Christopher Ward Twelve & Tissot PRX Killed Integrated Sports Watches.
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- Опубліковано 25 вер 2023
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The Christopher Ward Twelve and the Tissot PRX have dominated lower and middle tier watch lists for a while now. However, with the boom in more affordable integrated sports watches...we have to ask, are they losing their appeal? Something that was so explosive and cool and the 70's and then carried on by many of the most beautifully designed watches ever is now being made HEAVILY by all brands at all price points. Are we just repeating the 70's only to one day not like any of these watches for another 50 some odd years?
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I love Christian, but I’m fascinated that the show loses none of its charm when Michael is flying solo! So very watchable!
Christian comes off as pretentious while Michael seems like one of us imo
Here’s your click for an amazing title, Mike.
All tends come to an end, but integrated watches have stood the test of time. The hype will slowly leave the integrated market, however integrated watches will continue to find their customers.
I own both the Twelve and RO. CW did an amazing job with the Twelve. I wear it when I don’t want to wear the more expensive piece/version by AP. The Twelve is very well made, thin and has a nice feel on the wrist. I don’t own a Nautilus so I can’t comment on that as a comparison. I would recommend CW Twelve and BelCanto to any collector. AP and Patek, while beautiful, are a bit overpriced/overhyped right now in my opinion.
Did you get the TI or SS option?
Interesting that videos are 30% shorter with more hard info and reporting when Christian is on vacation.
When I was doing my undergrad in Materials Engineering I wrote a (class) paper on IWC and their recently released Ceratanium case material. The paper actually turned out really good and highlighted how cutting edge this material, and the required manufacturing techniques, truly are. Another discovery throughout the research was how watch brands are uniquely positioned, across all industries, to lead materials engineering discovery in the next coming years. This was mainly being these material improvements can be justified as part of an overall marketing budget, rather than the incremental economic value that they bring to a product or industry,. Happy to share the paper and talk more.
Nivada Grenchen (the original brand, not the recent relaunch) made an AP Royal Oak clone in the 1970s, the "F77", it's quite a charming piece, you can now get them used for about $2000 in good condition. Oh, and I just saw that they have now reissued that model.
Great video, thanks Michael! Great point about the pioneer brands being forced to innovate because the technology afforded to the lower-cost brands are allowing them to catch up. I’m one that admittedly gets easily caught up in the latest trends in watches so I appreciate you also saying that the trend of integrated bracelet watches will dwindle. I’m always on the fence about getting a PRX or The Twelve because I like them but I also don’t like hype pieces. I guess I need to stick to the classics that never go out of style!
Just buy what you find appealing. If you’re not buying for the hype, you’re going to love it when it’s no longer a “hype piece”
The formex essence is not an integrated bracelet Watch
Masterworks is ridiculous, can't wait til they're dropped as a sponsor
And art market is so overvalued, main place for money laundering
The Twelve is soooo good not just for its price but beyond it. I’m with Christian. It definitely scratches that itch. I have a PRX but when I received the Twelve, next level.
I couldn’t agree more. I love my Twelve Ti. Great watch.
really? i'm so on the fence about getting one. i literally had a browser page up a few weeks ago for multiple days, and i had all my options selected and all i had to do was click "purchase" but i couldn't bring myself to do it....i'm terrified that i'll get it, and it'll suck. i want to believe it's awesome so badly.
@@omar10213245 get it. They have a fantastic return policy so there is zero risk.
I picked up a twelve 36mm…it completely scratched my integrated watch itch.
Way more expensive than prx
The Twelve is REALLY good. I was fortunate enough to try several of them on at the Windup Chicago event and was really impressed. CW as a whole is impressive, but the Twelve in particular. While integrated bracelet sports watches may not be the hottest thing on the market at some point, I don't think they'll ever go away like they pretty much did for a while after the '70s. I think they'll be sort of a sub-genre/staple in brand collections. Maybe field watches will reign supreme (not a prediction) or two tone will really make a strong come back, but I think they'll still have their fans. I think materials innovation from the luxury brands will also keep them interesting, as discussed in the video.
I think the question is when does technology and automation reach a level that it is indistinguishable from a hand finished movement and polishing with complications and no human involvement is required
With the exponential growth of GenAi, 3D printing, robotics that day is (scarily) fast approaching.
Tudor use robot automation today to bring down their production costs today.
So how quickly does the tech get to a level when the “manual labour cost” and “creative design” element is removed, so it’s just a question of how much more are you paying for brand heritage/image.
The CW12 is beautiful n breathtaking at this price tag.
Only the 38h power reserve bugs me a bit.
Commenting to show Mike some support: I think you’re right. Cant speak about everybody else but I myself am already bored with the integrated bracelet designs. It was fresh and intriguing a few years back but now it just feels like a tired trend outside of the OGs (RO and Nautilus) and maybe the 222 and also the Oysterquartz.
Hey Mike’s doing great work alone!
How is this process different from Sinn tegimented steel except for the polishing. Is this process somewhat similar ?
Love the Hamilton Khaki Aviation Pilot Pioneer on his wrist
Panerai did BMG several years ago but I guess it’s “revolutionary” because AP charges out the butt for it.
That's the first thing I thought of. Panerai is not mentioned enough these days with watch influencers but that just makes mine all the more novel.
8:06 Sponsored ad segue level: Expert
You're doing superbly solo!
I think CW nailed it. The 40mm with the blue dial and that bracelet. CW really nailed the timing of the release to crap all over IWC and thier insane pricing. The only thing I didnt like about CW watches was the arrowhead hour hand. the hour hand on the 12 is perfect.
If like me you love integrated bracelet watches, but want something different with more personality. I'd suggest the Nivada F77.
I loved my PRX but the size didn't suit me whereas the F77 is perfect at 37. finish is very good and the dial has a ton of character.
I want to say I'm sick of integrated bracelet watches but they just aren't my preference. I'm with you on the materials front. Case construction excites me more than many complications or in some cases history.
12:00 want an innovative case material? I have a 21 year old Rado Diastar, with it’s scratch resistant case that has absolutely no scratches!! Invented by Rado in 1962…. That’s innovation!
I had a liquid metal marketed Tennis racket in the 90s ;)
This is the perfect time to snag a nice integrated bracelet. The value on a twelve is fantastic and things will only get more expensive. If your attention moves on as the trends move on you won't have a ton invested in a PRX or Twelve. The twelve would be a great addition to any watch collection.
Baume mercier riviera is excellent and understated.. .
Diggin the solo shows.
Please check „amorphe metals“ (I hope this is the correct translation from German into English). If a melted metal is cooled so fast that it cannot crystallize it remains amorphe. Typically these materials are very thin as you cannot get the heat quick enough out of a thick metal block. That is why it works best for alloys with small, medium and large atoms.
I love my PRX and don’t think I’ll get tired of looking at it and I’ve just gotten into watches seriously in last 3 yrs
Same. It’s so comfortable as well, and a hell of a watch for the price
@@Warmode88very thin bracelet though.
Don't forget VC 222, Hublot Big Bang Integrated, and of course the relaunch of the IWC Ingenieur. Oh and the Zenith Defy Skyline Ceramic and Bvlgari Octo Finissimo. I think integrated sports watches are here to stay.
What about the Steinhart Architect….you didn’t mention that one! 😮
Good stuff
We are just repeating the cycle that already happened in the 80s when everybody copied the Royal Oak integrated bracelet. The style got saturated and it took 30 years to become fashionable again
I love the CW Twelve. I want the Titanium version.
The thumbnail looks like you mocked up a PRX moonphase…. I’d buy that
I got The Twelve not because it is an integrated bracelet sports watch, but just because it is a good looking watch.
Wanted a solid every day watch and wasn’t really concerned with type.
Don't forget the Nivada Grenchen F77, which actually looks identical to the original F77 back in the mid 70s.
Integrated sports watches, Tiffany blue dials, green dials, bronze cases, GMT functions etc. We are all hostages to the horological fads of the moment.
The PRX bracelet is what makes that watch the most sold IMO,
the bracelet is as important in design as the bezel
The Twelve bracelet is better in every way.
The Twelve is not very close to the AP, but rather the Zenith Defy Skyline (bezel) and the Czapek Antarctique (the rest). It is a very good deal at £1050. By the way, there is a Tissot PRX with an 18k gold bezel that looks as if taken from a DateJust. It costs £1800. Not a good deal.
I have a Tudor Royal, basically a Rolex Oysterquartz and designed by Gerald Genta; anyway, if Rolex released a new or similar watch the watch game would be over!
I'd jump for an oyster quartz.
You better not hit anything with those metal glass links. If there is one thing in common (or is actually even worse) in metal glasses with conventional glasses is the brittleness. They will not make a case out of that material anytime soon.
Integrated sport watches are great. They keep dress watch prices low 😊
Yes AP and PP both stopped productions.
awesome❤❤
Wrist check?
As someone who loves integrated sports watches, I think its great to have more affordable watches with their own designs even if they all borrow from Genta's DNA.
People are buying these watches because of design. AP is not really in the conversation. Some yes but a large amount not even. PRX crushed it and people are in love with the design. The 12 is the step up but holds it own because of the design. They get compared but they are different in design and reason behind release. Awesome video.
Agreed
I definitely see where you’re coming from, I just think the Christopher Ward and PRX allow people with no access to AP or PP to wear an integrated sports watch. Will they remain AS popular? Probably not, but I don’t think the appeal of them will completely go away. Now that the market has access to them, where they didn’t before, I can see them staying for the long term.
Bruno Mars catching strays for no reason 😂😭😭
I am beyond done with integrated sports bracelets but clearly there is a part of the market that isn’t hence every company trying to quickly make one to make a quick buck. Can imagine this style going out of fashion very quickly as it is not a “timeless look” that will always look good.
Never cared about integrated bracelets
OMG AP & Omega have created Beskar.
This kid is killing it.
I'm already over it, been over it. I am not saying that a person who loves their Royal Oak has poor taste. It's a lovely watch. But this trend is so very trendy and it is just a fad.
Yeah for sure, things were better when the only things being hyped were dive watches in one of the five acceptable dial colors.
My Tsuyosa says "Hi"
I have an AP. I truly don't understand why anyone would waste their money on the CW 12. Perhaps they want to spend their money on nights out or trips to Fiji. I've found that the Seychelles are just as lovely. Plus, I get to relax on the beach with my AP 😊
To each their own.
For anyone considering between the 12 or an AP, I would suggest not eating out as often for a couple of months and just go with the Royal Oak. You'll thank yourself in the long run.
I have 7 variations and colours of royal oaks and slowly got sick of them, even though the cw is outrageously expensive I bought one just because of the tiffany dial which makes my royal oaks look old and dusty.
CW 12 outrageously expensive compared to a Royal Oak?!
I never understood the appeal of the Royal Oak.
The CW Twelve and the Wempe Iron Walker are more beautiful examples of these Genta-style watches. Gerald Genta would have loved them.
Not everyone can splurge on a royal oak tho, even if one skips meals for months. But i get , i wouldnt buy the 12 even as a poor person. Probably the most overhyped watch of the year.
@@Psysso If I were that poor, then I would settle for a Rolex. Perhaps the new IWC? I hear they've come out with a knock off of the AP too. Anyone can afford an IWC, and it's probably better than the 12. Either way, I advise skipping the 12.
In my opinion there is no getting tired of getting tired of integrated sports watches.
I'm going to say it... Christian ain't nada in the face of Michael when it comes to watchability. More solo Michael vids in the future please!
The PRX and Twelve don't do much for me in design terms. My full metal G looks ace on an integrated bracelet though imho (although it is very very blingy). I think a lot of these integrated watches look a bit "thin" for me and they lack visual heft. And they aren't soft and cute whatever either. Seems like a weird spot for me, I will not be too upset when the next trend comes in.
Nautilus and "most beautiful watches in history", choose one
Bruv.... I got mad...
the prx is a college budget maybe but the 12 isnt
Isn’t it weird that people refuse to admit AP is a one trick pony… Tissot and CW managed to bring competition to the market under 10k and drove the market nuts. AP needs to step it up and innovate…
Why isn’t my oyster quarts not booming tooo00 the moooon yet
Im ok with AP continuing to swim in their lane.
Love the topic. Please slow slow down it feels like I got a podcast on 3X speed
great show, but bad hair day!😂
Always a bad hair day :/ lol!
A good watch is a good watch and if it looks good, then who cares! Wear what you like; it’s that simple. Thanks for the video 🤘🏼
bro def owns a prx
@@pr33tu_ oh look who knows so much. I actually don’t own a PRX.
@@nolo5150 Just poking some fun, I'm sure you have a very unique collection 👌
No. If you like it, then buy it and wear what you want.
Honestly, I think the idea that the RO and Naut are going to be truly timeless is more of a hot take than integrateds dieing
i LOVE YALL❤🎉❤🎉
Got the 23rd like ❤
Where is a 15 or 16 year old getting the money for a CW????????????? Or even a Tissot??????????
Living on another planet.
I’m never met amorphous I didn’t like
Elitist😂
How did he get a 17 MINUTE long video out of this? I gave up after the first 30 seconds
Are we getting tired of divers? Are we getting tired of 3 hand dress watches???. 😊 Welcome your new watch archetype to the modern era
What I always want say when I hear this topic. Divers are the most boring watches imo but they seem to never go out of “style”. Just wear what you like
The PRX is extremely played out. Vintage Tissot designs are soo much nicer. Modern Tissot looks like it be next to a T shirt rack at K mart. That's just the feel they give off. Extremely massed produced vibes
You're saying a lot of rubbish. The Tissot PRX is a 101 copy of the Tissot Seastar from 1970! But the AP Royal Oak didn't come until 1972! So who copied whom? Do your homework! 👎
Yes, bored now .. Royal Oak will always be beautiful but everything else now feels like a tired copy. boring
I don’t understand the fascination with the royal oak…. It’s one of the ugliest watches made! The segmented bracelet looks like crap and the faux screws are just cheesy.
I thought so too, until I tried it on.
Democratizing a watch style is not killing it... and if you get to feel bad for it, then you might be a snob with a fragile ego.
I´d never pay 1200 for a CWard
CW made a chiming hour watch, never before seen under 10k. Would you still not pay 1200?
Great, one more for us! apparently you care more about the brand rather than the substance...
Enjoy!!!@@fastdays_1
B.S. Christopher Ward has made an excellent watch, bottom line the RO and Nautilus have in many ways made intergrated watches out of touch for the masses
It pains me to say this as a long time viewer and subscriber but these videos with only Michael are just not as good..... I know Christian catches a lot of hate for his pretentious persona but he adds sooo much color and passion to the videos. I find Michael's videos to be disorganized, boring, and corny. Sorry Michael.
Your show is 10 times better without Chris. May he stay in his holidays for ever.