It’s not just testosterone that gives an advantage. There are differences in bone density, ligament strength, speed, bone structure, lung capacity, etc.
Micheal Phelps has double jounted ankles, a crazy limb to torso ratio, twice the lung capacity of a normal person and 50% less lactic acid production. He is a genetic freak of nature and the most decorated Olympian ever. should he be banned?
@@tZydecoI think the point is that even if an athlete takes drugs to lower their testosterone levels, if they went through male puberty or had higher testosterone levels during puberty as an intersex person, the increased muscle mass, bone density, lung capacity, etc. is still not reversible.
No. He was 19 when he committed the offence and I think served 3-4 years prison time. He was fully remorseful and after release he married and is now 29 and in a stable marriage relationship. Yes he committed a crime at 19 but paid the price and has completely turned his life around. It is a very bad society if, with the exception of very serious crimes like multiple homicide, if a criminal is never allowed to pay off their crime and be allowed back into society as a rehabilitated person.
that doesnt make him a pedo,,,, except it really does but not acc to them but everything has been taken over by the darkness, we must be in the last days when they accept raping children
“Boxing is not a sport known for having an impeccable safety record, mostly because of the punching in the head part.” Dr. Grande never fails to crack me up!
Hi. "A gender. Verification test." IVA regulations. XX is a female . XY , is a male. Rare conditions, that DSD. I think, I encountered some people like that. Dr. Grande is probably the Best UA-camr . I know of. Pleased to see your comment here. How are you doing ? Need a British Pen Pal ?
I feel for Iman. I am a female, born as a female, live as a female, but am not blessed with a female build or features. I have never been diagnosed with dsd. What I have experienced are stares, incorrect judgements, catty comments whispered as I walk by. It can be a cruel world.
I'd like to add my informed opinion here as a person with a PhD in genome biology. In the majority of cases, XX = female and XY = male, but sometimes this doesn't happen, because chromosomes can do strange things. Simply relying on chromosomes will not tell you the sex of an individual with 100% certainty, that is why we have an intersex category. We also have people with only one X and no Y, XXY, and even XXXY. In the case of Iman, she may have XY chromosomes but that doesn't mean, as many people are saying, that she has male reproductive organs that have never descended. It's possible she has all the female reproductive 'bits' with ovaries that aren't completely formed or generic gonads (that are neither testicles nor ovaries), a mix of testicular and ovarian tissue, or, indeed internal testicles (this doesn't mean these are normal functioning testicles, though). All of these would lead to high testosterone to different extents because ovaries need to work well to convert testosterone into female hormones. What I mean is that if she was examined by a team of doctors and they decided she was a female, who the hell are we to say she is a male? Also, it's important to remember that this is a person. She's not a walking political statement. She doesn't deserve all this shaming and ignorant assumptions for simply having been born a certain way. My sources: How should we classify intersex disorders?, Journal of Pediatric Urology, Volume 6, Issue 5, October 2010, Pages 447-448 Bennecke, E., Köhler, B., Röhle, R., Thyen, U., Gehrmann, K., Lee, P., … Wiesemann, C. (2020). Disorders or Differences of Sex Development? Views of Affected Individuals on DSD Terminology. The Journal of Sex Research, 58(4), 522-531
Where is your sympathy for the woman who this person beat up? What statement would you make to her? Shut up and take it? Because that's what she was told. Sports needs to be fair, and there needs to be rules that protect the even playing field. That's not discriminatory. The fact that a vicious, homophobic, misogynistic and cultish movement - one that uses the very conditions that you describe to justify the mutilation of non gender conforming children who are perfectly healthy - makes this a political discussion which you are not above.
She wasn't examined by a team of doctors. She wasn't even examined by anybody. They used her passport to identify her sex . Did you miss that part of the discussion?
@@JaneAustenAteMyCat Yeah that must be it. What about the swimming and track and field women's titles and records being broken by men pretending to be women? Maybe grass and water are to blame? What a moronic statement.
I remember back in the day there were born women athletes at the Olympics who cheated by taking steroids similar to male hormone. These woman were tested and disqualified from competition.
Except that there are for all intents and purposes an even distribution of people in the weight classes, or at least something resembling a bell curve at worst. With something like hormone levels, you have too small a range and too large a median to have actual classes based on that. It can also be manipulated, it also changes and isn't consistent. It's ok to have rules that exclude a millionth of the population. Just like how they wont sanction a fight if you're blind in one eye or have some other medical anomaly. If you were wolverine with knives coming out of your knuckles you wouldn't have a right to participate, they're allowed to say it's unfair and dangerous and what ever else.
Why not have a height class too? Then there can be basketball matches for the people shorter than 6 feet. Or they can have arms length classes, so that swimmers with shorter arms don't have to compete with Phelps.
This has been happening since the 1930s, with prominent cases throughout the 50s and 60s. Female athletes has always been put through these medical mazes while male athletes, as far as I know, are not.
But that was before Wikipedia, when you know better, you do better; please try to improve you knowledge, and decrease your assumptions en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersex
It's funny when they end up being 5'2" wide hipped soft shouldered men and since they insist on he/him they are now White males. So they have to remind you "but I'm trans" to keep getting those oppression points.
This issue is a perfect analog for the greater rift in our culture. Both extreme ends of this debate sound absurdly ideological, while the greatest number of us are somewhere in the middle.....trying to be cosiderate of special cases, but equally considerate of common sense and fair play.
yep plenty of crazy people out there. and its exaggerated on the internet because wild and irrational people and opinions are "exciting" and "different".
This is exactly where I expected the trans issue in sports to go, calling cis women trans because they have more muscle density/ higher bone density/ unnaturally tall etc. Where this leads is basically very strict physical guide lines for cis and trans women to be able to compete in a sport. Which isn’t fair for many cis women as well as trans women. I suppose we could could start having things similar to weight classes but that is yet to be determined. Don’t even get me started on how unfair it is for women in a sport to be forced to compete against trans men because that’s what their biological sex was at birth.
Please enlighten me where the right supports anything close to sexually mutilating children? Giving castration drugs to children, claiming two year old babies can be “gay”. The left is bat shit crazy now.
Yeah, but in this case the problem is that the trans issue is falsely mixed up with it. She grew up as a girl, and was even not allowed to do boxing for a time by her father because she is a girl and now she is accused of not being a woman. Maybe she is an intersex person and just learning it, imagine the psychological struggle of finding this out like this, being publicly accused and humiliated and in addition coming from a very conservative country where this is probably not a widely known condition.
It’s the CCP model, put something out that’s pushing the boundaries but not too far , normalise …then push again, then again…then suddenly you have normalised pedeu…. Kinda like normalising sexual disfigurement in children. Or giving kids sterilisation drugs “to save them” Pure Evil
Not everyone can participate in sports. A lot of young people have got health problems or other issues that prevent them from playing. If you can't play, you just need to accept it and invest your life's energies in other directions.
Disagree in this case, she’s not trans or a male and would likely not even know about a “chromosome disorder” if she wasn’t an athlete and been tested.
She’s been defeated by like 5 different women throughout her career. She doesn’t have some insurmountable advantage. People like you desperately need to educate yourself. Also she is from Algeria(99 percent Muslim) they aren’t going to send someone who is a “woman by self identification”
The 2 women who were previously banned and suspected to possess a XY karyotype easily got away with the gold in women boxing, in their respective weight category. The IOC failed to ensure fairness and athletes safety, and miserably so. They also had their athletes swim in sewage water. Let that sink in.
@@justinejustice_league1857 Why would the parents know? I don't know many parents who do a chromosome check on their children. If you think XY chromosomes necessarily lead to the development of particular features, look it up and think again.
It's far worse than that. It's designed to induce psychosis on a national (if not global) level. Read the book The DeepState Encyclopedia by ReallyGraceful (she's got an excellent youtube channel).
It is actually indoctrination. If you check out "commitment and consistency" in psychology of persuasion you'll see how forcing people to play make believe actually has a lot to do with forcing beliefs onto them. This boxing example shows the result, they have been forced to concede that there are differences between women and transwomen but they continue inventing pseudo-scientific explanations that just so happen to mean the transwoman is physically identical to women if you ignore the performances of the transwomen making new world records etc.
The only thing which really occurs to me in this case is that the fighters look like they belong to different weight classes. The size difference is ridiculous. I can see why people fixated on sex and gender, but it really looks like an issue of weight class.
Stella Walsh never had her 1930s medals taken away despite her intersex status which was only revealed when she was autopsied following her murder during an armed robbery when she was 69 years old.
At autopsy, Stella Walsh was determined to be intersex--lacking female sex organs, such as a vagina, uterus, or ovaries, but with a male reproductive system including a non-functioning underdeveloped penis, an abnormal urethra, small testes, and a small prostate. Walsh was reported to have genetic mosaicism. Most of her cells contained XY chromosomes, but some contained a single X0 chromosome. Though "socially, culturally and legally" a woman, her sex would have been ambiguous at birth. As she grew up, people in her neighborhood were aware of her condition to a certain extent, but had no reason to draw attention to it. She wondered out loud in the presence of a childhood friend why God had done this to her.
Sorry, one bad precedent does not absolve us from doing everything we can to establish fairness and safety. It's like saying that, since a lot of people got away with performance enhancing drugs, Lance Armstrong should be allowed to keep his Tour de France victories.
@@3112isabel I don't feel bad for Imam. I feel bad for the women he battered. Biological males, even with developmental issues, have no business in women's sports.
The IBA on their website stated: "Point to note, the athletes did not undergo a testosterone examination but were subject to a separate and recognized test, whereby the specifics remain confidential. This test conclusively indicated that both athletes did not meet the required necessary eligibility criteria and were found to have competitive advantages over other female competitors."
The IBA has become a Russian controlled organization with serious corruption issues, the Algerian boxer was disqualified at thr IBA Championships after defeating a Russian, that enabled the Russian to progress.
I'm not debating that the IBA ban may be suspect, as pointed out elsewhere. The point is that in order to let a previously banned athlete compete in the Olympics, the IOC should have come up with a better argument than 'her passport says she's female and that's good enough'. As far as I know, they ignored the ban, which is worrisome in itself. Someone correct me if my info is wrong.
@@trinketmage8145 You mean deferring to experts who have PhDs in this stuff rather than some ignorant loudmouth on Twitter? You DGGers are really something else.
This is not a new problem. See Caster Semenya and the results of the women's 800 m final at the 2016 Rio Olympics. People with this condition are assigned "female" because the medical professionals cannot see the penis and testicles, which stay internal and don't descend. They end up with what looks like a vagina but there is no cervix. As a result they have XY chromosomes and much higher levels of testosterone than the typical woman. Reading Caster's story, I felt very bad for her being at the center of this terrible controversy, but I also felt bad for the competitors who got bumped off the podium by a person who looked more than a little bit masculine. This is a really tough problem and the sport associations don't look close to a solution after 15 years of trying.
exactly, this is not a new problem re: Castor Semenya: In April 2018, the IAAF (track and field) announced new rules effective 8 May 2019 that applied to athletes with certain disorders of sex development (DSDs) that result in androgen sensitivity and testosterone levels above 5 nmol/L. Under the new rules, these athletes would be required to take medication to lower their testosterone levels below the 5 nmol/L threshold for at least six months in order to compete in the female classification for certain events. In a report explaining its decision, the IAAF wrote that there was a "broad medical and scientific consensus" that athletes with high testosterone can "significantly enhance their sporting potential" due to greater muscle mass, strength, and haemoglobin levels. The report added that "there is no other genetic or biological trait encountered in female athletics that confers such a huge performance advantage." The IAAF's changes applied to eight different events-including the 400m, 800m, and 1500m, which Semenya regularly competed in.Sports scientist Ross Tucker estimated that the new rules could make Semenya "five to seven seconds slower over 800 metres." So why hasn't the IOC followed the lead of the IAAF and apply to all sports ?
The only people claiming that she tested for XY chromosomes are a corrupt Russian organization who initially let her compete and only released the statement after she beat a Russian
Amin would not be qualified if they had administered the swab test for DNA. Anyone who has Y chromosomes is a biological male. If you think that I am wrong, then marry Iman Khalifi and see if your "wife" will get pregnant with a baby.
If she has XY chromosomes, then she is male. This is something that she's been made aware of, and has disqualified her from other female competitions. It's not controversial to point that out. She can live as a female if that's what she's comfortable with, and who's to judge? What she shouldn't be doing is competing in female sports. It's just common sense, given the biological differences between males and females.
but she doesn’t have XY chromosome. that claim came from a russian source that is not credible and there is no evidence the XY chromosome story is true
I'd first like to see a genetic test and hormone test, because it's obvious by looking at her that she's built like a male. I'm not saying she's a man, but as usual, we can't even have a discussion about it without being called some sort of insult by the lefties.
The Italian boxer was not knocked out or concussed. So how can the punch have been so amazingly hard? I suspect that she convinced herself into being defeated before even getting into the ring.
True, didn't even get a bloody nose or anything, it doesn't make sense that an experienced competitor would quit after that. Seems to me she already checked out mentally and was looking for an excuse to give up.
that's what my dad taught me, at his time, 7 billion, and he use to say, "no two are the same, so you are going to get some extremely strange examples."
One of them is man. You'd have a chance against the woman though. Men can puch 260% stronger than women of the same size. No amount of training can make woman puch as hard as a man who falls in the same weight class.
In cases like this, when it's simply not 100% - such as the female athlete doesn't have female chromosomes, but has male chromosomes, or elevated testosterone levels, it simply shouldn't be allowed, just like doping isn't allowed. Even if testosterone blockers were put in place, an individual like that, had quarter of century to grow with male characteristics- musculature, bone density, strength levels. There's a reason, why men and women don't compete against each other - even in non contact sports, such as athletics. It simply wouldn't be fair - again, just like taking steroids wouldn't be fair.
not how it works, if you castrate all men they will have lost all their bone density and muscular strength in five years tops. It doesn't matter how strong they were before, they will fall within female ranges because a constant supply of testosterone is required for the body to remain within male ranges.
Many of them did not. They want to validate their own feelings rather than admit being wrong about the facts or face the possibility they were emotionally manipulated.
I feel bad for Iman. I dont think she is "a man trying to kill women" life is not great for women with masculine traits and the fact that someone like jk rowling made it her place to call her a man, claim she was sneering and a cheat etc was just incredibly cruel. Whatever she is/ has , she is not a transwoman. She was assigned female at birth. Maybe she has some strong advantages that make her participation unfair or dangerous , but the cruelty and insults and claims over her lack of character and dishonesty are just wrong. I bet shes been bullied her entire life over her looks. Imagine being born with physical traits you cannot control and being blasted on social media for lt by very prominant celebrities. Disgusting bullying.
I feel bad for her too. If she was born with a Y chromosome she is genetically male. I don't know what is fair here, but I don't believe it is fair for women with two X chromosomes to have to compete against someone with a Y chromosome.
People wouldn’t be jumping on this if we haven’t had to endure the lunacy over the past decade hearing elementary kids can decide their gender, or there are no differences, gender is a social construct, etc.
@anneb889 Lunacy that is approved and studied by the medical community practically everywhere in the world? I think it's yall being freaks about it is the reason why this is happening, no need to try and shift the blame honey
One of my ex-girlfriends was over 1,80 (over 1,90 in high heels) and had a frame that was on par with many male physiques, as well as the musculature. She was not trans, just a woman with a genetic makeup that would have favored her in any combat sport (but she was not interested). These women exist, and I think it would be a mistake to exclude them from the sports under the guise of fairness - or should we have disqualified Usain Bolt when he outran every competitor by far, just because he is obviously a freak of nature? We want to see those exceptional people do exceptional things. If a man does it, we are fascinated by his insane physique. If a woman does it, we cry "unfair" and "we must protect women in sports". I think this is hypocritical. Right now, this debate is not about sports for the most part, but about the place of trans people in our society (and if they should have one), and this is done under the guise of protecting women in sports.
Khalif is not a woman with high testosterone, but male. Considering long history of males with 5-ARD competing and winning against women, and his physical characteristics perfectly aligning with the disorder, we can assume that condition is most likely. Boys with this disorder are often missexed at birth, and end up with "female" on birth certificate. Sometimes the disorder is not discovered until puberty, but then it becomes apparent. Men with 5-ARD produce normal male levels of testosterone, but can not convert it to DHT resulting in low to no facial and body hair, and "resistance" to male pattern baldness. Still men. Penis size does not determine sex.
The difference is that these two athletes, have XY chromosomes, and although raised as women, may have exceptionally high testosterone levels. We don't know because the international Olympic committee is not being transparent about how they ensure competitive fairness in women's sports. No matter what solution they come up with, someone will think it is unfair, but at that point it is what it is and people who think it is unfair are free to try and change it.
Ultimately the question is why do we have women's sport. Why should low T women have to compete against high T women? Why should low T men have to compete against high T men?
FYI you might have been dating and having intercourse with a man... She might have been born with female reproductive organs (but infertile) and been raised as a female but if she has XY chromosomes she is a genetic male. If the boxer did have XY chromosome than they are a genetic male even if they had a genetic abnormality (likely Swyer Syndrome) that caused them to have female reproductive organs.
The public response, comments, Tweets, etc. really show how often people don't analyze cases and instead just jump to whatever conclusion fits their narrative. So many people are treating this as a transgender issue, going on about transwomen beating women in sports, etc. Imane Khelif is not a transwoman, but has an "intersex" condition/a type of disorder of sex differentiation. It's a medical issue that's entirely unrelated to the issue of a proper biological male merely identifying as a woman.
@@muncangel5993that's not his point, he's saying too many ppl have misunderstood the story to be trans related when in fact it's about whether or not an intersex person with ambiguous genitals and xy chromosomes can compete with/identify as women. Tra's have done an excellent job conflating the two issues
@michelethe80sbaby yes sadly the more extremist trans activists have co-opted intersex issues, when the two are completely different socially and physiologically
ANY advantage conferred by male testosterone levels leads to an advantage in combat. Trans, intersex, unicorn-pixie dust sexual whatever. Why is this so difficult to understand?
@@wubforceonei second this. I also tend to believe that a women who lives in a country where transitioning/hormone treatments are illegal is most definitely a woman, but call me crazy I guess, it’s not like they would have killed her or anything
It’s crazy to say that when the ones accusing her, are the old Olympic committee who isn’t running it anymore because of corruption 😭😭 you believe what you want. Nothing to do with the Olympic committee
I think this case is similar to Caster Semenya, a runner. She didn't run, because they were forcing her to take hormones to lower her testosterone levels. Thanks as always, Dr. Grande. A reasonable voice in a crazy world. Love from Canada
Dutee Chand had a similar problem. She had Swyer syndrome and was accused of being a man because of her T levels. She was born a woman and never identified as anything different. This issue is a lot murkier than people understand.
@@rizzorizzo2311 Agreed it is murky. People say she was born a woman but don’t explain what that means. If Imane has XY chromosomes, male levels of testosterone and internal testes, very difficult to really say how that that is being “born female”. It’s just that the characteristics making them male were not observable at birth.
@@JB-nw1ix that is being intersex so technically these people are one sex more then the other but can have bits that is part of men. But not really functioncal male sex parts.
@@StAlphonsusHasAPosse My dad was stationed in Germany in the early '60's and got into a bar fight visiting France, brought home a felt french police cap, the flat round ones.
yeah, but literally getting out after one punch? Our hungarian girl followed and she pulled thru even after losing and saying she can't win halftime because its a male. (even not completely, but what not fair IS THAT theyre in the SAME weight category while just look at the differences. yeah, fair she can go boying with females bbut like 70kg not 60, come on now!)
Very simple solution. The Olympics and ALL sports must require gender chromosome testing. XX competes with XX. XY competes with XY. Give this person another gender test, and every time before competing updated gender testing is required for all competitors same as continual drug tests. No discussion necessary.
Gender testing wouldn’t be necessary before each competition. Chromosomes won’t change. They should be tested as a baseline and carry identification of the results of the test.
@@realitycheck4842 Granted, but *only if all contestants are fair and honest!* There are so many opportunities and methods how *probes could be mainpulated or changed* (like it is known for any "normal" drug/ doping test...) that *the criminal energy to falsify the results could be immense* , especially for small competing countries, like, Algeria... There is so much money to be gained in the so-called "amateur" Olympic Games, that one gold medal winner could not only support HIS (IMO and conviction!) family, but bring HIS native country to international notice, with many benefits. Now it has only led to notoriety...
I agree, this really is the best solution. Not only is no discussion needed, none of the mockery or hostility is needed that I've seen in so many comments.
No. They just need to verify that she is a woman. Which we have done. The Olympics is filled with genetic freaks with conditions. If we tested everyone with an unfair advantages, people like Biles, Phelps, and Yao Ming would be disqualified.
JD Dunce giving commentary on that men shouldn’t be allowed to pummel women while simultaneously advocating to make it harder for women in abusive relationships to get divorced is very rich 🙄🤦🏾♀️. I agree dr grande - this is on the ioc!
Fair video, Doc. If anything, this whole debacle shows how poorly educated the general public is on subjects regarding transgender, intersex, and genetics. The Olympics are filled with competitors with genetic advantages; that's why Michael Phelps won all those gold medals. The _entire point_ is to have the most physically capable athletes compete. So unless the IOC establishes some limit for testosterone levels, this kind of thing will happen again. Besides, this isn't even a transgender/intersex issue. This is all about the drama happening behind the scenes. The IBA (the group that oversaw the tests) was decertified by the IOC in 2023. The IBA was plagued with scandals for years, including bribery and match fixing. They also never specified what kind of tests Imane had, stating that the results were confidential. The reason for Imane's disqualification in 2023 was never stated. What _is_ known is that she was disqualified 3 days after she beat Azalia Amineva, a Russian boxer. The whole XY claim was made by Umar Kremlev, the IBA's Russian president, who clearly wanted mess with IOC after they'd taken over control of boxing at the Olympics. This whole debacle is nothing more than a geopolitical sideshow. Also, that Italian boxer's initial response was ridiculous. She became a professional in a sport that revolves around getting punched in the face. What was she expecting?
Crazy considering how they ran so flawlessly for literally 128 years. Women's BMX Park had a transgender woman in it, so the statement by the Olympic committee is actually incorrect as well.
if Imane either went through male puberty and/or she has male-level amounts of testosterone... she should not be fighting women. it does not matter what sex she naturally is.. if that can even appropriately be determined. it's the advantages created by undergoing male puberty and it's male-level testosterone amounts that 'cause the unfair advantages. there is no need to focus on her declared born sex... the game-changer is whether or not she has the advantages or not. If she did not go through male puberty and she has high testosterone levels for a female but not in the male range.... then she should be fine to compete. no problem. but if she was mistakenly determined to be female at birth, and did eventually undergo male puberty... then her formerly recorded status as a female at birth shouldn't be any determinant here. it doesn't matter that she can be beaten by non-DSD women. it really doesn't have to be so complicated. undergoing the process of male puberty or having male-level amounts of testosterone is not to be allowed when competing in women's sports. that's the piece that matters. that's where the line needs to be drawn for safety. any males who have natural differences in testosterone to one another but whom all went through male puberty should be able to compete together fine by weight class. same goes with females who processed as such. there does not need to be exceptions made in those cases.
Totally agree! Your comment is one of the most factual and reasonable ones here! 👍 It's all about the fairness in sports competitions, and the line should be drawn somewhere and at some point!
I really enjoy your analysis and videos that don't include anyone being murdered. And your straight face when you say, the desire not to be killed is a common feeling for most human beings.
Imane Khelif was determined to be a girl at birth, like many other individuals at that time, where the nurses or doctors only looked a the body for a male genitalia. Khelif doesn't have one (not even now). Yet like a lot of individuals, Khelif chromosome is XY. There are also cases of an individual having XX chromosome, but developed male like genetalia. The notion of gender/sex is more of a cultural thing. One thing to note. The organization that disqualified Khelif was International Boxing Association (IBA) which is Russian-led, and IBA's Olympic status was revoked in June 2023 due to governance issues and perceived judging and refereeing corruption. So IBA is not exactly the authority in boxing.
@@yellowlynx I’m surprised you quote with such authority the findings by the doctors present at her birth. I would be more interested in seeing her genitalia today. Far more relevant External absence of testes is common and referred to as undescended testes Not true absence
XY females have an athletic disadvantage against XX women as their ovaries are non-functional, and they don't develop testicles. Khelif is a male who very likely has 5-ARD, a DSD exclusive to males that results in ambiguous genitals at birth, and normal male puberty, although without facial and body hair growth as they can not convert testosterone into DHT. This also means they will never experience male-pattern baldness. This is the same disorder that father of two Caster Semanya has. It's a common DSD among male olympic medalists in women's category.
Once we have established that the boxer has XY chromosomes it becomes hard to keep saying that this person is female. This is not about the fact that looking at the genitals at birth, they decided that this was a female. The appearance of a newborn's genitals does not have an impact on XY chromosomes. When children are born with 5α-reductase type 2 deficiency, at puberty, the body is going to develop as that of a male. Dr Grande, you are mistaken in this case as this is not only about the testosterone levels today, but about the transformation that occurred during male puberty. Upper body strength, bone density, muscle strength, bigger lungs, there are countless advantages at stake. From this perspective, it is important that an individual born with XY chromosomes does not compete against women.
Exactly. The body is built up according to the hand of cards, hormone-wise, it is dealt. That becomes an easily notriceable change and difference during puberty. Physically, on many levels, men are dealt a far superior card. The exceptions merely prove the rule.
I just looked it up to confirm. In the US, I can go right now and request a passport with my gender as male. I do not have to supply any documentation to corroborate.
I am so happy you analyzed this story and I am so glad that people are coming out to defend her. Now that I understand all the basic facts, I am rooting for her and cannot wait to see her win Olympic gold for her country. She is obviously very talented and has worked hard to earn her place at the Olympic games.
At the end of the day, he’s biologically a male. Doesn’t matter of his life experience and that he ‘lived as a woman’. We are making it acceptable for males to beat females. The argument that he is exploiting the situation or not is completely irrelevant.
JK Rowlings will chime in at anything remotely smelling trans. She really needs to be held accountable for her transphobia. Imane won fair and square, with her natural advantage, just like some swimmers with longer arms and legs, and bigger hands and feet. Just because there was a mention of trans..... the transphobia was well revealed.
They are saying about Simone Biles and Katie Ladecky now, too. If people can’t comprehend how this rhetoric is so blatantly dangerous for all women, cis and trans alike, they shouldn’t be welcome in society. Idek how to engage in discourse with them any more, and the harm they are causing is disturbing
I don't doubt it. And I know you are being somewhat facetious. Yet the biggest difference regarding the current context and back then (in regards to this specific issue) is that women weren't Allowed to compete in Athens. I think that's important of note considering the focus of the current debate.
@@mariatodd3132You're right. Genetic analyses weren't a thing back in the day. She would have been considered a female because she was literally born a female and has female parts.
@@ORAVA1993 I'm in favor for that except keep male and female sports. The third category should be a mixed gender league where any gender can participate.
Fair and balanced discussion. I take Dr Grande's points about public figures jumping to conclusions and the IOC struggling to come up with a workable system.
For things to be completely fair: I believe that there should be a trans league. we should have trans athletes competing against others who also identify or have transitioned the same.
The joke is the above nonsensical trans league comment got way more likes than the comments below correcting it. Dr Grande even talks about how people comment without knowing all the information 😂 He clearly says she's a woman who just so happens to have a (naturally occurring) higher level of testosterone in her body. This doesn't make her trans. If a guy has a lower level of testosterone he can't just walk into a woman's changing area.
Michael Phelps has the wingspan of a California condor and produces 50% less lactic acid than the average person but not a word about his unfair advantage.
Or...imagine being a female competitor, who has worked hard her entire life, only to to be outclassed, at the Pinnacle of your career, by a male who's testicles failed to drop! Y'all are sick!!!
In this case, she has a natural advantage due to her intersex condition. This incident is more akin to a female athlete being on PEDs than anything to do with trans ideology, yet some people wasted no time jumping on that because they were emotionally manipulated by culture warriors and grifters.
Nonsense. Masculinity does not give any athletic advantage. Femininity does not give athletic disadvantage. Men are not losing medals and prizes to women. Women are losing to men. Khalif is not a masculine woman, but a man who was wrongly sex at birth and knowingly takes advantage of that fact by beating women for a living.
Yeah but competitive sports all depend on being the fastest or the strongest so obviously men are always going to gain the top prize... but have an average man stand back to the wall, with a chair in front of him front to back, bend over till his chest touches the chair back, and try to straighten up and LIFT the chair, 97 PERCENT OF MEN CAN'T do it, 97 percent of WOMEN can... doesn't matter how strong or fast you are, IT'S IMPOSSIBLE because of the females lower center of gravity in the thighs and hips...
I am an RN. I was educated in biology, human anatomy and physiology, and other sciences. A person with XY chromosomes is a male. Full stop. Imane was assigned female at birth, and raised as such, due to ambiguous genitalia and/or internal organs. Unless Imane has androgen insensitivity or no testes, Imane has developed a skeleton and musculature of a man, which certainly appears to be the case. They have even failed a testosterone level previously. The rights of women are not being considered. The chromosomes should be determinative.
@@samsonlovesyou news FLASH, you studies introductory physiology and went over the basics. LETS STOP pretending that two chapters in developmental human biology made both of you an expert.
@weareallthesame7924 Not the basics, we get that at secondary level education in the UK, but not expert level either. That's why I continue to consult experts to build on those foundations. Happy to put my understanding up against yours if you'd like to refute the above post.
This isn't a genetic defect, this is BIOLOGICAL MALE with ambiguous genitalia raised as a female. Again, BIOLOGICAL MALE with ambiguous genitalia raised a s female. Why is it so hard for people like you to draw this common sense distinction?
There have been four lab tests taken in two different labs in different countries. Both boxers are 46,XY. The labs who conducted the tests were in India and Turkey, and both are accredited by the Swiss Court of Arbitration in Sport. Their credibility is above reproach. The odds of four tests all being incorrect are one in one hundred million, literally. The boxers are male. As for what DSD they may have, we don't actually know that they have a DSD at all, but if they do it is almost certain to be 5-ARD, a male specific DSD which results in an underdeveloped penis. Babies with 5-ARD are often raised as girls, either because their parents believe them to be girls, or because they wish to conceal their condition. However, as they have functional testicles, they experience normal male puberty, at which time it becomes impossible to hide their true sex as their features masculinize, their voice deepens, and their underdeveloped genitalia grows. People with 5-ARD are categorically male, and can even father children. They are not women with high testosterone. They are men with normal testosterone. There is no difference whatsoever between a male with 5-ARD boxing against a woman, and any other man boxing against a woman. Both possibilities are completely inappropriate and dangerous.
It’s not just testosterone that gives an advantage. There are differences in bone density, ligament strength, speed, bone structure, lung capacity, etc.
And which characteristics are largely determined by testosterone levels?
These differences occur in male sports as well. So ban the most manly men?
@@tZydecoThe androgenization due to testoterone levels, often done via puberty, but not always.
Micheal Phelps has double jounted ankles, a crazy limb to torso ratio, twice the lung capacity of a normal person and 50% less lactic acid production.
He is a genetic freak of nature and the most decorated Olympian ever. should he be banned?
@@tZydecoI think the point is that even if an athlete takes drugs to lower their testosterone levels, if they went through male puberty or had higher testosterone levels during puberty as an intersex person, the increased muscle mass, bone density, lung capacity, etc. is still not reversible.
I never directly accuse my wife of moving my keys, I only speculate about what could be happening in a situation like that 😂
😂
Savage. 🤘
🤣
Savage af 🤣🤣🤣
😂😂😂
I'm personally outraged beyond words that there's the raper of a 12 year old girl in the Olympics
Yeah, that should cause the most outrage, yet somehow and intersex person and a shitty artshow are more interesting.
No. He was 19 when he committed the offence and I think served 3-4 years prison time. He was fully remorseful and after release he married and is now 29 and in a stable marriage relationship.
Yes he committed a crime at 19 but paid the price and has completely turned his life around. It is a very bad society if, with the exception of very serious crimes like multiple homicide, if a criminal is never allowed to pay off their crime and be allowed back into society as a rehabilitated person.
Who?
@@sparkplugpeggy4910 I agree. He definitely should not be representing a country in the Olympics.
that doesnt make him a pedo,,,, except it really does but not acc to them but everything has been taken over by the darkness, we must be in the last days when they accept raping children
"I encounter many people who don't want to be killed, it is a relatively common human fear" -Todd Grande
Dr. Grande needs to travel Toronto freeways to witness many people who care little about their lives.
If only French police officers and prosecutors were so understanding... So many victims of conjugal violence get a 'diagnosis' of anxiety...
“Boxing is not a sport known for having an impeccable safety record, mostly because of the punching in the head part.”
Dr. Grande never fails to crack me up!
I read this comment while he was saying the line. 😂
Hi. "A gender. Verification test." IVA regulations. XX is a female . XY , is a male.
Rare conditions, that DSD. I think, I encountered some people like that.
Dr. Grande is probably the Best UA-camr . I know of. Pleased to see your comment here.
How are you doing ? Need a British Pen Pal ?
He has such dry humor that sometimes it's easy to miss if you aren't listening carefully!
@@sidroj7 right lol. He nails the cadence and delivery each time!
My clinical muse!
I feel for Iman. I am a female, born as a female, live as a female, but am not blessed with a female build or features. I have never been diagnosed with dsd. What I have experienced are stares, incorrect judgements, catty comments whispered as I walk by. It can be a cruel world.
Just curious, do you have a Y chromosone? She has or had them. Do you or did you? Not trying to be mean in any way, just curious.
But you are not taking advantage of this, and , in the case of a boxer, hurting someone.
@@tbabubba32682so? She’s a woman from birth, she didn’t transition
@@stevegreen2432what are you on about??
So you’re a biological male?
"I have encountered many people who don't want to be killed... it's a fairly common feeling among human beings..." that was gold!
@@Elisabeth-id6lc or just silly
@@hollygolden9673 was hilarious and very clever.
It could have been a Monty Python line
Mostly because of the dying part.
Fairly common but by no means universal. Just look at all those Russians going to Ukraine to get killed.
‘Tolerance will reach such a level that intelligent people will be banned from thinking so as not to offend the imbeciles.’
Fyodor Dostoyevsky
Dostoyevsky was imprisoned by the totalitarian communist government of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, the USSR.
Wow, very true.
I'd like to add my informed opinion here as a person with a PhD in genome biology. In the majority of cases, XX = female and XY = male, but sometimes this doesn't happen, because chromosomes can do strange things. Simply relying on chromosomes will not tell you the sex of an individual with 100% certainty, that is why we have an intersex category. We also have people with only one X and no Y, XXY, and even XXXY.
In the case of Iman, she may have XY chromosomes but that doesn't mean, as many people are saying, that she has male reproductive organs that have never descended. It's possible she has all the female reproductive 'bits' with ovaries that aren't completely formed or generic gonads (that are neither testicles nor ovaries), a mix of testicular and ovarian tissue, or, indeed internal testicles (this doesn't mean these are normal functioning testicles, though). All of these would lead to high testosterone to different extents because ovaries need to work well to convert testosterone into female hormones. What I mean is that if she was examined by a team of doctors and they decided she was a female, who the hell are we to say she is a male?
Also, it's important to remember that this is a person. She's not a walking political statement. She doesn't deserve all this shaming and ignorant assumptions for simply having been born a certain way.
My sources:
How should we classify intersex disorders?, Journal of Pediatric Urology, Volume 6, Issue 5, October 2010, Pages 447-448
Bennecke, E., Köhler, B., Röhle, R., Thyen, U., Gehrmann, K., Lee, P., … Wiesemann, C. (2020). Disorders or Differences of Sex Development? Views of Affected Individuals on DSD Terminology. The Journal of Sex Research, 58(4), 522-531
Thank you for giving an actual scientific opinion.
They are AIS and have a small bulge in their crouch.
That means partial CAIS.
Where is your sympathy for the woman who this person beat up? What statement would you make to her? Shut up and take it? Because that's what she was told. Sports needs to be fair, and there needs to be rules that protect the even playing field. That's not discriminatory. The fact that a vicious, homophobic, misogynistic and cultish movement - one that uses the very conditions that you describe to justify the mutilation of non gender conforming children who are perfectly healthy - makes this a political discussion which you are not above.
#likeascholar
She wasn't examined by a team of doctors. She wasn't even examined by anybody. They used her passport to identify her sex . Did you miss that part of the discussion?
"I encounter many people who don't want to be killed" lol I think this sums it up well.
😂
So perhaps boxing is the problem?
@@JaneAustenAteMyCat Yeah that must be it. What about the swimming and track and field women's titles and records being broken by men pretending to be women?
Maybe grass and water are to blame?
What a moronic statement.
@@JaneAustenAteMyCatthe sanctioning body of boxing, yes.
you don't say 😂
I remember back in the day there were born women athletes at the Olympics who cheated by taking steroids similar to male hormone. These woman were tested and disqualified from competition.
These days they accuse you of being a WW2 German for not supporting it
Not the same. She didn't take anything. She was born that way. Many women have high testosterone for a fenale.
They should sue now lolll
Wth! And what does.this have to do with the situation?
@@lorenakarim7257 Think it through.
"If they can have a weight class, they can have a gender/ hormone class, too."
OOOHHH! Good point.
UM...SHE is a WOMAN...she is right where she needs to be..in WOMENS boxing...scram
Get the f*** out of here she's not even that good of a boxer
Except that there are for all intents and purposes an even distribution of people in the weight classes, or at least something resembling a bell curve at worst. With something like hormone levels, you have too small a range and too large a median to have actual classes based on that. It can also be manipulated, it also changes and isn't consistent. It's ok to have rules that exclude a millionth of the population. Just like how they wont sanction a fight if you're blind in one eye or have some other medical anomaly. If you were wolverine with knives coming out of your knuckles you wouldn't have a right to participate, they're allowed to say it's unfair and dangerous and what ever else.
Why not have a height class too? Then there can be basketball matches for the people shorter than 6 feet. Or they can have arms length classes, so that swimmers with shorter arms don't have to compete with Phelps.
It's amazing that in the 70s and 80s they were able to determine the sex of athletes, but can't today.
@@lawrencescales9864 Nope, it wasn't a thing,
Yep. We had common sense. Now weak mean wanna beat women for fun. What world.
@@ScottinWV-bg2ij there have always been DSD athletes. It’s just a political hot topic in recent years.
This has been happening since the 1930s, with prominent cases throughout the 50s and 60s. Female athletes has always been put through these medical mazes while male athletes, as far as I know, are not.
But that was before Wikipedia, when you know better, you do better; please try to improve you knowledge, and decrease your assumptions en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersex
It's weird how trans men never seem to have this problem.
Exactly!
It's funny when they end up being 5'2" wide hipped soft shouldered men and since they insist on he/him they are now White males. So they have to remind you "but I'm trans" to keep getting those oppression points.
What problem?
Imane Khelif is not trans.
yea exactly where's trans men in men's sports? 🧐
I used to do some boxing... then I got punched... I quit boxing.
I am normal.
Nice cope
@@machanobakas3249Why are you talking to yourself in a UA-cam comment? Odd
I used to lift weights. But they are heavy. I am normal. (But a sissy foo-foo la-la!)
@@jjtinkler97 Carini??
Is it normal now to not have an ounce of competitiveness or toughness? Where is this? So I can avoid this "normal" place.
Thank you for taking the time to figure out what the details are, and sharing them with the community~
This issue is a perfect analog for the greater rift in our culture. Both extreme ends of this debate sound absurdly ideological, while the greatest number of us are somewhere in the middle.....trying to be cosiderate of special cases, but equally considerate of common sense and fair play.
yep plenty of crazy people out there. and its exaggerated on the internet because wild and irrational people and opinions are "exciting" and "different".
This is exactly where I expected the trans issue in sports to go, calling cis women trans because they have more muscle density/ higher bone density/ unnaturally tall etc. Where this leads is basically very strict physical guide lines for cis and trans women to be able to compete in a sport. Which isn’t fair for many cis women as well as trans women. I suppose we could could start having things similar to weight classes but that is yet to be determined.
Don’t even get me started on how unfair it is for women in a sport to be forced to compete against trans men because that’s what their biological sex was at birth.
Please enlighten me where the right supports anything close to sexually mutilating children? Giving castration drugs to children, claiming two year old babies can be “gay”. The left is bat shit crazy now.
Yeah, but in this case the problem is that the trans issue is falsely mixed up with it. She grew up as a girl, and was even not allowed to do boxing for a time by her father because she is a girl and now she is accused of not being a woman. Maybe she is an intersex person and just learning it, imagine the psychological struggle of finding this out like this, being publicly accused and humiliated and in addition coming from a very conservative country where this is probably not a widely known condition.
It’s the CCP model, put something out that’s pushing the boundaries but not too far , normalise …then push again, then again…then suddenly you have normalised pedeu…. Kinda like normalising sexual disfigurement in children. Or giving kids sterilisation drugs “to save them” Pure Evil
The Olympics needs a major overhaul of common sense.
Yeah imagine women having to fight women in boxing.
Not everyone can participate in sports. A lot of young people have got health problems or other issues that prevent them from playing. If you can't play, you just need to accept it and invest your life's energies in other directions.
Disagree in this case, she’s not trans or a male and would likely not even know about a “chromosome disorder” if she wasn’t an athlete and been tested.
At least the Olympics have common sense, unlike you.
She’s been defeated by like 5 different women throughout her career. She doesn’t have some insurmountable advantage. People like you desperately need to educate yourself. Also she is from Algeria(99 percent Muslim) they aren’t going to send someone who is a “woman by self identification”
The 2 women who were previously banned and suspected to possess a XY karyotype easily got away with the gold in women boxing, in their respective weight category. The IOC failed to ensure fairness and athletes safety, and miserably so. They also had their athletes swim in sewage water. Let that sink in.
I often hear about these things late through friends and family, and the story tends to get a bit distorted. Thank you for clarifying this issue.
Dr. Grande: "During my career as a counselor I have encountered many people who do not want to be killed"
Jeez, Doc I hope this is the norm,
Ever heard of suicide by cop? It's pretty popular today
@@PowuhToSeven suicides in general are more common then we think.
Dr. Grande took his time with this one. I came checking everyday since the time of this incident.
So does that fighter have XY chromosomes or not? That's the simple answer that we need to know.
Yes she does have XY chromosomes, but she could also have a vagina. Biological problem
Not for the sake of Olympic competition we don’t. Italia lost a fair fight.
The parents would know...but we shouldn't dig them up for something like this 😂
@@justinejustice_league1857 Why would the parents know? I don't know many parents who do a chromosome check on their children. If you think XY chromosomes necessarily lead to the development of particular features, look it up and think again.
It's unknown unfortunately.
Dr Grande, you got this one wrong. How can you be so sure and come to your conclusion that this boxer was a female?
This constant gaslighting on television is purposeful demoralization.
It's far worse than that. It's designed to induce psychosis on a national (if not global) level. Read the book The DeepState Encyclopedia by ReallyGraceful (she's got an excellent youtube channel).
It is actually indoctrination. If you check out "commitment and consistency" in psychology of persuasion you'll see how forcing people to play make believe actually has a lot to do with forcing beliefs onto them. This boxing example shows the result, they have been forced to concede that there are differences between women and transwomen but they continue inventing pseudo-scientific explanations that just so happen to mean the transwoman is physically identical to women if you ignore the performances of the transwomen making new world records etc.
The constant accusation of everybody ‘gaslighting’ everybody else is, ironically, a form of gaslighting.
@@RC-qf3mpthanks robot.
@@drungeltunks3720 you’re welcome, human.
The only thing which really occurs to me in this case is that the fighters look like they belong to different weight classes. The size difference is ridiculous. I can see why people fixated on sex and gender, but it really looks like an issue of weight class.
Looks like an upper body strength issue and not weight class.
@@gailmorgan2556 Same difference: more muscle, higher weight.
@gailmorgan2556 that's what it appears to be to me as well. Look at the guns on that...woman.⁹
No, it’s an issue of sex. Men at the same weight class as women have a 260% stronger punch. That’s a massive difference.
@@sharifsalem Good thing her sex is female.
Stella Walsh never had her 1930s medals taken away despite her intersex status which was only revealed when she was autopsied following her murder during an armed robbery when she was 69 years old.
At autopsy, Stella Walsh was determined to be intersex--lacking female sex organs, such as a vagina, uterus, or ovaries, but with a male reproductive system including a non-functioning underdeveloped penis, an abnormal urethra, small testes, and a small prostate. Walsh was reported to have genetic mosaicism. Most of her cells contained XY chromosomes, but some contained a single X0 chromosome. Though "socially, culturally and legally" a woman, her sex would have been ambiguous at birth. As she grew up, people in her neighborhood were aware of her condition to a certain extent, but had no reason to draw attention to it. She wondered out loud in the presence of a childhood friend why God had done this to her.
I feel bad for Iman, she didn’t cheat or break any rules, but I also don’t think the other woman should be put at risk…..
Sorry, one bad precedent does not absolve us from doing everything we can to establish fairness and safety. It's like saying that, since a lot of people got away with performance enhancing drugs, Lance Armstrong should be allowed to keep his Tour de France victories.
@@3112isabel I don't feel bad for Imam. I feel bad for the women he battered. Biological males, even with developmental issues, have no business in women's sports.
@@3112isabelThey are boxers. They signed up to get punched in the face. Stop infantilizing them.
Dr.Grande, your analysis is much appreciated, spot on. 👌🏾
How refreshing to hear facts and a level headed not ideological analysis. Thank you :)
The IBA on their website stated:
"Point to note, the athletes did not undergo a testosterone examination but were subject to a separate and recognized test, whereby the specifics remain confidential. This test conclusively indicated that both athletes did not meet the required necessary eligibility criteria and were found to have competitive advantages over other female competitors."
Correct. No details.
The IBA has become a Russian controlled organization with serious corruption issues, the Algerian boxer was disqualified at thr IBA Championships after defeating a Russian, that enabled the Russian to progress.
@@andrewworth7574And we know how much Russians love LGBTQIA+ 🙄
@@andrewworth7574oh ffs. Would you give the conspiracy theories a rest.
I'm not debating that the IBA ban may be suspect, as pointed out elsewhere. The point is that in order to let a previously banned athlete compete in the Olympics, the IOC should have come up with a better argument than 'her passport says she's female and that's good enough'. As far as I know, they ignored the ban, which is worrisome in itself. Someone correct me if my info is wrong.
All the people who were experts on COVID have somehow found the time to also be experts on genetics.
XY
Appeal to authority fallacy.
Appeal to Facts @@trinketmage8145
@@trinketmage8145 You mean deferring to experts who have PhDs in this stuff rather than some ignorant loudmouth on Twitter? You DGGers are really something else.
@@benzmane7564XXY
This was the most Evan handed and reasonable assessment of the situation I have seen. It IS complicated. Thanks 🙏
This is not a new problem. See Caster Semenya and the results of the women's 800 m final at the 2016 Rio Olympics. People with this condition are assigned "female" because the medical professionals cannot see the penis and testicles, which stay internal and don't descend. They end up with what looks like a vagina but there is no cervix. As a result they have XY chromosomes and much higher levels of testosterone than the typical woman. Reading Caster's story, I felt very bad for her being at the center of this terrible controversy, but I also felt bad for the competitors who got bumped off the podium by a person who looked more than a little bit masculine.
This is a really tough problem and the sport associations don't look close to a solution after 15 years of trying.
exactly, this is not a new problem re: Castor Semenya: In April 2018, the IAAF (track and field) announced new rules effective 8 May 2019 that applied to athletes with certain disorders of sex development (DSDs) that result in androgen sensitivity and testosterone levels above 5 nmol/L. Under the new rules, these athletes would be required to take medication to lower their testosterone levels below the 5 nmol/L threshold for at least six months in order to compete in the female classification for certain events. In a report explaining its decision, the IAAF wrote that there was a "broad medical and scientific consensus" that athletes with high testosterone can "significantly enhance their sporting potential" due to greater muscle mass, strength, and haemoglobin levels. The report added that "there is no other genetic or biological trait encountered in female athletics that confers such a huge performance advantage."
The IAAF's changes applied to eight different events-including the 400m, 800m, and 1500m, which Semenya regularly competed in.Sports scientist Ross Tucker estimated that the new rules could make Semenya "five to seven seconds slower over 800 metres."
So why hasn't the IOC followed the lead of the IAAF and apply to all sports ?
It's really simple to resolve, if a person has xy chromosomes, they are biological males. Ban biological males from competing in women's sports.
I don't think it is complicated. Simply make an XX category and a category for all others.
The only people claiming that she tested for XY chromosomes are a corrupt Russian organization who initially let her compete and only released the statement after she beat a Russian
Too strong to be a women, too weak to be a men. Basically a IT.
She lost to a woman in previous composition.
She didn't do well in the Beethoven composition olympics
Amin would not be qualified if they had administered the swab test for DNA. Anyone who has Y chromosomes is a biological male. If you think that I am wrong, then marry Iman Khalifi and see if your "wife" will get pregnant with a baby.
Because no woman has ever defeated a man. XY chromosomes. Any other argument is complete and udder horse plops
*He
@@rnsteve2265shut up bigot
Box is a dangerous thing even among male boxers
I wouldn't last 10 seconds in the ring with Mike Tyson, if he caught me (I'd be running).
And females should not be punched by males
If she has XY chromosomes, then she is male. This is something that she's been made aware of, and has disqualified her from other female competitions. It's not controversial to point that out. She can live as a female if that's what she's comfortable with, and who's to judge? What she shouldn't be doing is competing in female sports. It's just common sense, given the biological differences between males and females.
but she doesn’t have XY chromosome. that claim came from a russian source that is not credible and there is no evidence the XY chromosome story is true
I'd first like to see a genetic test and hormone test, because it's obvious by looking at her that she's built like a male. I'm not saying she's a man, but as usual, we can't even have a discussion about it without being called some sort of insult by the lefties.
Exactly
Agreed!
xxy and born with a vagina... so... not as simple or clear cut as your little mind can handle
The Italian boxer was not knocked out or concussed.
So how can the punch have been so amazingly hard?
I suspect that she convinced herself into being defeated before even getting into the ring.
True, didn't even get a bloody nose or anything, it doesn't make sense that an experienced competitor would quit after that. Seems to me she already checked out mentally and was looking for an excuse to give up.
Males punch 260% harder than females of the same size. She never fought a man before, so she never experienced such force. That's how.
@@SilverAgatka well, she should definitely have been knocked out or concussed then.
But wasn't
8 billion gonna produce some odd ones
that's what my dad taught me, at his time, 7 billion, and he use to say, "no two are the same, so you are going to get some extremely strange examples."
Exactly. Takes all kinds
And you think that you're not "odd"? Get a life. 🙄
@@DemePoole you misunderstand what he said so hard
More like 6 million...
Just looking at the two women, how were they even in the same weight class?
It's not 2 women. One has XY chromosomes
What's ur proof? @@lourdeszurita9244
Because they weigh the same.
@@lourdeszurita9244both are biological women. Not as clear cut as you’re making it out to be.
@@lourdeszurita9244XXY,, not XY,, there's also men with an extra Y and they're not any more or less masculine than other guys...
This is the most important analysis
Thank you dr. Grande
It's not an equal category. Unacceptable and inmoral.
Your common sense analysis of these videos is the reason I tune into your channel, no extreme views one way or the other......refreshing!
As someone who would have been knocked the heck out by either one of those women (in less than five seconds), I'm staying outta this.
😆
Ditto! Discretion is the better part of valor...😊
You win!!! 🤣✌🏼
I am hiding right behind you.
One of them is man. You'd have a chance against the woman though. Men can puch 260% stronger than women of the same size. No amount of training can make woman puch as hard as a man who falls in the same weight class.
You’re great, Dr. Grande. Well done.
In cases like this, when it's simply not 100% - such as the female athlete doesn't have female chromosomes, but has male chromosomes, or elevated testosterone levels, it simply shouldn't be allowed, just like doping isn't allowed.
Even if testosterone blockers were put in place, an individual like that, had quarter of century to grow with male characteristics- musculature, bone density, strength levels.
There's a reason, why men and women don't compete against each other - even in non contact sports, such as athletics. It simply wouldn't be fair - again, just like taking steroids wouldn't be fair.
not how it works, if you castrate all men they will have lost all their bone density and muscular strength in five years tops. It doesn't matter how strong they were before, they will fall within female ranges because a constant supply of testosterone is required for the body to remain within male ranges.
So her being born with a vagina and a uterus doesn't make her woman enough to compete with women?
Even in male boxing, there are weight limits to ensure a fair fight. Why wasn't this the case here?
They were both fighting in the 66kg weight category.
They are fighting in the same weight, but due to the chromosome difference - imane is built like a man.
I've read they were in the same weight class, although Khelif is a head taller & substantially more muscular.
These comments are ridiculously ignorant. 😑
Did any of you actually watch the video?
Many of them did not. They want to validate their own feelings rather than admit being wrong about the facts or face the possibility they were emotionally manipulated.
Right? It's like these people just go to every video and comment without watching just to vent 😂
They all narrow minded people, who want to use this to further their bigotry. SAD.
Dr. Grande we can always count on you for the honest and accurate truth. Thank you for that 😊
I feel bad for Iman. I dont think she is "a man trying to kill women" life is not great for women with masculine traits and the fact that someone like jk rowling made it her place to call her a man, claim she was sneering and a cheat etc was just incredibly cruel. Whatever she is/ has , she is not a transwoman. She was assigned female at birth. Maybe she has some strong advantages that make her participation unfair or dangerous , but the cruelty and insults and claims over her lack of character and dishonesty are just wrong. I bet shes been bullied her entire life over her looks. Imagine being born with physical traits you cannot control and being blasted on social media for lt by very prominant celebrities. Disgusting bullying.
It may all be true if she was a really woman, but is she?
XY!!! Male. Maybe he has some mixed up parts but his chromosomes are xy.
I feel bad for her too. If she was born with a Y chromosome she is genetically male. I don't know what is fair here, but I don't believe it is fair for women with two X chromosomes to have to compete against someone with a Y chromosome.
People wouldn’t be jumping on this if we haven’t had to endure the lunacy over the past decade hearing elementary kids can decide their gender, or there are no differences, gender is a social construct, etc.
@anneb889 Lunacy that is approved and studied by the medical community practically everywhere in the world? I think it's yall being freaks about it is the reason why this is happening, no need to try and shift the blame honey
Why is this even a discussion?
Political points.
All I will say is that the emperor has no clothes.
I only speculate how much I am comforted by and enjoy the content of Dr. Grande. ...
One of my ex-girlfriends was over 1,80 (over 1,90 in high heels) and had a frame that was on par with many male physiques, as well as the musculature. She was not trans, just a woman with a genetic makeup that would have favored her in any combat sport (but she was not interested). These women exist, and I think it would be a mistake to exclude them from the sports under the guise of fairness - or should we have disqualified Usain Bolt when he outran every competitor by far, just because he is obviously a freak of nature? We want to see those exceptional people do exceptional things. If a man does it, we are fascinated by his insane physique. If a woman does it, we cry "unfair" and "we must protect women in sports". I think this is hypocritical. Right now, this debate is not about sports for the most part, but about the place of trans people in our society (and if they should have one), and this is done under the guise of protecting women in sports.
Khalif is not a woman with high testosterone, but male. Considering long history of males with 5-ARD competing and winning against women, and his physical characteristics perfectly aligning with the disorder, we can assume that condition is most likely. Boys with this disorder are often missexed at birth, and end up with "female" on birth certificate. Sometimes the disorder is not discovered until puberty, but then it becomes apparent. Men with 5-ARD produce normal male levels of testosterone, but can not convert it to DHT resulting in low to no facial and body hair, and "resistance" to male pattern baldness. Still men. Penis size does not determine sex.
The difference is that these two athletes, have XY chromosomes, and although raised as women, may have exceptionally high testosterone levels. We don't know because the international Olympic committee is not being transparent about how they ensure competitive fairness in women's sports. No matter what solution they come up with, someone will think it is unfair, but at that point it is what it is and people who think it is unfair are free to try and change it.
Was she XX or XY?
Ultimately the question is why do we have women's sport. Why should low T women have to compete against high T women? Why should low T men have to compete against high T men?
FYI you might have been dating and having intercourse with a man...
She might have been born with female reproductive organs (but infertile) and been raised as a female but if she has XY chromosomes she is a genetic male.
If the boxer did have XY chromosome than they are a genetic male even if they had a genetic abnormality (likely Swyer Syndrome) that caused them to have female reproductive organs.
"And the trees were all kept equal by hatchet, ax and saw."
Nice Rush reference
My favorite Rush song.
No his mind is not for rent, to any God or government.
great RUSH reference!!
Does anyone else think that we are going down a hole and life is going to get alot more chaotic
no. We actually have the most resources to find a truth than any population in human history.
Idk I think WWII was a lot worse.
@@Kai...999Yet we’re at the beginning of WW3. WW2 will probably look like child’s play in the end.
@@carnifaxx I wish I was as naive as your reply. Things would be easier.
@@fkcoolers2669 so how exactly without the knowledge of DNA would you find out she may be a male, when she has female genitals? How naive is that?
You're the best, Dr. Todd!
The public response, comments, Tweets, etc. really show how often people don't analyze cases and instead just jump to whatever conclusion fits their narrative. So many people are treating this as a transgender issue, going on about transwomen beating women in sports, etc. Imane Khelif is not a transwoman, but has an "intersex" condition/a type of disorder of sex differentiation. It's a medical issue that's entirely unrelated to the issue of a proper biological male merely identifying as a woman.
He has XY chromosomes, stronger muscels, bones, speed is fasrer, punches harder etc...u reall think that s a fair competition?
@@muncangel5993that's not his point, he's saying too many ppl have misunderstood the story to be trans related when in fact it's about whether or not an intersex person with ambiguous genitals and xy chromosomes can compete with/identify as women. Tra's have done an excellent job conflating the two issues
@michelethe80sbaby yes sadly the more extremist trans activists have co-opted intersex issues, when the two are completely different socially and physiologically
ANY advantage conferred by male testosterone levels leads to an advantage in combat. Trans, intersex, unicorn-pixie dust sexual whatever. Why is this so difficult to understand?
@@adamweisshaup Succinctly put, and seconded by me!!!
I don’t take the Olympic committee word for anything.
But you trust the corrupt IBA?? GTFOH
i believe them 10 times more than id believe you thats for sure.
@@wubforceonei second this. I also tend to believe that a women who lives in a country where transitioning/hormone treatments are illegal is most definitely a woman, but call me crazy I guess, it’s not like they would have killed her or anything
Haters when they are confronted with the facts :
It’s crazy to say that when the ones accusing her, are the old Olympic committee who isn’t running it anymore because of corruption 😭😭 you believe what you want. Nothing to do with the Olympic committee
I think this case is similar to Caster Semenya, a runner. She didn't run, because they were forcing her to take hormones to lower her testosterone levels.
Thanks as always, Dr. Grande. A reasonable voice in a crazy world.
Love from Canada
Fact check false. A politically explicit voice contributing to a politically charged world, masquerading as a reasonable moderate.
Dutee Chand had a similar problem. She had Swyer syndrome and was accused of being a man because of her T levels. She was born a woman and never identified as anything different. This issue is a lot murkier than people understand.
@@rizzorizzo2311 Agreed it is murky. People say she was born a woman but don’t explain what that means. If Imane has XY chromosomes, male levels of testosterone and internal testes, very difficult to really say how that that is being “born female”. It’s just that the characteristics making them male were not observable at birth.
Caster is male.
@@JB-nw1ix that is being intersex so technically these people are one sex more then the other but can have bits that is part of men. But not really functioncal male sex parts.
This is the best and most well rounded and reasonable analysis of this sticky situation.
This video is uploaded at 3.30 A.m here In france.. luckily for me I'm awake so I can watch a fresh upload from da 👑 DR. Grande. X
Like Moe Sizzlack said "Cheese eatin' surrender monkeys..."
The French Olympics have been an embarrassment to France. Sorry, but true
@@StAlphonsusHasAPosse It can't be the body odor and the cheese, I agree, that and the reputation for surrendering at the drop of a snitzel.
@@richspillman4191
Lol, my grandfather fought with the French in WWII and said that they either couldn't fight well or would run away
@@StAlphonsusHasAPosse My dad was stationed in Germany in the early '60's and got into a bar fight visiting France, brought home a felt french police cap, the flat round ones.
She’s right. It’s NOT fair, and should not be. But here we are.
Speaking of your arse.
yeah, but literally getting out after one punch? Our hungarian girl followed and she pulled thru even after losing and saying she can't win halftime because its a male. (even not completely, but what not fair IS THAT theyre in the SAME weight category while just look at the differences. yeah, fair she can go boying with females bbut like 70kg not 60, come on now!)
Very simple solution. The Olympics and ALL sports must require gender chromosome testing. XX competes with XX. XY competes with XY. Give this person another gender test, and every time before competing updated gender testing is required for all competitors same as continual drug tests. No discussion necessary.
Gender testing wouldn’t be necessary before each competition. Chromosomes won’t change. They should be tested as a baseline and carry identification of the results of the test.
@@realitycheck4842 Granted, but *only if all contestants are fair and honest!* There are so many opportunities and methods how *probes could be mainpulated or changed* (like it is known for any "normal" drug/ doping test...) that *the criminal energy to falsify the results could be immense* , especially for small competing countries, like, Algeria...
There is so much money to be gained in the so-called "amateur" Olympic Games, that one gold medal winner could not only support HIS (IMO and conviction!) family, but bring HIS native country to international notice, with many benefits. Now it has only led to notoriety...
I agree, this really is the best solution. Not only is no discussion needed, none of the mockery or hostility is needed that I've seen in so many comments.
No. They just need to verify that she is a woman. Which we have done. The Olympics is filled with genetic freaks with conditions. If we tested everyone with an unfair advantages, people like Biles, Phelps, and Yao Ming would be disqualified.
What about the intersex athletes XXY?
As usual, Sir, you are a voice of reason. Respect!
maybe you should analyse the embarrassment and pain that this poor young woman faces after this slander and abuse
HE. Oh. My. GOD. Open your eyes 🙄
Is your hair pink or green?
@@madmarlowe1422 what does it matter?
@@wendyleeconnelly2939 You answered my question thanks.
@@madmarlowe1422 🤣🤣🤣🤣👍🏻
JD Dunce giving commentary on that men shouldn’t be allowed to pummel women while simultaneously advocating to make it harder for women in abusive relationships to get divorced is very rich 🙄🤦🏾♀️. I agree dr grande - this is on the ioc!
The IOC have their rules published online. Algeria followed the rules and Italia quit thus making Algeria the winner ❤
Fair video, Doc. If anything, this whole debacle shows how poorly educated the general public is on subjects regarding transgender, intersex, and genetics. The Olympics are filled with competitors with genetic advantages; that's why Michael Phelps won all those gold medals. The _entire point_ is to have the most physically capable athletes compete. So unless the IOC establishes some limit for testosterone levels, this kind of thing will happen again.
Besides, this isn't even a transgender/intersex issue. This is all about the drama happening behind the scenes. The IBA (the group that oversaw the tests) was decertified by the IOC in 2023. The IBA was plagued with scandals for years, including bribery and match fixing. They also never specified what kind of tests Imane had, stating that the results were confidential. The reason for Imane's disqualification in 2023 was never stated. What _is_ known is that she was disqualified 3 days after she beat Azalia Amineva, a Russian boxer. The whole XY claim was made by Umar Kremlev, the IBA's Russian president, who clearly wanted mess with IOC after they'd taken over control of boxing at the Olympics. This whole debacle is nothing more than a geopolitical sideshow.
Also, that Italian boxer's initial response was ridiculous. She became a professional in a sport that revolves around getting punched in the face. What was she expecting?
Dr. Grande's dry sense of humor is chef's kiss level awesome
The 2024 Olympic Games have barely begun and yet it’s already plagued by multiple controversies.
We're about halfway through actually.
Crazy considering how they ran so flawlessly for literally 128 years.
Women's BMX Park had a transgender woman in it, so the statement by the Olympic committee is actually incorrect as well.
South Park made the perfect episode about this.
yup
How when South Park mocked MALES invading female spaces? Imane Khelif is not even trans or male.
Yeah, right! Leave it to South Park!
Only that the person in south park was man and this one isn't
if Imane either went through male puberty and/or she has male-level amounts of testosterone... she should not be fighting women. it does not matter what sex she naturally is.. if that can even appropriately be determined. it's the advantages created by undergoing male puberty and it's male-level testosterone amounts that 'cause the unfair advantages.
there is no need to focus on her declared born sex... the game-changer is whether or not she has the advantages or not.
If she did not go through male puberty and she has high testosterone levels for a female but not in the male range.... then she should be fine to compete. no problem.
but if she was mistakenly determined to be female at birth, and did eventually undergo male puberty... then her formerly recorded status as a female at birth shouldn't be any determinant here. it doesn't matter that she can be beaten by non-DSD women.
it really doesn't have to be so complicated. undergoing the process of male puberty or having male-level amounts of testosterone is not to be allowed when competing in women's sports. that's the piece that matters. that's where the line needs to be drawn for safety.
any males who have natural differences in testosterone to one another but whom all went through male puberty should be able to compete together fine by weight class. same goes with females who processed as such. there does not need to be exceptions made in those cases.
Totally agree!
Your comment is one of the most factual and reasonable ones here! 👍
It's all about the fairness in sports competitions, and the line should be drawn somewhere and at some point!
I really enjoy your analysis and videos that don't include anyone being murdered. And your straight face when you say, the desire not to be killed is a common feeling for most human beings.
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes
you sound stupid here.
Imane Khelif was determined to be a girl at birth, like many other individuals at that time, where the nurses or doctors only looked a the body for a male genitalia. Khelif doesn't have one (not even now). Yet like a lot of individuals, Khelif chromosome is XY. There are also cases of an individual having XX chromosome, but developed male like genetalia. The notion of gender/sex is more of a cultural thing.
One thing to note. The organization that disqualified Khelif was International Boxing Association (IBA) which is Russian-led, and IBA's Olympic status was revoked in June 2023 due to governance issues and perceived judging and refereeing corruption. So IBA is not exactly the authority in boxing.
@@yellowlynx I’m surprised you quote with such authority the findings by the doctors present at her birth. I would be more interested in seeing her genitalia today. Far more relevant
External absence of testes is common and referred to as undescended testes Not true absence
@@KizzyMMA And you should listen to the IBA instead...?
XY females have an athletic disadvantage against XX women as their ovaries are non-functional, and they don't develop testicles. Khelif is a male who very likely has 5-ARD, a DSD exclusive to males that results in ambiguous genitals at birth, and normal male puberty, although without facial and body hair growth as they can not convert testosterone into DHT. This also means they will never experience male-pattern baldness. This is the same disorder that father of two Caster Semanya has. It's a common DSD among male olympic medalists in women's category.
@therian_forever12 No details of the tests were released. Nobody can be sure if it is actually a proper "gender test".
@@alfredopampanga9356 The key thing is that, Khelif and the other was raised as a girl since birth, so you can't call them "transgender".
Once we have established that the boxer has XY chromosomes it becomes hard to keep saying that this person is female. This is not about the fact that looking at the genitals at birth, they decided that this was a female. The appearance of a newborn's genitals does not have an impact on XY chromosomes. When children are born with 5α-reductase type 2 deficiency, at puberty, the body is going to develop as that of a male. Dr Grande, you are mistaken in this case as this is not only about the testosterone levels today, but about the transformation that occurred during male puberty. Upper body strength, bone density, muscle strength, bigger lungs, there are countless advantages at stake. From this perspective, it is important that an individual born with XY chromosomes does not compete against women.
agreed. its a sad reality for intersex people but if they go through male puberty they should not be competing with women.
Exactly. The body is built up according to the hand of cards, hormone-wise, it is dealt. That becomes an easily notriceable change and difference during puberty. Physically, on many levels, men are dealt a far superior card. The exceptions merely prove the rule.
This is the second video of his that I've seen and both of his analyses have misinformation .
The humor in this video was some of the best I’ve heard over this controversy. 😂 great analysis
The IOC uses a passport to determine the sex of an athlete? Seems a little lacking considering the current state of affairs in women's sports.
I just looked it up to confirm. In the US, I can go right now and request a passport with my gender as male. I do not have to supply any documentation to corroborate.
They are cowardly. The passport means almost nothing.
@@vanessak69😂😂😂
I am so happy you analyzed this story and I am so glad that people are coming out to defend her. Now that I understand all the basic facts, I am rooting for her and cannot wait to see her win Olympic gold for her country. She is obviously very talented and has worked hard to earn her place at the Olympic games.
At the end of the day, he’s biologically a male. Doesn’t matter of his life experience and that he ‘lived as a woman’. We are making it acceptable for males to beat females. The argument that he is exploiting the situation or not is completely irrelevant.
No, the athlete was born a woman and has a rare condition
Thank you for clearing this up, I was honestly confused and misinformed
JK Rowlings will chime in at anything remotely smelling trans. She really needs to be held accountable for her transphobia. Imane won fair and square, with her natural advantage, just like some swimmers with longer arms and legs, and bigger hands and feet. Just because there was a mention of trans..... the transphobia was well revealed.
Where are the transgender men competing in men’s sports?
Martina Navratilova and Caster Semaya have faced the same accusations. Well said Dr Grande.
Martina is female and Caster is male.
They are saying about Simone Biles and Katie Ladecky now, too. If people can’t comprehend how this rhetoric is so blatantly dangerous for all women, cis and trans alike, they shouldn’t be welcome in society. Idek how to engage in discourse with them any more, and the harm they are causing is disturbing
@@tluvsbeauty1 Real women can just take a chromosome test and wave the XX in front of the media. Something the two male boxers won't do.
@@tluvsbeauty1 BTW, "transwomen" are men.
@@shrikeofterven6006 they aren’t though! They are women:) must suck to be so confused all the time
I hope doc G doesnt get cancelled. I hope world can find sense again. I hope good people will fight hard for what ia right, and what is truthful.
100% agree.
I don't think he cares about being canceled.
Brilliant Doc scrupulously fair well done 🍀🍀🍀
It wasn't the testosterone that both boxers failed at the world championships on it was a test that revealed a y chromosome
No, this is incorrect.
So many people skipping over this even though this is the smoking gun
Right on! Doc blew this one. He lost that fact and went for a red herring of testosterone .
@@samus6256 nope, there is no evidence that is true in any way.
@@kathleenkaufman5920 nope, there is no evidence that is true in any way.
Somehow I don't think that when the ancient Greeks had the first Olympic games back in 776 BC that they had these types of problems.
Because only men were allowed to compete. There were no contests for women.
I don't doubt it. And I know you are being somewhat facetious. Yet the biggest difference regarding the current context and back then (in regards to this specific issue) is that women weren't Allowed to compete in Athens. I think that's important of note considering the focus of the current debate.
Replied before I saw your comment. Exactly 💯👌
@@mariatodd3132You're right. Genetic analyses weren't a thing back in the day. She would have been considered a female because she was literally born a female and has female parts.
@karenpearson6991 unmarried women did compete.
Maybe the only solution would be to make a third category in sports, for people who are neither male nor female
or just get rid of categories altogether because equality? may the best human win
@@ORAVA1993Lol...that would mean the instant death of female participation in olympic sports.
@@ORAVA1993 I'm in favor for that except keep male and female sports. The third category should be a mixed gender league where any gender can participate.
Fair and balanced discussion. I take Dr Grande's points about public figures jumping to conclusions and the IOC struggling to come up with a workable system.
For things to be completely fair: I believe that there should be a trans league. we should have trans athletes competing against others who also identify or have transitioned the same.
This is not a trans issue though.
she is not trans 😅
The joke is the above nonsensical trans league comment got way more likes than the comments below correcting it. Dr Grande even talks about how people comment without knowing all the information 😂
He clearly says she's a woman who just so happens to have a (naturally occurring) higher level of testosterone in her body. This doesn't make her trans. If a guy has a lower level of testosterone he can't just walk into a woman's changing area.
There's the answer.
@@gtrance3567hermaphrodite / trans, are simply too strong to compete with women.
Michael Phelps has the wingspan of a California condor and produces 50% less lactic acid than the average person but not a word about his unfair advantage.
Fair, but he doesn't touch/hit other humans to compete in his sport!
What's Michael Phelps' testosterone level compared to his peers?
his body naturally produces 50% less lactic acid and never had surgery to increase his wingspan
That’s amazing! He’s a genetic anomaly
When he's swimming against women we can have a discussion.
Here we go!
Well said, Dr Grande 👏
Imagine out classing your opponent so badly that you are accused of being something you are not by experts who dont know WTF they are talking about.
Exactly! She knocked her a lil too hard, I guess. I thought that was he whole point of boxing tho
Or...imagine being a female competitor, who has worked hard her entire life, only to to be outclassed, at the Pinnacle of your career, by a male who's testicles failed to drop! Y'all are sick!!!
Masculine women have athletic advantages. But feminine men don't. Nobody is talking about this specifically.
In this case, she has a natural advantage due to her intersex condition. This incident is more akin to a female athlete being on PEDs than anything to do with trans ideology, yet some people wasted no time jumping on that because they were emotionally manipulated by culture warriors and grifters.
Iman didn't, though. She's never gone above 7th place. So Italia is either a pussy or Iman gave a really good punch.
then why did you comment? You're not staying out of it you are trying to get involved but pretending you are not
Nonsense. Masculinity does not give any athletic advantage. Femininity does not give athletic disadvantage. Men are not losing medals and prizes to women. Women are losing to men. Khalif is not a masculine woman, but a man who was wrongly sex at birth and knowingly takes advantage of that fact by beating women for a living.
Yeah but competitive sports all depend on being the fastest or the strongest so obviously men are always going to gain the top prize... but have an average man stand back to the wall, with a chair in front of him front to back, bend over till his chest touches the chair back, and try to straighten up and LIFT the chair, 97 PERCENT OF MEN CAN'T do it, 97 percent of WOMEN can... doesn't matter how strong or fast you are, IT'S IMPOSSIBLE because of the females lower center of gravity in the thighs and hips...
I am an RN. I was educated in biology, human anatomy and physiology, and other sciences. A person with XY chromosomes is a male. Full stop. Imane was assigned female at birth, and raised as such, due to ambiguous genitalia and/or internal organs. Unless Imane has androgen insensitivity or no testes, Imane has developed a skeleton and musculature of a man, which certainly appears to be the case. They have even failed a testosterone level previously. The rights of women are not being considered. The chromosomes should be determinative.
Yeah nurses. The smartest people out there. lol
The same people who wouldn’t get vaccinated against Covid.
No, You should go back and get a refund.
I'm an AHP and this is consistent with my physiology training, too.
@@samsonlovesyou news FLASH, you studies introductory physiology and went over the basics. LETS STOP pretending that two chapters in developmental human biology made both of you an expert.
@weareallthesame7924 Not the basics, we get that at secondary level education in the UK, but not expert level either. That's why I continue to consult experts to build on those foundations. Happy to put my understanding up against yours if you'd like to refute the above post.
There are so many commentators fanning the flames of controversy. Dr Grande is a fire extinguisher.
Michael Phelps has physical advantages due to his genetic defect but nobody's complaining about it.
This isn't a genetic defect, this is BIOLOGICAL MALE with ambiguous genitalia raised as a female. Again, BIOLOGICAL MALE with ambiguous genitalia raised a s female. Why is it so hard for people like you to draw this common sense distinction?
Genetic defect....? Which is?
There have been four lab tests taken in two different labs in different countries. Both boxers are 46,XY. The labs who conducted the tests were in India and Turkey, and both are accredited by the Swiss Court of Arbitration in Sport. Their credibility is above reproach. The odds of four tests all being incorrect are one in one hundred million, literally. The boxers are male.
As for what DSD they may have, we don't actually know that they have a DSD at all, but if they do it is almost certain to be 5-ARD, a male specific DSD which results in an underdeveloped penis. Babies with 5-ARD are often raised as girls, either because their parents believe them to be girls, or because they wish to conceal their condition. However, as they have functional testicles, they experience normal male puberty, at which time it becomes impossible to hide their true sex as their features masculinize, their voice deepens, and their underdeveloped genitalia grows. People with 5-ARD are categorically male, and can even father children. They are not women with high testosterone. They are men with normal testosterone. There is no difference whatsoever between a male with 5-ARD boxing against a woman, and any other man boxing against a woman. Both possibilities are completely inappropriate and dangerous.
Thank you Dr Grande. I thought Iman was transgender, I misunderstood.
👆🏽
cheating male
Stfu @@LloydChristmas-vx2whimane is a woman with XX chromosomes
This was a good break down. Much better than your first break down.
This really digs deep and highlights the future problems