Migrated over here from Knorr's "Behind the lawn" because I was looking for something a little more in depth than LCN's videos. They were great for starting out, but I'm trying to learn why instead of just when. Was not disappointed, good stuff man. Looking forward to a possible Carbon Earth rebirth.
Great video!! For my residential Bermuda (north Texas), I've done a split treatment in the early Spring for the past several years.....Also, in the late fall I go straight Barricade. Then in early Spring, I put out Barricade then wait 2 weeks and spray Dimension. Haven't had a weed in 4 years.
Great video. Made my 1st application of dithiopyr today. I will say though that even though Specticle G or Flo are considered the holy grail of pre emergents, I did experience SIGNIFICANT stunting of lateral growth and dieback on Tifway 419 when I ran it at full strength at the start of the year (especially in more shaded areas in my lawn).
Mostly great success with Dimension, though it really only performs at the highest rate. I find that it is easy to find a cheap granular Dimension, not so much the barricade, so I tend to use it more. I use Prodiamine in spray form as a result where it is cheaper, and only when I have to have long term from one spray, but it’s pruning capacity in early spring has given me some issues even on Bermuda.
Thanks for the vid. My closest lawn supply carries dithyopyr in the anderson package. And it's like 30 bucks for 50lbs. That will last me years, so that's what I run for now
Pre or Post, each has a negtivive effect on turf, it may not be a visual difference but each has made an impact. A home owner who has the time, and time being the key word should be able to manage their lawn without the use of these products or very limited. Have you ever noticed the old man that has the lawn on the corner of the street, how nice his lawn is? He mows and mows, maybe to get away from his wife, maybe time to solve lifes problems, but hes mowing his warm season grass, on a 3-5 day schedule. We find that high frequency mowing is one of the most over looked culture pratices here in states. Having a golf couse type lawn requires a golf course type effort, and Effort being the key word. My experience is I can manage my own lawn without the use of pre or post emergence, this requires a special technique called Bendaknees. Bendaknees has long been forgotten, as it requires time and effort. So when we can't master this "Time or Effort" We have a eazy solution, Pre and post emergence herbicides. We manage about 350 residential sites, about 75 acres, and it is impossible to manage without the use of all the above. But you are on to something about not using Pre emergence, if you have the time, try Bendaknees, if time is of essence try spot spraying your crabgrass. The big box stores do have some products that work, but it seems that most crabgrass products all seem to stress the temperatures in the 80s or below. As a professoinal I find most of Matts videos are right on the spot, Further more I would say even as a professional Ive learned more from Matt than any Turf school or professer.
@8:00 Just as I suspected, pre-emergents hurt the KBG's self repair aspect. But an established well fed lawn can prabably handle it better than new weed seed.
Matt...you are driving down the road and see some guy on a sprayer/spreader applying something from a yellow bag. His truck has no decals or charter #. Do you (a) drive by smile and wave or (b) pull in and ask questions like a Tenn ag inspector.
Dithiopyr is just so expensive you may as well use prodiamine and some generic quinclorac for the crab that has already germinated in my experience. I'd really like to try a dimension herbicide program, mostly because of sandburs, but I just can't eat that cost.
I always liked prodiamine, but didn't realize it affected the roots of existing kbg, figured it only affected new seed. Might have to go everyone other year.
Good video Matt ! I am a little nervous of the negative affects I may have caused with an accidental 8 month Prodiamine dose I made, to my St Aug and Common Bermuda on 2/24, though. .553 oz per 1k, in Sandy Loam soil.
@Al 6r I don’t remember what I may have heard in this video that caused me to make that comment. Maybe if you just watched this video you can help jog my memory. I did have some decline of my St Augustine in isolated spots that started around a month later but not sure if they are related to this videos subject matter 🤔
Good stuff... learned a lot of what I’ve been throwing down every spring for 3 years... good to know. Glad I use the lower rates but I do split prodiamine and dithiopyr so I’m double screwed.
I don't know why you would start with one material and finish with a completely different one 2nd app. You should not need to switch to a "post" killer IF your 1st prodiamine app was made early and properly.
I no longer use pre-emergents on my personal turf due to the damage developed over a 30 year period. Information on root pruning in turf was never provided to me. I certainly suspected some type of toxicity as the grass declined over time. My lawn has recovered, but it did take 2-3 years. I think short term use of pre-emergent products are great when there is high weed volume. I do need to use one of these products over cobblestone. Will prodiamine stain concrete and stone?
So I have centipede grass along with some carpetgrass. 1 acre of yard. What would be your pre emergent of choice. I thought about spraying Celsius and certainly in early fall on carpet grass. Appling lime according to soil sample. 5.0 to 5.2 ph in my yard. Yes I have some crabgrass as well.
Matt, I'm in WV which is Zone 6. Forsythia in full bloom. Soil temp today was 59. I have some new customers and need to make decision. After watching this I'm reminded that Prodiamine isn't necessarily preventing CG germination as much as it is a root pruner. Having said that, will Prodiamine be effective in controlling CG if applied now or am I better to go to Dimension. Both herbicides will be in granular form.
@@TheGrassFactor we will still have a frost or two within the next 4 weeks. Wouldn't that squash CG, leaving Prodiamine still a viable option. Hate spending the extra $ on dithiopyr.
Ur numbers are different when I look at my product label for Prodiamine 65 WDG Mine says 0.185 oz/1000 sq ft gives 3 months of coverage….u are saying 0.183 oz/1000 sq ft gives 2 months coverage? This is sooo confusing…. And I don’t understand how to calibrate a sprayer to spray the right amount onto 1,000 sq ft
My lawn is Ryan Knorr's famous sissy grass (perennial rye blend), I get a lot of seed shoots in the spring...... would Dithiopyr have any effect on the seed shoots?
awesome info. I had considered a dithiopyr app for sometime in March but think I'll skip it after seeing this, I want best root establishment I can get with the grass i just planted last fall. I did a February prodiamine app already
Is it true that Dithiopyr covers more different types of weeds than prodiamine? Dithiopyr covers more than 120 different types of weed species which I guess are broadleaf which would make it better for winter. Think I just answered my own question.
It is true, but it is not as effective on poa making it less effective as a winter pre. Also, typically winters are wet seasons for most areas, which means greater downward mobility/less efficacy
@@TheGrassFactor Thanks for the reply. Very very informative. Still have an older bottle of prodiamine and this would save me a lot of $$$ . Will give it another shot.
I plan on using SCOTTS HALTS. "Pendimethalin" Can I spray and cover the whole lawn with MESO 40 "Mesotrione" if I have also used HALTS? If so how long should I wait until doing so? Or should I wait and spot spray. I had a massive crabgrass takeover last season. I live in Syracuse, NY so I have cool-season grass. Soil temps are in the 40s right now.
Thank you for the education, it's very much appreciated. I have a curious question. If I understood right both pre emergents affect the growth of bermuda grass. If so is there a need for a growth inhibitor during the growing season if regular pre schedule is used?
Growth regulators affect only gibberellic acid production, which regulates upward growth - not tillering or rooting, as those continue operating at a normal speed. The pre's slow the tillering and rooting, and do not affect upward growth
I live in the SW our soil temps have dropped to the 45's on 1/18/23, I planted my Bermuda Tif Tuf Sod on Nov 1, soil temp 67 degrees, my Bermuda has not come into full dormancy it is still green but I have not mowed it yet. Can I put a post emergent down now? soil temps 45 degrees. Or ride out the uglies until next fall? Thanks I have sub'd.
I recently watched another video and the outcome came down to cool season or warm season. Are your results from this video dependent upon cool/warm season?? Thanks.
How much will prodiamine prevent kbg from spreading. I have scotts provista and its real thin. Will prodiamine prevent kbg from filling in bald spots and fill in in general?
Triploidy in animals, insects, plants, etc. is inherently genetically unstable and usually detrimental. I would take the fact that herbicides can cause changes to the plant with a grain of salt. Many environmental factors could cause this.
@@TheGrassFactor I may have seen a guide suggesting prodiamine first then dithiopyr in may and then prodiamine before winter. Is this trash advice or a decent strategy?
@@GregDaMurse prodiamine followed by dimension is not a synergistic application. The claim dimensions applied for "early post" crabgrass only applies if single use max rate dimension with a good surfactant. I never see that in guides.
Señor Matt, I have a question. 🙋🏽♂️ One of the other UA-cam guys coincidentally mentioned something I’ve been thinking about recently. He mentioned that after a few years of applying pre-em to his lawn, he got to a point where he felt his lawn was strong enough. So he’s gone a couple of years without applying any pre-em at all and that he only treats with post-em. Can a lawn get that healthy? Would maybe a reduction of the label rate be better? Like him, I have had the good fortune of not having had any weed issues over the last 3 years. I hand-pull the occasional poa annua or dandelion that comes up.
@@TheGrassFactor Yeah, I'd love to not HAVE TO apply it simply because it's less "stuff" on the lawn, but as you may remember, I'm Bermuda in Central TX. Winter storms aside, our winters are pretty mild.
@@jaygonzalez3555 you can pretty much guarantee in TX, you'll be applying pre almost all of the time unless you want to rotate to post only year, I which you'll be spraying significantly more because of the weed pressure
Its July 8, 2021, I live in South/Central New Jersey, I have a Kentucky Bluegrass lawn (Tall fescue in the rear) I've recently overseeded with Perennial Ryegrass and my law has been looking great, but there are sections where I have annoying weeds (Clover leaf, crabgrass, Japanese Stiltgrass, weeds, etc) Can I use any and/or both of these products NOW? (I don't want to wait till fall, need to stop the weeds now before lawn is ruined.) Also, I understand that Prodiamine does not require surfactant mixed in my tank, but can I use surfactant anyway?
These only work preventatively, so if you see it now, these products won't help. You must use a post emergent now - like quinclorac or pylex, and then apply the pre-ergents in late winter/early spring before they show up.
The pre emergent herbicides are safe around ornamental plants and shrubs as long as no contact with the roots occur. It is very important to only apply a pre emergent to plants that have the soil firmly settled around the roots so the pre stays at the surface of the soil.
If you check the subvertnpk.com website, we have some trial data showing the efficacy of our prefix product used to overcome the effects of pre. Yes they help, but need higher rates. 2-3oz/M of a concentrated product
Thanks Matt. I have a POA Annua problem in my turfgrass, TTTF. Any way to attack this aside of a total renovation? Mid Atlantic transition zone. I applied Prodiamine about 10 days ago, any input appreciated.
@@TheGrassFactor Thanks. Am I stuck with using Prograss EC or can Ethofumesate be purchased separately? Prograss EC is pricey, but cheaper than a renovation.
You really do scare people off from using pre-emergent materials. What's your point! There is a risk in everything we do out here. Risk reward I guess. You wouldn't offer crabgrass control if you were still at Trugreen.
The point is to understand this is happening. Who cares if it scares people. It's the reality of what we're doing. All the more reason to have a good NPK program so we're not starting at dormant lawns on June22. All the more reason to understand why we follow label rates. Also, so we can have that in the tool box as a diagnostic tool.how many problems are we looking at in lawns that can be attributed to over/misapplication of pre-emergent
Ehhhhhhhh possibly, I've never run into applying it in mid January as long as I ran a split rate. Maybe as a single Max rate, but I honestly don't know
Coming up we have a video on PPE (because I needed to brush up) and will also begin the herbicide vs. herbicide comparisons!
Sounds good Matt....look forward to all the information coming up!! I got a late start this year with the crazy texas weather.
Conor Ward has a very impressive video on wearing PPE 😁
Lame! Unless it's just a short clip about if you feel your spray hit your face to close your eyes... Because that's my ppe.
Migrated over here from Knorr's "Behind the lawn" because I was looking for something a little more in depth than LCN's videos. They were great for starting out, but I'm trying to learn why instead of just when.
Was not disappointed, good stuff man. Looking forward to a possible Carbon Earth rebirth.
Really appreciate the clarity with which you're able to unpack this info for us normal folk.
Great video!! For my residential Bermuda (north Texas), I've done a split treatment in the early Spring for the past several years.....Also, in the late fall I go straight Barricade. Then in early Spring, I put out Barricade then wait 2 weeks and spray Dimension. Haven't had a weed in 4 years.
Any issues or yellowing w your turf?
So does prodiamine help with broadleaf? I've been overloaded with information and I'm over thinking this stuff. Haha
Very informative!! As usual, you geeked out on this great topic! 🤪
I have prodiamine on the shelf. Glad I know more about it now. Great info.
Great video. Made my 1st application of dithiopyr today. I will say though that even though Specticle G or Flo are considered the holy grail of pre emergents, I did experience SIGNIFICANT stunting of lateral growth and dieback on Tifway 419 when I ran it at full strength at the start of the year (especially in more shaded areas in my lawn).
I half ass understood the chemistry but at the end of the video I learned I need dithiopyr! Thank you for the video very informative! 👌🏼👏
The professor is back, now we just need the white board.
Mostly great success with Dimension, though it really only performs at the highest rate. I find that it is easy to find a cheap granular Dimension, not so much the barricade, so I tend to use it more. I use Prodiamine in spray form as a result where it is cheaper, and only when I have to have long term from one spray, but it’s pruning capacity in early spring has given me some issues even on Bermuda.
In the I've tried the prodiamine approach. We'll keep ya posted.
Done it for 15 years. It works.
Thanks Matt, I had to watch this one twice. I’m picking up what your puttin down.
Thanks for the vid. My closest lawn supply carries dithyopyr in the anderson package. And it's like 30 bucks for 50lbs. That will last me years, so that's what I run for now
This makes me not wanna use a pre-emergent! But I need to because crabgrass and other weeds are the devil. Thanks. Lol
Pre or Post, each has a negtivive effect on turf, it may not be a visual difference but each has made an impact. A home owner who has the time, and time being the key word should be able to manage their lawn without the use of these products or very limited. Have you ever noticed the old man that has the lawn on the corner of the street, how nice his lawn is? He mows and mows, maybe to get away from his wife, maybe time to solve lifes problems, but hes mowing his warm season grass, on a 3-5 day schedule. We find that high frequency mowing is one of the most over looked culture pratices here in states. Having a golf couse type lawn requires a golf course type effort, and Effort being the key word. My experience is I can manage my own lawn without the use of pre or post emergence, this requires a special technique called Bendaknees. Bendaknees has long been forgotten, as it requires time and effort. So when we can't master this "Time or Effort" We have a eazy solution, Pre and post emergence herbicides. We manage about 350 residential sites, about 75 acres, and it is impossible to manage without the use of all the above. But you are on to something about not using Pre emergence, if you have the time, try Bendaknees, if time is of essence try spot spraying your crabgrass. The big box stores do have some products that work, but it seems that most crabgrass products all seem to stress the temperatures in the 80s or below. As a professoinal I find most of Matts videos are right on the spot, Further more I would say even as a professional Ive learned more from Matt than any Turf school or professer.
great! haven't got this from you for a while. stick to it👌 welcome back
Great info in this video! Your production quality is great also!
@8:00 Just as I suspected, pre-emergents hurt the KBG's self repair aspect. But an established well fed lawn can prabably handle it better than new weed seed.
Well done 👌🏾💪🏾🌱
Matt...you are driving down the road and see some guy on a sprayer/spreader applying something from a yellow bag. His truck has no decals or charter #. Do you (a) drive by smile and wave or (b) pull in and ask questions like a Tenn ag inspector.
A or B. ???
What about on clay soils like Texas has?
Very educational. Really enjoyed the video.
Great video Matt. Thank you.
Another quality video! Love the education!!!
Dithiopyr is just so expensive you may as well use prodiamine and some generic quinclorac for the crab that has already germinated in my experience. I'd really like to try a dimension herbicide program, mostly because of sandburs, but I just can't eat that cost.
I apply both. Dithiopyr granular and prodiamine liquid
I always liked prodiamine, but didn't realize it affected the roots of existing kbg, figured it only affected new seed. Might have to go everyone other year.
Good video Matt !
I am a little nervous of the negative affects I may have caused with an accidental 8 month Prodiamine dose I made, to my St Aug and Common Bermuda on 2/24, though. .553 oz per 1k, in Sandy Loam soil.
.83oz. is max per year
@Al 6r I don’t remember what I may have heard in this video that caused me to make that comment. Maybe if you just watched this video you can help jog my memory. I did have some decline of my St Augustine in isolated spots that started around a month later but not sure if they are related to this videos subject matter 🤔
Definitely NOT trash!
Aldo I love the pic!
Thanks for the data Matt...
This is great! Thank you
Based completely on how cool prodiamine looks when you drop it in...it's obviously going to be better.
I swapped to a new spray tip and used a little blue turf dye to double check my pattern..... looked like a radioactive lime green with prodiamine.
Thanks Matt.
Good stuff... learned a lot of what I’ve been throwing down every spring for 3 years... good to know. Glad I use the lower rates but I do split prodiamine and dithiopyr so I’m double screwed.
I don't know why you would start with one material and finish with a completely different one 2nd app. You should not need to switch to a "post" killer IF your 1st prodiamine app was made early and properly.
Great video! Thank you!
Great video. Thanks.
I no longer use pre-emergents on my personal turf due to the damage developed over a 30 year period. Information on root pruning in turf was never provided to me. I certainly suspected some type of toxicity as the grass declined over time. My lawn has recovered, but it did take 2-3 years. I think short term use of pre-emergent products are great when there is high weed volume. I do need to use one of these products over cobblestone. Will prodiamine stain concrete and stone?
So I have centipede grass along with some carpetgrass. 1 acre of yard. What would be your pre emergent of choice.
I thought about spraying Celsius and certainly in early fall on carpet grass.
Appling lime according to soil sample. 5.0 to 5.2 ph in my yard.
Yes I have some crabgrass as well.
Matt, Do to the root pruning effects you discussed, would you recommend a post-emergent approach for first year KBG over using pre-emergent?
Matt, I'm in WV which is Zone 6. Forsythia in full bloom. Soil temp today was 59. I have some new customers and need to make decision. After watching this I'm reminded that Prodiamine isn't necessarily preventing CG germination as much as it is a root pruner. Having said that, will Prodiamine be effective in controlling CG if applied now or am I better to go to Dimension. Both herbicides will be in granular form.
Late applications, dithiopyr is better unless it's the second of split apps
@@TheGrassFactor we will still have a frost or two within the next 4 weeks. Wouldn't that squash CG, leaving Prodiamine still a viable option. Hate spending the extra $ on dithiopyr.
@@aj12271 for sure! If you've still got a frost, I'd push forward with what I got
@@TheGrassFactor thx Matt!
Ur numbers are different when I look at my product label for Prodiamine 65 WDG
Mine says 0.185 oz/1000 sq ft gives 3 months of coverage….u are saying 0.183 oz/1000 sq ft gives 2 months coverage?
This is sooo confusing….
And I don’t understand how to calibrate a sprayer to spray the right amount onto 1,000 sq ft
Sorry, this comment was posted on the wrong UA-cam video…ur video automatically came up..
Any advice on using either of these products on bent grass?
Great Info!!
Great information I did not know that about specticle! Did you mention sureguard? Is it a root pruner?
Sureguard is not a root pruner, all good there
My lawn is Ryan Knorr's famous sissy grass (perennial rye blend), I get a lot of seed shoots in the spring...... would Dithiopyr have any effect on the seed shoots?
I use both on my celebration Bermuda and empire zoysia
awesome info. I had considered a dithiopyr app for sometime in March but think I'll skip it after seeing this, I want best root establishment I can get with the grass i just planted last fall. I did a February prodiamine app already
Is it true that Dithiopyr covers more different types of weeds than prodiamine? Dithiopyr covers more than 120 different types of weed species which I guess are broadleaf which would make it better for winter. Think I just answered my own question.
It is true, but it is not as effective on poa making it less effective as a winter pre. Also, typically winters are wet seasons for most areas, which means greater downward mobility/less efficacy
@@TheGrassFactor Thanks for the reply. Very very informative. Still have an older bottle of prodiamine and this would save me a lot of $$$ . Will give it another shot.
I plan on using SCOTTS HALTS. "Pendimethalin" Can I spray and cover the whole lawn with MESO 40 "Mesotrione" if I have also used HALTS? If so how long should I wait until doing so? Or should I wait and spot spray. I had a massive crabgrass takeover last season. I live in Syracuse, NY so I have cool-season grass. Soil temps are in the 40s right now.
Does prodiamine come in granular? If so, what brands are best?
Do split apps of Prodiamine help with root pruning vs. Full rate?
Studies show no not really
Thank you for the education, it's very much appreciated. I have a curious question. If I understood right both pre emergents affect the growth of bermuda grass. If so is there a need for a growth inhibitor during the growing season if regular pre schedule is used?
Growth regulators affect only gibberellic acid production, which regulates upward growth - not tillering or rooting, as those continue operating at a normal speed. The pre's slow the tillering and rooting, and do not affect upward growth
Is it possible to use Prodiamine early AND Diptiopyr later?
I live in the SW our soil temps have dropped to the 45's on 1/18/23, I planted my Bermuda Tif Tuf Sod on Nov 1, soil temp 67 degrees, my Bermuda has not come into full dormancy it is still green but I have not mowed it yet.
Can I put a post emergent down now? soil temps 45 degrees. Or ride out the uglies until next fall? Thanks I have sub'd.
That answer is no, do not put pre emergent down on a newly sodded lawn you have to wait at least 1 year.
What’s best for zoysia grass in central Florida east coast? I have some weeds but not crazy
Why not run prodiamine in Feb and dithiopyr in may
I just bought both, cant wait to use soon. 4 treatments a yr, bye bye weeds we will be seein ya, or not lol
I recently watched another video and the outcome came down to cool season or warm season. Are your results from this video dependent upon cool/warm season?? Thanks.
How much will prodiamine prevent kbg from spreading. I have scotts provista and its real thin. Will prodiamine prevent kbg from filling in bald spots and fill in in general?
What if i go in late and i combine prodiamine and a post-emergent like quinclorac to catch young crabgrass?
Great option!
@@TheGrassFactor thanks
@@TheGrassFactor thanks
why? Isn't it bad to blanket spray post emergent if you have no to very little showing of weeds? Just spot spray. No?
I’ve also begun adopting the approach of applying pre m quarterly all year round. How screwed am I by doing this?
Triploidy in animals, insects, plants, etc. is inherently genetically unstable and usually detrimental. I would take the fact that herbicides can cause changes to the plant with a grain of salt. Many environmental factors could cause this.
Sorry Matt I'll try to ask the question again....(Split apps)-1st app barricade 2nd app Dimension. I know people who think that works. Do you agree?
makes no sense to me
@@TheGrassFactor I may have seen a guide suggesting prodiamine first then dithiopyr in may and then prodiamine before winter. Is this trash advice or a decent strategy?
@@GregDaMurse prodiamine followed by dimension is not a synergistic application. The claim dimensions applied for "early post" crabgrass only applies if single use max rate dimension with a good surfactant. I never see that in guides.
@@TheGrassFactor ok makes sense. I didn’t know it was only at max rate there was some post emergence activity.
If i put seed down say kbg/pr/and ttf mix and applied pre emerg to early will that seed ever germinate?
Señor Matt, I have a question. 🙋🏽♂️
One of the other UA-cam guys coincidentally mentioned something I’ve been thinking about recently. He mentioned that after a few years of applying pre-em to his lawn, he got to a point where he felt his lawn was strong enough. So he’s gone a couple of years without applying any pre-em at all and that he only treats with post-em.
Can a lawn get that healthy?
Would maybe a reduction of the label rate be better?
Like him, I have had the good fortune of not having had any weed issues over the last 3 years. I hand-pull the occasional poa annua or dandelion that comes up.
You see it all the time in golf greens, etc.
@@TheGrassFactor Those places don't typically use pre-emergents?
@@jaygonzalez3555 they alternate on and off. Many kbg pure stands do not use any at all. Some zoysia too. But almost all bermuda and tall fescue do
@@TheGrassFactor Yeah, I'd love to not HAVE TO apply it simply because it's less "stuff" on the lawn, but as you may remember, I'm Bermuda in Central TX. Winter storms aside, our winters are pretty mild.
@@jaygonzalez3555 you can pretty much guarantee in TX, you'll be applying pre almost all of the time unless you want to rotate to post only year, I which you'll be spraying significantly more because of the weed pressure
Which would you put down in November in NY, is it necessary?
In November? None of them. That's past the window of cool season weed germination
Its July 8, 2021, I live in South/Central New Jersey, I have a Kentucky Bluegrass lawn (Tall fescue in the rear) I've recently overseeded with Perennial Ryegrass and my law has been looking great, but there are sections where I have annoying weeds (Clover leaf, crabgrass, Japanese Stiltgrass, weeds, etc) Can I use any and/or both of these products NOW? (I don't want to wait till fall, need to stop the weeds now before lawn is ruined.) Also, I understand that Prodiamine does not require surfactant mixed in my tank, but can I use surfactant anyway?
These only work preventatively, so if you see it now, these products won't help. You must use a post emergent now - like quinclorac or pylex, and then apply the pre-ergents in late winter/early spring before they show up.
I'm "rooting" for Dithiopyr, but let's see what this video has to say first, lol
I bought 5lbs of prodiamine, still have 4lbs left.
INDAZIFLAM IS MOVING TO THE TOP SPOT.
Would they also have a root pruning effect on recently planted ornamental shrubs/plants?
Yes, anything growing in soil treated with a pre-emergent herbicide will be affected to some degree. Most tolerant species are listed on the label
The pre emergent herbicides are safe around ornamental plants and shrubs as long as no contact with the roots occur. It is very important to only apply a pre emergent to plants that have the soil firmly settled around the roots so the pre stays at the surface of the soil.
What can we do to limit root pruning if we choose to use prodiamine? Is there a product?
Subvert Pre-Fix
With the cost of dimension, doesn't it make sense to just run a prodiamine-sulfentrazone or prodiamine- quinclorac mix?
IMO that's what I would do unless I had a bunch of dimension laying around I needed to just use up
What are your thoughts on the shelf life of prodiamine wdg and dimension in liquid form. I've read it's 3 years, but not from an official source.
Prodiamine as a WDG formulation is indefinite as long as it stays dry. I'm honestly not sure on Dimension.
@@TheGrassFactor Thanks!
If it is granular dithiopyr, is there any benefit to it at all over prodiamine now that it no longer offers any post-emergent qualities?
Depends on timing and soil structure
Is Penoxsulam a DNA? Would it be ok to apply on St. Aug in clay?
Penoxsulam is not a DNA. My experience with it is it's hard on the turf but I've never applied to St. Augustine either. YMMV
After year's of use I found that dimension was not as effective
If using Peptides does that help combat the root pruning effect of Prodiamine ?
If you check the subvertnpk.com website, we have some trial data showing the efficacy of our prefix product used to overcome the effects of pre. Yes they help, but need higher rates. 2-3oz/M of a concentrated product
@@TheGrassFactor .... Thats where I read it, Thank you sir. I started using Subvert last year, great product.
What’d he say?
Thanks Matt.
I have a POA Annua problem in my turfgrass, TTTF. Any way to attack this aside of a total renovation?
Mid Atlantic transition zone.
I applied Prodiamine about 10 days ago, any input appreciated.
Ethofumesate
@@TheGrassFactor Thanks.
Am I stuck with using Prograss EC or can Ethofumesate be purchased separately?
Prograss EC is pricey, but cheaper than a renovation.
First
👍👍😊😊
11:25
Need to change your name to the "Why Guy".
You really do scare people off from using pre-emergent materials. What's your point! There is a risk in everything we do out here. Risk reward I guess. You wouldn't offer crabgrass control if you were still at Trugreen.
The point is to understand this is happening. Who cares if it scares people. It's the reality of what we're doing. All the more reason to have a good NPK program so we're not starting at dormant lawns on June22. All the more reason to understand why we follow label rates. Also, so we can have that in the tool box as a diagnostic tool.how many problems are we looking at in lawns that can be attributed to over/misapplication of pre-emergent
Dump the pretentious headphones and microphone
Will that appease you? Will you like me then? What else can I do to serve you today?
No.
APPEASE ME!! Lol little touchy eh?@@TheGrassFactor
Can you put out pre-emergents too early? Like weeks?
Ehhhhhhhh possibly, I've never run into applying it in mid January as long as I ran a split rate. Maybe as a single Max rate, but I honestly don't know