Are The Necrons Truly Soulless? - 40K Theories
Вставка
- Опубліковано 8 сер 2021
- The Necrons are commonly described as being a race of soulless automatons. But did the Necrontyr truly lose their souls after undergoing the biotransference process, or could some trace of their spiritual essence, no matter how small, remain within their new mechanical forms?
This is an updated and remastered video with additional information, correcting a couple of mistakes and adding higher quality audio.
Additional Narration by Stephanie Swan Quills
/ stephanieswanquill
Intro theme by Stringstorm
/ galiant609
Additional audio editing by Officio Audiorum
/ officioaudiorum
Additional artwork by Eliphusz, Dmitrii Ustinov and MyDeads
www.deviantart.com/eliphusz
www.artstation.com/conceptartist
www.deviantart.com/mydeads
All art property of their respective owners
Visit Games Workshop's official site here:
www.games-workshop.com/
Support 40K Theories on Patreon:
/ 40ktheories
All art property of their respective owners
Visit Games Workshop's official site here:
www.games-workshop.com/
Support 40K Theories on Patreon:
/ 40ktheories - Ігри
The Necron's might not be entirely soulless, but GW is proving that it is.
"Forget the promise of progress and understanding, for in the grim dark future there is only stupid. There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting corporate accountants."
I think I quoted that one correctly... did I miss a comma or something?
Ooooooooo snap
To me, the answer is simple: you cannot remove the soul of something entirely. When you drink from a glass, there is always a part of the liquid still there and the same way it is with the soul. This means the souls of the rank and file necrons are only an incredibly small fraction, but they still have one.
well said brother
But in this metaphor the glass would be the Necrontry’s original body which was incinerated in the soul forge so and the essence of the souls were eaten by the C’tan
@@henrycunningham8975 as far as I know, their bodies have been changed, but not destroyed and in the meantime parts of their soul have been lost.
This assumes that the Necrons are literally made from the physical bodies of the Necrontyr. It fits the tone of the setting better to think that the C'tan lied to all of them and just had them build robots with AIs that matched their leaders' personalities.
The C'tan would just have to pass that off as upgrades to their very same bodies, souls included, when it was all just one big scam so the Ctan could genocide the Necrontyr, eat their souls, and get a sweet new robot army in the process. It'd be a win-win for the C'tan.
You absolutely can remove the Soul of something entirely, and 40K's pretty much full of examples of beings having their Souls stripped from them.
Biotransference isn't like pouring water out of a glass. Biotransference is like if you take a glass of water, have an incredibly thirsty man lap up as much of that water as they possibly can, smash the glass, and then reconstruct the glass' exact dimensions with steel.
Nothing of the original Necrontyr remains in the Necron except for their memories and consciousness, converted into hard, raw data that can be transferred between data banks.
Newer Necron books are very keen on saying the Necrons no longer have Souls, GW themselves recently reinforced pretty adamantly that the C'tan devoured Souls, and even the Eldar, who have extremely keen psychic senses, refer to the Necrons plainly as Soulless.
Tau are examples of having weak souls. Necrons are examples having no souls at all. Blanks go further by having Anti-Souls.
Trazyn the Infinite: "YOU DARE CHALLENGE TRAZYN THE INFINITE?"
Orikan the Diviner: "This galaxy isn't big enough for us two supervillains!"
Trazyn the Infinite: "OH YOU'RE A VILLAIN ALRIGHT! JUST NOT A SUPER ONE!"
Orikan the Diviner: "Yeah, and what's the difference?!"
Trazyn the Infinite: *"PRESENTATION!!!"*
One word: Window
Reddit mometo
That is excellent
Trazyn once acquired a pokemon game, he was most amused by the plot
@@bartoszkosmowski7149 One more word: Statue
I am glad you are continuing to make content in these troubled times. Hope your break was relaxing
He is needed now more than ever brother ternel..more than he knows ;,(
@@ChillAssTurtle even in the darkest times we must have faith in the emperor. And if we are truly at the end, I would sooner see it on my feet than cowering on my knees
In the novella Indomitus there are a lot of mentions about the soul,how the more higher up Necrons still are alive(ish) while lower tier are nothing more automatons. One Necron keeps thinking and remembering his family and seeking them in the horde. Once he found them he realised that they no longer had the spark of a soul, individuality, you name it, he destroyed them and made sure they couldn't return. When he himself died he believed his soul would join his family.
That's pretty interesting, and honestly kinda heartbreaking.
@@40KTheories Yup. Very humanising. Similarly the different factions still carry grudges against each other. Also a faction that directly opposes the Silent King but in shadows. They've infiltrated his forces. They fear the Pariah field weapon.
That's sad
Anyway
Enemy: "You have no soul!"
Necrons: "AND THAT IS WHY WE HAVE NO FEAR!"
Your morale can't be broken when you can't feel fear to begin with!
@@inquisitorbenediktanders3142 it can't broke if there's no moral in first place
@@murder1625 it can't *break*
@@inquisitorbenediktanders3142 well it's just works
Nice reference
In Warhammer Fantasy Battles, Tomb Kings studied souls: "Whereas Sigmar's priests may speak of the anima and animus, the identity and energy of the soul, the Nehekharans did not believe in so simple a spiritual dyad as this. Instead, the soul consisted of seven parts that were in a complex arrangement with each other." To be truly resurrected, you need all 7 parts.
Necrons were supposed to be Space Tomb Kings, so it's possible, that necrons lost some parts of their souls, like Tomb Kings.
Also, blanks probably do have souls. They simply have negative warp charge, while everyone else have positive warp charge, similar to Blackstone that can be charged positively to boost warp or negatively to suppress warp.
Thanks for quoting that piece of information. There being a difference between identity and energy is a good one. If the Ctan just consumed the Necrontyr's energy or lifeforce than their souls or some parts of it may still be there. But they are not necessarily somewhere in the automaton. maybe these souls or soul fragments are floating trough the endless warp, far away from what was once their body. this is likely I assume at least with your average Necron. Since the lords still have at least fragments of their identity intact or just decaying, there might be some bits of soul left within them.
@@phreakazoith2237 It makes complete sense when you look at the ancient Egyptian concept of the parts of the soul:
• All Necrons lost their Khet and Ib (physical body & heart) in the transference.
• The C’tan devoured the Ka, or lifeforce, and probably the Sah (spiritual body / Warp Presence) and Sekhem (“power”) as well.
The noble Necrons retained their Ba (personality), Ren (name) and Akh (mind), while the automata lost theirs.
• The only part the Necron Warriors may still retain of their souls are the Shut (shadow) that still clings, screaming, in the dark.
Tzeench: What is a soul? An immaterial little pile of secrets.
Any pile of secrets is immaterial to Tzeench.
You steal men’s souls, and make them chaos spawn!
@@llewelynshingler2173 Of course, even material secrets will cast an immaterial shadow into Tzeenchs little corner of the Warp.
@@TheCrimsonSpork Perhaps the same could be said for your Corpse Emperor?
Enough talk... Have at you!
Man, I miss the Necron's Pariahs
Same. Shame they've been "doomed to obscurity" :(
Yea I agree, please bring me back from the realm of the sqauts.
Well Squats came back recently (in both Necromunda and teased in Psychic Awakening)
Imperial Beastmen came back
Saharduin came back
There's always a chance...
Remember that the Necrontyr were largely unaware of the Warp.
When an Aldari talks about their "soul", you can be fairly sure they are talking about the actual psychic phenomenon. The same is true for an Imperial Human who had been inducted into the deeper mysteries.
However, Tau, Necrontyr, and Humans from before we learned about psykers would all be more likely to mean the soul in a more figurative sense. When the Silent King said they lost their souls, he may simply have been talking about their personalities, not their psychic reflection in the Warp.
For me its the part about Lucius the Eternal that clenches it, they at the very least have a tinny soul if nothing else. Even if the C'tan at their souls, they developed new ones over time. Even the hatred to all life by the Destroyer Cults implies emotionality, and thus a soul. Then there is Orikan the Diviner, in the book the Infinite and the Divine, Orikan goes though temporary transformations, where he is transforming himself into a mini-C'tan... or some form of Deamon, and there the distinction between the two may be fine. Now not all Necrons may have souls, the rank and file may just be empty vessels at this point, but the higher ranking ones, not so much.
It was pointed out in the new Dark imperium book by an Eldar Farseer in Papa Smurf’s service that the C’tan are the Physical gods of the materium,
But we do know that things without a soul can display emotions like the machine spirits of titans or The AI of the Men of iron so a soul isnt a necessary to display emotion (also Canoptek Constructs have shown emotion and so do blanks and neither have a soul)
Animals have emotions, and yet they do not have souls. Emotion seems to be related to sapience more than sentience. Having a soul just means that there's "someone in there", if you catch my drift.
@@Jupiter__001_ yet again i must tell you of Blanks, Men of Iron and titans all of them are sapient (titans to a lesser degree the Castigator being the exception) all of them do not have souls and are still sapient
@@bloodfartmoon2765 Except we don't know that Men of Iron had no souls, and Blanks probably do have some form of... inverted soul? A rock has no soul, but it doesn't push back the warp, but Blanks are a who other argument.
In the infinite and the devine book, it is stated by oracon the Diviner (in his ascended astral form) that the Necron had impoverished shadow souls
Whoever you are, wherever you are, whenever you are.. *The Holy God Emperor of Mankind loves you*
Wholesome
Except when you're a xenos or demonic, then big E want's you dead.
@@inquisitorbenediktanders3142 you know best *Lord Inquisitor* :□
@@ChillAssTurtle Thank you, random servant of the emperor.
@@inquisitorbenediktanders3142 Or if you're none of those things but your human colony is doing well without the imperium, then you also get dieded.
I get the impression that the necrons do not have souls, but A.I. constructs. The higher the rank, the more sophisticated the construct. Their personalities are transferred into engrams that control the simulated soul.
then "do i have a soul?" the AI asks.
Sort of. It depends on if you'd define a person's memories and thought patterns converted into data and inserted into a machine as an AI or a person.
But in practice yes, Necron consciousness engrams function similarly to Artificial Intelligence.
I say they do have souls. The bio transference was a process that burned the body and cast off the life energy. The C'tan absorbed that energy, and the soul was transfered into a mechanical body. The more complex the body, the better retention of self-identity. But the more basic the body, the more self-identity is eroded or suppressed. Either way, they do have their souls even if they are shadows of themselves.
Necrons are not " soulless" in that sense, part of their spirits was consumed, but they still have a consciousness and all that, so they can be afraid and all that.Plus that the dark eldar in soulstorm said that necrons souls are sour, implying that the soul is there, but consumed and wasted, like a spoiled, expired bad apple.
2:06 The Old Ones also created the races of Eldar and the Krorks/Orks as bio-engineered weapons to fight against the Necrontyr too as well.
Its been implied that the Krork were created _after_ the Necrontyr became the Necrons as a countermeasure. As the for the Aeldari, while the Old Ones did aid in their evolution and ascension, there has been contradicting sources regarding as to _when_ this occurred, as some claim that the Aeldari were created to serve as foot soldiers for the Old Ones against the Necrontyr, whereas others state the Aeldari rose to prominence before the War in Heaven. One such source even depicts the Aeldari and Necrontyr making a brief alliance prior to the War in Heaven to fight against a horde of warp entities.
(In either case, it's best to treat the Old Ones as a faction in regards to the War in Heaven)
@@40KTheories The Necrons wish to return to flesh? How exactly would they do that? Is there a lost STC (Eg nanotechnology)?
1:37 Silent King: "Let's start the War in Heaven just to regain the unity and harmony of my people against a common foe! I mean what could possibly go wrong?"
*cue to the massive corruption of the Realm of Souls into the Warp and the creation of three elder Chaos Gods: Khorne, Tzeentch and Nurgle born from the War in Heaven*
Silent King looks at War in heaven's results. "Gee. I'm outta here."
I remembered this theory glad to see it again
Welcome back, Your presence is much needed
I posted a video last week, but thank you regardless ^^
Necrons " what's a soul ?"
Humans "beats me but it's about 21 grams of gold ( in weight/energy ) apparently . "
It makes complete sense when you look at the ancient Egyptian concept of the parts of the soul:
• All Necrons lost their Khet and Ib (physical body & heart) in the transference.
• The C’tan devoured the Ka, or lifeforce, and probably the Sah (spiritual body / Warp Presence) and Sekhem (“power”) as well.
The noble Necrons retained their Ba (personality), Ren (name) and Akh (mind), while the automata lost theirs.
• The only part the Necron Warriors may still retain of their souls are the Shut (shadow) that still clings, screaming, in the dark.
I think Lucius the Eternal is twinked out. (As in they use the flimsiest excuses to bring him back, as in the twinkie defense from the killer of Harvey Milk in 1979)
I think it should have to be more than just normal pride in a job well done, that it has to be something of excessive pride.
Yup, he's a chaos champion and they don't want him to be taken out easy, but they've basically made him the single weakest chaos champion since he has the most deaths of any of them due to how they wanted to make him unique, so now they've given him the most BS power available in order to make him a threat, as far as I know he's the only chaos champion to literally die to a landmine.
@@Nyghtking that may have been intentional, if he knows his powers well. That landmine basically became a free teleport to a hive or a forge world for him.
Trayzn has a soul.
It's in a jar next to his pokemon collection!
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
*Badumtish*
Hope we keep seeing videos from this wonderful channel as GW are coming down on content creators.
I think the problem it all comes down to is this: WHAT is a soul and what are the rules that apply to it? Depending on how you interpret that question, your stance on wether or not the Necrons are truly soulless may differ significantly.
My personal take: I think the soul is warp energy that has coaleced within a single spot when a conciousness is formed and links all living things to the warp, in some way (even pariahs, in their own horrific way). It is time and again described as a psychic flame by those that are capable of perceiving them (like psychers) and the "light" radiating from it is what actually influences the stuff of the warp around it. It is also mentioned time and again that the souls of the dead dissipate into the warp, becoming one with it, as if it had always been made of the same material.
So I believe that the Necrons still do possess souls, since the C'tan would have been completely incapable of actually accessing a creatures soul, since they were beings purely of the material realm and the energies of the sea of souls was as poison to them. But I also think the process of biotransferrence trapped the souls in a way, binding them to their new metal bodies and horrendously butchered them (some more than others), resulting in our moder day Necrons.
"... the process of biotransferrence trapped the souls in a way, binding them to their new metal bodies and horrendously butchered them..."
So... kinda like a bunch of tiny, alien Golden Thrones with legs, less gold, and _more_ skulls? That's a good take on the situation. It also opens up the possibility that the Necrons _could_ potentially return to being Necrontyr again; as long as even the tiniest of soul fragments remains, a person cannot be truly gone forever.
@@anthonylamonica8301 that's a good analogy actually. Didn't think of that.
what if in every necron warrior there is a bound Screaming Necrontyr soul taken for a ride by the construct forever aware.
I always thought that Necrons are souls trapped in cold heartless machines
like a furby
Despite being claimed soulless, the Necrons still seem to have something that animates them. Whether that be their original souls, the will of C'Tan, or a something else entirely, new bodies don't seem to be able to express all of this lifeforce that they had as Necrontyr.
Its pretty simple actually they dont need a soul to be animated (See the Men of iron and every Canoptek construct) its just that their minds themselves were digitalized into super computers (Think GLaDOS from portal but more advanced)
@@bloodfartmoon2765 I mean ultimately the problems with Souls in Warhammer is that it’s really unclear what they even do. Is your souls your personal identity? Doesn’t seem like it. Is it your passion and emotions? It’s heavily implied to be yes, but some of the most passionate beings across all the Settings of Warhammer are Soulless (Trazyn the Infinite, Vlad and Isabella Von Carstein, Etc.)
@@InquisitorThomas so far i think in Warhammer the soul counts as some sort of "spiritual second brain" just as a brain allows something to have a mind in the material plane, a soul allows that mind to also exist and affect the warp.
so you can make something with a mind without a soul but it seems that life in the Warhammer universe has a tendency to have souls with the exceptions of things like blanks.
and you can have something that is pure soul but no physical body or brain, warpspawn
blanks and other soules beings do provide with a reason as to why life develops a warp presence so often
Not having the connection to the warp like most life does seems to leave the soulless creature to not feel as connected as creatures with souls do.
or at least that's my head cannon from what I understand of the universe
Even if they arent GW certainly is.
Who hoo your back hope well rested. Cheers
I came back last week :)
But thank you ^^
@@40KTheories I said I'd put my comment here as I didn't get to watch your other vid on release day due to the camping holiday in the ash wastes, with my high lord of tera Wifey and our retinue of of my mini clones. And I like to make sure my favourite creators feel the love.
I think the greatest supporting evidence for this is the ultimate goal of the Necron race; undoing the biotransference and returning their race to its original mortality. On top of that, necron warriors have been mentioned in bast editions to have experienced several instances of memeory flashes - the faintest hints as to who their mortal life, somehow managing to resurface.
Great video Remliez. Nice to consider the skellyboys may have even a bit of a soul. :)
10:10 I'd argue the shattering of the soul of The Emperor is a more visceral example than Magnus getting his soul shattered. I may be biased tho because #BlameMagnus
Hellz yeah glad it's here :)
Another good example is the ‘Severed’ novella where Nemesor Zahndrekh revealed to his trusted bodyguard and confidante Obyron that he’s actually perfectly sane and deliberately acts like he’s stuck in the past to annoy the other Necron Lords and simply to remember the joy he once felt as a living being. If it means playing the fool a bit, all in good fun as far as he’s concerned.
He also gives a nice exposition to Obyron about why he believes he DOES have a soul, stating that if he was truly just a machine engram as so many have come to believe then why did he hesitate doing the logical thing of betraying him as a machine would? The loyalty he felt for his master went beyond simple programming but represented a connection that saw him refuse to turn on him despite his misgivings about his supposedly fraying sanity and the perceived chance to restore their people’s souls.
He CHOSE that loyalty because he CARED about his master, Zahndrekh said , and that’s not the thinking of a mere machine engram but EMOTION from a LIVING being. And that’s why he believed that while their souls might be damaged or fragmented, they did still exist within them.
A question I've had that's sort of related to this is, are blanks truly soulless? From my recollection there are these ultra blank assassins they do something to in order to crank that pariah gene way up, but that raises the question: How can they become *more* soulless? This suggests to me that they aren't strictly speaking soulless, but rather have some sort of anti-soul.
Yup, they have to have something.
Oh dope a remake of an already fantastic theory. I have no doubt this one will be bette, considering how interesting of a question this is, and the amount of new lore we have gotten since then.
My own thoughts on the topic before watching the video are that necrons, at least the high ranking ones, do in fact have souls of varying potency. Considering that AI from the dark age of technology have been known to develop souls, and that Lucius has been able to take over a necron, this just serves as evidence in my mind that they do infact have souls of some sort, even if they are only dim. However im not convinced necron warriors have souls.
Something I've seen said to be evidence for necrons having souls which i disagree with is the fact the because high ranking necrons have emotions, they must have souls. Considering that blanks do not have souls and still have emotions, i dont see this as evidence as all.
He Returns!
(I returned last week :P)
Necrons: *send war declaration to old ones*
Old ones: *mark as spam*
Good see new uploads brother...anoint that oil and carry on
Maybe only so much soul can be placed into necron constructs as opposed to living flesh beings.
good story bro
Honestly, I think the answer shifts with each edition.
However, I feel that having the Necrons have Souls gives better stories.
Maybe just leave it vague and maybe some kind of vestige soul at best
I agree with the first part but not the second. You may be conflating soul with personality. AI can have personality, it's common theme throughout science fiction.
@@Emidretrauqe I suppose that does apply to this setting, the Imperium of Man is made of pseudo-medieval screwheads, in part, due to a war they had with their own AIs
@@llewelynshingler2173 Yeah, I've always viewed the Necron story as the assertion that _any_ race that attempts to create intelligent machines will end up being eradicated by them. If the C'tan couldn't make it work, then like hell anyone else can.
I want to to say that I believe it was in the indomitus novel by gav Thorpe, that there is a necron dystoyer lord that talks about his vivid memory of the bio transfer. And there is some discord about it In the infinite and the divine
Never heard anything about the Grey Knight Ferry Men before could you make a vid please about this process
As many said before I believe that the necrons still have a small sliver of their souls which works, in lack of a better term, as their machine spirit. The higher up the necrontyr was, more of his soul was preserved and so they could keep more of their personality.
I would totally agree with that! there must be some remanence of a soul.
But what I find more interesting in regards to souls is the quote in godblight that mentions that mortarion might be safed
Just a speculation, but in the novel, the Infinite and The Divine there Exodite farseer makes an appearance and uses psychic ability to directly talk to Trazyn. I however do not know how was this communication done. Another weird instance could be Necrons hallucinating or acting rather unaturaly considering their mechanical bodies. For example, winking, yawning, screaming in terror and mentioned hallucinating.
Given how time 'works' in the Warp, couldn't you say that their souls either never existed, or they 'exist/have always existed/always will exist?'
thats cool
Could there be a thing or place between soul and no soul? Soul residue perhaps? That something may remain, something that if given time, could one day reform into a soul of its own? Warp related phenomena is weird like that.
Could you do a theory about Clone Fulgrim?
Yes, that would be cool, I don't think there is much lore on clone Fulgrim other than Fabius did a swop with the collector!
9:03 The eldar pretty much say that almost all souls experience some sort of hell if they go back into the warp, since they are seen as the playthings of demons.
The Doylist explanation I read out of that is that GW has not decided if 'soulless Necrons y/n' is on net useful to driving stakes and interest.
The soul cannot be destroyed but it can be trapped or altered in such a way that it cannot escape.
This sounds dangerously close to the Nobody debates on kingdom hearts
So for somebody that's just getting into all of this y'all think the mechanicum would take interest in necrons?
Since they see the purity in replacing decayed flawed flesh for pure mechanics.
Or with what they went through with bio-transference and some were stripped of their individuality. It feels like they would enjoy having that kind of power.
Boy do I have a game to recommend for you if you want to see that idea explored
‘Mechanicus’ is a fun game where some mechanicum personnel attempt to investigate a Necron tomb world over many rounds
Well we know from Bile's primarch cloning that you can create a functioning being with independent thought, personality, and skill regardless of it missing that "spark". Affriel Strain even shows us the same thing, at least at first, prior to back luck setting in. Then there are the examples of broodlord and hive tyrants with personality, relatively independent thought and reasoning skills, and they are clearly still extensions of the hive mind without true souls. There are probably plenty of other examples but those off the top of my head come to mind. So the idea that Necrons that display aspirations, higher thought, personality, or independence has to mean there is some remnant of a soul I think has been in lore debunked enough. That doesn't mean that don't, only that this behavior doesn't require it.
"We can build you a body out of this wonderful material we found!"
"Yes. I'd like that."
"We are the best at working with it and our scientists know it inside and out."
"Sure. Sounds great. Can you make bodies our of it?"
"Uh... yeah... we... just said that?"
"Right, right. Carry on then."
"Hey! Are you eating the energy as we switch to the new material?"
"Why would I eat that? It's basically trash, right? Do I look like a raccoon or a possum?"
"A rac... what?"
"Nevermind. Look, here is the deal... would a janitor drink the blood from an operating table?"
"No! Gross!"
"And why do you think that is?"
"They don't know what that fluid is! They could be drinking liquid excrement for all they know!"
"Exactly."
"Did you just get bigger?"
"Nope. Must be a trick of the atmosphere or something. The scanners add a billion pounds, I've been told."
"Then how..."
"Look, kid. Necrodermis is your jam. If I knew how to eat the leftovers, I'd have been eating it already."
"That does make sense. What about the energy though?"
"Im sorry, the what?"
"You said you don't know how to eat the necrodermis when I asked about the energy."
"Right. I don't eat the necrodermis."
"You just did it again! Are you even larger?!"
"Let me be clear. I don't eat necrodermis, and I am offended that you would assume that I would."
"THE ENERGY. DO YOU EAT IT? YES OR NO!"
"Oh, hey, did you see that frog over there? I think its trying to eat the energy I stole from you!"
"Kill the frogs!"
"Very good. Follow me."
So question about Lucius, when he becomes "reborn" is he reborn with his wargear as well? Is it an immediate transformation? Or over time?
He is reborn with his wargear, yes. And the transformation is implied to take place over the course of anywhere from a few minutes to a few days, depending on the source.
@@40KTheories ok further question; if living or....debatable alive creatures can be turned into Lucius, and so can xenos, as well as other sexes, then is there a limit to how big/small of a thing he can transform?
Like if a sentient and AI controlled titan killed him and felt the electronic equivalent of pride then would the titan shrink and transform into lucius? Or if a Necron scarab was allowed to eat him from within for hours until he died would the scarab (if capable of feeling pride) grow into lucius?
Loophole: send Lucius into the immaterial, get the chaos gods pussed at him until they kill him personally, chaos God transforms into Lucius, repeat x3, chaos gods defeated.
I have a hypothesis that Necrons are the originators of Tau in order to eventually rewrite their brain-patterns with Necron minds when Tau population is big enough. This would let Necrons regain (steal) mortal bodies and souls.
Both Necrontyr and Tau seem quite similar: gaunt grey humanoids with little presence in the Warp.
and the physical differences can easy be by lack of complete genes from necrons and or mutations
@@NexionSE the appearence of ethereals could be Eldars messing with this plan, or just another stage in Necron plan to increase the population and unify tau for easier transference. And some chaos could make small differences even in tau
The only thing that is truly souless is a GW legal team
Yes
Its difficult as most authors that even touch the subject of souls have their own ideas of it. In the Infinite and Divine, they don't have souls, yet they shouldn't be able to be influenced by things like blanks, yet they also have pariahs which clearly are in possession of something that has the same function of a soul
Werent pariahs basically captured humans that went to a crude version of biotransferance?
@@bloodfartmoon2765 yes but also the fact that they exist proves that biotransferance isn't strictly a complete destruction of the soul
Delta variant is out at large yet we still are positive about the future
Imagine the Novokh and Nihilakh dynasty completely corrupted by Mortarion's curse, the Ferric Blight, and converted to Nurgle!
What stops them from conquering and bribing all the other Necrons?
Personally I liked it more when the Necrons where depicted as soulless automatons, like a genocidal AI after the deal with the C’tan. Same with the undead being just the undead without the tomb kings in fantasy.
I really don’t like that whole Egyptian dynasty vibe both 40k and fantasy started. That soulless, mindless advance and threat of both was just awesome.
Same. The Oldcrons had a creepy eldritch vibe about them, though I do understand why they made the change, since the Tyranids already filled the niche for 'unstoppable alien menace that cannot be bargained or reasoned with that wants to eradicate all life', kind of deal, so I can understand the reason for not having two races fill the same niche.
We have to make a case what does soul really do in WH40k, cause let's say is it like part of your mind? result of existance of Warp? what is its function, what happens to it, like in Supernatural you can loose a soul and live but you find yourself empty and detached, in other verses it can be simply source of power , in others it is very think that defines you like in Dark Souls; do you have humanity or Lord Soul or Profaned Flame soul,
It makes more sense that the Necrontyr were not completely stupid. Meaning they did try to maintain their consciousness and therefore at least part of their soul. But the biggest clue that some Necron's have some type of soul. Is that Orikan the Diviner did achieve apotheosis for a short time. All types of apotheosis are Warped based abilities and can only be achieved if one has a soul or at least the best approximation of a soul.
What if their soul is like their code?
With regards to the War in Heaven, I thought that while the necrontyr _were_ highly advanced, the Old Ones' technology was more advanced still. Or is that something that has been retconned?
It's not the most prestigious source, but this subject is brought up in Dawn of War Soulstorm. After conquering the Necron stronghold as the Dark Eldar it states that the Necrons do have souls. The DE can't enjoy fighting them because their souls are too withered for Necrons to experience true pain.
Doesn’t Farsight have a Necron blade that regenerates the body or soul?
Farsight has a sword of unknown alien origin (as in it hasn't been officially confirmed as to what race created it) that takes the lifespan of those it kills and adds it to that of the wielder.
The real question is if the Emperor's body can be rebuilt completely out of cyber dongs.
I miss TTS, RIP Kitten!
Imagine they take his videos out because of the start sequence
What if Vulkan led the Imperium after the War of the Beast?
What happened to Necrontyr gingers?
I would argue that Lokhust Destroyers do not have Souls. I mean they lack feet of any kind...
I'll see myself out.
lol!
Alternatively, as we progress though the editions we notice the truth being more and more obfuscated, like a multi millenia game of telephone.
Ate the corpses became ate the life energy became ate the soul.
can't they regrow their souls like some titans come to have souls ( ?machine spirits? ) of their own ?
The Dukary doctor's can restore a dead eldar with a single cell or almoust no DNA making a perfect replica of the body, has more claim to the soul them even a god.
Speaking of Lucious, someone call Vegeta.
We could use his forced spirit fission tech on him.
Wait. Soulless like a Sister of Silence or Soulless like a Games Workshop Executive?
The Deceiver was a C'Tan huh? I thought he was a Nord
Can Ai develop souls over time.
When they begin to have emotions
Then a soul.
The necrons may have there memories locked inside those robotic bodies. There soul is gone but something new may come.
So are the old ones the lizard men?
Are the Necrons even the same beings as the Necronteir? Are they just ai with programs containing a duplicate of the minds of the necrontier?
Necrons are not " soulless" in that sense, part of their spirits was consumed, but they still have a consciousness and all that, so they can be afraid and all that .Plus that the dark eldar in soulstorm said that necrons souls are sour, implying that the soul is there, but consumed and wasted, like a spoiled, expired bad apple.
I swear Lucius is the most annoying prick to ever bend the rules. According to the lore he was reborn through a manufactorum worker who was proud to create landmines for the ongoing wars, which is just utter BS. But as a necron player - I`m also very unhappy with the Phasing Sword situation, as that also sounds kinda BS and broken.
On terms of souls - well, if a lack of a soul is what kills things, Blanks are also not exactly soulless - wouldn`t they rather have an anti-soul? Kinda like anti-matter, but for souls?
And the argument about feelings proving an existance of a soul kinda falls flat.
AI would be capable of simulating emotions, and necron tech is so advanced that in cases it can be confused for magic. What is to say that more advanced chassis don`t simply simulate a full suite of pre-biotransferrance personality, emotions and all? At that point - a necron lord could speak of souls, simply because the super-advanced engrams in them are simulating it to a high degree, and the viruses (both flayer and destroyer) act to corrupt these engrams. I would imagine that having your core programs corrupted and twisted, would "feel" soul-shredding to an AI... maybe...
Edit: Also, glad to have you back, Remleiz. :)
I do want to point out that I didn't say that feelings prove the existence of a soul, only that some view the two as being synonymous ;)
@@40KTheories that one was referring to some comments I`ve heard/seen regarding it, where it`s stated as a hard fact - feelings=soul.
Probably should have prefaced that point with it, but I feel it`s a valid point for this topic.
Wasn't there a necron that possessed by a deamon
There was a tomb world that was corrupted by Chaos yes, but Chaos can also corrupt soulless objects/entities. Even Blanks can be corrupted, as shown in the novel Nemesis.
In this video I do also mention the Necron that served as the vessel of Lucius' rebirth.
@@40KTheories blanks? but how?
@@praise_kek340 presumably a plot hole or oversight written in so the setting maintains that grim dark mood, remember, it isn't grim dark if something could be perceived as positive or uncorruptible
Basically the result of a long ritual by Erebus. Nemesis explains it in detail
But what about the lords? They seem to have personalities?
Very True, Lords and Crypteks seem to have a remanence of a soul
What if the "-tyr" in "necrontyr" means "soul"?
Didn't you already do this?
It's an update and remaster, as stated in the video description (correcting a couple of errors and adding new information)
Necrons originate from Faythe"Sylvaneth Dryads & Spriggans*so they are Nature
Terminator..s... Terminators.
My head cannon is that the necron souls have coleleced into to the souls possessed by the higher ups
Here’s a better question, are the necrontyr and humanity related.
There may be a difference between a soul and a psyche in the setting. Afterall blanks have a psyche despite being soulless.
The Soul of the Necrons are stored in the Dark Cells (Balls)
All Tomorrows all over this beesch
I think its pretty clear necrons dont have souls with Orikan and Trazyn straight up saying they dont have souls and feel hollow
Also do not confuse soul with the capapility to be sentient/sapient as we have seen things that do not have souls be sentient multiple times such as a Canoptek scarab being happy when it sees Orikan and the Men of iron as a whole you could also throw Titans into that mix especially the Castigator titan
Necrons have highly advanced AI constructs made from their once organic brains thats what Biotransferance did (besides giving them New bodies) just imagine GLaDOS from portal but more advanced
Again I want to point out that I didn't say that feelings prove the existence of a soul, only that _some_ view the two as being synonymous ;)
@@40KTheories i know its just that i saw some comments atributing emotions and sentience to souls so i wanted to give my 2 cents on the matter thanks for the great content mate
Here's the thing though:
How would Orikan or Trazyn even know wether or not they had a soul. The Necrons never were a psychic species, so they were never able to actually deal with the subject, as they had no way to perceive souls (an ability only psychers and warp-beings have).
So I wouldn't take their word for it.
@@draochvar9646 the fact that both of them feel an emptiness inside them (even the silent King feels it) and the fact that Orikan says that he can only feels what its like to have a soul again when he enters his energy form (this happens at towards the end of the infinite and the divine)
Maybe the term "soul" is incorrect here. Perhaps the Necrons use the term soul like we would operating system for a computer, like Windows 10 being the soul of the computer I'm writing this comment on.
This also means that if a Hemlock's weapons aren't 100% Warp based, then they could have an EMP like effect on the Necrons.