@@SuperKratosgamer Microsoft owns them both now, and as naive as this is, I hope Microsoft somehow gets them to comprise. They remind me of that one couple that everyone rooted for but they broke up and nothings been the same sense. (Although I love Obsidians work way more than Bethesda now :( )
Small point but when Vulpes tells you how nobody in Nipton fought back there's a dead wastelander with a laser rifle in the southern trailer park area that seemingly implies that Vulpes is lying. Not out of character for Vulpes to be honest.
I think he means when they had already rounded them up. Before one guy probably fought but it's not the point he was trying to make. It was an observation that these people were so scared for their own lives that they didn't think to fight back where they most likely could have won if they did.
It's even crazier once you realize people will live long enough to experience an entire century up to year 2100 considering it's possible to age up to 100 years old (and in exceedingly rare cases 110 years).
The part where Caesar mentions the worth of an individual to the state as means of production or to wage war is literally taken out of the Doctrine of Fascism by Mussolini and Gentile
Maybe it really was destiny for Caesar, or at least the best way to go about using his skills based on the world around him. The Blackfoots were *already* at war with their neighboring tribes. Heck, I bet more than half of the 86 tribes were in a state of near war long before Caesar was ever a thing. All Caesar did was show them what they wanted. He simply corrected their warmongering, and the tribes rewarded him for it and asked, “more”. Maybe the Legion wasn’t founded by Caesar, maybe Caesar was founded by the Legion. He’s just the only man with the bravery to be their leader they always wanted.
Do you think you could do a dive on the Imperium of Mankind from 40k specifically before how it went from a atheist military junta, to religious theocracy?
@@connorwgoode5681 It would make for an interesting video but its a very expansive setting that started back in 1987 where since then it has video games,books,tabletop war games and rpgs made for it. even with just the early Imperium of Man when it was athiestic ps: Amazing video the quality is amazing along with the representation.
The evolution of the IoM has been stranger than that. When the emperor tried to shift power to a civilian bureaucracy after Ullanor, the empire was shortly turned on its head. By the events of the War of the Beast, it became a religious military junta with a former admiral as Lord Commander with the real power being held by Lord High Admiral Langsung. After Vanorgrich's rule the IoM was divided over it should be theocracy or bureaucracy, until the theocracy triumphed under Vandire and after the reign of blood, the bureaucracy would win out.
@@connorwgoode5681 I’d be interested to see you cover 40k since there aren’t a lot of real political/thematic analysis. But like someone else commented here, 40k is an insanely expansive setting with the main series of books (Horus Heresy) well into the fifties now. Although imo I do think HH does a pretty good job of showing how the Imperium already had the basic skeleton of the nightmare it would become set up long before it began to rot
What if the Legion learned from its mistake at the first battle of Hoover dam? Caeser properly grooms a successor, they adopt a sniper/explosive corp., and adopt much more subversive tactics.
I feel prewar America, and the enclave in the lore has more in common with fascists than the legion. The legion seems more like a dark mirror of the ncr. They both are largely expansive, and exploit locals to enrich the state, or in the ncr’s case the richer and more powerful states. Both are emulating previous civilizations. I feel one problem with trying to define the legion is our lack of information on how the non military aspects operate. Do they build cities? Have large farms/ranches? They seem to be a mixture of Sparta and Rome with Sparta’s dependence on a slave class.
@@bradybaker7650 Caesar explains it perfectly. Hegelian dialectical process, collectivist ideology under one state, a hierarchical society with a strong leader held in the highest importance. Completely opposed to democracy and the weak capitalistic bureaucracy of the NCR as they see it. It pretty much falls exactly in line with fascist ideology but more violent and harsh since it’s adapted to a post-nuclear wasteland.
In trying to replicate Ancient Rome, Caesar thought he was avoiding the mistakes of the past. Not knowing, however, that he was repeating the mistakes of Nazi Germany, or of Italy under Mussolini, and other fascist nations.
@Mark Seriously? Did you even watch the video? Forget that, you even play the game? It seems pretty obvious, what with all the slavery and culling of the “inferior”, state enforced eugenics and rape, shunning all knowledge not provided by the dictator, deliberate ignorance and re-writing of history. Warmongering to reinforce cultural superiority and focus on the “enemy” profligates, total submission to the de facto ruler under penalty of death. They also destroy the cultures of tribes they absorb, forcing them to assimilate or die. You’re expected to praise the ideal of the Legion and Caesar, so much that you’d die to protect it. I go on, but if you knew anything about fascism, to quote Caesar himself, “maybe you’d learn about if you ever bothered to pick up and read a book”, and you wouldn’t have asked at all.
@@johnathanjarisch7323 That’s just not true, fascism can take hold without nationalism present. Umberto Eco’s essay “Ur-Fascism” discusses the manner in which fascism has many different elements that can label something as fascist. Rhetoric, economics, nationalism, racism, machismo, etc. can show different ways fascism can permeate in a social class or government gradually. However I do agree with you that nationalism is very much integral to fascism.
@@gooseneck5433 I'm not saying that fascism can't take hold without nationalism, just that in order to have something that is truly fascist, it has to be nationalist.
@@johnathanjarisch7323 looking back on my comment I hope it didn’t come off as too brash, you’re definitely correct. I just don’t want others to think that just because something appears fascist, but technically isn’t, it is to be dismissed or ignored.
Amazing video! I found this to be both insightful and entertaining to watch. The style and presentation is wonderful and I would be sure to watch further analytical videos from you. I would like to say that during the small segments of quote reading, that you should have people with higher quality mics and clearer voices to do those parts.
I'm not 100% sure they're actually fascist. Totalitarian, sure, but they're not always the same. The primary reasons why I think this is because they don't envision themselves as a national rebirth, nor do they have an out-group to use as a scapegoat. The only Fallout faction that is able to combine all of these is the Enclave (maybe the Fallout 4 BoS has some inklings as well). Plus, they have communistic values, like Sparta, in that there is no private ownership and there are no wealth distinctions. I would also say that Caesar is more Machiavellian than any fascist dictator history has provided. He has definitely studied The Prince it seems like, and he does seem to try and emulate himself after a Lycurgis or Romulus. He's also communitarian. Based off this evaluation, he seems more left leaning to me, like Authoritarian-Left on the traditional political compass. However, if you view his ideas on culture as some sort of ultra nationalism, that might pull him to the right some. I'm not too sure how to think about that aspect, what do you think?
You argue that the NCR is the out group, but I dont think they really apply. They're not a group within. They're an external enemy, like the enemy of all countries, they are viewed as inferior and propagandized. That's not anything unqiue to fascism. The US did this to Germany in both world wars, Japan in ww2, the British against Napoleon, etc.
I also don't think selling lies to the populace is fascist in the slightest, nor are national myths. In fact, republics feature national myths more than any other type of regime. The Romans had myths that they descended from gods, and Americans view their founders as deific people as well, and believed in things like Manifest Destiny. But back to the lies thing, I'm sure you know the phrase "history is written by the victor." Truth is established by the dominant culture, and they often leave several things out. For example, America leaves out much about the atrocities they've committed throughout history, like Japanese internment camps, and they retell the Pearl Harbor bombing in 1941 as if Pearl Harbor was the only thing that happened that day (in fact, Japan had bombed the Philippines, a US territory at the time, and they had invaded the Aleutian Islands, part of Alaska). More examples are with the colonization of the New World, where the British and French perpetuate the Black Legend, making the Spanish out to be violent monsters, but do not tell the whole story. Some things fit the dominant narrative better than other things, and so history is constructed in a certain manner
Communism as defined as a stateless classes moneyless society means Caesers Legion is in no way Communist. There is no communal property, no workers democratically deciding their work, there is a class system with slaves being at the bottom level. Socialism being defined as Workers control over the means of production means Caesers Legion isnt even Socialist. No worker has any control over any means, its all for Caeser to arm his legionaries, not for the betterment of the workers. Caesers Legion is no where to the left, not at all. The Legion are definitely Fascist, The out group is the NCR, with Caeser presenting them as the Thesis to the legions antithesis. You have a might is right attitude through the Legions obliteration of tribal identity, only the Legion identity is allowed to exist. There is a rejection of Modernism with the refusal to allow Legionaries to use modern weapons or even long range weapons. There's supremacy of the military, rampant sexism with enslaving almost all women. It all point to Fascism. Caesers Legion might not be the typical easy to spot Fascism of the Nazis or the Italian Fascists but it does have, and actively works to perpetuate, all the features of Fascism, and most importantly not Communism
Yeah, that's cool and all but your Fallout New Vegas world-space looks fresh as hell especially around the Chapter 2 segment. What mods you running for that kind of FOV and clear world and textures?
I think it was the Ojo Bueno texture pack, with the MGs Neat Clutter mod mixed in there, that I have and also the 47 the sequel ENB. EDIT: and the Textures Over Time mod, forgot to mention that one. I use that to overwrite the Ojo rock textures since I prefer TOT versions.
That's something I always found amazing with the Legion. They are STRICTLY fascist. The problem is when we call "fascism" to any sort of nationalist and/or reactionary movement. True fascism was conceived in Italy, and many times it standed against other authoritarian regimes (nazism, francoism, stalinism, etc.). The Legion represents what Mussolini truly wanted to achieve. While nazis and communist only use the State as a medium to an end (Lebensraum and communism, respectively), fascism sees it as the ultimate goal. The fascist State is where this doesn't differentiate from its individuals, as they are a unified body. Unlike other examples of authoritarianism, this is a truly totalitarian State. Also, the fact that Caesar mentions Hegelian philosophy makes me think the developers really knew what they were doing, as fascist philosophy is heavily inspired by Hegel's.
1:08 Well . . . yeah. Caesar outright says he's a fascist. He uses that word directly. What really gets me is that The Frontier mod has brought out a bunch of people who _don't_ think the Enclave is fascist. Cringey dialogue in the mod notwithstanding, that's an undeniable fact.
@CHB Ryan You are flatly incorrect. Nazi Germany was fine with big industry. Capitalism is the private ownership of, well, capital. And the means of production. It just doesn't specify who or what necessarily. A hyper-privatized industry collected in the hands of an elite is still capitalism. Sorry, buddy. Some sociologists and political theorists outright include the willing collusion of "traditional elites" in their definition of fascism ( Robert Paxton). By which he means, essentially, rich people who own a lot of stuff. I don't even know where you get the idea Enclave is capitalist because they aren't a business or about making profit. They're quite literally paramilitary (or just plain military in their own eyes) and themselves behave like they're still the politicians and staff that retreated to the bunkers back when the bombs dropped. Their entire agenda is plainly about race purity and restoring their vision of a Pre-War United States nation, completely to detriment of the people who already live in the wastes. Bethesda even made it more obvious by playing on the double meaning of Project Purity. (I can almost imagine Todd Howard elbowing me asking me if I got the joke. Get it? Because it's about ethnic cleansing!) Like how is it that people look at the Enclave's evil plans to purge the population with a literal bioweapon, based on their perceived lack of genetic purity, and not get the hint that these people are basically American Nazis? _It's not a subtle bad guy._ Holy shit people. No wonder we have a world-wide problem with far-right extremist movements. They're so dumb they walk straight into colluding with fascists because they're that ignorant and lacking in critical thought. And no, race purity policies are not supposed to be rational. That's the damn point. If you think we're not doing enough about immigration and that we have a pressing problem with miscegenation or the dilution of our culture, you're probably the bad guy. People don't go 0-to-100 into the Holocaust for no reason, it is a process where you look at sensible policy and go, "Well that doesn't go far enough, I know so because a politician told me the rapists are coming to take our jobs. Let's build a wall that won't solve the problem which also only exists in fantasy." And to nobody's surprise, that doesn't work, so they keep going harder. Whether they do so out of ignorance or merely needed a justification for their hatred makes no difference anymore at that point. That's how you get Nazis.
@CHB Ryan You have severe reading comprehension problems. I suggest you go back and quote back to me the part where I said you were pro-Enclave, or implied it. I said that you're flatly wrong about them being capitalist. Also: That wasn't their plan. They created a method to inoculate the Enclave against the virus. At least, that's how it worked in Fallout 2. Not sure what it was in Fallout 3, but I ignore Bethesda canon anyway. It also doesn't modify my point in any way. It's their intentions that are important, not whether they're incompetent about achieving their stated goals. If anything, the Enclave pretty well represents how the alt-right has been behaving recently. Like I said, they propose nonsense policy solutions to non-existent fantasy problems while downplaying real ones. (Building the wall but ignoring the pandemic.) Back then I thought the Enclave were too obvious and cheesy, but it seems like reality wants to prove me wrong. If anything, they're way too cool and the reality is far more buffoonish.
Caesar him self literally defines his nation as a supremacist authoritarian nation state that obliterates the cultures of all those it absorbs to keep mankind from fracturing. Aside form conquering things this has nothing to do with the khanates of the past. The khanates of the past let the people they absorbed worship who they wanted and have freedom and autonomy to live as they please. Not only that but women had an upfront ruling role in mongol life and politics. Not in the legion
@@gwynjustice6664 Thank you! Genghis Khan literally invented a welfare system that broke with Mongol tradition by dividing resources and plunder among the widows, children, and invalids, who could not support themselves in the traditional method of division. It's crazy to me that people misunderstand that their brutality was more a matter of strategy than a fundamental pillar of their society. Even the Roman Empire which the Legion superficially models itself after was quite syncretic and permissive (if not particularly egalitarian,) especially compared to the way the Legion organizes its' society. Fascists are always historically illiterate, lol.
Caesar's Legion seem to be pure utilitarians where the ends always justify the means. As Caesar explains, the worth of each individual is defined by their utility to the state. They view individualism as weak and degenerate. Concepts such as private property and individual rights are seen by them as immoral when they come into conflict with what they perceive as being better for the community as a whole.
Which is hilarious, since the entire legion is the private property of Caesar himself; and he has the most extreme of individual rights realized for himself. Caesar's legion would be better if it was a ruthless meritocracy that embraced individualism for those strong enough to rise up; and the position of Caesar should be open to constant competition for whoever is the best amongst the legion. Caesar's most capable legionnaires are his most independent minded; Vulpes & The Legate.
Is there an argument to state that Caesar’s legion is not a fascist regime, but a different kind of totalitarianism? Fascism usually relied on technology as a means to promote itself. The Legion sounds more aligned with a reactionary, esoteric, traditionalist regime similar to what Julius Evola envisioned.
He's basing his opinion on modern lol evil=fascism thinking. Caesars legion is a totalitarian dictatorship. Nothing he said was comparable to caesars legion.
This the first time I’ve heard vulpes speech and use “you” and “your”. Whenever I hear it he says “they” and “their”. Probably cause you were allied with NCR but it’s just an interesting little detail
@@connorwgoode5681 I can be lazier and dumber, or I can be more intellectual and get ignored. This problem does not stem from you specifically but is systematically perpetuated by social norms and promoted by neoliberal intelligencia(Government, academia, corporate media, et cetera). I could get into the specifics of what fascism actually is and what it is not, as well as suggest a list of resources and books by fascist intellectuals or non biased observers of fascist countries and movements in actions, or even the bare minimum of the founding philosophy and ideologues behind it: EG. Gentile, however nobody wants to actually do their research, and would rather parrot the socially accepted buzzwords and talking points of "Ur-fascism", "fascism=racist authoritarianism" "fascism=politically suppression" "fascism=everything against the current neoliberal/capitalist society values". Quite literally modern peoples are programmed to view fascism=everything bad, and if ever questioned on this, instead of citing unbiased third party sources, or the most accurate first party policies, philosophies, writings from fascists themselves, like you would do any other subject or ideology, you only get opinions from communist/capitalist/Jewish ANTIFASCISTS who happen to have some sheet of paper behind them validating their clearly biased subjective "observations", who obviously have an agenda to define fascism as negatively as possible. In the words of George Orwell: "By ‘Fascism’ they mean, roughly speaking, something cruel, unscrupulous, arrogant, obscurantist, anti-liberal and anti-working-class. Except for the relatively small number of Fascist sympathizers, almost any English person would accept ‘bully’ as a synonym for ‘Fascist’. That is about as near to a definition as this much-abused word has come."
@@connorwgoode5681 The left-wing definition of fascism is so loose that it could describe anything from modern society to pre-history, i wonder what that could mean.
@@fallout1953 literally what are you talking about? I never even defined fascism and you say "I guess based on your definitions you didn't give that means XYZ obvious strawman "? What are you on about?
Honestly the legion is very interesting to me, because we all judge them based off of our standards . The fall out world is very different from ours, however, I don't want to defend them because I hate them, but I can see why this kind of society would thrive and many would think they are necessary
Isn't that viewpoint countered by the fact that there are many post-war societies that exist without fascism? The NCR is the most obvious example, they share many values that western society have today, and they've managed to be an equal to Ceasar - he acknowledges that himself. The Legion's fascist views are a method for survival in a post-apocalypse, but they're far from necessary.
@@matt4048 The NCR is in no way a modern democracy, it is at best a representation of the US in the 1800s. Expansionism, de facto segregation with mutants, the existence of a brahmin-baron caste that increases in power every day, outright genocidal tendencies towards indigenous tribes, etc.
@@matt4048 ncr is dying, and one could say that for the legion this methods were necessary, legion didn't have all the technology that NCR did, so it was their method
Stumbled across this video while thinking about the strong fascistic tendencies Caesar's legion. Great analysis. Happy to add another breadtuber to my subscriptions.
On another video could you talk about androids in videogames? In Fallout 4, Detroit become human and even Borderlands at some point treat them like metal-people. Yes, in the first 2 that’s the plot’s primary Theme, but those games make it too easy to decide. The only time I questioned it was while seeing a fan-made short of Overwatch where Seniata tells Genji about the omnics. I don’t know, I thought it would be a nice idea for a video. See ya!
There were probably as many ways to pronounce latin as there were regions in the Roman Empire, though a lot of books of that era seem to agree that C had a K sound, thus making Ceasar something akin to "Kaisar" (This is why Germany, who saw themselves as descendants of the Holy Roman Empire, had a title called Kaiser, the Emperor) rather than See-Sar
if you care about political language to the degree of autism i'd say that legion resembles some form of militarist fundamentalism than actual fascism. For one they aren't a big fan of using firearms or high tech, they also forbid the use of drugs. try to compare them how nazis were in ww2 and you'll see my point.
Is it bad that I join the legion in every play through I do purely because of how awful and barbaric they are? It’s quite interesting. The first time I played the game I was much younger and liked the legion because they reminded me of Rome. Now it’s just because they are so evil (and for some reason I always like playing the bad guy in video games).
@@deadprank947 Every time and in every situation it depends on the system of beliefs (and they are can be VERY different from human to human). There are no objectively evil or good factions. Not in the game, not in the real world. How old are you? Do I really need to explain it?
@@trickytrack00 You wouldn’t consider rape, murder, and slavery to be objectively evil? That’s the problem with this stupid line of thought; no one ever actually says anything meaningful with it, they’re just spouting bullshit they think makes them look smart.
Fascism literally requires a nation, the legion is an army without a nation. Read some books and learn what words mean. Even Caesar says once new Vegas is conquered his nation can form as a synthesis of the legion and ncr. It seems all too common that people spend all their time trying to link fictional factions to real life ideologies for brownie points instead of paying attention to the lore. The closest real world example of the legion would be Sparta and the helots.
@@yaboicowboi578 You're an idiot if you think that fascism is not a form of governance. If you conflate fascism for an ideology then you divorce yourself from reality. Seeing as how Fascism is a highly authoritarian political belief of "whatever is best for the state" which is willing to crush anyone who is deemed as a detriment or even those who aren't a benefit. Saying fascism isn't a governmental system quite literally boils down the only defining part of fascism is authoritarian. People need to stop believing everything they read on twitter.
@@yaboicowboi578 Sounds like you have yet to start. A vague catchall response because you and I both know that fascism is a very specific thing and it can be clearly defined. Unlike you I have read about the worst of humanity, not simply listen to videos of pseudo intellectuals.
It was an interesting turn by Bethesda and was a gateway due to their isolationist mentality. They were withering away by the time of New Vegas and were willing to die by their codex. The eastern BOS, from what I remembered, returned to their old ways of wanting to preserve technology by drastic measures; intimidation, terror, a cult of personality, believing BOS members are superior to wastelanders (similar to how fascists use nationalism to their own ends) and *othering* androids (even though androids are capable of human thought, they don't care which means they are purposely hurting beings of sentient thought). I'll have to catch up on the lore of the BOS since I'm covering them in huge essay video about totalitarianism.
I wouldnt call them fascist since fascism is result of reaction to socialism which only comes after capitalism. This is just bunch of empowered communalist groups
1, 2, 3, new Vegas, it's only bethesda that made them idiots, I hope Veronica somehow takes control of the west coast or even has just more pull among them, they could finally live up to the original ideals of the BoS, maybe help the people of westside and the like
THe only reason the Legion could possibly be sensible, is the fact that it's set in a post apocalyptic setting, you have raiders, mutants, few major governments. SOmetimes in a brutal world you need brutal rule. I like the dicotemy between the NCR and Legion. The NCR is larger and more powerful in equipment and possibly manpower, they have freedoms and attempt democracy, yet they're too massive to run efficiantly, there is corruption and sometimes it does opress people. The Legion is ruled largely by one man giving out authority as he sees fit, this means the Legion is quicker on policy and action as Ceasar just needs to decree it and it gets done if the Legion can accomplish the task. Thier soldiers are more skilled in melee combat and don't need to rely on firearms when needed, they have more security as they wipe out or integrate Raider groups they encounter, but they are opressive and enslave people, men are forced largely into the miliary and women are made essentially breeding stock and slaves. THe Legion is also stable only as long as Caesar and Legate Lanius are still alive, as it's members can be capable soldiers and officers, but likely don't have the needed knowledge for governance, thus the Legion could easily fall apart to infighting at the deaths of these 2. THe NCR offers more freedoms, but is hindered by buerocracy and corruption an law is harder to maintain yet is resiliant if it's leaders die, the Legion is more powerful and dicisive and orderly, but less resiliant if it's leaders are killed and they enslave and oppress.
I think they’re more of a Roman style autocracy rather than a plainly 20th century fascist dictatorship. I can’t deny they have aspects aligned with fascism, especially Mussolini style, but they aren’t trying to be neo-Roman empire like Mussolini with all of the racist tendencies and master race crap, but an actual Roman Empire or as close as they can get to the ancient empire from the other side of the world, but without all of the culture and civilian side backing the military. What we see in game is the purely militant side of legion culture, it would be like living in Gaul during ancient times and your only impression of Rome is Caesar and his army. I agree with a few points in your video but I don’t think we can assume all of what the legion is from purely the military and how they and their slaves act and do without a complete picture
“Fascism” and “dictator” have different definitions on what time you’re in. The ancient dictator had no negative connotation since it was a position an individual was given in a crisis. The dictator made all the choices that would abate the crisis. Modern dictators are totalitarians with how we use “dictator.” A fascist also does not have to be right wing. If you encountered what you would call a fascist country in the 1700’s, would the “right wing/ left wing” dichotomy we use now even apply? Would our left/right dichotomy of politics even matter to someone in the future such as Ulysses?
I think he's a lot like Mussolini in that Mussolini came from a socialist faction and Edward Sallow came from the followers of the apocalypse, which is some kind of revolutionary anarchist faction, I mean the context of the time is different but it's vaguely similar
I'm not going to argue with your definitions beging as though you read them and didn't make them on your own, however Fascism in practice can be just as far left as far right. For instance most would agree that Joseph Stallin was a fascist, but under the communism he ran Russia with that is a far left political ideology. And the only thing Nazi's have in common with today's political right is wanting a strong nation. Racism is not a political view point of the right anymore than the left. It's an individual tribalistic morality. So when today's right advocate for a strong nation they mean the nation not just their own race within said nation. But I did enjoy what I heard other than that
I would really like this video if it wasn't so partisan, its little digs like "pre war America and many other capitalist countries have fallen apart due to lack of resources...". Well every country in the world including communist china, and according to the lore i believe the soviet union too suffered, as well as everywhere else. It was a resource war, everyone was effected, so why the aggression specifically toward capitalism? Also U should focus more on Mussolini and fascist doctrine rather than specifically Nazism, its more thematically relevant and has many more similarities, and references to trans genderism is weird given it wasn't really something in mainstream discourse during fascisms rise or in New Vegas. U should watch some short fat otaku and Aydin paladin videos to supplement your contrapoints viewing.
You do know that the Nazis burned transgender books in their book burnings correct? It was one of the key texts they sought to destroy. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institut_für_Sexualwissenschaft (the articles of the Institute for clarity)
You may just want to accept the fact that his left leaning views are more correct than any right leaning views on fascism. If you have a problem with left leaning views being factually correct when criticizing fascism, then I suppose you have an issue with facts. It can be argued that going to the right of liberalism (centrist) is inherently far right. A genuine conservative wants to preserve the liberal status quo, whereas a fascist wants to turn back the clock, a feat that is impossible.
This is dumb and has nothing to do with an analysis of any real world primary sources from Germany or Italy. It is ironically itself a mythologized history that would not be sympathetic or reflective of any of the cultures you're talking about.
You should do a video like this about the brotherhood of steel on the eastcoast, theyre by far the most screwed up when you look into it, they now have some kind of racial superiority thing going on with arthur maxson and his terrible beliefs, which justify their raiding of farms and the outright destruction of rivet city, and the implied massacre that would follow due to rivet city being a self sufficient, well armed city full of eager citizens with plenty of merchants. They also kinda treat gen 3 synths as subhuman and as badly as possible despite them being the same as regular humans for better or for worse, like danse, curie, mayor mcdonaugh(?), and that raider boss.
@@centercannothold Basically the same thing. Fascist military junta with a socially conservative bend. Really disgusting people. I'd argue they aren't people at all.
@@ThunderTheBlackShadowKitty ... The FO4 Brotherhood might be a joke compared to the earlier iterations of the faction like in FONV or FO2. But to say they aren't people because their leader is an insane dictator is... a bit much. Unlike the Legion the FO4 BOS is poorly written and poorly depicted in-game, that's not because the characters lack humanity and are barely people, it's because they are written terribly. A trend you see across all the factions in FO4 especially The Institute and the Railroad.
its sad how Bot people are around "fascism" the Enclave is the series fascism i.e Nazism The Legionary is literally a Guy who wants to build a new Rome
I'm trying to role play a legion character and as a socialist, getting into the facist mindset is pretty hard. This video is a great help for getting into the legion mindset for a new playthrough
Fascism can be left or right wing it doesn't really matter. It's essentially collectivism and the rule of a individual, party and/or ideology taken to its extremes. Plus the nazi's were alot more aligned with left wing ideas hence the term national socialism. It's a few right wing values and ideas done in a left wing socialist collectivist system.
The Nazis were not left-wing, they called themselves socialists to get working class people to support them instead of the communist and social democrat party. They even killed socialists and communists. Plus, they privatised the German economy which was why the bourgeoisie were supportive of the Nazis and the party destroyed labour rights of workers. I would advise reading into this because no academic agrees with this assertion that the Nazis aligned up with left-wing ideas, especially considering the Nazis themselves openly hated leftists.
@@connorwgoode5681 Yeah not totally right wing though. Fascism doesn't really belong in political compasses as it can be collectivism on practically anything. Race, religion, feelings, identity politics we see today, social issues or justice, communism, capitalism list goes on and on. Do like New Vegas and how it gave a compelling argument for each faction well besides Yes Man as well the courier isn't really experienced in building a nation. Reason I still think House is best although not the way the games ending is, is simple. He cares about humanity itself. Ending I'd have liked and was sadly cut was to side with the NCR and convince Mr House to not surrender but become a citizen of the NCR he'd be the governor of the state in a way. That way NCR continues to annex South west and house is allowed to carry out his vision
The nazis were the right wing equivalent to left wing totalitarianism (on paper). They're similar but also very different for a few key reasons. The same reasons which split the left and right wings in the first place.
you don't have to be a defect who unironically agrees with them to enjoy the legion, they make very good villains and if you ever decide to do an evil playthrough you should definitely side with them.
It really is a crime that a good chunk of Legion story was cut if we ever get a remaster maybe we’ll get some of that cut content
That would be nice to see.
@@connorwgoode5681 If we don't like it, censor it.
Cause that will stop history repeating itself?
@@connorwgoode5681 Legio optima, Legio victorius, mors in Nova Republica California
nah remasters dont put new stuff in, only remakes do that. But i dont think bethesda would do that, since it was obsidian who developed the game.
@@SuperKratosgamer Microsoft owns them both now, and as naive as this is, I hope Microsoft somehow gets them to comprise. They remind me of that one couple that everyone rooted for but they broke up and nothings been the same sense. (Although I love Obsidians work way more than Bethesda now :( )
when the profligate is nailed to a cross
bottom text
wheres my legion supremacists at?
@@basedqacist7526 Adsum amice!
@@basedqacist7526 in the cuck shed of course, where else?
Faction X vs Faction Y in FNV
Your Warcrimes: Cringe and horrific
My Warcrimes: Based and justified
War, war never changes
The Balkans want to know how you got their number
This might be the most insightful thing ever posted on the internet
A war crime committed against the legion is an oxymoron, it's a war service to humanity. You can only commit war crimes against people not facists
My opinion: based
Your opinion: cringe
@@markkars8754 Deep
Small point but when Vulpes tells you how nobody in Nipton fought back there's a dead wastelander with a laser rifle in the southern trailer park area that seemingly implies that Vulpes is lying. Not out of character for Vulpes to be honest.
I think he means when they had already rounded them up. Before one guy probably fought but it's not the point he was trying to make. It was an observation that these people were so scared for their own lives that they didn't think to fight back where they most likely could have won if they did.
Yeah, plus there's a pile of ash next to that guy with legion gear
You're like 20 at the oldest and I feel ancient.
Your guess was spot on.
@@connorwgoode5681 I mean, it's not a guess. You said you were ten in 2010.
Yeah when he said he was 10… I cried a little. Enjoy the long life ahead of you mate lol
It's even crazier once you realize people will live long enough to experience an entire century up to year 2100 considering it's possible to age up to 100 years old (and in exceedingly rare cases 110 years).
You put the Legion being fash as some heavily concealed cryptic stuff when Caesar is practically quoting Giovanni Gentile and Georges Sorel.
Real shit? What quotes?
Wasn't he quoting literally Maos' "On Contradiction"?
The part where Caesar mentions the worth of an individual to the state as means of production or to wage war is literally taken out of the Doctrine of Fascism by Mussolini and Gentile
"The Legion are fascists"
*gasp* No? Really? Who would've thought?
If Caesar is not the son of Mars, explain how he defeat 87 tribes and make the most powerful factions of post war America look like little bitches
Maybe it really was destiny for Caesar, or at least the best way to go about using his skills based on the world around him. The Blackfoots were *already* at war with their neighboring tribes. Heck, I bet more than half of the 86 tribes were in a state of near war long before Caesar was ever a thing. All Caesar did was show them what they wanted. He simply corrected their warmongering, and the tribes rewarded him for it and asked, “more”.
Maybe the Legion wasn’t founded by Caesar, maybe Caesar was founded by the Legion. He’s just the only man with the bravery to be their leader they always wanted.
🤯
Interesting take
Do you think you could do a dive on the Imperium of Mankind from 40k specifically before how it went from a atheist military junta, to religious theocracy?
That sounds interesting to do but I’ve never played that game.
@@connorwgoode5681 It would make for an interesting video but its a very expansive setting that started back in 1987 where since then it has video games,books,tabletop war games and rpgs made for it.
even with just the early Imperium of Man when it was athiestic
ps: Amazing video the quality is amazing along with the representation.
The evolution of the IoM has been stranger than that. When the emperor tried to shift power to a civilian bureaucracy after Ullanor, the empire was shortly turned on its head. By the events of the War of the Beast, it became a religious military junta with a former admiral as Lord Commander with the real power being held by Lord High Admiral Langsung. After Vanorgrich's rule the IoM was divided over it should be theocracy or bureaucracy, until the theocracy triumphed under Vandire and after the reign of blood, the bureaucracy would win out.
@@connorwgoode5681 *laughter*
You fool...
@@connorwgoode5681 I’d be interested to see you cover 40k since there aren’t a lot of real political/thematic analysis. But like someone else commented here, 40k is an insanely expansive setting with the main series of books (Horus Heresy) well into the fifties now. Although imo I do think HH does a pretty good job of showing how the Imperium already had the basic skeleton of the nightmare it would become set up long before it began to rot
The Legion in behavior and structure are much more like a central Asian steppe army like that of Timur or Attila.
What if the Legion learned from its mistake at the first battle of Hoover dam? Caeser properly grooms a successor, they adopt a sniper/explosive corp., and adopt much more subversive tactics.
Really good video! Fallout New Vegas truly is a masterpiece.
I can never manage to stop killing the Legion long enough to talk to them, so I appreciate this dive.
I'm glad you enjoyed it. Thank you.
I have the same issue but with the NCR.
@@joko49perez YES.
@@joko49perez based
@@ill8485 boone is one of the few likable ncr members
I feel prewar America, and the enclave in the lore has more in common with fascists than the legion. The legion seems more like a dark mirror of the ncr. They both are largely expansive, and exploit locals to enrich the state, or in the ncr’s case the richer and more powerful states. Both are emulating previous civilizations. I feel one problem with trying to define the legion is our lack of information on how the non military aspects operate. Do they build cities? Have large farms/ranches? They seem to be a mixture of Sparta and Rome with Sparta’s dependence on a slave class.
Classical colonialism vs neo-colonialism?
@@BR-bn1mz I’m ignorant to the difference between the two
No, the legion is extremely similar to a fascist system in ideology and structure.
@@np4231 how so?
@@bradybaker7650 Caesar explains it perfectly. Hegelian dialectical process, collectivist ideology under one state, a hierarchical society with a strong leader held in the highest importance. Completely opposed to democracy and the weak capitalistic bureaucracy of the NCR as they see it. It pretty much falls exactly in line with fascist ideology but more violent and harsh since it’s adapted to a post-nuclear wasteland.
In trying to replicate Ancient Rome, Caesar thought he was avoiding the mistakes of the past. Not knowing, however, that he was repeating the mistakes of Nazi Germany, or of Italy under Mussolini, and other fascist nations.
@Mark Seriously? Did you even watch the video? Forget that, you even play the game?
It seems pretty obvious, what with all the slavery and culling of the “inferior”, state enforced eugenics and rape, shunning all knowledge not provided by the dictator, deliberate ignorance and re-writing of history. Warmongering to reinforce cultural superiority and focus on the “enemy” profligates, total submission to the de facto ruler under penalty of death. They also destroy the cultures of tribes they absorb, forcing them to assimilate or die. You’re expected to praise the ideal of the Legion and Caesar, so much that you’d die to protect it. I go on, but if you knew anything about fascism, to quote Caesar himself, “maybe you’d learn about if you ever bothered to pick up and read a book”, and you wouldn’t have asked at all.
@@BLK_MN The belief of national superiority is central to fascism. Remove that and you really don't have fascism anymore, just something like it.
@@johnathanjarisch7323 That’s just not true, fascism can take hold without nationalism present. Umberto Eco’s essay “Ur-Fascism” discusses the manner in which fascism has many different elements that can label something as fascist. Rhetoric, economics, nationalism, racism, machismo, etc. can show different ways fascism can permeate in a social class or government gradually. However I do agree with you that nationalism is very much integral to fascism.
@@gooseneck5433 I'm not saying that fascism can't take hold without nationalism, just that in order to have something that is truly fascist, it has to be nationalist.
@@johnathanjarisch7323 looking back on my comment I hope it didn’t come off as too brash, you’re definitely correct. I just don’t want others to think that just because something appears fascist, but technically isn’t, it is to be dismissed or ignored.
Amazing video! I found this to be both insightful and entertaining to watch. The style and presentation is wonderful and I would be sure to watch further analytical videos from you. I would like to say that during the small segments of quote reading, that you should have people with higher quality mics and clearer voices to do those parts.
I'm not 100% sure they're actually fascist. Totalitarian, sure, but they're not always the same. The primary reasons why I think this is because they don't envision themselves as a national rebirth, nor do they have an out-group to use as a scapegoat. The only Fallout faction that is able to combine all of these is the Enclave (maybe the Fallout 4 BoS has some inklings as well). Plus, they have communistic values, like Sparta, in that there is no private ownership and there are no wealth distinctions. I would also say that Caesar is more Machiavellian than any fascist dictator history has provided. He has definitely studied The Prince it seems like, and he does seem to try and emulate himself after a Lycurgis or Romulus. He's also communitarian. Based off this evaluation, he seems more left leaning to me, like Authoritarian-Left on the traditional political compass. However, if you view his ideas on culture as some sort of ultra nationalism, that might pull him to the right some. I'm not too sure how to think about that aspect, what do you think?
You argue that the NCR is the out group, but I dont think they really apply. They're not a group within. They're an external enemy, like the enemy of all countries, they are viewed as inferior and propagandized. That's not anything unqiue to fascism. The US did this to Germany in both world wars, Japan in ww2, the British against Napoleon, etc.
I also don't think selling lies to the populace is fascist in the slightest, nor are national myths. In fact, republics feature national myths more than any other type of regime. The Romans had myths that they descended from gods, and Americans view their founders as deific people as well, and believed in things like Manifest Destiny. But back to the lies thing, I'm sure you know the phrase "history is written by the victor." Truth is established by the dominant culture, and they often leave several things out. For example, America leaves out much about the atrocities they've committed throughout history, like Japanese internment camps, and they retell the Pearl Harbor bombing in 1941 as if Pearl Harbor was the only thing that happened that day (in fact, Japan had bombed the Philippines, a US territory at the time, and they had invaded the Aleutian Islands, part of Alaska). More examples are with the colonization of the New World, where the British and French perpetuate the Black Legend, making the Spanish out to be violent monsters, but do not tell the whole story. Some things fit the dominant narrative better than other things, and so history is constructed in a certain manner
He's not saying they're literally fascist, he's just likening them to fascists. It's a classic literary exercise.
This guy didn’t watch the video.
Communism as defined as a stateless classes moneyless society means Caesers Legion is in no way Communist. There is no communal property, no workers democratically deciding their work, there is a class system with slaves being at the bottom level.
Socialism being defined as Workers control over the means of production means Caesers Legion isnt even Socialist. No worker has any control over any means, its all for Caeser to arm his legionaries, not for the betterment of the workers.
Caesers Legion is no where to the left, not at all. The Legion are definitely Fascist, The out group is the NCR, with Caeser presenting them as the Thesis to the legions antithesis. You have a might is right attitude through the Legions obliteration of tribal identity, only the Legion identity is allowed to exist. There is a rejection of Modernism with the refusal to allow Legionaries to use modern weapons or even long range weapons. There's supremacy of the military, rampant sexism with enslaving almost all women. It all point to Fascism.
Caesers Legion might not be the typical easy to spot Fascism of the Nazis or the Italian Fascists but it does have, and actively works to perpetuate, all the features of Fascism, and most importantly not Communism
Awesome video. saw this after your Joshua Graham video, playing thru fallout new Vegas ultimate edition for the first time, dlc here we go
I would love a video on the NCR and the BoS about their philosophy and its problems.
Brotherhood will reform or disperse & die. Ncr will perhaps survive & develop mop
Could it be? A comment section discussing fallout factions peacefully?
Yeah, that's cool and all but your Fallout New Vegas world-space looks fresh as hell especially around the Chapter 2 segment. What mods you running for that kind of FOV and clear world and textures?
I think it was the Ojo Bueno texture pack, with the MGs Neat Clutter mod mixed in there, that I have and also the 47 the sequel ENB.
EDIT: and the Textures Over Time mod, forgot to mention that one. I use that to overwrite the Ojo rock textures since I prefer TOT versions.
@@connorwgoode5681 thanks, I was JUST about to start a new game and this is something to look forward to
Ave True to Caesar! You will pay for your criticism profligate!
allright I'll pay you 5 caps, now leave us alone.
That's something I always found amazing with the Legion. They are STRICTLY fascist. The problem is when we call "fascism" to any sort of nationalist and/or reactionary movement. True fascism was conceived in Italy, and many times it standed against other authoritarian regimes (nazism, francoism, stalinism, etc.).
The Legion represents what Mussolini truly wanted to achieve. While nazis and communist only use the State as a medium to an end (Lebensraum and communism, respectively), fascism sees it as the ultimate goal. The fascist State is where this doesn't differentiate from its individuals, as they are a unified body. Unlike other examples of authoritarianism, this is a truly totalitarian State.
Also, the fact that Caesar mentions Hegelian philosophy makes me think the developers really knew what they were doing, as fascist philosophy is heavily inspired by Hegel's.
Communists and Socialists also rely heavily on Hegelian Dialectics, they see it as a lens in which they can view the past and justify their violence.
@@Skiritai Wathever. I'm always pro-violence.
I've watched your star wars and new vegas videos and I got to say they are great. It's a shame that they don't get views
1:08
Well . . . yeah. Caesar outright says he's a fascist. He uses that word directly.
What really gets me is that The Frontier mod has brought out a bunch of people who _don't_ think the Enclave is fascist. Cringey dialogue in the mod notwithstanding, that's an undeniable fact.
@CHB Ryan
You are flatly incorrect. Nazi Germany was fine with big industry. Capitalism is the private ownership of, well, capital. And the means of production. It just doesn't specify who or what necessarily. A hyper-privatized industry collected in the hands of an elite is still capitalism. Sorry, buddy. Some sociologists and political theorists outright include the willing collusion of "traditional elites" in their definition of fascism ( Robert Paxton). By which he means, essentially, rich people who own a lot of stuff.
I don't even know where you get the idea Enclave is capitalist because they aren't a business or about making profit. They're quite literally paramilitary (or just plain military in their own eyes) and themselves behave like they're still the politicians and staff that retreated to the bunkers back when the bombs dropped.
Their entire agenda is plainly about race purity and restoring their vision of a Pre-War United States nation, completely to detriment of the people who already live in the wastes. Bethesda even made it more obvious by playing on the double meaning of Project Purity. (I can almost imagine Todd Howard elbowing me asking me if I got the joke. Get it? Because it's about ethnic cleansing!)
Like how is it that people look at the Enclave's evil plans to purge the population with a literal bioweapon, based on their perceived lack of genetic purity, and not get the hint that these people are basically American Nazis? _It's not a subtle bad guy._
Holy shit people. No wonder we have a world-wide problem with far-right extremist movements. They're so dumb they walk straight into colluding with fascists because they're that ignorant and lacking in critical thought.
And no, race purity policies are not supposed to be rational. That's the damn point. If you think we're not doing enough about immigration and that we have a pressing problem with miscegenation or the dilution of our culture, you're probably the bad guy. People don't go 0-to-100 into the Holocaust for no reason, it is a process where you look at sensible policy and go, "Well that doesn't go far enough, I know so because a politician told me the rapists are coming to take our jobs. Let's build a wall that won't solve the problem which also only exists in fantasy." And to nobody's surprise, that doesn't work, so they keep going harder. Whether they do so out of ignorance or merely needed a justification for their hatred makes no difference anymore at that point. That's how you get Nazis.
@CHB Ryan
What brain worms do you have?
@CHB Ryan
You have severe reading comprehension problems. I suggest you go back and quote back to me the part where I said you were pro-Enclave, or implied it. I said that you're flatly wrong about them being capitalist.
Also: That wasn't their plan. They created a method to inoculate the Enclave against the virus. At least, that's how it worked in Fallout 2. Not sure what it was in Fallout 3, but I ignore Bethesda canon anyway.
It also doesn't modify my point in any way. It's their intentions that are important, not whether they're incompetent about achieving their stated goals.
If anything, the Enclave pretty well represents how the alt-right has been behaving recently. Like I said, they propose nonsense policy solutions to non-existent fantasy problems while downplaying real ones. (Building the wall but ignoring the pandemic.)
Back then I thought the Enclave were too obvious and cheesy, but it seems like reality wants to prove me wrong. If anything, they're way too cool and the reality is far more buffoonish.
@@afqwa423 Dude please go back to twitter. You're so fucking pretentious. "HURR DURR BIDEO GAME LIKE BANDEMIC!!!" fuck off.
@@theta_clips I don't have a twitter.
just found your channel. really liking it. keep it up
Dude you deserve so much more recognition
Caesars legion more closely resembles a khanate.
Caesar him self literally defines his nation as a supremacist authoritarian nation state that obliterates the cultures of all those it absorbs to keep mankind from fracturing. Aside form conquering things this has nothing to do with the khanates of the past. The khanates of the past let the people they absorbed worship who they wanted and have freedom and autonomy to live as they please. Not only that but women had an upfront ruling role in mongol life and politics. Not in the legion
@@gwynjustice6664 Thank you! Genghis Khan literally invented a welfare system that broke with Mongol tradition by dividing resources and plunder among the widows, children, and invalids, who could not support themselves in the traditional method of division. It's crazy to me that people misunderstand that their brutality was more a matter of strategy than a fundamental pillar of their society.
Even the Roman Empire which the Legion superficially models itself after was quite syncretic and permissive (if not particularly egalitarian,) especially compared to the way the Legion organizes its' society. Fascists are always historically illiterate, lol.
I’d like to see a similar vid on the NCR, Yes-man, and/or Mr. House
I just realized that the genitals of the bull are on the Legions flag
Caesar's Legion seem to be pure utilitarians where the ends always justify the means. As Caesar explains, the worth of each individual is defined by their utility to the state. They view individualism as weak and degenerate. Concepts such as private property and individual rights are seen by them as immoral when they come into conflict with what they perceive as being better for the community as a whole.
Which is hilarious, since the entire legion is the private property of Caesar himself; and he has the most extreme of individual rights realized for himself. Caesar's legion would be better if it was a ruthless meritocracy that embraced individualism for those strong enough to rise up; and the position of Caesar should be open to constant competition for whoever is the best amongst the legion. Caesar's most capable legionnaires are his most independent minded; Vulpes & The Legate.
Is there an argument to state that Caesar’s legion is not a fascist regime, but a different kind of totalitarianism? Fascism usually relied on technology as a means to promote itself. The Legion sounds more aligned with a reactionary, esoteric, traditionalist regime similar to what Julius Evola envisioned.
He's basing his opinion on modern lol evil=fascism thinking.
Caesars legion is a totalitarian dictatorship.
Nothing he said was comparable to caesars legion.
I think the best word to describe the Legion is “Timocracy” which is no joke the word Plato used to describe Sparta in his book “The Republic”
This the first time I’ve heard vulpes speech and use “you” and “your”. Whenever I hear it he says “they” and “their”. Probably cause you were allied with NCR but it’s just an interesting little detail
In this video: someone who doesn't understand fascism labels everything he views as bad as fascist
That’s actually the laziest and dumbest critique someone has thrown my way about my videos
@@connorwgoode5681 I can be lazier and dumber, or I can be more intellectual and get ignored. This problem does not stem from you specifically but is systematically perpetuated by social norms and promoted by neoliberal intelligencia(Government, academia, corporate media, et cetera). I could get into the specifics of what fascism actually is and what it is not, as well as suggest a list of resources and books by fascist intellectuals or non biased observers of fascist countries and movements in actions, or even the bare minimum of the founding philosophy and ideologues behind it: EG. Gentile, however nobody wants to actually do their research, and would rather parrot the socially accepted buzzwords and talking points of "Ur-fascism", "fascism=racist authoritarianism" "fascism=politically suppression" "fascism=everything against the current neoliberal/capitalist society values". Quite literally modern peoples are programmed to view fascism=everything bad, and if ever questioned on this, instead of citing unbiased third party sources, or the most accurate first party policies, philosophies, writings from fascists themselves, like you would do any other subject or ideology, you only get opinions from communist/capitalist/Jewish ANTIFASCISTS who happen to have some sheet of paper behind them validating their clearly biased subjective "observations", who obviously have an agenda to define fascism as negatively as possible.
In the words of George Orwell:
"By ‘Fascism’ they mean, roughly speaking, something cruel, unscrupulous, arrogant, obscurantist, anti-liberal and anti-working-class. Except for the relatively small number of Fascist sympathizers, almost any English person would accept ‘bully’ as a synonym for ‘Fascist’. That is about as near to a definition as this much-abused word has come."
@@connorwgoode5681 The left-wing definition of fascism is so loose that it could describe anything from modern society to pre-history, i wonder what that could mean.
@@Holy_Hobo I guess Hitler wasn't a fascist, then. "Both the German worker and the German businessman are important for the national community"
@@fallout1953 literally what are you talking about? I never even defined fascism and you say "I guess based on your definitions you didn't give that means XYZ obvious strawman "? What are you on about?
Fuck man, just when I think I’ve had enough of this game for a while, I see a video like this and think, “Damn, time to play some more FNV”
Honestly the legion is very interesting to me, because we all judge them based off of our standards . The fall out world is very different from ours, however, I don't want to defend them because I hate them, but I can see why this kind of society would thrive and many would think they are necessary
Isn't that viewpoint countered by the fact that there are many post-war societies that exist without fascism? The NCR is the most obvious example, they share many values that western society have today, and they've managed to be an equal to Ceasar - he acknowledges that himself.
The Legion's fascist views are a method for survival in a post-apocalypse, but they're far from necessary.
@@matt4048
The NCR is in no way a modern democracy, it is at best a representation of the US in the 1800s. Expansionism, de facto segregation with mutants, the existence of a brahmin-baron caste that increases in power every day, outright genocidal tendencies towards indigenous tribes, etc.
@@matt4048 ncr is dying, and one could say that for the legion this methods were necessary, legion didn't have all the technology that NCR did, so it was their method
This guy should have more subs, he is really good ngl.
Anglos and their obsession with fascism is hilariously infuriating everything to the right of mao is fascism from rome to trump lmao
Stumbled across this video while thinking about the strong fascistic tendencies Caesar's legion. Great analysis. Happy to add another breadtuber to my subscriptions.
Legio optima, Legio victorius, mors in Nova Republica California
I think hegal and ficte got mixed
On another video could you talk about androids in videogames? In Fallout 4, Detroit become human and even Borderlands at some point treat them like metal-people. Yes, in the first 2 that’s the plot’s primary Theme, but those games make it too easy to decide. The only time I questioned it was while seeing a fan-made short of Overwatch where Seniata tells Genji about the omnics. I don’t know, I thought it would be a nice idea for a video. See ya!
Ok, this video is cool and all but is it pronounced ceasar or ceasar. I need to know. Please
There were probably as many ways to pronounce latin as there were regions in the Roman Empire, though a lot of books of that era seem to agree that C had a K sound, thus making Ceasar something akin to "Kaisar" (This is why Germany, who saw themselves as descendants of the Holy Roman Empire, had a title called Kaiser, the Emperor) rather than See-Sar
Edward
@@jamesduffy7549 Based
if you care about political language to the degree of autism i'd say that legion resembles some form of militarist fundamentalism than actual fascism. For one they aren't a big fan of using firearms or high tech, they also forbid the use of drugs. try to compare them how nazis were in ww2 and you'll see my point.
As i said to arcade
"Hes a madman what did you expect?"
Is it bad that I join the legion in every play through I do purely because of how awful and barbaric they are? It’s quite interesting. The first time I played the game I was much younger and liked the legion because they reminded me of Rome. Now it’s just because they are so evil (and for some reason I always like playing the bad guy in video games).
They're neither 'evil' nor 'the bad guys'. They're pretty clearly the only reasonable alternative for a government in the wasteland.
Wow same I wanna join ncr but always turn to legion
@@spritefroggy If you believe the Legion isn’t evil, you have no understanding on how they work.
@@deadprank947 Every time and in every situation it depends on the system of beliefs (and they are can be VERY different from human to human). There are no objectively evil or good factions. Not in the game, not in the real world.
How old are you? Do I really need to explain it?
@@trickytrack00 You wouldn’t consider rape, murder, and slavery to be objectively evil? That’s the problem with this stupid line of thought; no one ever actually says anything meaningful with it, they’re just spouting bullshit they think makes them look smart.
Fascism literally requires a nation, the legion is an army without a nation. Read some books and learn what words mean. Even Caesar says once new Vegas is conquered his nation can form as a synthesis of the legion and ncr. It seems all too common that people spend all their time trying to link fictional factions to real life ideologies for brownie points instead of paying attention to the lore. The closest real world example of the legion would be Sparta and the helots.
Check yourself. Fascism is an ideology not a form of government. There is no need for a nation, in order to be fascist.
@@yaboicowboi578 You're an idiot if you think that fascism is not a form of governance. If you conflate fascism for an ideology then you divorce yourself from reality. Seeing as how Fascism is a highly authoritarian political belief of "whatever is best for the state" which is willing to crush anyone who is deemed as a detriment or even those who aren't a benefit. Saying fascism isn't a governmental system quite literally boils down the only defining part of fascism is authoritarian.
People need to stop believing everything they read on twitter.
@@Kravockian you’re not finished learning about fascism.
@@yaboicowboi578 Sounds like you have yet to start. A vague catchall response because you and I both know that fascism is a very specific thing and it can be clearly defined. Unlike you I have read about the worst of humanity, not simply listen to videos of pseudo intellectuals.
@@Kravockian go watch renegade cut’s video on fascism. Probably the most informative video on fascism I’ve seen yet.
Every fascist is evil, but not every evil person is a fascist.
Me Ne Frego
Every communist is evil, but not every evil person is a communist.
Very good video!
The Legion are a good faction I support them
I wish we had more games and art that doesnt just copy the WW2 insert "evil Nazis here" political dichotomy. But hey someone's making money
Great video, but can you drop your mod list?
The Brotherhood of Steel in Fallout 4 (and arguably other games) are also fascists.
It was an interesting turn by Bethesda and was a gateway due to their isolationist mentality. They were withering away by the time of New Vegas and were willing to die by their codex. The eastern BOS, from what I remembered, returned to their old ways of wanting to preserve technology by drastic measures; intimidation, terror, a cult of personality, believing BOS members are superior to wastelanders (similar to how fascists use nationalism to their own ends) and *othering* androids (even though androids are capable of human thought, they don't care which means they are purposely hurting beings of sentient thought). I'll have to catch up on the lore of the BOS since I'm covering them in huge essay video about totalitarianism.
I wouldnt call them fascist since fascism is result of reaction to socialism which only comes after capitalism. This is just bunch of empowered communalist groups
@@WM-gf8zm Have i ever seen a more dumb way to define an ideology?
1, 2, 3, new Vegas, it's only bethesda that made them idiots, I hope Veronica somehow takes control of the west coast or even has just more pull among them, they could finally live up to the original ideals of the BoS, maybe help the people of westside and the like
what mods do u use on your fnv
Legion being awesome
THe only reason the Legion could possibly be sensible, is the fact that it's set in a post apocalyptic setting, you have raiders, mutants, few major governments. SOmetimes in a brutal world you need brutal rule. I like the dicotemy between the NCR and Legion. The NCR is larger and more powerful in equipment and possibly manpower, they have freedoms and attempt democracy, yet they're too massive to run efficiantly, there is corruption and sometimes it does opress people. The Legion is ruled largely by one man giving out authority as he sees fit, this means the Legion is quicker on policy and action as Ceasar just needs to decree it and it gets done if the Legion can accomplish the task. Thier soldiers are more skilled in melee combat and don't need to rely on firearms when needed, they have more security as they wipe out or integrate Raider groups they encounter, but they are opressive and enslave people, men are forced largely into the miliary and women are made essentially breeding stock and slaves. THe Legion is also stable only as long as Caesar and Legate Lanius are still alive, as it's members can be capable soldiers and officers, but likely don't have the needed knowledge for governance, thus the Legion could easily fall apart to infighting at the deaths of these 2.
THe NCR offers more freedoms, but is hindered by buerocracy and corruption an law is harder to maintain yet is resiliant if it's leaders die, the Legion is more powerful and dicisive and orderly, but less resiliant if it's leaders are killed and they enslave and oppress.
I think they’re more of a Roman style autocracy rather than a plainly 20th century fascist dictatorship. I can’t deny they have aspects aligned with fascism, especially Mussolini style, but they aren’t trying to be neo-Roman empire like Mussolini with all of the racist tendencies and master race crap, but an actual Roman Empire or as close as they can get to the ancient empire from the other side of the world, but without all of the culture and civilian side backing the military. What we see in game is the purely militant side of legion culture, it would be like living in Gaul during ancient times and your only impression of Rome is Caesar and his army. I agree with a few points in your video but I don’t think we can assume all of what the legion is from purely the military and how they and their slaves act and do without a complete picture
“Fascism” and “dictator” have different definitions on what time you’re in.
The ancient dictator had no negative connotation since it was a position an individual was given in a crisis. The dictator made all the choices that would abate the crisis. Modern dictators are totalitarians with how we use “dictator.”
A fascist also does not have to be right wing. If you encountered what you would call a fascist country in the 1700’s, would the “right wing/ left wing” dichotomy we use now even apply?
Would our left/right dichotomy of politics even matter to someone in the future such as Ulysses?
I think he's a lot like Mussolini in that Mussolini came from a socialist faction and Edward Sallow came from the followers of the apocalypse, which is some kind of revolutionary anarchist faction, I mean the context of the time is different but it's vaguely similar
Have you played Fallout 1 and 2? You'd get a lot out of them, especially 2. It's about as political as New Vegas.
I'm not going to argue with your definitions beging as though you read them and didn't make them on your own, however Fascism in practice can be just as far left as far right. For instance most would agree that Joseph Stallin was a fascist, but under the communism he ran Russia with that is a far left political ideology. And the only thing Nazi's have in common with today's political right is wanting a strong nation. Racism is not a political view point of the right anymore than the left. It's an individual tribalistic morality. So when today's right advocate for a strong nation they mean the nation not just their own race within said nation. But I did enjoy what I heard other than that
Bro what the legion is the least fascistic faction in fallout, the enclave is far more fascist
Yeesh. Being a Nationalist doesn’t mean you’re fascist.
Yet every nationalist in a game or in reality is a fascist.
@@olfrogo That’s wrong.
@@jacobberry5138
Yet it is right
Fascism is built upon victimhood and it exploits it to the fullest.
Not true anymore. Today, being overly nationalist is a dangerous road to fascism, a far right authoritarian regime.
I would really like this video if it wasn't so partisan, its little digs like "pre war America and many other capitalist countries have fallen apart due to lack of resources...". Well every country in the world including communist china, and according to the lore i believe the soviet union too suffered, as well as everywhere else. It was a resource war, everyone was effected, so why the aggression specifically toward capitalism? Also U should focus more on Mussolini and fascist doctrine rather than specifically Nazism, its more thematically relevant and has many more similarities, and references to trans genderism is weird given it wasn't really something in mainstream discourse during fascisms rise or in New Vegas. U should watch some short fat otaku and Aydin paladin videos to supplement your contrapoints viewing.
*toward capitalism*
If you watch his other videos, you will see why. Videos are great, but he seems to be a bit "lefty-guy" :)
You do know that the Nazis burned transgender books in their book burnings correct? It was one of the key texts they sought to destroy.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institut_für_Sexualwissenschaft (the articles of the Institute for clarity)
@@trickytrack00 Oh, no. The guy has a political opinion.
What a crime, what a shame!
You may just want to accept the fact that his left leaning views are more correct than any right leaning views on fascism. If you have a problem with left leaning views being factually correct when criticizing fascism, then I suppose you have an issue with facts. It can be argued that going to the right of liberalism (centrist) is inherently far right. A genuine conservative wants to preserve the liberal status quo, whereas a fascist wants to turn back the clock, a feat that is impossible.
This is dumb and has nothing to do with an analysis of any real world primary sources from Germany or Italy. It is ironically itself a mythologized history that would not be sympathetic or reflective of any of the cultures you're talking about.
24:21 Wouldn't you say that Caesar has... Imposter Syndrome? OwO
godddd that description on the video just got u a follow my man
Wow you are brave, a anti facist comment will instantly subscribe not the video itself
@@travus111 i watched the video too dingus
@@travus111 I mean I kinda get it. I can vibe with pretty much anyone who is anti-fascist.
You should do a video like this about the brotherhood of steel on the eastcoast, theyre by far the most screwed up when you look into it, they now have some kind of racial superiority thing going on with arthur maxson and his terrible beliefs, which justify their raiding of farms and the outright destruction of rivet city, and the implied massacre that would follow due to rivet city being a self sufficient, well armed city full of eager citizens with plenty of merchants.
They also kinda treat gen 3 synths as subhuman and as badly as possible despite them being the same as regular humans for better or for worse, like danse, curie, mayor mcdonaugh(?), and that raider boss.
Do you treat your phone as if it is a person?
The BoS in FO4 unironically become fascist. It's sad to see how low Arthur fell after the Citadel.
@@ThunderTheBlackShadowKitty nah. They act more like Feudal military order. Still authoritarian thou. A boot is still a boot.
@@centercannothold Basically the same thing. Fascist military junta with a socially conservative bend. Really disgusting people. I'd argue they aren't people at all.
@@ThunderTheBlackShadowKitty ... The FO4 Brotherhood might be a joke compared to the earlier iterations of the faction like in FONV or FO2. But to say they aren't people because their leader is an insane dictator is... a bit much. Unlike the Legion the FO4 BOS is poorly written and poorly depicted in-game, that's not because the characters lack humanity and are barely people, it's because they are written terribly. A trend you see across all the factions in FO4 especially The Institute and the Railroad.
True to Ceasar
Pfp is just rich.
Do like the sight of your own blood?!
Not based very soy
"Fascism"?
I like your funny words, profligate.
its sad how Bot people are around "fascism" the Enclave is the series fascism i.e Nazism The Legionary is literally a Guy who wants to build a new Rome
I'm trying to role play a legion character and as a socialist, getting into the facist mindset is pretty hard. This video is a great help for getting into the legion mindset for a new playthrough
not as bad as NCR
They are infinitely worse than the NCR, objectively.
LONG LIVE THE LEGION
1:35
Ave true to Caesar.
Ideology is cool sword and throw spear heheheh
Fall Out 1,2,3 New Vegas and Fallout 4 that's where I stop. Brotherhood of Steel forever.
Don’t care, true to Caesar
i dont know if i would go so far to say the legion are fascist but they're def getting pretty close
Made it to 9:30 but it got too cringe to continue
I think you need to go back and study the actual meaning of fascism a little better there bud..
Fascism can be left or right wing it doesn't really matter. It's essentially collectivism and the rule of a individual, party and/or ideology taken to its extremes. Plus the nazi's were alot more aligned with left wing ideas hence the term national socialism. It's a few right wing values and ideas done in a left wing socialist collectivist system.
The Nazis were not left-wing, they called themselves socialists to get working class people to support them instead of the communist and social democrat party. They even killed socialists and communists. Plus, they privatised the German economy which was why the bourgeoisie were supportive of the Nazis and the party destroyed labour rights of workers. I would advise reading into this because no academic agrees with this assertion that the Nazis aligned up with left-wing ideas, especially considering the Nazis themselves openly hated leftists.
@@connorwgoode5681 Yeah not totally right wing though. Fascism doesn't really belong in political compasses as it can be collectivism on practically anything. Race, religion, feelings, identity politics we see today, social issues or justice, communism, capitalism list goes on and on.
Do like New Vegas and how it gave a compelling argument for each faction well besides Yes Man as well the courier isn't really experienced in building a nation. Reason I still think House is best although not the way the games ending is, is simple. He cares about humanity itself. Ending I'd have liked and was sadly cut was to side with the NCR and convince Mr House to not surrender but become a citizen of the NCR he'd be the governor of the state in a way. That way NCR continues to annex South west and house is allowed to carry out his vision
@@connorwgoode5681 in the knight of the long knifes hitler took out the strasserists
The nazis were the right wing equivalent to left wing totalitarianism (on paper). They're similar but also very different for a few key reasons. The same reasons which split the left and right wings in the first place.
No, authoritarianism can be left or right wing, fascism is expressly right wing
Was gonna try a Legion run until I saw this vid
Still should
still should imo, its not an endorsement lmao and its still the best game ever made
@@Kriskazam I’ll feel bad
Still should, in the end of the day its just a video game like any other, unless you are unironic supporter then it's a different case
you don't have to be a defect who unironically agrees with them to enjoy the legion, they make very good villains and if you ever decide to do an evil playthrough you should definitely side with them.
Its fascisum when they do it.
Only are ideas are correct.
Hummm.
Oh God, the psychedelics are kicking in. Oh shit