What's the Most Important Surround Speaker in Home Theater?
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- Опубліковано 27 жов 2022
- In this video, I discuss what I feel to be the most important surround speaker is in a typical 7.1.4 home theater speaker layout. We discuss the LCR's, side surround, back surround, and 4 height channels along with recommendations to get the most enveloping surround experience for 2CH music upmixing and Dolby Atmos movie watching.
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#hometheater #loudspeakers #movies - Наука та технологія
Thank you SO much for getting to the point and not dragging out the main subject to the point that I loose desire to watch! Great info and you have earned my subscription.
Really great approach Gene, that's what keeps me coming back. thanks again!
I never had side channels until about 2 years ago. Using SVS Prime Elevations. It really made a huge difference.
I've learnt so much from you. Thank you for your channel and all the tremendous knowledge you share.
I have a 7.2.4 B&W speaker configuration driven by a Denon AVR-X8500HA in my living room. In my home theater I have a 7.1.4 Wharfdale layout with a REL sub, driven by a Marantz SR6015. Obviously room acoustics play a major role and I find the home theater setup more expressive and perfect for movie nights.
Both of my layouts were largely influenced by your advice and recommendations. Than you Gene.
I love Andor as well. The audio mix is just next level awesome
I'm glad that you showed up on my UA-cam algorithm radar because I have grown to trust your opinion on all things audio above all other UA-cam content providers.
I'm using multiple pairs of vintage Polk Audio LSi9' s in my base layer of my 7.2.6 (seems to be playing in 7.2.4 most of the time) with 2 moderately sized SVS PB 1000 subs (one in front and one to the side) and six SVS prime satellite speakers bolted to my ceiling.
I've got the tweeters in my base layer pretty much at ear level and pointed at the prime seating position. Honestly, music sounds better in my theater than even the best 2.1 rig I ever created.
I do wish I had larger subwoofers for movies but it's not bad at all.
As someone new to the speaker game - I currently run a 3.1 and am looking to add and upgrade. Very helpful video.
Very interesting Gene, thank you for the valuable insight! Perfect timing, this going to help me in purchasing my side surrounds. :)
Gene - Thanks for a much needed video! Agree that surround sides (near rears) are the next important channel in immersive sound setup. In fact, they are placed directly feeding into listener's ears. Extremely effective.
Media Room: Atmos 7.2.4 config - B&W 805D3 (L/R); HTM4D2 (C); Polk R30 (Sides); DefTech BP10 (Rears); B&W M-1 (4 X Atmos Heights); dual SVS SB2000 (LFE). Anthem AVM70 (Pre/Pro); Mark Levinson 533H (L/C/R); Anthem PVA7 (Bed Layer); Rotel RMB1555 (Atmos Heights). Considering upgrading the sides (Polk R30s) or swap with rears (TechDef BP10s)...however, sides are not dominant enough (and should not be) to warrant change at the moment. Another option is to swap out Sides and Rears with 4 X KEF Q100s (bookshelf) to match surround timbre.
Just upgraded to 7.1.4. Using in wall Triad Gold 4 Omni SE for surround and rear surround. Using Triad Silver Sat 9 for atmos. Front stage is Paradigm Studio V5 100 and CC690 that I've had for years. Very happy with the Triad Surround and Atmos additions to my Paradigms.
my current setup has the same floor standing tower for all 5 main speakers - though the rear surrounds are small bookshelf speakers in the same product line. Moving the bookshelf speakers to the rear and replacing the sides with matching full towers gave a noticeable presence/size improvement over the 2-way bookshelves that had been serving as side surrounds. Like Gene said both for upmixed music and movies.
That validates my thoughts about speakers. Thanks so much. 🔊👍
Fully agreed - good side speakers and placement leads to a much more headphone like impact in precision without putting a constraint on the soundstage if the dsp and alignment is done properly
Thank you Gene for the informative video! I have a Klipsch Synergy 7.1 surround sound system with a Yamaha 7.2 A/V receiver. My sub is the Klipsch down firing SW-450 I find using the YAPO within my Yamaha receiver comes in useful. I purchased both in 2010, but they are both sounding as good as the day of purchase...knock on wood.
Totally agree, the side surrounds also enhances the stereo wide with upmixed stereo soundsources
Terrific video Gene, Thank you. As you said here, I feel the same that the front stage speakers (LCR), in a theater, listening space, are of utmost importance, but also have to agree that out of all the surrounds the sides should receive some special attention, especially for listening to music. I'm running a 7.2.4 and after some experimentation, (using elevation, not in-ceiling) my side surrounds are now located 2 feet above ear height and just slightly behind the MLP. Like you, I listen to a lot of music, both stereo, and multi-channel and prefer Auro 3D for any content that's streamed or on a disc that's recorded, mixed and mastered utilizing 5.1 or 7.1 multichannel sound. As for just 2 channel recordings, (as per your suggestion in a past video), I prefer up-mixing using Dolby Surround instead of DTS Neural:X or Auro 3D.
I so agree, the best upgrade for my system was changing my small surrounds to a pair of pair of stage foldback speakers that I required, listening now to Pink Floyd Animals SACD 5.1……..Incredible.
Great info on the 10 degree in front side channels!!
Thanks Gene! So I'm running a 7.4.4 system...I think you're spot on if you're on the main row...in my case the rear surrounds on rear/2nd row sounds just as good, if not better.
Especially, if you have enough power going to each one of them... I'm running the Monoprice Class D, 8x200w amplifier...
I recently integrated two active speakers (Nubert nuPro A-20) I still had from an older desktop setup into the main system, bringing it from pure stereo to 4.0. Both my wife and I are blown away by the immersion this brought to movies and TV shows.
I had hoped and anticipated that much...What I didn't anticipate was the added bass output, that those brought. In our current living situation using a sub sadly isn't possible. But those two punch so deep and Audyssey integrated them so well, I am really not missing much.
I don't use them for Music though, as their electrical design is slightly flawed, giving them a high noise floor.
I agree, My L&R are large towers and side surrounds are the next size down tower in the same series.
Wow I was surprised and amazed by your answer
My 7.2.4 theater has a speaker layout pretty much identical to the one you showed. My surrounds are 2.5 way speakers using four Dynaudio high powered drivers with 2.5 inch voice coils and Dynaudio D28 AF tweeters. These used to be my location monitors for outside broadcasts. Since this is a three row, 9 seat room, the surrounds are just behind the second row. The MLP is the center second row. This works very well. The rears a are active bi-amp using KEF and Dynaudio drivers. These are my TL monitors from my old room from Grand Forks ND. The bass lines were rebuilt in 2005. The ceiling speakers are four sealed Mark Audio full range drivers in sealed enclosures. They are absolutely ideal ceiling speakers. I agree the sense of spaciousness with the Dolby up mixer is amazing. I have just received my first audio only BD Atmos recording. It is on DGG and a recording of the new organ of St. Stephen's Cathedral in Vienna. It is a true Atmos recoding and NOT upmixed as most are. It is a true revelations and you are literally transported into the Cathedral space.
Got a 5.2.4 system. Listening to this video makes me wanna try a 7.2.4 even more now. My processor has the channels to do it. Just need to get a 2 channel amp and some speakers.
I enjoyed the 4 second stare at the end of the video.
Hi Gene.Thanks for your information
I am running 5.2.4 in my apartment given I have limited space so I have no room for rear speakers. So I placed a better bookshelf now for my sides instead. I cant wait to try later tonight. Thanks Gene.
totally agree 👍 the real new dimension with all this new Atmos and even in DD+ are the side speakers ! im running classic 7.2 setup all equal speakers but rear Bipole .
Really useful video thank you :)
Great video. Good info. Regarding subs, I try to be careful to not just generalize the benefit of multiple subs. I’ve had rooms (my own!), where two subs in different locations created a null in response. We ended up placing the two subs directly beside each other…at which point I sold both and got one bigger sub! But I have a system going in now where the response with two huge subs was poor at the listening position…until we moved them high on the wall (unseen behind a screenwall on a shelf that could hold King Kong). But still a larger than desirable null at the main listening position (crazy how often this is the case). We added two large JL in-wall subs in the back and our in room response really flattened out. It was a good lesson to not just declare two subs is always better. It is almost always better. But you should be measuring, modeling, or listening and testing if possible to truly determine what kind of bass support and where in the room it is needed.
I agree, I have three rows and am putting in three side speaker pairs, one for each row. The sides are very similar to the mains just smaller CBT line arrays. I'm still batting around ideas about what to build for the rear speakers.
The back row is pretty much against the back wall so that doesn't make it easy. Maybe inverted ground plane CBT's? That might work. At one point I was thinking of that for the sides but that would have caused the height to vary relative to the seating rows so I opted for full CBT's mounted at constant height relative to the seat rows. For the rear speakers however an inverted ground plane might work.
You totally right side channel surround is the cherry on top of the cake on a Home Theater set up
HI STILL USING MY OLD THX BOSTON 555 575 STILL SOUNDS GREAT
I've got a 7.2.2 and I agree, the side surrounds are the most important. Case in point: In Top Gun-Maverick, when the CO says "Attention on deck" to introduce the Top Gun pilots to their new instructor, Maverick, there are jets that fly right to left and, once offscreen, they fly directly into the left side surround channel. The rear surrounds create a sense of envelopment, but they're more about diffuse, far-out ambience.
I'm running a 5.1 channel system. I want to update to 5.2 later down the road and then 7.2.4 as the holy grail lmao. I will say it's more than enough in my tiny 10 ft room and the surround sound is phenomenal. I have 2 1961 arendal speakers, they're pretty sweet.
I use a 9.2 setup in my home theater (Onkyo TX-NR1030, Panasonic DP-UB9000, Optoma UHD60 4K projected on a 92" screen). However, that setup is a conventional 7.2 arrangement that adds two "height" speakers in the front that are mounted near the ceiling. That provides a vary expansive soundstage. In addition, some receivers that provide for height speakers have an adjustable parameter called "dialog lift" where a selectable amount of front left and right audio in the range of human vocals can be fed to the height speakers. This really helps place the dialog in the screen as opposed to the main LCR speakers which are at ear level. I liked the arrangement so much that I did the same in my den AV system. The home theater has a suspended acoustic tile ceiling so ceiling mounted Atmos speakers could be added (would require a new receiver) but I am satisfied with the current arrangement and have no plans to do so. Another benefit is that the height speaker outputs can be switched to "second program" to feed 2 ch stereo to patio speakers (requires a speaker switch also).
Gene.. I fully agree your vie about the surrounds.. same importance tobe given as we give toLCR..multi ch. music listening will prove this..
Hi Gene, 7.2.4
Triad Gold LCR'S up front, Triad Bronze on wall for surround, in- ceiling Bronze for Atmos and Rhythmic F18 for the subwoofers.
I'm still rocking 5.1 with some old Mission bipoles i just picked up, 20+ years old and they still sound amazing.
7.4.4 setup and I agree that the rearbsides are very important
I have a Marantz Sr-7012 receiver with a Klipsch Reference system 5.3.4 and I use the Klipsch R 52-c center channel speakers for my top height, rear height and rear side surrounds and the center channel is a Klipsch RP450-c which is a larger center channel which is elevated to ear height. The 2 subwoofers are SVS SB-3000 and one is a SVS SB1000. I believe two of the best movies to experience the great surround effects are Top Gun Maverick and Gravity. The 52-C makes a great surround speaker!
Appreciate the knowledge and based on this video I have subscribed. I have spent quite a bit on LCR but sadly I admit I have skimped on my surrounds and rears. Any recommendations of rears and surrounds in the lower to midrange budgets?
In my surround system I have two left and two right side surrounds,two towards the front and two towards the side plus two back speakers plus five 12 inch powered subs !
I feel this video in my soul. I have B&W 683S2 fronts, and HTM61S2 (Matching Large Center) and I originally purchased the B&W 686 S2 bookshelf speakers as side surrounds to run my 5.4.4 ATMOS setup in my room. A few years later after they discontinued the 68X S2 line for the newer and current 600 Series, I was disappointed in myself for not building a 7ch B&W 68X S2 system. However, the audio gods smiled on me shortly after by messaging my phone direct from the Audio Father to let me know that a pair of B&W 684 S2s (Little brother tower to my fronts), were available on OfferUp and at a steal of a price ($400/pr). These bad boys were mint, owned by someone who really took care of his equipment. I wasted no time and purchased them to use as my side surrounds and moved the 686's to the rear surround spots. These little towers really upped my surround immersion, and having all matched set base sound plain speakers is really something extra ordinary. Gene speaks facts!!
great video. Interesting note to hear you mention that the sides should not be behind the MLP. I am planning to add some Ascend HTM-200SE for my surrounds, they seem like they will work great and were recommended by AV Rant's Tom & Rob. Also, agreed on the tie fighter scene in Andor, WOW!
Well, when you have 5.1 layer, they are set on your sides and slightly behind.
When you have 7.1, now you have 4 surround speakers. Are eras are set to distinguished well, sound in front but not behind, so if you have 4 speakers behind you, you don't actually feel if the sound is coming from the side/back speaker or for the back speaker, so it makes sense to have 2 to your side and 2 behind.
If you are gonna have 4 behind, it's not worth it. In that case stick to 5.1. You save time, money and space.
Thanks Gene!
Good morning Gene. I agree the side speakers are underrated with a cape on them; I have a 5.2.2 setup, and do you think I should keep it as a 7.2, or 5.2.2?
I know you hear this same question for years; I value your opinion.
I think I'm hearing "Take care of the Bed Layer 1st" message... I agree. " Identical" IS essential. Build as you can afford it, secure the base before going vertical. If not identical, & and you can't wait... buy the exact same line at least for all its sizes. Match drivers.
THX Gene.
Just a thought...
How about a series where you review people's home theater's and do like a audioholics seal of approval or something. Again just a thought. Keep up the amazing videos . Your advice has helped me so much of the Years
that would be cool
Great idea. A bit like reviews of people's PC setups at home.
The biggest bang for the buck is a 2nd subwoofer! It changed my whole listening experience. Sides were nice, but that 2nd sub was magic. The next best was a center channel that outperforms everything.
Nice input my man... what center speaker did you go for?
I did the DIY favorite. CSS audio top the line. Fantastic.
@@superslyko123 i tried googling that with no luck. Did you make the center speaker yourself by DIY with components from this Css audio? Is that a brand?
@@PEM-zt5rd Try again. Google, UA-cam, you're losing credibility. They're everywhere. I chose their improved crossover MTM speaker & simply put it on it's side.
@@superslyko123 I am building my own subs. I'm using dayton um 18's. I bought a rsl 12s and was extremely disappointed in it. The impact was next to 0. So I returned it and am building my own. What subs are you running and how is the impact? I thought about building all the rest as well. How is the css kit? Curious what was the benefit of 2 subs? I will say if you want impact do not buy rsl. They tried to blame my reciever so I bought a new one. Then when it was still trash I called them. They then no bs tried blaming my gear. I said wait your saying my brand new reciever is the problem. No, take it back I'm done. It's honestly weak and can't wait to finish building my 18's. I was going to build 2 um12's. Which I guarantee will outperform the rsl in a 1v1. I'd be curious to see by how much though. I decided to go w 18's instead though. I bought my surround sound speakers dirt cheap. I have polk towers and episode for the rest. Got the polks for 50 bucks and the 5 episodes for 30. Sounds phenomenal, I tried out Dirac which is pretty cool. Anyways take care and enjoy. Can't wait till my subs are done. Only got a little bit left.
Others are saying center and they're right, but I know you're talking about strictly the "surround" speakers and you're right about that as they probably have most information in track compared to the rears and ceiling and probably closest to our ears. Honestly having 5 exact full range speakers was still my favorite movie experience. I had 5 Klipsch La Scalas and 4 subs. I'd go back to that any day if i could, or at least front 3 same full range LCR speakers. That's the key as the center is most important. These little horizontal speakers that are not even a quarter size of the mains L/R speakers in a lot of systems just doesn't cut it. A lot of people can get away with larger side surrounds vs a lot smaller rear and ceiling speakers and that's a big factor in all these little speakers being drowned out even with room correction.
I think the side channels are crucial if you have an odd-shaped room (front left/right). Also, when watching content with 2.1 audio, it helps to have the speakers there to hear the dialogue better.
Great video
thank you very much
Interesting. This is the first and only person I've ever heard say they like the Atmos & DTS music up mixers better than Auro 3D. I'm currently in the process of building a dedicated home theater/listening room that will be a 7.4.6 and am anxious to hear which format I like best.
I'm format agnostic but I go with what sounds beet based in content. In music that doesn't have a lot of decorrelated info Auro sounds better to me (ie. Close mic jack music recorded in a small venue). For mostly everything else, the DSU is far superior.
See:ua-cam.com/video/AayO583aY6A/v-deo.html
My current situation has me limited to a 3.1 for now, but I have a 7.1 system & can agree that rears & sides are extremely important for immersion/surround. A 2.1 or 3.1 are great for generic low cost systems, but they lack the fullness of a full 7.1. Honestly, I don't need Atmos & would be good w/ a 7.2 setup as bass is 33% of your overall sound imo.
Makes sense - you’re creating a 180 degree bubble where sound matters the most. I have mine in the back but at a steep angle that makes a 210 degree bubble (living room limitations). After watching this, I understand why I prefer it over my other system which has speakers in the rear on the ceiling. The other system gives an eerie surround feel when sound just comes from those speakers but it’s not as spacious or cohesive.
Others have also pointed that sound coming from above is actually the opposite of immersive as it alerts you every time you hear it.
That’s dumb because in reality life when I’m out & about and hear a plane flying over head guess what it does - my ears/ brain alerts me that there’s something occurring high over me 🤷♂️
Gene, when I'm playing my music blu-rays on my 5-1-2, I like it set to "Virtual" which I think emphasises my centre speaker(which is my most expensive
Can’t remember the video you asked about our systems so, I’ll write it here. I have 3 surround systems. Right or wrong I wanted to try for the best Surround and stereo in 1. So, my best system includes a Denon AVR-X6300H for the 2020 B&W HTM71 S2 Center, and 1999, Canadian made (pre Klipsch ownership) Energy C-2HB-1 surround and 1999 Energy indoor/outdoor surround backs. Then a 2021 Moon ACE in bypass mode, allowing use of the Denon EQ with Audyssey off after initial Audyssey setup, driving L & R 2020 B&W 702 S2 fronts and a 1999 Energy Encore-8 Sub. I mostly stream my music. For streaming in stereo (not a fan of Dolby ATMOS) I use Qobuz from my IPad Pro and iPhone Pro to a 2022 ifi micro iDSD Signature DAC to the Denon and back through the Moon for front channels only. For my large CD library, I get great sound from a decent Sony BlueRay player with Super CD. I also have a Sony DVP-S7000 but, the new player has way better sound. For me, with the addition of the Moon, I am super happy with the surround and the 702s for stereo. Of course, I have Apple TV and can stream all of my Apple Music as well. BTW, the Moon Ace is a streamer and the reason for getting the ACE but, I prefer using the EQ in the Denon where the ACE does not have an EQ. Lastly, I wish I would have known about your sight sooner. I will admit that I probably could have purchased a set of B&W 705 S2s for my surround side speakers with the money I’ve spent with audioQuest products between cables and portable DACs. All of the portable dacs have failed and several audio cables have shorted in addition to the wasted money overall.
Bought my first surround speaker system from a friend and yeah realised how important the center is cause the jamo s81 was just ”ok” so have to def upgrade that one and in time upgrade the front speakers and put the front canton mx to the sides and have 7.1 , the heco 12 inch sub im more then happy with. God damn already after two weeks im thinking about upgrading This will turn out expensive just like my Photography passion 😂
I certainly agree about the side surrounds, but question putting their quality close to LCR's. My understanding is that, in general, there is very little content below 100 hz or above ~10,000 hz sent to the surround channels.
I have a 7.1.2 setup. I have to put the sides somewhat behind me, there is a sliding glass door where Gene recommends putting them.
I use Klipsch RP250S as side speakers...they are bipole...and it sounds seamless between the fronts and back speakers....
I have a 5.3.2 set up my seating is close to the wall I don't have the space to have rears in my set up however I have a pair of paradigm bipolars that are mounted on the rear wall but somewhat angled towards my listening position and do get reflections based on the multi angles but I think it ads a lot of spaciousness to my listing making the environment sound a lot larger may be I should try to get them beside me but I have a open wall to one side. I have changed mains and kept those paradigms they sound rather good
Well Gene I'm running a 25.8.16 channel setup. I have a Yamaha RX-A8A running half the system and a Marantz Cinema 50 running the other half. My speakers are all 2ohm. I have eco mode enabled on both receivers and I have the 4 ohm switch enabled on both receivers on all channels. I'm running YPAO, Audyssey, and Dirac all simultaneously. However I like to re-run YPAO after for good measure to really dial it all in.
Sounds amazing and I save a lot of money on my electric bill.
Troll
@@Audioholics c'mon Gene. It was a joke. You didn't t laugh? I was laughing my ass off.
@Mike Lewis SELA I did actually.
Hi Gene - since you have a 9.4.4 system, you should do a video from most important surround all the way to least important so we know which channels to really prioritize and in what order.
(Hard Time deciding between rears vs wides or front height vs top front vs top middle, etc)
Good idea. Thanks
If Gene is saying side surrounds are important because of the depth they add to the back set of speakers then it makes sense that front sides (or front wides as they are more better known) would do the same for front set of speakers by adding more depth and dimension to bridge gap between side surrounds and Mains
Center #1.. We mix most dialogue into it.
But yeah the sides give you the most depth.
I noticed this years ago when we first switched
mixing 5.1 to 7.1.. now we do 7.2.4
If the sides in the back provide depth like you said then it only follows logical sense for the front sides (aka front wides) to do the same up front
But sadly many people, and people making content choose to ignore them -sigh-
Can’t agree more. Side channels have much more presence than rear or height
All of them of course
I'm running 7.1.2. The four surrounds are about 3 feet higher than the listening position and angled down.
Great video. I only have room (and money) for a 4.1 or 2.1.2 setup. I have really good front speakers and a great sub. What 2 extrachannels would you recommend to prioritise? I’m thinking of using in ceiling for rear channels and have them at 90 degrees (to the side) and angled down 30 degrees. Would that not make the most sense?
Hello Gene. My side surrounds are floorstanding speakers that match my fronts. Unfortunately my room doesnt allow me to put speakers behind me. My couch is a foot from the back wall. Im using in ceiling speakers directly above me for rear surounds. If I add a pair of the martin logan fx2 behind my seating position would it be worth the investment? If I did this I would use a splitter and utilize 2 sets of speakers for my rear surrounds
Interesting. Side channels. I understand positioning them correctly is important. However, when I put my ears next to speakers other than the Center, very little sound comes out of them. Only sporadic effect sounds (high pitch dings, bangs, shhhh, etc noises) heard now and then. That's why I bought into a number of explanations advising surround speakers do not need to be super great.
It really depends on content and how mastered. I agree with films, the sides are typically used for sound effects. However, for immersive audio (e.g. orchestral/choral, live concerts, SACD, multichannel DSD, DVD/A, BDA, etc), that's where it really matters - all bed layer channels are essentially always on! I will agree with Gene that the rears are often used for large concert reverb effects whereas the sides actually have instruments/vocals. FYI - if you play converted 4 channel "quadrphonic" recordings from the 1970's to SACD, the sound comes out on L/R and the 2 sides - nothing in the rear surrounds.
Hey Gene, one love your videos, and two have a quick question on this older video you did.
Do you believe 821’s will be measurable difference vs the 760’s? Looking to get my sides to go with my 831R but wondering if it’s worth stepping up for the sides
i have a living room setup I have a semi open room. When I had a 5.1 system my back surrounds were bookshelf speakers high up on the back wall on each end of couch. couch about 4 feet from back wall. When I went atmos I put in in wall surrounds in back wall and significantly lowered them at same time I added top front top rear in ceiling speakers. In most cases I think my setup is better that I have my surrounds behind in a 5.1.4 . If my surrounds were to the side when something was supposed to be happening behind me I would have no speaker also I would have in my opinion less envelopment overall beacause my soundstage would stop at sofa. By placing behind me I get that rear envelopment and I still retain the left right seperation. Having said that if I had sidewalls I would have side and rear surround. but in my opinion with only one set of surrounds its more useful to place them at rear you still get side to side but you retain more envelopment and rear effects if any.
Hey. Great channel. Just got into HT last yr. Currently 7.2.4 set up. Question, should my sides be my(rp600 IIs) monopole or my Bi-pole RP- 502S IIs. Currently my Monpoles r my SBL&SBR and bipoles r SL&SR ?
Hey Gene the Front Wides channels are essentially the equivalent of the Side surrounds except they are up front but for whatever reason it seems like they get ignored way too much
I’d easily sacrifice having 6 height channels and go with 4 of it means I can have front wide channels
This is great, but now I wonder what you think should be the approach for the rear surrounds. My approach was to get smaller wall mountable units that had very detailed mids and highs but lacked on bass a bit because of their size. The idea was that they would just be providing fill and the fronts/subs would do most of the bass duty.
Well actually, when you set the cross over in you rear speakers to 110hz or even 120hz, you still get the punch, becouse humans don't feel where the sound is coming when is under 120/150Hz.
my 4 bouncy house atmos forsure.
Thank you for this video! Can you provide (reply) with a priority order please 🙏? I ask because I am slowly upgrading all my 7.2.6 setup over time and would appreciate which to swap out first. So far LCR and now sides will be immediate. Then which next? 😀
Running 7.4.4 Denon X3800H 😊
Center speaker is so important. That’s why i keep mine in a locked cabinet below tv so dust can’t get to it
Thanks for the giggle! With ultra short throw projectors this might become my unfortunate reality.
Wrong place for a centre speaker. Putting it an enclosure will change the sound. Diffraction and gain are affected, the speaker will sound muddy. Protect from dust, rediculous, like any piece of furniture just dust it. You need to look at the videos and articles on speaker placement.
Hi. Great information. I have Andrew Jones pioneer full system speaker setup. I use my system mainly for TV and movies. What would you recommend as a step up or two from the speakers? Thank you for your time
Hi Gene, Great post as always.
I fully agree with you but then I don't have much choice since my room doesn't allow for rear surrounds. I currently run a 5.2.4 rig but I am a firm believer in having matching speakers in all positions, at least the 5 base. Recently when I bought my new speakers I had to dig really deep in my pockets to get 4 JBL HDI-3600's for the four corners and the HDI-4500 center. Wish my room would allow for a projector and sonicly transparent screen so I could have put another 3600 behind it for the center, just TOO small.
I believe it may be possible to configure my Denon X4700H to run a single mono rear surround on the wall directly behind me. What would you think of this arrangement?
TIA Sal1950
sides would be also cus more content uses them. 5.1 is basically the minimum surround format. not all movies do 7.1 "es" or "ex" mixes when talking older content. that side my 4 surrounds are all the same speaker and if they get upgraded, likely do all 4 at once. but if you have a 5.1 now and add 2 more then yeah get better speakers to make the new side surrounds, and depreciate your current ones to the rears.
All speakers are Martin Logan. 50XTi Center, 40i front With up firing speakers on top for Dolby, 35XTi side, two 1000X subwoofers in the front.
I’m using Klipsch reference 2 front and rear towers and it’s really
Big difference with the sound in your rear channel is more open
Clear and solid sound
Can you do a Video about Difuses vs bipole surround speakers?
Thank you so much for covering this topic! Very helpful. I have a 5.2.4 setup and might go to 7.2.4 and I’m curious - do you think the side or back speakers should receive the same amount of external amplification ideally as my LCRs 4 ohm > 90 sensitivity if they are matching 4 ohm > 90 sensitivity but bookshelf speakers (all are the new Martin Logan Motion XT loudspeakers, F200, C100, B100) and go with a 7 channel continuous 250W @4 ohms amp for all 7 bed layers with my Marantz Cinema 40 powering the 4 Atmos speakers or is an 11 channels LCR 250W @ 4 ohms with all effects speakers 150W @ 4 ohms sufficient? I’ve never purchased an external amp before but feel I need them with my Marantz Cinema 40 in combo with these 4ohm Martin Logan Motion XT speakers bed speakers. My Atmos speakers are 8 ohm Triad Silver 9 - amiable 45 degree baffle in ceiling speakers. I might move to separates / a preprocesser (thinking Anthem) one day so I thought maybe having the 11 channel would be good and also offer the same sound signature across all speakers instead of delegating the Marantz internal amps to the height speakers? Or is the lower power 150W effects stereo amps on a 11 amp undesirable for the B100’s over a 250W all 7 channel driven amp? Bottom line - how much power do surrounds really need? Thank you in advance for your help / thoughts! -Andy
I probably need a spool of cable to hook up the Side floorstanding speakers. What cable should I buy on a spool?
I have 5.1 Klipschs RP-8000F for fronts L R , RP-404C Center , Klipsch RP-600M Reference Premiere Bookshelf Speakers for side. And SVS PB 2000 Sub..
Can you provide a link to those surround speakers ? I can't find it on there website thanks
One thing I would advise against is using towers for your surrounds. I had a pair of Boston Horizons kicking around and decided to give it a try. The bass is weak, and the mid/treble is at the correct height. Well it seems like they're just tuned incorrectly to be used for surrounds. It was a good thought, but didn't work out.
I would say it depends. I run SVS and have the prime towers as surrounds (sides and rears) and it does an incredible job. Those towers are matched to the three ultras I have for LCR. The timbre match makes a big difference. I can run my bed lower at the same crossover because I have all towers. It’s simply a more cohesive configuration, IMO.
@@FriendOfaCoolFriend Many thanks, what kind of balance settings are you using in the processor?
@andrew jackson
If your LCR are different make from those BA towers (that you used as surrounds) IME lack of timber match is a recipe for disappointment.
Would you do side OVER surround back? Only have 5 speakers right now!
what are your thoughts on bi /di pol I have def tech bp2002 towers clr 3000 center triad gold for my wide def tech bipolar side surround and large book shelf speakers in the rear, def tech book shelf in front height and def tech xtr 40 height middle 9.6.4 based on your reviews i got the Marantz 8015 and added an amp for the wide channel most of my speakers are bit older but still kicks nice i'm fairly new at this and have swopping out speakers that i can afford ,
I have my sides at 90 degrees, I might try a little in front some day
With di-pole or bi-pole surrounds that have angled tweeters rather than a tweeter beaming directly at front of the speaker in a typical bookshelf surround speaker, do you still recomend the side speakers to be set up right at the sides or a bit behind so the angled tweeters can better line up with where your head/ears are at the listening position?
I recommend monopoles for sides and backs in Atmos systems. If you absolutely must use bipoles I'd position them so the null is lined up with the MLP.
I've been on 5.4 for years with my rear channels diagonally behind me... running out of room in my apartment. My only concern if i add side speakers should it be same brand line/model line for those? Ive always heard keep timber the same.. Im also a bit picky on clarity (using the ol cm series, 9s, 5s, center with the yellow kevlar), they still sound decent.
The short answer: Yes on brand/model. The long answer…
For best results, IME your bed layer (5, 7, or 9!) should be, at minimum, all of the same brand. Same series is much better. Same model takes it up another notch, if space allows.
In my case I started with & followed the “Series” logic for 5 channels: LR towers, the better Center, & bookshelf surrounds. Later I upped the surrounds to the bigger brother* to be pleasantly surprised by the SQ improvement. Later, I upped the Surrounds again this time their power source to the same make** & model amp as the LCR enjoying a smaller improvement, mostly transparency
*bigger mid @ 6.5” - the same size as the towers, allowed a lower XO to subs
**formerly a near-equal but different brand amp
You should give attention to the room’s sound if you haven’t already
The sub(s), are the most important🙊
There is nothing more anoying than a lack in the bottom end...
And...for the best sound, all speakers should be exactly the same as you said. (My layout: tower LCR and surroun rear. Bookshelf variant of towers for surround and 4 atmos. 3 subs. Gues it is 6.1 (3).4? External power for all towers🤪
The House of Sound home theatre room in NYC has 16 subs (all Sonus Faber Arena S15). 10 in the front, with 6 in the rear. All low frequencies around and above the room are directed to the subs. They have proven that low frequencies are not omni-directional. If you want a truly immersive and visceral experience, you need more subs.
@Audioholics --- What would 10.4.8 sound like? Would any movies even be able to use that configuration? Or 12.6.10?
And what about players/streamers and receivers/processors, would they be able to handle that many channels?