Thanks for the update as I was highly suspecting that it wouldn't hold up long in outdoor setting being a resin type product. I've found an organic outdoor furniture oil easier and still matt finish and I just have to rub some more on 6monthly or yearly (which takes 5mins) and if it needs cleaning first a acid deck cleaner works well. I can't help but wonder if a bees wax oil mix may also be as easy and durable in the weather with 6monthly reapplication?.. One day I'll try it.
The Wood Whisperer- Couple quick questions... I am looking to finish a bottle cap table for exterior use. I wanted to do an epoxy clear fill on the top, there is a lip for it. Or should I polyurethane multiple times to ensure a longer stay with UV and harsh weather exposure? Can I do a layer of epoxy (1/16-1/8 inch) and then polyurethane on top to help the cure? I would love recommendations if you have any. Thank you
I subscribed for the sole reason that you provided an update to say you were unsatisfied with the results. 95% of youtube posters claim to be experts by showing how to do something and then never providing an update months or years later. You're the man!
I've had the chance to use this table a couple of times now. It's fun to whip out in front of people:) I can see what people are talking about when they say the legs are delicate, but they're design to support a "mostly" vertical load, not be torqued from the side or pushed back into place. If you just let the table open or close on it's own and don't force anything, it works great ua-cam.com/users/postUgkxyFZUPFEey-PuqsPMxqaykBhgA1LWxFHh Once it's set up, it's pretty solid. My only gripe would probably be related to the clamps provided. They're not the highest quality. They do the job, so no big deal, but they could be better. All in all, pretty cool gadget.
Reducing epoxy always extends the cure. You can offset this by adding additional hardener. When you reduce you are adding additional base components which is why the reaction is significantly slowed. For instance, polyester resins harden because of a molecular chain reaction. You need enough resin and hardener to complete the reaction for a period of time. When reducing polyester additional hardener is needed to offset the additional volume of ketones added to thin.. Or even filler to thicken. Epoxy works differently as the hardener reacts with with acetone and two phenol molecules. By adding additional acetone to epoxy you actually added base to the mix. Epoxy works on cross linked hydrogen atoms. The additional acetone present prevents the cross link until evaporation or it is absorbed. Next time add more hardener... Play with a small amount of the specific resin to learn how it cuts with acetone. Hope this helps in the future. Thanks for your videos.
if that a been me...when I sloshed that epoxy all over the top and tried to sand that rock hard mess it would made a me fall off the wagon and enter a booze infused weekend of poorly lit bars and gray haired barflys speckled with skintags all mishmashed into loud music and vague attempts at dancing ending in a cheap motel sunday morning with an aching head with no recollections of how the sheets wound up ont on the floor..your a better man then me..I'm glad you held it all together
Mark is a very talented guy and seems to be a great father too. I've been following the channel for years now with an encore two years ago cause I got sort of annoyed cause back then I was trying to learn woodworking and it felt too comercial. I mean, it felt like everything was sponsored and to be honest most of the stuff he uses is out of reality for most of the people. I also moved from a house to one apartment which limited my access to tools but then I started watching the videos again not as instructional videos but just for fun. For the entertainment and God, it's so much better. I can sit and watch and just apreciate it.
I was only looking for a video about outdoor finish that I can use on a wooden bench I plan to make for my balcony. Instead, I get this super informative and very pleasant video about applying a finish that will make any outdoor project last for centuries! That's just freakin awesome!
Thank you SO much for posting this and your 2019 update. I feel your pain. That's a lot of work, money and effort to go through for it to not wait at least 5 years before falling apart!!
What I like best about this, the child was inserted and you let him help. I see tons of parents tell their kids no, it's too hard or your too young, so the kids lose interest. Who knows, your son may end up growing up to be a contractor because he was inspired as a kid to learn how to handle wood. Good for you.
I used these exact same products you used on my Mahogany and stained Glass front door and side panels. Total cost 500 dollars for the materials and it took me a whole year. Shamefully a year and a half. The builder who originally did a real half ass job. The door came out amazing. Sanded the door. Stained the door. Used the epoxy as you did and the varnish. This was eight coats on each side plus the two side panels. What a job. Fortunately the builder left the original door so I used it to replace mine during this "God awful knight mere." Only kidding. Great video. I know exactly what you went through.
Doing exactly as you show on BIG oak tree cookies (45 to 50 inch diameter) my coworker had taken down. I am making tables using this finishing technique that is leaving me speechless. Its one thing seeing it on video/photo BUT to stand in presence of this finish once done with high gloss, which Im a fan of, is a whole different ballgame ! My neighbors are totally amazed and just like you outdoors is the only place I can work on these giants. .
Nice on man..I do a lot outdoor dining sets. Here we have quit the climate and for me the best way to protect wood is 2 part polyurethane with poly primer 2-3 coats and last polyurethane finish with 30% hardner. I apply it always with air gun. Nice video keep up the good work good luck
Slovenian Woodworker: Please provide brand/supplier info in these products. I have a chair design I want to execute, but want an outdoor finish my customers can trust.
Let me share with you what I learned back in the mid 70's as far as finishes that withstand weather and in particular the dreaded ultra violet rays that cause finishes to break down and also wood to discolor and break down. This started with a job that I got from a man who started his own company on the side from his regular job working at the Chrysler Auto trim plant. For the finish on the speaker cabinets he contracted me to build he specified Tung Oil to be used as the finish. He also gave me a education about Tung Oil, it being a natural product from the nut from the Tung tree that is native to China. Tung Oil is sold under many different kinds of finish and you have to read the can to find the right finish. Seems that most of the finish companies mix Tung Oil with other types of finish then market it as Tung Oil, which it is not anymore. This was critical to my client as he wanted a durable finish that would last for years without the common problem of being exposed to ultraviolet rays and temperature changes. Because of his regular job at the Chrysler auto trim plant he used all the finishes applied to wood and exposed them to weather in the climate chamber they used there to test interior and exterior trim materials to determine what holds up to different weather conditions from all over the surface of the Earth. He brought in a wide variety of samples he had tested and only Tung Oil was unaffected by all conditions in the climate chamber. The key here is to make sure you are using "pure" Tung Oil and not a mixture of several other finishing materials mixed in with Tung Oil. Tung Oil is very easy to apply and will build up to a very nice finish and really will hold up to weather conditions. I have used it on entry doors in Las Vegas where I live with a southwest exposure to direct sun with no deterioration to the finish, that is saying something for wood with brutal sunlight on the outside and cool air conditioned air on the interior side. It made a believer out of me and it is my go to finish for any exterior project.
James, typically how many coats do you find yourself putting on your exterior projects, and do you thin the first few coats with mineral spirits to improve absorption?
cajunfid I apply 3 to 4 coats of Tung oil full strength, wiping it on with a lint free cloth. light sanding between coats. this in my opinion is one of the easiest finishes to apply.
@James Stanlake - I finished a new cedar mailbox last year with Formby's tung oil (which is a mix), and over a matter of a few months it started to discolor from black mold. I sprayed it with an an antifungal solution and the mold rinsed away. After some googling, I read other reports of tung oil being a favorite of black mold. My plan is to sand and refinish with Minwax® Helmsman® Spar Urethane, designed for outdoor use.
A couple of comments from someone who has maintained natural wood surfaces on boats: 1) even with the sealing, filling and 5-7 coats of spar varnish, if the table stays outside, it should be cleaned, sanded and recoated every one to three years with the Epiphaned, depending on conditions, if not, you will find it gradually descending to an unacceptable place again, but now with cracks partially filled with epoxy. 2) when applying a crack-filling coat of epoxy, you can save substantial material and substantial sanding time by applying with a flexible squeegee and a little pressure, the more leveling you want to do, the stiffer the squeegee.
I loved your commentary. It was entertaining and I chuckled a few times. I watched the entire video out of pure curiosity. Good job on the table. It's quite beautiful!
Thanks for the instructional. I’m completing a breadboard oak table for outdoors and my thoughts were to do the exact same finish. You took it a level up. Thanks for showing how it’s done
I was going to say, "oh hell no," then came to the comments and see you beat me to it. I played with epoxy and poly finishes inside and out starting over forty years ago. From that I learned, as you point out, everything needs maintenance. The easier that maintenance, the better. The other thing I learned is, deep penetration trumps surface coats every day. In fact, ideally, we'd replace lost moisture with oil, which would swell the wood. The only way to do that with a hardening oil would be, keeping the surface wet for a long time, so the air didn't start hardening the oil. Then there is the non-hardening oil approach, but which brings the fun of applying finishes.
Thank you much! Finally there is something what makes me feel better. Even if Master of Finishing (you) ran into tons of work with outdoors furniture it makes all my own labor less difficult. Once again, thank you for sharing your experience and knowledge.
I vacillate between sealing up outdoor wood with a varnish and using an oil type finish . Over the years i have used more and more oil type finishes that break down in the elements into a thin powdery substance . These type of finishes are incredibly easy to recoat as they only need to be brushed off and re applied with a huge bristle brush that require zero skill. Using a varnish with a lot of solids can involve a lot of preparation . Both are excellent and it just comes down to personal preference .
Wow what a great finish. I bought and used the wrong stuff on mine. Was more of a waxy liquid. Now after two years it's all flaking off and he rain is warping the planks. Gonna be a pain in the proverbial to remove, refinish the wood and then apply the proper stuff. Love the matte look! I'll have to see how much the stuff he used will cost me. Table is 2m x 1.2m then there are 2 two seater benches and 2 single chairs all with backs and arm rests.
restoring antique chris crafts its nice to see a guy like you use epifane and cpes-or something like it. I have found cpes is the secret to many perfect finishes and glued joints. Bravo
Lot of work! What would you recommend for an outdoor cedar table in Denver? I was thinking linseed, diluted with some mineral spirits and add some melted wax. I don't want varnishes or epoxy or things that will peel off. Thanks so much.
If you are going to go through the trouble/hassle of using epoxy as a base/sealer, I recommend MAS epoxies. They are specifically formulated for amatuer boat builders and the results are professional. They have three different cure durations from very fast kicking to very slow. For a base/sealer, I'd go with a very fast setting batch. Thin with 10-15% acetone or de-natured alcohol (preferred, because you clean up with it). A 15% dilution will flow on like very warm honey and soak in well. Your wood is now water proof - not just resistant. Cover coat with something that is UV resistant. UV is death to epoxy. Maintain the finish coat by light sanding before recoat. Do not sand away the epoxy, or you'll have to spot treat. For a really tough surface, wait til the sealer coat is cured, then apply a heavy coat of epoxy mixed for glass work. Roll on your #6oz fiberglass cloth ansd squeegie it down flat, pulling the wribnkles out as you go. Apply another heavy coat of epoxy and squeegie that off by movingiot around teh table til the fiberglass become invisible. Wait to cure, then sand to a powdery surface and wipe with denatured alcohol. Coat with UV resistant varnish . You now have an indestructible, transparent surface that is easy to mainatin and you don't have to worry about water intrusion - ever.
That high altitude sun is no joke. I lived outside of Denver for a number of years, quite a bit higher in elevation, and everything left outside weathered way way faster than expected. For outdoor tables and benches we just used a deck sealer every year in the spring. Every single year in the spring everything made of wood , outside, that we cared about would get a good coat of water based wood sealer. These things would grey and check but would not warp or rot at all. you have to have different expectations for outdoor wood furniture
Same finish as the cedar strip canoe I made. I thought after the fiber glass and epoxy I was done. NOPE It still needed a few coats of this same varnish. Cut it a little too close to vacation time and had to put the varnish on after we used it for 10 days. Seems to be none the worse???? I also made this table and bench set after watching your video last year and its actually our indoor dining set in the winter. Thanks Marc and Nicole
great video! new woodworkers need to know that a good finish sometimes takes longer than the build, but is just as important. nice to see how products I haven't used work in real life.
Ahh, loved that table when you built it and still love it now. Great stuff. Steve Ramsey always talks about how the most durable finish is paint, and there's a lot of sense to that, but boy, sometimes it just breaks my heart to paint wood furniture.
Dave Starr oh good ol paint...gotta love it! Being in the field I am (decorative painter..aka faux finisher) id love to know if this is really true. I know a lot about paint chemistry n solids ratio, but very little about epoxy makeup and finial hardness since I’ve only been woodworking for a year. Honestly, I’d imagine epoxy would beat paint every time for solids & film coverage abilities. Maybe someday I’ll meet someone who knows as much about it as I do paint & we can answer that question together 🤓
I found that it was helpful to lightly scuff up the varnish undercoats before using the epiphanes...It is possible for bubbling up to occur if this is not done...This was also advised by the folks at the Epiphanes site...A really lovely way to do an outdoor finish...People really like it on the outdoor chairs I have put together...Not sure how long it will last?
I tried this on the rail of my Hans Christian 38T sailboat, using West epoxy as the sealer. I had the same experience, with the varnish finish cracking after about a year in the marina. I'm guessing that the bond between the varnish and the epoxy is not enough to hold during expansion and contraction in the weather.
I have three cedar gates, with some pine framing, and a cedar plank facing on my facia. I have used Penofin once a year for the past eight years and the wood looks like I just built and/or installed them.
I don’t understand I’m very confused how can you put a clear coat of epoxy on the top give it a sanding and then apply varnish doesn’t the epoxy create a lawyer so that nothing could get soaked back into the wood
For the small outside stuff (armrests, small stools etc) I use Danish oil. I do have to add a light coat once or twice a year, but it's just a light sanding and wiping it on. I can do all the furniture in well under an hour and it dries within a day, so I just leave them all in place and do it on a day we don't use them.
Zack Maynard epoxy itself is amazing. It doesn’t need to take this long. Epoxy will hold up for years and years. In some cases 20 yrs or more. It’s really easy to apply on wood too.
@@rakashaagain Sometimes it is like that with outdoor finishes. This is why I personally don't like plastic film finishes they will flake over time and you'll need to strip and refinish everything. I use BLO mixed with orange and turpentine oil applying coats until the wood doesn't take it in anymore. Then I repeat wit one/two coats a year. I'm well aware my wood will become darker and gray with this finish and I have to reapply it at least once a year to keep in good shape but I like that look and I know wood lasts longer with oils applied outside in the harsh weather. Now pigmented paint (white) will protect and last longest but you kill the beauty of the wood. Cheers.
I agree MARC, The added contrast from the cured epoxy in the natural cracks looks amazing. Many people would have little idea that epoxy was utilized to fill the cracks. Ya may have begun a Cracked Craze, lol. Well done Marc.
You did it right, just the way we finish exterior wood on boats. It's a lot of work and it takes discipline to apply enough coats, but the beauty is worth it in the end. One suggestion... all finishes wear out in the sun... boats have to be stripped of all that sealer material and resealed every couple of years, because the boat sits in the sun all the time. Keep your table in the shade, and cover it when not in use... that will add significant years to the life of your finish.
Another awesome and helpful video by a great woodworker. Thank you Marc for everything. Now that several years have past since you made this video, do you still believe that this is the best finish to protect wood from the elements?
Hi, I have a boat with white oak and mahogany rub rails. I am taking off the old varnish via heat gun and scraper. I have varnished many times in the past with Pettit Captains Varnish and though beautiful, the flaking in the future drives me nuts. I have used a product called Semco on teak which is a nice sealer but am wondering what else is out there. I know I definitely want to go the sealer route and just re-coat 1-3x a year to keep the wood looking good. The boat is on saltwater. Can you recommend a sealer for marine use? Also the mahogany and white oak have gone grey, can I use oxalic acid to restore to original color without damaging the surrounding paint? Thanks!
Great video, Marc. It's especially timely with the coming of spring. I'm using this finishing schedule right now on some chairs for my deck. Thanks mate!
I JUST finished (i.e. 5 minutes ago) my own western red cedar outdoor table. I also reclaimed the wood. Mine doesn't receive much if any sun - how well would a deck sealer like Thompsons water sealer do? I have a set of teek furniture next to it that I renew with teek oil At least twice a year so I'm not adverse to maintenance
I've done the same.. but used West System's epoxy instead of varying it. I agree on the Foam brush.. but use a foam roller to apply the expoxy/varnish and then tip with a foam brush... this eliminates the bubbles and provides a clear finish. Another thing is GLOSS will has much longer than a matte finish. You might also apply a wax like a car wax to the finished product with a micro fiber cloth every 3 months.. because it's dirt that causes issues with water attached to it.
This is definitely one of the best projects I`ve seen for about last 2 years! Matte finish looks so great that I want to finish every wooden thing matte from now :D
I have a reclaimed redwood table that I want to re-finish, but I actually love the rustic look of the big nail holes and cracks in it - I want them to be able to show through. Do I still need to do the first round of West Systems epoxy fill, or can I simply do the second Total Boat layer?
Boatwork recipes for brightwork: All raw wood thats been presanded & clean gets liberally brushed or slathered with boiling hot linseed oil (preboiled) 80% to 20% turpentine. Caution remove oil far from flame as turpentine is extremely flammable. The heat & thinner drive oil deep into wood. Once sufficiently dry ( tacky to touch which will take time) you can begin applying successive coats of following: McCloskys spar varnish - way less expensive than marine varnish just as good. 85 - 95%, Boiled linseed oil 5-15% the higher the% the slower it will dry (days) but the softer & more flexible the recipe which wont bubble peel or flake because it expands & contracts with the wood. Turpentine 20%. Total 2 - up to 6 coats for really high end work with a 220 grit light sanding & tac clothing & airhose between to give ea layer teeth to receive next coat. The idea of using epoxy in a varnish recipe is contrary. Yes to epoxy for filling gaps but you want a soft pliable finish on the woods surface because it will, no matter what expand & contract. Non believers try this on a pc of scrap & throw it up on the roof for a season & forget about it. Check it next spring & see for yourself. Youre very welcome.
Would love an update as we are about to embark on refinishing 5 large picnic tables from a two year old Eagle project. We bought the larger size of the West Marine Epoxy but wanted to get some advice first. 1. How has this held up since it was done? We have variable climate - hot, humid summers and often wet, below freezing for a month winters. 2. We used a sealer/stain combo for the original build; figure we’ll have to do a lot of sanding 3. What finish do you recommend if we cannot commit the time (or space) to do all 5 tables in the manner you did (though we love the look)? I’m afraid of using any poly for fear of cracking and failing/yellowing. Intrigued about using Tung Oil and redoing that on the spot each year.
Thats just how it is with outdoor furniture/boats. No matter what, you will (or pay someone) to refinish your prize. Just life. My old man used to redo our picnic table back in the 70's like evcery two or three years. He enjoyed using Shellac. Looked great, but every two or three years, it was a redo
Can you give a list of supplies you used on this project. I bought West SYSTEM 105 epoxy resin but it is clear and the one you used is a dark color. Would help if you could give a list of exactly what products you used thanks
I am wanting to build a grape trellis using cedar post and wanted to use a outdoor varnish/sealer to make it look good and last. Which one of the following would you use CPES, Epifanes, or total boat epoxy. They are just post like a fence post but wanted them to look nice. If there is another product please let me know what you would use and how to apply.
Beautiful job. I am a beginner and am currently making a deck box with redwood. What do you suggest i apply for protection? Varnish, Linseed oil? Not sure on what to use as the box will be outside in the elements? Thanks.
What about adding a layer of fiberglass to that epoxy? I have a covered front porch that doesn't see a lot of weather but high traffic, teak T&G on plywood subfloor.
Thanks for this video!! I didn't know very much about how wood interacted with different types of protective coatings. It was a huge help, to realize the process a lot better with the way you explained things. Hope you got to enjoy that table on the 4th of July weekend, with your family and friends!
Hi, thanks for your video. I’m trying to re purpose a shelving system to use out doors in my backyard. Besides paint, I’m using vinyl wallpaper, for the sides and back of the shelving system. The wood is some sort particle board. What should I use to seal it, and protect it from the Florida sun and rain? Will sealers adhere to the vinyl? Should I use a water based polyurethane first over the paint to seal the wood, and then apply the vinyl wallpaper? Will the wallpaper stick to the sealer? I also would rather have a matte finish, but don’t even know if any of this is possible. This is my first project.....so I am a bit lost. Any help would be appreciated.
Good job Marc, have the same problem with an outdoor table and was thinking about the same approach you took with epoxy and coating, but taking the lessons learned into account. Would be useful to see a quick follow up a few years later on the table. Would that be possible? Many thanks and best from Europe.
Love the look and quality of the finish. I'd like to build a table like that for my backyard. Can you tell me how many cans of Epifanes you went through on a table that size? I'd like to make sure i have enough on hand without going overboard. Thanks.
Great video, thank you. I'm making small table out or wormy chestnut - interior only. Can suggest a good coating option that's clear but at the same time offers some protection?
Just got a very small table that I want to use outside. Looking for your suggestions of less expensive products that would do roughly the same job. Understood that the affect/durability will not be the same. Thank you
How many cans of 1000mL of Epifanes did you use? I've got a cedar porch rail and columns that I'm going to apply the Epifanes to and just trying to gauge how much to buy.
thanks for the video, i am following a pretty similar approach for a glue lam exterior beam. you wern't kidding about it taking time.. seems like you need to wait a few days or more sometimes for the epifanes product to harden enough to sand it efficiently, otherwise it just gums up and makes a mess. how'd the finish end up holding up?
What is oil but decayed trees and vegetation. Some people say oil from your oil changes are good for fences, wagon wood,etc. That preserves outdoor wood. Not for a table to eat at but for other wood that is exposed to elements perhaps.
I just purchased acacia outdoor wood patio set and in one week I’m seeing evidence of weather and sun damage. Please tell me what i should use to protect it now that it’s new?
It is never a recommendation to dilute an exterior varnish. It will always weaken the finish. If you notice how well he applies the vanish, it's not a good place to get lessons. Starting with exterior epoxy and then applying vanish should give you a clue. Anyone who puts on a lot of varnish would put it on so heavy that it would need to be that thick.
What are your experiences with Spar Urethane? I'm considering making some outdoor oversized 9x9 Go Boards (about 3' by 3') for kids, and I'm trying to decide what finish I should use on something like this. I'm going to use a yellow solid wood-stain, so I think I will make these out of 3/4" birch plywood.
This finish didn't hold up as expected, due to a number of factors. So before you try it, be sure to read the update in the description above.
Do you think that a high gloss coat would have held up better??
Thank you for posting the update!
Thanks for the update as I was highly suspecting that it wouldn't hold up long in outdoor setting being a resin type product. I've found an organic outdoor furniture oil easier and still matt finish and I just have to rub some more on 6monthly or yearly (which takes 5mins) and if it needs cleaning first a acid deck cleaner works well. I can't help but wonder if a bees wax oil mix may also be as easy and durable in the weather with 6monthly reapplication?.. One day I'll try it.
The Wood Whisperer- Couple quick questions... I am looking to finish a bottle cap table for exterior use. I wanted to do an epoxy clear fill on the top, there is a lip for it. Or should I polyurethane multiple times to ensure a longer stay with UV and harsh weather exposure? Can I do a layer of epoxy (1/16-1/8 inch) and then polyurethane on top to help the cure? I would love recommendations if you have any. Thank you
Thanks for giving the update!!
I subscribed for the sole reason that you provided an update to say you were unsatisfied with the results. 95% of youtube posters claim to be experts by showing how to do something and then never providing an update months or years later. You're the man!
I second this. Many thanks for the followup.
I've had the chance to use this table a couple of times now. It's fun to whip out in front of people:) I can see what people are talking about when they say the legs are delicate, but they're design to support a "mostly" vertical load, not be torqued from the side or pushed back into place. If you just let the table open or close on it's own and don't force anything, it works great ua-cam.com/users/postUgkxyFZUPFEey-PuqsPMxqaykBhgA1LWxFHh Once it's set up, it's pretty solid. My only gripe would probably be related to the clamps provided. They're not the highest quality. They do the job, so no big deal, but they could be better. All in all, pretty cool gadget.
Reducing epoxy always extends the cure. You can offset this by adding additional hardener. When you reduce you are adding additional base components which is why the reaction is significantly slowed. For instance, polyester resins harden because of a molecular chain reaction. You need enough resin and hardener to complete the reaction for a period of time. When reducing polyester additional hardener is needed to offset the additional volume of ketones added to thin.. Or even filler to thicken. Epoxy works differently as the hardener reacts with with acetone and two phenol molecules. By adding additional acetone to epoxy you actually added base to the mix. Epoxy works on cross linked hydrogen atoms. The additional acetone present prevents the cross link until evaporation or it is absorbed. Next time add more hardener... Play with a small amount of the specific resin to learn how it cuts with acetone. Hope this helps in the future. Thanks for your videos.
Additionally, thinning with either acetone or lacquer thinner usually will reduce the hardness of the cured epoxy.
if that a been me...when I sloshed that epoxy all over the top and tried to sand that rock hard mess it would made a me fall off the wagon and enter a booze infused weekend of poorly lit bars and gray haired barflys speckled with skintags all mishmashed into loud music and vague attempts at dancing ending in a cheap motel sunday morning with an aching head with no recollections of how the sheets wound up ont on the floor..your a better man then me..I'm glad you held it all together
LMAO !!!
Sounds like a fun weekend to me.
This might be an old comment, but it's hilarious (and that's coming from a woman).
Mark is a very talented guy and seems to be a great father too. I've been following the channel for years now with an encore two years ago cause I got sort of annoyed cause back then I was trying to learn woodworking and it felt too comercial. I mean, it felt like everything was sponsored and to be honest most of the stuff he uses is out of reality for most of the people. I also moved from a house to one apartment which limited my access to tools but then I started watching the videos again not as instructional videos but just for fun. For the entertainment and God, it's so much better. I can sit and watch and just apreciate it.
I was only looking for a video about outdoor finish that I can use on a wooden bench I plan to make for my balcony. Instead, I get this super informative and very pleasant video about applying a finish that will make any outdoor project last for centuries! That's just freakin awesome!
Thank you SO much for posting this and your 2019 update. I feel your pain. That's a lot of work, money and effort to go through for it to not wait at least 5 years before falling apart!!
What I like best about this, the child was inserted and you let him help. I see tons of parents tell their kids no, it's too hard or your too young, so the kids lose interest. Who knows, your son may end up growing up to be a contractor because he was inspired as a kid to learn how to handle wood. Good for you.
I used these exact same products you used on my Mahogany and stained Glass front door and side panels. Total cost 500 dollars for the materials and it took me a whole year. Shamefully a year and a half. The builder who originally did a real half ass job. The door came out amazing. Sanded the door. Stained the door. Used the epoxy as you did and the varnish. This was eight coats on each side plus the two side panels. What a job. Fortunately the builder left the original door so I used it to replace mine during this "God awful knight mere." Only kidding. Great video. I know exactly what you went through.
Doing exactly as you show on BIG oak tree cookies (45 to 50 inch diameter) my coworker had taken down. I am making tables using this finishing technique that is leaving me speechless. Its one thing seeing it on video/photo BUT to stand in presence of this finish once done with high gloss, which Im a fan of, is a whole different ballgame ! My neighbors are totally amazed and just like you outdoors is the only place I can work on these giants. .
I think it turned out looking 10 times more beautiful than it already was. Awesome video
Nice on man..I do a lot outdoor dining sets.
Here we have quit the climate and for me the best way to protect wood is 2 part polyurethane with poly primer 2-3 coats and last polyurethane finish with 30% hardner.
I apply it always with air gun.
Nice video keep up the good work
good luck
Slovenian Woodworker: Please provide brand/supplier info in these products. I have a chair design I want to execute, but want an outdoor finish my customers can trust.
Let me share with you what I learned back in the mid 70's as far as finishes that withstand weather and in particular the dreaded ultra violet rays that cause finishes to break down and also wood to discolor and break down.
This started with a job that I got from a man who started his own company on the side from his regular job working at the Chrysler Auto trim plant. For the finish on the speaker cabinets he contracted me to build he specified Tung Oil to be used as the finish. He also gave me a education about Tung Oil, it being a natural product from the nut from the Tung tree that is native to China. Tung Oil is sold under many different kinds of finish and you have to read the can to find the right finish. Seems that most of the finish companies mix Tung Oil with other types of finish then market it as Tung Oil, which it is not anymore.
This was critical to my client as he wanted a durable finish that would last for years without the common problem of being exposed to ultraviolet rays and temperature changes. Because of his regular job at the Chrysler auto trim plant he used all the finishes applied to wood and exposed them to weather in the climate chamber they used there to test interior and exterior trim materials to determine what holds up to different weather conditions from all over the surface of the Earth. He brought in a wide variety of samples he had tested and only Tung Oil was unaffected by all conditions in the climate chamber. The key here is to make sure you are using "pure" Tung Oil and not a mixture of several other finishing materials mixed in with Tung Oil.
Tung Oil is very easy to apply and will build up to a very nice finish and really will hold up to weather conditions. I have used it on entry doors in Las Vegas where I live with a southwest exposure to direct sun with no deterioration to the finish, that is saying something for wood with brutal sunlight on the outside and cool air conditioned air on the interior side.
It made a believer out of me and it is my go to finish for any exterior project.
James, typically how many coats do you find yourself putting on your exterior projects, and do you thin the first few coats with mineral spirits to improve absorption?
cajunfid I apply 3 to 4 coats of Tung oil full strength, wiping it on with a lint free cloth. light sanding between coats. this in my opinion is one of the easiest finishes to apply.
Everything I learned in the 70s was............... never mind I can't remember the 70s
FDA approved it as a food safe surface. Should be ok, just make sure it's pure tung oil not some mixture marketed as tung oil.
@James Stanlake - I finished a new cedar mailbox last year with Formby's tung oil (which is a mix), and over a matter of a few months it started to discolor from black mold. I sprayed it with an an antifungal solution and the mold rinsed away. After some googling, I read other reports of tung oil being a favorite of black mold. My plan is to sand and refinish with Minwax® Helmsman® Spar Urethane, designed for outdoor use.
That's, by far, the most beautiful outdoor table I've ever seen! Love it!
A couple of comments from someone who has maintained natural wood surfaces on boats: 1) even with the sealing, filling and 5-7 coats of spar varnish, if the table stays outside, it should be cleaned, sanded and recoated every one to three years with the Epiphaned, depending on conditions, if not, you will find it gradually descending to an unacceptable place again, but now with cracks partially filled with epoxy. 2) when applying a crack-filling coat of epoxy, you can save substantial material and substantial sanding time by applying with a flexible squeegee and a little pressure, the more leveling you want to do, the stiffer the squeegee.
I loved your commentary. It was entertaining and I chuckled a few times. I watched the entire video out of pure curiosity. Good job on the table. It's quite beautiful!
Can we get an update please? I'd love to see how it held up after a year.
I like the way you taped all around the end-grain, and let the wood absorb all it could.
Thanks for the instructional. I’m completing a breadboard oak table for outdoors and my thoughts were to do the exact same finish. You took it a level up. Thanks for showing how it’s done
That table turned out amazing. I mostly do home repairs but I'm getting into more wood working.
Ughhhhhhhhhh just watching this I was dreading replicating but the results speak for themselves. Very good and informative video. Table looks amazing
Superb efforts salvaging the beautiful rustic outdoor furniture
I was going to say, "oh hell no," then came to the comments and see you beat me to it.
I played with epoxy and poly finishes inside and out starting over forty years ago. From that I learned, as you point out, everything needs maintenance. The easier that maintenance, the better.
The other thing I learned is, deep penetration trumps surface coats every day. In fact, ideally, we'd replace lost moisture with oil, which would swell the wood. The only way to do that with a hardening oil would be, keeping the surface wet for a long time, so the air didn't start hardening the oil. Then there is the non-hardening oil approach, but which brings the fun of applying finishes.
Thank you much! Finally there is something what makes me feel better. Even if Master of Finishing (you) ran into tons of work with outdoors furniture it makes all my own labor less difficult. Once again, thank you for sharing your experience and knowledge.
I vacillate between sealing up outdoor wood with a varnish and using an oil type finish .
Over the years i have used more and more oil type finishes that break down in the elements into a thin powdery substance .
These type of finishes are incredibly easy to recoat as they only need to be brushed off and re applied with a huge bristle brush that require zero skill.
Using a varnish with a lot of solids can involve a lot of preparation .
Both are excellent and it just comes down to personal preference .
Wow what a great finish.
I bought and used the wrong stuff on mine. Was more of a waxy liquid. Now after two years it's all flaking off and he rain is warping the planks.
Gonna be a pain in the proverbial to remove, refinish the wood and then apply the proper stuff.
Love the matte look!
I'll have to see how much the stuff he used will cost me.
Table is 2m x 1.2m then there are 2 two seater benches and 2 single chairs all with backs and arm rests.
Holy smokes! That's a lot of work. No denying it looks nice though. I really like that matte look for outdoors.
After all that work I would have to move it into the dining room out of the weather.
restoring antique chris crafts its nice to see a guy like you use epifane and cpes-or something like it. I have found cpes is the secret to many perfect finishes and glued joints. Bravo
Marc, Friday streams are all good but I have to tell you that it's videos like this that motivate me to go build something! Thanks for the upload.
Glad you liked it! Thanks JD.
I'm so blown away with the finished work. SUPER NICE!
LOOKS GREAT, The weathering gave it really good character
Lot of work! What would you recommend for an outdoor cedar table in Denver? I was thinking linseed, diluted with some mineral spirits and add some melted wax. I don't want varnishes or epoxy or things that will peel off. Thanks so much.
If you are going to go through the trouble/hassle of using epoxy as a base/sealer, I recommend MAS epoxies. They are specifically formulated for amatuer boat builders and the results are professional. They have three different cure durations from very fast kicking to very slow. For a base/sealer, I'd go with a very fast setting batch. Thin with 10-15% acetone or de-natured alcohol (preferred, because you clean up with it). A 15% dilution will flow on like very warm honey and soak in well. Your wood is now water proof - not just resistant. Cover coat with something that is UV resistant. UV is death to epoxy. Maintain the finish coat by light sanding before recoat. Do not sand away the epoxy, or you'll have to spot treat.
For a really tough surface, wait til the sealer coat is cured, then apply a heavy coat of epoxy mixed for glass work. Roll on your #6oz fiberglass cloth ansd squeegie it down flat, pulling the wribnkles out as you go. Apply another heavy coat of epoxy and squeegie that off by movingiot around teh table til the fiberglass become invisible. Wait to cure, then sand to a powdery surface and wipe with denatured alcohol. Coat with UV resistant varnish . You now have an indestructible, transparent surface that is easy to mainatin and you don't have to worry about water intrusion - ever.
This furniture will last for ever. Nice work.
That high altitude sun is no joke. I lived outside of Denver for a number of years, quite a bit higher in elevation, and everything left outside weathered way way faster than expected. For outdoor tables and benches we just used a deck sealer every year in the spring. Every single year in the spring everything made of wood , outside, that we cared about would get a good coat of water based wood sealer. These things would grey and check but would not warp or rot at all. you have to have different expectations for outdoor wood furniture
Same finish as the cedar strip canoe I made. I thought after the fiber glass and epoxy I was done. NOPE It still needed a few coats of this same varnish. Cut it a little too close to vacation time and had to put the varnish on after we used it for 10 days. Seems to be none the worse???? I also made this table and bench set after watching your video last year and its actually our indoor dining set in the winter. Thanks Marc and Nicole
great video! new woodworkers need to know that a good finish sometimes takes longer than the build, but is just as important. nice to see how products I haven't used work in real life.
Ahh, loved that table when you built it and still love it now. Great stuff. Steve Ramsey always talks about how the most durable finish is paint, and there's a lot of sense to that, but boy, sometimes it just breaks my heart to paint wood furniture.
+Dave Starr yeah if I want paint, I'll use a more durable material than wood.
Dave Starr oh good ol paint...gotta love it! Being in the field I am (decorative painter..aka faux finisher) id love to know if this is really true. I know a lot about paint chemistry n solids ratio, but very little about epoxy makeup and finial hardness since I’ve only been woodworking for a year. Honestly, I’d imagine epoxy would beat paint every time for solids & film coverage abilities. Maybe someday I’ll meet someone who knows as much about it as I do paint & we can answer that question together 🤓
Wow...I love the mini tip with the blue tape to prevent dripping!
That's a dedicated refinishing process! Beautiful table. Love the breadboard ends
Great Video Colorado is tough in outdoor furniture for sure.. I have to clean and polish all my outdoor wood furniture to keep up on the UV damage.
I found that it was helpful to lightly scuff up the varnish undercoats before using the epiphanes...It is possible for bubbling up to occur if this is not done...This was also advised by the folks at the Epiphanes site...A really lovely way to do an outdoor finish...People really like it on the outdoor chairs I have put together...Not sure how long it will last?
I tried this on the rail of my Hans Christian 38T sailboat, using West epoxy as the sealer. I had the same experience, with the varnish finish cracking after about a year in the marina. I'm guessing that the bond between the varnish and the epoxy is not enough to hold during expansion and contraction in the weather.
I have three cedar gates, with some pine framing, and a cedar plank facing on my facia. I have used Penofin once a year for the past eight years and the wood looks like I just built and/or installed them.
I don’t understand I’m very confused how can you put a clear coat of epoxy on the top give it a sanding and then apply varnish doesn’t the epoxy create a lawyer so that nothing could get soaked back into the wood
With my entry level hands on capability, this is a rocket science to me.
Love Epifanes … makes you look like a hero when you’re done
For the small outside stuff (armrests, small stools etc) I use Danish oil. I do have to add a light coat once or twice a year, but it's just a light sanding and wiping it on. I can do all the furniture in well under an hour and it dries within a day, so I just leave them all in place and do it on a day we don't use them.
How about a follow up on that finish now?
Please follow up with how this holds up after 1 or 2 years. It is really hard to find information about how these finishes actually hold up over time.
Zack Maynard epoxy itself is amazing. It doesn’t need to take this long. Epoxy will hold up for years and years. In some cases 20 yrs or more. It’s really easy to apply on wood too.
yea would like to know how it holded.
I think he mentioned in Friday Live show that he wasn't happy and that the finish here didn't last long.
Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Andrea's Workshop all this work and it didn't hold up? Damn.
@@rakashaagain Sometimes it is like that with outdoor finishes. This is why I personally don't like plastic film finishes they will flake over time and you'll need to strip and refinish everything.
I use BLO mixed with orange and turpentine oil applying coats until the wood doesn't take it in anymore. Then I repeat wit one/two coats a year.
I'm well aware my wood will become darker and gray with this finish and I have to reapply it at least once a year to keep in good shape but I like that look and I know wood lasts longer with oils applied outside in the harsh weather. Now pigmented paint (white) will protect and last longest but you kill the beauty of the wood.
Cheers.
I agree MARC, The added contrast from the cured epoxy in the natural cracks looks amazing. Many people would have little idea that epoxy was utilized to fill the cracks. Ya may have begun a Cracked Craze, lol. Well done Marc.
And it only takes three years in the AZ sun to achieve. This is likely to catch on! ;)
Good to see another project from you after quite some time. cheers.
Love the matte look.
foam brushes are the way to go.
and yeah, epifanes is priced like liquid platinum.
You did it right, just the way we finish exterior wood on boats. It's a lot of work and it takes discipline to apply enough coats, but the beauty is worth it in the end. One suggestion... all finishes wear out in the sun... boats have to be stripped of all that sealer material and resealed every couple of years, because the boat sits in the sun all the time. Keep your table in the shade, and cover it when not in use... that will add significant years to the life of your finish.
Another awesome and helpful video by a great woodworker. Thank you Marc for everything. Now that several years have past since you made this video, do you still believe that this is the best finish to protect wood from the elements?
Hi, I have a boat with white oak and mahogany rub rails. I am taking off the old varnish via heat gun and scraper. I have varnished many times in the past with Pettit Captains Varnish and though beautiful, the flaking in the future drives me nuts. I have used a product called Semco on teak which is a nice sealer but am wondering what else is out there. I know I definitely want to go the sealer route and just re-coat 1-3x a year to keep the wood looking good. The boat is on saltwater. Can you recommend a sealer for marine use? Also the mahogany and white oak have gone grey, can I use oxalic acid to restore to original color without damaging the surrounding paint? Thanks!
Great video, Marc. It's especially timely with the coming of spring. I'm using this finishing schedule right now on some chairs for my deck. Thanks mate!
I JUST finished (i.e. 5 minutes ago) my own western red cedar outdoor table. I also reclaimed the wood. Mine doesn't receive much if any sun - how well would a deck sealer like Thompsons water sealer do?
I have a set of teek furniture next to it that I renew with teek oil At least twice a year so I'm not adverse to maintenance
Is there a video on building the table and benches? They are amazing!
I've done the same.. but used West System's epoxy instead of varying it. I agree on the Foam brush.. but use a foam roller to apply the expoxy/varnish and then tip with a foam brush... this eliminates the bubbles and provides a clear finish. Another thing is GLOSS will has much longer than a matte finish. You might also apply a wax like a car wax to the finished product with a micro fiber cloth every 3 months.. because it's dirt that causes issues with water attached to it.
I just a mix of 50% turps, 50% linseed oil once a year on my cedar outdoor table. Less trouble than hard finishes.
This is definitely one of the best projects I`ve seen for about last 2 years! Matte finish looks so great that I want to finish every wooden thing matte from now :D
I have a reclaimed redwood table that I want to re-finish, but I actually love the rustic look of the big nail holes and cracks in it - I want them to be able to show through. Do I still need to do the first round of West Systems epoxy fill, or can I simply do the second Total Boat layer?
Great video. Why wasn't a spar varnish a good choice?
Wow .. just looks awesome! How would you finish an outdoor treated pine hand rail? Cheers.
Boatwork recipes for brightwork:
All raw wood thats been presanded & clean gets liberally brushed or slathered with boiling hot linseed oil (preboiled) 80% to 20% turpentine. Caution remove oil far from flame as turpentine is extremely flammable. The heat & thinner drive oil deep into wood. Once sufficiently dry ( tacky to touch which will take time) you can begin applying successive coats of following: McCloskys spar varnish - way less expensive than marine varnish just as good. 85 - 95%, Boiled linseed oil 5-15% the higher the% the slower it will dry (days) but the softer & more flexible the recipe which wont bubble peel or flake because it expands & contracts with the wood. Turpentine 20%. Total 2 - up to 6 coats for really high end work with a 220 grit light sanding & tac clothing & airhose between to give ea layer teeth to receive next coat. The idea of using epoxy in a varnish recipe is contrary. Yes to epoxy for filling gaps but you want a soft pliable finish on the woods surface because it will, no matter what expand & contract. Non believers try this on a pc of scrap & throw it up on the roof for a season & forget about it. Check it next spring & see for yourself. Youre very welcome.
Would love an update as we are about to embark on refinishing 5 large picnic tables from a two year old Eagle project. We bought the larger size of the West Marine Epoxy but wanted to get some advice first. 1. How has this held up since it was done? We have variable climate - hot, humid summers and often wet, below freezing for a month winters. 2. We used a sealer/stain combo for the original build; figure we’ll have to do a lot of sanding 3. What finish do you recommend if we cannot commit the time (or space) to do all 5 tables in the manner you did (though we love the look)? I’m afraid of using any poly for fear of cracking and failing/yellowing. Intrigued about using Tung Oil and redoing that on the spot each year.
Thats just how it is with outdoor furniture/boats. No matter what, you will (or pay someone) to refinish your prize. Just life. My old man used to redo our picnic table back in the 70's like evcery two or three years. He enjoyed using Shellac. Looked great, but every two or three years, it was a redo
Can you give a list of supplies you used on this project. I bought West SYSTEM 105 epoxy resin but it is clear and the one you used is a dark color. Would help if you could give a list of exactly what products you used thanks
Marc, great stuff, as alwasy! Now that this new and improved finish is coming on two years old, how has it held up?
I am wanting to build a grape trellis using cedar post and wanted to use a outdoor varnish/sealer to make it look good and last. Which one of the following would you use CPES, Epifanes, or total boat epoxy. They are just post like a fence post but wanted them to look nice. If there is another product please let me know what you would use and how to apply.
I love the matte look. I wonder if the table feels like plastic with that many coats of finish?
Instead of the sealant you used would Thompson’s water seal do the trick before applying the marine varnish? Asking cause I have a lot of it
Beautiful job. I am a beginner and am currently making a deck box with redwood. What do you suggest i apply for protection? Varnish, Linseed oil? Not sure on what to use as the box will be outside in the elements? Thanks.
What about adding a layer of fiberglass to that epoxy? I have a covered front porch that doesn't see a lot of weather but high traffic, teak T&G on plywood subfloor.
Thanks for this video!! I didn't know very much about how wood interacted with different types of protective coatings. It was a huge help, to realize the process a lot better with the way you explained things. Hope you got to enjoy that table on the 4th of July weekend, with your family and friends!
Hi, thanks for your video. I’m trying to re purpose a shelving system to use out doors in my backyard. Besides paint, I’m using vinyl wallpaper, for the sides and back of the shelving system. The wood is some sort particle board. What should I use to seal it, and protect it from the Florida sun and rain? Will sealers adhere to the vinyl? Should I use a water based polyurethane first over the paint to seal the wood, and then apply the vinyl wallpaper? Will the wallpaper stick to the sealer? I also would rather have a matte finish, but don’t even know if any of this is possible. This is my first project.....so I am a bit lost. Any help would be appreciated.
Good job Marc, have the same problem with an outdoor table and was thinking about the same approach you took with epoxy and coating, but taking the lessons learned into account. Would be useful to see a quick follow up a few years later on the table. Would that be possible? Many thanks and best from Europe.
Check the description. ;)
Love the look and quality of the finish. I'd like to build a table like that for my backyard. Can you tell me how many cans of Epifanes you went through on a table that size? I'd like to make sure i have enough on hand without going overboard. Thanks.
I had no idea any of that was possible. wow what an awesome video!
I’m not going to lie, throughout the video I was thinking, “Man this is a pain in the ass,” but the end product looks great
Great video, thank you. I'm making small table out or wormy chestnut - interior only. Can suggest a good coating option that's clear but at the same time offers some protection?
Beautiful results. Do you recommend Epifanio over Spar Varnish and why?
A lovely rustic result. ....well done.
Just got a very small table that I want to use outside. Looking for your suggestions of less expensive products that would do roughly the same job. Understood that the affect/durability will not be the same. Thank you
How many cans of 1000mL of Epifanes did you use? I've got a cedar porch rail and columns that I'm going to apply the Epifanes to and just trying to gauge how much to buy.
How does deck stain differ from the initial teak oil coating, just more thinner?
Why the layers of gloss before the matte finish? Was this necessary or just to help stretch the more expensive matte finish?
thanks for the video, i am following a pretty similar approach for a glue lam exterior beam. you wern't kidding about it taking time.. seems like you need to wait a few days or more sometimes for the epifanes product to harden enough to sand it efficiently, otherwise it just gums up and makes a mess. how'd the finish end up holding up?
looks better than ever before. awesome garden btw. you should make a tour.
Ever try Wet Sanding?
With a high grade grit.
Smoothest finish you can get.
Learned a lot from your video! Project looks great!
What is oil but decayed trees and vegetation. Some people say oil from your oil changes are good for fences, wagon wood,etc. That preserves outdoor wood. Not for a table to eat at but for other wood that is exposed to elements perhaps.
50% dilution on the first 2-3 coats is bingo bango. Used Helmsman Spar the same way and works.
Fantastic video as always.
Very helpful info!
I just purchased acacia outdoor wood patio set and in one week I’m seeing evidence of weather and sun damage.
Please tell me what i should use to protect it now that it’s new?
Someone explain to me why diluting down the items with what is supposed to remove the epoxy it is a good idea??
It is never a recommendation to dilute an exterior varnish. It will always weaken the finish.
If you notice how well he applies the vanish, it's not a good place to get lessons. Starting with exterior epoxy and then applying vanish should give you a clue.
Anyone who puts on a lot of varnish would put it on so heavy that it would need to be that thick.
What are your experiences with Spar Urethane? I'm considering making some outdoor oversized 9x9 Go Boards (about 3' by 3') for kids, and I'm trying to decide what finish I should use on something like this. I'm going to use a yellow solid wood-stain, so I think I will make these out of 3/4" birch plywood.