“Used in Anger” Episode 1: Lavalier Mics in 2022 (RODE vs.DJI vs. Zoom vs. Sony)
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- Опубліковано 3 лис 2022
- Welcome to episode 1 in a new, occasional series I'm calling "Used in Anger." This is a British phrase meaning "used for its intended purpose rather than for practice," and in this video I discuss what I learned about lavalier mics during a complicated shoot.
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Gear Used to Make This Video:
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- Camera: geni.us/Qltrb0z
- Lens: geni.us/CDHl2C0
- Microphone: geni.us/dUJb
- Accessories: geni.us/k1YCB
- Key Light: geni.us/BGAw
- Key Light Modifier: geni.us/HObbjo4
FULL EDIT SUITE
- Main Computer for editing geni.us/oIYLUA
- Secondary RAID system: geni.us/7GPqOV
- Primary RAID system: geni.us/C7fDV5
- Laptop for writing: geni.us/ccCt
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My guy, this is the best video reviewing these microphones. Presenting the information through the framework of your own user experience on the job is BRILLIANT! I love this. THANK YOU
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For me, I bought the Senheiser EW's years ago for corporate gigs. One body pack transmitter and one that plugs into any XLR mic. That wireless system is the perfect example of "buy once, cry once".
The only time they failed me was on a mountain ridge near a radio tower (as you would expect) but even the wired backup had interference. Fortunately it was easy enough to take out because it was a constant pitch like a sine wave.
Over the years I've found that I've never regretted buying the "industry standard" of anything.
Yeah my g3s have been solid for about 12 years and counting. Have the avx now too. Sennheiser are the way
Thanks Hugh - always informative / enjoyable.
Thank YOU, Bill.
Always good to hear about the real-world experience of using different types of gear. Thanks for posting. Yeah, I've definitely learned the value of having backup audio devices. Usually have 3 ways of getting usable audio. A boom mic where possible, lav mics, and a room mic as a 2nd backup.
While many of the reviews for 2.4ghz wireless say they generally works indoors, the line-of-sight issues are enough to keep me from buying anything along that line. Mainly because I often record live events where the presenter moves around a lot, and these events sometimes happen outdoors. UHF systems are far more reliable, especially when they use a diversity set of antennae or receivers. I believe the Sony system does this, where the Sennheiser ew100 series does not.
Interestingly, the cheaper Saramonic UHF system can be set up in a diversity arrangement by adding a 2nd receiver tuned to the same channels as the transmitters. While this requires additional recording channels (and more futzing), it does provide a safety net for interference issues. For the types of projects I work on, a wireless system using a base unit (like the BLX-D or SLX-D systems by Shure, or similar systems by Sennheiser and others) are the best balance between cost, reliability, and ease-of-use. XLR cables from the receivers to a DR-70D mounted under a camera, with a short 3.5mm cable between audio recorder and camera, provide a manageable pathway of getting audio into the camera, as well as a higher-quality recording for post.
Having said that, I do expect to get a more portable wireless set with a camera-mounted receiver. Sometimes, you just want to get something set up quickly, and that can be more valuable that getting the best quality. Just need to have some type of backup no matter what system you use.
Same with rode wireless 2. I had to send the receiver back for issues. The back up recording feature has saved me many times though.
A/V gear manufacturers need to understand that, especially in this UA-cam era, the biggest obstacle to producing content can be the lack of another human being to operate and babysit it. Creators need reliable gear that can be left unmanned and unmonitored throughout a shoot because the creators themselves are often in front of the camera or managing a multi-camera setup.
Just so!
Audio more left than right in a Video about audio?
Good ears - an issue with FCPX.
Thanks for this
Absolutely brilliant, Hugh! I, too, carry the scar tissue from one-man corporate interview videos gone wrong - thanks to audio issues. These days, I implement no fewer than three audio capture devices for all interviews - the DJI mic (onboard recording), a Zoom H1N, and a camera-mounted VideoMic NTG. Watching (and listening to) you is always such a delight.
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Great idea! I'll implement this too and I've had scar tissue as well being a one man band. Audio is so so crucial!
@@JoaquimGonsalves My new saviour is a 32-bit float field recorder, meaning I don’t even have to set levels for connected mics.
@@peterfritzphoto Thank you for sharing that brother. God willing some day soon.
@@peterfritzphoto As a sound guy I can't help but roll my eyes at you! 32bit float is NOT a replacement for properly gain staging your audio... It is the equivalent of setting your camera to "auto". I don't know any professional photo/videographers who would do such a silly thing, do you?
It is a great tool for the inexperienced but is not a replacement for experience!
Wonderful content! Thanks for sharing your insight. For now I am using the RODE 2... ZOOM audio quality I think beats the DJI ? What would you suggest?
I've owned Sony's previous-generation UWP-D transmitter/receivers for a few years and I've been fortunate that I haven't had any issues, but oof, it's really unfortunate to hear about your experience with the Rode/DJI. :( ...and yeah, nothing can replace having a person behind the camera.
Excellent information! Thanks or the audio BTS from the shoot. Now I know what you meant in those comments! Pro gear every time!
We’ve all been there. My Rode wireless go 2’s have been collecting dust too. I use the 32 bit Tentacle sync Track E audio recorder and it works flawlessly. Has physical controls to start and stop recording and led’s on the front that measure input levels. Plus it syncs up in post with just a few clicks if you run tentacle sync timecode to your cameras. Not sure if it’s “pro” gear, but its never let me down.
I second that. Whe you are a one man band, you cant be worrying about audio levels so 32 bit float is an absolute must. The Tentaclesync Track-e does that in a small simple bulletproof package. They are priced like pro gear and they work like pro gear without the bulk.
Sorry, I chuckled a few times watching this video. I can imagine the frustration was pretty bad, sounded like you planed for just about every scenario that could happen and still unfortunately had issues. I don't do interviews, mostly just recordings of my kids playing in band or chorus. I've never had my h4npro let me down so far and is a nice backup. I bought the Godox Movelink M2 kit and for what it is I like it a lot, but it doesn't have internal recording. Works well for recording to the camera. I really enjoy your videos and a long time subscriber. You're a cool dude!! Keep up the good work.
Thanks for the video. With the Sony uwp-d27, Do you know if, through the MI shoe, I can hear and monitor the levels each transmitter separately in the Sony fx6?
Hugh always like the way you explain thing, in a sort of sarcastic way,I’m a seasoned video guy like yourself, i’ve used every dog and cat over the years but I’m actually quite happy with the Rode go 2, yes sometimes it doesn’t come on and other times it doesn’t pick up one of the mics or both of them but the backup recording does work and it’s saved me more than once even though it’s difficult to find the track that you actually need, oh by the way if you have any interest in Turkey, the country, take a look at our channel
Thanks for your thoughts
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Your description says a Fujifilm camera was used, but you mention you're using a A7IV. WHich one is it? Which lens?
Nicely said! I've heard so many people say that the 2.4GHz systems have never failed them. My experience has been different and I'd much prefer to use a UHF system like the SONY UWP-D where I can scan the filming location. Also, 100% agree that having SOMEONE monitor audio and camera through critical filming sessions is a must, not a nice-to-have.
Nice to see you here, Curtis! Always enjoy your videos!
Okay i've had the same problem with de Rode. One transmitter would turn off after some time (very random, sometimes 20 sec, sometimes 4 min, sometimes always keep on) I've asked around by 2 friends / filmmakers who use them; and they both have a transmitter with the same problem! Maybe this is a much bigger problem? I'm going to ask a Rode rep here in The Netherlands...
😲 What a nightmare. I think you can definitely take 1st place in the category of "Murphys Law - If it can go wrong, it will" 😭
I don't trust WiFi gear myself, too much pot luck involved, especially in built-up environments. I use the F2BT and found it good for the mostly outdoor work I do (with a Windbubble fitted). I heard some reviewers comment on poor connection issues with the mic jack though.
🤔🤔 On an unrelated item... As I watched you video at 3:10am GMT, I see 93k plus views and only 106 likes. 🤔 Honestly, how much effort does it take for folks to do creators a solid and tap the 👍. #Unfortunate
A good quality informative video as always. Have a good weekend. Kind regards, BG 👍😎
I've been fortunate to only use Sennheiser and Sony wireless packs for professional gigs. But every once in a while, I get a little brave and start thinking it's time to give one of these prosumer packs a chance. Thanks for nudging me back to reality. Especially when doing one man band, the last thing you want to do is to come back to the office with unusable audio.
Great video and this is just a GREAT example of what I think about when the client goes "but it's just a quick 7 minute recording - how can you charge this much?". Background: I've been doing audio since 1993 and video since 2007 - during the Covid lockdown I had, literally, HUNDREDS of live stream sessions from, say, conferences. Even though I always get professional grade equipment that most people would find "overkill", there's hardly ever a project, that goes 100% smooth. You turn of a given device 50 times - then at job #51 something doesn't work. Or like this week: I set up for a livestream this week a day before the actual production - EVERYTHING worked. When I got there on the morning, EVERYTHING (still) worked and literally 10 minutes before going live, my audio interface died out of nowhere. As professionals, this seems quite odd because "everything working" would be what everyone expects - that's why the client hires us instead of doing it themselves. But - as a pro for 2 decades, I just KNOW that on more or less every production, something will bring headaches and I just expect it to happen (ie. I bring more equipment than I need - I mount two mics for interviews, I have backup streams ready to switch to, I have more lenses than I need because - knock on wood - at some point, I will drop one and break it). It's not a matter of IF but WHEN problems happen and it's cheaper to be prepared for that, compared to the money I will loose if the clients decides not wanting to pay because of a give problem.
Thanks so much for sharing!
I recently got the Sony UWP system, and it is fantastic. While the Rode and DJI systems work most of the time, they always seem to go wrong when it really counts.
Holy gee whiz! I should have watched this last week. Now, just as I'm getting ready to do my first one-man-production interview, I realize how much more I need to know. Help! And I do not have your very best secret weapon.
Hugh, thanks for your excellent advice. I'm on the 'nursery slopes' of sound engineering and as mostly a 'one man solo operator appreciate your learnings and insights.
I guess it's a case of getting what you pay for. The higher cost of better build quality, reliability and ease of use really come into their own when a second take isn't a realistic possibility. It also points up the value of monitoring whenever possible.
I had bought into a Deity's interview kit and was dismayed to learn they stopped making it and successor BP-TRX packs and so it's soon going to be effectively obsolete (when it breaks or service/repair is impossible). So, I need to budget for, then invest in better pro-grade sound kit and redundancy strategies asap. Thus hopefully minimizing risk of future sound problems.
I also take out the idea that a Zoom F2 is a relatively affordable redundancy option for when things go wrong in future, despite utilising high-end sound kit (ie when the going gets tough and the sound gods aka 'sods law' are against you).
I’ve managed to have issues with the F2 as well, although I appreciate your “belt & braces” approach even with top notch equipment.
i use the saramonic blink 500 pro b2 kit. you can't go wrong with that kit! solid, reliable, lasts many hours and sounds great!
Good to know!
I had that kit. I put it away fully charged in it’s charging box for about six months and all batteries were totally dead and are extremely difficult to replace. I tried replacing one and ended up cracking the display and it’s all trash now. Now I have the Sony set with field replaceable batteries. Internal technician replaceable batteries, advanced technician replaceable batteries are no good in the long run.
I’ve used a wireless Sony lav (the kind that works through the hot shoe)…good sound and rock steady…but I hate mic wires on talent. just picked up the Rode wireless go II for a VR camera…not pumped about the quality of the sound. My go-to wireless lav is the PicoStream dual mic system…best sound of any of these systems, smallest transmitter, and longest battery life. I’ve used zoom F1 as a secondary audio recording…but it is like most systems - fiddling with mic wires on-body. So I use the pico Mic, and a backup of either a shotgun mic, or camera mic. Redundancy has saved my ass many times.
Yeah the Rode, DJI and Zoom are more prosumer level equipment. Like maybe ok if you film yourself and you’re ok with doing it over. For pro work I go Sennheiser but have had good results with Sony too. Sennheiser avx to zoom h6 is my go to atm
Hi Hugh.. I have been following you channel for a few years now and love your content. Please take my following input in the spirit I intend it to be. As a wedding videographer 14 years into my journey, I am a devout Sennheiser user. The AVX system has been my go to since it came out and to date it has never failed. Yes I have plans B and C in the shape of field recorders but I haven't as yet needed to use the audio from them.
Noted, Peter - with thanks!
Great video!
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Three reviews I’ve watched, 2 broke the hot shoe.
😳poorly designed component to an otherwise well-considered product.
This is like listening to my brain at the moment as well. I have the rode. F2’s and dji systems and thinking of switching to the sonys with the fx3. The range issues with dji, the quality control issues and battery drop outs with rode. I just want a one man band solid system 🤦♂️
Hugh, thanks for sharing. Your story was a catalyst to my spending £1200+ (I'm in the UK) on the latest Sony lav mike kit to replace my Deity (effectively now obsolete) Interview kit. It seemed like a bargain when I bought it and has many nice qualities but self-noise and interference free transmission in tricky situations are known weaknesses. An example perhaps of buying cheap then buying twice?
As a relatively wealthy amateur hobbyist, most of my gear mistakes over the years involved trying to save money buying less than mid/high-end kit only to then upgrade later to better kit.
It's easy to be wise after the event. In truth over 30 years in photography, sound and now video. Most of the stuff I use and trust is the more expensive, better built, properly designed, reliable pro-grade kit.
If I could go back and talk to my younger self it would be to advise in doing careful research, never buying in haste, be wary of clearance sales (cheaper for a reason) and save for better grade when possible.
Man, do I hear you, Ricky!
Wow, what a comment 😀
Let me introduce myself. My name is Frans, I am in pension, picking up on a videohobby. Outdoors/run/gun/travel/shooter, preferring wireless, a receiver and two transmitters, for several scenarios. I don’t mind a lavalier for behind the camera use.
I have a Panasonic gh5, possibly upgrading sometime later to gh6/g9mk2. As minimum possible in post.
Watching YT reviews, all brands are promising us heaven on earth, if you buy their stuff. 24 bit, 32 bit floating, you name it.
Let me come to my point. I don’t have 30 years left (70 years now) to figure things out, trial and error.
So, what set up do you recommend for my outdoor use case?
Thank you so far, for you patient attention and looking forward to your educated reply, 😀👍👋 Frans, the Netherlands/Indonesia.
Hi Franz, looking at reliable 'honest Joe's YTs by the likes of Curtis Judd (for audio and lighting) may help. There are others too. Alas many YT 'creators' are well intentioned but sometimes don't seem to want to 'bad mouth' their freebie suppliers.
So do take anything I say with 'caution' as what I like and think may not suit you, your budget or your needs. On audio I used to have a Tascam field recorder but switched to a much better Sound Devices MixPre 6ii. Other SD models may save a little eg MixPre 3ii or cost heaps more (eg 888) but as with anything you should do your own research. Zoom seem pretty capable too, possibly better value, but a tad below SD. For radio mikes, if money is no object then Zaxcom or Sound Devices seem highly rated in pro circles but too expensive IMO (keen, relatively wealthy, amateur). I bought into the latest gen Sony radio mikes then switched out the lav for a Sanken Cos 11D. Good but expensive. Much more affordable are small radio systems operating on the 2.4 (wifi) freq. band. Of these I like the DJI Mike system but def not as well regarded as as more expensive 'pro' oriented models. I'm also exploring using timecode using Deity TC-1 boxes. But in TC Tentacle Sync are also well regarded. But especially, especially if using one camera, then feeding in audio direct to camera can be good, simpler and cheaper . The DJI Mike is well regarded for this, cheaper too. Good audio is but just one tech area. Ideally, you shouldn't neglect story. You can also do a lot in post using voice overs, but that's no good if needing lip sync.
Thay sounds like an audio disaster day! You were over prepared and things still didn't fully work. I'm still considering Dji as a stepping stone for my audio needs right now. My current level of work is nowhere near professional enough to need more that what thay system offers. But in the future, the professional level audio equipment is definitely a must.
I wish Sony would upgrade their Alpha cameras to 24-bit audio (can only do with XLR-K3M, not with the UWP wireless or compact microphones). Their wireless lavalier system is (much) better than these other prosumer products, but it doesn't reach full potential unless paired with an FX6/FX9. Lumix and Fuji have D conversion (the prosumer stuff can get around this with internal recording, but still have inferior A/D converters in my experience).
I've had multiple small issues with my Rode mic ii kit. I like my DJI wireless kit alot more but shielding on the transmitters has given me some odd noise issues at times. I've been tempted to grab a Zoom f2 as a back up as well. I could have dropped $1k for a pro set for all this trouble.
I have the zoom and dji. You have to keep the units in separate pockets I found or the zoom picked up interference from the dji transmitter. Shocking but true
@@philvfilms that's a great point. Interestingly the noise issues have gotten better since the firmware update. I'm still looking at getting something more professional though in the future.
Thanks
@@kevinbatts2804 same, why can’t Sony put internal recording or 32 but float at the expensive price tag. With the size of the units as they are there’s plenty of space?? That’s the only thing stopping me purchasing them. No redundancy
@@philvfilms there are still a lot of questions about patents Zaxcom units. I know they license their tech to Deity so I wouldn't put it past other companies to have that same license. Maybe that's one of the many hang ups. Who knows.
There’s not enough attention on sound in general on UA-cam. People spend thousands on getting the lens trinity and extra lenses, or the most expensive cameras, and then buy a Rode go or DJI mic or similar for sound. This is a mistake. Skip a lens and invest in solid quality audio. Buy good quality radio systems from Sennheiser or Sony. The latest Sony UWP-D system seems great. It has true diversity meaning the receiver has two radio receivers and constantly hops between these always using the best signal. Quite rare for wireless systems to have diversity at the Sony price level.
Also don’t underestimate the worth of XLR connections - more robust and with better sound quality than 3.5mm jacks. The audio handle for the FX3/FX30 is fantastic.
Video shot with a potato but with good sound beats video shot with Arri with bad sound.
In past years I had sworn off wireless labs because when using them “in anger” I’d been burned. But, I also have had near misses when a subject started to walk away from a wired system. Using a single channel pro level Sony wireless lav - great reliability, but…AA batteries (hate hate hate them). Recently got the Rode Wireless Go II…good sound, but I hate seeing those squares on shirts, and not a fan of using an app. PicoStream dual channel wireless mic has performed flawlessly for me (and are absolutely the least intrusive mics), with great battery life and sound…but no recording. Old Zoom F1 works well, but is a bit bulky for the talent. Just got the DJI dual mic system…again, those big transmitters to hide, but I love the redundancy of backup recordings (without using an app to access). But I need to use them in anger…not sold yet on their tone.
* Experience is the goddess with the bloody nose and skinned knees still hidden on Mount Olympus.
* Kudos to the people behind the camera
Also the Sony is closer to the Leica price bracket and therefore master race compatible technology.
That's important!
😜
Never fun getting burned like that.
Here is the interview link he refers to at 7:28 with Leica Director ua-cam.com/video/HOJ9ppLK3_4/v-deo.html
Lesson: NEVER use Prosumer gear in a professional environment. It’s not designed for this application and will bite you in the A** every time.
Always get the exended warranty and Bestbuy has the best one in industry