The Zero company is anti right to repair and even though the bike is good an fun by purchasing the bike this is what you support. I believe this information is important to include in the review of the bike.
I am waiting for energica to bring out something similar, at least they have this "fix it yourself" part covered. If I had spare money, I'd get the energica eva ribelle and no in between. Also, for this kind of range, I'd just buy an electric scooter, which has even a little compartment storage for your groceries.
exact reason why i didn't buy one even though it's perfect for me with my commute being stop and go 15 miles max. they'll completely block you out of the dealer network if someone without their golden star touches it.
@@ThatsNotaRealBike I’d be perfectly ok with them making profits without artificially restricting the item that you pay for. I want them to succeed I love the idea of an electric motorcycle but their business model run counter to anything that I want to participate in. I was literally about to pull the trigger on an fxe like a month ago but then started reading about all the bs that they put their customers through and the pay to unlock features that exist on the bike. Needless to say I bought another gas bike instead
@@sonny9608 software is one thing I still don’t like when that’s the case either but zero takes it further with hardware that exists on the bike that you paid for but can’t use I.E. heated grips , battery capacity and charging speed. Or so I’ve read anyway. It’s just not a something that should be the case in my opinion on such an already expensive purchase. But to each their own, I just won’t be buying one
A motorcycle you cant work on is not a motorcycle at all. We need open source electric bikes where all the part schematics are available, the modules hackable and parts off the shelf. Then they would be excellent short hop bikes, otherwise they are iphones on wheels.
@@TravisTerrell any electric vehicles will be like that. Tesla will lock you out of their supercharger network if they deemed you made "unauthorized" repairs. I'm going to stick with gas vehicles until 2050 when they ban gas cars completely.
Zack is a great ambassador for our sport and does a good job elevating this Zero. That said, the super short range and having to stay shackled to the Zero dealer network make this one a no for me. It’s a shame though, I’d really be open to the right electric bike.
Same, it just has to be affordable and have decent range. 100 miles on a motorcycle shouldn’t be a problem, and this pricepoint is just laughable. The Honda catalog is ROBUST with choices well under $12k
I've owned my Zero DSR with Charge Tank for over a year. Bought it used and it now has 12,000 miles on the clock. No commuting, only fun riding. Bay Area freeway speeds or the coast I average around 75MPH and get around 80 miles before I charge. Combined freeway/coast/surface streets I average about 120 miles. I hook up to a ChargePoint EVSE station, take a piss, grab some chow and when I return the bike averages between 80-91%. I don't run down to nothing, just like I didn't riding a gas bike. No problems whatsoever and the dealership I use is stellar. My experiece is I have not had a need for my dealership because the bike has been problem free. Owned and race many ICE bikes, two stroke and four strokes, motocross, desert and finally road racing. In my life ICE bikes dealer service varies widely depending on the owner of the shops. I do like the Energica EVA but DC to DC chargers are not nearly as prevelant as J1772 chargers. Not sure how many kWs the Energica's accept when not using the CCS plug but if it's less than 6.2kW that would be bad. Plus I like having a dual sport, something I can take on fire roads when I want to do so. As of today Zero is the only EV maker I'm aware of that has a bike like this.I have no desire to convince anyone either way about electric or the pros and cons of dealer support. All I know is my experience for both has been great.
Sup Mark. My brother also lives in the Bay Area and owns a Zero S. He uses it to commute to work and that's it. Just perfect for him. As Zack tried to explain, it's not for everyone, the person who buys it already knows its range limitation and gets it for a specific reason. The times I've ridden it has been a blast. I own a 2020 Ducati Supersport S & a 2019 HD Iron 1200 and I STILL think Zero Motos are a blast and am glad they're around. Im always keeping an eye out for a used SR/F and will likely get one once my work requires us to go back to the office full-time.
@@edgarmachado1300 Hey Brah. I got mine from SFMoto in SF $10,500 2017 model year. Had been on their lot for 132 days. Former owner traded it in for a SR/S. I had not ridden in about 15 years, had not raced or taught for 17. My race bike was a RC51. I knew that I didn't want a Zero without a Charge Tank. I've owned a Sur Ron since 2018, have 9k miles on it to date. Like other things back then all I heard was how the bike was "A Chinese piece of crap." Same shit I heard as a kid about Japanese cars. Humans gravitate toward the negative mob mentality side of new tech. Glock hand guns....plastic really!? ATM cards, etc. Most just repeat what they've read 'somewhere' or been told 'something.' Yes I'm an early adopter just like ICE vehicles were early adopters 100 years ago taking over steam. I made a 14k mistake buying a Cake Kalk& and the battery went bad after 8 months. Cake would not replace it under warranty so I returned the bike. POS in my own experience. It's OK, I could care less what people ride, only my experience with my own bikes. Even now when I look at ICE cars, loved my Porsches and really wanted a GT-R Godzilla, but now I don't see myself buyinmg a gas car again. Like I say, everyone is different. I don't forward information I've just 'read somewhere or seen on UA-cam. Of course there are bad things from any manufacturer. I just dig deeper than many to find out for myself. When I read articles saying the elephant in the room is how electric cars are just as if not more expensive than ICE cars, I just dig down and have always found that the author comes from a petroleum based profit standpoint. And of course they sight "an expert" in electricity. BS, do some work and don't be a lamb is my view. To each their own. 🙂
You would have a much, much different opinion of the bike if you lived further away from the dealer network. Zeros are an extremely niche market, unfortunately.
I have the 2022 Fx (dual sport) all though I agree the range is not great, it literally cost $0.01 to travel per mile. For an under 60 mile urban commute, my bike is a blast and can do some decent off-roading. I’m very happy with the purchase.
I don't think I've ever seen Zack wheelie any bike this often within a single daily rider review. He wheelied it in the 50 yards between the u-turn and parking up!
@@goru426 No, people have djfferent needs. They'll work better in europe where cities and other are closer to eachother. Or people who work in the city they live in. I do think they're way too expensive.
I own the FXE, made 2000km on it so far and I just love it. Regarding the missing traction control: I got it in January and was riding it with the new tires in wet and near freezing temperatures. And yes, the traction can be very tricky even in Eco mode (about 40% torque) when you crank it up from the stop lights. The easy solution: Set up Custom mode as a rain mode with just 25% torque and it'll behave like a regular, tame 125cc. Now in dry and milder conditions I have set Custom to 100% torque, 45% coasting regen and 100% braking regen and it's super nice and precise to ride with the feel of mild engine braking (much less than in Eco but more than Sport). Eco has become my wet mode now that I know how the torque kicks in. This bike certainly isn't for everyone but really is the perfect bike for me and my needs and distances. The only gripe I have are the tires: The Pirelli DR2 are pure warm weather tires IMO, perfect for Cali or Italy but surely not for all year riding in Germany. I'm gonna rock these down this summer and will get Michelin Road 5 in time for autumn to have a tire that doesn't need as much warming up and has better wet/rain performance.
@@HaTran-tf3fe I'm at 3800km now and my range hasn't decreased at all. It even got better now with higher temperatures. I don't ride highways but when I ride roads with speeds between 70-120kph I get about 90-100km range. (I weigh 85kgs, my son at 70kgs gets 100-120km range)
I am really excited to someday own an electric bike. The problems for me are probably the same as many. The range on some are ok for my commute (60 miles round trip). I’m concerned about having to limit what I think I can do in a day based on my bike’s range. The bikes are also still pretty expensive for what they are. My biggest draw to getting one is that they are nearly maintenance free
@@sonny9608 Are you specifically talking about this bike in particular because batteries in general have made considerable progress. Saying this won't change anytime soon is blatant bullshit.
@@sonny9608 the overall tech might be the same but its refinement that often improves the technology. Its the energy density that's different. Lithium ion/polymer batteries now have way better energy density now than back in the 70s. Technology isn't simply about finding new things in the lab. Its refinement and engineering, and manufacturing challenges. I hear the same argument for other tech like fuel cell, because its old tech. It that tech has other challenges such as bringing down the cost of production. Fuel cell relies on precious metals, and while fuel cell has been around since the Apollo missions, you don't have the same budget to build a car or bike as a spacecraft. If I recall, Kawasaki is working on hydrogen powered bikes. Maybe some engineer got the wet dream of having an H2 that runs on H2O 😂😂. It would be pretty freaking hilarious if their hydrogen bike is named that.
@@sonny9608 lol, so you've chosen to ignore the advances in the various lithium type batteries such as improved energy density of lithium ion, lfp and you've completely ignored solid state lithium metal batteries. These aren't secrets, they're widely known and well publicised. Perhaps you should do some actual reading next time instead of running your mouth off and making yourself look like a complete idiot
I have a 22 Zero FX 7.2. 21" dirtbike spoke wire version of the FXE. If you ride 55-85mph range is 50 miles. If you ride dirt roads 35mph range is 80 miles with my 235lbs ass on it. Top speed of 85 and its super quick off line. Very light and plugs into garage 110v outlet.
It isn't a terrible range. It is only a terrible range if you have to ride it really aggressively on high speed roads. If you live particularly far and isolated away from your employment. Plenty of people don't live like that but it is also true that plenty of people do. Just the nature of the shitty way we decided to build a lot of the country post-cars. The company's anti-right to repair is an unforgivable sin however. Design a vehicle to be intentionally obtuse, intentionally limit the parts availability and charge up the ass when someone takes it to those shops for repair. It is not just about repairing it yourself. It also inflates the shop repair as they have a monopoly on it. Greed turns the simple act of keeping your expensive vehicle running into a profit center. It also enables them to barr your ability to repair if it is going to be considerably expensive for them to do. "Sorry, can't repair that. Guess you are going to have to buy a new one." Manufactured e-waste. Particularly hypocritical since part of the appeal/selling point of an EV is being better for the environment. They are dragging the whole EV motorcycle industry with them as well. People are already hyper critical to an unrealistic degree so this is just ammunition. It ain't going to work itself out either. Unless one of the more reputable companies decides to make electric but not screw people over in this regard. But if it works for Zero they will do that too.
I have an electric car that gets about 50-60 miles of range (with an 8 hour recharge time) and I have a supercharged Pontiac. I drive the electric 95% of the time but there are times I fall back on the Pontiac (or my Kawi Vulcan) for long trips. Electric is cheap to run, low maintenance (no oil changes), super fun punchy instant torque. I think everyone should have something electric but only if you know you never need to commute very far or you also have something conventional to fall back on.
Highway is the worst for Zeros in terms of range. On my SRS, going about 40 miles per hour its using under 100 watt hours per mile. So with the 14.4 pack and a usable amount of around 12, thats 120 miles range full to dead. At 100mph its 330 watt hours per mile. So now its 36 miles full to dead. The range is on a spectrum depending mostly on speed. Mine is the worst case scenario with a big guy in full gear and side and top cases to drag in the wind. Also the range drops by as much as 10% in cold weather, by that I mean 50F and below, vs a warm summer day.
It's weak territory in general for anything electric. You can't beat physics. I think Zero's other offerings would probably be a better bet, where you can overcome the range with a bigger pack of cells or better aero (supermoto platforms are about as aerodynamic as a portapotty). I think it was Aerostitch that did a winter in Minnesota on a studded-tyre Zero FX to see if it could work. It needed a battery warmer overnight, but I believe they made it work - it's on here somewhere. One of our faculty staff has a Tesla and says our Winters (SW PA) really test an EV, not just the cold and battery chemistry, but the fact you need a heater running full time too. There's also the issue that cars can carry the equipment for things like fast charging, whereas bikes are limited to the slow charge, although I think Zero do have an option for this, but last I checked (back in 2018) it was eye-waveringly expensive.
@@sullybiker6520 Some info for anyone interested, about charging. Mine is the "Premium" model. The base has one onboard 3.6kw charger, the premium has two. It comes with a Webasto branded plug in to charge the bike. That can detect if its connected to 1 phase or two. If the Webasto is plugged into 1 phase, 15A, it charges the bike at 1.3kw. If I connect it to the two phase I ran to my garage it charges at 3.3kw. When I use the chargepoint charging station in the parking lot at work (Webasto not needed here) it charges at 5.8kw
@@bunberrier For anyone else here interested in charging information. Zero is hopelessly behind the competition in regards to electric motorcycle charging capabilities. The rest of the competition is already on DC charging while Zero is using old tech and needs to overhaul their battery design to get there. Which of course costs RnD investments which they won't do. Energica makes bikes in the same price range that are just simply better. Harley makes a, questionably, better bike that is much more expensive. But they could improve in the future. Other electric bikes are coming. Unless Zero makes a 180 in their battery design, they won't be able to keep up.
Just confirming that range is extraordinarilly affected by riding speed. I typically get 100 miles of range on my 11.4 Zero if I travel around 30mph in the city and 50 miles at 60mph on the highway.
Regarding power wheelies and traction control, Bosch requires an extra ECU module for those features, turning it into a full Electronic Stability control system. The Bosch system is designed to control lift-up via a Bosch ECU modulating a traditional engine's torque, however they have appeared to have integrated it into the higher spec model SR/F. They put a price on safety.
Right now this seems like an expensive toy for folks who live in a larger city. For that purpose it actually looks pretty awesome though, but at this price point I’d want more bike for the money. 9500 and lower and it starts to make sense. Just a couple more years and going electric will be a valid option for motorcycles too.
@@jamievidd775 name one supermoto that’s 4k with this much torque and this modern look. You have to be realistic bro. A husqvarna svartpillen is also spec wise not impressive and you can get older cheaper bikes with more hp but that’s not the point of these bikes.
@@jamievidd775 And it will cost less than that 4k bike in a few years. This is more like a 5-6k ICE bike though. I don't know of many 4,000 dollar bikes that can do what this can do.
A new MT09, Street Triple or Duke 890R is basically around the same price point too. Since there’s no clutch a back break lever in it’s place would be quite fun. Anyway always enjoy these reviews👍
@@Carado5150 Here in Thailand quite a few "real motorcycle" (with a clutch) owners also have a scooter (with a rear brake lever on the left) for short trips to the store, and I have never heard any of them complaining about muscle memory. Humans are very adaptable.
Yeah me too especially after I watched a sur ronster video the other day. He has a surron that does 70 or 80 mph after upgrades and a whole lot cheaper than a zero
Wouldnt mind an electic bike but there are some challanges I would need to overcome. 1. Charging - I live in a block of flats so would struggle with charging. 2. Range - Kinda need about 100 mile range. 3. Price - I cannot afford the initial outlay on an electric bike.
1: removable batteries are one of the big benefits of electric bikes, nobody can steal it if the fuel tank is gone and I'd like to see any criminal sell a bike without a fuel tank in a black market or back alley deal, the only electric bikes that are worth it are the ones with removable batteries. 2: range will inevitably increase although the niche that electric bikes fit best will probably make you wait a while until 100 miles is possible in one charge for less than £8,000, remember though that any electric outlet is a fuel station if you have the time so a 40 mile commute on a 6 hour shift will usually be completely fine if you charge the battery at work 3: the initial outlay on an electric bike is so much more affordable than the running costs of petrol bikes... if you are able to wait afew months to have the extra needed to set on it all at once then definitely do it and if you would be willing to finance the bike, its cheaper per month to finance an electric bike than it is to finance AND fuel a petrol bike and it also doesn't get extremely expensive to use an electric bike often because you aren't needing to constantly set down your wallet on petrol and maintenance
@@fawkyou2001 batteries not removable on this bike. only the FX has that i think. and i heard it's a bit of a pain to do it and the batteries are heavy.
I was looking to buy one of these for my daily 6 mile commute to LAX (12 miles round trip). But none were available in this area. So I went with the Sur Ron at less than half the price. It has similar range, eco & sport mode, and charges to 100% in 2 to 3 hours. Of course it only has a top speed of about 50 mph but that's plenty for my short commute. (Frankly, I stay in eco mode so the top speed is 30mph with regenerative braking.) Plus because it looks like a mountain bike, I can get away with riding it on the side walk as long as I stay at bicycle speeds. I'm glad I didn't waste the extra money on a Zero. And I still have my Honda Fury 1300 when I need to ride a "real" motorcycle.
Hi Jay the advantage of Sur ron is they can also be modified for more speed / power if you really want to - I find sport mode is fast enough on such a super light weight electric mountain bike (I also take short cuts on the cycle paths to conserve as much battery power as possible :)
They're not the same range. If I took your route on the Zero going your speeds, I'd get 100 miles. But for such a short commute i think you made a great choice.
It’s fun when you accidentally “fill” the battery above the cut-off point, spilling electrons on the tank, and getting a little zap when you climb back on the bike. It’s like an extra shot in your morning coffee. (favorite T-shirt, from another channel: “I’ve lost an electron! Are you positive?”)
I'm sure eventually electric motorcycles will be more mainstream but the price and range are just killers. You can get 400cc bike that is well under 400lbs for less than half the cost and get 80mpg and they make great urban runabouts.
It is about what your priorities are and how much you can afford. 80 mpg is good compared to cars and most motorcycles, but terrible compared to EVs and especially electric motorcycles.
@@JuiceBoxScott problem is this specific manufacturer sucks. Have a problem with the battery? Well then you got to pay to ship hazmat all the way across the country instead of just going to the store. I can't wait for electric motorcycles to work out just not there yet.
@@RedEmpire36 it's impressive they've stuck around as long as they have, but I think you're right. I've got two HD dealers in town that I know can take care of my Street Bob if anything goes wrong. The Zero dealer in town is a jack of all trades/used bike dealer. I'm sure the dealer experience is poor in comparison.
The quality of individual dealers isn't the point. The dealer network is sparse compared to the other big names and you are tied to them for any service you may need. Zero will not allow you to do any service yourself: they will not sell you parts, and if you do manage to get them it will void your warranty.
I feel the same way when women comment about the size of my peen before they let me get up in em. It's not the size, it's the motion right?....right? Lol
I'm here for it. Like he said, you gotta have some disposable cash and want it for what it is. I picked up a 2018 SR as a commuter (10 miles RT - all surface streets) and I've never had so much fun commuting. Every stoplight is a new 0-45mph record waiting to be broken. Would my Honda accord be better? Yes, all around. But I'm in it for the fun.
I got a Yamaha mt-03 last August and as a lifetime rider it's my best friend for my 3 1/2 mile street commute. Almost 60mpg when I'm nice (that's happened twice) 52 when I'm harsh. I'm somewhere in the middle most of the time, 57ish. I can wheelie in a flash, dive into a corner on some 120 fronts and 160 backs (almost big boy size) and kill any car in the stop light. What else can you ask under 5. Screw this electric garbage in Arizona. I gotta pay that summer a.c. bill. This type of thing is gonna kill people when the rates get jacked. Literally.
@@TexasP00nTappa my Civic has 290k miles and its like 800 bucks for another engine 😵💫 im sure the electric motor will outlast any ICE but i doubt those batteries will 😵💫
I feel all the people who are like "But it's more expensive and makes less power than " or "With the range I can't justify it compared to " are missing the point of motorcycles in general. This bike fills a specific use case. If that use case doens't fit with what you want / need, buy something else. It's that simple.
While I will agree with you that it does fill a specific niche, is that niche big enough to support the company. From the replies I'm seeing on the video, it doesn't.
When will people admit the emperor has no clothes? Because it's politically "correct" to say endlessly that battery tech will make this monumental leap forward and combustion technology is somehow ending all life as we know it. The reason battery tech isn't making this giant leap forward is because you CANNOT WISH THINGS INTO EXISTENCE THAT YOU WANT, you cannot simply THROW MONEY AROUND AND MAKE SOMETHING COME ABOUT. There's a little thing called science and physics and math. EV's somehow have convinced people that doing the same thing is worth paying 3x more for. What other mechanical or electrical devices in this world have accomplished the same naked-emperor deniability and sold for 3x as much?
@@exothermal.sprocket Yes. Close to the same destruction of combustion engines which have hurt the earth considerably more and longer than batteries from raping the mountains for ore, burning foundries to make alloys, poisoning water systems from refining crude oil and creating an engine with a thermal efficiency of about 50%. not to even mention the lag in power delivery and tiny baby torque.
Zack, I know what you're doing wrong when you do the stop/start. You use the front brake and when you let the lever go, in that split second you wobble. Use the back brake. Hold and release plus hard throttle. I ride a Honda Hornet 600 and do this all the time. I usually only drop a leg on adverse cambers. Give a mention if you try this.
There are some elements you need their software for, other than that its all as repairable as any other motorcycle. Watching a Louis Rossman video doesnt tell you much about Zero ownership.
@@kmb957 they sell belts. Not the stuff that breaks and electronics are drm city, lack of manuals etc. Zero is popular enough that theres some aftermarket but theres a reason old are cheap if not running giveaways.
@@kmb957 to replace the belt, you will need to remove the swingarm and the belt is only obtainable at the dealer, for a hefty price and they break very easily
This is the ultimate stealth hooligan. I have a zero FX and one of the things I've noticed is that in places that you don't want to be noticed it is less noticeable.
Just want to say I love watching Daily Rider, not only cause you da man Zach!, but also you’re cruising around my home town! Always starting off on Wardlow in LB all the way up Vincent thomas bridge, PV then carson lol..You even got lost in my neighborhood in one of the older videos when the 710 entrance was closed haha.. Anyways, makes me miss home! 🙏🏽
I mostly use motorcycles for short commutes but $12,000 is a deal breaker. I do wish Zero the best of luck and hope they stick around a long time (Brammo anyone?).
I ride the FXE a lot and the no traction control bit me recently. Was going very slow and hit the gas a litte bit too hard and hit some light gravel on the road (black gravel on black road. no way seeing it. But also cold road, cold tires. So I got too comfortable and was stupid.) and I lowsided. Footpegs got scratched but not bent. So you could keep using them. Only destroyed one rear indicator. But I need a new handlebar, new rubber grip and the cap at the end of the handlebar. So not too much damage but still. Costs several hundred € to fix it but it could be a lot worse! So overall. If you just lowside and slide the bike, not too much damage.
Personally if I had to pick between a Navi and the Zero (disregarding R2R sentiments) I'd go with the Navi. The price of the Zero for the range you get is just way too high. I get that electric motorcycles are still really new tech so people like me definitely aren't the target market (I only ever buy used bikes) but the limitations of the Zero for 12k is pretty ridiculous.
They're incredibly cost prohibitive, even as an urban runabout, especially when the Navi is a fraction of the price and will do everything the Zero does (aside from the highway)
The Navi is so much cheaper, but also so much slower and a lot less fun in most people's minds. The best comparisons would be to a 500-750cc standard or super moto. Most would be significantly cheaper and trade off the electric for gas (50mpg instead of 150mpge, unlimited range vs 65 miles, etc).
I can't think of any ride I would go on the would be less than 100 miles. Add a milk crate and it might be a good grocery getter, or a to work and back bike. With twice the range it might be ok for short trips. Excellent review
I’m awaiting my Metacycle. Projected delivery June. I’m 79 years old and have been riding motorcycles off & on for most of my life. Haven’t had one for quite a while but have been riding ebikes for the last 25+ years. I probably would have gotten a Zero if there was a dealer in Idaho(I live in Twin Falls).I’m interested in trying the Metacycle and since I’ll be getting it @ the introductory price I expect I can turn it over and get a Zero if it doesn’t fit. Your review of the FSX sounds like it would do anything I need. Thanks for the review!
Hey Zack; wanted to say that I appreciate how well you are articulating the place for electric motorcycles in the motorcycle community! Particularly in your answers to the final instagram question (but also generally through this video) you are giving a very realistic, pragmatic, and fair presentation of this motorcycle. Your approach translates well to EV cars as well, and I think it’s important to acknowledge that EVs do some things incredibly well that blow ICE out of the water while In other areas they don’t quite compare (-yet?). It should be up to us to decide if the implications of electric vs fossil fuel power are in line with our goals or not; but whether I’m totally in to the electrification bandwagon or I’m more focused on all the “shortcomings” when compared to the status quo, it’s important for folks like to you present the product as-is. As someone who works in the EV industry and believes that they likely, and necessarily, are the future of transportation (while recognizing that they’re not the perfect fit for every application at present); I think you did a great job threading the needle here, and encourage you to keep up the gold work! Love the show, along with CTXP and Ari’s Shop Manual. Cheers!
I got a 2008 Yamaha WR250X, it’s an awesome super moto and at about 63mpg it has a 120+ range and have had it on interstates at 94mph indicated and can refuel it and keep on riding🥰
I think this product has two narrow of a niche. I'd rather plan an extra 15 minutes for my commute and use an e-bike (one that reaches 30 mph with a greater range) while spending less than a third of what this costs and not paying insurance.
That's pretty much what I was thinking. It will however work great in LA because it's a car-centered city. Anywhere else, yeah e-bike will be as much fun and will save you tons of cash.
I agree but will note that you'll be hard pressed to top this bike's range. Ridden like a 25mph ebike it'll likely do 100+ miles whereas I don't think you could find many ebikes that'll throttle at 25mph for 4 hours. Of course once you have the speed you would use it.
When someone has a bike with a 100 mile plus range at 70 mph for that money, I'm in line. Assuming it's a company that lets you repair you own bike of course, so not Zero.
50 miles and 8 hour recharge is too limited … maybe if they do the battery hot swap stations in the future this will be fine but at the moment that range is a killer … does it have a fast charge option?
Moving ahead, but like you say/imply, they just aren't cost competitive on performance, equipment etc with ICE bikes. Not even the ridiculous prices we've seen recently for fossil fuels are enough to make up for that. I can live with range/charge times not much better than what's available now. I can deal with the increased weight for comparable performance. I could probably even live with the lack of character compared to the differences between ICE engine configurations (Singles, Parallel twins, V2, IL3, IL4, V4, 2-Stroke, Rotary, Supercharged, Turbocharged etc) The prices are a deal breaker though. I'm not paying that much more for that much less.
And all it would take is opening up the Keystone XL pipeline and some rejiggering of politics, and gas would be less than $2 a gallon and USA would be exporting it all over the place. Simple as that.
Convincing OPEC to increase their production ramp up speed, and/or ending the Ukraine war, is a lot of "rejiggering". The US tried to convince OPEC and failed. Prices should come back down barring further shocks though. All of which is out of my control at least, whereas the decision to switch to electric is very much mine, and high fuel prices aren't enough for it to make sense.
Louis Rossmann has got it right when he talks about Zero's horrible repair practices. If you're remotely interested in buying a Zero bike, I'd recommend watching his video first.
I'm waiting for a quickly removable and replaceable battery so I can "refuel" on the road and continue my travel. A forty to eighty Mike round trip range limit is too restrictive unless you just want a city commute bike. Thanks for a superb review.
These Zeros have quick swap batteries. I'm not sure if it's this model specifically but you can also attach a second battery for more range or swap them out quickly. I considered getting one in the past for commuting and leaving one battery to charge overnight at work and another at home so I would always be ready to go but I never got that job so I never got the bike.
The vehicle battery swap idea sounds good until you realize the sheer number of batteries needed along the road. They also need storage and/or being charged and transported around “fuel stations” to match demand. And you will want a fully charged battery ready at the station. Which is bad for the battery. It can be solved but you will pay, in cash or inconvenience or both… 😊
@@kristofferrydquist8384 I appreciate your good points and I agree! One way or another, it's going to cost us something to be able to tour across the country (world) on electric motorcycles in future, IF we ever really want to do that. Perhaps the manufactures who "confederate" per an agreement to design machines with universal/interchangeable powerpacks will need to market a membership program for those of us who want to participate in cross-country powerpack exchanges at participating "refueling" stations. It will cost us. However, it may be worth the price of admission. Until then, I'll keep riding my two-wheeled gas-burner until (and IF ever) riding an electric machine makes more sense. ;)
Quite the interesting ride there, Zack. The issues behind choosing a bike like this, to me, are manifold: - Ideal usage: When I still lived in NYC, something like the Zero would be "cute", but a total no-go: as an apartment dweller, I'd have a tough time finding a place to charge it overnight, and *very* few places I've ever worked at would have facilities to that end. Besides, between scooter ride-share systems like Revel (which I'm a member of), and a pretty rich public-transit system, why on Earth would I sink $12k into something I couldn't even entertain taking *out* of town on weekends, given its atrocious range and not-at-all-quick charge rate? - Versatility: Now that I'm across the river (New Jersey), I've actually needed my own wheels, and not a car, for several reasons I won't go into here. The bike I chose was a 2015 Vespa GTS 300 (replaced with a 2022 GTS SupeTech since an accident in December). Out-the-door cost would've been a bit over $9k, but ended up around $8700 (because of someone returning a bike to the dealer after the person they were gifting the bike to rejected it because they didn't like the color…given our current supply-chain issues, I'd *still* be waiting for a bike otherwise), including a few extras like heated grips. The bike averages some 70 miles per gallon, has a top speed in the low-to-mid 80s, has a good deal of storage capacity even without racks and a top-case, and is as easy to ride as a Zero, if not easier on account of a step-through frame. I ride it regularly between the Jersey Shore and NYC (and even took a trip to Philly to visit a relative and RevZilla's HQ), without any issues at highway speeds…and, with no "anxiety" about range, since a fill-up takes all of three minutes, from pulling up to the pump to rolling back out on the road. (And: that $3k difference buys a *lot* of plankton-juice.)
I live in an apartment too. I can't charge there or at work. I bicycle commute 20 miles each way. For fun/longer stuff on two wheels I have a 20 year old GSXR that cost me $3500 (just rode it from California to CotA MotoGP).
I had a Zero at two apartments. One was the bottom floor and I just rode it inside. The other was third floor and I just ran an extension cord out a window (sealed the rest of the crack in the window) and charged it under the stairs. Zeros definitely fit only a few use cases at the moment though.
I would like to see the maintenance schedule for the zero vs gas bikes. No oil changes? No valve adjustments? No air filter buried inside bike? Zero stated unlimited miles for five years on power pack on their website. Besides brakes and tires no other maintenance seems pretty sweet.
@@davidkeith3920, you have a major bias with all your answers. Let's start with this one: You say, "After 5yrs, then what? You're supposed to throw the bike away?" Really? Is this your conclusion? Are people throwing their Zero's away after 5yrs? With every Japanese, Italian, Austrian bike manufacturers, are people throwing their bikes away once their warranty is over after 2yrs. 2yrs, man! That's it! Most people pay to have their bikes fixed after the warranty runs out. Same with all vehicles. No different then Zero. Afer 5yrs, why wouldn't you pay to get whatever needs fixed? And what needs fixed on a Zero other then replacing the brake pads and belt? Blown shock seal? They can be replaced by anyone with their eyes closed. Same with brake pads. My daughter can replace brake pads! The electronics are complicated and require a professional. No one should be cutting and splicing things on an E-bike. Are people doing this on their Teslas? No. electronics are complicated and i don't why anyone would want to try and mess with them and make it worse? That's what certified mechanics are for. I don't get the bombastic bias you are throwing out with all your comments. I do not own a zero. I do not own any electric bike. Never have. But it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see its the future and quite practical in certain, situations-- IE-- living and commuting in a city...ever try driving around SF, LA, NYC, MIAMI, etc during rush hour on a motorcycle with the fan running -- doing everything possible to try and keep the engine cool -- and blowing hot air on your legs? Anyway, like most people, I enjoy reading an objective opinion that looks at the pros and cons. I like to see people being objective and rendering opinions without bias. Your opinions are completely biased and that makes for a very non-objective reading. My current bikes are KTM 990 SMR, KTM 890 Adventure, and KTM 525 SMR. Before that, I have owned 26 motorcycles. I see the logic right away for riding a 300lbs ZERO or any E-bike around congested city traffic. Also, did anyone not notice the ease of doing wheelies on this Zero, the perfect balance, the quietness, the lack of too many parts on a bike and things breaking, the lack of valves, exhaust, transmission, clutch plates, etc. etc. There's a lot right about this bike, but I agree about the range issue. As batteries become more and more advanced, the issue will be fixed at some point. My next bike will be gas as well, but after that I see the writing on the wall. With more quick charging stations eventually being available for E-bikes, and better infrastructure that will also eventually get here within the next dew years, it will make more sense to own one.
My main problem with Zero is the ‘pay to unlock’ model they are currently pursuing Bikes are fully specced but throttled down until you pay for the upgrade. This includes things like heated grips, range, charging speed, power and even traction control which I think is a moral issue. Imagine someone dies who might have been saved by the 6 axis imu traction control that the bike has installed but the company has put the riders safety behind a paywall…. Also they charge existing owners for ‘improvements’ to the existing battery system. So the latest firmware can add 10% speed onto the charging and a bit of range but it’s a pay upgrade. No rebate for the time my SRS was in the shop while they figured out how to combat water ingress There is something rotten in Zeros company culture
This is no different than if they were added on after the fact; the idea of them putting it on everything actually saves the user money because it's cheaper for the motorcycle to be manufactured. In regards to your "traction control," can you make that argument about any other motorcycle that has specific options for TC or ABS? It's like you're saying it's somehow worse to put it on the bike and charge vs not even have it in the first place. You're still not paying for it, it's just cheaper for the company to put it there for manufacturing. Ever get in a car and it has a blank button? Plastic cap? That's the same thing. Higher trims have something there; rather than redesign the whole dash they just make 1 mold and put a plastic cap. Do you complain about that? I get it if you don't like the bike, but the model makes sense and it's done by most manufacturers. It's like you're complaining that you can't have something you can clearly see you *should have access to* without paying for it. What's the alternative; you just have everything and the price goes up another 1k? Would you rather that?
@@YSPDJapan I kind of agree with Andrew here. If it is a safety feature, and the hardware is already on the vehicle and it's just a software setting to activate it from the dealer, then it is putting greed before safety. They can add other comfort options and charge extra for that. But if it is a big safety improvement like TC or ABS then they should definitely make that available to all buyers, if all the necessary hardware already is there. I remember a few years ago I was looking for a new car seat for my kid. In the store they had all different models in a wide range of price categories. I was trying to figure out why one cost about $60 more than the one next to it, they looked pretty much the same. The sales girl explained to me that the more expensive one was safer (their go-to explanation to any question about price differences), and the magic $60 feature was a soft plastic attachment to the seat belt that somehow made the chair very much safer. So I asked her, if that simple plastic part, that cost the manufacturer perhaps $1-2, was such a safety improvement, why do you charge the customers $60 for it instead of including it for free? A) it isn't such an important safety feature after all. B) greed before safety. I put disabled TC as category B.
@@YSPDJapan I think it IS worse to put on the bike and not let you access it. If it’s so much cheaper to manufacture the bike like that then manufacture the bike like that… Otherwise we will have this situation where the people paying for the upgrades are subsidising everyone else who buys the bike. I understand the model, I’m just stating my preference that I do not agree or like it. You may feel differently. Good for you!
@@YSPDJapan 'Ever get in a car and it has a blank button? Plastic cap? That's the same thing. Higher trims have something there; rather than redesign the whole dash they just make 1 mold and put a plastic cap. Do you complain about that?' The difference here being that in a subscription service, all the hardware is there already. They didn't just blank cap it, the button is right there, It just doesn't do anything unless you pay to activate it. The 'save money by not putting in X feature on a lower trim level' argument doesn't hold water when all the hardware is all already installed. You're not going to tell me that the company saves money by putting ABS on every bike, they could easily sell a non-ABS bike at a cheaper price. The point being the company is greedy and thinks they can force consumers to subscribe to keep access to a feature that they've literally already purchased.
Bought mine yesterday! Luckily I'm about 30min from one of the larger dealers/shops so I'm not worried about repairs down the line. Was talking to another owner in there with a 2015 DS with 60k+ on his. He just needed a replacement taillight screw because his had fallen out and the dealer just gave him one for free. Super fun bike (I just got licensed 2 weeks ago so take that into account, probably anything will be fun for me.) I l'll be getting a windscreen though because wow it feels like you're going to get blown off by wind at highway speeds.
I like the point about electric motorbikes filling a different role than existing ICE bikes similar to dirt bikes vs. street bikes. I've owned an FXS for a year and it's a great commuter and urban runabout. Zero as a company is kinda terrible, but electric motorbikes are great.
So much to process today. I, too, like the quiet. I have two ICE bikes, one 1K v-twin with cans: love the sound, but I could live without it many times. I'd guess - and you should check with Zero - TC can be worked into the software pretty easily. E-bike vs bicycle is simple: city streets only, or not? Pricing today for EVs is still a tough one. Depends entirely on individual priorities (clean, never smelly, no drips, NO trips to the gas station, just about no maintenance - all pretty attractive). Long-term running costs - fuel, maintenance (including time for things like a chain and dealer visits) could even out, specially if gas prices stay up there (probably so). But, purchase prices are dropping. Overseas manufacturers are pushing down hard on the value proposition and will continue, and US and European manufacturers will have to respond one way or the other. The very affordable electric scooter is also making huge strides, fitting in between bikes and motos. Battery and charging tech are also catching up quickly to ICE standards. Heck, I waited 20 minutes just to GET gas the other day. And...you need a separate category for commuters! Phew! The progress we're seeing is awesome. Thanks, Zack!
CRF300L also have way more range per fill. So back of the napkin math, CRF goes 6 times further, which pushes the break even point for fuel cost even further down the road. You can fill the CRF about 600 times before the costs add up?
Aside from lacking traction control, I wouldn't say it's a good beginner bike unless you want to only ride electric motorcycles. It doesn't have a clutch, so you can't master an essential skill for riding a gas powered bike.
@@kmb957 That's your opinion. The fact is that most motorcycles do have a clutch and if you want to ride them well you need to master that skill, whether you like it, or not. Luckily for you, you can get a DCT bike, or an electric one and your problem is solved. I do like having the clutch in both my cars and my bikes.
That's only a very small aspect of riding. There are many more skills you use when riding a motorcycle. I started on electric and was totally fine when I got a gas bike.
@@therealkzero One aspect yes, small absolutely not. But it matters not how many aspects. My point was that this is the one you can't practice on an electric bike. I didn't say you can't start on electric. I said I won't recommend it as a first bike. Most people start on smaller bikes then upgrade on something bigger, more powerful and more expensive. I believe it's better to learn clutch control on a less powerful and more forgiving bike. Of course your case might be different.
the friction zone is completely lost without a clutch. you can of course drag a brake and load throttle but the level of fine control in slow speed maneuvers is lost. still love my DCT tho
Zero buyer beware! After less than 5000 miles, the Zero is worth its namesake in trade in value. Because the service at the dealer didn’t recognize a sound with the motor, since I bought it, or during any of the service checks, Zero won’t stand behind their product, with a known issue, because it’s out of warranty. It’s a $20k+ bike that is worth $0, and can’t be traded in.
Zack, a couple points when talking electric bikes: 1. You should take into account MAINTENANCE for the Daily Ride. No oil changes? No coolant changes? Reduced brake pad changes? For something I can jump on and go, that's great! 2. You started to talk fuel prices, definitely bring that up! So let's finish your math: CRF300L gets about 74mpg and 2 gallons means 148 miles for $12, or 12.3 miles per dollar. The FXR, at 45 miles per charge for $1 is, well, 45 miles per dollar, lol. So the FXE is almost 4x cheaper to run per mile, before factoring in the maintenance above. That's not nothing! Thanks for the review, for sure!
Actually, electric bicycles tend to have more range compared to this thing. Plus, you can even take a spare battery for your bicycle with you. But of course speed will be way slower, with a spare battery you will be cycling all day long basically.
You could go for 4 hours on this bike at 25mph. It's not a great comparison to ebikes in general but it is a 7.2kw battery which is enormous for most any ebike. The range is much lower than you'd expect because people don't ride it at 25mph all day.
@@DadMichoMurphy I was countering the argument that an ebike has further range. I mean, I guess it is a bicycle so in that sense "unlimited range" but otherwise emotorcycles have extremely long range when ridden at bicycle speeds.
I guess I'm still confused by the name. "Daily Rider" to me sounds like the bike you're using for commuting to and from work. Which, to me, implies something comfortable, decent on gas, and small enough to slip around traffic easily, and tuck into hidden parking areas. Then the top of the leader board is always the most giant 500lb touring bikes that I don't associate with hop on and go, and are also ridiculously expensive (more expensive than this over priced electric). Likely just a difference in what is valued as a commuter bike, as you mentioned in Tiger video, but it's still weird to me.
Great video. I struggle with getting my “last bite at the apple” gas motorcycle (cough, Tuono) vs an electric. Being in Boston this bike makes a lot of sense, as you said Zack.
Thanks for daily riding these electric bikes, I'd seriously consider one once the price drops (& a major manufacturer like Honda brings out something like an electric Grom).
@@easyfromtnbtw3555 ye same here, still waiting for prices to drop and I'm not really living in a big city but otherwise I'd love a electric bike as well.
The biggest problem with EV bikes is price, but with Zero they have been making EV bikes since 2010 and there prices are STILL high. For example, the DX model in 2010 MSRP $9,995, for 2022 MSRP $11,595. Zero has been selling bikes for 12 years and yet their bikes are still expensive. Why? Battery? In the last 12 years they haven't figured out how to bring the price of EV batteries down? Yes, people have range anxiety about EVs but more people would take the plunge if the price was comparable to gas powered motorcycles. I like EVs and I am all for saving the environment, but I am not going to break the bank to do it.
Bingo. I'd love to have an electric bike for my commute in summer, or even a small electric car, but they just aren't feasible. Unfortunately the demand for battery materials will continue to outpace supply and prevent the prices from ever making sense.
One issue not covered in your review is battery replacement. The only option is return to the agent. Putting in another battery, even if salvaged from another machine bricks the machine. Your reviews of all machines should start including which features are subscription based seeing thus is a thing these days. Vehicles that must go to the agents for service or be bricked, must also have a review on number of agents and where located.
It's like Zack said, an e-bike would work for some siutations, but the FXE can go on the freeway and e-bike can't, so if your commute hits a freeway and you wanna go for an electric powered motorbike, then the FXE could work for you. Expensive though..
One thing I don't quite understand fro design point of view. If there is no clutch lever, why didn't they put the rear break lever there instead like on a scooter or a bicycle for example?
Sur Ron, Segway X260, Talaria Sting.!!! All about $4700-5k. Top end speed of about 45-50mph in sport mode. Not required to get insurance, endorsement, plates, oil changes, etc. No Highways, but you could ride just about every fire road, rail to trail, single track, etc. If they could just get a better range outta them I'd be SUPER about it... if these bikes could get 100-150 miles range per charge, but that's coming in the next 3 - 5 years as battery tech continues to improve.
I tried Zero SRF couple of years ago and I was really impressed. Their mid level street bike didn't feel nearly as good. With crazy prices and Zero's reputation for not standing behind their products, it is no go for me. As first bike, even this low end model is insane idea both for price and power delivery. Better off with Navi as first bike.
My question was WHY DOES IT COST $12000? For 40 Miles worth of riding? That thing is worth $3k at best.. Maybe if it went 200 miles a charge.. Not worth it..
the nissan leaf electric car costs 28000 and has 150 miles of range, average cost of E Cars is 60k and probably get 250 to 350 miles of range 👀 electric isnt cheap, those batteries alone are not cheap 👀 not much range for the money either way 👀
@@therealkzero i just hope hydrogen catches on, if all these huge trucks today are successfully using compressed natural gas, i see no reason we cant run on Hydrogen made from Solar, water Dam, nuclear or wind power 🙏 giant lithium mines are horrible and we cant even recycle plastic properly let alone giant batteries, They will end up in the ocean or landfill by the truck load 👀
There is a huge gap in the market for an electric (aka noiseless) dual sport that you can take on “bike” trails without drawing attention, but having a big enough battery to have a usable 100mi range and get up to highway speeds at least to 250cc speeds. That’s the unicorn dual sport, free to explore wherever you please but can actually get you places unlike an e-bike with 30mi/30mph range
The Zero company is anti right to repair and even though the bike is good an fun by purchasing the bike this is what you support. I believe this information is important to include in the review of the bike.
Thank you for bringing this up! It’s important information to share
I am waiting for energica to bring out something similar, at least they have this "fix it yourself" part covered. If I had spare money, I'd get the energica eva ribelle and no in between. Also, for this kind of range, I'd just buy an electric scooter, which has even a little compartment storage for your groceries.
exact reason why i didn't buy one even though it's perfect for me with my commute being stop and go 15 miles max. they'll completely block you out of the dealer network if someone without their golden star touches it.
can someone say Teslar, Apple.
Can you change brake pads, chain/sprockets, and tires? Not much else going on unless you're a computer programmer.
If zero would embrace their customers instead of their profits I would’ve bought one already
They kind of don't have profits which is a tough scenario.
I feel the same, but they are one of very few companies to last in the e-moto business as long as they have. So many have come and gone.
So Zero should not be concerned about making a profit? What kind of commie bullshit is that?
@@ThatsNotaRealBike I’d be perfectly ok with them making profits without artificially restricting the item that you pay for. I want them to succeed I love the idea of an electric motorcycle but their business model run counter to anything that I want to participate in. I was literally about to pull the trigger on an fxe like a month ago but then started reading about all the bs that they put their customers through and the pay to unlock features that exist on the bike. Needless to say I bought another gas bike instead
@@sonny9608 software is one thing I still don’t like when that’s the case either but zero takes it further with hardware that exists on the bike that you paid for but can’t use I.E. heated grips , battery capacity and charging speed. Or so I’ve read anyway. It’s just not a something that should be the case in my opinion on such an already expensive purchase. But to each their own, I just won’t be buying one
The company is incredibly anti-R2R, good luck having anything fixed on these bikes in a timely fashion
Just another reason to not buy this junk.
I’ve heard that from many Zero owners. Apparently there’s very little dealer and parts support.
Glad you pointed this out. As much as I'd like one, I'm pretty darn opposed to buying things I'm not allowed to work on myself.
A motorcycle you cant work on is not a motorcycle at all. We need open source electric bikes where all the part schematics are available, the modules hackable and parts off the shelf. Then they would be excellent short hop bikes, otherwise they are iphones on wheels.
@@TravisTerrell any electric vehicles will be like that. Tesla will lock you out of their supercharger network if they deemed you made "unauthorized" repairs. I'm going to stick with gas vehicles until 2050 when they ban gas cars completely.
Zack is a great ambassador for our sport and does a good job elevating this Zero. That said, the super short range and having to stay shackled to the Zero dealer network make this one a no for me. It’s a shame though, I’d really be open to the right electric bike.
There was a pretty decent EV dirtbike or dualsport that Ryan F9 recently made a video about. Unfortunately, it got Harley'ed and Davidson'ed. D-E-D!
@@ZildjianMan30 Alta are not dual sport, they are MX machines. you can buy one used still or get a Stark Varg or Husquavarna makes one too.
@@just_one_opinion You know what an MX bike is called when you slap on a mirror, lights, and zip tie a license plate? A dual sport. Don't split hairs.
Energica might be worth a look. They've only got 4 bikes out, but they support at home repair unlike zero, and don't have any cypher store nonsense.
Same, it just has to be affordable and have decent range. 100 miles on a motorcycle shouldn’t be a problem, and this pricepoint is just laughable. The Honda catalog is ROBUST with choices well under $12k
I've owned my Zero DSR with Charge Tank for over a year. Bought it used and it now has 12,000 miles on the clock. No commuting, only fun riding. Bay Area freeway speeds or the coast I average around 75MPH and get around 80 miles before I charge. Combined freeway/coast/surface streets I average about 120 miles. I hook up to a ChargePoint EVSE station, take a piss, grab some chow and when I return the bike averages between 80-91%. I don't run down to nothing, just like I didn't riding a gas bike. No problems whatsoever and the dealership I use is stellar. My experiece is I have not had a need for my dealership because the bike has been problem free. Owned and race many ICE bikes, two stroke and four strokes, motocross, desert and finally road racing. In my life ICE bikes dealer service varies widely depending on the owner of the shops. I do like the Energica EVA but DC to DC chargers are not nearly as prevelant as J1772 chargers. Not sure how many kWs the Energica's accept when not using the CCS plug but if it's less than 6.2kW that would be bad. Plus I like having a dual sport, something I can take on fire roads when I want to do so. As of today Zero is the only EV maker I'm aware of that has a bike like this.I have no desire to convince anyone either way about electric or the pros and cons of dealer support. All I know is my experience for both has been great.
Sup Mark. My brother also lives in the Bay Area and owns a Zero S. He uses it to commute to work and that's it. Just perfect for him. As Zack tried to explain, it's not for everyone, the person who buys it already knows its range limitation and gets it for a specific reason. The times I've ridden it has been a blast. I own a 2020 Ducati Supersport S & a 2019 HD Iron 1200 and I STILL think Zero Motos are a blast and am glad they're around. Im always keeping an eye out for a used SR/F and will likely get one once my work requires us to go back to the office full-time.
@@edgarmachado1300 Hey Brah. I got mine from SFMoto in SF $10,500 2017 model year. Had been on their lot for 132 days. Former owner traded it in for a SR/S. I had not ridden in about 15 years, had not raced or taught for 17. My race bike was a RC51. I knew that I didn't want a Zero without a Charge Tank. I've owned a Sur Ron since 2018, have 9k miles on it to date. Like other things back then all I heard was how the bike was "A Chinese piece of crap." Same shit I heard as a kid about Japanese cars. Humans gravitate toward the negative mob mentality side of new tech. Glock hand guns....plastic really!? ATM cards, etc. Most just repeat what they've read 'somewhere' or been told 'something.' Yes I'm an early adopter just like ICE vehicles were early adopters 100 years ago taking over steam. I made a 14k mistake buying a Cake Kalk& and the battery went bad after 8 months. Cake would not replace it under warranty so I returned the bike. POS in my own experience. It's OK, I could care less what people ride, only my experience with my own bikes. Even now when I look at ICE cars, loved my Porsches and really wanted a GT-R Godzilla, but now I don't see myself buyinmg a gas car again. Like I say, everyone is different. I don't forward information I've just 'read somewhere or seen on UA-cam. Of course there are bad things from any manufacturer. I just dig deeper than many to find out for myself.
When I read articles saying the elephant in the room is how electric cars are just as if not more expensive than ICE cars, I just dig down and have always found that the author comes from a petroleum based profit standpoint. And of course they sight "an expert" in electricity. BS, do some work and don't be a lamb is my view. To each their own. 🙂
You would have a much, much different opinion of the bike if you lived further away from the dealer network. Zeros are an extremely niche market, unfortunately.
I have the 2022 Fx (dual sport) all though I agree the range is not great, it literally cost $0.01 to travel per mile. For an under 60 mile urban commute, my bike is a blast and can do some decent off-roading. I’m very happy with the purchase.
nothing like coming up on someone in stealth mode, or flying away at stop lights with no sound! Cheers.
I don't think I've ever seen Zack wheelie any bike this often within a single daily rider review. He wheelied it in the 50 yards between the u-turn and parking up!
I commute 39 miles one way, mostly freeway at 75mph. This is probably not the bike for me.
Plus for $12,200, I can just get the MT-09sp 😎 🏍💨
Or Versys
I’d go for the SP for sure. You can almost buy a Tracer 9 GT for what this thing costs
Versys 650 would be perfect. Zero motorcycles make no sense to a person with functioning brain!
for that much you could also get a street triple.
@@goru426 No, people have djfferent needs. They'll work better in europe where cities and other are closer to eachother. Or people who work in the city they live in. I do think they're way too expensive.
I own the FXE, made 2000km on it so far and I just love it. Regarding the missing traction control: I got it in January and was riding it with the new tires in wet and near freezing temperatures. And yes, the traction can be very tricky even in Eco mode (about 40% torque) when you crank it up from the stop lights. The easy solution: Set up Custom mode as a rain mode with just 25% torque and it'll behave like a regular, tame 125cc.
Now in dry and milder conditions I have set Custom to 100% torque, 45% coasting regen and 100% braking regen and it's super nice and precise to ride with the feel of mild engine braking (much less than in Eco but more than Sport). Eco has become my wet mode now that I know how the torque kicks in. This bike certainly isn't for everyone but really is the perfect bike for me and my needs and distances. The only gripe I have are the tires: The Pirelli DR2 are pure warm weather tires IMO, perfect for Cali or Italy but surely not for all year riding in Germany. I'm gonna rock these down this summer and will get Michelin Road 5 in time for autumn to have a tire that doesn't need as much warming up and has better wet/rain performance.
Great comment! I had the same torque issue when in sport mode. I'll try this right away with my FXS - thanks!
How much has your range decreased over time? And how well do you feel the range is on the highway?
@@HaTran-tf3fe I'm at 3800km now and my range hasn't decreased at all. It even got better now with higher temperatures. I don't ride highways but when I ride roads with speeds between 70-120kph I get about 90-100km range. (I weigh 85kgs, my son at 70kgs gets 100-120km range)
I am really excited to someday own an electric bike. The problems for me are probably the same as many. The range on some are ok for my commute (60 miles round trip). I’m concerned about having to limit what I think I can do in a day based on my bike’s range. The bikes are also still pretty expensive for what they are. My biggest draw to getting one is that they are nearly maintenance free
zero are an extremely anti right to repair company, this is just a worse super soco tc max with a terrible company.
Biggest problem is they dont have a clutch. Might as well ride a taxi.
@@sonny9608 Are you specifically talking about this bike in particular because batteries in general have made considerable progress. Saying this won't change anytime soon is blatant bullshit.
@@sonny9608 the overall tech might be the same but its refinement that often improves the technology. Its the energy density that's different. Lithium ion/polymer batteries now have way better energy density now than back in the 70s. Technology isn't simply about finding new things in the lab. Its refinement and engineering, and manufacturing challenges. I hear the same argument for other tech like fuel cell, because its old tech. It that tech has other challenges such as bringing down the cost of production. Fuel cell relies on precious metals, and while fuel cell has been around since the Apollo missions, you don't have the same budget to build a car or bike as a spacecraft.
If I recall, Kawasaki is working on hydrogen powered bikes. Maybe some engineer got the wet dream of having an H2 that runs on H2O 😂😂. It would be pretty freaking hilarious if their hydrogen bike is named that.
@@sonny9608 lol, so you've chosen to ignore the advances in the various lithium type batteries such as improved energy density of lithium ion, lfp and you've completely ignored solid state lithium metal batteries.
These aren't secrets, they're widely known and well publicised. Perhaps you should do some actual reading next time instead of running your mouth off and making yourself look like a complete idiot
I have a 22 Zero FX 7.2. 21" dirtbike spoke wire version of the FXE. If you ride 55-85mph range is 50 miles. If you ride dirt roads 35mph range is 80 miles with my 235lbs ass on it. Top speed of 85 and its super quick off line. Very light and plugs into garage 110v outlet.
A super moto with terrible range, made by a company that is fiercly anti R2R = epic fail.
It isn't a terrible range. It is only a terrible range if you have to ride it really aggressively on high speed roads. If you live particularly far and isolated away from your employment. Plenty of people don't live like that but it is also true that plenty of people do. Just the nature of the shitty way we decided to build a lot of the country post-cars.
The company's anti-right to repair is an unforgivable sin however. Design a vehicle to be intentionally obtuse, intentionally limit the parts availability and charge up the ass when someone takes it to those shops for repair. It is not just about repairing it yourself. It also inflates the shop repair as they have a monopoly on it. Greed turns the simple act of keeping your expensive vehicle running into a profit center. It also enables them to barr your ability to repair if it is going to be considerably expensive for them to do. "Sorry, can't repair that. Guess you are going to have to buy a new one." Manufactured e-waste. Particularly hypocritical since part of the appeal/selling point of an EV is being better for the environment. They are dragging the whole EV motorcycle industry with them as well. People are already hyper critical to an unrealistic degree so this is just ammunition. It ain't going to work itself out either. Unless one of the more reputable companies decides to make electric but not screw people over in this regard. But if it works for Zero they will do that too.
I have an electric car that gets about 50-60 miles of range (with an 8 hour recharge time) and I have a supercharged Pontiac. I drive the electric 95% of the time but there are times I fall back on the Pontiac (or my Kawi Vulcan) for long trips.
Electric is cheap to run, low maintenance (no oil changes), super fun punchy instant torque. I think everyone should have something electric but only if you know you never need to commute very far or you also have something conventional to fall back on.
A Zero FXE for my 40 mile round trip commute and an MX-5 for everything else!
Highway is the worst for Zeros in terms of range. On my SRS, going about 40 miles per hour its using under 100 watt hours per mile. So with the 14.4 pack and a usable amount of around 12, thats 120 miles range full to dead. At 100mph its 330 watt hours per mile. So now its 36 miles full to dead. The range is on a spectrum depending mostly on speed. Mine is the worst case scenario with a big guy in full gear and side and top cases to drag in the wind. Also the range drops by as much as 10% in cold weather, by that I mean 50F and below, vs a warm summer day.
It's weak territory in general for anything electric. You can't beat physics. I think Zero's other offerings would probably be a better bet, where you can overcome the range with a bigger pack of cells or better aero (supermoto platforms are about as aerodynamic as a portapotty).
I think it was Aerostitch that did a winter in Minnesota on a studded-tyre Zero FX to see if it could work. It needed a battery warmer overnight, but I believe they made it work - it's on here somewhere. One of our faculty staff has a Tesla and says our Winters (SW PA) really test an EV, not just the cold and battery chemistry, but the fact you need a heater running full time too.
There's also the issue that cars can carry the equipment for things like fast charging, whereas bikes are limited to the slow charge, although I think Zero do have an option for this, but last I checked (back in 2018) it was eye-waveringly expensive.
@@sullybiker6520 Some info for anyone interested, about charging. Mine is the "Premium" model. The base has one onboard 3.6kw charger, the premium has two. It comes with a Webasto branded plug in to charge the bike. That can detect if its connected to 1 phase or two. If the Webasto is plugged into 1 phase, 15A, it charges the bike at 1.3kw. If I connect it to the two phase I ran to my garage it charges at 3.3kw. When I use the chargepoint charging station in the parking lot at work (Webasto not needed here) it charges at 5.8kw
@@bunberrier For anyone else here interested in charging information.
Zero is hopelessly behind the competition in regards to electric motorcycle charging capabilities. The rest of the competition is already on DC charging while Zero is using old tech and needs to overhaul their battery design to get there. Which of course costs RnD investments which they won't do.
Energica makes bikes in the same price range that are just simply better.
Harley makes a, questionably, better bike that is much more expensive. But they could improve in the future.
Other electric bikes are coming.
Unless Zero makes a 180 in their battery design, they won't be able to keep up.
Just confirming that range is extraordinarilly affected by riding speed. I typically get 100 miles of range on my 11.4 Zero if I travel around 30mph in the city and 50 miles at 60mph on the highway.
Regarding power wheelies and traction control, Bosch requires an extra ECU module for those features, turning it into a full Electronic Stability control system. The Bosch system is designed to control lift-up via a Bosch ECU modulating a traditional engine's torque, however they have appeared to have integrated it into the higher spec model SR/F. They put a price on safety.
After 22k miles on the FXE / FXS platform, I have never felt unsafe or had stability issues.
Not a fan of electric bikes, not a fan of automatic anything. BUT…..I’m here to see you wheelie!!
You should go plough the farms and protest use of machines. You sir belong in the stone age, ok boomer bye.
Not a fan of gas bikes, not a fan of manual anything. But I'm here to see you keep both wheels on the ground.
Right now this seems like an expensive toy for folks who live in a larger city. For that purpose it actually looks pretty awesome though, but at this price point I’d want more bike for the money. 9500 and lower and it starts to make sense. Just a couple more years and going electric will be a valid option for motorcycles too.
Try 4500 USD and maybe.
9500? LOL. It has specs of a $4k bike.
@@jamievidd775 name one supermoto that’s 4k with this much torque and this modern look. You have to be realistic bro. A husqvarna svartpillen is also spec wise not impressive and you can get older cheaper bikes with more hp but that’s not the point of these bikes.
@@jamievidd775 105Nm of torque is more than a Ducati Multistrada.
@@jamievidd775 And it will cost less than that 4k bike in a few years. This is more like a 5-6k ICE bike though. I don't know of many 4,000 dollar bikes that can do what this can do.
A new MT09, Street Triple or Duke 890R is basically around the same price point too. Since there’s no clutch a back break lever in it’s place would be quite fun. Anyway always enjoy these reviews👍
They wouldn't do that for safety guaranteed. Muscle memory.
@@Carado5150 True. That could be quite a problem.
@@Carado5150 Here in Thailand quite a few "real motorcycle" (with a clutch) owners also have a scooter (with a rear brake lever on the left) for short trips to the store, and I have never heard any of them complaining about muscle memory. Humans are very adaptable.
I love the idea of silent hooniganism.
Yeah me too especially after I watched a sur ronster video the other day. He has a surron that does 70 or 80 mph after upgrades and a whole lot cheaper than a zero
This is probably the better DR board talk, all good arguments back and forth.
Wouldnt mind an electic bike but there are some challanges I would need to overcome. 1. Charging - I live in a block of flats so would struggle with charging. 2. Range - Kinda need about 100 mile range. 3. Price - I cannot afford the initial outlay on an electric bike.
1: removable batteries are one of the big benefits of electric bikes, nobody can steal it if the fuel tank is gone and I'd like to see any criminal sell a bike without a fuel tank in a black market or back alley deal, the only electric bikes that are worth it are the ones with removable batteries.
2: range will inevitably increase although the niche that electric bikes fit best will probably make you wait a while until 100 miles is possible in one charge for less than £8,000, remember though that any electric outlet is a fuel station if you have the time so a 40 mile commute on a 6 hour shift will usually be completely fine if you charge the battery at work
3: the initial outlay on an electric bike is so much more affordable than the running costs of petrol bikes... if you are able to wait afew months to have the extra needed to set on it all at once then definitely do it and if you would be willing to finance the bike, its cheaper per month to finance an electric bike than it is to finance AND fuel a petrol bike and it also doesn't get extremely expensive to use an electric bike often because you aren't needing to constantly set down your wallet on petrol and maintenance
Agree on your points. This is still a niche motorcycle.
@@fawkyou2001 batteries not removable on this bike. only the FX has that i think. and i heard it's a bit of a pain to do it and the batteries are heavy.
I was looking to buy one of these for my daily 6 mile commute to LAX (12 miles round trip). But none were available in this area. So I went with the Sur Ron at less than half the price. It has similar range, eco & sport mode, and charges to 100% in 2 to 3 hours. Of course it only has a top speed of about 50 mph but that's plenty for my short commute. (Frankly, I stay in eco mode so the top speed is 30mph with regenerative braking.) Plus because it looks like a mountain bike, I can get away with riding it on the side walk as long as I stay at bicycle speeds. I'm glad I didn't waste the extra money on a Zero. And I still have my Honda Fury 1300 when I need to ride a "real" motorcycle.
Hi Jay the advantage of Sur ron is they can also be modified for more speed / power if you really want to - I find sport mode is fast enough on such a super light weight electric mountain bike (I also take short cuts on the cycle paths to conserve as much battery power as possible :)
They're not the same range. If I took your route on the Zero going your speeds, I'd get 100 miles. But for such a short commute i think you made a great choice.
I love Zacks uncontrollable giggle every single wheelie. Not your average bear indeed.
It’s fun when you accidentally “fill” the battery above the cut-off point, spilling electrons on the tank, and getting a little zap when you climb back on the bike. It’s like an extra shot in your morning coffee. (favorite T-shirt, from another channel: “I’ve lost an electron! Are you positive?”)
I'm sure eventually electric motorcycles will be more mainstream but the price and range are just killers. You can get 400cc bike that is well under 400lbs for less than half the cost and get 80mpg and they make great urban runabouts.
It is about what your priorities are and how much you can afford. 80 mpg is good compared to cars and most motorcycles, but terrible compared to EVs and especially electric motorcycles.
@@JuiceBoxScott problem is this specific manufacturer sucks. Have a problem with the battery? Well then you got to pay to ship hazmat all the way across the country instead of just going to the store. I can't wait for electric motorcycles to work out just not there yet.
@@RedEmpire36 it's impressive they've stuck around as long as they have, but I think you're right. I've got two HD dealers in town that I know can take care of my Street Bob if anything goes wrong. The Zero dealer in town is a jack of all trades/used bike dealer. I'm sure the dealer experience is poor in comparison.
@@JuiceBoxScott My Zero dealer has been great here on the east coast.
The quality of individual dealers isn't the point. The dealer network is sparse compared to the other big names and you are tied to them for any service you may need. Zero will not allow you to do any service yourself: they will not sell you parts, and if you do manage to get them it will void your warranty.
The practicality of a Grom (a fan favorite) for almost 10 times the cost. Yay?
Love people posting declarative opinions about a 30 minute video less than 10 minutes after it debuted.
The problem with the gene pool is that there's no lifeguard.
Facts, some comment are actually useful, but the most are just hating man
I feel the same way when women comment about the size of my peen before they let me get up in em. It's not the size, it's the motion right?....right? Lol
I absolutely love this series. Only UA-cam series I have watched every last one of. Keep them coming.
May I introduce you to fortnine
I'm here for it. Like he said, you gotta have some disposable cash and want it for what it is. I picked up a 2018 SR as a commuter (10 miles RT - all surface streets) and I've never had so much fun commuting. Every stoplight is a new 0-45mph record waiting to be broken. Would my Honda accord be better? Yes, all around. But I'm in it for the fun.
@@Dave-sw2dm that engine would last 10x longer than those batteries even at stop and go traffic all the time
I got a Yamaha mt-03 last August and as a lifetime rider it's my best friend for my 3 1/2 mile street commute. Almost 60mpg when I'm nice (that's happened twice) 52 when I'm harsh. I'm somewhere in the middle most of the time, 57ish. I can wheelie in a flash, dive into a corner on some 120 fronts and 160 backs (almost big boy size) and kill any car in the stop light. What else can you ask under 5. Screw this electric garbage in Arizona. I gotta pay that summer a.c. bill. This type of thing is gonna kill people when the rates get jacked. Literally.
@@TexasP00nTappa my Civic has 290k miles and its like 800 bucks for another engine 😵💫 im sure the electric motor will outlast any ICE but i doubt those batteries will 😵💫
I feel all the people who are like "But it's more expensive and makes less power than " or "With the range I can't justify it compared to " are missing the point of motorcycles in general. This bike fills a specific use case. If that use case doens't fit with what you want / need, buy something else. It's that simple.
That's what the trans woman on the corner told me. I can respect it.
While I will agree with you that it does fill a specific niche, is that niche big enough to support the company. From the replies I'm seeing on the video, it doesn't.
@@GaryMCurran 1) Sample size, 2) Zero has more models, for other niches.
Still waiting on that big leap forward. I'll stick with internal combustion for now.
When will people admit the emperor has no clothes? Because it's politically "correct" to say endlessly that battery tech will make this monumental leap forward and combustion technology is somehow ending all life as we know it. The reason battery tech isn't making this giant leap forward is because you CANNOT WISH THINGS INTO EXISTENCE THAT YOU WANT, you cannot simply THROW MONEY AROUND AND MAKE SOMETHING COME ABOUT. There's a little thing called science and physics and math.
EV's somehow have convinced people that doing the same thing is worth paying 3x more for.
What other mechanical or electrical devices in this world have accomplished the same naked-emperor deniability and sold for 3x as much?
Energica is close. Zero is a joke
Closer to what? destroying the surface of the earth and the water systems, agriculture, and economy to make batteries?
@@exothermal.sprocket thank you. I've said this many times to deaf ears.
@@exothermal.sprocket Yes. Close to the same destruction of combustion engines which have hurt the earth considerably more and longer than batteries from raping the mountains for ore, burning foundries to make alloys, poisoning water systems from refining crude oil and creating an engine with a thermal efficiency of about 50%. not to even mention the lag in power delivery and tiny baby torque.
Zack, I know what you're doing wrong when you do the stop/start. You use the front brake and when you let the lever go, in that split second you wobble. Use the back brake. Hold and release plus hard throttle. I ride a Honda Hornet 600 and do this all the time. I usually only drop a leg on adverse cambers. Give a mention if you try this.
You can’t repair them! Something goes wrong Zero blocks you from repairing YOUR bike!
yeah you'll end up having to mod everything at once to fix anything...
That statement is pretty broad. Are you telling me I can't replace my own brakes and chain? Or are you talking about just the electric motor?
There are some elements you need their software for, other than that its all as repairable as any other motorcycle. Watching a Louis Rossman video doesnt tell you much about Zero ownership.
@@kmb957 they sell belts. Not the stuff that breaks and electronics are drm city, lack of manuals etc.
Zero is popular enough that theres some aftermarket but theres a reason old are cheap if not running giveaways.
@@kmb957 to replace the belt, you will need to remove the swingarm and the belt is only obtainable at the dealer, for a hefty price and they break very easily
Bought one today! Super excited for my commutes. Thanks for posting the video. Helped me make my decision to buy.
how you liking it? is the range good?
This is the ultimate stealth hooligan. I have a zero FX and one of the things I've noticed is that in places that you don't want to be noticed it is less noticeable.
Trespassing never felt so peaceful
JJuan brakes are not Brembos but JJuan owner used to work for Brembo for many years. His products are used in many top teams throughout Europe.
All those giggles. That's why I bought the Zero DSR. It's my daily commuter, and it's perfect in that role.
I wish you could get a lever on the left, where the clutch would be, for maximum regen, like some cars have on a paddle.
I’m so glad there are other comments expressing concern for Zero’s ethics. It looks like a great bike but I refuse to support their company.
Just want to say I love watching Daily Rider, not only cause you da man Zach!, but also you’re cruising around my home town! Always starting off on Wardlow in LB all the way up Vincent thomas bridge, PV then carson lol..You even got lost in my neighborhood in one of the older videos when the 710 entrance was closed haha.. Anyways, makes me miss home! 🙏🏽
I mostly use motorcycles for short commutes but $12,000 is a deal breaker. I do wish Zero the best of luck and hope they stick around a long time (Brammo anyone?).
I ride the FXE a lot and the no traction control bit me recently. Was going very slow and hit the gas a litte bit too hard and hit some light gravel on the road (black gravel on black road. no way seeing it. But also cold road, cold tires. So I got too comfortable and was stupid.) and I lowsided. Footpegs got scratched but not bent. So you could keep using them. Only destroyed one rear indicator. But I need a new handlebar, new rubber grip and the cap at the end of the handlebar.
So not too much damage but still. Costs several hundred € to fix it but it could be a lot worse! So overall. If you just lowside and slide the bike, not too much damage.
Personally if I had to pick between a Navi and the Zero (disregarding R2R sentiments) I'd go with the Navi. The price of the Zero for the range you get is just way too high. I get that electric motorcycles are still really new tech so people like me definitely aren't the target market (I only ever buy used bikes) but the limitations of the Zero for 12k is pretty ridiculous.
They're incredibly cost prohibitive, even as an urban runabout, especially when the Navi is a fraction of the price and will do everything the Zero does (aside from the highway)
@QUICK-STAR I'm 35, well past the point of caring what I look like on a bike lol
@QUICK-STAR you're acting like a 14yo...
The Navi is so much cheaper, but also so much slower and a lot less fun in most people's minds. The best comparisons would be to a 500-750cc standard or super moto. Most would be significantly cheaper and trade off the electric for gas (50mpg instead of 150mpge, unlimited range vs 65 miles, etc).
@@fixienick You could use that argument against every other motorcycle in existence though. This bike has 5x the horsepower of a Navi.
Next electric bikes to try. Sur ron x bike and Talaria. They are becoming popular and have a good aftermarket support.
Once the Big 4 get their modular battery program going, Zero will be a footnote in the history of electric bikes.
Can't wait. Zero deserves to fail.
@@RedEmpire36 me too. Greedy anti-consumer bastards.
I wonder if they just want to get bough out. Most of the other bike companies make their tech just to sell it
@@pleasedontwatchthese9593 yeah, i get the feeling they are here to play, not here to stay.
I can't think of any ride I would go on the would be less than 100 miles. Add a milk crate and it might be a good grocery getter, or a to work and back bike. With twice the range it might be ok for short trips. Excellent review
12 Grand!?
I’m awaiting my Metacycle. Projected delivery June. I’m 79 years old and have been riding motorcycles off & on for most of my life. Haven’t had one for quite a while but have been riding ebikes for the last 25+ years. I probably would have gotten a Zero if there was a dealer in Idaho(I live in Twin Falls).I’m interested in trying the Metacycle and since I’ll be getting it @ the introductory price I expect I can turn it over and get a Zero if it doesn’t fit. Your review of the FSX sounds like it would do anything I need. Thanks for the review!
Hey Zack; wanted to say that I appreciate how well you are articulating the place for electric motorcycles in the motorcycle community!
Particularly in your answers to the final instagram question (but also generally through this video) you are giving a very realistic, pragmatic, and fair presentation of this motorcycle. Your approach translates well to EV cars as well, and I think it’s important to acknowledge that EVs do some things incredibly well that blow ICE out of the water while In other areas they don’t quite compare (-yet?). It should be up to us to decide if the implications of electric vs fossil fuel power are in line with our goals or not; but whether I’m totally in to the electrification bandwagon or I’m more focused on all the “shortcomings” when compared to the status quo, it’s important for folks like to you present the product as-is.
As someone who works in the EV industry and believes that they likely, and necessarily, are the future of transportation (while recognizing that they’re not the perfect fit for every application at present); I think you did a great job threading the needle here, and encourage you to keep up the gold work! Love the show, along with CTXP and Ari’s Shop Manual. Cheers!
I got a 2008 Yamaha WR250X, it’s an awesome super moto and at about 63mpg it has a 120+ range and have had it on interstates at 94mph indicated and can refuel it and keep on riding🥰
exactly what I use daily to work :D
I think this product has two narrow of a niche. I'd rather plan an extra 15 minutes for my commute and use an e-bike (one that reaches 30 mph with a greater range) while spending less than a third of what this costs and not paying insurance.
That's pretty much what I was thinking. It will however work great in LA because it's a car-centered city. Anywhere else, yeah e-bike will be as much fun and will save you tons of cash.
I agree but will note that you'll be hard pressed to top this bike's range. Ridden like a 25mph ebike it'll likely do 100+ miles whereas I don't think you could find many ebikes that'll throttle at 25mph for 4 hours. Of course once you have the speed you would use it.
Hey Zack, got plans to review the 2022 Honda CB500X?
Definitely a good option for a shorter commute in good weather.
Always fun to see Zack jumping bikes over the ‘Australian Root’
When someone has a bike with a 100 mile plus range at 70 mph for that money, I'm in line. Assuming it's a company that lets you repair you own bike of course, so not Zero.
50 miles and 8 hour recharge is too limited … maybe if they do the battery hot swap stations in the future this will be fine but at the moment that range is a killer … does it have a fast charge option?
I'd love to see more small cc bike reviews or obscure e-bikes as those are probably the main source for actual commuting on 2 wheels.
How does an electric bike like this handle a rodeo situation (without a clutch)? Clutch and rear brake are used together with the gas.
Moving ahead, but like you say/imply, they just aren't cost competitive on performance, equipment etc with ICE bikes. Not even the ridiculous prices we've seen recently for fossil fuels are enough to make up for that. I can live with range/charge times not much better than what's available now. I can deal with the increased weight for comparable performance. I could probably even live with the lack of character compared to the differences between ICE engine configurations (Singles, Parallel twins, V2, IL3, IL4, V4, 2-Stroke, Rotary, Supercharged, Turbocharged etc) The prices are a deal breaker though. I'm not paying that much more for that much less.
And all it would take is opening up the Keystone XL pipeline and some rejiggering of politics, and gas would be less than $2 a gallon and USA would be exporting it all over the place. Simple as that.
Convincing OPEC to increase their production ramp up speed, and/or ending the Ukraine war, is a lot of "rejiggering". The US tried to convince OPEC and failed. Prices should come back down barring further shocks though. All of which is out of my control at least, whereas the decision to switch to electric is very much mine, and high fuel prices aren't enough for it to make sense.
@@Joric78 Forgot all about 2019? Gas was under $2, USA was energy independent.
The giggle you make when you wheelie is worth watching the whole video.
Louis Rossmann has got it right when he talks about Zero's horrible repair practices. If you're remotely interested in buying a Zero bike, I'd recommend watching his video first.
I'm waiting for a quickly removable and replaceable battery so I can "refuel" on the road and continue my travel. A forty to eighty Mike round trip range limit is too restrictive unless you just want a city commute bike. Thanks for a superb review.
These Zeros have quick swap batteries. I'm not sure if it's this model specifically but you can also attach a second battery for more range or swap them out quickly. I considered getting one in the past for commuting and leaving one battery to charge overnight at work and another at home so I would always be ready to go but I never got that job so I never got the bike.
@@DcCock I think this is being phased out. It didn't really come in as handy as you might think.
The vehicle battery swap idea sounds good until you realize the sheer number of batteries needed along the road. They also need storage and/or being charged and transported around “fuel stations” to match demand. And you will want a fully charged battery ready at the station. Which is bad for the battery. It can be solved but you will pay, in cash or inconvenience or both… 😊
@@kristofferrydquist8384 I appreciate your good points and I agree! One way or another, it's going to cost us something to be able to tour across the country (world) on electric motorcycles in future, IF we ever really want to do that. Perhaps the manufactures who "confederate" per an agreement to design machines with universal/interchangeable powerpacks will need to market a membership program for those of us who want to participate in cross-country powerpack exchanges at participating "refueling" stations. It will cost us. However, it may be worth the price of admission. Until then, I'll keep riding my two-wheeled gas-burner until (and IF ever) riding an electric machine makes more sense. ;)
Intresting bike woul love to see honda cb650r in daily rider
He got me when he said "alright we're gonma rev it up"
Quite the interesting ride there, Zack. The issues behind choosing a bike like this, to me, are manifold:
- Ideal usage: When I still lived in NYC, something like the Zero would be "cute", but a total no-go: as an apartment dweller, I'd have a tough time finding a place to charge it overnight, and *very* few places I've ever worked at would have facilities to that end. Besides, between scooter ride-share systems like Revel (which I'm a member of), and a pretty rich public-transit system, why on Earth would I sink $12k into something I couldn't even entertain taking *out* of town on weekends, given its atrocious range and not-at-all-quick charge rate?
- Versatility: Now that I'm across the river (New Jersey), I've actually needed my own wheels, and not a car, for several reasons I won't go into here. The bike I chose was a 2015 Vespa GTS 300 (replaced with a 2022 GTS SupeTech since an accident in December). Out-the-door cost would've been a bit over $9k, but ended up around $8700 (because of someone returning a bike to the dealer after the person they were gifting the bike to rejected it because they didn't like the color…given our current supply-chain issues, I'd *still* be waiting for a bike otherwise), including a few extras like heated grips. The bike averages some 70 miles per gallon, has a top speed in the low-to-mid 80s, has a good deal of storage capacity even without racks and a top-case, and is as easy to ride as a Zero, if not easier on account of a step-through frame. I ride it regularly between the Jersey Shore and NYC (and even took a trip to Philly to visit a relative and RevZilla's HQ), without any issues at highway speeds…and, with no "anxiety" about range, since a fill-up takes all of three minutes, from pulling up to the pump to rolling back out on the road. (And: that $3k difference buys a *lot* of plankton-juice.)
I live in an apartment too. I can't charge there or at work.
I bicycle commute 20 miles each way. For fun/longer stuff on two wheels I have a 20 year old GSXR that cost me $3500 (just rode it from California to CotA MotoGP).
I had a Zero at two apartments. One was the bottom floor and I just rode it inside. The other was third floor and I just ran an extension cord out a window (sealed the rest of the crack in the window) and charged it under the stairs. Zeros definitely fit only a few use cases at the moment though.
NYC doesn't have enough charging stations?
@@donderstorm1845 Not by my lights, even since I wrote that.
@@barrettwbenton i'm surprised. i thought a city like NYC would have a lot of them all over the place.
I would like to see the maintenance schedule for the zero vs gas bikes. No oil changes? No valve adjustments? No air filter buried inside bike? Zero stated unlimited miles for five years on power pack on their website. Besides brakes and tires no other maintenance seems pretty sweet.
And after five years... what? You're supposed to throw the bike away and get a new one? That's real eco-friendly right there.
@@davidkeith3920, you have a major bias with all your answers. Let's start with this one: You say, "After 5yrs, then what? You're supposed to throw the bike away?" Really? Is this your conclusion? Are people throwing their Zero's away after 5yrs? With every Japanese, Italian, Austrian bike manufacturers, are people throwing their bikes away once their warranty is over after 2yrs. 2yrs, man! That's it! Most people pay to have their bikes fixed after the warranty runs out. Same with all vehicles. No different then Zero. Afer 5yrs, why wouldn't you pay to get whatever needs fixed? And what needs fixed on a Zero other then replacing the brake pads and belt? Blown shock seal? They can be replaced by anyone with their eyes closed. Same with brake pads. My daughter can replace brake pads! The electronics are complicated and require a professional. No one should be cutting and splicing things on an E-bike. Are people doing this on their Teslas? No. electronics are complicated and i don't why anyone would want to try and mess with them and make it worse? That's what certified mechanics are for. I don't get the bombastic bias you are throwing out with all your comments. I do not own a zero. I do not own any electric bike. Never have. But it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see its the future and quite practical in certain, situations-- IE-- living and commuting in a city...ever try driving around SF, LA, NYC, MIAMI, etc during rush hour on a motorcycle with the fan running -- doing everything possible to try and keep the engine cool -- and blowing hot air on your legs? Anyway, like most people, I enjoy reading an objective opinion that looks at the pros and cons. I like to see people being objective and rendering opinions without bias. Your opinions are completely biased and that makes for a very non-objective reading. My current bikes are KTM 990 SMR, KTM 890 Adventure, and KTM 525 SMR. Before that, I have owned 26 motorcycles. I see the logic right away for riding a 300lbs ZERO or any E-bike around congested city traffic. Also, did anyone not notice the ease of doing wheelies on this Zero, the perfect balance, the quietness, the lack of too many parts on a bike and things breaking, the lack of valves, exhaust, transmission, clutch plates, etc. etc. There's a lot right about this bike, but I agree about the range issue. As batteries become more and more advanced, the issue will be fixed at some point. My next bike will be gas as well, but after that I see the writing on the wall. With more quick charging stations eventually being available for E-bikes, and better infrastructure that will also eventually get here within the next dew years, it will make more sense to own one.
My main problem with Zero is the ‘pay to unlock’ model they are currently pursuing
Bikes are fully specced but throttled down until you pay for the upgrade.
This includes things like heated grips, range, charging speed, power and even traction control which I think is a moral issue. Imagine someone dies who might have been saved by the 6 axis imu traction control that the bike has installed but the company has put the riders safety behind a paywall….
Also they charge existing owners for ‘improvements’ to the existing battery system. So the latest firmware can add 10% speed onto the charging and a bit of range but it’s a pay upgrade.
No rebate for the time my SRS was in the shop while they figured out how to combat water ingress
There is something rotten in Zeros company culture
This is no different than if they were added on after the fact; the idea of them putting it on everything actually saves the user money because it's cheaper for the motorcycle to be manufactured.
In regards to your "traction control," can you make that argument about any other motorcycle that has specific options for TC or ABS? It's like you're saying it's somehow worse to put it on the bike and charge vs not even have it in the first place. You're still not paying for it, it's just cheaper for the company to put it there for manufacturing.
Ever get in a car and it has a blank button? Plastic cap? That's the same thing. Higher trims have something there; rather than redesign the whole dash they just make 1 mold and put a plastic cap. Do you complain about that?
I get it if you don't like the bike, but the model makes sense and it's done by most manufacturers. It's like you're complaining that you can't have something you can clearly see you *should have access to* without paying for it. What's the alternative; you just have everything and the price goes up another 1k? Would you rather that?
@@YSPDJapan I kind of agree with Andrew here. If it is a safety feature, and the hardware is already on the vehicle and it's just a software setting to activate it from the dealer, then it is putting greed before safety. They can add other comfort options and charge extra for that. But if it is a big safety improvement like TC or ABS then they should definitely make that available to all buyers, if all the necessary hardware already is there.
I remember a few years ago I was looking for a new car seat for my kid. In the store they had all different models in a wide range of price categories. I was trying to figure out why one cost about $60 more than the one next to it, they looked pretty much the same. The sales girl explained to me that the more expensive one was safer (their go-to explanation to any question about price differences), and the magic $60 feature was a soft plastic attachment to the seat belt that somehow made the chair very much safer. So I asked her, if that simple plastic part, that cost the manufacturer perhaps $1-2, was such a safety improvement, why do you charge the customers $60 for it instead of including it for free?
A) it isn't such an important safety feature after all.
B) greed before safety.
I put disabled TC as category B.
@@YSPDJapan I think it IS worse to put on the bike and not let you access it. If it’s so much cheaper to manufacture the bike like that then manufacture the bike like that…
Otherwise we will have this situation where the people paying for the upgrades are subsidising everyone else who buys the bike.
I understand the model, I’m just stating my preference that I do not agree or like it.
You may feel differently. Good for you!
@@YSPDJapan 'Ever get in a car and it has a blank button? Plastic cap? That's the same thing. Higher trims have something there; rather than redesign the whole dash they just make 1 mold and put a plastic cap. Do you complain about that?'
The difference here being that in a subscription service, all the hardware is there already. They didn't just blank cap it, the button is right there, It just doesn't do anything unless you pay to activate it. The 'save money by not putting in X feature on a lower trim level' argument doesn't hold water when all the hardware is all already installed. You're not going to tell me that the company saves money by putting ABS on every bike, they could easily sell a non-ABS bike at a cheaper price. The point being the company is greedy and thinks they can force consumers to subscribe to keep access to a feature that they've literally already purchased.
It's business. They don't want to add to the msrp
Bought mine yesterday! Luckily I'm about 30min from one of the larger dealers/shops so I'm not worried about repairs down the line. Was talking to another owner in there with a 2015 DS with 60k+ on his. He just needed a replacement taillight screw because his had fallen out and the dealer just gave him one for free. Super fun bike (I just got licensed 2 weeks ago so take that into account, probably anything will be fun for me.) I
l'll be getting a windscreen though because wow it feels like you're going to get blown off by wind at highway speeds.
I like the point about electric motorbikes filling a different role than existing ICE bikes similar to dirt bikes vs. street bikes. I've owned an FXS for a year and it's a great commuter and urban runabout.
Zero as a company is kinda terrible, but electric motorbikes are great.
So much to process today. I, too, like the quiet. I have two ICE bikes, one 1K v-twin with cans: love the sound, but I could live without it many times. I'd guess - and you should check with Zero - TC can be worked into the software pretty easily. E-bike vs bicycle is simple: city streets only, or not? Pricing today for EVs is still a tough one. Depends entirely on individual priorities (clean, never smelly, no drips, NO trips to the gas station, just about no maintenance - all pretty attractive). Long-term running costs - fuel, maintenance (including time for things like a chain and dealer visits) could even out, specially if gas prices stay up there (probably so). But, purchase prices are dropping. Overseas manufacturers are pushing down hard on the value proposition and will continue, and US and European manufacturers will have to respond one way or the other. The very affordable electric scooter is also making huge strides, fitting in between bikes and motos. Battery and charging tech are also catching up quickly to ICE standards. Heck, I waited 20 minutes just to GET gas the other day. And...you need a separate category for commuters! Phew! The progress we're seeing is awesome. Thanks, Zack!
This thing looks pretty fun!! 🙌🏻🤩
CRF300L also have way more range per fill. So back of the napkin math, CRF goes 6 times further, which pushes the break even point for fuel cost even further down the road. You can fill the CRF about 600 times before the costs add up?
Aside from lacking traction control, I wouldn't say it's a good beginner bike unless you want to only ride electric motorcycles. It doesn't have a clutch, so you can't master an essential skill for riding a gas powered bike.
Operating a clutch is overrated. Been doing it for 20 years now and frankly tired of it for the everyday ride.
@@kmb957 That's your opinion. The fact is that most motorcycles do have a clutch and if you want to ride them well you need to master that skill, whether you like it, or not. Luckily for you, you can get a DCT bike, or an electric one and your problem is solved. I do like having the clutch in both my cars and my bikes.
That's only a very small aspect of riding. There are many more skills you use when riding a motorcycle. I started on electric and was totally fine when I got a gas bike.
@@therealkzero One aspect yes, small absolutely not. But it matters not how many aspects. My point was that this is the one you can't practice on an electric bike. I didn't say you can't start on electric. I said I won't recommend it as a first bike. Most people start on smaller bikes then upgrade on something bigger, more powerful and more expensive. I believe it's better to learn clutch control on a less powerful and more forgiving bike. Of course your case might be different.
the friction zone is completely lost without a clutch. you can of course drag a brake and load throttle but the level of fine control in slow speed maneuvers is lost. still love my DCT tho
He took the decision serious. Zach was genuinely trying hard. Thanks for the effort.
Zero buyer beware! After less than 5000 miles, the Zero is worth its namesake in trade in value. Because the service at the dealer didn’t recognize a sound with the motor, since I bought it, or during any of the service checks, Zero won’t stand behind their product, with a known issue, because it’s out of warranty. It’s a $20k+ bike that is worth $0, and can’t be traded in.
How is it 20k+?
@ it’s a Zero SR/S Premium with Charge Tank.
@ note: no Zero Motorcycle is listed on KBB; so, they all have $0 trade in value.
Zack, a couple points when talking electric bikes:
1. You should take into account MAINTENANCE for the Daily Ride. No oil changes? No coolant changes? Reduced brake pad changes? For something I can jump on and go, that's great!
2. You started to talk fuel prices, definitely bring that up! So let's finish your math: CRF300L gets about 74mpg and 2 gallons means 148 miles for $12, or 12.3 miles per dollar. The FXR, at 45 miles per charge for $1 is, well, 45 miles per dollar, lol. So the FXE is almost 4x cheaper to run per mile, before factoring in the maintenance above. That's not nothing!
Thanks for the review, for sure!
Actually, electric bicycles tend to have more range compared to this thing.
Plus, you can even take a spare battery for your bicycle with you.
But of course speed will be way slower, with a spare battery you will be cycling all day long basically.
not bad if you want to show up late and sweaty 🤣
You could go for 4 hours on this bike at 25mph. It's not a great comparison to ebikes in general but it is a 7.2kw battery which is enormous for most any ebike. The range is much lower than you'd expect because people don't ride it at 25mph all day.
@@alwaysplaythegame you certainly can’t ride an ebike on the freeway for any distance. This is a real street legal motorcycle.
@@DadMichoMurphy I was countering the argument that an ebike has further range. I mean, I guess it is a bicycle so in that sense "unlimited range" but otherwise emotorcycles have extremely long range when ridden at bicycle speeds.
@@alwaysplaythegame Solid point.
Zack , great review , thx for this , will you be doing an updated review for the sport eStreet bike ?
I guess I'm still confused by the name. "Daily Rider" to me sounds like the bike you're using for commuting to and from work. Which, to me, implies something comfortable, decent on gas, and small enough to slip around traffic easily, and tuck into hidden parking areas. Then the top of the leader board is always the most giant 500lb touring bikes that I don't associate with hop on and go, and are also ridiculously expensive (more expensive than this over priced electric). Likely just a difference in what is valued as a commuter bike, as you mentioned in Tiger video, but it's still weird to me.
Great video. I struggle with getting my “last bite at the apple” gas motorcycle (cough, Tuono) vs an electric. Being in Boston this bike makes a lot of sense, as you said Zack.
12k and (maybe) 50 mile range?
It would seem cheaper to book a flight on one of Bezos's Dealdo rockets 🚀
Thanks for daily riding these electric bikes, I'd seriously consider one once the price drops (& a major manufacturer like Honda brings out something like an electric Grom).
"I don't like electric bla bla bla i don't like automatics bla bla bla".
Yo I love bikes and that sure looks like a fun city bike, great video.
That's a scooter
I would definitely consider one if they weren’t so damn expensive. You can get a lot of bike for 12k for an ice bike
@@easyfromtnbtw3555 ye same here, still waiting for prices to drop and I'm not really living in a big city but otherwise I'd love a electric bike as well.
Do they have Electric Side by Sides?
The biggest problem with EV bikes is price, but with Zero they have been making EV bikes since 2010 and there prices are STILL high. For example, the DX model in 2010 MSRP $9,995, for 2022 MSRP $11,595.
Zero has been selling bikes for 12 years and yet their bikes are still expensive. Why? Battery? In the last 12 years they haven't figured out how to bring the price of EV batteries down? Yes, people have range anxiety about EVs but more people would take the plunge if the price was comparable to gas powered motorcycles.
I like EVs and I am all for saving the environment, but I am not going to break the bank to do it.
Bingo. I'd love to have an electric bike for my commute in summer, or even a small electric car, but they just aren't feasible. Unfortunately the demand for battery materials will continue to outpace supply and prevent the prices from ever making sense.
If you think Lithium mining will save the environment, you may be deluded by propaganda.
To be fair, the bike is much much nicer now than in 2010
I always enjoy these videos. Despite the price this would be the bike for me.
One issue not covered in your review is battery replacement. The only option is return to the agent. Putting in another battery, even if salvaged from another machine bricks the machine. Your reviews of all machines should start including which features are subscription based seeing thus is a thing these days. Vehicles that must go to the agents for service or be bricked, must also have a review on number of agents and where located.
I am personally incredibly excited for the electric bikes that will come out in the near future. I'd love one of these FXE's for sure!
The pull on that thing when you switched to sport mode is something very impressive for what Is basically a 300lb. supermoto.
Are those USDM KTM 890 Duke turn signals on the front? That brake fluid reservoir looks familiar as well.
Great review. I think it's a great bike for $5-6K but 12? Not even close. Get an electric mountain bike.
It's like Zack said, an e-bike would work for some siutations, but the FXE can go on the freeway and e-bike can't, so if your commute hits a freeway and you wanna go for an electric powered motorbike, then the FXE could work for you. Expensive though..
One thing I don't quite understand fro design point of view. If there is no clutch lever, why didn't they put the rear break lever there instead like on a scooter or a bicycle for example?
$13k ? 40 mile range? Just get a Surron .
Sur Ron, Segway X260, Talaria Sting.!!! All about $4700-5k. Top end speed of about 45-50mph in sport mode. Not required to get insurance, endorsement, plates, oil changes, etc. No Highways, but you could ride just about every fire road, rail to trail, single track, etc. If they could just get a better range outta them I'd be SUPER about it... if these bikes could get 100-150 miles range per charge, but that's coming in the next 3 - 5 years as battery tech continues to improve.
The Honda CRF 300L Rally was a great comparison, I hadn't thought of that. The Zero seemed like a good bike, until you mentioned that option.
And not the only one.
The Zero has more than twice the power though, with no gas, oil changes, chain maintenance, etc.
I tried Zero SRF couple of years ago and I was really impressed. Their mid level street bike didn't feel nearly as good. With crazy prices and Zero's reputation for not standing behind their products, it is no go for me. As first bike, even this low end model is insane idea both for price and power delivery. Better off with Navi as first bike.
UA-cam recommended exactly what i need. Thank you, i really want to buy this bike.
My question was WHY DOES IT COST $12000? For 40 Miles worth of riding? That thing is worth $3k at best.. Maybe if it went 200 miles a charge.. Not worth it..
the nissan leaf electric car costs 28000 and has 150 miles of range, average cost of E Cars is 60k and probably get 250 to 350 miles of range 👀 electric isnt cheap, those batteries alone are not cheap 👀 not much range for the money either way 👀
EV market is still expensive. As time goes on the prices will come down because the tech will get cheaper.
@@therealkzero i just hope hydrogen catches on, if all these huge trucks today are successfully using compressed natural gas, i see no reason we cant run on Hydrogen made from Solar, water Dam, nuclear or wind power 🙏 giant lithium mines are horrible and we cant even recycle plastic properly let alone giant batteries, They will end up in the ocean or landfill by the truck load 👀
Low center of gravity needs to have good mass centralization to really make the bike feel light
A $12k toy scooter. When motorcycles go electric they’ll become “remember when we had motorcycles”.
Lol
There is a huge gap in the market for an electric (aka noiseless) dual sport that you can take on “bike” trails without drawing attention, but having a big enough battery to have a usable 100mi range and get up to highway speeds at least to 250cc speeds. That’s the unicorn dual sport, free to explore wherever you please but can actually get you places unlike an e-bike with 30mi/30mph range
Anything with a 50mph top speed will draw attention on bike trails lol. Even a surron will draw a lot of negative attention.