couple villages and he makes you "General of the Minutemen." A largely hollow title at the time and its up to you to make it real by bringing the Mintuemen back from the brink. You singlehandedly go about recruiting more people and settlements to your cause and eventually become a large faction. You even retake the old abandoned old Minuteman HQ back. From there...... things stop making sense.
You're now the General of a fairly large and well-organised militia with dozens of soldiers and at least five villages under your command. Preston is your second in command and there's a woman named Ronnie who could feasibly be named your third in command. From that point on you probably shouldn't be doing front line grunt work. You're the General. You should be in your HQ giving the orders and working out tactics. You shouldn't be going to various settlements and villages doing petty grunt work for them and building their settlements for them.
Worse of course is the Nuka World DLC. So you hear a radio signal inviting everyone to Nukaworld, a theme park a bit like disneyland except dedicated to nuka cola the equivalent of coca cola. You get aboard a monorail taking you there thinking you're going to be rescuing a family from raiders/bandits. Only you find out its actually a trap, there are three large and powerful raider gangs inhabiting Nukaworld who promptly force you through a long, difficult, dangerous gauntlet before you have to fight their leader, Colter, the Overboss.
One of the Raiders sabotages Colter so you win, and tells you that the Overboss is the raider that keeps peace and order between the three rival, squabbling gangs in the park. Colter was doing a bad job so they arranged to have him killed and whomever survived the gauntlet and killed him would be the new Overboss. You. Only the thing is as Overboss you're the one that has to travel between the different section parks of Nukaworld clearing out critters, robots, baddies of all sorts and deciding which of the three gangs gets each park.
That's..... really not how being a boss/leader works.
Just watching for a random thing to watch. Man that music makes me happy. Reminds me when things were good in life
The student thing always bothered me, especially that if you consider the 4 students that died in the midden, plus the 4 from the scrapped lost apprentice quest that got revived; you see twice as many dead students as live students!
Don't forget Orthorn (who is alive... unless you choose otherwise)
Plus "don't tell me another apprentice was incinerated again"... implying it has happened at least once.
There are plenty of students. They just have such a poor survival rate I'm surprised a few living ones don't 'disappear' after an experiment off campus.
My first character was kindof a "Fuck all I want to do whatever I want" because I wanted to see all the main factions and such.
Got through the whole College of Winterhold quest line with like all novice spells of which I barely used.
Someone with barely any magical prowess becomes archmage because reasons I guess.
Purifyerino Kripperino Me too
That should be something that happens after you get all of the Master spells.
Having started my Bethesda library with The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind and Daggerfall, I've long been aware of the steps backward Bethesda Game Studios has taken with their flagship RPG series.
Removal of etiquette from dialogue, homogenizing skills, removing context specific actions like bashing down doors, removing skill requirements for guild advancement, removing spellcrafting, toning down race specific disposition and attitudes, removing the ability to play a class build or start blank, and on and on and on.
It seems like the number 4 is a cursed one in the games industry, for Bethesda especially. First there was The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion, and now Fallout 4 has fallen flat on its face.
Magic is nearly worthless in Skyrim imo. It needs to be about 5X as strong minimum for me to bother. Enchanting is the only worthwhile 'magic' related option.
Purifyerino Kripperino only spells I use Are Summon Arvak Arniel’s Shade and Fast Healing that’s it