Contact Patch: Recommended Motorcycle Tire Pressures are Wrong
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- Опубліковано 5 лют 2025
- www.DaveMossTuning.com
42 psi rear and 36 psi front have been the recommended tire pressures for every motorcycle tire brand and model since the dawn of time. You'll find 42/36 on every motorcycle at every dealership in the United States if not the world. Welcome to the 21st Century where you can determine your own tire pressures.
www.DaveMossTuning.com
I've been filling my tires with helium for years. The weight of the bike drops dramatically because of this, which reduces the need for higher pressures. An extra plus is when you hit a speed bump at 70 MPH, the landing is delayed by several minutes.
Lmao. That's gold.
I thought you were serious for a minute, but no one could possibly think that
🎈😂
"test protocol" let's get serious about tyre pressure😅😂
LOL
When is Dave going to NOT tell me about how i've been doing something wrong my entire riding career! Best bike content on youtube!
when you realise that most od this is irrlelvant unless you are either hunting for the best performance, wether if its time of cost.
So many factors play a role where the calculated pressure will tople over when one thing is not right.
Tirepressure rises the hotter the wheels get, this is dependant on how hot the road is (maybe it's even raining). And different surfaces in different times of the day heat up at different speeds, there could also be trees casting shade on the ground. You don't have to consider all this when you're going to meet up some friends on your bike
@@Daniel-dj7fh the point was spec pressure on swingarm is not always correct. I can confirm on my bike atleast. 25 psi is written for front which makes the tyre be easily pressed by foot and engine braking is so high in first two gears. I live where I always encounter stop and go traffic and 28psi does better job, ofcourse when the tyre is cold.
@@Daniel-dj7fh I have plenty of personal experience saying that if you ride 36/42 in cold weather you will crash, especially if you have to make evasive maneuvers (turning braking) or like to take turns nearer the speed limit than half of it. I ride 28 psi in cold weather, 32 in cool, 35 in warm and 42/38 in hot. And I get better traction on hot days than the cold days, no matter what the psi.
@@MultiPleaser what do u ride mate???
@@annabanna666 YZF600r, cbr600f1, fzr400, kz650. They all had the same problem in the cold.
Dave used to literally brush/lean on me as he passed during a race (i was in a different class). It was a dangerous situation that he made the LEAST dangerous as possible, hell he was trying to win his race (which he does…a lot). Dave has been a friend, a teacher, a fellow bike nerd, racer, true dude…and he still amazes me on his insight, straight talk, and transparency on the fundamentals and nuances of riding…he should be employed by a MotoGP or equiv team…but hes too cool for that…I owe you dinner at Casa Ramos, Dave…you one of my favorites…
Thanks Jordan. Really appreciate you taking the time to create a testimonial on me as a person, friend, fellow racer and mentor. Thank you ! You and family are missed at the track for sure.
I learned a lot about tires today.
99 percent of bike shops, don't event tune your suspension for the riders weight and riding.... Let alone have insight on tire pressure like you. I wish i could be on the west coast.... Thank you for educating us.
Always able to help via email or 1-1 video using my Remote Tuning service. If you would like to review this please email me dave@davemosstuning.com
If you deflate your tire too much, you loose your pressure point in the center of the contact patch, because the tire deforms to where only the outer edge of the contact patch, applies enough pressure. Also, an underinflated tire creates high temperatures due to internal friction, that can delaminate your street tires under high speeds. Race compound tires are soft enough and plyable and behave differently, preventing delamination.
Race tyres are hard …
Thanks for putting Celsius temps.
Ikr
? not hard to convert haha
There are many conversion calculators online. You can just do a quick conversion, instead of complaining on here.
@@fgjf1079 complain?
Not a conplain ddmc
As with many things in life, it's a pleasure to listen to someone who has thought things through and is happy to share their conclusions. Wisdom from experience.
When time, and life's distractions, allow I thoroughly enjoy learning from you. Thanks.
Wow, thank you
So it's simply what feels good. 😆
This is a great sentiment and I thoroughly agree. Well done Dave.
When I’m done testing and already figured out what tire pressure I need, it’s time for a new tire and the climate has changed and the cycle of tests continue
That's when your riding becomes better, and you become more confident with what your tires are doing. Also it helps you keep your focus on the road and your riding, makes you more aware of your environment and hopefully help you avoid becoming a statistic ... when you are riding confidently, you enjoy the ride.
Ps.: not talking at you. Just sharing my opinion.
Ride safe, enjoy!
Sounds like you need to get out and ride more often.
It was summer when I started testing, it was winter before I finished.
Keep a log book of the data you collected, then you have a head start on your starting point….
😂
Please someone forward this to the dealers who religiously return the pressures to 'factory' at each service. I now take a gauge with me and adjust them at the dealers before I leave. As examples, my Royal Enfield the pressures needed to be raised 8 psi front and rear, a 30% change to get the most predictable handling, whereas my Honda Rebel needed a 3 psi drop front and rear to give reasonable comfort and stop the bike skipping from bump to bump. Daves' videos are so informative and justify things that I have been doing 'seat of the pants' for years without real understanding.
I cannot think of any other 1 person who is THIS thoroughly knowledgeable + this intricate on as many aspects of a motorcycle as Dave! We are blessed with tires + Dave!! Thank You for all you do Dave!! To be faster + SAFER is a royal gem in my book, not found often!! YOU ARE APPRECIATED!
I am always humbled by riders that take DMT content to heart and step up to make a difference with their motorcycle. Thank you for watching and using the content to good effect!
Providing a converted value of Farenheit to Celcius is beyond commendable.
I'd give 5 stars but he didn't convert "tire" to "tyre"
Easy ((°F - 32) x 5) / 9 = °C ex. ((70°F - 32) x 5) / 9 = 21°C
dammit...... next time
@@BangFarang1 "easy"
@@BangFarang1 Even more simple for a "close enough" estimate:
F to C: subtract 30 and divide by two.
C to F: double and add thirty.
Dave, you are a motorcycle nerd, and I mean that with the highest regard. You've forgotten more motorcycle related information than most motorcyclists will EVER know. Thanks for the reminder as the temps climb. I'm off to check my pressures!
i know a backhanded compliment when i see one 😂
Dave, the clarity and outright simplicity you manage to make your tutorials is testament to your skill as a mechanic and as a teacher! 👍🏻
I don’t think this was clear from the start. Why when all manufacturers spend time and money on testing to find the ideal compromise pressures, and the front is always less than the rear, has Dave Moss used equal pressures front and rear? The rest of the information is based on this anomaly and is like a house built without proper foundations. I would prefer to rely on the manufacturer’s settings as a baseline, not these rather arbitrary figures presented here.
@@markpearce5793 Seconded.
Dave, tested and experimented as you recommended, absolutely very fast and accurate protocol to understand tyre pressure influence on speed, handling and performance, thanks for sharing.
I really wanted to see a comparison between an actual test conclusion and the manufacturer's recommended pressure, it would be really funny if they are the same
I'm watching these videos because of the exquisite work ethics. Thanking customers for working with you... Mind blowing.
Another thing to consider is if you are going to be riding in an area with a different altitude. It can change the pressure considerably. We have learned this from riding atv's in the winter when we drop pressure to keep on top of the snow, but as we go up in altitude we have to drop the pressure again.
That is true - thank for being diligent!
The best things one can do for their bike are getting the suspension tuned, and having proper tires and pressure. Both will differ greatly depending on the variables you listed
I brought an old bike (new to me) to a track day and it felt really bad. A guy was there doing suspension tuning for $70. Unreal difference before and after. Suddenly the bike felt stable after tip-in on slow turns, held lines properly on fast turns/sweepers, and acted much more predictably. $70 did more for that bike than any performance upgrade I can imagine except maybe fresh high-end brake pads or better tires.
Thank you the guys and I riden in the TN/Nc mountins and I run 37/36. I tell all may friend to drop the tire pressure and they tell me it's the best ride they had had in the mountains.
Thanks for sharing your experience and results!
Sir, I pride myself for always looking at things from a different angle, relative to the presentation and motivations behind it. You Sir, have just blown my mind. After decades of driving, understanding the advantages and/or hype of nitrogen, how my truck tires loose are from summer to winter…but never once applied those principles to my bike, not to mention elevation. This is simply an invaluable lesson.
Fat Boy 114
Subscribed
I sincerely appreciate you being aware and thinking critically. Thank you for the kind words and enjoying all the content there is on this channel!
Thanks Dave. Excellent video. I usually run +2 psi from recommended pressures. Works for me for many years now.
Bang on!
Dave Sir you are a pure genius in my book!!👍🏻 I was running 28/30 at Brands on monday and the wear was superb, with lots of grip. Thank you
28 rear front 30 ?
@@Pesting_Yawafront tire is always lower on motorcycle to help with steering. Prevents slip
@@NB-ir1meit prevents slip😂😂😂
I’ve never heard Dave say anything stupid, absolute pro 👍🏼
I won’t be repeating the 40 minute rides on the same road but I understand your point. Good to see someone going into detail that is largely overlooked
Very informative. I have been riding for nigh on 40 yrs and no one has made as much sense as you - Thank you. Also, I would add that you should feel or listen to the bike. I had a Kawa 1400 that used to tell me if my pressure was wrong - if the front was low, she would try and go straight in the corner and you'd have to force her to turn (scary when you pick up a puncture and tip her in at 150kmh only for her to fight back) and if the back was low, she would try and lie down in the corner and you'd have to pick her back up.
32 front 36 rear has always been my go-to. On my last three motorcycles. Even different weights.
That is what Kawasaki recommends for the W650...its no sports-bike though .
Glad to witness someone actually getting down to proper analysis. A few things to consider. Load rating is super important. It also can be used to calculate a new starting point with a tire other than stock size and load. If you get a tire with a higher load rating, you must lower your starting point to inversely proportionate pressure. Ask me how I know.
I typically double the turn speed postings.
MEANWHILE YOUR WIFE'S LOAD RATING IS 100 DUDES... PER HOUR
11:52 - I think a lot of people miss this part. It seems like the common understanding is "higher pressure=touring, lower pressure=performance" but I find that for tight winding curves, I like a higher pressure because of the added steering response and agility, and I don't need the added grip because I don't ride at the limit on public roads with blind curves.
Yes! Has a 290 lb rider. The lower pressures are a joke. Sure I burn them out quicker. But the improve handling massively
@@dsiz9421 hit the gym. Ul feel better on bike
@pmacc3557 what's the gym got to do with anything? If you want to lose weight you just eat less, you can't out exercise a bad diet.
It's not only about weight, also has to do with stamina and physical strength to be responsive, specially in long journeys
I think you miss the point here. Listen to Dave he is a genius. In the twisties you want a bigger contact patch for grip so you don't crash. It's much safer.
I'm currently at 39/40 Cold and 40/43 Hot, Leisure/Slow rider and commuter, heavy bike & rider, Southern USA, sadly only a few twisties. Everything feels fine to me, but I will be performing the test soon to see if I can even detect a difference in a few PSI. Thanks Dave Moss Tuning
Well stated. I've been riding since 1975. Another parameter to include is tire temperature. When checking your tire pressure, also check the temperature. You can use a simple Harbor Freight digital Laser thermometer. excessive heat causes tire failure.
An outstanding video Dave. I was fortunate to attend one of your suspension clinics in NZ when we rode a route in the Waikato and constantly tweaked the bike. That was an unbelievable revelation and much gratitude for your time and patience. Best regards, Geoff James
Thank you for being open to some new information and leveraging the opportunity Geoff. Really appreciate it.
My pleasure Dave. I'll give your video a plug in our next IAM newsletter. I did so on my blog after your suspension clinic: geoffjames.blogspot.com/2018/03/a-most-excellent-week.html .
It rains so much here in Ireland my tyres get rusty.
Get some tires with softer compound and thread pattern that can dissipate water efficiently.
Buy a rear mudguard to avoid getting a rusty craic.
LOL!!! Thanks
Even at age 5Seven I Still ask Why???
Lubricate you tires regularly, or you could opt for an oil dripper just under the water fender (if there are newbees out there, that's a JOKE ! Don't do that for God's sake !)
I also ride a Onewheel E board which uses a go-kart tire. It’s amazing what one or two pounds of pressure does to the handling on that thing. A good tool to feel the relevance of tire pressure especially with no suspension.
My baby is a Honda ST1300, my weight around 208 pounds 94 kg, my average speed is 60 miles / 96 km and on the highway 80 miles / 128 km tires Bridgestone Battlax slides perfect with 42/42. I bought a compressor, I live in Florida, and in winter and fall the tires hit 38 pounds when there are cold nights. Excellent explanations, thumb up. Thanks Dave
Thank you for your diligence and sharing the data you have acquired!
I just got a new Goldwing about a year ago. Tire pressure is always something that is discussed (sometimes heatedly with some), and no one ever has a good answer. People are too busy listening to respond rather than listening to hear. So, I searched YooToob and found your channel. This one video has trumped every other thing I've heard, and it makes perfect sense. I'm excited to test my tires now and see where that sweet spot is for my riding style! Thanks for an OUTSTANDING video.
Thank you for your kind words and leveraging the content. Please share your new pressures that you acquired via testing.
It sounds like before I will find out my ideal pressure I will already wear out the tires. Great video though !
Ride to your known road, start with high cold pressures and reduce hot pressures in 2psi increment over a 4 miles section. 30 minutes tops and you are done.
Then buy the same set and now you know. You're acting like riding is a chore...if it's a chore then you should probably just bang on with your car
@Dave moss tuning I did notice that you didn't discuss differences between front and rear and the effect of changing one independently of the other, or did I miss that? Apologies if so. Informative though, thanks.
Every time I have a "debatable" question my notification comes on with Dave Moss explaining that exact thing! Thank you!
Because they are always listening.. happens to me too
Proof positive huh.....
Dave. I've been waiting for this video for 11 years! Thank you. Keep producing great content. Your assisting generations within the riding community.
Dude, if you didn't know this for the last ten years then you are one sad mofo!
Long story short I ran the recommended pressures for years and I ended up dropping the front and rear by 2psi and it smoothed the whole bike out. If there is any additional tire wear I don't really see any. I weigh 160 so going down on the pressure makes sense. Great video.
Wow, I'm digging the all bunch of information about motorcycles , maintenance and how to ride , for the last 8 months. You are the best man that I have ever watched and listen.! Bravo sir. Thank you
I appreciate your kind thoughts and support! Thank you.
One critical factor that needs to be added in the calculation is air volume. Tire and rim width is a major factor in determining tire pressure as well. More air volume will need less pressure than on a narrower rims/tires--just like bicycle tires.
On my '22 Yamaha Tracer 7 I should add 36psi on the rear and 33psi on the front, following the manual that is, need some explanation here please 😊
For those with on-the-fly adjustable suspension systems with different ride modes you may wish to consider establishing a baseline of tire pressure settings for each of the different suspension settings/ride modes. A tire pressure that feels good on my S1000XR in Dynamic ride mode set for two-up riding with luggage is very different than Road mode with one rider no luggage. All other variables Dave mentioned apply. Keep the shiny side up my friends.
One time when I pumped up the tires according to the manual (Hayabusa. Both tyres at 2.9 bar) - I got a wheel drift at the first intersection. Now I always pump within closer to the track values on the hot - 2,1-2,2 bar. Tires hold the road much better.
I have a similar bike (BKing) and if I dont have at least 2.4 in my rear I start to pump like crazy at hard accel out of the curve.Guess you aint riding it to the limit?I take a controlled side over a stop and go pumping anytime.
Did you set the suspension up especially with rebound damping? That might be the cause vs tire pressure and sidewall flex?
@@catalystreactionsbw Yes its clearly getting the grip then flexes then loosing it then getting it again.With more pressure its slides controllably def not a suspension issue.I do have a 240 on tho.
Thank you, useful
SoCal, 40 psi on a 180 rear tire on my Multi Enduro 1200, loaded paniers at 85 mph. I ride it every day and I’m 6’2” 220. I got 11,000 miles off my last set I just replaced. Still life left on Rear. Great vid. Love to meet you.
I'm getting back on a motorcycle for the first time in eighteen years. Yes, I'm going to suck up as much new information as I can because I don't want to ride the way I used to. I want to be a better and safer rider today. I'm glad I found this channel and subscribed immediately. Thanks for such specific information.
Thanks for subscribing Warren. I am sure you will find some great basic information here on sag, compression and rebound along with tyre pressures to get you started.
Also worth noting that your tire pressure will very much affect how much your tires heat up. Lower pressure = more heat (because more deflection).
I read about on advrider some time ago history of one guy who burned hes rear knobby tire by going very fast on highway - it started smoking, melting and separating thread layer - thats not entirely related to his pressure (more just because he went way too fast for too long on knobby tire) but still worth mentioning ;
By the time you've figured out what pressure you want, I've arrived at destination.
this is for people riding twisties, not for people like you speeding on a straight line and thinking thats biking
Cringe. Honey, they're both biking.
Go to a drag strip and tell everyone they're not riding bikes, you might get back to your car fast enough to avoid a slap for being a 💩 for 🧠s
I have been suffering on this issue for a long time by following the only recommended tire pressure on the sticker of the motorcycle without considering the weight of the rider and other factors. It's like... you have busted a myth for me. Now I can focus on the experimentation for the sweet spot. Thank you so so much. You have my gratitude.
One would have tought that those tire recommended pressures were all estimated on an standardized set of conditions... good information there. Thanks Dave!
Thanks 👍
@@catalystreactionsbwno
been avid biker >50 years and have ALWAYS filled my tires to full max capacity listed on the sidewalls. Now am gonna try your scientific method. Thanks
Enjoy the testing and take notes. Make sure you factor in carcass as well to understand why some tyres have a profound difference when others do not (soft vs hard).
In Last 40 years,
No one ever said this to Me in this Detail, Hope they teach all d Kids in School it'll be a Service to Mankind...
I'd take a class if he'd do the lectures!!
Planning a tour of the US once C19 regs loosen up.
@@tbillyjoeroth Absolutely I shall be there...
@@catalystreactionsbw that 'll be Lovely...
Thank you for a clear explanation. Fantastic. I have been testing different pressures, at different seasons. I agree it changes. Someday with the wrong pressure it doesn't feel right. Some this is my skill level too
My '18 Yamaha Tracer lists two sets of tire pressures - one for lighter loads (33F/36R) and one for heavier loads over 200 lbs (the universal 36/42)
Dave Is one of the most indirectly funny people, mean that in the best of ways. Wealth of knowledge folks. He knows mo re than most
I took your advice a year ago with the tires i put on my Yamaha FJR. I got 9,760 miles out of those tires and am running them at 42/42. I could have pro'ly squeezed out another 240 miles to hit that magical 10k mark, but the front tire showed the most wear and there's no sense in pushing it unsafely. I live in Texas and the summer temperatures can exceed your example, but you've given me a much better understanding of the dynamics. Thank you for sharing your knowledge and insight! I reviewed this video for a refresher. Next, a better understanding on improving the suspension will help me tho I'm very comfortable on my bike. There's always room for improvement, in my mind.
Thank you very much for sharing your experience and helping others realize a little work can pay some huge dividends!
At 42 PSI, the bike rides so hard over small ripply bumps it might as well be a cement truck. Ride quality enters into the grip vs. longevity equation also.
Yeah I’ve never filled my past 36 42 seems so incredibly high to me 😂
@@alexduey7868 Really heavy bikes with squishy suspension can run 39 front, 42 rear, but those are special cases. Lower pressures on heavy bikes cause the front tire especially to cup. I have a Super Tenere which qualifies as heavy and squishy, it never sees more than a dirt road and I actually do run 39 front and 42 rear on that whale 😆
@@alexduey7868 I have a GSX-S750 and those are the Factory recommended for that bike. But would not run it otherwise. I always do factory recommended. I'm 175lbs
@spartanx169x I've always run 36f/42r on my bikes, had plenty of different litre bikes and 600 supersports. Just recently though, after getting a k6 gixxer 1000, I ran 36/42 and the bike felt so twitchy and unstable, especially when I had it leaned over, it just didn't feel right, not like my previous s1000rr or 09 cbr1000. Decided to try 36/36 on it and it felt so much better even though they recommend 36/42 on the swing arm. Tyres are metzeller m9rr which are the same tyres I ran on my s1000rr. That's what I found worked for me anyway, although 36/42 was OK for one bike it definitely didn't feel good on another. It could definitely come to different riding styles or different bike attributes, I think it's always a good idea to try and see what you like or what the bike likes
It's great to find some one who understands tires and tire pressures. In the late 70's my first job was working in automotive garage, the owner of the first garage I worked for explained to me about the label for tire pressures. The label for tire pressures on all vehicles are written when the vehicle is first tested when it's was made. it is made for comfort and fuel economy and maybe a little safety I sometimes question that. There for the size make model of the tire stated on the label only and for driving in the same test conditions when the label was made. Unless the tires on the vehicle are from the same lot, day, and production line the tire will be different than what they made the label for. Always start with the pressures listed on the tire your using first and go from there with intention to weight always. Great video I hope people learn from this great job.
I'm finding out that there's more to riding and owning a motorcycle than swinging my leg over the saddle and turning the key
Hence my Trademark: Feed your brain, love your bike more!
@@catalystreactionsbw How much higher psi should I ride if I want the bike to be flicable? I have a "17 cbr 1000rr
@UCmWWXzwZZB_-wbsbNUhz4zA depends on the carcass: ua-cam.com/video/72WnOGxX1Mw/v-deo.html
Dave, why is the front tyre pressure the same as the rear? Or do you drop this but just didn’t mention it.
Only if you don’t own a Honda then if you do you can just throw your leg over and ride all you want and not break just do maintenance, tires, and your good! I would rather own a used Honda then a new harley and I love Harley’s but I love riding and money more two things which you have to give up to own a harley 😂
I live in Canada Ottawa so of course I can tell you that whatever pressure says on the tire does not work in most cases. here we have all kids of different temperature especially during biking season say, from late April to kind of the end of October. Thanks once again for your video
Refreshing to listen to someone who actually knows what he is talking about - nice work!!
thank you Dave! This video and your MT-07 fix video made me love the bike again! The suspension was terrible for the longest time and I live in a very hot area so after making the correct adjustments it corners like a dream! Way less break dive too!
Thank you for that information, gave me a really nice idea how to manage my tire pressure under different riding conditions and circumstances. Greetings from Germany 🇩🇪
Great video Dave. Regardless of the type of motorcycle I’m riding (sport or adventure typically), I enjoy a softer front pressure (for feedback and grip) and harder rear pressure (to handle fast cornering and durability). I usually go through two rears to one front - regardless of tire type and bike.
Finally a sensible video on tire pressure. This 100% applies to cars as well
I'm gonna have to take a notepad with me to my track days and actually start recording how different pressures for the temp and pace affect how the bike handles etc.
You are an abundance of wisdom Mr Moss.
If you do that, you will save $$ hundreds and optimize grip AND longevity. Well worth it for next season as then you have your reference points for those tires for the future!
@@catalystreactionsbw What are your thoughts on the Bridgestone R11's for a 600cc? Tyre life versus traction levels etc and can they be used without a set of warmers?
@@KR4Z3D666 modern track tires have much the same grip levels - set up is critical to get the maximum out of them, as are tire warmers. You would need 2-3 laps to warm then up outside of Summer.
I’m gonna have to watch that a few times to figure it out.
Not that hard though
Thank you for sharing your knowledge I've watched so many of your videos and I feel like a better and more confident rider , mechanic, etc already telling my friends to also check out two clicks out Dave is phenomenal
Thank you for wanting to learn more and elevate the experiences with your motorcycle to a higher level! I sincerely appreciate you paying it forward.
@LastRaven Thanks for the correction. Considering our community guidelines its not the response i wanted to send. "Get it right" ok hotshot you can fly away now raven.🇺🇸
@LastRaven sounds to me like 'bimmer' is what folk in the USA would say, whereas 'beemer' would be more of a UK-based nickname for a BMW. Anyone correct me on this if I'm mistaken please - I'm not a native English speaker. 😇
This fellow knows exactly how to evaluate tires. I am relatively expert on tires and the factors he covers are spot on. I would add that direct tire temp measurement is extremely useful in determining response to these variables.
Great advice. Combination of Physics , Comfort , Safety , and Common Sense.
Thank you!
Great video.Easy to follow and understand for those of us that can't fix a Sammich was presented so I'd understand and be able to try this without asking or paying someone for help.Before anyone dumps on me we all have our strengths and weakness.Nothing wrong with knowing you've got plenty to learn
Over complication for 90% of riders. Set the PSI to tire manufacturer recommendation. If you want/need better cornering...lower the pressure 1 or 2 PSI. If you're going to be riding upright over a long distance...put 1 or 2 PSI extra in the tire. A harder tire rolls more easily and a softer tire grips the road better.
🤦
over complicated for you maybe
Maybe so, but Dave's channel is about the technical details of motorcycle handling. I doubt a noob rider will spend much time here, but for those of us with a higher level of riding experience it's very interesting. 😎
You think this is over complicated?? Maybe you're acting like a noob..
You obviously didn't listen to what he said. For example, when riding aggressively I take turns twice the speed of the posted speed limit. That puts much more force and compression on the tire. If I listened to you my tire would compress even worse. It's more complex than less air more grip.
Thank you for sharing your knowledge good sir.
I reckon Dave has ridden the Old Pacific Hwy out of Sydney.
I SO appreciate your no-nonsense approach. Every mistake you mention in all your videos pertain to me. Im an idiot. But, I am learning. Thanks to you. Anyway, thank you Sir. Kevin, Idaho.
Thank you very much.We all start at the beginning so i try to keep that in mind when I create content.
What this guy does'nt know about bikes is not worth knowing....1 of the best in my opinion 👍👏
Gratefully appreciate your comment.
Amazing mate, wish you were in Australia
That’s Right
Me too
Thanks for making the questions for us. Every one of your clips make me think more about my riding and tweaking my bike. Fun fact: I come from an agricultural background. No tractor is delivered with fixed tire pressures. They usually recommend a table based on tire dimensions and specific loads and speeds, or you get those tables from the tire manufacturers. That´s because tire pressure is very important for optimal grip. Do you think it is the same for bikes? 😉
Also, I love the way you explain how to find your own comfort zone. Top content! 👌
It would be even more relevant for a motorcycle 😒
Very much so as we all ride differently based on experience, knowledge and speed/enjoyment factor.
So I ended up back here again. YT made me look, and I still find the topic intriguing. Now, I am a bit older, and I´ve been riding a bit more - so now I have some new thoughts for y´all... However, I would not diminish Dave´s work, because he is obviously right in everything he teaches. The only thing I would comment, is that 99% of us have little use of this talk about tire pressure. Most of us would be better off paying attention to his suspension classes though, because most of our sins lie there.
Now, I was going to make this all about tire pressures, but I had some other thoughts. Dave, as a racing mechanic of course knows every tiny comma there is to know about the subject. I Strongly recommend setting your bike up according to his elaborate instructions over IDK how many videos, there are literally tons of them. Choose either one. However, having done that - tire pressure is just the Icing on the cake.
Dave needs to know, because of the races. You and I don´t, because we ride in different conditions every week. The main thing for us, is to know how our bikes handles, and adjust our ride accordingly. We don´t have a racing team to tweak every bit of the bike, or the precise measurements of tire-, asphalt, and air temperature for every single ride. What we need to do is find the middle ground which fits the majority of our rides the best, and go with that. Then we ride well within our limits, and feel a lot better about it, because we got all these great tips from Dave that made our bike fit our needs better.
To sum it up, if you want the best experience from your ride, which is what I personally aim for; Set up your bike ergonomically, then trim your suspension. If you then find your tires lacking, try out these tips. And I think this is always true. A bike that does not fit you ergonomically, will always put you off your end goal, whether it is a smooth ride, or the fastest lap time.
The suspension is the most important for a smooth ride across difficult roads, and even more important if you want good lap times. But don´t think it doesn´t matter at slower speeds too. Your weight is a huge factor in this, considering the relatively low weight of the bike itself. Finally, you can tweak tire pressuse as you want, either for longevity or to maximise grip. Higher pressures (up to a point) increases longevity, while lower pressures increases grip (also to a point). You should never just "drop half a bar" on a track day just because someone else said so. Your tire might warm up faster or slower - you might be heavier or lighter, and the tire compound might vary a lot from your friend´s, so test it out slowly. Get to know your limitations, then vary one thing at a time. Change your preload a bit, ride 3 laps. Change tire pressure front, ride another 3 - and so on...
Great video. I have always been suspicious about these sorts of blanket recommendations in manuals or on machines. My bike recommends 36/36 with one rider and 36/41with a pillion passenger. I always ride solo but am quite heavy at 85 kilos so ride 36/38 (UK spring, summer autumn). That seems to be a reasonable all weather compromise for tourer type riding.
85kg is not "quite heavy". I'm 160
Some of the best content on tuning there is. Notice how he explains things which is the mark of someone who knows something and not just another MEETOO video. Dave Moss is a true gift to motorcycling and from his videos you can actually accomplish things you have shied away from or thought was too complicated. The gift he gives you is more enjoyment in motorcycling. When Dave Moss says something, pay attention because he didn't pull it out of his rear end unblike all the endless copy paste videos.
Thank you for the compliment. trying to help as many riders as possible have a great handling bike that will perform well in a crisis to improve the end result and avoid an accident.
That should be explained when taking motorcycle driving class !!!! Great Job!!!!
Very interesting video. I’ve been using a mix of 78% Nitrogen, 21% Oxygen and 1% Argon for years. This I’ve found to be the optimal mix for my style of riding. I use a temperature of 15 Deg C and a ambient pressure 1225g per m3 @ 1013.5 millibars as my base standard. Hotter days I increase pressure, lower days I reduce. I find that 1psi reduction per 2 deg c increase from my base standard works. Temperature and tyre pressure are inversely proportional. 42.4 % of statistics are made up, so I tend to freestyle my pressures to suit my requirements, as stated by Dave. Stay upright guys, it’s a jungle out there!
Thats is exactly what I do .
thank you for the information !
now i'm wondering when you should start trying to adjust the rear and the front differently from each other? i mean if you start with 42/42 for example...
Heavy bikes, higher pressures. Watch this video to give you a little more background: ua-cam.com/video/72WnOGxX1Mw/v-deo.html
@@catalystreactionsbw Watched the vid...it does not address tire pressure at all nor the difference between front & rear tire pressure??!!
Better check your link Dave....
B Barnett front tire needs to squat n spread under breaking and due to size a lower tire pressure compensates for smaller contact patch vs a rear
"Climate" implies change over too long a term or area to consider in relation to tire pressure. Tire pressure is tire pressure no matter whether you live in a temperate or tropical climate. 30 PSI in the Alaska is the same as 30 PSI in Hawaii; it just takes a different mass of air constrained to the same volume of space (tire) to achieve that 30 PSI at different temperatures. But we don't really care about mass of air or volume of tire. What matters is the temperature differential (of the air in the tire) between the time you measure / adjust the pressure and that which occurs during the duration of your riding. I think we can eliminate "climate" temperature as a tire pressure factor. Unless of course for example you air up your tires in Hawaii and then transport you bike to Alaska... then you will have to increase the mass of air constrained in the tire to achieve the same PSI, in Hawaii. I run about 27.5 PSI rear and 29 PSI front in my Pirelli Diablo Supercorsa's no matter the climate.
Thanks for saying that. Some people like to skew statistics and mess shit up..
.. nice bike by the way 😀
You are funny. Look into this again. What you said and what he said are very different things. Dude you are kindergarten wrong. It's funny.
My tired test show different results for different bikes. 29psi front is to low on my Aprilla has the front slides with pirelli diablo corsa tiers .
But 32 is fine, the BMW likes it above that 38 psi in the front less it slides.
You are right about pressure is a consistent no matter what temperature it is. However, One thing you missed is: the physical properties of rubber changes dramatically based on temperature, a tire with 27.5 PSI will deform and grip differently under the same force (cornering speed) but different temp. The point of adjusting tire pressure according to temperature is to compensate this physical change introduced by temp delta and achieve consistent tire performance.
Totally agree. As the tire warm up due to flexing the pressure goes up. At that point you may need to lower pressure. That is impractical therefore we have a range. The pressure needs to be within the range when you start and when you finish the ride. Working on aircraft that just landed the tire pressure was about 30-40 psi higher than nominal (190 psi). One had to wait at least four hours before checking tire pressure. Also working in Miami we always had to lower the pressure as it was too high if the tire was serviced in the winter in northern climate. Also some tires are sensitive to pressure where a few psi makes a drastic change in grip. Case in point was a Michelin on the track. I could feel a 2 psi change in grip. Stoped using them due to that as the tire was too soft at the beginning and greasy at the end of a track session.
4 years later, still the best information available on the topic.
42/36PSI (2,9/2,5BAR) recommended for every bike ever? I ride a 2015 Yamaha FJR1300, big heavy sports tourer, this exact pressure is stamped on the bike.
My situation is that I drive daily at speed limits in city traffic, but when I go to rallies I load it up with all the luggage and weigh it down even more, then I drive much harder over long hauls with tons of corners ranging from sweeping turns to shorter/tighter corners flicking back and forth.
Just ordered new tires as the ones that came with the bike ended up badly cupped after this years first rally, front is literally undriveable at over 80 km/h (50 m/h or so).
Given that my front had the same tire pressure as a bike+rider weighing almost half as much again I shouldn't be surprised.
Putting Dunlop Roadsmart 4GT on next week, I'll do this exact testing and start at 42/42 baseline.
Bike+rider should be approx 50kg heavier than Dave's exambple, but I live in Northern Norway, climate is much colder and should average at 15-25 degrees Celsius (59-77F).
I'll also do a separate benchmark for when the bike is fully laden.
Additionally, I've order a new Wilbers shock for the rear that's fully adjustable, and new progressive springs for the front, I'll need new settings for that as well in different scenarios.
So happy I've found Dave's channel and website, subscribed both here and on the website and will most likely contact Dave for remote tuning once I got my new suspension, can't think of anyone I'd trust more to guide me :D
I would guess he is talking for track purposes. I weigh 175lbs 5 ft9 and always run manufacturer recommend pressures and every one of my bikes(I've 15 bikes now) perform flawlessly ON THE STREET. Him nor anybody else can convince me to do otherwise for street riding at speeds under 100MPH.
@@spartanx169x Dave normally does more track focused content, but he's talking about his daily driver bike with cases, testing on the street, etc.
My guess is that the standard is set because it _does_ work for most every bike in normal conditions, but the FJR especially is notorious for having issues handling the front since it's much more tuned for touring than sporty riding.
I'm by no means advocating that everyone NEEDS to change from the standard pressures, but IF you're having issues (like me), this is very valuable knowledge.
I'm a fellow FJR 1300 rider in the Pacific Northwest USA so our temps are similar. What pressures did you settle on and how do you like the Roadsmart 4 tires? I've heard that they steer and handle well but I don't know about how they perform on an FJR.😊
Here I was just following the recommended psi. I am definitely trying this and see what improvements I feel.
Please post what you ran and the pressures you found were good for you! Make sure you share brand and model tyre. Thanks!!
I used to use helium too but every time id leave the bike for a while and come back to it ! It would be upside down tires up like if u were fixing a pushbike
Awesome , thanks Dave! When the rubber meets the Road, it's so essential! And so much choice of rubber! 10/10
Thanks for this Dave, great video well presented, it's good to apply some variables over and above the catch all manufacturer guidelines. Long story short, I wasn't convinced with my tyre pressure gauge. A few (not the cheapest) inflators/gauges later it was interesting that 42 on one gauge was 44 on another, and 40 on another (up to 4 psi variance). Unless you have access to a accurately calibrated gauge (to inflate with, or baseline your gauge against) there can be more variance than you might expect.
Machine or tire shops with air lines have regulated pressures. They may even have a test port so you can see what you gauge shows vs known pressures. I test mine every 4 months due to so much track work where pressures are critical and 1.5 psi can be the difference between great wear and a hot mess.
Thank you, I found this excellent information for my lack of knowledge on motorcycle tyres. I am a seasoned mountain biker and got my first motorbike this year, a Fazer 600.
Schoolboy error, went out first couple of rides (2nd for 100 miles on minor roads) without considering how much the tyre pressures could have dropped in 6 months in my garage & the front end behaved strangely on corners under duress. Was 5psi lower than recommended front and 8 low on the rear. Checked the pressures after a 10 minutes run recently and had only lost 1 psi each tyre in a month. Upped pressure to 1 psi over recommendation for quick riding and feels more agile as you say.
This week went out in colder greasier conditions and having done a good 45 minutes extra urban riding
returned to town but felt the front end was slipping around to such a degree I thought there may be oil or grease on the front tyre. Twice the front seemed close to slipping from under me, severely lacking grip. Went to a jet wash and cleaned both well for a few minutes then seemed okay.
As I am a new rider, if there is no “optimum” pressure as such, am I correct to assume that I can simply run slightly lower pressures constantly to give more grip? Expense matters nothing when it comes to brakes and tyres..
Great share and thank you so much for taking the time to type this out! Yes, you can go with manufacturer's recommended to start -2psi cold (also remember cold dense air measures a lot less). Gain on a road ride would be ideal at +3 or +4 over your starting cold pressure. That being said, realize/rationalize that the front tire is always in cold air so you may see 2-3 gain. Hope this helps!
This answers my question!
40 minutes riding about 6 presures is a lot of work though. Thats before you even workout the difference between front and rear.
I think it is safe to assume that even if the manufacturer pressure recommendations are not exactly accurate for all use cases and modern tires, the ratio between front and rear is still relatively accurate. At the very least it is a good starting point. 🤔
2.5 & 2.9 bar are the "don't sue us" pressures I suppose.
@jeffrosamson I'm sure he knows it's the metric system !! He is just making a statement about liability.
@jeffrosamson you're completely missing the point. Also, bar isn't an SI unit, there's nothing important about it, not need to get on your high horse.
If you crash your insurance company will look for any excuse not to pay. Tires not being at recommended pressure could well be one...
Sticker on a 2009 vs manufacturer pressure on S21. Which one is correct for the investigating Officer or adjuster? I'd argue the Bridgestone number.
@@catalystreactionsbw oh I don't disagree at all... The default should be the most up to date ie the tyre, and I'm sure it would be very unusual but I've known companies be like this. Top content by the way!
I ride at so many different speeds, temperatures, elevations, distances, and surfaces I am gonna be changing my air pressure CONSTANTLY! LOLOLOLOLOLOL
Ride to master your tire pressure on the bike
Loved it, so much valuable information, much learnt. Thanks a lot Dave! Just subscribed.....
If it helps I will share my experience, I'm a weekend rider on mountain twisties and long trips with a few occasional commuting rides, I ride a CBR1100XX with Battlax 023GT, front with 2.5kg (35psi) and rear with 2,95kg (41psi) they last between 6000kms-8000kms aprox. (4000-5000miles). For those tires that pressure is ideal for my bike during all weather and season, no problems nor issues so far. Safe rides mates, cheers.
Thanks for sharing as that can inspire and help hundreds of riders at least!
I road raced production Yamaha RDs.I won six championships, I won two national championships AMA and, WERA.. i’m not bragging I’m just pointing out that my method was successful. When dealing with tire pressures..
it seemed like it rained about 25% of the time during my races here in the East Coast. When it did rain, I raised my tire pressures to shrink my contact patch 6 pounds per tire. The theory is, a smaller contact patch puts more squeegee pressure on a smaller patch to pump water out.. this worked well enough for me to be able to say in over 100 heat and final races, that I only had one crash in the rain, and that was my over exuberance due to late braking for the lead on the last lap..
always increase tire pressure in the rain
Great vid thanks. Have heard so many theories from so many experts over the years but so much more valuable with your sound explanation. And what’s best way to work out different pressures front and back?
Start with recommended and then even them up. Does the bike overall ride better? If so, go 2 psi higher and test 4psi lower than the original test number.
@@catalystreactionsbw Dave should front and back be the same pressure? I always thought the rear should be a few psi higher than the front.
@@jamesnorth7318 It can be several or the same. I never carry a passenger or a load on my street bikes so I run pressures the same. I came to that disposition after testing different pressures to see if my motorcycle handled better and it did. Sam scenario with changing pressures every week when I commuted. Got 3,000 miles more out of the tyres. I find it interesting to challenge sticker information and apply critical thinking especially when the gains are all positive and put $$ in my pocket.
Why yes, my bike is a 2006 R1 anniversary edition.
Front 2,3 bar.(cold tire) rear 2,5 bar (cold tire) is perfect for your nice R1!
Congrats....2006 R1 SP.
@@istra70 Yep, nice one. Bought it in '06.....
I got its baby brother R62012 anniversary
All I got was "go do trial and error"
Well said John. Thank you.
No, SCIENTIFIC trial - only, not error. There should be NO error.
An unsuccessful experimental trial is a failure, not an error.
@@johnc8910 It's maybe an experience too !
You've got the attention span of a goldfish, seek medical attention asap.
@@keaponlaffin6737 🤣🤣🤣
Maybe his goldfish is very attentive??
Excellent practical tire pressure video; provides answers to questions I’ve been too uninformed to ask. Thanks!
This expert is doing his audience a great disservice. Run the recommended tire pressure for your motorcycle and check it often. It’s that simple. There is no need to overthink it or try to out engineer the engineers. As a general rule the manufacturer knows best.
I wouldn't go through the trouble he does, but the theory is good to know for those who don't. The recommended pressure is a good starting place, but not ideal for every situation. Just riding with a passenger changes that, not to mention all the different riding styles and conditions.