The Pakistani left, PDM, PTI and Marxism - Dr. Shahram Azhar - TPE
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- Опубліковано 30 тра 2024
- Dr. Shahram Azhar is a Marxist and Professor of Economics at Bucknell University, Pennsylvania. Dr Shahram Azhar is also a lover of poetry and a singer, he was the former lead singer of the band 'Laal'.
Shahram comes on The Pakistan Experience for a deep dive discussion on the Pakistani left and the economy of Pakistan.
We discuss:
1. Why the Pakistani left is stuck in the 1960s
2. The erosion of decency in Pakistani politics
3. The role of the establishment in politics
4. The role of PPP and the legacy of Benazir Bhutto
5. How Marxism can shape the future
6. Has PTI failed to manage the economy?
7. Has the hybrid regime failed?
8. Colonialism
9. Why are Bangladesh's exports doing better than Pakistan's
10. Why God has blessed Shahram Azhar with such a beautiful voice
The Pakistan Experience is an independently produced podcast looking to tell stories about Pakistan, and Pakistanis, through the lost art of conversation. We do deep dive long form podcasts to show you the many shades that encapsulate The Pakistan Experience.
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The podcast is hosted by comedian and writer, Shehzad Ghias Shaikh. Shehzad is a Fulbright scholar with a Masters in Theatre from Brooklyn College. He is also one of the foremost Stand-up comedians in Pakistan and frequently writes for numerous publications. He can be found on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter and Tinder.
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Chapters:
0:00 Introduction
1:34:21 Why is Pakistan's Urea more expensive
1:43:23 Barriers to business
1:46:26 Unpaid Family work
1:48:00 Certainty during Martial Law
1:48:50 Was Pakistan meant to be for the elite?
1:53:00 Was Bhutto to be blamed for 1971?
1:55:15 What was Musharaf's plan with Kargil?
1:57:00 Is the notion of the state obsolete?
2:00:00 Workers Cooperative
2:12:15 Environment and AI in Marxism
2:16:00 Meaning of Labour in modern Marxism
2:21:00 State of Pakistan's Economy
2:26:00 Can weak coalition's deliver?
2:36:00 Why are leftists more artistic
2:40:00 How is your voice so good?
2:41:35 Why did Laal break up?
2:43:00 Jalib and Faiz
2:45:00 Poetry and Singing - Розваги
Shehzad, you're a fantastic interviewer. Thank you for this conversation
My the most favorite teacher. Much respect for him. Dr Shahram is just love.
One of your best episodes. Absolutely loved how he made a point about a way in-between socialism and capitalism.
@@ThePakistanExperience hope we get mukti from pisslam the pissful mazhab
Admire that Dr. Azhar is speaking in Urdu mostly.
I’m a driver and had to travel for many hours ….. this discussion was amazing and I appreciate Dr. Azhar speaking. Shahzad you’re the best .. keep up the good work
🙌
MashaAllah Alhamdulillah InshaAllah🙏
Shahram is an institution of knowledge and intellect. I am hugely inspired by him and hope to see him again soon. Pls make him a regular guest
Both of you boys are looking great MashaAllah! Just the way you are kiddos. Your thoughts and minds are your greatest asset. And you have great minds!
I will never forget Shahram Azhar singing in the Urdu translation of the immortal _L' Internationale_ anthem after the restoration of Democracy. *_Ye Azm ka tarana hai_*
What a man. Brilliant, i can now forgive LUMS for everything now. What a gem they produced.
Would love to see Ayesha Chundigar (founder of ACF) on this podcast, conversations around animal rights are much needed.
Another great episode, as always.
02:01:00 Richard Wolff ko me bhi apna ustad manta hu, though im not a Marxist, phr bhi ustad manta hu, its such pleasant thing to hear abt him from another Pakistani for the first time.
there is no match when it comes to Richard Wolff's explaination of the economy and capitalism. Even school going kids can understand from him.
Slavoj Zizek...🥺
" If there’s an institution in your society that’s above criticism,
you’re giving it a free pass to indulge all of its weaknesses and darker tendencies."
Wolff
@@ballerstalin5346
"We feel free because we lack the very language to articulate our unfreedom"
Zizek
Love from India
My Favourite Podcast. Thank you so much Shahzad Ghias for inviting him. Please invite him again... Please Please Please 🙏
I pray to all the gods there are for your continual success!
With regards to Shahram's discussion on regulations, it's not that Pakistan doesn't possess these regulatory bodies. Infact, as far as engineering standards go Pakistan already has a very robust organization called PNAEC which adopts and regulates international standards for engineering, and manufacturing. Furthermore, all exporters in Pakistan are required to comply with standards for Social Accountability (like SA 8000), other best practices, etc. Plus there's an environmental watchdog too in Pakistan. As far as expertise is concerned there is no shortage, the only issue is its effectiveness and rampant corruption which has far reaching consequences in terms of effectiveness of the regulations.
This video has everything I look for in a youtube video. This is the first time this has happened.
I could listen them forever.
And it's so random bcz before today, I didn't know about the these people and neither the channel. Just stumbled upon it out of nowhere.
And the irony is that I am pretty much a communist or left critic (A lay one)
I have to say, this video did add value to my life.
Such a great episode, what an absolute joy listening to Shahram, and Shahzad bhai, you're a gem, needless to say!
Aap heeron mein tolne laaiq kaam kar rahe hain.
Lots of love from Islamabad!
Thank you shahzad and Dr. Shahram Azhar.
Always loved to listen him.❤️
Can you invite Dr Akbar Zaidi or Qaiser Bengali?
My jeeju on my favorite podcast ❤️❤️❤️ 😊😊😊
Absolutely brilliant 3 hours. Though I disagree on a lot of things but I enjoyed it so much.
Shahzad you are gem.these 90 episodes are worth like reading 90 books,To day i watched the episode till the very end.
Keep up the good work,God bless you.
Shahram azhar widened the thoughts by his examples.Thanks.
Again a very good conversation! 🤘🤘🤘
Thank you both for sharing your knowledge and respective views.
Both of you are such beautiful human beings, blown away 🙏
What a killer episode! This rationalized a lot of recent events excellently.
One of your best episodes Shehzad. Great empathetic guest.
You are absolutely right political left is stuck is 60s and not able to address the contemporary challenges..
No, actually it's not,no true leftist can remain stagnant.
It's just that these foreign qualified rich self acclaimed leftists have their own agendas.
Left and Marxism is associated with continuing critical analysis.
Unfortunately in this current period of compromises in our history,not many free people's thinkers exist,many have compromised.
Once geopolitics changes,things will revert back to previous clarity.
Shahram be like "ab aap isse dhyan se suno .. aapko maza aane wala" .. Yess indeed!
BTW shehzad, kudos for the hosting today. There were times where he explained the basics, which sometimes seem mundane to you and you try to jump ahead, but you didn't today. Beautiful hosting.
Everything you’re saying is well said. What is that practical in Pakistan?
Great show as alwayys and thanks for introducing us to Dr. Shahram Azher, especially for those of us living abroad who are not familiar with the Pakistani intelligensia.
However, my criticism is on the typecast language and jargon used. Not all of your viewers, like me, subscribe to left wing or right wing ideology and not all moral precepts have to be coopted by a particular brand of ideologues like Marxism, Islam, post-modern feminist narrative, etc. For instance we don't have to subscribe to the 'patriarchy' boogieman (read strawman) and start shadowboxing it to realize that certain behaviors are wrong. Being a decent human being in virtually any paradigm one is required to respect women. I don't have to be a feminist or a marxist to rally for equal rights and neither is Marxism the exclusive club it is made out to be for morality.
Thank you shahzad!
This is the best podcast you have ever done
Loved each and every minute of this
Finally got an intelligent discourse from Pakistan.. I think you should invite more celebarity from Pakistan.. So that more people coude understand the discourse
In fact,there should be debates,dialogues between many,a single individual maybe biased,may represent wrongly, deliberately.
This was so intriguing! Really made me understand Marxism better.
Try to understand Marxism,from Marx himself.
The interpreters,especially in west, particularly affluent,may be deliberately distracting.
Their own understanding of Marxism is not only poor,but maligned too.
It's a strategy,and they are just stooges.
Please let me know which political party in Pakistan are not coming in power without establishment?
Respectfully disagree with your narrow definition of corruption here. Corruption is keeping the dollar value artificially low, leading to de-industrialization. Corruption is not clamping down on hawala hundi operators, corruption is burdening the exchequer through overburdening SOE with 1000s of political appointees, not initiating tax reforms etc
Because our political parties do not want to spend their political capital in taking these tough measures. That's the corruption that has led us to where we are and there are children dying out there because of this.
@@ThePakistanExperience no one in their right mind is going to defend the rent-seeking sugar or fertilizer industrialists. But the argument that Shahram made on growing the economic pie so that corruption won't even be an issue anymore, is weak and not backed by data. China or India for that matter may have rampant financial corruption, but they have some of the most robust industrial policies in the world. Aren't politicians who kept the dollar artificially low and allowed for the flight of capital, criminals then?
Would love a separate , more detailed conversation with Dr. Azhar on poetry of Faiz, Jalib, Elia and others
Why don't you watch and read Faiz,Jakub,Joan and all other progressive writers,foremost Sibte Hassan and Dr Mubarak Ali,Ali Abbas Jalapuri,Kaifi Azmi,Manto,Krishan Chandr,Rajinder Singh Bedi,Ali Sardar Jafri,Ismat Chughtai,Zaheer Kashmiri,yourself.
There are many many others.
Just look for Progressive writers movement.
These people can just sing,or recite,or mention a little bit.
They are not interpreters,neither practitioners actually.
Dr shahram great analyst
Please invite Jawad Ahmed,singer and chairman Barabri Party Pakistan in your program. I have recently been introduced to your program. Bravo, great program.
Dr. Azhar can you please tell who wrote that punjabi shair that you said before talking about jalib and faiz. Thank you!
Well done friends. Keep it up. Warm regards.
Love from Gujerkhan Pakistan
Interesting podcast. Very informative
***PLEASEE REPLYY***
just one question to the guest and host.. if bilawal bhutto ke naam ke saath say bhutto hata diya jaaye and maryem nawaz ke naam sath nawaz hata dia jaye then aur inn dono ki kiya hasiyat , kiya qabaliyat hai kia contribution hai aisi jis sy inhay Pakistan ka pm banaya jaye?
one more thing USSR was not state capitalist until the end of Stalin. But afterwards, during the time of yilson USSR was not even state capitalist.
Awesome ❤ podcast 👍
Shahram : Hain na...
audience : haan na 🥰 🥰
thnx shahzad. Kahan kahan se logon ko le aate ho... umeed abhi kayam hai 😌
i have to share directly with you. Your other socials are not listed. (how) can i?
Just fallen in love with shahram... love u man
2:16 Good reply, but this is where Marx's Theory of Alienation comes in when the ruling class, has all the wealth AND all the labor, the laborer, the proletariat, the class who makes money through not ownership, but solely through selling their labor is alienated from society altogether. The incentive a Capitalist to pay wages has has come to an end, the Capitalists have the all wealth, created by Capital by itself. This is when we enjoy the things human about ourselves, under Socialism, this is when we have abolished work and can enjoy the things human about ourselves, whatever we desire as the pressure of work no longer exists since work itself has been abolished, as Marx puts it;
_---while in communist society, where nobody has one exclusive sphere of activity but each can become accomplished in any branch he wishes, society regulates the general production and thus makes it possible for me to do one thing today and another tomorrow, _*_to hunt in the morning, fish in the afternoon, rear cattle in the evening, criticise after dinner, just as I have a mind, without ever becoming hunter, fisherman, herdsman or critic_*_ .”_
Yes, exactly 🎉
thanks
The point about Marxism being implemented keeping in view of the changing times, makes real sense!
Please brake down chapter more
Regarding your question with respect to dumping of products in the ocean and other corporate violations, there's a new upcoming model called ESG (Environment Social Governance), I suggest you look into it.
Great podcast.
lovely podcast
01:46:23 just came to know recently, Sitara group in Faisalabad has shut down most of its industries and invested in housing societies, only because of hurdles in industrial work and custom duties. When other industrialists also start doing this, this will cause even more downfall in the economy
The biggest crisis being faced by the human race these days is the division of Humans into Nations. So nowadays humans have stopped being born. These days citizens of countries are born. All humans are immediately linked to a nation after being born. Every Govt of a nation proudly proclaims that they have done everything possible for the benefit of their citizens which is usually at the cost of humans of another nation. Nationalism is the source of hatred in the hearts of the humans for other humans. Therefore, having nations on this planet is extremely dangerous for the sustainable existence of the human race. Both World War I and World War II occurred because of Nationalism. The main aim of any Nation is to become better than the other Nation and / or take over other Nations even at the cost of human life. If Nationalism is prevalent equitable life for entire humanity is impossible. There can never be peace in this world if Nations exit on this planet. Islam propagates Universalism and prohibits Nationalism. Universalism is the only way to achieve global peace. We immediately need redefine the world order by abolishing all Nations and work collectively towards developing a community of Humans who work towards the benefit of entire humanity and all humans on this planet as mentioned in the Holy Quran. Islam wants that the entire Humanity should have one Governing body ensuring equitable distribution of resources. Nationalism is a completely Un-Islamic concept. This world has been created by Allah for entire Humanity and no bunch of people can be allowed to hoard land just to benefit a handful of people. All resources in this world are for entire Humanity. Universalism can only be attained by following the laws of civilization mentioned by Allah in the Holy Quran not by laws created by Humans because such laws will always be biased.
loved the conversation, learned so much also how cute is Shahram?
Is that John Alia’s pic on top left behind the guest?
Shahzad ap ka podcast bauht acha hota hai pr ek cheez bauht prominent lgti hai ki ap Identity politics ko bauht emphasize krty hain.ap shayd usi lense se sb issues ko deikhty hain.regards
Shehzad is so jealous. Same here shehzad same here. So talented, so good looking, great voice. Sara capital to inke paas he.
AMAZINGLY, OUR NATION LIKES TO LISTEN TO THE TRUTH BUT IN DAILY CONVERSATION THE MAJORITY WANT TO SPEAK 2 MEANINGFUL TALKS? But I am VERY HAPPY COZ OUR NEW GENERATION TALK STRAIGHT AND ONE MEANING CONVERSATION.
wow what amazing podcast. finally an episode where you tried to challenge the ideas. agree with 95 percent of what shahram said. though i am a right wing capitalist but tried to understand his ideas. specially agree with his view that corruption is not the biggest problem. corruption comes from earnings. you cant just stop income to stop corruption, you cant distribute poverty haha. very well explained. challenging our core beliefs. Saturday night well spent . thanks for the interesting questions too. P.S. coal is already not profitable its not environment india is switching to renewable but solar in india is way cheaper than coal. gov buys electricity from adani solar for 3.10rs inr i.e. 6.50 pakistani rupee. also it will bring millions green job
Capitalism incentivizes corruption
@@aunthegeek5788 socialism equally distributes poverty and hunger
Socialism is a failed ideology.
02:55:46 haye, rula dia yar. Touched heart
سر حسین شہید سہروردی پاکستان کا پہلا وزیر اعظم تھا جن کو عزیز ہم وطنوں نے کرپشن پر نکالا تھا اور بعد میں پتا چلا کہ ان کے پاس اپنا ذاتی گھر بھی نہیں تھا بلکہ وہ ایک کرائے کے گھر میں رہتا تھا۔
Love from india
Historically all parties needs power though establishment only.
2:09 This is the point where that worker co-operative starts lobbying the government.
online workers are also proletariate but must remember tertiary sector essentially based on industrial sector.
Would love to write an email to Dr. Sahab, Aspiring Legum Doctor [In Shaa Allah]
2n3 parts ready
2:17:10 'Her' movie has shown that this isn't possible either
Although takka is Bangladeshi currency which is looked down upon by pakistanis and some people may use it in this context which is factually incorrect as of right now takka has more value as compared to pkr but takka was also considered one of units of rupee
Please invite hassan nishar on ur podcast.i m from India and a great admirer of him.
I am curious the money that pak armmyy coerces which pockets does it go to exactly. Are there few or many benefactors would love to hear shahrams or the hosts opinion on it
About the language thing. The official language of Muslim League before partition was also Urdu even though Jinnah barely spoke it and 2/3 of the League was made up of Bengalis or Punjabis. Because it was a "class" thing. A language of the "Muslim ashrafia".
Exactly,Aligarh
1:07:33 I’m dead 🤣🤣
1:11:18 punjabi was written in shahmukhi (arabo-persian) script before partition too and before gurmukhi, though the point about phonetics is right to some extent as gurmukhi was developed specifically for punjabi
Ayyaz Mallick is also best one .
मुझे लगता है कि शहज़ाद और शहरान की बंगाल का भारत में स्टेटस शायद थोड़ा नीचा है । In India Bengal certainly enjoys a very high status. Of all the Nobel Prize winners most have Bengal connection.
Rabindra Nath Tagore, CV Raman ( Calcutta University), Ramakrishna ( again Calcutta), Mother Teressa. Similarly Fims: Satyajit Ray, Bimal Roy, Guru Dutt ( again Calcutta connection), Mrinal Sen, etc
The problem with worker cooperatives is that they operate under a Market economy. You eliminate the boss because he's the big baddy but the worker becomes his own boss, exploiting his own labor to maximize profits, the element of competition exists, while your business is democratically managed by 10 of your co-workers, the other worker cooperative down the street can put you out of business. Aside from this obvious Capitalist contradiction, you haven't abolished private property, your worker cooperative is OWNED by 10 co-workers, while the idea is society collectively owning the means of production and investing for long-term gain, while the market economy will always incentivize short term gain and profit. The idea behind Leninist thought was, which I'm very disappointed about your view on since you have done lectures on Lenin's legacy on the Muqadimmah channel to make a WORKERS' State, which puts the workers' needs first and foremost. Lenin saw the state as an institution of oppression, but its institutions were constructed very smartly, to keep the Proletariat suppressed no matter what, the emphasis on overthrowing the state and building a new one is to utilize those tools against the very people who created it, it's the most efficient way to gain power. The withering away of the State is a key element of Leninism.
_The theory of the Communists may be summed up in the single sentence: Abolition of private property_
How is private property and wealth amassed ?
What's wrong in distribution of wealth amongst all the living ?
How will it happen ?
😍😍
Shahzad I dont live in pakistan but your podcasts make me feel connected to pakistan in so many ways. I do not listen to music anymore while driving and one 3hr long podcast lasts usually 3 to 4 days. This gives me another sort of joy which i cant describe honestly
@@ThePakistanExperience you are going to go a long way. More power to you. Stay safe
Im kinda a supportive of the ideology but the case what he say about south korea and war crimes and after that you saw that the person who have a very big role in making of south korea economy and you saw that his daughter is in jail for what reasons( can any body know). I dont think he have point there.
I am a Bernie Sanders follower , it was sad that how Americans like Obama pushed him aside.
Hey Shazad, did you just got confused between left and socialism? or i am wrong? I mean not every leftist is socialist?
how can you say these parties have become mature when there leaders call first lady as peerni and females as tractor trolley.
Mr. 10% name is not given by political parties. Infect, by those contractors who we’re paying this percentage to this political leader.
Nice one, please do one with Jawad Ahmed as well
You need to get that guy Ziyad Faisal Ismaili. Idk much about who or what that guy is/does, or is he even a guy who is famous/infamous enough to come talk, but his twitter is amazin
PMNL has historically comes from Gate number 4. Imran khan also came from same way.
02:56:18 the way he hides his face when you match him with Munna bhai 😂
1. If the argument is that people understand their own interests and PMLN and PPP are popular because the people understand they have their interests at heart, then TLP must also be popular for the same reason.
2. If leftists want to support the most democratic party at the moment, they should support JI... since it's the only mainstream party that actually has democratic selection of leadership is isn't just a cult of personality.
Great conversation and loved the views shared in the podcast. Have one comment on democracy: What is democracy: It is the dictatorship of a Group of People : Democracy is falling into cracks and is enroute to self destruct. Any system where 51% of selected selfish incompetent people can make any law which can go against mankind legal is bound to fail .. we knew this 1400 years ago.. there is nothing surprising here.. this was expected to happen.. until the hunger for power wealth and lust is not self controlled and people don’t realize they are mortals here on this planet for approx 70 years and therefore cannot own or hoard resources like land water minerals commodities which were given by God in abundance for all individuals to consume individuals cannot be called humans and this race of individuals cannot survive and will kill each other or kill this planet unless they become humans by eliminating divisions in terms of countries races sects color etc and believe in universalism which promotes peaceful existence of all on equal terms and resources
If you can joke why can’t anyone else
Beautiful ending. Bhai pr ab right ky logo ko bhi lao ak jaga tilt na kro.