I’d also like to point out that, because Ikaris died flying into the sun, either A) he heard the story and thought “yeah that sounds nice”, or B) Sprite predicted in a story “yeah this is absolutely something that drama queen would do” and was spot on
I just find it crazy because outside of the name there’s nothing in common beyond name. The story is way more about Daedalus then Icarus- yet why would an Eternal add a father figure ?
Actually this confusion is from the comics. When Jack Kirby made the Eternals, the idea was for the Eternal take place in separate continuity, however due to editoral, they were included in the main universe, so was establish they share similar names of the gods, very similar to Peter and Miles or Thor and Jane Foster.
I thought they said that the eternals handle the gods duties on earth and basically add lore to them while the gods themselves are doing their own thing
@@st4ne4rmthevill63 no his name is Odinson, Thor is a title. He's called Thor in the MCU as if it's his given name because he's the only Thor that has been except Jane Foster.
@@jasonninja55 His first name is Thor. His last name is Odinson. Bcz he is the son of Odin. Just as Odin is 'Odin Borson' bcz he is the son of Bor. Idc about that new bs Marvel tried that failed. There must always be a Thor sounds dumb af & only people who aren't actual Thor fans subscribe to that mess.
In the comics, Thena was originally named Azura, but changed her name after meeting Athena. Obviously this can’t really be said to have happened in the MCU since Thena’s presumably been called Thena long before she ever came to Earth.
Hey hopping on this comment bc u bring up a point I feel explains this after seeing how the gods act in love and thunder! From my understanding, a lot of gods in marvel (and idk if this is canon to MCU but I feel like I remember something about this in love and thunder. Don't quote me lol) are born by people's beliefs in their myth. My thought is that while the eternals inspired stories about the gods and references for what they looked like, etc. that it doesn't translate to the myths. For example, those people were believing in myths about Athena, something they envisioned from an old concept of Thena, and Athena the goddess was born.
@@heavenlyrhyme2539- in the comics the gods are extradimensional beings like the Asgardians. Olympus is reached through a portal on Mount Olympus just as Asgard is reached via the rainbow bridge. Similar portals exist to Heliopolis (Egyptian pantheon) and other divine realms. Because Earth is one of the axes of the universe many of these entities end up coming to Earth in particular. Odin was around in caveman times. And Cthon from whom Scarlet Witch gained her chaos magic is even older. Like Gaea he was around when the Earth was formed. As for the Eternals, in the comics they and the Deviants are human. When the Celestials visit a planet they uplift one of the dominant species and create three separate lineages of this species: a perfect unchanging Eternal race, an unstable shapeshifting Deviant race, and in the case of Earth the human race that appears unremarkable but has the capacity to surpass the other two over time (ie by evolving into superhumans and mutants). From time to time the Celestials return to test their creations and correct any imbalances in the system (hence them destroying most of the Deviants on one of their visits to Earth to prevent them from dominating the whole planet). The reasons for them doing this are beyond the capacity for humans to comprehend. If the system becomes too out of balance they sterilise the entire planet and start again. And even the actual gods aren't powerful enough to intervene usually when this happens. According to one Marvel continuity, the Celestials create the three races as an immune system to defend their seed inside the planet. At first the Eternals and Deviants form the immune system, but as the seed develops and reaches its time to be born the third race reaches maturity and develops superhuman abilities to defend the planet until the new Celestial is fully grown and ready to be born. Galactus in this interpretation of events exists to prevent the Celestials from overpopulating the multiverse. When he devours a world he's actually draining the life from the Celestial seed so it will never be born. The Skrull homeworld was destroyed by Galactus and had also been visited by the Celestials. In the case of the Skrulls, though, their Deviants outbred the baseline Skrulls and killed their Eternals, hence why all Skrulls are shaoeshifters.
My head canon is that pre-Eternals there was already an Athena, whose name might’ve inspired the naming of Thena. Then Thena and her heroics on Earth helped to spread the worship of Athena by the greeks.
The comics explained it with having thena taking her name from Athena as part of a deal with the Greek gods, her old name was Azura I want to add that the comics are infinitely better than that movie and trying Neil gaiman's story on it would make up with that disappointing mess the MCU did
@@essencemcbaka8484existed for eons out there in the Universe. Not on Earth. Theyve only been to Earth once and thats this film. Their past visions are irrelevant
Another option is that Zeus named his child after the Eternal, knowing that Athena would also become a legendary warrior. The same could be the case for Mercury. It's a bit of a mess, but there are still nice ways that they can clean it up.
Love and Thunder doesn’t make much sense at all. In Thor 2 Odin’s all “we’re not gods! We’re born, we live, we die!” Then L&T comes around and it’s like “lol we’re totally gods now.”
the writers of thor 2 and thor lgbt are different writers, thor lgbt has been possessed by the ridiculous spirit of today's disney and i don't consider it canon
There's a fairly simple explanation though? Eternals do their feats, feats are witnessed by mortals, liken them to gods, eventually their feats become myths, mortals pass down myths to next generation, myths get muddled up, continued worship and belief gives power to the pantheons of gods, gods become real.
Some stuff was thena, some stuff was minerva. Problem solved. Like when you’re talking to your wife and she brings up “Sarah” and you ask how her kid is and your wife says “not that sarah, the one with glasses” or whatever. And you have to be like “wait theres two sarahs? Since when?” And she says that there has always been two Sarah’s
@@dibsdibs3495 it's realistic. human history is still being found and interpreted to this day. a lot of it was from oral history, and most don't know the origins of stories told. it would make sense that a huge game of chinese whisper would merge two beings' histories together bc they were similar.
By the way, you could also look at actual historical myths from our reality to explain this. There is a LOT of syncretism and local deties being mashed up and separated, like how there's Selene, Diana and Artemis who are moon goddesses. It's entirely possible that Minerva was worshipped as a separate deity and then syncretized with Thena.
The way I see it is that back then there was no phone/internet so tales are passed down through word of mouth, so when there’s a tale describing someone with similar characteristic then it’s easy for people to assume they’re the same person
Is it? iirc the externals form a pact with the Greek gods to stand in their place on earth. I’m pretty sure thena was the one to suggest the pact after realising how similar her Zeurus (her father) and Zeus are to one another.
Not a thing in the comics. They completely rewrote all of the lore around the Eternals to the point that I ask why even name it the Eternals. The only thing they got correct was the name of characters everything else was idiot writers trying to reinvent the wheel.
Could be a case of mistaken identity. Thena and Minerva are running around in the universe at the same time getting consistently confused for one another
Kirby's Eternals was never intended by him to be part of the main Marvel continuity so there wouldn't have been these conflicts with the "Marvel Gods" who had predated the Eternals already by a few decades. He was pushed by editorial to include Marvel characters like The Hulk to try and boost poor sales, so along with that merging came all the awkward conflicts we have today. At the very least it also helped to give us the Gaiman reboot run which is worth a read.
*There’s bound to be continuity issues* with something as big as the MCU… and at some point they’ll likely reboot - - when they realise that people have to watch 3,000 forgettable Disney+ shows and 700 movies to understand their next team up.
that's very true. they created the ultimates comics at the start of this century to provide an easier starting point for new readers. they'll do it again with films.
This isn’t entirely inexplicable. It is possible the Eternals got their names from Gods who were worshipped by early humans. Maybe they were thought to be one and the same by the mortals.
If you want a neat and tidy comic book explanation - Marvel has cosmic archetypes that come from Couldn't-Be-Shouldn't-Be (formerly the 4th Multiverse), which basically means that many characters can be variations of the Archetypes. If you're curious, read Defenders: There Are No Rules.
A lot of things don't make sense after the Eternals lost the war against the Planet of the Copyright Lawyers. This is the reality we live in, folks.
5 днів тому+4
Kirby never intended for the Eternals to exist in the Marvel universe. So these problems also arose in the comics when Marvel absorbed them anyway. They just don't fit.
Yes this is probably one of my biggest problems with the movie. That and that thanos plan was like just the thing that the celestials an so the eternals would have been preocupied to stop.
Could it be that the gods are created (come into being) by the veneration of humans (or living beings in the case of the MCU). If so, there would be an Athena in the universe that is just taking credit for whatever Thena did 😅
That was the whole point of the Eternals. Over the millennia names twist and change. Zuras leader of the Eternals in the comic books (not featured in the movie) became Zeus. Ikaris became Icarus, Thena became Athena. Makkari not only became Mercury but also changed genders. Ajak became Ajax and also gender swapped, and Phastos became Hephaestus. So why are there two Zeus, two Athenas? Well, it's quite possible that the Greek and Roman Gods took the Eternal's names or the Eternals were simply mistaken for the Gods or the other way around. According to Marvel comics the Eternals are one million years old, while Gods like Odin's Grandfather Buri Father of Bor are a little younger. Even Zeus is said to be around 790,000 years old.
Maybe the eternals thought they made them up not knowing the real ones were out there considering their memories were wiped each time it would make sense
It's not really that big of deal. They have similar names (Thena and Athena) so people back then could have assumed they were the same. Could be due to them thinking they were shape shifting or even just different accents. It still applies to if the Athena figure is know as Minerva. Why? Because I'm our own history Athena went from being know as Athena to Minerva.
I'm 54 and I've been reading comics for a long time...nothing recent. One thing I've noticed about the heroes/villains in EVERY COMIC MOVIE EVER MADE was how SERIOUSLY people take the storyline. It's very intriguing....
read the comics so it would make sense to you. if you don’t want to, basically you have eternals, olympians, asgardians and other pantheons. Much like venus is to aphrodite, athena is to thena. For the stories, much like how every civilization has a story of a great flood, twas so long ago that nobody knows whose who, and who did what.
That is because the writers copied stuff from the Bible and Sumerian motifs. He jumbled everything up.. he also got the titans, the giants....the 3 mile high giants from Enoch.
I loved werewolf by night, I loved moon knight, if they can combine the feel of both for the midnight suns it will be fantastic, especially if they watch this 😉
I read one of the Eternals omnibuses with stories from the last 5 years in it. One of the Eternals states that something to the effect of, “The mortals worship us as gods and it’s starting to irritate the gods.” So yes, these kinds of issues are acknowledged in-universe.
I mean, it's no different than any other instance someone accidentally gets credit for another's work. Like whenever an artist is wrongfully credited for a comic they didn't do but it either goes unnoticed, or is just never fixed in reprints.
It doesn't have to be that. People aren't seeing those "gods" every day so they wouldn't know who Athena was. People describe her as beautiful, Powerful, and intelligent. And that can get both so throughout history, people thought it was the same person so they gave her the same name.
Hear me out… Couldn’t both Athena and Thena exist in this universe? And because their names and overall vibe are so similar everyone believes they are the same person. I can imagine this situation would be incredibly irritating for both parties involved…
Sure, two people can have the same name. But the same name and the same powers? And it is not one, it is a whole group of same name/same powers people. At that point is isn't just a coincidence.
We need to realize that the solid thorough continuity of the infinity saga was a 1 time deal. Now as the MCU begins to expand and expand situations like this are going to become more and more common. The marvel universe is amazingly expansive and has characters based on characters based on characters based on real life figures. As we reach phas 5,6,7,8,9,10 etc were going to have to increasingly suspend disbelief to enjoy these movies.
Rightfully people points out this is already a thing from the comics. But of course this is already a fundamental part of all myths and legends. There are several different sources, legendariums, hagiographics, four different gospel at least and different skalds drawing inspirations from different sagas. There's not only one Odin. There's not only one Hercules (Or Heracles). There's not only one Amatsu-Mikaboshi. There's not even only one Jesus. I do not say that these different versions are not the same. But the way we read, interpret, perform, sings songs about or pray to these entities underline that they are different versions in one way or another.
The Eternals were often mistaken for the gods, but the gods still existed. Both Thena and Athena exist. Why are their names similar? Because they are. Don't worry about it.
There are two peters in the mcu but no one freaks out about spiderman being at knowhere. It's simple. There is Thena and Athena. They have similar names and get mistaken. The eternals know of other deities but others they've never met. It appears that Odin took control of misgard after the ice giants invasion and the other dieties appeared to dip. Wakanda was isolationist and kept their deity. Same with Talocan and the dimension in China as seen in Shangchi chi. Egyptian deities hang around via avatars escaping the fury of Odin. Eternals just chill on earth waiting to leave their shift of killing deviants
Its not really a issue you dont see in real life. From what i can see you cant really ever identify mythological characters properly. They always have couple of names to call them that sometimes sound similar to others. Which those others could just be themself. So if anything having 2 Athena's makes it way more realistic
it doesn't make sense if you are not paying attention. They never say those gods don't exist they say some of her exploits are accredited to the Goddess Athena not that there is no Goddess Athena who may have been having exploits of her own. Also the ancients tended to see most gods a analogues. They thought many gods were actually the same Gods known by different names in other cultures
The Eternal movie is not perfect but it’s ok far from comic accurate but I like how they portrayed Ajak as this motherly figure in the Eternal’s movie but I don’t like how they killed her off so quick in the movie her death was really unnecessary and I really liked her she was my favourite character in the movie I just wish we could have seen more of her and I love how she is played by the beautifully stunning Selena Hayek
This blows my mind because eternals came out a year before Thor 4. It’s the same thing with WandaVision and the Doctor Strange two movie. I don’t have the writers in the same room so it’s not cohesive. I don’t even want to get started on the Loki show, how that ruined everything.
Well, in this sense, they are following how it is in the comic books. In the comic books, all pantheons exist. And the Eternals also exist. This was reconciled by just saying that sometimes they would get mistaken for each other.
I can’t believe I watched this whole thing. It was so immersive and engaging. I personally felt like I watched a full fledged documentary and now I would never ever have to spend money on it even if it was still available. This video literally saved me $6,000
My head canon is that Minerva like other gods didn’t really help her worshipers but in order to gain more worshipers claimed the feats of thena changed the name a bit and boom athena
Eternals has a deeper story that -like the Earth which is half visible, half not visible- is not directly seen. Each Eternal represents a part of being a human. If you see it, the movie makes perfect sense
This is probably one of the few things I didn't like about the direction of the Eternals, specifically in Thena's case. The relationship between the Gods and the Eternals is that the Eternals get mistaken for being actual gods due to their direct involvement with humanity. The movie made it seem like Thena was actually Athena when that's not the case.
As messy as the multiverse in the MCU sometimes is, setting Eternals in an alternate universe and making Thena that universe's version of the Minerva from Love & Thunder would've probably made more sense
They didn't think it through with the writing another issue with phase 4 since we seen that those Gods actually exist. If Zeus exist then the other greek pantheon also exists.
This is explained in the comics, and I can't believe I scrolled through a bunch of comments trying to explain this without actually hitting on the official one There's even a comic that showcases a meeting between Zuras and Zeus detailing how the Eternals could operate on Earth and perpetuate the already established myths between their similar parallel members
Actual is does make some sense. In Thor love and thunder we do see two celestial there meaning that they are aware of the Greek gods existence. We also learned that the eternals are not real, their memories are wiped every time their mission is complete so it could be take one could be inspired by the other. It similar to the situation with two mandrins like from iron man 3 and Shang chi
It's really not that complex compared to real life, in real mythology there is a story about Thor and Loki being tricked by another guy named Loki. His name was Útgarða-Loki.
I just always thought of the Roman and Greek sets as different Gods. Just because one was inspired by the other, it doesn't mean it's just one goddess and not two different ones.
Simple answer......they both are different in the mcu Done and Dusted..... But when you hate/love something, you find more reasons to hate/love it and make others hate/love it as well
So the way Thor L&T presents gods in the universe is that gods exist when people believe in them, Santa clause style. So technically Thena the eternal is the basis of the stories of Athena, but the Greek/Roman people don’t believe in Thena, they believe in Athena, which is why both exist in the MCU
I don’t see how the Athena one doesn’t make sense. Wouldn’t it make sense if human written mythology was wildly inaccurate? Like, would be rather that all the myths about Thor and Loki that are absurd or out of character just don’t exist in the MCU, do exist and are true, or do exist, and just aren’t accurate, because they are folklore passed by word of mouth other thousands of years? With that in mind, ‘Athena’ could be a total fiction, could be Minerva being mistaken for Thena, a mix of the two people, a 90/10 split. Regardless, we should be taking for granted that human myth is inaccurate. If you look at Greek depictions of, say Dionysus, it’s not like they’re even consistent within themselves. Who he is and what he looked like changes depending on the author.
![Badcomedian - Дивергент [удаленный обзор]](/img/n.gif)
I’d also like to point out that, because Ikaris died flying into the sun, either A) he heard the story and thought “yeah that sounds nice”, or B) Sprite predicted in a story “yeah this is absolutely something that drama queen would do” and was spot on
B is very Sprite tho
I’m choosing to believe B
I just find it crazy because outside of the name there’s nothing in common beyond name. The story is way more about Daedalus then Icarus- yet why would an Eternal add a father figure ?
@@solvemproblerstudios5889The idea is that the story changes minutely each time it gets passed along, like fairytales.
what if I reach and say Sprite secretly was fed some knowledge from the future /j
Actually this confusion is from the comics. When Jack Kirby made the Eternals, the idea was for the Eternal take place in separate continuity, however due to editoral, they were included in the main universe, so was establish they share similar names of the gods, very similar to Peter and Miles or Thor and Jane Foster.
Thor is his birth name. Not a title.
I thought they said that the eternals handle the gods duties on earth and basically add lore to them while the gods themselves are doing their own thing
@@st4ne4rmthevill63 no his name is Odinson, Thor is a title. He's called Thor in the MCU as if it's his given name because he's the only Thor that has been except Jane Foster.
@@jasonninja55 His first name is Thor. His last name is Odinson. Bcz he is the son of Odin. Just as Odin is 'Odin Borson' bcz he is the son of Bor. Idc about that new bs Marvel tried that failed. There must always be a Thor sounds dumb af & only people who aren't actual Thor fans subscribe to that mess.
@@st4ne4rmthevill63 in the comics is a guy named Donald Blake who takes up the mantle as thor but they kinda don’t do that anymore
In the comics, Thena was originally named Azura, but changed her name after meeting Athena. Obviously this can’t really be said to have happened in the MCU since Thena’s presumably been called Thena long before she ever came to Earth.
Hey hopping on this comment bc u bring up a point I feel explains this after seeing how the gods act in love and thunder! From my understanding, a lot of gods in marvel (and idk if this is canon to MCU but I feel like I remember something about this in love and thunder. Don't quote me lol) are born by people's beliefs in their myth. My thought is that while the eternals inspired stories about the gods and references for what they looked like, etc. that it doesn't translate to the myths. For example, those people were believing in myths about Athena, something they envisioned from an old concept of Thena, and Athena the goddess was born.
@@heavenlyrhyme2539- in the comics the gods are extradimensional beings like the Asgardians. Olympus is reached through a portal on Mount Olympus just as Asgard is reached via the rainbow bridge. Similar portals exist to Heliopolis (Egyptian pantheon) and other divine realms. Because Earth is one of the axes of the universe many of these entities end up coming to Earth in particular. Odin was around in caveman times. And Cthon from whom Scarlet Witch gained her chaos magic is even older. Like Gaea he was around when the Earth was formed.
As for the Eternals, in the comics they and the Deviants are human. When the Celestials visit a planet they uplift one of the dominant species and create three separate lineages of this species: a perfect unchanging Eternal race, an unstable shapeshifting Deviant race, and in the case of Earth the human race that appears unremarkable but has the capacity to surpass the other two over time (ie by evolving into superhumans and mutants). From time to time the Celestials return to test their creations and correct any imbalances in the system (hence them destroying most of the Deviants on one of their visits to Earth to prevent them from dominating the whole planet). The reasons for them doing this are beyond the capacity for humans to comprehend. If the system becomes too out of balance they sterilise the entire planet and start again. And even the actual gods aren't powerful enough to intervene usually when this happens.
According to one Marvel continuity, the Celestials create the three races as an immune system to defend their seed inside the planet. At first the Eternals and Deviants form the immune system, but as the seed develops and reaches its time to be born the third race reaches maturity and develops superhuman abilities to defend the planet until the new Celestial is fully grown and ready to be born.
Galactus in this interpretation of events exists to prevent the Celestials from overpopulating the multiverse. When he devours a world he's actually draining the life from the Celestial seed so it will never be born.
The Skrull homeworld was destroyed by Galactus and had also been visited by the Celestials. In the case of the Skrulls, though, their Deviants outbred the baseline Skrulls and killed their Eternals, hence why all Skrulls are shaoeshifters.
My head canon is that pre-Eternals there was already an Athena, whose name might’ve inspired the naming of Thena. Then Thena and her heroics on Earth helped to spread the worship of Athena by the greeks.
That wouldn’t work though because the eternal shave existed for eons being created over and over, because she already had visions of past worlds.
The comics explained it with having thena taking her name from Athena as part of a deal with the Greek gods, her old name was Azura
I want to add that the comics are infinitely better than that movie and trying Neil gaiman's story on it would make up with that disappointing mess the MCU did
Yeah i assumed the Greek gods were there before the Eternals showed up.
@@essencemcbaka8484existed for eons out there in the Universe. Not on Earth.
Theyve only been to Earth once and thats this film. Their past visions are irrelevant
No
If you wanna get freakier, there’s a character in Captain Marvel called Minn-Erva played by an Eternal.
Oh yeah, she played two roles in the MCU. How tf...
don't count love and thunder as a real movie
Another option is that Zeus named his child after the Eternal, knowing that Athena would also become a legendary warrior. The same could be the case for Mercury. It's a bit of a mess, but there are still nice ways that they can clean it up.
That's what happened in the comics.
@@solvseus What? In the comics, Thena the Eternal took the name from Greek goddess Athena.
Love and Thunder doesn’t make much sense at all. In Thor 2 Odin’s all “we’re not gods! We’re born, we live, we die!” Then L&T comes around and it’s like “lol we’re totally gods now.”
If they not killed they lived up until 5000 years.
They didn't know what they were doing early on.
they are basically gods ..for humans for sure ...odin just humble them down because loki was out of rails
They for 5000 years if not killed.
the writers of thor 2 and thor lgbt are different writers, thor lgbt has been possessed by the ridiculous spirit of today's disney and i don't consider it canon
Technically they would be using the Roman version of Hercules though. Since in Greece he's actually named Herakles.
In comics its Hercules as he wanted to avoid Hera
Yet Dwayne Johnson Hercules is based on the Greek's Herakles yet the title is of a Roman equivent. Hollywood confusion.
@@univyashollywoodtakes the most popular one.. ez.
honey you mean HUNKules
@@SirsasthNigam. ironic. In the myth, he's called Heracles to appease Hera (it doesn't work)
There's a fairly simple explanation though?
Eternals do their feats, feats are witnessed by mortals, liken them to gods, eventually their feats become myths, mortals pass down myths to next generation, myths get muddled up, continued worship and belief gives power to the pantheons of gods, gods become real.
Some stuff was thena, some stuff was minerva. Problem solved.
Like when you’re talking to your wife and she brings up “Sarah” and you ask how her kid is and your wife says “not that sarah, the one with glasses” or whatever. And you have to be like “wait theres two sarahs? Since when?” And she says that there has always been two Sarah’s
Why is this so relatable and I don't even have a wife?
Kind of a cheap way out that probably wasn’t the intention
@@dibsdibs3495 it's realistic. human history is still being found and interpreted to this day. a lot of it was from oral history, and most don't know the origins of stories told. it would make sense that a huge game of chinese whisper would merge two beings' histories together bc they were similar.
That's.... oddly specific but can't say you're wrong
🤣🤣🤣 relatable
By the way, you could also look at actual historical myths from our reality to explain this. There is a LOT of syncretism and local deties being mashed up and separated, like how there's Selene, Diana and Artemis who are moon goddesses. It's entirely possible that Minerva was worshipped as a separate deity and then syncretized with Thena.
Shh, that's too smart for someone like Nando to understand.
The way I see it is that back then there was no phone/internet so tales are passed down through word of mouth, so when there’s a tale describing someone with similar characteristic then it’s easy for people to assume they’re the same person
This is a problem in the comics, too. Don't worry too much about two super powered people having the same name.
Is it? iirc the externals form a pact with the Greek gods to stand in their place on earth. I’m pretty sure thena was the one to suggest the pact after realising how similar her Zeurus (her father) and Zeus are to one another.
Not a thing in the comics. They completely rewrote all of the lore around the Eternals to the point that I ask why even name it the Eternals. The only thing they got correct was the name of characters everything else was idiot writers trying to reinvent the wheel.
That sounds more like a Love and Thunder problem than an Eternals problem.
Eternals Stan, don’t @ me
Could be a case of mistaken identity. Thena and Minerva are running around in the universe at the same time getting consistently confused for one another
The comics explained it with having thena taking her name from Athena as part of a deal with the Greek gods, her old name was Azura
Kirby's Eternals was never intended by him to be part of the main Marvel continuity so there wouldn't have been these conflicts with the "Marvel Gods" who had predated the Eternals already by a few decades. He was pushed by editorial to include Marvel characters like The Hulk to try and boost poor sales, so along with that merging came all the awkward conflicts we have today.
At the very least it also helped to give us the Gaiman reboot run which is worth a read.
I love how the Eternals are named after famous gods and people from history it’s so amazing
My favourite characters in the Eternals movie are Druig, Gilgamesh, Ajak and Thena I just love these characters in the movie and comics
*There’s bound to be continuity issues* with something as big as the MCU… and at some point they’ll likely reboot - - when they realise that people have to watch 3,000 forgettable Disney+ shows and 700 movies to understand their next team up.
that's very true. they created the ultimates comics at the start of this century to provide an easier starting point for new readers. they'll do it again with films.
@@amorfatikhb
And they already erased that one too lol
The MCU isn't that big. It isn't even the full Marvel Universe. Both the Earth and Space are missing a ton of key elements that make up the universe.
Athena was goddess of knowledge and wisdom....thats why oddeyses was her favorite because he was clever and used his intelligence
This isn’t entirely inexplicable. It is possible the Eternals got their names from Gods who were worshipped by early humans. Maybe they were thought to be one and the same by the mortals.
Two sets of Gods, one Roman, one Greek
If you want a neat and tidy comic book explanation - Marvel has cosmic archetypes that come from Couldn't-Be-Shouldn't-Be (formerly the 4th Multiverse), which basically means that many characters can be variations of the Archetypes. If you're curious, read Defenders: There Are No Rules.
This is my biggest gripe with the MCU. When a universe tries to do too much, things start to conflict
Same with comics there Norse gods Egyptian gods and more
A lot of things don't make sense after the Eternals lost the war against the Planet of the Copyright Lawyers. This is the reality we live in, folks.
Kirby never intended for the Eternals to exist in the Marvel universe. So these problems also arose in the comics when Marvel absorbed them anyway.
They just don't fit.
Yes this is probably one of my biggest problems with the movie. That and that thanos plan was like just the thing that the celestials an so the eternals would have been preocupied to stop.
Yeah this is why you can’t do a grand universal solo movie without consulting with the other movies.
@@dibsdibs3495 Indeed, the movie would be a lot better if it wasn't on the MCU
@@HectorT52 yeah all the absurd throwaway lines about the rest of the mcu were so pointless. It’s pure SR pitch meeting content
Thanos is a Titan, very similar to the eternals creators
@@Crashryding Not at all, he is more similar to the eternals than the celestials.
Minerva was also the name of Gemma Chan's character in Captain Marvel.
Gemma Chan who played Sersi in Eternals
The salma heyak character still has a heavy accent after living on earth for thousands of years 😂
Could it be that the gods are created (come into being) by the veneration of humans (or living beings in the case of the MCU). If so, there would be an Athena in the universe that is just taking credit for whatever Thena did 😅
That was the whole point of the Eternals. Over the millennia names twist and change. Zuras leader of the Eternals in the comic books (not featured in the movie) became Zeus. Ikaris became Icarus, Thena became Athena. Makkari not only became Mercury but also changed genders. Ajak became Ajax and also gender swapped, and Phastos became Hephaestus.
So why are there two Zeus, two Athenas? Well, it's quite possible that the Greek and Roman Gods took the Eternal's names or the Eternals were simply mistaken for the Gods or the other way around. According to Marvel comics the Eternals are one million years old, while Gods like Odin's Grandfather Buri Father of Bor are a little younger. Even Zeus is said to be around 790,000 years old.
When Athena stole her name so Athena just goes by Minerva now
Maybe the eternals thought they made them up not knowing the real ones were out there considering their memories were wiped each time it would make sense
Except why would their abilities happen to be the same as the names they were making up?
Except in the Eternals movie they directly address this by referencing the fact that the goddess Athena and Thena are two different entities.
I never seen a comment section where everyone had paragraphs before.
We're all a bunch of "um actually"s.
@@solvseus 😂😂
Especially for a short
@@laykniTrue a very
It's not really that big of deal. They have similar names (Thena and Athena) so people back then could have assumed they were the same. Could be due to them thinking they were shape shifting or even just different accents. It still applies to if the Athena figure is know as Minerva. Why? Because I'm our own history Athena went from being know as Athena to Minerva.
I'm 54 and I've been reading comics for a long time...nothing recent. One thing I've noticed about the heroes/villains in EVERY COMIC MOVIE EVER MADE was how SERIOUSLY people take the storyline. It's very intriguing....
read the comics so it would make sense to you. if you don’t want to, basically you have eternals, olympians, asgardians and other pantheons. Much like venus is to aphrodite, athena is to thena. For the stories, much like how every civilization has a story of a great flood, twas so long ago that nobody knows whose who, and who did what.
Haha basically
The Roman gods and Greek gods did not "merge" until around the 2nd century BCE, so they started out as separate entities.
That is because the writers copied stuff from the Bible and Sumerian motifs. He jumbled everything up.. he also got the titans, the giants....the 3 mile high giants from Enoch.
It was explained. Athena does exist in the MCU. The Eternals are so powerful some of their adventures were credited to the actual gods.
As for that last point, everyone except for Heracles. They insist on naming him Hercules.
I loved werewolf by night, I loved moon knight, if they can combine the feel of both for the midnight suns it will be fantastic, especially if they watch this 😉
My only problem with Moon Knight was that Moon Knight was barely in the show.
Regardless, I love The Eternal
My fav MCU film post-Endgame
I read one of the Eternals omnibuses with stories from the last 5 years in it. One of the Eternals states that something to the effect of, “The mortals worship us as gods and it’s starting to irritate the gods.” So yes, these kinds of issues are acknowledged in-universe.
I mean, it's no different than any other instance someone accidentally gets credit for another's work. Like whenever an artist is wrongfully credited for a comic they didn't do but it either goes unnoticed, or is just never fixed in reprints.
It doesn't have to be that. People aren't seeing those "gods" every day so they wouldn't know who Athena was. People describe her as beautiful, Powerful, and intelligent. And that can get both so throughout history, people thought it was the same person so they gave her the same name.
Hear me out… Couldn’t both Athena and Thena exist in this universe? And because their names and overall vibe are so similar everyone believes they are the same person. I can imagine this situation would be incredibly irritating for both parties involved…
Sure, two people can have the same name. But the same name and the same powers? And it is not one, it is a whole group of same name/same powers people. At that point is isn't just a coincidence.
Man this movie was great,I don't know people didn't like it.
“They share names”
*2 completely different names*
Sorry man but you are wrong. Minerva is the roman equivalent but they are not the same gods. Greeks and romans worshipped two different religions
We need to realize that the solid thorough continuity of the infinity saga was a 1 time deal. Now as the MCU begins to expand and expand situations like this are going to become more and more common. The marvel universe is amazingly expansive and has characters based on characters based on characters based on real life figures. As we reach phas 5,6,7,8,9,10 etc were going to have to increasingly suspend disbelief to enjoy these movies.
The actress who played sersei also played min-nerva in captain marvel
Rightfully people points out this is already a thing from the comics.
But of course this is already a fundamental part of all myths and legends. There are several different sources, legendariums, hagiographics, four different gospel at least and different skalds drawing inspirations from different sagas.
There's not only one Odin. There's not only one Hercules (Or Heracles). There's not only one Amatsu-Mikaboshi. There's not even only one Jesus.
I do not say that these different versions are not the same. But the way we read, interpret, perform, sings songs about or pray to these entities underline that they are different versions in one way or another.
Such a lovely smile ...❤
Finally someone gets it. Most people just blame the concept of the multiverse and not the execution
The Eternals were often mistaken for the gods, but the gods still existed. Both Thena and Athena exist. Why are their names similar? Because they are. Don't worry about it.
"Why?"
"It's just the way it is. Don' worry 'bout it."
There are two peters in the mcu but no one freaks out about spiderman being at knowhere. It's simple. There is Thena and Athena. They have similar names and get mistaken. The eternals know of other deities but others they've never met. It appears that Odin took control of misgard after the ice giants invasion and the other dieties appeared to dip. Wakanda was isolationist and kept their deity. Same with Talocan and the dimension in China as seen in Shangchi chi. Egyptian deities hang around via avatars escaping the fury of Odin. Eternals just chill on earth waiting to leave their shift of killing deviants
Its not really a issue you dont see in real life. From what i can see you cant really ever identify mythological characters properly. They always have couple of names to call them that sometimes sound similar to others. Which those others could just be themself. So if anything having 2 Athena's makes it way more realistic
makin ones weapons came about in ULTRAViolet, starring Milla Jojowich. Her DNA sequence allowed her to make her weapons in her hand extended.
Phase 4 was a mess
That’s why Antman is called Spider-Man. Both are around at the same time and people are just getting confused. Lol 😂
Hercules is the Roman name for Herakles, so it's not all Greek
It’s all Greek to me
I loved that Greek Disney movie...but Bulfinch has a great book...
Tho TBH I've been looking Norse Mythos more lately. Ever since I was in my 20's...
This is why Comic book context MATTERS
it doesn't make sense if you are not paying attention. They never say those gods don't exist they say some of her exploits are accredited to the Goddess Athena not that there is no Goddess Athena who may have been having exploits of her own. Also the ancients tended to see most gods a analogues. They thought many gods were actually the same Gods known by different names in other cultures
There’s an endless amount of clearance mech if anyone’s interested at wal mart
I thought that Minerva was played by the girl from 13 Reasons Why, also Tony's daughter from the future.
Mesopotamia? then iraq lawyers should sue Marvel for playing an Asian guy as Assyrian Middle East mythology 😂😂
The Eternal movie is not perfect but it’s ok far from comic accurate but I like how they portrayed Ajak as this motherly figure in the Eternal’s movie but I don’t like how they killed her off so quick in the movie her death was really unnecessary and I really liked her she was my favourite character in the movie I just wish we could have seen more of her and I love how she is played by the beautifully stunning Selena Hayek
This blows my mind because eternals came out a year before Thor 4. It’s the same thing with WandaVision and the Doctor Strange two movie. I don’t have the writers in the same room so it’s not cohesive. I don’t even want to get started on the Loki show, how that ruined everything.
Well, in this sense, they are following how it is in the comic books. In the comic books, all pantheons exist. And the Eternals also exist. This was reconciled by just saying that sometimes they would get mistaken for each other.
I can’t believe I watched this whole thing. It was so immersive and engaging. I personally felt like I watched a full fledged documentary and now I would never ever have to spend money on it even if it was still available. This video literally saved me $6,000
"the nine realms" they already messed up in the first thor movie
Robb stark, Cersei, and John snow
The Eternals and Gods also coexist(due to an error) in the comic universe so I wouldnt give it too much thought actually
My head canon is that Minerva like other gods didn’t really help her worshipers but in order to gain more worshipers claimed the feats of thena changed the name a bit and boom athena
Eternals has a deeper story that -like the Earth which is half visible, half not visible- is not directly seen. Each Eternal represents a part of being a human. If you see it, the movie makes perfect sense
Marvel stopped keeping track of things after Endgame
That would totally make sense, it would just rely on the two being confused for one another in stories
This is probably one of the few things I didn't like about the direction of the Eternals, specifically in Thena's case. The relationship between the Gods and the Eternals is that the Eternals get mistaken for being actual gods due to their direct involvement with humanity. The movie made it seem like Thena was actually Athena when that's not the case.
As messy as the multiverse in the MCU sometimes is, setting Eternals in an alternate universe and making Thena that universe's version of the Minerva from Love & Thunder would've probably made more sense
This shows clark humility
They didn't think it through with the writing another issue with phase 4 since we seen that those Gods actually exist. If Zeus exist then the other greek pantheon also exists.
This is explained in the comics, and I can't believe I scrolled through a bunch of comments trying to explain this without actually hitting on the official one
There's even a comic that showcases a meeting between Zuras and Zeus detailing how the Eternals could operate on Earth and perpetuate the already established myths between their similar parallel members
So we can have Ronin and the Ronan but Thena and Athena would be too confusing. Got it.
Athena changed her name to Minerva to avoid Thena while Hercules did it to avoid Hera
In comics thena is not her og name, it's Azura. Azura and her father Zuras became representative of Athena and Zeus some time in the past.
You are a little late to the Eternals bashing party.
Actual is does make some sense. In Thor love and thunder we do see two celestial there meaning that they are aware of the Greek gods existence. We also learned that the eternals are not real, their memories are wiped every time their mission is complete so it could be take one could be inspired by the other. It similar to the situation with two mandrins like from iron man 3 and Shang chi
It's really not that complex compared to real life, in real mythology there is a story about Thor and Loki being tricked by another guy named Loki. His name was Útgarða-Loki.
Well, it could be that the mortals mistaken them as the gods, who already existed. It could be just that, so both could exist.
Well there is always room for “multiverse” excuse.
I just always thought of the Roman and Greek sets as different Gods. Just because one was inspired by the other, it doesn't mean it's just one goddess and not two different ones.
Simple answer......they both are different in the mcu
Done and Dusted.....
But when you hate/love something, you find more reasons to hate/love it and make others hate/love it as well
Or, and hear me out, the Eternals just assumed the already existing names of those Gods, and over time the legends intermingled
So the way Thor L&T presents gods in the universe is that gods exist when people believe in them, Santa clause style. So technically Thena the eternal is the basis of the stories of Athena, but the Greek/Roman people don’t believe in Thena, they believe in Athena, which is why both exist in the MCU
Well it’s pretty clear that not a lot of thought went into love and thunder
The main problem of mcu now is how they gonna change jonathan majors from mcu
No one who worked on Eternals has watched a Marvel movie.
No one who worked on a Marvel movie has watched Eternals.
I don’t see how the Athena one doesn’t make sense. Wouldn’t it make sense if human written mythology was wildly inaccurate? Like, would be rather that all the myths about Thor and Loki that are absurd or out of character just don’t exist in the MCU, do exist and are true, or do exist, and just aren’t accurate, because they are folklore passed by word of mouth other thousands of years?
With that in mind, ‘Athena’ could be a total fiction, could be Minerva being mistaken for Thena, a mix of the two people, a 90/10 split. Regardless, we should be taking for granted that human myth is inaccurate.
If you look at Greek depictions of, say Dionysus, it’s not like they’re even consistent within themselves. Who he is and what he looked like changes depending on the author.