For the tiny riders out there, I did 15, 15, 15 and my bike feels like a whole new ride. I'm 5'2" 120 lbs. The shop trimmed my spacers 15mm. Added 15 W oil. And lowered the front 15mm. I can finally stand on the balls of my feet. And finally turn without the tail end of my bike bouncing and sliding all over the place. I paid just under 300 bucks to have it done at my local spot. Totally worth it. They threw in my asv shorties as well. Finally a setup for itty bitty riders! Yay!
Like all you yanks .... loads of information that’s not needed you Americans are all about racing in a straight line !!!!! I watch how you lot go round a track and it’s funny , you Americans are slow !! What I will say is it’s good to see girls on the track ! No one in England uses a tape measure What a jobs worth!! Different ppl ride differently she seemed happy the way the bike was ! I ride a 03 Cbr600rr and I love it Some one comment here ! Come Europe I’ll meet u bet you go home faster,....£400 a day on the track with a new bike , r6 ,gsxr zx6 that is 400£ on the track 115£ a day with a bike , This man is full of bolloxed
I love how calm, kind, and informative he is. It's nice to see someone with his level of knowledge not talking down to people, and instead providing them with the information they need. This is the kind of man that wants everyone to be able to enjoy a fun, safe ride. Mad props to this guy, I wish I could ride with him some day.
@@chrisredfield3240 it's the preload that moves "weight" of the bike forward. Stock it's at 3rd notch. I moved mine to 6 so it became alot more planted in the corners. And still pop some wheelies.
He does sound like a douche and is pretty condescending when he speaks about certain things, for instance @5:08 (everybody throws those away), the majority of people don't throw them away, he makes it sound like just have to open your house door in the morning and find unused brand new springs laying around. I would be interested to hear what the Engineers at Yamaha think of this suspension criticism when you call it a " Catastrophically Bad Problem". A Catastrophically Bad Problem would not remain unsolved on one of the most popular naked bike in the World (and I don't even own one).
Thanks for sharing you results from the changes made so others can benefit from your experience! Enjoy the better handling you now have but remember that when the pogo starts again, the oil needs to be replaced.
@@catalystreactionsbwI need to make the same changes to my front forks. I already ran 15wt fork oil. But I weigh over 140 so I’ll cut the spacer 10 mm but then since I’m cutting that spacer about how much less fork oil to I use than oem specs? Do I use 10mm less of fork oil as well? Or still the same amount?
@@catalystreactionsbw if I use my motion pro fork level measuring tool to the 162 mm after cutting the spacers down 10mm is that going to be too much oil? Or does that depend on the fork travel and etc? And then should I raise the forks in the triple clamps 8 mm?
@@Lopez23300 Oil level assists with bottoming out. as an air spring effect - compressing air slows down the compression stroke. It is easy to add oil so start low.
She's probably at the stiffest setting because someone said "stiffer is better" or "soft suspension doesn't let you feel the road" or something similar. Suspension is there to maximize tire contact, but is dependent on rider weight since the rider becomes part of the machine. . . . I just discovered this channel today. I'm loving it!!!
Dave & the team, thank you sincerely for sharing this insight. To verify & reiterate in writing for everyone: 1. Cut the Front Fork Spacer's length depending on the rider's weight: - 15mm if the rider weighs less than ~140 lbs - 10mm if the rider weights higher than ~140 lbs 2. Replace the Front Fork Oil with a heavier weight fork oil (i.e. Bel-ray fork oil recommended, according to another video by Dave Moss) - 15W oil if the rider weights less than ~140 lbs - 20W oil if the rider weighs higher than ~140 lbs 3. Adjust the Rear Shock Preload depending on the height difference between any two fixed points between the suspension & the seat - Increase (stiffen) if the difference is higher than 40mm - Decrease (soften) if the difference is lower than 30mm Is there anything else that you would recommend done to refine FZ-07?
@Bob Sacamano "Don't do any modifications to your bike unless you can be certain it is appropriate for your riding conditions" tell that to Yamaha, who decided zero rear sag and a near solid front end was a good idea on a bike ridden by predominantly beginners. Or do you think having suspension that is not compliant at all and wants to bounce around enough to throw you from the bike is better for the road? He's not giving the girl in a shop carpark a track recommendation, he's giving her a better baseline that can be fine tuned for whatever work she wants to do after the fact.
Bob Sacamano That's blx. Sag setups are a no brainier for any bike track or road. How many bikes had no static sag. Do you have that on your road or track bike ?
@@DenvarShay I am willing to wager that zero sag is blown out of proportion. If this was absolutely true, you will see a lot of deaths and a massive class action lawsuit. This is only one man's opinion.
I met Dave at a auckland bike show a few years ago , he adjusted my suspension on my mv agusta brutale . Omg the ride home was amazing , a totally different bike , thanks Dave , true professional
Well where are you to get an idea for the set up. It's not like that information is easy to comprehend without background in it. You want to ride a bike, take the course, buy a bike and ride, thinking the manufacturer set it up correctly... Blown away that people are blown away about people not knowing everything...
Why are you blown away? This is a skill set that not everyone has. It has to be taught. Maybe you were just born with insight about bike setup. Do you own a fridge? Can you re gas it? I can't believe that people own fridges and can't re gas them.
My view on suspension is don't touch what you don't know. Having said that I did the same as he did in this video to the rear suspension but only because my backside was aching after a few hours ride, I just wanted a comfier ride and not too concerned about cornering on 30mph gatso infested London roads tbh. Also I'm not sure I like the idea of bike going into a corner more easily, it's something you get accustomed to I wouldn't say one is better or worse unless you're talking lap times, think about how different the bike handles when you had low pressure tyres and then you inflate them back to normal and it feels like a different bike but you got used to riding it on flats. So it's only something you have to experience, he could've adjusted that suspension and the girl could've gone home hating it, just saying.
I personally had a very close call when braking into a corner and hitting a bump. While I lost initial control I managed to save a crash and didn't ride the bike again until after I fixed the factory fork problem. Thanks Dave.
Congrats on your skills and saving yourself and the bike from distress! I sincerely appreciate you sharing that you made the upgrade with the fork oil.
@@catalystreactionsbw But power weheelies on this bike are possible mainly because of bikes geometry rather than it's power. There are bikes with more kW and Nm but they cannot wheelie as good as mt07 does. So I will ask more precisely will lowering front decrease bikes power wheeling ability. Thanx
This is the kind of information a seller should give you when you buy a new bike. I got sold an fz6 and no one asked my weight or how tall i am to adjust it. Years later i learned about these things on a forum. Small adjustments that dont take long, will make so much difference! I wish we would learn about this in driving schools. Thats part of a safer riding!
Hey Dave, I’ve watched this video 30 times. Your confidence in what your talking about gave me (not a mechanic) the courage to do this. I had a lilttle trouble, the bottom bolt wouldn’t come out of one side, it was spinning, and the Yamaha diagram of this fork has the fork seal upside down, so I was putting it in wrong. With a little help from my dealership ($50) it’s back together. I did shorten the spacers 10 mm & 15w fork oil. I’m excited to try it out...
Hi John. Fantastic work and congrats on the end result. A tip of the hat to you sir! I too am excited to see what you find in regards to ride quality. Make sure you test geometry as that is a big part of the end result. Start with stock and lower by 4mm, then lower another 4mm. Don't forget the cable tie on the right fork tube.......
How is it even possible to dislike this video? This guy does his job and knows what to do. He gives back his knowledge in such a pleasent manner, so the customers get it and don't feel dumb. Cheers for this.
There are plenty of people that prefer to have the "glass half empty" disposition unfortunately. I spend most of my time and energy with the glass half full sector who leverage the content and pay it forward.
Hi Dave! I have a MT-07LA ( Australia ) and I've moved up my forks ~15mm how I saw at ( 10:34 ) - it's made such a HUGE difference!!! corner entry feels like carving butter! I have yet to do my fork oil and shorten the spacer, but I am ASTONISHED at the difference just a few milimeters could make!
Thanks for sharing what your learned so far! I will normally go in 3mm increments so once the fork oil and spacer are done start at 4, 8,12 and see what you prefer then.
my fz07 has handle like shit forever... i always wondered why other bikes were so much more safe in the bends... cant believe ive had a bike 8 years and have suffered for 18k miles.... thank you dave
Glad the video is helpful. There is another oner where we take the front end apart and fix it, so watch that video. Please make sure you choose the right viscosity oil based on your weight.
I had the oil and springs changed on my sv650s. Now the adjusters work and it's way better. Can't help but think that the action is quite crude over sudden 'shock' bumps, and that it's a limitation of damper rod forks. I'll save for a cartridge kit next.
@Yolande Nelson - the XSR shock preload needs to be at the lowest/softest setting. The forks (if adjustable) can have preload and rebound set correctly. If not, they will need the 15w oil in the forks.
Awesome advice - i wish i knew about it before passing on the mt-07 due to everyone mentioning suspension as having issues... any pointers for a kawi z650 ?
Many bikes have these issues. What we need is a universal advice vid for all styles of bike. What are the ideal setups in each case. What’s a good solution on one bike won’t work on another though. So then we need is more specific advice on individual types of issues. The advice to solve the excess front sag on my 1989 Japanese domestic Honda CB-1 is the opposite of his advice to remove 10, 15, 20 mm from the spacers. We add 20 mm spacers. The rear issue is more difficult. Depending upon your weight, a slightly longer rear shock with better damping, but the original progressive spring is one solution. Why? Because Japanese kids are a lot lighter than most of us older guys in the west. I’m probably twice the weight of the average Japanese teenager. So, the unit off a CBR1100XX Super Blackbird is one opinion. I like the way you teach. Great to see. Thank you for sharing.
Thank for sharing your experiences and paying it forward. I appreciate the kind words and a tip of the hat to you for taking the time to work through your motorcycles to make them better.
Dave Moss Tuning From you that’s a very kind response. All I did was read a lot of comments from other CB-1 owners and engage in the debate online, then put some of the findings into practice. I’m just ignorant of enough subjects to be aware I’m not too old to learn. What you do is share your IMMENSE and priceless knowledge freely online. And the way you do it is like watching a sainted guru!! No matter how fucked up a rider’s settings, I’ve never seen you ridicule them, or even show Gordon Ramsey style exasperation over their choices. So, it’s THIS I’m most grateful for. I know it’s my LACK of patience that very often hinders my ability to help others, no matter how good my knowledge of any specific subject. If you were on TV the producers would be looking for the most dangerous setups and the most stupid riders - just to test your resolve!! What kills bikers most often? Failure to plan ahead appropriately? Maybe. But when and where should that planning actually begin? In my humble opinion it should at least be somewhere close to the choices we make about who’s advice we firstly seek, then listen to, then take on board, then respect and revisit (having double checked if we want), then implement, carry with us and share with each other. That’s how humans evolved from the grunting stage. MC Rider and you share the calmness and patience which cause you both to stand out from the crown of fevered egos and false prophets, who’s eye is mainly on their profile and the profits they can make in terms of kudos and Dollars. Anyway, enough of this smoke blowing and philosophical bollox. Ride safe bro.
With the front end of my on my old 1990 FZR600, I experimented with different length spacers until I got the sag right. To set the damping I got some thick and thin fork oils, and then tried them mixed in different ratios. That and with a bit of messing with the oil level, for such a simple budget suspension system I got it working quite well..And all for the cost of a bit o steel tubing, and a couple of bottles of oil. (For the rear I bought a second hand adjustable shock).
Good to see even the pro's have issues with those C-spanners; I thought I was being overly clumsy with it but turns out they're just annoying as heck to use
I wish I would have known this 4 years ago when I had my 2015 FZ-07. I ended up changing the rear shock to Gears (they hooked me up) as well as using their fork spring kit with preload adjusters. Didn’t change oil or cut spacers. Wish I had Dave set it up after changing all those parts. Oh well, it’s gone now anyway. Waiting for the 2021 update to the MT-07 maybe I’ll buy one and start over.
Before you buy, measure the static sag. If it is 15mm or less the same problem exists with the spacer. Also ask what weight the fork oil is in the 21 service manual and see if it is 10 or 15w.
That is very cool! It amazes me how many of the riders just out there riding and not knowing or caring about geometry or safety. I mean tiptoeing for a rider on a high bike is plain unsafe. Just like he said.
Yesterday i took the spacer out and took it to the master on a lathe machine to cut it 15mm. Today I am going to put 15w oil and assemble everything on a motorcycle. I still have cold weather and I hope for the first ride in a few days. I'll also adjust the rear suspension as recommended by Dave. Sorry for my english. I hope everyone understands what I wanted to write
@@catalystreactionsbw Thank you Mr. Dave. I finished everything yesterday but today I will put more oil up to 110. Yes, the oil is Motul fork oil 15w. Static sag I have now. When I sit down and get up from the motorcycle the front fork is aligned with the rear shock absorber, which has never happened before. Thanks again.
First ride yesterday. The difference is so great that it's just not the same motorbike. I finally ride comfortably and safely. Thank you very much Mr.Dave
I rode one of these fz07 at a demo day and swore the suspension was a death trap. Now I know why. I didn't push anything on that ride , I just slowly brought it back n parked it. Great video
I just did this mod on a xsr700 2020, skipped spending on springs, just adjustable caps and 15w synthetic oil from lucas. And cut spacers 15mm On bumps it eats it up and its medium plushness is what prefer. Thanks Dave
Fantastic video for MT-07 owners! Thanks Dave for taking the time to share this with everyone. I own the MT-07 Tracer, do you recommend any changes to the front and rear suspension?
Stock my FZ-07 forks handled like a Pogo Stick very sketchy at higher speeds. I hit a deer and bent my forks badly in 2019 I paid $208.00 each for new forks and $650.00 for Ohlin Cartages, night and day improvement. I have a K-Teck rear shock to install too .
@@catalystreactionsbw You said that the stock shock wears out after 12,000 miles, I have noticed that. I carry side cases and a top case 95% of the time. I am one click off from the stiffest rear spring setting and I weigh 180# though I did get down to 160# in 2020. I finally did my first track day this summer. I just took all of the luggage off but left the spring pre-load the same. I should have thought to check the sag. I had lowered the forks in the front tubes because I have very short legs, then I chose to go back to fully extended while riding on the tail of the dragon. I thought the geometry was better with the forks extended out. When I got to Tail of the Dragon and put my tent up .. I took 80 Pounds of gear and luggage off from the bike. I know this because I weight all of it when I got home from my trip .
My 2019 has garbage suspension. Coming from a motocross background, suspension is something I'm picky with and first thing I noticed is how extremely unbalanced and unstable the bike is from the factory. Blows my mind how shit it is.
They did the same thing with the MT-09. Boggles my mind how fucking stupid it is that Yamaha lets their bikes out of the factory like that. Whoever is in charge of suspension tuning down there should not be getting paid.
@@ruikazane5123 you dont need to be an expert to have appropriate spring rates, damper rates and sag rates on cheap suspension for no extra production expense.
I used to own a mt07 and wondered why sometimes I went out on it it would feel "wrong". its one reason why I sold it. I need to change my username now lol
I owned a 2015 FZ-07. I liked everything about the bike except the suspension. Because of the plastics I decided it wasn't worth upgrading the suspension so I traded it off. Such a nice engine in way too much of a budget bike.
Hi Dave, hope you able to made the same vid for yamaha R3/R25. in Asian country most R3/R25 owners love to lower the front fork by 1-2 inches drop. will there be a drastic changes? thx
Dropping the front end makes the 'attack angle' of the steering (aka steering angle) steeper, thus making the bike steer quicker, more razor-sharp. One thing you want to do is whether you bottom the entire front end with that much drop on the front, you can be preventing full travel of the shocks. If travel is unaffected just check whether fenders or such will rub out in full compression. This mod is commonly used to lower ride height, but increase the steering head angle when the rear shock is not adjusted accordingly.
I tend to chose 3-4mm increments. It is known that most Asian countries lower the front end dramatically but I am not sure if that is done via testing per bike or the social norm as it is a legacy practice from decades ago? As per Rui Kazane's comment, lowering can take away travel so you have to mark bottom out and make sure that you do not go any further than that.
All the stuff he said are correct but for the pre 2018 models. In 2018 yamaha stiffened the front fork springs and the rear shock, that now has a rebound regulation. Not a top end job but for daily use the fz07 is better than before, on fast ride the front fork is pretty saggy yet.
Thanks for adding some information. Would you be kind enough to share with everyone what the static sag in in the 2018 and newer models? Is it over 25mm? Thanks for helping all MT07 owners with those year models.
@@catalystreactionsbw i worked only on the rear shock modifing the preload, for my 83kg, on the 4° notch (if i remember correctly) and the value of the rider sag is exactly 30 mm. The static sag is only 13 mm on that notch. For the fork the static sag is 24mm and the rider sag is 37mm, with stock springs (and oil). I measured the value of the static sag with the bike on a stand.
Ah now you've gone and done it for me Dave. I'm always tinkering with mt MT07 and looking for new things to do but I'm possibly around your age an only started riding 2 years ago ( done 30,000+klms in that time though, all fun riding and no commuting ) Anyway, I know nothing about set up but have tinkered, I'm betting I'm not getting the best out of it by far. I have rear shock as tight as it goes and I put after market load adjusters on front forks and cranked them down as tight as they go thinking compressing the springs was a good thing. I reckon a control,alt,delete is needed. Where do i start please mate? I'm around 75 kilo, And great vid, Subscribed.
OOpppsssss :) Start with a cable tie on the front fork and mark bottom out to see how much travel you are using. Look at the shock shaft coming out of the shock body to see what is dirty and what is clean. That will give you the foundation of knowledge to work from. Next, change fork oil to 15w to the same volume as stock and test ride - was it more stable. Thicker oil moves slower so you may use less fork travel. Check shock travel again and ideal is 2-3mm of dirt above the bottom out bumper. If there's no dirt, you may need a stiffer spring. Game on! Please report back to help others and pay it forward.
Dave Moss Tuning Mate, I’m chuffed you found time to reply! I shall do as advised hopefully this coming weekend and will certainly report back and do my bit of paying it forward. You’re a gent and a legend. Cheers mate.
This is very common on most cheaper motorcycles. The issue is they aim the suspension design to the biggest sales markets,which are smaller, lighter riders on low quality public roads. For the US market, the buyers rarely ever take to the track. Most mid and small Japanese brands bikes are underdamped and undersprung for US rider weights. Proper springs and oil weight can fix that, but I think the idea is to keep progressing customers to more expensive bikes, they do not want you happy on a 250/300.
Hi Dave. Thanks so much for the tutorial. I was hoping you could address we bigger guys. What oil and spacer length would suit a 240lb rider? Is the stock shock ok? Thank so much
Hi Jason. Step 1, check static sag on the forks. If you have less than 10mm, the spacer needs to be trimmed. At 200lbs or more a 7mm trim makes sense and 20w would acceptable to the stock volume. With the forks, mark fork bottom out with a felt pen (ua-cam.com/video/eds3dn1LBkw/v-deo.html) and visually check travel used via a cable tie on the forks and looking to see how much of the shock shaft is clean. If 100% clean, the shock needs to be stiffened. If it cannot, the OEM spring needs to be replaced. Hope this helps!
Awesome channel. Thanks for the pro tips. I'm picking up a new 2021 model mt-07. I'm 120 kilos heavy and 169 cm in height. What are your suggestions for my setup. I don't seem to be able to find a similar guy/girl at my specifications in the comments. Thank you in advance.
Thank you! 20w fork oil, forks at stock height. Shock at 3 notches from the highest point and rebound at 1 turn from closed.. Start at 42 front and 44 rear cold psi with your weight.
Ok thanks alot for the informations ! I really love how you deliever your idea or advice i would say .. im gonna subscribe But !! How come we in the 2020 and you guys still call it the FZ ? It's the MT !
AT2 Productions its not about old version or new .. they always been called the MT in the rest of the world but here in the us they always call them the FZ .. and most of them still do now . Even it official as the MT bike
Wawan Blondy Where was the video filmed? The US. Where are the majority of viewers for this channel? The US. What is the official model designation for the 689cc variant produced prior to 2018 for the North American market (not just the US)? FZ. Quit your bitching about a person in the video using the correct name of the bike for the market it was delivered to and being ridden in. Names change often enough, or do you also complain about the change during the life of the Ducati Monster? They were originally designated as the M600, M750, and M900. But then in the early 2000’s the “M” was dropped and they became officially the “Monster (insert number here)”. And yet there are still issues and discrepancies between the sources motor vehicle registries use for the product line. Some have my 2005 Monster 620 Dark listed with a model number of M600 while the others have it correctly listed as Monster 620D. So do you have a legit problem, or are you merely whinging to whinge?
I've had 2 budget Suzuki's which, fresh from the factory, were supplied with 1/4 the spec quantity of fork oil. These were out of warranty but there's no way they'd ever been taken apart by the previous owners.
Yes it does and you might find that even at the softest preload settings for the rear shock, you cannot get any static sag: davemosstuning.com/?s=static+sag
@@catalystreactionsbw can you tell it step by step for us not screwing anything? İ never disasssmbled a fork. Can it be done by not so pro guys like me?
As someone who comes from a Motocross background with suspension that is fully adjustable. It appalls me that some people who ride street dont adjust their machines. Im always adjusting my machine slightly to suit different tracks and surfaces. Even if it goes in the wrong direction, I will have learned
I had two MT07 the first one was a 2014 version and when it was stock it behaved nicely. Then I got a 2017 version and it felt hard to turn in tight corners and the front was very light when accelerating out of a corner so I contacted Dave who told me to do exactly what he said in the video. Put 15W oil in the front and remove 10 mm of preload. I Went to two different shop and I got the oil replaced, but both refused to cut preload telling me that they don't take that kind of responsibility. I could have contacted some suspension tuner in my area but I ended up selling my Yamaha before that. I wonder what it would have felt like but whatever, I have a very different bike now.
Great video, your the man Dave! My girlfriend just bought one of these (2016) and I will get right on it 👌 How about the old model of MT09 , same problem same fix?
Thanks for your post and question. The first generation MT09 needed 15w fork oil to the same volume the manual requires and that transformed the bike's handling
Man... that face, when you tell them the truth. I know you’re mostly used to it by now, but don’t you want to just hug them and tell them it’s going to be alright. Well, as long as they walk home today
Hi Dave, at the start of the vid you say 15mm if your light and 10mm if your heavy. But then you tell the light girl 10mm. I assume the start of the vid's instructions are correct? and you were just making it easy for them to remember. Just checking because I'm about to make the cut :) I'm 73kg I'm trimming 13mm off. Please let me know if I should trim off more. I have watch the How To vid you made in New Zealand. THANK YOU VERY MUCH, UR A CHAMP! Terry from Austalia.
Appreciate the advice Dave ! The last months I've been looking at MT07 videos, articles, etc and biggest flaw I found with the bike was the suspension, but your solution is super easy. I finally managed to reserve a new MT07 year 2021, although the supply for Yamaha in Romania was really bad this year. I'll have 3 years warranty for it. Do you think the dealer will accept making the 15mm cut to the spacer ? Is this something they would normally do ? I'm 171cm and 65kg. On one hand I wouldn't want to lose the warranty but on the other hand safety is even more important. Cheers !
There is no issue with warranty if you change spacer length and oil. This has been proven many times by owners that have made changes to the forks. Changing the rear shock to a different one does not invalidate warranty either. The main concern of warranty is engine and electronics. You might ask a different brand dealership what would invalidate a warranty on say a Ninja 650.
hey dave just picked up a fz07 18k miles, does the shortening the fork spacer still apply to me, im 250lbs. also what front/rear cold psi do you recommend for cobb mtn, lake co, sonoma twistys? bike just has sportmax gpr300's at the moment, nothing special. ill put in 20-30 weight fork oil also. working on buying a shock... probably k-tech or ohlins.
Congrats - will be back in Cobb next week for a couple of days. If you are over 200lbs, 20w and 400cc. No on spacer trim due to your weight and yes to geometry change.
@@truantray So do Americans. It's not like we don't work on our Japanese bikes! Cheers, cousin from across the pond. I'm dreaming of the day I can afford to get over there and attend the IOMTT!! P[>
It's very simple, 20 weight oil is thinner than 30 weight oil you get the picture the millimeters don't have anything to do with the oil per say as to what he's doing to the front by cutting cutting off what he was talking about
Hi Dave, We as motorcyclists should appreciate the expert knowledge that you share with us non-experts. Thank you for adding value. I just picked up an Fz-07 today and it has no static sag. I'm about 185-190lbs with gear. I will try the 15w oil swap and the 10mm spacer reduction, unless you suggest otherwise. Do you see much value in progressive springs in addition to the prior mods or just stick to the stock ones? Thanks in advance sir!
Thank you for the kind words and congrats on the FZ07! Given your weight a 7mm reduction will be more appropriate for the spacer. Linear or progressive wind springs will work but test the OEM springs for travel used prior to acquiring new springs based on marking fork bottom out: ua-cam.com/video/eds3dn1LBkw/v-deo.html
I hope people take on the challenge, trim the spacer and find the right weight oil for themselves - then and most importantly, they share what they did and the positive effects it had for them. Doing that helps me save lives by riders sharing positive experiences!
@@catalystreactionsbw If it's anything like when I swapped my rear suspension for a used Bitubo shock with rebound/pre I can't wait to finally feel what this bike was supposed to feel like all along...
@@Chad-bq7vw That's the positive change you will feel with the right oil viscosity and height. trim the spacer and it will be a positive change again. If needed, select the right springs.
Here's the one video you will need to get the process started Roy. ua-cam.com/video/0kCGoDjtnM4/v-deo.html. Once you have gone through this, keep an eye on fork and shock travel used and experiment with cold pressures of 36/36, 38/38 and 40/40 cold front and rear, on pressure per week.
After years of doing accident investigations on all sorts of vehicles, I find that I and most others give almost any company way too much credit. They do far less actual engineering and testing for things than you could ever imagine.
Thank you very much for sharing your knowledge. I have a 2017 Tracer 700. For some reason I don't have much confidence in the front suspension... Given that the platform is the MT-07, are the suspensions similar? I am 95kg, 184cm, should I reduce the saucer by 10mm and raise the forks 8mm? Thank you in advance
For the tiny riders out there, I did 15, 15, 15 and my bike feels like a whole new ride. I'm 5'2" 120 lbs. The shop trimmed my spacers 15mm. Added 15 W oil. And lowered the front 15mm. I can finally stand on the balls of my feet. And finally turn without the tail end of my bike bouncing and sliding all over the place. I paid just under 300 bucks to have it done at my local spot. Totally worth it. They threw in my asv shorties as well. Finally a setup for itty bitty riders! Yay!
Fantastic and thank you for the leap of faith. I appreciate your sharing the results to inspire others to make the changes needed!!!
You could grind off the peg feelers fold them up with your calves and you could put you feet flat.
@@highlanderfreelancer4553 Could But You Feet is my A-1 clown phrase of the week.
@@gregp103 it was a typical put not but whoops
@@highlanderfreelancer4553 Typical Put Not But Whoops is my A-2.
your* feet. Try another edit.
I don’t even own a Yamaha and I watched this.
Man’s a god.
and informative.
ShakespearesBruv same here bro I own Ducati lol
I had to make a comment to get him off of 666 though, lol.
@@billyballbell which town is that?
Like all you yanks .... loads of information that’s not needed you Americans are all about racing in a straight line !!!!!
I watch how you lot go round a track and it’s funny , you Americans are slow !!
What I will say is it’s good to see girls on the track !
No one in England uses a tape measure
What a jobs worth!!
Different ppl ride differently she seemed happy the way the bike was !
I ride a 03 Cbr600rr and I love it
Some one comment here !
Come Europe I’ll meet u bet you go home faster,....£400 a day on the track with a new bike , r6 ,gsxr zx6 that is 400£ on the track
115£ a day with a bike ,
This man is full of bolloxed
I love how calm, kind, and informative he is. It's nice to see someone with his level of knowledge not talking down to people, and instead providing them with the information they need. This is the kind of man that wants everyone to be able to enjoy a fun, safe ride. Mad props to this guy, I wish I could ride with him some day.
careful what you wish for!
She may not know anything about suspension, she might be a nuclear engineer...........
I like how you don’t make your customers feel stupid even though they made adjustments that are detrimental to the ride.
She was cute though.maybe it felt like it moved around to much at the back so she stiffened it up a bit
There is nothing wrong in experimentation, most of the people never do any adjustments.
True, i lowered my handlebars just to look cooler, and it's actually detrimental by making my ride less comfortable..
@@chrisredfield3240 it's the preload that moves "weight" of the bike forward. Stock it's at 3rd notch. I moved mine to 6 so it became alot more planted in the corners. And still pop some wheelies.
He does sound like a douche and is pretty condescending when he speaks about certain things, for instance @5:08 (everybody throws those away), the majority of people don't throw them away, he makes it sound like just have to open your house door in the morning and find unused brand new springs laying around. I would be interested to hear what the Engineers at Yamaha think of this suspension criticism when you call it a " Catastrophically Bad Problem". A Catastrophically Bad Problem would not remain unsolved on one of the most popular naked bike in the World (and I don't even own one).
Dave: Did you understand everything I just said?
Guy in an oversized suit: OK.
@Dar u mean the guy that looked like lorenzo?
@Dar sorry i have replied to the wrong person.haha
He said OK to everything haha
💀
Lol. He definitely seemed uninterested and zoning out.
random dude: my wife left me and the house is on fire
dave: just cut the spacer 7 to 10 milimeters and u good
Dave: ....also, for the time being I'd add a few extra bounces on the rebound.
And a thicker drink
lmao
Random dude: my girlfriend left me, broke the tv, and took the dog.
Dave: unbind the rear shock and you won't be riding a pogostick.
I put 15w in the forks and cut the spacers down 10mm. It made a huge difference. I’m not riding a pogo stick anymore. This guy is a suspension god. 👍
Thanks for sharing you results from the changes made so others can benefit from your experience! Enjoy the better handling you now have but remember that when the pogo starts again, the oil needs to be replaced.
@@catalystreactionsbwI need to make the same changes to my front forks. I already ran 15wt fork oil. But I weigh over 140 so I’ll cut the spacer 10 mm but then since I’m cutting that spacer about how much less fork oil to I use than oem specs? Do I use 10mm less of fork oil as well? Or still the same amount?
@@Lopez23300 I would suggest at your weight you use 3765cc/ml
@@catalystreactionsbw if I use my motion pro fork level measuring tool to the 162 mm after cutting the spacers down 10mm is that going to be too much oil? Or does that depend on the fork travel and etc? And then should I raise the forks in the triple clamps 8 mm?
@@Lopez23300 Oil level assists with bottoming out. as an air spring effect - compressing air slows down the compression stroke. It is easy to add oil so start low.
She's probably at the stiffest setting because someone said "stiffer is better" or "soft suspension doesn't let you feel the road" or something similar. Suspension is there to maximize tire contact, but is dependent on rider weight since the rider becomes part of the machine. . . . I just discovered this channel today. I'm loving it!!!
Dave & the team, thank you sincerely for sharing this insight.
To verify & reiterate in writing for everyone:
1. Cut the Front Fork Spacer's length depending on the rider's weight:
- 15mm if the rider weighs less than ~140 lbs
- 10mm if the rider weights higher than ~140 lbs
2. Replace the Front Fork Oil with a heavier weight fork oil
(i.e. Bel-ray fork oil recommended, according to another video by Dave Moss)
- 15W oil if the rider weights less than ~140 lbs
- 20W oil if the rider weighs higher than ~140 lbs
3. Adjust the Rear Shock Preload depending on the height difference between any two fixed points between the suspension & the seat
- Increase (stiffen) if the difference is higher than 40mm
- Decrease (soften) if the difference is lower than 30mm
Is there anything else that you would recommend done to refine FZ-07?
Basic stuff most mx racers know but road riders dont. Great video.
How much oil do the front suspension rods carry when changing the oil seal on Yamaha MT 07 2015?
Yes, you forgot to rise the height of the fork about 10mm ;)
@@davidfpv4969 eight mm.
@@datpat2475 415 cc.
The way Dave explains not having any static slack as being "The second kid on the trampoline" is so perfect!
Yeh, never good when your suspension goes cock-stiff...
Dave Moss seems like an Aeronautical engineer who just tinkers bikes for fun. What an articulate and intelligent guy
Is that a British accent
Shared to the MT-07 Uk owners club. Everyone should know how to safely set up their suspension so thank you for sharing your knowledge.
Exactly why don't motorcycle dealers do this when they sell the bike? What exactly do they do for their 30%?
@@truantray They want it to break. Just like how car dealership want parts on the car to break to make money.
@Bob Sacamano "Don't do any modifications to your bike unless you can be certain it is appropriate for your riding conditions" tell that to Yamaha, who decided zero rear sag and a near solid front end was a good idea on a bike ridden by predominantly beginners. Or do you think having suspension that is not compliant at all and wants to bounce around enough to throw you from the bike is better for the road? He's not giving the girl in a shop carpark a track recommendation, he's giving her a better baseline that can be fine tuned for whatever work she wants to do after the fact.
Bob Sacamano That's blx. Sag setups are a no brainier for any bike track or road. How many bikes had no static sag. Do you have that on your road or track bike ?
@@DenvarShay I am willing to wager that zero sag is blown out of proportion. If this was absolutely true, you will see a lot of deaths and a massive class action lawsuit. This is only one man's opinion.
"It's smoking and there's a chattering sound..."
"Shhhh... ahh I see the problem... cut 15mm from the fork..."
He's not cutting the fork... There's an internal spacer above the spring ;-)
krazed0451 Issajoke
@@marcd7332 Repeating the video verbatim is a joke? Weird.
@@krazed0451 dude you are such a dumbstruck, ya cut the fork.
Jeez
@@tonydiridoni1732 Ok, cut your forks all you like! ;-)
I met Dave at a auckland bike show a few years ago , he adjusted my suspension on my mv agusta brutale . Omg the ride home was amazing , a totally different bike , thanks Dave , true professional
Thanks for posting to let other MV owner's know what a difference it makes to have your bike set to you!
Blown away how many people ride bikes and have no idea about set up .. Thank god for the two Daves.
Safe travels in NZ Mr Moss
Well where are you to get an idea for the set up. It's not like that information is easy to comprehend without background in it. You want to ride a bike, take the course, buy a bike and ride, thinking the manufacturer set it up correctly... Blown away that people are blown away about people not knowing everything...
Why are you blown away? This is a skill set that not everyone has. It has to be taught. Maybe you were just born with insight about bike setup. Do you own a fridge? Can you re gas it? I can't believe that people own fridges and can't re gas them.
My view on suspension is don't touch what you don't know. Having said that I did the same as he did in this video to the rear suspension but only because my backside was aching after a few hours ride, I just wanted a comfier ride and not too concerned about cornering on 30mph gatso infested London roads tbh. Also I'm not sure I like the idea of bike going into a corner more easily, it's something you get accustomed to I wouldn't say one is better or worse unless you're talking lap times, think about how different the bike handles when you had low pressure tyres and then you inflate them back to normal and it feels like a different bike but you got used to riding it on flats. So it's only something you have to experience, he could've adjusted that suspension and the girl could've gone home hating it, just saying.
I personally had a very close call when braking into a corner and hitting a bump. While I lost initial control I managed to save a crash and didn't ride the bike again until after I fixed the factory fork problem. Thanks Dave.
Congrats on your skills and saving yourself and the bike from distress! I sincerely appreciate you sharing that you made the upgrade with the fork oil.
Thanks for sharing this dave, cut 10mm off the spacer and put in 20w oil in the forks. It has to be the best mod I've done
Thanks for taking the time to get that done and share how much better the bike handles now! I appreciate you paying it forward by posting.
Does it reduce bikes ability to powerwheelie? Is it noticeably less wobbly in corners? Thanx
@@TheBalija1 Power wheelie is throttle control so no it does not. Less wobbly in the corners? 100% yes.
@@catalystreactionsbw But power weheelies on this bike are possible mainly because of bikes geometry rather than it's power. There are bikes with more kW and Nm but they cannot wheelie as good as mt07 does. So I will ask more precisely will lowering front decrease bikes power wheeling ability. Thanx
Did you cut the spacers in both forks or just one?
This is the kind of information a seller should give you when you buy a new bike. I got sold an fz6 and no one asked my weight or how tall i am to adjust it. Years later i learned about these things on a forum. Small adjustments that dont take long, will make so much difference! I wish we would learn about this in driving schools. Thats part of a safer riding!
Thanks for sharing your experience and POV. I concur, some information on the very basics really helps.
Hey Dave, I’ve watched this video 30 times. Your confidence in what your talking about gave me (not a mechanic) the courage to do this. I had a lilttle trouble, the bottom bolt wouldn’t come out of one side, it was spinning, and the Yamaha diagram of this fork has the fork seal upside down, so I was putting it in wrong. With a little help from my dealership ($50) it’s back together. I did shorten the spacers 10 mm & 15w fork oil. I’m excited to try it out...
Hi John. Fantastic work and congrats on the end result. A tip of the hat to you sir! I too am excited to see what you find in regards to ride quality. Make sure you test geometry as that is a big part of the end result. Start with stock and lower by 4mm, then lower another 4mm. Don't forget the cable tie on the right fork tube.......
How did it turn out?
How is it even possible to dislike this video? This guy does his job and knows what to do. He gives back his knowledge in such a pleasent manner, so the customers get it and don't feel dumb. Cheers for this.
There are plenty of people that prefer to have the "glass half empty" disposition unfortunately. I spend most of my time and energy with the glass half full sector who leverage the content and pay it forward.
Hi Dave!
I have a MT-07LA ( Australia ) and I've moved up my forks ~15mm how I saw at ( 10:34 ) - it's made such a HUGE difference!!! corner entry feels like carving butter!
I have yet to do my fork oil and shorten the spacer, but I am ASTONISHED at the difference just a few milimeters could make!
Thanks for sharing what your learned so far! I will normally go in 3mm increments so once the fork oil and spacer are done start at 4, 8,12 and see what you prefer then.
This guy speaks magic if people listen.
That girl's FZ looks really good.
Loved the shade!
Only took $20 from amazon. Bought the wrap and used a blow dryer.
@@cindyorellana6025 Is that your bike? So how does it feel now?
Dzimka Bujiashvili
The girl looks better. The FZ....its ok
@@andrewford80 less bouncy hahahahaha
He travels, teaches and bring back people to the right path
Dave Moss, The Tuning Prophet
"Ur the 2nd kid on the trampoline" 😅 LOL!
This man is the suspension guru. Absolutely awesome knowledge
This should be standard knowledge for bike enthusiasts
Perhaps Yamaha should employ him.!
Well I’m cutting mine this weekend
So glad I found this channel. Finally, some very intelligent and knowledgable advice on the things we wonder about every day. Thank you, Dave.
Welcome! Thanks for discovering the channel and I have no doubt you will enjoy the content and make some changes to your motorcycle(s)!
I remember when this video doesn’t have much of coverage amongst Malaysian, now there is a workshop can do the setup they call ‘Dave Moss’. 👍🏼
Finally a full video (:
my fz07 has handle like shit forever... i always wondered why other bikes were so much more safe in the bends... cant believe ive had a bike 8 years and have suffered for 18k miles.... thank you dave
Glad the video is helpful. There is another oner where we take the front end apart and fix it, so watch that video. Please make sure you choose the right viscosity oil based on your weight.
Oh i was waiting for this for 2 years! Thanks Dave!
I'm not too god at English, and I don't understand Mechanic things, but this is important.
I wish found a mechanic like Dave in My Country Spain!
I had the oil and springs changed on my sv650s. Now the adjusters work and it's way better.
Can't help but think that the action is quite crude over sudden 'shock' bumps, and that it's a limitation of damper rod forks. I'll save for a cartridge kit next.
Curious how such a blatant flaw in the FZ-07 suspension I've never heard mentioned in any on-line reviews, but Dave nails it down in about 5 seconds.
If you have the opportunity, same more budget bikes with telescopic suspension across all brands.
@@catalystreactionsbw I need to go look at my 690 Duke again.
I always admired suspension experts.
Wow ... seeing Dave explain the problem n fix it about a minute is incredible. Now i know how to adjust my MT 07. Thanks man.
That nice color on the girls bike wow
Chameleon wrap bought for $20 on amazon. Wrapping a bike is pretty easy
@@cindyorellana6025 Send link, please and thank you. ;)
@@cindyorellana6025 Can i get a link please
@@nomanhaider2742 www.amazon.co.uk/Protection-Chameleon-Metallic-Vehicle-Changing/dp/B07QMD27XJ
@@keremcolakoglu1 Thanks, Kerem. Piss off, Cindy.
@Yolande Nelson - the XSR shock preload needs to be at the lowest/softest setting. The forks (if adjustable) can have preload and rebound set correctly. If not, they will need the 15w oil in the forks.
Awesome advice - i wish i knew about it before passing on the mt-07 due to everyone mentioning suspension as having issues... any pointers for a kawi z650 ?
Same task with fork oil viscosity, fork geometry change and at some point a rear shock change.
Get a z900
@@RidingNomad get a turbo busa
@@RidingNomad Does it not suffer any of these suspension designs?
@@catalystreactionsbw
I just finish what u said even cut the spacer at 10mm with 20w going to test it tomorrow morning wish me luck 🤞🤞🤞
Many bikes have these issues. What we need is a universal advice vid for all styles of bike. What are the ideal setups in each case.
What’s a good solution on one bike won’t work on another though. So then we need is more specific advice on individual types of issues.
The advice to solve the excess front sag on my 1989 Japanese domestic Honda CB-1 is the opposite of his advice to remove 10, 15, 20 mm from the spacers. We add 20 mm spacers.
The rear issue is more difficult. Depending upon your weight, a slightly longer rear shock with better damping, but the original progressive spring is one solution.
Why? Because Japanese kids are a lot lighter than most of us older guys in the west. I’m probably twice the weight of the average Japanese teenager. So, the unit off a CBR1100XX Super Blackbird is one opinion.
I like the way you teach. Great to see. Thank you for sharing.
Thank for sharing your experiences and paying it forward. I appreciate the kind words and a tip of the hat to you for taking the time to work through your motorcycles to make them better.
Dave Moss Tuning From you that’s a very kind response. All I did was read a lot of comments from other CB-1 owners and engage in the debate online, then put some of the findings into practice. I’m just ignorant of enough subjects to be aware I’m not too old to learn.
What you do is share your IMMENSE and priceless knowledge freely online. And the way you do it is like watching a sainted guru!! No matter how fucked up a rider’s settings, I’ve never seen you ridicule them, or even show Gordon Ramsey style exasperation over their choices.
So, it’s THIS I’m most grateful for. I know it’s my LACK of patience that very often hinders my ability to help others, no matter how good my knowledge of any specific subject.
If you were on TV the producers would be looking for the most dangerous setups and the most stupid riders - just to test your resolve!!
What kills bikers most often? Failure to plan ahead appropriately? Maybe. But when and where should that planning actually begin? In my humble opinion it should at least be somewhere close to the choices we make about who’s advice we firstly seek, then listen to, then take on board, then respect and revisit (having double checked if we want), then implement, carry with us and share with each other. That’s how humans evolved from the grunting stage.
MC Rider and you share the calmness and patience which cause you both to stand out from the crown of fevered egos and false prophets, who’s eye is mainly on their profile and the profits they can make in terms of kudos and Dollars.
Anyway, enough of this smoke blowing and philosophical bollox. Ride safe bro.
"do u work on things?"
"yea"
2 minutes later
"my buddy can do that for me"
i know some of those people
Maybe he doesn't have a pipe cutter
With the front end of my on my old 1990 FZR600, I experimented with different length spacers until I got the sag right. To set the damping I got some thick and thin fork oils, and then tried them mixed in different ratios. That and with a bit of messing with the oil level, for such a simple budget suspension system I got it working quite well..And all for the cost of a bit o steel tubing, and a couple of bottles of oil. (For the rear I bought a second hand adjustable shock).
Good to see even the pro's have issues with those C-spanners; I thought I was being overly clumsy with it but turns out they're just annoying as heck to use
Is the salty langue necessary? Kids watch these arcane suspension upgrade videos.
dave the world champion of used car salesman,
Imagine this guy being your dad, terrifying
Why?
I wish I would have known this 4 years ago when I had my 2015 FZ-07. I ended up changing the rear shock to Gears (they hooked me up) as well as using their fork spring kit with preload adjusters. Didn’t change oil or cut spacers. Wish I had Dave set it up after changing all those parts. Oh well, it’s gone now anyway. Waiting for the 2021 update to the MT-07 maybe I’ll buy one and start over.
Before you buy, measure the static sag. If it is 15mm or less the same problem exists with the spacer. Also ask what weight the fork oil is in the 21 service manual and see if it is 10 or 15w.
6:00 squid life had me
All the way.
🤣 same here... facepalm moment for Dave 🤭
That is very cool! It amazes me how many of the riders just out there riding and not knowing or caring about geometry or safety. I mean tiptoeing for a rider on a high bike is plain unsafe. Just like he said.
Every motorcycle shop should have someone like him to setup suspension for customers.
Yesterday i took the spacer out and took it to the master on a lathe machine to cut it 15mm. Today I am going to put 15w oil and assemble everything on a motorcycle. I still have cold weather and I hope for the first ride in a few days. I'll also adjust the rear suspension as recommended by Dave. Sorry for my english. I hope everyone understands what I wanted to write
Your English is excellent. Set the oil height to 110mm with the 15w
@@catalystreactionsbw Thank you Mr. Dave. I finished everything yesterday but today I will put more oil up to 110. Yes, the oil is Motul fork oil 15w. Static sag I have now. When I sit down and get up from the motorcycle the front fork is aligned with the rear shock absorber, which has never happened before.
Thanks again.
First ride yesterday. The difference is so great that it's just not the same motorbike. I finally ride comfortably and safely. Thank you very much Mr.Dave
@@salej6009 You are very welcome. Please share your experience to help other riders all over the world with their MT07 have a better handling bike!
@@catalystreactionsbw Yes yes. Thanks again
"The second kid on the trampoline" 😆
Problems aside, but what colour is the second bike? Looks awesome.
looks like it was was vinyl wrapped to me
Looks to me like 3M 2080 Satin Flip Glacial Frost Vinyl Wrap
Westwingturbos I thought so too.
Westwingturbos i think thats just to precise to be wrong fella ; ]
@@ph5056 Eh, could be close enough.
I rode one of these fz07 at a demo day and swore the suspension was a death trap. Now I know why. I didn't push anything on that ride , I just slowly brought it back n parked it.
Great video
I like how he does it like a Doctor, well I do believe he is one as he does.
I just did this mod on a xsr700 2020, skipped spending on springs, just adjustable caps and 15w synthetic oil from lucas. And cut spacers 15mm
On bumps it eats it up and its medium plushness is what prefer.
Thanks Dave
Thank you very much for sharing your experience to show others that this simple modification process makes an enormous positive difference.
Fantastic video for MT-07 owners! Thanks Dave for taking the time to share this with everyone. I own the MT-07 Tracer, do you recommend any changes to the front and rear suspension?
Yes I do! Set sag on the rear and see if the forks pogo and get that resolved.
Stock my FZ-07 forks handled like a Pogo Stick very sketchy at higher speeds. I hit a deer and bent my forks badly in 2019 I paid $208.00 each for new forks and $650.00 for Ohlin Cartages, night and day improvement. I have a K-Teck rear shock to install too .
Great post and thank you for sharing your upgrades and what a difference they made.
@@catalystreactionsbw You said that the stock shock wears out after 12,000 miles, I have noticed that. I carry side cases and a top case 95% of the time. I am one click off from the stiffest rear spring setting and I weigh 180# though I did get down to 160# in 2020. I finally did my first track day this summer. I just took all of the luggage off but left the spring pre-load the same. I should have thought to check the sag.
I had lowered the forks in the front tubes because I have very short legs, then I chose to go back to fully extended while riding on the tail of the dragon. I thought the geometry was better with the forks extended out.
When I got to Tail of the Dragon and put my tent up .. I took 80 Pounds of gear and luggage off from the bike. I know this because I weight all of it when I got home from my trip .
@@mikeskidmore6754 Great post to help people realize their bike needs their preference for settings!
My 2019 has garbage suspension. Coming from a motocross background, suspension is something I'm picky with and first thing I noticed is how extremely unbalanced and unstable the bike is from the factory. Blows my mind how shit it is.
They did the same thing with the MT-09. Boggles my mind how fucking stupid it is that Yamaha lets their bikes out of the factory like that. Whoever is in charge of suspension tuning down there should not be getting paid.
M. B. The thing is the suspension experts only work on the supersports, and they don't really give these any focus. They ain't even cartridge dampers
@@ruikazane5123 you dont need to be an expert to have appropriate spring rates, damper rates and sag rates on cheap suspension for no extra production expense.
M. B. But manufacturers just don't. AND it is a mystery why they do that.
@@ruikazane5123 it sure is. They design these incredible engines and chassis' but then they fuck up something so simple seemingly on purpose
Amazes me still that so many riders just don't have a clue or educate themselves on how to get the best out of their machine.
I used to own a mt07 and wondered why sometimes I went out on it it would feel "wrong". its one reason why I sold it. I need to change my username now lol
I owned a 2015 FZ-07. I liked everything about the bike except the suspension. Because of the plastics I decided it wasn't worth upgrading the suspension so I traded it off. Such a nice engine in way too much of a budget bike.
Hi Dave, hope you able to made the same vid for yamaha R3/R25. in Asian country most R3/R25 owners love to lower the front fork by 1-2 inches drop. will there be a drastic changes? thx
Dropping the front end makes the 'attack angle' of the steering (aka steering angle) steeper, thus making the bike steer quicker, more razor-sharp.
One thing you want to do is whether you bottom the entire front end with that much drop on the front, you can be preventing full travel of the shocks.
If travel is unaffected just check whether fenders or such will rub out in full compression.
This mod is commonly used to lower ride height, but increase the steering head angle when the rear shock is not adjusted accordingly.
I tend to chose 3-4mm increments. It is known that most Asian countries lower the front end dramatically but I am not sure if that is done via testing per bike or the social norm as it is a legacy practice from decades ago? As per Rui Kazane's comment, lowering can take away travel so you have to mark bottom out and make sure that you do not go any further than that.
All the stuff he said are correct but for the pre 2018 models. In 2018 yamaha stiffened the front fork springs and the rear shock, that now has a rebound regulation. Not a top end job but for daily use the fz07 is better than before, on fast ride the front fork is pretty saggy yet.
Thanks for adding some information. Would you be kind enough to share with everyone what the static sag in in the 2018 and newer models? Is it over 25mm? Thanks for helping all MT07 owners with those year models.
@@catalystreactionsbw i worked only on the rear shock modifing the preload, for my 83kg, on the 4° notch (if i remember correctly) and the value of the rider sag is exactly 30 mm. The static sag is only 13 mm on that notch.
For the fork the static sag is 24mm and the rider sag is 37mm, with stock springs (and oil). I measured the value of the static sag with the bike on a stand.
Ah now you've gone and done it for me Dave. I'm always tinkering with mt MT07 and looking for new things to do but I'm possibly around your age an only started riding 2 years ago ( done 30,000+klms in that time though, all fun riding and no commuting ) Anyway, I know nothing about set up but have tinkered, I'm betting I'm not getting the best out of it by far. I have rear shock as tight as it goes and I put after market load adjusters on front forks and cranked them down as tight as they go thinking compressing the springs was a good thing. I reckon a control,alt,delete is needed. Where do i start please mate? I'm around 75 kilo, And great vid, Subscribed.
OOpppsssss :) Start with a cable tie on the front fork and mark bottom out to see how much travel you are using. Look at the shock shaft coming out of the shock body to see what is dirty and what is clean. That will give you the foundation of knowledge to work from. Next, change fork oil to 15w to the same volume as stock and test ride - was it more stable. Thicker oil moves slower so you may use less fork travel. Check shock travel again and ideal is 2-3mm of dirt above the bottom out bumper. If there's no dirt, you may need a stiffer spring. Game on! Please report back to help others and pay it forward.
Dave Moss Tuning Mate, I’m chuffed you found time to reply! I shall do as advised hopefully this coming weekend and will certainly report back and do my bit of paying it forward. You’re a gent and a legend. Cheers mate.
@@mt07toooldtowalk42 Thank you! I look forward to hearing about your thoughts and experience once the changes have been made.
This is very common on most cheaper motorcycles. The issue is they aim the suspension design to the biggest sales markets,which are smaller, lighter riders on low quality public roads. For the US market, the buyers rarely ever take to the track. Most mid and small Japanese brands bikes are underdamped and undersprung for US rider weights. Proper springs and oil weight can fix that, but I think the idea is to keep progressing customers to more expensive bikes, they do not want you happy on a 250/300.
Hi Dave. Thanks so much for the tutorial. I was hoping you could address we bigger guys. What oil and spacer length would suit a 240lb rider? Is the stock shock ok? Thank so much
Hi Jason. Step 1, check static sag on the forks. If you have less than 10mm, the spacer needs to be trimmed. At 200lbs or more a 7mm trim makes sense and 20w would acceptable to the stock volume. With the forks, mark fork bottom out with a felt pen (ua-cam.com/video/eds3dn1LBkw/v-deo.html) and visually check travel used via a cable tie on the forks and looking to see how much of the shock shaft is clean. If 100% clean, the shock needs to be stiffened. If it cannot, the OEM spring needs to be replaced. Hope this helps!
Awesome channel. Thanks for the pro tips.
I'm picking up a new 2021 model mt-07.
I'm 120 kilos heavy and 169 cm in height. What are your suggestions for my setup. I don't seem to be able to find a similar guy/girl at my specifications in the comments.
Thank you in advance.
Thank you! 20w fork oil, forks at stock height. Shock at 3 notches from the highest point and rebound at 1 turn from closed.. Start at 42 front and 44 rear cold psi with your weight.
Ok thanks alot for the informations ! I really love how you deliever your idea or advice i would say .. im gonna subscribe
But !! How come we in the 2020 and you guys still call it the FZ ? It's the MT !
You can't teach an old dog new tricks
Teej 🤣🤣😅
Well, both bikes are older versions, and so are correctly called ‘FZ’.
AT2 Productions its not about old version or new .. they always been called the MT in the rest of the world but here in the us they always call them the FZ .. and most of them still do now . Even it official as the MT bike
Wawan Blondy Where was the video filmed? The US. Where are the majority of viewers for this channel? The US. What is the official model designation for the 689cc variant produced prior to 2018 for the North American market (not just the US)? FZ. Quit your bitching about a person in the video using the correct name of the bike for the market it was delivered to and being ridden in. Names change often enough, or do you also complain about the change during the life of the Ducati Monster? They were originally designated as the M600, M750, and M900. But then in the early 2000’s the “M” was dropped and they became officially the “Monster (insert number here)”. And yet there are still issues and discrepancies between the sources motor vehicle registries use for the product line. Some have my 2005 Monster 620 Dark listed with a model number of M600 while the others have it correctly listed as Monster 620D. So do you have a legit problem, or are you merely whinging to whinge?
best bit is the tension wrench he is using.... .. what a great video .. thank you Dave Moss
Do this apply to the 2019 model fz07/mt after the suspension changes yamaha made to the bike?
I will check a 2019 next week in Wellington to be sure.
@@catalystreactionsbw I would love to know this too thanks in advance
Dave Moss Tuning hey mate while your in nz will you be flying across to Australia? Brisbane
@@catalystreactionsbw awesome, can't wait to see a video on this as I have the 2019 model and want to see if I have to make any such changes!
also does this apply to the Tracer 700?
Wow a free expert consultation. THANKS SO MUCH
I've had 2 budget Suzuki's which, fresh from the factory, were supplied with 1/4 the spec quantity of fork oil. These were out of warranty but there's no way they'd ever been taken apart by the previous owners.
Does this flaw and fix also apply to the XSR 700? Thanks!
Yes it does and you might find that even at the softest preload settings for the rear shock, you cannot get any static sag: davemosstuning.com/?s=static+sag
@@catalystreactionsbw can you tell it step by step for us not screwing anything? İ never disasssmbled a fork. Can it be done by not so pro guys like me?
As someone who comes from a Motocross background with suspension that is fully adjustable. It appalls me that some people who ride street dont adjust their machines.
Im always adjusting my machine slightly to suit different tracks and surfaces. Even if it goes in the wrong direction, I will have learned
I had two MT07 the first one was a 2014 version and when it was stock it behaved nicely. Then I got a 2017 version and it felt hard to turn in tight corners and the front was very light when accelerating out of a corner so I contacted Dave who told me to do exactly what he said in the video. Put 15W oil in the front and remove 10 mm of preload. I Went to two different shop and I got the oil replaced, but both refused to cut preload telling me that they don't take that kind of responsibility. I could have contacted some suspension tuner in my area but I ended up selling my Yamaha before that. I wonder what it would have felt like but whatever, I have a very different bike now.
Which bike?
@@majormassenspektrometer I now have a Honda Rebel 500. Haven't done much to it yet, ebc brake pads front and back.
@@ifrit35 Nice bike! Hope you have fun with it. ;)
My 2018 mt-07 does not have the spacer the Fz has in this video...interesting wonder why the took it out 🤔
Thanks for sharing that critical piece of information. Have you checked static sag to see what you have in your 2018? Standard is 20-30mm.
Great video, your the man Dave!
My girlfriend just bought one of these (2016) and I will get right on it 👌
How about the old model of MT09 , same problem same fix?
Thanks for your post and question. The first generation MT09 needed 15w fork oil to the same volume the manual requires and that transformed the bike's handling
@@catalystreactionsbw awesome, thank you for taking your time to awnser my question 👌
Is this a common problem to all year's MT-07 models on the market until today??? Great video congratulations 👍
Yes, for oil viscosity as I verified with a 2020 MT07
That guy ought open a suspension business, go to track days and stuff. Oh wait...
Man... that face, when you tell them the truth. I know you’re mostly used to it by now, but don’t you want to just hug them and tell them it’s going to be alright. Well, as long as they walk home today
I knew immediately it was going to be suspension.
Martin Leon no you didn’t
@@guywelch656 its a common complaint so its likely he knew
BIg G he did - litterally everyone knows it’s the bikes biggest problem.
@@guywelch656 mt07 suspension is infamous. I'm sure a lot of people knew.
Hi Dave, at the start of the vid you say 15mm if your light and 10mm if your heavy. But then you tell the light girl 10mm. I assume the start of the vid's instructions are correct? and you were just making it easy for them to remember. Just checking because I'm about to make the cut :) I'm 73kg I'm trimming 13mm off. Please let me know if I should trim off more. I have watch the How To vid you made in New Zealand. THANK YOU VERY MUCH, UR A CHAMP! Terry from Austalia.
Appreciate the advice Dave ! The last months I've been looking at MT07 videos, articles, etc and biggest flaw I found with the bike was the suspension, but your solution is super easy.
I finally managed to reserve a new MT07 year 2021, although the supply for Yamaha in Romania was really bad this year.
I'll have 3 years warranty for it. Do you think the dealer will accept making the 15mm cut to the spacer ? Is this something they would normally do ? I'm 171cm and 65kg. On one hand I wouldn't want to lose the warranty but on the other hand safety is even more important. Cheers !
There is no issue with warranty if you change spacer length and oil. This has been proven many times by owners that have made changes to the forks. Changing the rear shock to a different one does not invalidate warranty either. The main concern of warranty is engine and electronics. You might ask a different brand dealership what would invalidate a warranty on say a Ninja 650.
hey dave just picked up a fz07 18k miles, does the shortening the fork spacer still apply to me, im 250lbs.
also what front/rear cold psi do you recommend for cobb mtn, lake co, sonoma twistys? bike just has sportmax gpr300's at the moment, nothing special.
ill put in 20-30 weight fork oil also.
working on buying a shock... probably k-tech or ohlins.
Congrats - will be back in Cobb next week for a couple of days. If you are over 200lbs, 20w and 400cc. No on spacer trim due to your weight and yes to geometry change.
@CatalystReactionSBW thank you! I will stop next time I see your van around!
I set psi to 29f / 30r for now.
Confusing mix of pounds and millimeters. 🙃 I really didnt know anyone mixed metric and that other crazy system.. 😄
Canadians and brits do this all the time.
@@truantray So do Americans. It's not like we don't work on our Japanese bikes! Cheers, cousin from across the pond. I'm dreaming of the day I can afford to get over there and attend the IOMTT!! P[>
It's very simple, 20 weight oil is thinner than 30 weight oil you get the picture the millimeters don't have anything to do with the oil per say as to what he's doing to the front by cutting cutting off what he was talking about
Metric is for authoritarians.
This video is so perfect 4k and Dave is so on it. The doctor is in!
He's a motorcycle scientist, and you can tell how well he knows his shit by how easily he is understood
Hi Dave, We as motorcyclists should appreciate the expert knowledge that you share with us non-experts. Thank you for adding value. I just picked up an Fz-07 today and it has no static sag. I'm about 185-190lbs with gear. I will try the 15w oil swap and the 10mm spacer reduction, unless you suggest otherwise. Do you see much value in progressive springs in addition to the prior mods or just stick to the stock ones? Thanks in advance sir!
Thank you for the kind words and congrats on the FZ07! Given your weight a 7mm reduction will be more appropriate for the spacer. Linear or progressive wind springs will work but test the OEM springs for travel used prior to acquiring new springs based on marking fork bottom out: ua-cam.com/video/eds3dn1LBkw/v-deo.html
@@catalystreactionsbw Thank you Sir!
Awesome tips! I was wondering about changing the oil viscosity on my forks,... now I know:)
This video is about to pop off, it's being shared around Fz07 groups, Thakns for the content
I hope people take on the challenge, trim the spacer and find the right weight oil for themselves - then and most importantly, they share what they did and the positive effects it had for them. Doing that helps me save lives by riders sharing positive experiences!
@@catalystreactionsbw If it's anything like when I swapped my rear suspension for a used Bitubo shock with rebound/pre I can't wait to finally feel what this bike was supposed to feel like all along...
@@Chad-bq7vw That's the positive change you will feel with the right oil viscosity and height. trim the spacer and it will be a positive change again. If needed, select the right springs.
5:51 I need your bike in my life!! 😍😍😍
Dave I just got my 18 year old son a new mt 125cc he's 200 Ibs anything I need to get adjusted to suit his weight .
Great videos
Here's the one video you will need to get the process started Roy. ua-cam.com/video/0kCGoDjtnM4/v-deo.html. Once you have gone through this, keep an eye on fork and shock travel used and experiment with cold pressures of 36/36, 38/38 and 40/40 cold front and rear, on pressure per week.
@@catalystreactionsbw thanx dave very kind of you to reply.
That's my kind of torque wrench, 2 and a half grunts.
I like this Guy, he's so into what he does that he could've told me anything and I would've believed it.
After years of doing accident investigations on all sorts of vehicles, I find that I and most others give almost any company way too much credit. They do far less actual engineering and testing for things than you could ever imagine.
I have a Tracer 7 and it has adjustable forks but wonder if shorter spacers and thicker oil would improve the ride..Big Love from Sunny England..✌️
For your Tracer, thicker oil at 10w or 15w might help based on weight, speed and load. Spacer will remain stock.
@@catalystreactionsbw thank you so much for your reply..I'll try that..much appreciated..You The Man..!! ✌️
Explains why the MT really doesn’t want to turn on power
Correct!
Dave Williams, editor, replying here watch. And here's video proof at 5:15 ua-cam.com/video/Dglu0Wsf80k/v-deo.html
Thank you very much for sharing your knowledge.
I have a 2017 Tracer 700.
For some reason I don't have much confidence in the front suspension...
Given that the platform is the MT-07, are the suspensions similar?
I am 95kg, 184cm, should I reduce the saucer by 10mm and raise the forks 8mm?
Thank you in advance
Depending on your weight, 15w to 20w oil and yes to spacer and geometry if you are less than 170lbs or 77kgs
@@catalystreactionsbw
Haven't gotten the oil yet but changed spacers to 140mm and it's already a new bike. It's awesome. Thank you for the tip
@@tiagoduarte7579 Thank you for sharing the your experience and benefits so far!
This should be a recall!!
How dare you confuse us with science and engineering. Great explanation of cause and remedy!