Why ski jumpers hold their skis in a V
Вставка
- Опубліковано 6 лют 2022
- It’s more about aerodynamics than aesthetics.
Subscribe and turn on notifications 🔔 so you don't miss any videos: goo.gl/0bsAjO
If you looked at photos of ski jumpers today and ski jumpers 50 years ago, you’d notice one big difference.
In the past, jumpers held their skis tightly underneath their body in a parallel position. Keeping the body in a straight line like this was considered elegant and appealing. But more importantly, it was the position jumpers used to gather as much distance as possible. This position made athletes thin and small, which allowed them to move forward through the air quickly. However, the parallel position didn’t do much to help them fight gravity.
In the 1980s, ski jumper Jan Boklov tested out a different ski position - one that resembled a V. He noticed that the V shape allowed him to achieve longer distances.
That’s because, unlike the parallel position, the V position allows air to hit athletes' bodies directly. Instead of cutting through the air quickly, they’re using their body to catch air like a wing. This extra air lifts athletes up, allowing them to stay airborne longer - and go further. This small change revolutionized the sport, and since then, gold medal winners have used the V style to make it to the podium.
This is the first video of 5 videos from our channel's winter sports theme week. From aerodynamics to concussions to climate change, we covered cold-weather athleticism from a bunch of angles. Watch here: bit.ly/3oESqgx
Further reading:
To learn more about USA Nordic: usanordic.org/
You can also follow USA Nordic on both Instagram and Twitter at @USANordic.
Great diagrams on the airflow of the ski jump - usanordic.org/four-phases-of-...
1995 paper referred to in the video: Desirable Gliding Styles and Techniques in Ski Jumping: sci-hubtw.hkvisa.net/10.1123/...
Smithsonian Science Education Center - Falling with style: The science of ski jumping ssec.si.edu/stemvisions-blog/...
Chicago Tribune - Ski jumping 101: Aerodynamics key to success www.chicagotribune.com/sports...
Vox.com is a news website that helps you cut through the noise and understand what's really driving the events in the headlines. Check out www.vox.com
Support Vox's reporting with a one-time or recurring contribution: vox.com/contribute-now
Shop the Vox merch store: vox.com/store
Watch our full video catalog: goo.gl/IZONyE
Follow Vox on Facebook: / vox
Follow Vox on Twitter: / voxdotcom
Follow Vox on TikTok: / voxdotcom - Спорт
One thing we didn't get to talk about in this piece is how equipment and clothing affect surface area. With suits, small changes can go a long way.
One extra centimeter of slack doesn't sound like much, but when it's distributed across the body, it can have a parachute-like effect, giving skiers more airtime. On the other hand, making suits too skin-tight can cause athletes to go too fast, resulting in injuries. Besides looseness, suit material could dramatically affect how athletes cut through the air.
While the V position’s changes were fairly definitive, uniform specifications are still being tinkered with year to year. The international ski federation has granular rules that define what suits can look like down to the centimeter. You can view all the specifications for competition equipment here: assets.fis-ski.com/image/upload/v1544086634/fis-prod/Specifications_for_CC_JP_NC_SB_FS_FK_Competiton_Equipment.pdf
-Ed
Wing suits baby let's gooooooo
they should add speed as component of final ranking ..that way old style may still have some reason to be used!!
5:00 where Toni Neminen 122m result is mentioned without context, kind of misleads and may suggest that V style is that much more effective compared to 78m achieved with classic style why these jumps were made on different venue and hill size
They could have extra cloth under the arms, so they fly like a bird!
What software did you use for the animation?
Vox dabbles in respectable animations now. It's a real talent for one to know their way around any such software.
I know, I was just about to praise whoever had to sit there and model that skier and make it move the way it was moving lol. I thought it was a model at first it looked so real.
Gotta love Blender!
Can we just appreciate how the quality of this video skyrocketed with those animations? Great job as always Vox!
You feel like you have to tell us that we have to appreciate what we watched? lol
simping over vox, that's low.
@@moofymoo Having the time, to comment on a positive comment, is indeed low. Very low.
@@moofymoo Telling a creator that they are doing great is not “simping”. I know you had to use a word you have seen somewhere else, but you still have to make sense.
The pure V-shape has widened through the years and evolved into W and H styles where you also spread the back of the V. You rarely see a V where the backs of the skis overlap anymore.
Really good on Vox for getting an actual expert to speak about aerodynamics. There's lots of misconceptions about lift that get thrown around a lot but bringing an actual aerodynamicist shows the level of journalism. I applaud that
I've tried ski jumping once and that experience was the only thing that made me interested in how so many people out there can do it professionally.
Great video!
It's quite impressive how ski jumpers zoom through the air and land at record distances.
But did you know that arctic hares can also go airborne too? They bound through the snow at speeds as high as 64 km/h and are taking off like a rocket! 🐇🚀
Please make a video on that TerraMatter! 😀
@@myselfyuvi Great idea! Featuring all the cool animals that would win some medals at the Winter Olympics:
Arctic fox: cross-country-skiing
Penguin: bobsleigh
Arctic hare: ski jumping
Snowy owl: biathlon
Seal: skeleton sled
Crow: curling
I just got back from competing in Women’s Ski Jumping in this Beijing Olympics and am so happy to see more people interested in ski jumping! Thank you Vox for sharing the sport I love the most!
keep up Anna, we in Europe actually look up to ski jumping becoming more popular in the US, the more competition the better
As a Slovene, it's always nice to see our products in popular media. Also, greetings to other ski-jumping nations in the comments, it's a relatively niche sport, but it has a pretty dedicated fanbase.
Greetings from Poland and congratulations on the recent success!
Happy to see a video about this too, as a Norwegian.
Greetings from Germany! I'm a huge fan of ski jumping 😃
From Russia with love
Ahh, the lovely ski-jumping community. Good luck to all of your teams from Poland
It's so mesmerizing to see them stick their landing flawlessly even when using this technique.
What the expert commentator on slovenian television also said is that jumpers have their legs further and further apart in the recent years as well because it also maximises surface area between the legs
I used to officiate at waterskiing competitions, and the common lore in WS world is that the V style has always been used in waterski jumping, and winter jumpers just borrowed it.
The Delta (reverse V) style actually predates the V technique. Here's Delta pioneer Steve Collins (CAN) as a teenager in 1980 setting Lahti (FIN) hill record that stood for 12 years.
I guess among other things it is probably not preferrable as I could imagine getting in and out of it for jump and landing could be trickier than the V. Especially the landing is a quite dangerous moment, getting your skis across in front of you can lead to grave injuries. While with the V you basically just have to put your legs together, a more natural and quicker motion.
It's not "delta" it's PIZZA!!!
Yeah, the whole time I was watching the video, I was wondering when they would talk about Steve Collins from Thunder Bay! Truly unique.
The last question regarding revered V:
I imagine it will be similar to swept wings, forward swept wings have a slower stalling speed (meaning speed lower than that wings no longer generate lift) while being less stable. Backward swept wings (revered v) are more stable comparatively, they have a lower frontal drag but also stalls earlier than straight or forward swept wings.
true, which is why her suggestion makes sense...i relate it to like a delta-shaped wing, if the athletes are able to do that triangle starting at the front of their bodies...
Unlikely. It's purely due to the increase in lifting area.
If they actually functioned enough like delta wings the position would be unusable because that configuration is pretty unstable, and they don't actually have THAT much control over the positioning of their skis that they would be able to balance the lift. (Remember that the ski's are hinged, and are controlled exclusively with the ankles.)
A sport with only 15 countries listed in global rankings. Extremely popular in my country of Poland (ski jumpers are like national heroes).
Małysz really blew it up. Ever since he started dominating the sport, literally every single person in Poland was watching every competition. Pretty sure it beat out soccer / football for popularity, which is saying something.
I think since he retired the popularity dropped somewhat, but it's still a source of national pride.
@@JanBabiuchHall All that is true, Małysz was indeed a formidable sportsman. But it's fair to say that Stoch (4 x Olympic medalist), Kubacki and Żyła continue his legacy and the popularity of ski jumping is still very high
@@michalslusarski I am amazed how Malysz started a skijumping boom in Poland. I hope the polish jumpers will come back to their full power (Kubacki came in third yesterday).
Exactly. Unfortunately seems like some countries stopped investing in the sport much. Poland and Finland have produced, in my opinion, 4 of the top 5 greatest ski jumpers of all time. Finland is one of the biggest superpowers in ski jumping, regularly winning team competitions throughout decades.
That being said neither of these countries have future ahead of them. I don’t think after Stoch, Kubacki and Żyła retire there will be another talented generation (at least no signs for it so far). Even worse with Finland where long time retired, 44 year old Jane Ahonnen won the bronze medal at the national championships last month. 20-25 years ago Finns had over 5 jumpers who mattered on the international stage and nowadays they’re far away from having one.
@@JanBabiuchHall I wouldn’t go as far to say it overtook football’s popularity at any point but it’s been for sure the second most popular sport this century and Małysz was without a doubt the nr 1 sports icon in Poland.
Glad to see so many video updates!
It was timely, as I was just watching the normal hill ski jumping yesterday!
I love Vox's animation style, and the blender? I respect you for trying new techniques!
@nub Just copied your comment word for word, 31 minutes after you posted yours.
When I lived in northern Sweden I had a school teacher that swore he knew the guy who came up with the V style and how nobody believed it to become a thing at the time. I was like "sure whatever ol' man" :D
yes he is from my home town gällivare / koskuskulle,
Vox really outdid themselves in terms of cinematic graphics to show simulation of the different ski positions
I got to watch a practice session at the ski jumping complex in Lake Placid last year. It's a pretty magical thing to watch in person.
This made me remember when I was a kid. I was learning how to play roller coaster as it was popular then. The instructor told me to position my foot as a “V” shape, I wanted to see what would happen if I did the opposite. I positioned my foot as a “/\” and needless to say, I became moving backwards and ended up falling on my head. Learned a lot after that.
if you french fry when you're supposed to pizza, you're gonna have a bad time.
I remember the shift to v-style and how upset everyone in Sweden was that Janne Boklov got punished in the style points.
Great Blender animations!
Vray for the render
Some sports are simply beautiful to watch. This is one of them.
Agree!
That animation was awesome!
yoo these 3d animations are sick love the new visuals
A very impressive video and great animations! Also great job by Tess, the aerodynamic professor and expert, who explained the concepts in a very clear and simplified way.
Steve Collins, Canadian ski jumper, to my recollection was the first jumper who used the "v" style. His world cup debut in 1980. Following that there was a steady transition away from the classic style as more athletes began to experiment with the different aerodynamics.
TLDR: They switched from parallel skis to a V shape to generate more lift and land farther. Now go watch the video and enjoy those smooooth animations...
Just wanted to say I love the montage of the 3D edit at the end! Those animations were great!
It is so nice to see a Vox video about my favorite sport :)
Nowadays V-shape kinda evolves into H-shape style. Skis are a bit more parallel, but also wider as in V-style.
I love the ending montage, such zen!
so good! I would love to see something similar on the forces that downhill skiers face!
This channel really makes very interesting videos for a large range of subjects. Respect.
5:36 actually there's a canadian ski jumper named Steve Collins who performed that style during late 1970s until early 1980s, especially in 1980 winter olympics
I liked the brief glimpse behind the scenes at the end. Thanks!
4:54 The name of the Finnish guy is pronounced "Nie-mi-nen", not "Niemn".
Dont be so french dude
I don't get how Americans so consistently just ignore the spelling of foreign names and instead opt to shoot from the hip. It's not even that complicated of a name. Just reading it as it is spelled would get you closer to being correct than this. As for Boklöv, how difficult is it to look up how Ö is pronounced? The sound is used in English all the time. Google is a thing.
@@albinjohnsson2511 Yeah, google translate will literally pronounce the name for you and you would not think it to be so hard to just repeat exactly what it said. But then again, I've met several people who have been simply incapable of making certain sounds with their mouths. Somehow even when the same sound already exists in their native language, so go figure.
Great animations!!!
The animation is an interesting and lovely addition to the videos
I saw this v-style introduced at the 1988 Winter Olympics in Calgary. He medaled. He also made the ski jump facility immediately obsolete with this technique. It’s never been used again for competition. The ski jumpers fly too far.
That's pretty much was the video says, yeah
I like the animation of the explanation, great job
Per your expert's thinking on the potential benefit of an inverted vee "snowplow" jumping style, Canadian teen phenom Stevie Collins used it with great success in late 70s early 80s.
I knew the answer to that question was 'aerodynamics' but for some reason still watched the video
The animation is mind blowing
Ok, those animations were amazing!
"Lift is a tricky concept it's the basis of flight"
I could hear the complexity in that statement 😂
Vox: releases a new video
Me 5 seconds later: omg I’m so late I gotta watch this video
Very well researched
thanks, vox, for answering a question that i didn't know i had.!!!!!
You can always count on Vox for giving us facts we didn't know we wanted!
The images are awesome.
"The flying V?"
"No, the stinky V"
BLENDER
The guy in the sim got a GREAT takeoff!
Looked all you Olympics games video... They are great ! I never was really interested in the winter games, but your videos should be 'mandatory' to appreciate it (and not just count the medals at the end of the day). Now I want curling !
Glad to see blender getting some use!
Very good job with the graphics..!
Very interesting after watching this event on Saturday afternoon.
Very useful information right here👌
Hey! That's my dad at 0:56, Philip Dunham (AKA the Flying Dentist) at what looks to me like his home hill (Brattleboro's Harris Hill). He was US Veterans (Masters 35+) Champion in 1961. Where did you find the picture?
Great graphics!
Brak tak ikonicznej postaci dla świata skoków jak Adam Małysz jest strasznie rozczarowujące :V
The animation is really really good!
This is a beautiful sport, unreachable for 99% of population. Only a handful of people even have the guts to jump on skis
Im 26 years old and i just understood the concept of lift for the first time lol, this video explained it very well. thanks!
Would be great if we could eliminate unnecessary, subjective judging, from sports that have clearly defining metrics for winning. You go further, you win. Let the athletes experiment with what they want to get the best results.
I'd love to see drifting in the Olympics, just to see the judging controversies.
Nordic combined skiing uses ski jumping distances as a way to determine their cross country race start positions.
I get your point, but it is likely to increase accident frequency, as skiers will try to stretch that little bit further, instead of focusing on a safer landing at a slightly shorter distance.
There have also been trouble with contestants eating too little to weigh as little as possible, which is detrimental to the sport.
Awesome video thanks !
If you french fry when you are supposed to pizza , you're gonna have a bad time .
reverse V sounds awesome! Nice video!
That was very well described
ok, now let''s put a wingsuit on those jumpers
And now I know why you use "A-shape-style" in a recent image! That, it wasn't just an error, but invitation to trying new ideas :D
That little tid bit where the animation was being made was great, could you do a video about how it is done and how long it takes?
Fun fact, i've worked with Jan Boklöv in 2018. Nice humble guy.
Love the use of Blender at the end 🤣
I’d like to see them wear wingsuits as well.
If you french fry when you're supposed to pizza, you're going to have a bad time
Nice video.
Guys let's appreciate the effort of editor .He did a great job , I wonder what software he uses
For the animations he's using Blender
You feel like you have to tell us that we have to appreciate what we watched? Or are you here only to fish for likes, knowing that "appreicate" comments always get a ton.
The V also prevents too much air pressure from occurring around the tips of the skis. When that happens, it can flip you upside down which has happened to some downhill racers.
Love that 3d team! ❤️
You just have love a scientist proposing an idea that would likely yield further jumps but would also severely harm the jumper. That's why theory is always more fun than praxis.
You learn this with skydiving too - body position to gain speed and distance in tracking. This was an interesting video!
It's weird how the first judges of the V style knocked it so hard; I think it looks way cooler than parallel.
What about the H position seen by athelets like Domen Prevc, is that any effective?
Vox couldn't resist the V shape! something very vastly * vibrant about it.
The V-style was actually discovered by Miroslaw Gryf. It's sometimes called Gryf-Boklov style.
"French fry when you pizza youre gonna have a bad time."
I know nothing about skii jumping but they should use those suites that opens up to have kinda like wings on them to fly further. Not sure what they are called but I’ve seen people glide with them
Can we please make Puppies Leaping into a Swimming Pool an official Olympic sport?
Asserting dominance over air
Next is wingsuits in skiing
Mais um vídeo espetacular!
I always stick my hand out the car window on the freeway on an angle. Its a lovely feeling like youre patting the air
Someday a dude will jump so perfectly that he will generate enough lift to enter orbit and we'll never see him again.
551,524 views, 12k likes, 386 comments, 10.3M subscribers. Nice!!
Always wondered how ski jumpers land without pulverising many bones after a 100m+ jump....
It's more to do with them landing in a steep downhill.
4:55 "Toni Neemen" lol
Nothing beats the flippity flop.