Against the Darkmaster has excellent advice for creating villains -- not just the BBEG, but his lieutenants, who by themselves would make excellent D&D villains.
Making and running villains is one of the more fun aspects of role-playing games to me. You can really get into the nuts and bolts of player and character psychology and explore new stories based on how they react to villains. Similar to random NPC's who the players may adopt as allies, you don't always know which villain they'll REALLY hate until mid session. I do like to create villains ahead of time (that the players may or may not choose to deal with), but I'm always down to flesh out the sandbox goon who gets the players goat through circumstance.
Well-done as always Daniel. I would highly recommend the 1992 "Batman: the Animated Series" for referees studying what can be accomplished with small villains.
Great video! Working on my own rpg and we did a quick play test a few months ago. There was this obscure snake oil salesman in a bar I wrote in. Didn’t really give him any thought but the players really hated him. Long story short he turned into the players pick for the villain. Now I gotta actually write him in as a fleshed out NPC lol. Was not expecting it.
One of my most recent recurring villains was another adventuring party. They basically acted like your school bullies but the party couldn't do much but tolerate them. They were mote powerful and numerous and pushed their weight around. Both groups I have run through the campaign have hated them to the point of wanting to kill them. The first group already got to watch them die, happily.
Great advice. I love how you think. Currently, I am running an epic campaign on the world of Greyhawk for 2.5 years now, starting in Saltmarsh, Southern Keoland, starting in 576 (i.e. traditional starting year). I have two major factions, each with several super villains, who oppose the PCs, and might oppose each other. There is a lot of sceaming and plotting around the PCs and lots of opportunities for plot hooks. I let the super villains leveling up, but not as fast as the players. From time to time, the PCs are getting one of them, but usually at the end of a longer campaign, and I make the PCs hate the villain so much, they do almost everything to get them.
I totally agree with your thoughts here Daniel, especially in a sandbox and double in an ongoing campaign. Maybe BBEG, villains, and foils is how I would describe how I run it. Not every "Foil" is a big deal - it could be an overbearing father, a demanding lord, a dishonest patron, local gang, etc. that is part of the campaign fabric. As the party grows in experience and gathers more resources there is more scope for "real" villains and BBEG, but I like the idea of there being opposing forces in the "world" that the characters have to navigate that are not all "exploding volcano" level and also help the PC's exist in the world and not just the "game".
Have an NPC that one of the player characters (and the player) just doesn’t like. And I play NPC’s more gray than black&white. It’s funny because I love the improvisation between us. I’ll come right out and say “I know we can’t be liked by everyone and I don’t remember doing anything to you but whatever.” And it’s great when there’s tension between factious people that may not go anywhere. It makes the world real. It’s a blast.
I love this man... I think in my own headspace I was just thinking of ways I could make my players connect with various "antagonists" in the campaign... And you spell it out exactly as I needed to hear it. Good stuff!!
A good villain is one that can be sympathized with. They are doing what they see as right. They're just misguided, and zealous, but not unreasonable. I also like the untouchable kind of theme. Great video Daniel!
Villains are at range for sure. I love to look at comparisons like MAGNETO from the X-MEN, or MORGOTH from LOTR. There are those that are evil for evils sake, motivated by antagonistic means in the forefront or even at time hidden watching their evils unfold on the worlds. Then there are those that do not feel that they are evil or that they are "in the right". That greater good by way of evil. There is such a range for villains and even the description of villain is by definition the perception of others onto them. They may be doing things that to them are not evil, but to other they are beyond the levels of acceptance in societies and beyond. World changing villains reshape worlds were localized or limited villains can be touched, stopped, and impact smaller scale with more time resolved reward and recognition of fall. Some things are untouchables, they are beyond the now. That means they are paced in interaction, they are beyond the reach of the heroes, at least for now. Sometimes they are in the way of other villains. Evil is like death, it can be swayed, even delayed, but in the end all things that come to an end will be mantled by what is next. Love villain and their range in creative spaces. They are as measurable as success and fail in fantastical worlds.
Interesting take here... In the movie Pet Sematary who was the actual villain? Ultimately it was the Petroleum Plant that was constantly shipping down that road at all hours of the day. While mundane, its nonfeeling. The micmac burial grounds is the evil influence, but it can't be viewed as the villain any more than Gage could be. Because it had to be interacted with. The petroleum trucks were definitely the force racking up the most kills and acts as the primary reason the burial ground is even being used.
Great video! I always like to think about non-combat objectives, & this is a new take on that.... making killing the villain kind of an afterthought/irrelevant; the structure keeping him in power (both literal & societal bodyguards) is more powerful than he himself, and also merely killing him won't solve the problem & indeed might make things worse. Interesting!
As always, thanks for the advice on running sandboxes! Another form of on-going villain that I'm planning to introduce into my sandbox campaign are rival adventuring parties. I'm thinking of a high-level party that's dominated by a wizard turned lich that, as you mention, operates in the background. Another party may be one that is about the same level as the players' characters. These rascals may show up at inopportune times to vex the players in minor ways.
My friends wrote a heavily time-restrained dungeon. A temple where the priests invited people to show up and loot the place, and everyone still inside when time runs out becomes a voluntary sacrifice to flame and renewal. The encounter table had four competing adventuring parties around level 1-3. One group of vikings, tough people but disorganised. Four amazon hoplites who would move with more military discipline and face you with a spear and shield wall. One ad hoc group of thugs and thieves that skulked around and one group with a level 3 wizard and his three bodyguards. Neither is entirely hostile, but they are there for exactly the same reason. Looting the entire damn place.
@@SusCalvin That is a cool idea. I can imagine background events occurring where parcels of loot disappear from locations and end up in possession of the competing parties. Then as time runs low, the PCs have a choice to make whether to attack/loot the competing parties or negotiate and cooperate.
@@brautigan217 The four groups existed as random encounters, there was no way to track how they had moved around and explored. Only if the PCs ran into them inside a room did they get in the way of looting it. One group managed to meet all four groups. The thieves were efficiently looting a room when the PCs showed up but had left some hidden stuff. The vikings were trying and failing to find stuff in a barracks room. The amazons and the wizard were encountered in corridors. I know the Alien RPG expects you to track how other characters move. A xenomorph is a tremendous opponent but there is often a limited amount. If the soldier in room 5 patrols somewhere else, the two workers will be left alone. Every turn that the PCs move and do stuff, the xenomorphs or groups of humans around the place can move as well. Typically from one zone to another. If you have a motion tracker running, you can see blips move on the board.
Another good video the quality of your videos are excellent. Recently getting back into d&d and decided to DM b/x. Started with 3.5 in highschool so OSR is pretty new to me. I have a question I am making a mega dungeon and was wondering how you handled potions? I am probably going to have a small group of people 3-4 and wanted to increase the chance of survival with scrolls, potions and wands. Would you just straight up tell them what the potion is since they are low level. Asking a high level npc to identify them could take a while and lots of money.
As a barbarian I hear everything you’re saying really I do but on the other hand I have this big sword and really if you think about it it’s bigger than all their sword so what if I smash them then keep smashing more and then when all the bads are smashed I go find the villain and smash them then wait around a bit and smash any other bads that come. Why over complicate everything. Makes no sense. Subscribed to your channel though because it makes me think maybe there’s other ways to deal with problems than just smashing. Interesting. Maybe in the future I try telling them I won’t smash them if they be nice.
About DnD being a western: It seems to me, old school DnD - up to ADnD 2e - is the medieval fantasy equivalent of a western. Then there is Warhammer Fantasy, Mork Borg, Shadowdark and anything "grimdark", which are medieval spaghetti westerns. And then we have DnD's latest iterations up to 5e/Pathfinder, which completely deviate from the western type of story and are really medieval superhero tales.
Local villains are a great way to add smaller ticking clocks to reference the previous video. Do you have time to track down and depose the local bandit boss whose men take tolls on the road and bully the local villagers?
I prefer the type of villain who isn't seeking global domination or unleashing some ancient evil on the world, but the "I'm going to control my domain with an iron fist and you can't stop me".
I tend to make characters with a combined warrior, thief, cleric, wizard skillset (or paladin, bard, ranger) full of all sorts of combat and adventuring prowess, then intentionally point out the big gap in their skill set as being they're _not_ good at dealing with villains who use social influence (corrupt guild leaders, crime bosses, politicians). If the bad guys have good press, he can't just bash them over the head with a mace and expect their victims to laud him instead of lashing out at him. Recall how American forces _weren't_ hailed unilaterally as saviors when they ousted the Taliban in Afghanistan or Saddam Hussein in Iraq, as our military and citizenry had been conditioned to be the case for decades. Geopolitics are _complicated_ , and honestly small local politics might be even more complicated.
It's kinda difficult to make "untouchable" people in ttrpg. If this kingpin is so powerfull, party can see this power immediately and can't reach him, they probably won't be able to help locals. If they can help locals, but unable to reach him, most logical step to this kingpin is to harm locals or party really hard in retaliation (wich kinda punishes them for their intervention and desire to do good, wich is unfair and sucks). And if they can help locals AND able to rich him, can't imagine a scenario in wich anyone would not kill him, just for the satisfaction. Not impossible, but actually hard to make it work and looks organic.
Some villains just want to use their power to control others for their own good. To stop them making mistakes that the villain fears them making. The have made a judgement for other people about how those others can be permitted to act. 'Nobody must approach the dragon's cave, for the dragon is too dangerous.' This means they have to oppose the heroes' actions because they are defying the rules put there to protect them, or others.
I really like your videos but seeing you use AI-art for the thumbnail is just disappointing. Especially since you always encourage us the viewers to support creators. And this video is sponsored by real great artists.
That just comprises everything you have made and continue to make since I can't be sure that the scripts for your videos arent made with chatgpt and the like. @@BanditsKeep
Against the Darkmaster has excellent advice for creating villains -- not just the BBEG, but his lieutenants, who by themselves would make excellent D&D villains.
Nice!
Making and running villains is one of the more fun aspects of role-playing games to me. You can really get into the nuts and bolts of player and character psychology and explore new stories based on how they react to villains. Similar to random NPC's who the players may adopt as allies, you don't always know which villain they'll REALLY hate until mid session. I do like to create villains ahead of time (that the players may or may not choose to deal with), but I'm always down to flesh out the sandbox goon who gets the players goat through circumstance.
For sure
Well-done as always Daniel. I would highly recommend the 1992 "Batman: the Animated Series" for referees studying what can be accomplished with small villains.
Cool, I’ve definitely heard good things about the series
I indeed use villain and big bad evil gal interchangeably, for other kinds of opposition I prefer the term antagonists.
Cool
Great video! Working on my own rpg and we did a quick play test a few months ago. There was this obscure snake oil salesman in a bar I wrote in. Didn’t really give him any thought but the players really hated him. Long story short he turned into the players pick for the villain. Now I gotta actually write him in as a fleshed out NPC lol. Was not expecting it.
Nice!
One of my most recent recurring villains was another adventuring party. They basically acted like your school bullies but the party couldn't do much but tolerate them. They were mote powerful and numerous and pushed their weight around. Both groups I have run through the campaign have hated them to the point of wanting to kill them. The first group already got to watch them die, happily.
Nice
Love this!
S-tier advice as usual!
Thank You!
Great advice. I love how you think. Currently, I am running an epic campaign on the world of Greyhawk for 2.5 years now, starting in Saltmarsh, Southern Keoland, starting in 576 (i.e. traditional starting year). I have two major factions, each with several super villains, who oppose the PCs, and might oppose each other. There is a lot of sceaming and plotting around the PCs and lots of opportunities for plot hooks. I let the super villains leveling up, but not as fast as the players. From time to time, the PCs are getting one of them, but usually at the end of a longer campaign, and I make the PCs hate the villain so much, they do almost everything to get them.
Nice!
I am so jealous of your players!
Thank you for the quality content you present. It's very thoughtful and thought provoking.
Thanks!
Great ideas as always keep them up man!
Thank You!
I totally agree with your thoughts here Daniel, especially in a sandbox and double in an ongoing campaign. Maybe BBEG, villains, and foils is how I would describe how I run it. Not every "Foil" is a big deal - it could be an overbearing father, a demanding lord, a dishonest patron, local gang, etc. that is part of the campaign fabric. As the party grows in experience and gathers more resources there is more scope for "real" villains and BBEG, but I like the idea of there being opposing forces in the "world" that the characters have to navigate that are not all "exploding volcano" level and also help the PC's exist in the world and not just the "game".
For sure
Have an NPC that one of the player characters (and the player) just doesn’t like. And I play NPC’s more gray than black&white. It’s funny because I love the improvisation between us. I’ll come right out and say “I know we can’t be liked by everyone and I don’t remember doing anything to you but whatever.” And it’s great when there’s tension between factious people that may not go anywhere. It makes the world real. It’s a blast.
For sure
I love this man... I think in my own headspace I was just thinking of ways I could make my players connect with various "antagonists" in the campaign... And you spell it out exactly as I needed to hear it. Good stuff!!
Thank You!
Thanks, Daniel!
Thanks for watching
A good villain is one that can be sympathized with. They are doing what they see as right. They're just misguided, and zealous, but not unreasonable. I also like the untouchable kind of theme. Great video Daniel!
Thanks!
Good stuff mate.
Thank You!
I know you'll get this. Speaking of villains, you make me think of a phrase: "the kids. They called me Mr glass".
Ah yes
Villains are at range for sure. I love to look at comparisons like MAGNETO from the X-MEN, or MORGOTH from LOTR. There are those that are evil for evils sake, motivated by antagonistic means in the forefront or even at time hidden watching their evils unfold on the worlds. Then there are those that do not feel that they are evil or that they are "in the right". That greater good by way of evil. There is such a range for villains and even the description of villain is by definition the perception of others onto them. They may be doing things that to them are not evil, but to other they are beyond the levels of acceptance in societies and beyond. World changing villains reshape worlds were localized or limited villains can be touched, stopped, and impact smaller scale with more time resolved reward and recognition of fall. Some things are untouchables, they are beyond the now. That means they are paced in interaction, they are beyond the reach of the heroes, at least for now. Sometimes they are in the way of other villains. Evil is like death, it can be swayed, even delayed, but in the end all things that come to an end will be mantled by what is next. Love villain and their range in creative spaces. They are as measurable as success and fail in fantastical worlds.
Thwarting, Ending, and such isn't just reducing HP to zero. There are many many ways to reduce evil's effectiveness.
Indeed!
I like the way you think.
Thank You!
Great video!
Thanks!
Interesting take here... In the movie Pet Sematary who was the actual villain?
Ultimately it was the Petroleum Plant that was constantly shipping down that road at all hours of the day. While mundane, its nonfeeling.
The micmac burial grounds is the evil influence, but it can't be viewed as the villain any more than Gage could be. Because it had to be interacted with. The petroleum trucks were definitely the force racking up the most kills and acts as the primary reason the burial ground is even being used.
Interesting take
Great video! I always like to think about non-combat objectives, & this is a new take on that.... making killing the villain kind of an afterthought/irrelevant; the structure keeping him in power (both literal & societal bodyguards) is more powerful than he himself, and also merely killing him won't solve the problem & indeed might make things worse. Interesting!
Yes!
As always, thanks for the advice on running sandboxes! Another form of on-going villain that I'm planning to introduce into my sandbox campaign are rival adventuring parties. I'm thinking of a high-level party that's dominated by a wizard turned lich that, as you mention, operates in the background. Another party may be one that is about the same level as the players' characters. These rascals may show up at inopportune times to vex the players in minor ways.
My friends wrote a heavily time-restrained dungeon. A temple where the priests invited people to show up and loot the place, and everyone still inside when time runs out becomes a voluntary sacrifice to flame and renewal. The encounter table had four competing adventuring parties around level 1-3.
One group of vikings, tough people but disorganised. Four amazon hoplites who would move with more military discipline and face you with a spear and shield wall. One ad hoc group of thugs and thieves that skulked around and one group with a level 3 wizard and his three bodyguards. Neither is entirely hostile, but they are there for exactly the same reason. Looting the entire damn place.
@@SusCalvin That is a cool idea. I can imagine background events occurring where parcels of loot disappear from locations and end up in possession of the competing parties. Then as time runs low, the PCs have a choice to make whether to attack/loot the competing parties or negotiate and cooperate.
Rival parties can be super fun
@@brautigan217 The four groups existed as random encounters, there was no way to track how they had moved around and explored. Only if the PCs ran into them inside a room did they get in the way of looting it. One group managed to meet all four groups. The thieves were efficiently looting a room when the PCs showed up but had left some hidden stuff. The vikings were trying and failing to find stuff in a barracks room. The amazons and the wizard were encountered in corridors.
I know the Alien RPG expects you to track how other characters move. A xenomorph is a tremendous opponent but there is often a limited amount. If the soldier in room 5 patrols somewhere else, the two workers will be left alone. Every turn that the PCs move and do stuff, the xenomorphs or groups of humans around the place can move as well. Typically from one zone to another. If you have a motion tracker running, you can see blips move on the board.
Another good video the quality of your videos are excellent. Recently getting back into d&d and decided to DM b/x. Started with 3.5 in highschool so OSR is pretty new to me. I have a question I am making a mega dungeon and was wondering how you handled potions? I am probably going to have a small group of people 3-4 and wanted to increase the chance of survival with scrolls, potions and wands. Would you just straight up tell them what the potion is since they are low level. Asking a high level npc to identify them could take a while and lots of money.
If they take a sip they know what it is, of course if it’s poison that is bad
As a barbarian I hear everything you’re saying really I do but on the other hand I have this big sword and really if you think about it it’s bigger than all their sword so what if I smash them then keep smashing more and then when all the bads are smashed I go find the villain and smash them then wait around a bit and smash any other bads that come.
Why over complicate everything. Makes no sense.
Subscribed to your channel though because it makes me think maybe there’s other ways to deal with problems than just smashing. Interesting.
Maybe in the future I try telling them I won’t smash them if they be nice.
Sometimes smashing is the right answer
Just remember, it's pillage THEN burn
About DnD being a western: It seems to me, old school DnD - up to ADnD 2e - is the medieval fantasy equivalent of a western. Then there is Warhammer Fantasy, Mork Borg, Shadowdark and anything "grimdark", which are medieval spaghetti westerns. And then we have DnD's latest iterations up to 5e/Pathfinder, which completely deviate from the western type of story and are really medieval superhero tales.
Interesting take
Local villains are a great way to add smaller ticking clocks to reference the previous video. Do you have time to track down and depose the local bandit boss whose men take tolls on the road and bully the local villagers?
Sometimes you just have to grumble and pay the toll. You might, however, end up passing through again someday . . .
For sure
I prefer the type of villain who isn't seeking global domination or unleashing some ancient evil on the world, but the "I'm going to control my domain with an iron fist and you can't stop me".
For sure
Have you heard of the book series called fighter Fred?
I have not
I tend to make characters with a combined warrior, thief, cleric, wizard skillset (or paladin, bard, ranger) full of all sorts of combat and adventuring prowess, then intentionally point out the big gap in their skill set as being they're _not_ good at dealing with villains who use social influence (corrupt guild leaders, crime bosses, politicians). If the bad guys have good press, he can't just bash them over the head with a mace and expect their victims to laud him instead of lashing out at him.
Recall how American forces _weren't_ hailed unilaterally as saviors when they ousted the Taliban in Afghanistan or Saddam Hussein in Iraq, as our military and citizenry had been conditioned to be the case for decades. Geopolitics are _complicated_ , and honestly small local politics might be even more complicated.
Indeed
Is there anyway I could play a DCC single person game like in your DCC live play?
I did make a video about how I do it, that might be of use to you. I believe it was called “planning to improvise” or something like that
It's kinda difficult to make "untouchable" people in ttrpg. If this kingpin is so powerfull, party can see this power immediately and can't reach him, they probably won't be able to help locals. If they can help locals, but unable to reach him, most logical step to this kingpin is to harm locals or party really hard in retaliation (wich kinda punishes them for their intervention and desire to do good, wich is unfair and sucks). And if they can help locals AND able to rich him, can't imagine a scenario in wich anyone would not kill him, just for the satisfaction. Not impossible, but actually hard to make it work and looks organic.
I do it all the time - just have to place them in a way that what you are saying is not the case.
So does Bargle count as a villain here? While he's untouchable, I'm not sure he hits a lot of the other points.
For those who first experienced him in the red box, yes.
Cut scenes to your villains responing to the characters actions
Cut scenes? While you are playing with your group?
It's all fun and games until someone kills the hero's dog . . .
Indeed
Big Bad Evil Goofball, not all villains are guys.
Indeed
Some villains just want to use their power to control others for their own good. To stop them making mistakes that the villain fears them making. The have made a judgement for other people about how those others can be permitted to act. 'Nobody must approach the dragon's cave, for the dragon is too dangerous.' This means they have to oppose the heroes' actions because they are defying the rules put there to protect them, or others.
I really like your videos but seeing you use AI-art for the thumbnail is just disappointing. Especially since you always encourage us the viewers to support creators. And this video is sponsored by real great artists.
As someone in the arts (in my real life) I enjoy playing with technology.
That just comprises everything you have made and continue to make since I can't be sure that the scripts for your videos arent made with chatgpt and the like. @@BanditsKeep
@@madagrinde not sure if it is a complement, or an insult that you think it use a script.
@@BanditsKeep So I'm to assume that your videos are improvised on the spot including the topic with no preparation?
@@madagrinde This would be a nice conversation if I didn’t feel like you baiting me.